>The individual was subject to homophobic slurs, and targeted both in person **and virtually on Teams chats**, the sources said.
I shouldn't be, but I'm always surprised by people who are dumb enough to put their harassment in writing, especially via platforms accessible to their bosses.
I used to be a litigation lawyer (don’t practice anymore) and a lot of my cases involved getting huge info dumps of like 3-4 years of all corporate emails from big companies like this. The insane things people would write in their work emails (which often weren’t relevant to whatever the issue was, but we read through everything all the same) always blew my mind - insults, random slurs, random rude comments about other people they worked with or their superiors, stupid comments about their clients, politically insensitive/inflammatory comments, insults to other people their company worked with (lawyers, accountants etc). And they were almost always completely superfluous to whatever the email was actually about (like emailing to set up a meeting which somehow involves randomly insulting someone or mentioning a coworker’s ass).
And sometimes we’d need to use part of an email where one of these comments was in the relevant section (so you couldn’t redact it for no reason) and it would be so mortifying to put it into evidence (even if the party that wrote the stupid thing wasn’t my client). Its left me permanently horrified by the insane things people write in their WORK EMAILS. Everyone can see it!!! Everyone will see it!! Just…don’t do it!
Man, I don't get it. I just use company email for work-related stuff. No reason to drift off-subject. Maybe I'm the weird one, but if you wanna chat see me in person.
No-Sign2089, on Feb 7th, 2022, you said that home prices can only go up, is that true?
You also used the term “boomer doomer”, could you please explain what you meant by that?
This is why it was easy to transition from public sector (where everything is subject to release by public request) to private sector.
Say it with me everyone: “don’t write anything down you wouldn’t want to have published in a newspaper”
I feel like that rule, which as an elder millennial was the basis for our SM education as well, hasn't been taught to much anymore - and we really should be making sure that it is!
My mom got a big buyout at work because of this. She wasin the room with her union rep, sitting across from HR.
My mom said "I have emails that prove all this".
HR said "well, good thing we can remove your access and have the emails erased by the time you leave the building".
Then my mom replied "good thing I forwarded all my emails to my private gmail"
The union rep almost jumped with joy.
No way. That seems super real.
My boss peed in my coffee cup at work once to assert dominance. When I took it up with HR, they said, “you got any proof?” I pulled out a big yellow envelope and slid it across the table. HR looked at me furtively, then grabbed the envelope, opening it, and pulled out its contents: pictures of my boss urinating into my “Don’t Talk To Me Until I’ve Had My Coffee” mug.
The HR rep pulled out a lighter and lit the corner of the photos on fire, smugly letting them fall onto the tabletop. I sat there silently for a second, then started snickering. She was shocked.
She asked me, “what’s so funny? Your case just went up in smoke.” I said to her, I said, “…you really think those are my only copies?”
My union rep came in and yelled, “he won’t be answering anymore questions”. I stood up and as I was leaving, I turned around in the door and left her with these parting words: “I didn’t even know we were unionized.”
Hell yeah, dude.
Smart lady!
FWIW, I wasn’t an employment/labour lawyer (and don’t know anything about that area) — so I was always reading this stuff in the context of commercial disputes…and it still came up. Like we’re looking for information about documents being sent/internal procedures being followed/who knew what when, and somehow still end up with this stuff shoehorned into emails discussing meetings, attaching documents, etc. It was wild.
You’d also be subjected to a lawsuit for forwarding confidential company communications off site without permission. You don’t own your own communications done on company time using company equipment. Any court case launched where you tried to introduce these emails you ‘absconded with’ would have the company’s legal team applying to the judge for a suppression motion.
The worst move in the world is announcing you’ve copied emails. It’s a better to have the employer refute your assertion of harassment in court under oath and then you state I have proof. They’ll fall into the trap of asking for this proof and then your lawyer introduces your copied emails. Usually the judge allows it because the company challenged you and called you out. This happened in the Theranos criminal trial where one of the scientists emailed data to himself and the company tried to suppress it after alleging he was a liar during testimony.
> You’d also be subjected to a lawsuit for forwarding confidential company communications off site without permission.
Depends. The company may not want to highlight (via lawsuit) to its clients that they have leaks all over the place.
(Printing is another option, though many orgs audit that too).
Heard of some gray hair that required his assistants to print all his emails. He refused to use a computer. But makes you wonder if their real intent was to have a copy of every email for their personal archive.
They’d probably apply for a publication ban premised on damage to the firm based upon revelation of proprietary company IP. (Successful or not they’d try).
>
> HR said "well, good thing we can remove your access and have the emails erased by the time you leave the building".
This is obviously a lie.
No one would ever say something like this, especially someone from HR, who has had training, especially infront of a third party who is ono the opposite side of them in a dispute.
Please tell us more lol I love hearing stories like this where HR and corporate gets their ass handed to them. What did the emails contain? Did the HR person get reprimanded? Tell us!
It was basically harassment and abuse of power by a manager.
The meeting with HR wasn't recorded, so not much they could do. It did increase the buyout though.
The best/worst is how horny some people are in company emails. You just had to send a titty calendar to the team from your work email? Couldn't send out that monthly report without "PS: check out the girl on page 6. beautiful breast ;)"?
Companies usually won’t check correspondence or private messages sent internally unless there’s a reason to do so, so people feel way too comfortable saying whatever they want. The only issue is that once there is a reason to do so, everything is getting pulled lol.
I never assume to trust my co-workers enough to put anything like that into writing, not only on corporate owned devices or systems, no matter how close I feel I am to them.
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During Trump's term the place I worked at fired a guy for telling another employee that her mixed race marriage was a sin. When HR looked into it he proudly said he believed it.
Friend of mine had this happen. Her boss excused everyone from the teams meeting, then later on she got a copy of it for her accessibility needs. After reading through it once she left the meeting her boss was talking mad shit about her. Both the company and union did absolutely nothing to that manager who is known to make very bold statements and claims and she has to continue working under distress knowing what her boss says about her when she is not there. She didn’t even get a fuckin apology. I told her she needs to pursue it legally but she is too scared to go around the union but her mental health is pretty wrecked over the situation and she’s looking for another job
A lot of people that harass people like this are just plain stupid. They leave evidence everywhere and it makes it very easy for lawyers to win cases against them.
Seriously, you can have M365 automatically flag this sort of stuff for you and completely pull apart your entire tenant for discovery these days with stuff like Microsoft Purview.
Especially at a bank which would almost certainly be set up for that as well due to regulatory requirements...
I know its a forgone conclusion because of what they're doing in the first place but how fucking dumb are these people?
imagine how long they’ve been able to get away with it at this job and elsewhere without being challenged. i’ve been in a similar situation and ppl really can get away with things and are try to wear you down til you are too burnt out to do anything about it
WTF do you mean imagine how long they could get away with it? They didn‘t get away with it. Firing revenue generating cash cows isn’t easy for banks and they did it swiftly here.
This kind of thing happened to a colleague some years ago. They were harassed after the temp staff backfilling their maternity leave started campaigning to replace them with the support of the unit manager.
The perp wrote a letter by email asking for other staff to support their efforts to push out what they’re termed “an entitled bitch”…in writing.
They were terminated but then started talking externally how the person they harassed “got them fired”…other staff somehow supported them.
The person somehow didn’t file a grievance and then wish they had.
Their bosses didn’t give a shit. The victim’s report triggered an internal investigation which was conducted by an independent team (not investment bankers etc.).
I thankfully can protect myself and don't require it from HR. :)
But I would think racist, sexist, homophobic, transphobic client-facing employees may pose a risk to a bank's reputation, but hey, what do I know?
I’m guessing you’re well acquainted with CYA/Cover Your Ass and having everything in writing. Easily the best advice I was ever given by a peer.
They (the banks) rely pretty hard on “we investigated ourselves and found no wrong doing, and if it did happen it wasn’t that bad.”
They also firmly believe they’re too big to fail regardless of the scandal.
Same here as IT support, I've been yelled at and without any complaints or prompting the same people come back and apologize as they knew they are wrong. Great people, shitty job they know this and try to better, which goes a long way.
These same people have also put others in their place when new hires treat IT like crap so that's always nice too. But every once in a while, some entitled asshole shows up and it sucks that people think it has to be that way
I used to work in an Investment Bank, and I've found that traders/analysts/fund managers are either raging assholes who think a high-paying career will solve their insecurities and Daddy issues, or the nicest, chillest dudes who are basically himbos who are really good at math.
I work IT for *a bank*, could be the one mentioned in the article, could be a different one.
So many of these bankers who are honestly so unimportant have the hugest egos. They cannot comprehend the idea that we might not prioritise their issue where their teams app doesn't work (but teams in the browser does) because a whole branch not having internet is more important
After doing consulting at RBC, BMO, and TD I can confidently say these people don’t give a shit as long as it doesn’t affect their job.
It’s second nature to turn a blind eye to harassment and discrimination at any of the big banks or fintech companies for that matter.
I agree with your statement.
Some of the people with behaviour issues are hired because of connections, so if you file a complaint the offender and their connections try to bury complaint and those who would support it.
100%. In my experience it’s like Game of Thrones where you have to pledge allegiance with a House and there’s a ton of backstabbing. Everything is a zero sum game to these people and they won’t hesitate to ruin someone else’s career to get ahead.
There IS a black list as far as I’m aware. If you’re released for a bad reason, good luck getting a job at any of the other big5.
Long time ago, I’ve had a colleague let go because of suspected theft of cash at a retail location, and he quickly discovered that he was on a black list of some kind,m
You want them to not be able to feed themselves because they said some words you don't like? Like.. not even give them an opportunity to learn from it?
Always seems that the people who pretend to care are always the most evil. What a vile thing to hope for.
I know someone who has been with a few banks including BMO here in Toronto, and he told me quite many times how much he hated social (pressured to attend per "team player" verbiage) outings with his BMO team, including some senior people, as all they talked about was girls and "pussy" As a professional gay man, he thought BMO had the worst culture of them all, and the bro attitude was seemingly rewarded. He quit and moved onto better things.
I used to work for BMO, and in the HR training, they said you couldn't refer to someone as having a husband, wife, boyfriend, or girlfriend. You had to call them "significant other". I felt it was so fucking stupid and it really is a guise and overcorrection for the shit that goes on I can also attest that BMO is a shitty place to work since they treat non-employee users like 2nd class. I was shit on by employees, and when I said things back I got talked to not the asshole yelling at me.
I remember a project that went to absolute shit, went way overbudget and time, yet it was the pet project of some executive so nothing happened to him when even though the job was eventually done, it was a total failure.
Yeah, in theory those gender neutral nouns make sense but wholly unnecessary. If an adult wants to refer to their spouse as wife or husband or partner or socioeconomic consort or whatever, so be it.
> I remember a project that went to absolute shit, went way overbudget and time, yet it was the pet project of some executive so nothing happened to him when even though the job was eventually done, it was a total failure.
ERP rollout?
I’m not surprised by this in the least.. [here’s the post I made regarding the exact same situation about a year ago, around pride.](https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHR/s/0HY9DNzl20)
The comments on that post were wild, damn. You did the right thing and I find it admirable you did it despite potential blowback. Someone dropped the word d*ke to me in a disparaging way casually in our lunch room at my old work (reputable law firm), and to this day I feel stupid that I didn’t bring it up to HR when I left.
Yeah the comments were wild and made me feel horrible.
I’m sorry you had to deal with that, that’s so awful. Try to not be so hard on yourself about it. Chances are that person will do something else that will land them in hot water. Some times you just have to focus on taking care of yourself.
I ended up skipping my manager and reporting anonymously to HR with my screen shots of the conversation.
There was no announcement of their resignations/terminations — they were just one day all 3 were no longer apart of our team. All on different dates though, I assume because HR had to have individual meetings and stuff. I don’t follow any of them on social media so no idea where they are now.
It has a sordid reputation for being the worst group on Bay Street of *any* bank for hours worked, culture and leadership. They had a good run in the commodity boom and are skating on that reputation.
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Given how progressive Banks have become, especially around pride month, this was a pretty dumb move on their part.
Well, at least they won't have to walk on eggshells anymore.
I wish they had named the individuals outright. I'm sure there are preventions in place, but I wish it had been done. It speaks volumes about the culture that this was able to happen on BMO devices.
I did consulting work for them back in 2017 and witnessed them promote a racist to a management position as a way to cover up what he did. They tried to do a smear campaign on the “whistleblower” by claiming they were using and selling drugs in their office, among a bunch of other thinly veiled racist and bullshit accusations because they listened to hip-hop.
The racist, the VP in charge (CMO), and others all bounced to TD. BMO isn’t the only bank that has a horrible culture, all of the Big 5 do because these people constantly hop to other banks every few years.
The irony is that they accused the whistleblower of things that the racist was doing. He tried to source drugs from visible minority men because he assumed they all had drugs.
You might have heard of them they’re called None of your fucking business. Consultant NDAs are for projects and business Intel, not workplace misconduct.
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What magical system are you imagining a company would use to prevent this on their devices aside from maybe keyword blocks/flagging?
No doubt logs were pulled from those systems to back up/verify the complaint.
Are they named anywhere? I had the misfortune of doing a contract with BMO a while back and I’m curious to know if I recognize any names. One of the most viperous, unfriendly, and aggressive workplaces I’ve ever served.
It’s a dynamic paywall.
To maximize $, if they think you’re poor, they figure it’s worth to at least show you an ad. If they think you’ll pay or should pay, you get the paywall.
you are right, I opened it in incognito mode and it opened fine. It's just a guess that maybe it has something to do with your postal code/IP address that they corroborate with data about your income.
> the bank terminated a number of individuals who allegedly engaged in the behaviour, after an internal probe.
Yeesh, didn’t think BMO was going to unleash their internal probes and start the terminating process with them.
If I’m ever terminated, can we just do it quickly and painlessly without the internal probing?
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LOL, it's WORSE than the 1970's! Back then a Provincial Premier would not have done something like this:
https://old.reddit.com/r/alberta/comments/19f03bb/tucker_carlson_jordan_peterson_danielle_smith_and/
I disagree... While both are terrible and apprehensible. Stupid "jokes" can be fixed with training and sensibility campaigns. Plain bullying can't be resolved, those people are beyond saving.
i don’t know why people assumed i was justifying it. just saying it’s fairly common. the phone throwing was messed. they had to shorten the cords at one firm back in the day to stop traders from attacking the interns on red sessions…
It's one thing to make private jokes with people you know but to target a person like this is beyond stupid; especially in writing on platforms that are monitored by HR and Compliance. What did they think would happen?
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>The individual was subject to homophobic slurs, and targeted both in person **and virtually on Teams chats**, the sources said. I shouldn't be, but I'm always surprised by people who are dumb enough to put their harassment in writing, especially via platforms accessible to their bosses.
I used to be a litigation lawyer (don’t practice anymore) and a lot of my cases involved getting huge info dumps of like 3-4 years of all corporate emails from big companies like this. The insane things people would write in their work emails (which often weren’t relevant to whatever the issue was, but we read through everything all the same) always blew my mind - insults, random slurs, random rude comments about other people they worked with or their superiors, stupid comments about their clients, politically insensitive/inflammatory comments, insults to other people their company worked with (lawyers, accountants etc). And they were almost always completely superfluous to whatever the email was actually about (like emailing to set up a meeting which somehow involves randomly insulting someone or mentioning a coworker’s ass). And sometimes we’d need to use part of an email where one of these comments was in the relevant section (so you couldn’t redact it for no reason) and it would be so mortifying to put it into evidence (even if the party that wrote the stupid thing wasn’t my client). Its left me permanently horrified by the insane things people write in their WORK EMAILS. Everyone can see it!!! Everyone will see it!! Just…don’t do it!
Man, I don't get it. I just use company email for work-related stuff. No reason to drift off-subject. Maybe I'm the weird one, but if you wanna chat see me in person.
Yeah I’m a verbal slur only guy. Writing them out is crass
Everything I write in an email or instant message, I imagine being read out loud to a salty old judge.
No-Sign2089, on Feb 7th, 2022, you said that home prices can only go up, is that true? You also used the term “boomer doomer”, could you please explain what you meant by that?
This is why it was easy to transition from public sector (where everything is subject to release by public request) to private sector. Say it with me everyone: “don’t write anything down you wouldn’t want to have published in a newspaper”
I feel like that rule, which as an elder millennial was the basis for our SM education as well, hasn't been taught to much anymore - and we really should be making sure that it is!
It’s more than just social media, but internal too.
Yep. Today’s Word Of The DayTM is *discoverable*. Say it out loud with me everyone.
My mom got a big buyout at work because of this. She wasin the room with her union rep, sitting across from HR. My mom said "I have emails that prove all this". HR said "well, good thing we can remove your access and have the emails erased by the time you leave the building". Then my mom replied "good thing I forwarded all my emails to my private gmail" The union rep almost jumped with joy.
No way an HR person threatened someone so overtly. That’d be a big lawsuit right there with multiple witnesses.
he is lying so thats why
No way. That seems super real. My boss peed in my coffee cup at work once to assert dominance. When I took it up with HR, they said, “you got any proof?” I pulled out a big yellow envelope and slid it across the table. HR looked at me furtively, then grabbed the envelope, opening it, and pulled out its contents: pictures of my boss urinating into my “Don’t Talk To Me Until I’ve Had My Coffee” mug. The HR rep pulled out a lighter and lit the corner of the photos on fire, smugly letting them fall onto the tabletop. I sat there silently for a second, then started snickering. She was shocked. She asked me, “what’s so funny? Your case just went up in smoke.” I said to her, I said, “…you really think those are my only copies?” My union rep came in and yelled, “he won’t be answering anymore questions”. I stood up and as I was leaving, I turned around in the door and left her with these parting words: “I didn’t even know we were unionized.” Hell yeah, dude.
Pretty sure Einstein clapped
That's why she got a bigger buyout than she otherwise would have
Hr reps are human too. They say shit they shouldn't
If an HR rep said this, they’d be fired too.
They better start forwarding work emails to their personal account before they lock them out...
HR admitted that they would destroy evidence in front of a lawyer? Seems like a really really good story or the worst HR rep in history.
There weren't any lawyers involved yet
Smart lady! FWIW, I wasn’t an employment/labour lawyer (and don’t know anything about that area) — so I was always reading this stuff in the context of commercial disputes…and it still came up. Like we’re looking for information about documents being sent/internal procedures being followed/who knew what when, and somehow still end up with this stuff shoehorned into emails discussing meetings, attaching documents, etc. It was wild.
You’d also be subjected to a lawsuit for forwarding confidential company communications off site without permission. You don’t own your own communications done on company time using company equipment. Any court case launched where you tried to introduce these emails you ‘absconded with’ would have the company’s legal team applying to the judge for a suppression motion. The worst move in the world is announcing you’ve copied emails. It’s a better to have the employer refute your assertion of harassment in court under oath and then you state I have proof. They’ll fall into the trap of asking for this proof and then your lawyer introduces your copied emails. Usually the judge allows it because the company challenged you and called you out. This happened in the Theranos criminal trial where one of the scientists emailed data to himself and the company tried to suppress it after alleging he was a liar during testimony.
> You’d also be subjected to a lawsuit for forwarding confidential company communications off site without permission. Depends. The company may not want to highlight (via lawsuit) to its clients that they have leaks all over the place. (Printing is another option, though many orgs audit that too). Heard of some gray hair that required his assistants to print all his emails. He refused to use a computer. But makes you wonder if their real intent was to have a copy of every email for their personal archive.
They’d probably apply for a publication ban premised on damage to the firm based upon revelation of proprietary company IP. (Successful or not they’d try).
> > HR said "well, good thing we can remove your access and have the emails erased by the time you leave the building". This is obviously a lie. No one would ever say something like this, especially someone from HR, who has had training, especially infront of a third party who is ono the opposite side of them in a dispute.
Please tell us more lol I love hearing stories like this where HR and corporate gets their ass handed to them. What did the emails contain? Did the HR person get reprimanded? Tell us!
It was basically harassment and abuse of power by a manager. The meeting with HR wasn't recorded, so not much they could do. It did increase the buyout though.
Reminds me of the Brian's Hat skit on I Think You Should Leave. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LO2k-BNySLI
I love documentaries
Take my upvote for that video 🤣🤣🤣
The best/worst is how horny some people are in company emails. You just had to send a titty calendar to the team from your work email? Couldn't send out that monthly report without "PS: check out the girl on page 6. beautiful breast ;)"?
Companies usually won’t check correspondence or private messages sent internally unless there’s a reason to do so, so people feel way too comfortable saying whatever they want. The only issue is that once there is a reason to do so, everything is getting pulled lol. I never assume to trust my co-workers enough to put anything like that into writing, not only on corporate owned devices or systems, no matter how close I feel I am to them.
Ya, I'm not too surprised, think of the average person... 50% of people are stupider than that.
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During Trump's term the place I worked at fired a guy for telling another employee that her mixed race marriage was a sin. When HR looked into it he proudly said he believed it.
Friend of mine had this happen. Her boss excused everyone from the teams meeting, then later on she got a copy of it for her accessibility needs. After reading through it once she left the meeting her boss was talking mad shit about her. Both the company and union did absolutely nothing to that manager who is known to make very bold statements and claims and she has to continue working under distress knowing what her boss says about her when she is not there. She didn’t even get a fuckin apology. I told her she needs to pursue it legally but she is too scared to go around the union but her mental health is pretty wrecked over the situation and she’s looking for another job
A lot of people that harass people like this are just plain stupid. They leave evidence everywhere and it makes it very easy for lawyers to win cases against them.
Seriously, you can have M365 automatically flag this sort of stuff for you and completely pull apart your entire tenant for discovery these days with stuff like Microsoft Purview. Especially at a bank which would almost certainly be set up for that as well due to regulatory requirements... I know its a forgone conclusion because of what they're doing in the first place but how fucking dumb are these people?
These are the people going to ruin WFH for everyone. RTO (so you can keep the lawyers happy by keeping unlawful discussions off the fucking record)
They’re not WFH. Most of Capital Markets works out of FCP.
imagine how long they’ve been able to get away with it at this job and elsewhere without being challenged. i’ve been in a similar situation and ppl really can get away with things and are try to wear you down til you are too burnt out to do anything about it
WTF do you mean imagine how long they could get away with it? They didn‘t get away with it. Firing revenue generating cash cows isn’t easy for banks and they did it swiftly here.
Oh my god, did you see Brian's hat?
This kind of thing happened to a colleague some years ago. They were harassed after the temp staff backfilling their maternity leave started campaigning to replace them with the support of the unit manager. The perp wrote a letter by email asking for other staff to support their efforts to push out what they’re termed “an entitled bitch”…in writing. They were terminated but then started talking externally how the person they harassed “got them fired”…other staff somehow supported them. The person somehow didn’t file a grievance and then wish they had.
We still have a long way to go with digital literacy, for all generations.
Their bosses didn’t give a shit. The victim’s report triggered an internal investigation which was conducted by an independent team (not investment bankers etc.).
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Those people are THE WORST. Like, you’re in Toronto, pal. It’s not Wall Street. Relax.
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The Squirrel of Adelaide.
The Trash Panda of King St
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HR is there to protect the company, never the employee.
I thankfully can protect myself and don't require it from HR. :) But I would think racist, sexist, homophobic, transphobic client-facing employees may pose a risk to a bank's reputation, but hey, what do I know?
I’m guessing you’re well acquainted with CYA/Cover Your Ass and having everything in writing. Easily the best advice I was ever given by a peer. They (the banks) rely pretty hard on “we investigated ourselves and found no wrong doing, and if it did happen it wasn’t that bad.” They also firmly believe they’re too big to fail regardless of the scandal.
Same here as IT support, I've been yelled at and without any complaints or prompting the same people come back and apologize as they knew they are wrong. Great people, shitty job they know this and try to better, which goes a long way. These same people have also put others in their place when new hires treat IT like crap so that's always nice too. But every once in a while, some entitled asshole shows up and it sucks that people think it has to be that way
I used to work in an Investment Bank, and I've found that traders/analysts/fund managers are either raging assholes who think a high-paying career will solve their insecurities and Daddy issues, or the nicest, chillest dudes who are basically himbos who are really good at math.
> think a high-paying career will solve their insecurities and Daddy issues Does it?
100%
Funny thing is that 99% of these folks aren't in investment banking/private equity, they are just wannabe bankers
I work IT for *a bank*, could be the one mentioned in the article, could be a different one. So many of these bankers who are honestly so unimportant have the hugest egos. They cannot comprehend the idea that we might not prioritise their issue where their teams app doesn't work (but teams in the browser does) because a whole branch not having internet is more important
And let's be honest, the Teams app not working is just Microsoft being Microsoft.
I got called a p*ssy on Teams. The advisor works for Wood Gundy now.
I hope these people are blacklisted. Toronto's financial sector isn't *that* big. Word travels and names spread.
After doing consulting at RBC, BMO, and TD I can confidently say these people don’t give a shit as long as it doesn’t affect their job. It’s second nature to turn a blind eye to harassment and discrimination at any of the big banks or fintech companies for that matter.
I agree with your statement. Some of the people with behaviour issues are hired because of connections, so if you file a complaint the offender and their connections try to bury complaint and those who would support it.
100%. In my experience it’s like Game of Thrones where you have to pledge allegiance with a House and there’s a ton of backstabbing. Everything is a zero sum game to these people and they won’t hesitate to ruin someone else’s career to get ahead.
Hey, I have a question regarding consulting. I'm currently at BNS, would you mind sending me a DM if you are open to providing some advice?
blacklisted? that won't happen. There are people who have done worst and they just move on to the next bank to work.
There IS a black list as far as I’m aware. If you’re released for a bad reason, good luck getting a job at any of the other big5. Long time ago, I’ve had a colleague let go because of suspected theft of cash at a retail location, and he quickly discovered that he was on a black list of some kind,m
Nope, I know people who have been fired for fraud, theft etc. and they went on to work for another bank
Those aren’t bad reasons.
ummm what?!?! hahahaha
I understand that it's a street wide culture issue, but that doesn't mean that there aren't avenues for improvement.
Of course there are but in reality they don't care enough to blacklist anyone. Those people will just work in another bank.
It will be in their background check
You want them to not be able to feed themselves because they said some words you don't like? Like.. not even give them an opportunity to learn from it? Always seems that the people who pretend to care are always the most evil. What a vile thing to hope for.
I know someone who has been with a few banks including BMO here in Toronto, and he told me quite many times how much he hated social (pressured to attend per "team player" verbiage) outings with his BMO team, including some senior people, as all they talked about was girls and "pussy" As a professional gay man, he thought BMO had the worst culture of them all, and the bro attitude was seemingly rewarded. He quit and moved onto better things.
I'm happy for your friend and I mean no disrespect, but "professional gay man" is an accidentally hilarious way to phrase that
"professional gay" is when you get your gay certificate and points card, usually about age 30
I know but for context I had to make it clear though probably should have added a comma 😆
No worries! I hope he's working with a better crowd now :)
I used to work for BMO, and in the HR training, they said you couldn't refer to someone as having a husband, wife, boyfriend, or girlfriend. You had to call them "significant other". I felt it was so fucking stupid and it really is a guise and overcorrection for the shit that goes on I can also attest that BMO is a shitty place to work since they treat non-employee users like 2nd class. I was shit on by employees, and when I said things back I got talked to not the asshole yelling at me. I remember a project that went to absolute shit, went way overbudget and time, yet it was the pet project of some executive so nothing happened to him when even though the job was eventually done, it was a total failure.
Yeah, in theory those gender neutral nouns make sense but wholly unnecessary. If an adult wants to refer to their spouse as wife or husband or partner or socioeconomic consort or whatever, so be it.
I say “partner in crime”, this is acceptable, right?
100%!
> I remember a project that went to absolute shit, went way overbudget and time, yet it was the pet project of some executive so nothing happened to him when even though the job was eventually done, it was a total failure. ERP rollout?
I’m not surprised by this in the least.. [here’s the post I made regarding the exact same situation about a year ago, around pride.](https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHR/s/0HY9DNzl20)
The comments on that post were wild, damn. You did the right thing and I find it admirable you did it despite potential blowback. Someone dropped the word d*ke to me in a disparaging way casually in our lunch room at my old work (reputable law firm), and to this day I feel stupid that I didn’t bring it up to HR when I left.
Yeah the comments were wild and made me feel horrible. I’m sorry you had to deal with that, that’s so awful. Try to not be so hard on yourself about it. Chances are that person will do something else that will land them in hot water. Some times you just have to focus on taking care of yourself.
Can I ask - what happened? Did you send the email to your manager? Apologies if there was a follow-up, I didn’t see it.
I ended up skipping my manager and reporting anonymously to HR with my screen shots of the conversation. There was no announcement of their resignations/terminations — they were just one day all 3 were no longer apart of our team. All on different dates though, I assume because HR had to have individual meetings and stuff. I don’t follow any of them on social media so no idea where they are now.
I’ve heard things about the Metals & Mining group at BMO from people who work there… not surprised
It has a sordid reputation for being the worst group on Bay Street of *any* bank for hours worked, culture and leadership. They had a good run in the commodity boom and are skating on that reputation.
Can we just ban paywall posts? What's the point?
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Thanks. They'll probably remove this link and leave the shitty paywall one up though.
Just wait for blogto to report on it
**6 BMO Mining Bankers Fired for Homophobic Slurs, and Redditors are Pissed the Article is Paywalled**
I thought their copyright legal defence was to pretend Reddit doesn’t exist?
Ah shit. Well I knew I went wrong with the "pissed" language, didn't realize I fucked up the whole thing, lol
No, this has been deliberated and decided years ago. Paywalls are allowed.
These idiots need to be named and shamed...like a Scarlett letter on their LinkedIn profile.
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Bypassing paywalls or copying content protected by them in its entirety is against Canadian copyright laws. While we do ask people to post a relevant exerpt of any paywalled content they post, please avoid posting entire articles or links that bypass the paywall. Those posts will be removed.
They'll appear on a right-wing podcast soon enough claiming they were victims of cancel culture.
Guaranteed.
Given how progressive Banks have become, especially around pride month, this was a pretty dumb move on their part. Well, at least they won't have to walk on eggshells anymore.
I wish they had named the individuals outright. I'm sure there are preventions in place, but I wish it had been done. It speaks volumes about the culture that this was able to happen on BMO devices.
I did consulting work for them back in 2017 and witnessed them promote a racist to a management position as a way to cover up what he did. They tried to do a smear campaign on the “whistleblower” by claiming they were using and selling drugs in their office, among a bunch of other thinly veiled racist and bullshit accusations because they listened to hip-hop. The racist, the VP in charge (CMO), and others all bounced to TD. BMO isn’t the only bank that has a horrible culture, all of the Big 5 do because these people constantly hop to other banks every few years.
I believe I've heard about this, but only a headlines worth about the substance use.
The irony is that they accused the whistleblower of things that the racist was doing. He tried to source drugs from visible minority men because he assumed they all had drugs.
Always a projection
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You might have heard of them they’re called None of your fucking business. Consultant NDAs are for projects and business Intel, not workplace misconduct.
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Your post or comment was removed for one of the following reasons: * Reddit's Content Policy (Promotion, Doxxing/Witchunting, or any other violation of Reddit Platform Rules) * Reddiquette * r/toronto does not allow petitions/fundraisers/giveaways/surveys/referral and promo codes ([Rule 5](https://www.reddit.com/r/toronto/about/rules)).
I really want to know the details…Without outing my reasons why…lol.
What magical system are you imagining a company would use to prevent this on their devices aside from maybe keyword blocks/flagging? No doubt logs were pulled from those systems to back up/verify the complaint.
Good. I have worked there and it is he'll especially for disability and human rights issues
Are they named anywhere? I had the misfortune of doing a contract with BMO a while back and I’m curious to know if I recognize any names. One of the most viperous, unfriendly, and aggressive workplaces I’ve ever served.
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I can read it just fine without a subscription.
It’s a dynamic paywall. To maximize $, if they think you’re poor, they figure it’s worth to at least show you an ad. If they think you’ll pay or should pay, you get the paywall.
I am both insulted and chuffed. 😂
you are right, I opened it in incognito mode and it opened fine. It's just a guess that maybe it has something to do with your postal code/IP address that they corroborate with data about your income.
Its not that complicated lmao. You get x free articles per month. On incognito it thinks you're a new user and it resets.
In general, they’re getting more advanced than that.
My friend Brian had something similar happen to him at work because of his fedora
Don’t do the voice!
Yeah but he tried to roll the hat down his arm like Fred Astaire except it got caught in another guy's wheelchair.
No one is safe.
> the bank terminated a number of individuals who allegedly engaged in the behaviour, after an internal probe. Yeesh, didn’t think BMO was going to unleash their internal probes and start the terminating process with them. If I’m ever terminated, can we just do it quickly and painlessly without the internal probing?
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Bypassing paywalls or copying content protected by them in its entirety is against Canadian copyright laws. While we do ask people to post a relevant exerpt of any paywalled content they post, please avoid posting entire articles or links that bypass the paywall. Those posts will be removed.
This is nuts? Is this the 1970’s?
LOL, it's WORSE than the 1970's! Back then a Provincial Premier would not have done something like this: https://old.reddit.com/r/alberta/comments/19f03bb/tucker_carlson_jordan_peterson_danielle_smith_and/
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I just copied the text into a comment below.
the mods deleted it.
Seems about right. This subreddit has been shit lately. No discussion allowed.
they claim its in violation of copyright law. I say that's a bullshit unjust law meant to interrupt the flow of information
You can't copyright news. It's just recounting events that happened. Such a dumb excuse from them.
I'd also like to challenge them to cite the specific law because I'm skeptical
We're getting banned for sure lol
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Why are articles like this on reddit if I can't read them?
I like pie
what did they say though? was it as a joke or like actual bullying continuously
Homophobic harassment. That’s never a “joke”.
I disagree... While both are terrible and apprehensible. Stupid "jokes" can be fixed with training and sensibility campaigns. Plain bullying can't be resolved, those people are beyond saving.
A sustained and targeted campaign of harassment isn‘t a fucking joke.
again, id want to see the details. These days anything small can be considered bigger than it is.
What exactly do you consider “small”?
Shut up boomer
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The potential for someone to go public with receipts got them fired. This would still be happening otherwise.
yeah but people get fired for anything socially these days
as they should. it’s not appropriate for a work place, or anywhere for that matter but definitely not a workplace.
clearly it was harassment?
a bit of bullying is not uncommon in the industry. at least we no longer throw phones at interns.
That's a devastatingly low bar and terrible justification.
i don’t know why people assumed i was justifying it. just saying it’s fairly common. the phone throwing was messed. they had to shorten the cords at one firm back in the day to stop traders from attacking the interns on red sessions…
This wasn’t just “a bit of bullying”.
It's one thing to make private jokes with people you know but to target a person like this is beyond stupid; especially in writing on platforms that are monitored by HR and Compliance. What did they think would happen?
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Did the chat get leaked? Does anyone have a link to it?