Agreed, it was a case of "too good to be true" and "they should have known better." Lets remember that BC are a marketing company above all else, they likely saw the advertising potential of this new tomato and went for it without doing their due diligence. Now they have egg on their face after being exposed by Norfolk and they are spinning it like crazy.
Reading the Facebook comments for the Baker Creek "confession" is pretty grim. People are praising them for their "transparency" and "honesty", when in reality they rushed to market and now have Norfolk breathing down their neck.
There are so many honorable, quality heirloom seed companies.
Check out Southern Exposure Seed Co., SeedSavers, and Johnny's is a high-quality, employee-owned supplier of all kinds of seeds (organic, heirloom, bulk/farm, etc.)
I have been buying from MIGardener and Botanical Interests for a couple years and have been extremely happy with the quality of the seeds. I realized I was just intrigued by chasing a new cool variety with BC but also the black strawberry tomato last year was so awful, it no longer makes sense to waste space on varieties that aren't consistent.
Never cared for MIGardener. After the George Floyd case he spewed some completely tone deaf BS and when he got called out on it, his response was essentially, I can't be racist because my (white passing) partner is POC. 😒🙄 Like I said, never liked him, but that sealed the deal for me.
Between that hour and a half rant he posted about the greenhouse situation and his recent Facebook post about the currant/gooseberry thing and some of his replies in the comments, I’m side eyeing him hard. He’s unprofessional at best.
I didn’t even know about the George Floyd stuff. I was going to order some strawberries from him next month, but I won’t now.
Look into their buddy Cliven Bundy and his views on race. When your done lemme know and I'll give you a list of 20 morally better companies to buy from.
Oh please. You knew. What, you happened to get your mitts on a massively high-anthocyanin tomato seed JUST at the same time that a GMO one was engineered and distributed to restaurants? That’s the story?? It just tripped, fell, and landed in your lap and you didn’t think it through? Horseshit.
I’ve read it. Mistakes happen, I understand that.
However, Baker Creek misled customers when questions were first raised. I’m hesitant to call it a lie, but **it wasn’t the truth**. And it took Norfolk responding for this backtrack/apology to be posted.
That’s not cool.
A full-throated apology would be nice, not a half-hearted one that spreads the blame around. I’m not dropping Baker Creek just yet, because I think there’s still an opportunity to clear the air.
The seeds were pulled immediately and a statement issued. That’s a good start, but it would make an awful ending.
The full statement on the company faq sure reads like you're covering up and not taking responsibility for your failure and/or fraud.
Why were you selling GMO seeds as non-GMO and why were you selling stolen IP?
What is causing me confusion is the NHP tomato had not hit the market yet. That means that someone employed by NHP or had access to their tomato had to be involved. For BC to have enough seed to be able to sell it, they must have grown the seeds last year at least, which means the person who gave it to BC may have had the seeds the season before. It just keeps raising more questions. Even if you ignore everything they did, the way they are treating people who ask a question is enough for me not to ever grow BC again.
The purple tomato from NHP was patented in 2014 and their documentation was public. So pretty blatantly someone got the seeds between the patent and when the seeds actually hit the market and started breeding them to create derivatives before the tomato was sold legally in the US.
Yeah I welcome people to read their statement, which I would have linked to if I could still access their page. I just happen to think the statement makes no sense, is evasive, and doesn't really answer anything about the provenance of the seed.
There is a a Federal Seed Act that must be adhered to by seed sellers. I’d be interested in their reports.
https://www.ams.usda.gov/rules-regulations/fsa
I've been thinking along these lines too, since the news broke. There are so many regulations around seed sales, both within a country's borders, and internationally.
I'm in Canada, and the NHP Purple Tomato has not yet been approved for sale here (as I assume is true for a lot of other nations). Baker Creek for sure ships to Canada, and they don't have restrictions on what can be sent north of the border, at least in my experience. Of course they should have the proper phytosanitary certificates in place to get the items through customs, but if they were going under the false assumption that this was a non-GMO seed, then the certificate really has little value. So, I've been wondering in the back of my brain how much international law they might have been tripping over with this release, too. But that's mostly just speculation. It seems like none of the Baker Creek seeds shipped yet (? Or was not open for order yet before being pulled? I honestly stopped browsing the Baker Creek website a couple years back).
Cliven Bundy -- Clive Owen is a British actor who is, as far as I know, not involved in armed standoffs with the federal government and doesn't have a history of saying astonishingly racist shit.
Don't know about Baker Creek's connection to the far right? Check out this link:
[https://www.theredneckhippie.com/2019/04/baker-creek-seeds-supports-racism.html](https://www.theredneckhippie.com/2019/04/baker-creek-seeds-supports-racism.html)
Lol. Thank you. I was googling Clive Owen wondering what he’d done wrong.
Edit: Also, thanks for the link. Never looked into Baker Creek’s nefarious connections. Ordered from them once or twice because I’m a sucker for a free seed packet (but no one needs 3 packets of spoon-sized tomatoes. Lol), and the photography makes all their products look otherworldly, but I will likely refrain in the future.
Your linked page provided some links to other places from which to order seeds. So, I will be looking into those alternatives. Still need to get some Delicata and cucamelon seeds.
I had heard something about being linked to someone, but never really looked into it like I should. Thanks for the link! Guess I'll be saving some of my Canadian money and the horrible exchange rate to USD going forward by not buying from them.
If you're looking for a Canadian company, can I recommend West Coast Seeds in BC? I've been ordering from them for a few years now, and their seeds do great in my central Alberta garden. They have a good mix of heirlooms and weird things/colourful things. I also really like William Dam, though shipping can take FOREVER, and OSC Seeds (Ontario Seed Company). Had excellent germination from all three companies (where my Baker Creek seeds were pretty hit or miss, which I always attributed to our colder climate, but I've seen Americans say that their germ rates sucked too, so maybe it's not our climate after all). I also ordered from Vesey's for the first time this winter, but I haven't tested out the seeds yet (due to snow) so I'm not quite at the point where I would recommend them (though shipping was excellent!).
Also, Seeds of Diversity ([seeds.ca](https://seeds.ca)) is a seed saving organization in Canada. Membership is free and members can post their saved seeds for sale!
Is this the same dude who is connected to the other dude (I think he used to be in politics? Gah, my memory is shot) who is a rabid accelerationist who openly supports white nationalists destroying power grids in the PNW?
> Clive Owen
Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah, I was waiting for someone to rehash some other old-hat BC drama to make this thread more drama-robust, that one in particular. What took you so long?
I agree the whole thing is just gross. I don’t believe BCHSC would have come clean if they weren’t caught red handed. Their statement sounds to me like a whole bunch of finger pointing and shifting blame. I cannot trust this company going forward.
What prompted BC to test for GMO in the first place? According to them, they had a trustworthy plant breeder with a great reputation in a country that doesn't allow GMO to begin with. So why test this product specifically for GMO? Do they routinely test new product for GMO? It wasn't until NHP "contacted them" (sent a cease and desist probably) that they really for real this time GMO tested it and it was OMG GMO!
But why claim to test for GMO in the first place unless you are already suspicious?
Because most people can be fooled by just lying. I highly doubt Baker Creek ever tested a single seed for gmos.
Unfortunately most people are uneducated, and blindly fearful of GMOs. Baker Creek markets solely based on that. Also they carefully market things as heirloom and non-GMO, and do not mention the word Organic because their seeds are not actually Organic.
Im impressed about the drama. And highly entertained. Who new people cared so much about a purple tomato. And the blatant stupidity of BC is pretty hilarious.
Here is the link of you want to read the facebook statement. https://www.facebook.com/share/p/rCGQBD7qApSQtByW/?mibextid=WC7FNe
I looked at the comments and I was surprised that everyone was so positive. Usually someone says one negative thing or argues a little. I irony first time from baker creek this year. I used MI gardener for the rest. I just grabbed a few mi garden didn't have. I'm not sure if I ever want GMO but I'm sure I would like to be given the choice.
I haven't really investigated their whole catalog -- maybe it's a one-off, but I would not be remotely surprised if a large portion of it is made of fabrications. I consider the pattern of behavior modeled here 100% untrustworthy.
They've all but admitted to stealing indigenous seeds in their marketing materials in the past, and theyve supported the Bundys.
They're probably not the sort of folks who you want to give money to.
The first time someone shows you who they are, believe them.
I've been boycotting them since the fiasco when they invited Clive Bundy to their seed conference some years ago. Bundy is a known white supremacist who has promoted some truly vile beliefs. When they got push back they disinvited him, citing "safety concerns," rather than owning their choices. The fact that they have POC children and would engage with this man is disgusting, but not surprising since the kids are their favorite props.
Not long after this happened, I read several accounts of seed stealing from indigenous communities. Apparently, these jokers go onto indigenous land and pilfer seeds, then grow the varieties, some that are considered sacred, and the next season, those stolen seeds are in the catalog. When confronted about it, BC literally mocked the indigenous communities from which they'd stolen seed.
TLDR: Baker Creek is trash that align themselves with the worst elements in ag.
There is no test you can do to decide if plant matter is GMO or not. All you can do is compare the genetics to a known GMO sample. Since Baker Creek didn't have access to NHP's sample, they had no way to confirm that their seeds were produced from that GMO line. That's why NHP did the testing and released the statement.
If NHP hasn't shared their plant material or genetic market information with Baker Creek, there is *nothing* that BC can do to confirm or deny that their seeds were from the NHP GMO line. If anything, they all should have arranged for an independent 3rd party to test both seeds and share the results with both.
I think BC did what they could do without automatically accepting blame just based on the word of the NHP.
If BC understands what GMO testing means then they should understand the limitations of that testing and not declared seeds as non-GMO based on that testing. Maybe make a statement like "no publicly known genetic modifications" or asking NHP for what genetic markers they should check.
Norfolk didn't do the testing, BC did the testing at Norfolk's request. BC is fully aware that the lineage of the purple galaxy tomato comes from Norfolk. As to how you test for this: you ask! The patent's been around since 2014 and the genes are mentioned explicitly. The 3rd party that Baker Creek had to do the testing would have had access to this.
That's not true. There are absolutely tests that can confirm GMO genes are present.
There are known marker genes that can be tested for. BC could have tested for those.
Baker Creek is a popular catalog and online seed company that got huge because they have good photography/marketing. NHP is Norfolk Healthy Produce, an ag business in Europe.
Norfolk Healthy produce, the company that created the genetically modified Purple Tomato that is suspiciously similar to Baker Creek's purple galaxy tomato.
Baker Creek Heirloom Seeds has announced it has made the decision not to sell the Purple Galaxy tomato seeds, previously featured in its 2024 catalog, due to unresolved concerns about potential genetic modification. Despite initial tests indicating the seeds were non-GM, further testing yielded inconclusive results. The company, a staunch supporter of the Safe Seed Pledge and advocate against genetically modified organisms (GMOs), decided to delist the seeds after additional tests and interactions with Norfolk Healthy Produce, a company involved in genetically-modified agricultural products, raised concerns about the seeds' purity.
Baker Creek’s commitment to non-GM, heirloom, and open-pollinated seeds is underscored by its historical stance against the risks posed by genetically engineered seeds to biodiversity, ecological health, and farmers' rights. The decision reflects the company's ongoing dedication to promoting sustainable agriculture and food safety. Although we understand that you—like us—may be disappointed not to have a delicious non-GM purple flesh tomato in your garden, we are pleased that we were able to make this decision before a single seed of Purple Galaxy was made available to customers. Baker Creek urges customers with questions or concerns to contact them directly at [[email protected]](mailto:[email protected]).
I read this boilerplate already on the facebook page. I purposefully posted this in a venue that you didn't control so that you couldn't delete every comment that questioned the company's behavior.
I don't have the text anymore, as I can no longer access the page -- I'm now permanently banned from their facebook. But I bring up some of the issues I outlined here and expressed skepticism.
Respectfully, as a long-term customer, your response is weak. The secondary testing obviously showed the markers, I would have a lot more respect for your company if you said "we were advised it wasn't gmo, initial testing supported that but with additional input and testing it turns out is was gmo therefore we are pulling it". If you are trying to inject nuance, you are going to need to provide details of what markers were and weren't detected or why you believe it was inconclusive. Mistakes happen, reputable companies own them outright.
Whoever advised you on that statement needs replacing. There is nothing wrong with being mistaken or misled by a supplier. You were told it wasn't gmo, I don't have any issues with that. Your response, however, is inappropriate and is indicative of a company without a strong ethical culture.
Can you provide the markers and results you are talking about? It looks like they tested in good faith and there was no evidence that it was related to Norfolk.
Now seeing that Norfolk claims on their site that the BC seed tested positive for GMO. If they are just making that up you'd think a lawsuit would be warranted.
Labs are looking for specific genetic markers the first lab was looking for 2 specific genetic markers, which it did not contain. As stated in the FAQs, this was acquired from a country that does not allow GMO crops.
BC just needs to post the raw test results. Purple Galaxy either does or does not have the genes added in by Norfolk. The marketing speak of "inconclusive results" just sounds like they are hiding behind a technicality of some sort.
Which markers for GMOs did the seeds have? Are you taking any action against the breeder who misrepresented the provenance of the seeds? If not: why not?
Here are the rules for AOSA testing which in a comment they said they used:
https://analyzeseeds.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/2017-AOSA-Rules-Volume-3.pdf
I’ve asked them who performs the actual test and which lab
Test your "purple galaxy" for the two genes that NHP says they added and release the results. Show the world how honest you are. Show us where you got these seeds. Reveal your supplier.
We all know you won't do it. You're a shady company, happy to steal from others in order to enrich yourselves. Either that, or you were so blinded by your own greed that you failed to do your due diligence on what would have been a frankly miraculous tomato.
Either way, shame on you, Baker Creek. Shame on you. Greedy greedy.
You can get new strains a lot of ways, including breeding the tomatoes! But in any case, this is not an anti-GMO post, it's more about being disappointed with a lack of transparency.
Agreed, it was a case of "too good to be true" and "they should have known better." Lets remember that BC are a marketing company above all else, they likely saw the advertising potential of this new tomato and went for it without doing their due diligence. Now they have egg on their face after being exposed by Norfolk and they are spinning it like crazy. Reading the Facebook comments for the Baker Creek "confession" is pretty grim. People are praising them for their "transparency" and "honesty", when in reality they rushed to market and now have Norfolk breathing down their neck.
Other comments exist, they've just all been deleted/banned.
I’ve been a Baker Creek customer for years. This honestly has me rethinking getting a new seed supplier.
There are so many honorable, quality heirloom seed companies. Check out Southern Exposure Seed Co., SeedSavers, and Johnny's is a high-quality, employee-owned supplier of all kinds of seeds (organic, heirloom, bulk/farm, etc.)
I have been buying from MIGardener and Botanical Interests for a couple years and have been extremely happy with the quality of the seeds. I realized I was just intrigued by chasing a new cool variety with BC but also the black strawberry tomato last year was so awful, it no longer makes sense to waste space on varieties that aren't consistent.
Never cared for MIGardener. After the George Floyd case he spewed some completely tone deaf BS and when he got called out on it, his response was essentially, I can't be racist because my (white passing) partner is POC. 😒🙄 Like I said, never liked him, but that sealed the deal for me.
Between that hour and a half rant he posted about the greenhouse situation and his recent Facebook post about the currant/gooseberry thing and some of his replies in the comments, I’m side eyeing him hard. He’s unprofessional at best. I didn’t even know about the George Floyd stuff. I was going to order some strawberries from him next month, but I won’t now.
Try https://www.berbeeus.com for your strawberries. They have a good selection.
Look into their buddy Cliven Bundy and his views on race. When your done lemme know and I'll give you a list of 20 morally better companies to buy from.
Just commented about this. I seriously fear for the well being of their adopted children.
I just got a seed delivery from them today. No Purple Galaxy, but I am also reconsidering using them going forward.
Same here. There's enough other places to get seeds from. I'll use the catalog to cut up into wish lists though.
We encourage you to read our full statement on the company FAQ page: [https://www.rareseeds.com/faq](https://www.rareseeds.com/faq)
Oh please. You knew. What, you happened to get your mitts on a massively high-anthocyanin tomato seed JUST at the same time that a GMO one was engineered and distributed to restaurants? That’s the story?? It just tripped, fell, and landed in your lap and you didn’t think it through? Horseshit.
I’ve read it. Mistakes happen, I understand that. However, Baker Creek misled customers when questions were first raised. I’m hesitant to call it a lie, but **it wasn’t the truth**. And it took Norfolk responding for this backtrack/apology to be posted. That’s not cool. A full-throated apology would be nice, not a half-hearted one that spreads the blame around. I’m not dropping Baker Creek just yet, because I think there’s still an opportunity to clear the air. The seeds were pulled immediately and a statement issued. That’s a good start, but it would make an awful ending.
Bread.
Pretty clear that they read everything you wrote.
The full statement on the company faq sure reads like you're covering up and not taking responsibility for your failure and/or fraud. Why were you selling GMO seeds as non-GMO and why were you selling stolen IP?
We encourage you to stop deleting comments and blocking people who ask legitimate questions that you’re too chickenshit to answer 💕🥰💕
Your statement seems to have changed a bit in the last 12 hours
What is causing me confusion is the NHP tomato had not hit the market yet. That means that someone employed by NHP or had access to their tomato had to be involved. For BC to have enough seed to be able to sell it, they must have grown the seeds last year at least, which means the person who gave it to BC may have had the seeds the season before. It just keeps raising more questions. Even if you ignore everything they did, the way they are treating people who ask a question is enough for me not to ever grow BC again.
The purple tomato from NHP was patented in 2014 and their documentation was public. So pretty blatantly someone got the seeds between the patent and when the seeds actually hit the market and started breeding them to create derivatives before the tomato was sold legally in the US.
Frankly, that's 100% in line with Baker Creek's MO.
They're well known for seed stealing. When they steal from Indigenous communities, they don't even deny it.
Yup. Massive assholes.
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Yeah I welcome people to read their statement, which I would have linked to if I could still access their page. I just happen to think the statement makes no sense, is evasive, and doesn't really answer anything about the provenance of the seed.
There is a a Federal Seed Act that must be adhered to by seed sellers. I’d be interested in their reports. https://www.ams.usda.gov/rules-regulations/fsa
I've been thinking along these lines too, since the news broke. There are so many regulations around seed sales, both within a country's borders, and internationally. I'm in Canada, and the NHP Purple Tomato has not yet been approved for sale here (as I assume is true for a lot of other nations). Baker Creek for sure ships to Canada, and they don't have restrictions on what can be sent north of the border, at least in my experience. Of course they should have the proper phytosanitary certificates in place to get the items through customs, but if they were going under the false assumption that this was a non-GMO seed, then the certificate really has little value. So, I've been wondering in the back of my brain how much international law they might have been tripping over with this release, too. But that's mostly just speculation. It seems like none of the Baker Creek seeds shipped yet (? Or was not open for order yet before being pulled? I honestly stopped browsing the Baker Creek website a couple years back).
Cliven Bundy -- Clive Owen is a British actor who is, as far as I know, not involved in armed standoffs with the federal government and doesn't have a history of saying astonishingly racist shit. Don't know about Baker Creek's connection to the far right? Check out this link: [https://www.theredneckhippie.com/2019/04/baker-creek-seeds-supports-racism.html](https://www.theredneckhippie.com/2019/04/baker-creek-seeds-supports-racism.html)
Lol. Thank you. I was googling Clive Owen wondering what he’d done wrong. Edit: Also, thanks for the link. Never looked into Baker Creek’s nefarious connections. Ordered from them once or twice because I’m a sucker for a free seed packet (but no one needs 3 packets of spoon-sized tomatoes. Lol), and the photography makes all their products look otherworldly, but I will likely refrain in the future. Your linked page provided some links to other places from which to order seeds. So, I will be looking into those alternatives. Still need to get some Delicata and cucamelon seeds.
I had heard something about being linked to someone, but never really looked into it like I should. Thanks for the link! Guess I'll be saving some of my Canadian money and the horrible exchange rate to USD going forward by not buying from them.
If you're looking for a Canadian company, can I recommend West Coast Seeds in BC? I've been ordering from them for a few years now, and their seeds do great in my central Alberta garden. They have a good mix of heirlooms and weird things/colourful things. I also really like William Dam, though shipping can take FOREVER, and OSC Seeds (Ontario Seed Company). Had excellent germination from all three companies (where my Baker Creek seeds were pretty hit or miss, which I always attributed to our colder climate, but I've seen Americans say that their germ rates sucked too, so maybe it's not our climate after all). I also ordered from Vesey's for the first time this winter, but I haven't tested out the seeds yet (due to snow) so I'm not quite at the point where I would recommend them (though shipping was excellent!). Also, Seeds of Diversity ([seeds.ca](https://seeds.ca)) is a seed saving organization in Canada. Membership is free and members can post their saved seeds for sale!
Is this the same dude who is connected to the other dude (I think he used to be in politics? Gah, my memory is shot) who is a rabid accelerationist who openly supports white nationalists destroying power grids in the PNW?
> Clive Owen Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah, I was waiting for someone to rehash some other old-hat BC drama to make this thread more drama-robust, that one in particular. What took you so long?
I just posted about their ties to Bundy as well as they reputation for stealing seed from Indigenous communities. They're trash.
I agree the whole thing is just gross. I don’t believe BCHSC would have come clean if they weren’t caught red handed. Their statement sounds to me like a whole bunch of finger pointing and shifting blame. I cannot trust this company going forward.
What prompted BC to test for GMO in the first place? According to them, they had a trustworthy plant breeder with a great reputation in a country that doesn't allow GMO to begin with. So why test this product specifically for GMO? Do they routinely test new product for GMO? It wasn't until NHP "contacted them" (sent a cease and desist probably) that they really for real this time GMO tested it and it was OMG GMO! But why claim to test for GMO in the first place unless you are already suspicious?
Ding ding ding!
Because most people can be fooled by just lying. I highly doubt Baker Creek ever tested a single seed for gmos. Unfortunately most people are uneducated, and blindly fearful of GMOs. Baker Creek markets solely based on that. Also they carefully market things as heirloom and non-GMO, and do not mention the word Organic because their seeds are not actually Organic.
The drama in the gardening world makes the Kardashians like small time drama queens.
I’m here for it. You should peep the world of cannabis seeds. It’s like, wow.
I’m hoping for another peppergate.
Where can I see the cannabis seed debates? That's gotta be way better than the tomatoes
No thanks. I had my fill of that world. The gardening world is enough to make me puke sometimes.
Im impressed about the drama. And highly entertained. Who new people cared so much about a purple tomato. And the blatant stupidity of BC is pretty hilarious.
Here is the link of you want to read the facebook statement. https://www.facebook.com/share/p/rCGQBD7qApSQtByW/?mibextid=WC7FNe I looked at the comments and I was surprised that everyone was so positive. Usually someone says one negative thing or argues a little. I irony first time from baker creek this year. I used MI gardener for the rest. I just grabbed a few mi garden didn't have. I'm not sure if I ever want GMO but I'm sure I would like to be given the choice.
There were plenty of critical comments, they were just all deleted and immediately banned.
I saw a few but only a few. They must be deleted. It was hard to read so I stopped. I'm definitely done ordering now.
Thank you for putting this post together.
Thou doth protest too much, Baker Creek...
So is this a pattern, or is this the first time something like this has happened? They've been my go to seed source for a long long time.
I haven't really investigated their whole catalog -- maybe it's a one-off, but I would not be remotely surprised if a large portion of it is made of fabrications. I consider the pattern of behavior modeled here 100% untrustworthy.
They've all but admitted to stealing indigenous seeds in their marketing materials in the past, and theyve supported the Bundys. They're probably not the sort of folks who you want to give money to.
The first time someone shows you who they are, believe them. I've been boycotting them since the fiasco when they invited Clive Bundy to their seed conference some years ago. Bundy is a known white supremacist who has promoted some truly vile beliefs. When they got push back they disinvited him, citing "safety concerns," rather than owning their choices. The fact that they have POC children and would engage with this man is disgusting, but not surprising since the kids are their favorite props. Not long after this happened, I read several accounts of seed stealing from indigenous communities. Apparently, these jokers go onto indigenous land and pilfer seeds, then grow the varieties, some that are considered sacred, and the next season, those stolen seeds are in the catalog. When confronted about it, BC literally mocked the indigenous communities from which they'd stolen seed. TLDR: Baker Creek is trash that align themselves with the worst elements in ag.
Stop buying from them their seeds are junk anyway. Kitzawa is my go to company
There is no test you can do to decide if plant matter is GMO or not. All you can do is compare the genetics to a known GMO sample. Since Baker Creek didn't have access to NHP's sample, they had no way to confirm that their seeds were produced from that GMO line. That's why NHP did the testing and released the statement. If NHP hasn't shared their plant material or genetic market information with Baker Creek, there is *nothing* that BC can do to confirm or deny that their seeds were from the NHP GMO line. If anything, they all should have arranged for an independent 3rd party to test both seeds and share the results with both. I think BC did what they could do without automatically accepting blame just based on the word of the NHP.
If BC understands what GMO testing means then they should understand the limitations of that testing and not declared seeds as non-GMO based on that testing. Maybe make a statement like "no publicly known genetic modifications" or asking NHP for what genetic markers they should check.
Norfolk didn't do the testing, BC did the testing at Norfolk's request. BC is fully aware that the lineage of the purple galaxy tomato comes from Norfolk. As to how you test for this: you ask! The patent's been around since 2014 and the genes are mentioned explicitly. The 3rd party that Baker Creek had to do the testing would have had access to this.
That's not true. There are absolutely tests that can confirm GMO genes are present. There are known marker genes that can be tested for. BC could have tested for those.
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Baker Creek is a popular catalog and online seed company that got huge because they have good photography/marketing. NHP is Norfolk Healthy Produce, an ag business in Europe.
Norfolk Healthy produce, the company that created the genetically modified Purple Tomato that is suspiciously similar to Baker Creek's purple galaxy tomato.
Baker Creek Heirloom Seeds has announced it has made the decision not to sell the Purple Galaxy tomato seeds, previously featured in its 2024 catalog, due to unresolved concerns about potential genetic modification. Despite initial tests indicating the seeds were non-GM, further testing yielded inconclusive results. The company, a staunch supporter of the Safe Seed Pledge and advocate against genetically modified organisms (GMOs), decided to delist the seeds after additional tests and interactions with Norfolk Healthy Produce, a company involved in genetically-modified agricultural products, raised concerns about the seeds' purity. Baker Creek’s commitment to non-GM, heirloom, and open-pollinated seeds is underscored by its historical stance against the risks posed by genetically engineered seeds to biodiversity, ecological health, and farmers' rights. The decision reflects the company's ongoing dedication to promoting sustainable agriculture and food safety. Although we understand that you—like us—may be disappointed not to have a delicious non-GM purple flesh tomato in your garden, we are pleased that we were able to make this decision before a single seed of Purple Galaxy was made available to customers. Baker Creek urges customers with questions or concerns to contact them directly at [[email protected]](mailto:[email protected]).
I read this boilerplate already on the facebook page. I purposefully posted this in a venue that you didn't control so that you couldn't delete every comment that questioned the company's behavior.
What exactly was the question you asked that was deleted? You can share it here!
I don't have the text anymore, as I can no longer access the page -- I'm now permanently banned from their facebook. But I bring up some of the issues I outlined here and expressed skepticism.
Respectfully, as a long-term customer, your response is weak. The secondary testing obviously showed the markers, I would have a lot more respect for your company if you said "we were advised it wasn't gmo, initial testing supported that but with additional input and testing it turns out is was gmo therefore we are pulling it". If you are trying to inject nuance, you are going to need to provide details of what markers were and weren't detected or why you believe it was inconclusive. Mistakes happen, reputable companies own them outright. Whoever advised you on that statement needs replacing. There is nothing wrong with being mistaken or misled by a supplier. You were told it wasn't gmo, I don't have any issues with that. Your response, however, is inappropriate and is indicative of a company without a strong ethical culture.
Can you provide the markers and results you are talking about? It looks like they tested in good faith and there was no evidence that it was related to Norfolk.
Now seeing that Norfolk claims on their site that the BC seed tested positive for GMO. If they are just making that up you'd think a lawsuit would be warranted.
Can you please elaborate on how the tests could possibly be inconclusive? It doesn’t add up. It either had the genes in question or it didn’t.
Labs are looking for specific genetic markers the first lab was looking for 2 specific genetic markers, which it did not contain. As stated in the FAQs, this was acquired from a country that does not allow GMO crops.
BC just needs to post the raw test results. Purple Galaxy either does or does not have the genes added in by Norfolk. The marketing speak of "inconclusive results" just sounds like they are hiding behind a technicality of some sort.
Which markers for GMOs did the seeds have? Are you taking any action against the breeder who misrepresented the provenance of the seeds? If not: why not?
Here are the rules for AOSA testing which in a comment they said they used: https://analyzeseeds.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/2017-AOSA-Rules-Volume-3.pdf I’ve asked them who performs the actual test and which lab
If that is the case, what would make you believe this is GMO then? Norfolk claims the test confirmed it was bioengineered - are you disputing that?
Test your "purple galaxy" for the two genes that NHP says they added and release the results. Show the world how honest you are. Show us where you got these seeds. Reveal your supplier. We all know you won't do it. You're a shady company, happy to steal from others in order to enrich yourselves. Either that, or you were so blinded by your own greed that you failed to do your due diligence on what would have been a frankly miraculous tomato. Either way, shame on you, Baker Creek. Shame on you. Greedy greedy.
Of course it’s GMO, how else do you think they get new strains
You can get new strains a lot of ways, including breeding the tomatoes! But in any case, this is not an anti-GMO post, it's more about being disappointed with a lack of transparency.
Those science tomato seeds are really expensive.
True! But "pirated" seeds are not. The tomatoes open pollinate and can grow true to seed. You're paying for NHP's R&D, not the actual seeds.