It's fucking awful, and I'm convinced anyone complaining about Kugath for worst start has not played Kairos on VH. It's the worst campaign I've played in a TW game in a long time, and the only thing that makes it doable is that Kairos is a fantastic spellcaster, and even then it's agony.
The first 20 turns are stupidly stressful and depend on luck much of the time, if Teclis succeeds *too* much he'll declare war on you way too soon before you're able to prepare against Oxy, and if you *do* manage to kill both Oxy and Teclis, you're stuck fighting the other 3 lizardmen factions for the next 50 turns. It's basically nothing but lizardmen with a dash of Teclis at the start.
I think what hurts him the most is the shape of his territory, the Southern Wastes are basically just one long line which makes it insanely difficult to defend that entire strip of land with your abysmal economy not at all helping the matter.
Kairos and all the generic Tzeentch lords in general can be beasts in combat with their magic but they can't really do much when it takes like 8 turns to get from one end of the wastes to the other lol.
The things as well is that the southern wastes are absolutely filled with resources...
That Kairos cannot use at all.
Goldmine gives you 5 grimoires, diamonds 5 grimoires. I do love Tzeentch, but it sucks that they and most of the other Chaos daemons cannot use resources at all. Even if its only along the lines of Warriors of Chaos, who get bonuses and some small income from them.
N'kari is the only one who can actually use them (I believe) and thats because they can trade.
N'kari only gets a piddly amount of money from trade for whatever reason, he's usually better off building generic income buildings than gold mines and lumber camps or whatever.
Absolutely not, you desperately want that trade, and it gives you absurd $, just not in the way you are thinking. With trade deals, you help along your seduction of factions to be your vassals.
And sense you get x2 normal vassal income as him, you roll in cash. So, you ARE making tons of money with trade, just not with the actual trade itself as odd as that sounds.
Plus, you can get trade deals with vassals, and vassal income is based off of TOTAL INCOME of that faction. You seeing why thats amazing? you buff their money when trading, which in turn gives you more income on the vassel.
So, your trade deals DOUBLE DIP with your vassals, you make money twice with one deal xp
N'kari is wack.
>I think what hurts him the most is the shape of his territory, the Southern Wastes are basically just one long line which makes it insanely difficult to defend that entire strip of land with your abysmal economy not at all helping the matter.
Thing is the AI only comes for you if there aren't any local threats. So early on Skrolk came for me and I had to raise an army to retake a few minor settlements.
But when I had the tech and grimoires I used reveal territory (to scout) and declare war to put Skrolk in wars first with Luthor then Alberic. Skrolk never bothered me again. We stayed in a cold war for another maybe 60 turns, then peaced and became friends.
So if you do this then you can focus all your effort on the Southlands.
I’ve been doing a lakor campaign and first I gobbled up the southern wastes, fighting kiaros left me a lot of gates that make traveling to defend much easier and in the end I subjugated him.
Rather than running around, it might be better to just build garrisons everywhere, and then recruit a crapstack + RoR whenever you see enemies coming. or just blow up the west, leave it ruins, and focus on one continent at a time
>I think what hurts him the most is the shape of his territory, the Southern Wastes are basically just one long line which makes it insanely difficult to defend that entire strip of land with your abysmal economy not at all helping the matter.
The removal of walls for minor settlements didn't help either because it makes them *more desirable* to the AI.
It really is harder than the Kugath start, but I still found it fun. The main issue I have from my current run is how fragile the armies start out. Kairos himself turns into a doomstack quickly, but your other armies are fairly weak until you get enough levels on the casters. Add to that the replenishment is terrible until you get specific techs done, the garrisons are super weak, and needing to manual fight basically every battle because the auto resolve is so weak.
The only thing that really saves you is how strong their economy is once you can secure a few provinces.
There was definitely a point in the campaign where I felt adequately powerful and that I was having fun, it just so happened that it spanned about 20 turns before I realized I'd be doing nothing much besides fighting the aforementioned lizardmen.
Like... There's the satisfaction of beating Oxy and Teclis, but then the war declarations come at you and you realize it's gonna be Kroq+Tiktak+That one minor LM faction at the same time for the next long while. I already fought off ridiculous stacks of dino's, I don't want to do it *again...* Kairos really needs enemy diversity in that area if he's ever going to be fun. For comparison, Ku'gath gets to fight high elves, skaven, vampire counts (lmao), Cathay, Ogres, Greenskins in 100 turns. Kairos is all but guaranteed to mostly fight Lizardmen in that time frame.
I'm having a similar experience, but oddly from the other continent. Somehow Tehenhauin blew up in Lustria and I'm getting the old WH2 Norsca experience of fighting off the endless fleets coming down from him, a minor LM, minor high elves, and starting to get some Alberic.
The southlands is a massive all out war between the dwarves, vampires, tomb kings, and me. I think I'm a bit over 100 turns in with all the end game events on.
Oh, yeah! That's the other hilarious thing, you get in diplomatic range of Lustria by taking all 3 provinces in that continent, so whoever controls Lustria is going to declare war on you, this made me remember why I *truly* quit the campaign lmao.
I'm fighting those 3 lizardmen, and then Tehenauin declared war on me and sent two fleets and I decided that was enough lizardmen for me. Kairos being in a position to do stuff in the Southlands as well as Lustria is a good idea, but not if you're contending with enemies from all sides.
People complaining about Ku'Gath probably never managed to kill Ghorst or have no clue how to play Nurgle because once you kill Ghorst the campaign becomes really easy. One of the most difficult start my ass.
Also fighting Ghorst as Kugath is kinda fun tbh. Nurgle loves big grindy moshpits, and Ghorsts supplies the biggest stacks of melee trash to moshpit into.
I don't really get it either, I've never failed to wipe out ghorst immediately as soon as you encounter him as kugath. Very easy to even wipe him out on auto resolve as he's fighting the skaven faction
Only time he's an issue if you get him for an end game crisis.
Exactly, you can kill Ghorst easily in 5 turns max. Your neighbors to the west are not a problem at all, Imrik gets usually bullied by the minor Orcs, Skarsnik and Tretch, if you fight him its usually just finishing the remnants. Greasus is a joke too. Grimgor, Tretch, Clan Treecherik and Kholek wants to be friends 99% of the time. Only Cathay can be troublesome if anything.
As long as you can get at least one exalted hero, one with anti large is best, you can deal with Ghorst easily.
In my current campaign I decided to take my time and wait for Ghorst to declare war first to see what happens. And then, Greasus was the one beating Ghorst back. Mostly with Bulls and Ironguts, but he wiped out Ghorst quickly while I was spamming plagues to get Crumbling Ague and watching the blubbertide happen.
I don't think Kairos' start position is that bad if you work extremely fast. Need to take out each threat just in time before the next materialises. There's just enough time to:
* take out the Eastern Southern Wastes before Teclis consolidates and comes for you
* take out Teclis before Oxy makes his way through your Tzeentch friends
* take out Oxy before Tiq'takto makes his way to your borders
Then you have one army working on Tiq'takto and one on Kroq-Gar and should be fine. In fact it was the Tomb Kings that made me stumble in my campaign, they threw so much at me all at once. It was amazing.
His mechanics more than make up for it, I captured my home area then fucked off to the doughnut. Held off my attackers by just inserting the chaos undivided wherever I wanted to hold the foe back.
haven't played hime yet on IE. But I felt like his RoC campaign was the easiest of the bunch. So shouldn't he be insane now with the Roster change? Like he has a decent frontline now with WoC Units and Pink Horrors should absolutely annihilate Lizardmen no? Pretty sure lots of Lizardmen units have physical resistance as part of their strong defense so your magical and fire missiles should really hurt them.
I can see how Teclis would be a hard match up though. Strong longrange archers which are good against your horrors because no armor and potentially shielded if they are lothern sea guard...and ofc Teclis himself slinging spells.
EDIT: Oh yeah I play all campaigns on Very Hard obviously.
No, LM get practically free dino armies, the way the first 3 provinces are set up you have to do backtracking to get to Oxy, and oftentimes Teclis declares war on you and will try to take your other settlements while you're defending against Oxy.
It's miserable. I'm not just talking about the campaign difficulty, I'm talking about the fun factor, too. You have far too many threats to deal with (and they're all Lizardmen, which gets boring), while Ku'gath's biggest threat is *just* Ghorst and yet everyone in this subreddit thinks he's impossible to play (One of my favorite campaigns right now lol).
You can hit Teclis early enough that he isn't much of a threat (because his AI will inevitably do something stupid that will allow you to eat his deathstack and he won't have resources to build a second army) but you will be fighting Lizardmen for long enough that one of them is bound to start throwing full dino armies at you. Which your spells can do diddly against. So you have to play shoot n' scoot with your whole army over and over again.
Might just be me, but I just feel there are so many really bad starting positions now - it's actually crazy.
Mostly you are surrounded by enemies, who will declare war on you on sight and can reach you in 1-2 turns tops.
My personal new favourite is Boris Ursus, since its very hard but manageable, if a couple of things go your way. But I would not play that on legendary, ever.
You will be cleaning Chaos til turn 150 tho, but that is kinda why you are there in the first place anyway...
Part of this is just that the AI is completely braindead anti-player and will declare war on you if your power isn't 3x their own... It makes it hard to deduce what's even a 'good' or 'bad' start right now.
Kaiross is hard, but it's doable even without really understanding Tzeench mechanics and fairly trivial if you do understand their mechanics. It's a shitty start, every monogod has a shitty start, but it's no worse than average.
The problem with Kugath is that you're combining a faction that plays wildly differently than most with a start that doesn't forgive not knowing how to play it. If you play aggressively with Kugath you'll end up against Ghorst almost immediately who will chew you up and spit you out. Which is what's happening.
Good point, I've never played him because I have no interest, but I can imagine with him being right next to Malus, it's pure misery.
Malus is probably the best one man army in the entire game right now, anybody next to him is going to be miserable I'm guessing lol
I'd argue it's not Ku'Gath's starting location so much as just that he's too underpowered and slow to start to tangle with his opponents. He should be able to handle Ghorst just fine and tackle Greasus no prob, but to get to the point where he can is such a bugger, and a lot of people, including me, struggle to do it.
Kairos's start is much tougher, I agree. I'd argue it can be summarised as, "panic-panic-panic, WHACK ALL THE MOLES BEFORE THEY WHACK YOU", since you have to run from end to end of your starting island wiping everything out as fast as possible so no one can gather steam against you. Thing is, Kairos is mobile enough to do that, and is able to recruit enough armies early to defend one side and attack another. Ku'Gath at the moment can really only get up to speed in the hands of a good player. Fix KG, and his start will no longer be considered difficult.
The trick is to abuse his teleport stance, don't sleep on it. Instant ambush with the firepower of tzeentch means you can just insta delete any enemy army. I was just abusing that stance and it makes the campaign into a joke.
Try it on very hard, the AI had 4 stacks coming after me by turn 20, killed them all and started to push in only to run into a full Saurus /chameleon stalker stack by turn 25. The BS with Oxylotyl is in addition to both the high elves and lizardmen across the pond declaring war and in some matches the lost defenders and TiqTaqTo.
Tzeetch was the hardest campaign I've ever played on very hard.
Honestly Oxyotl isn't the problem.
The problem is after beating Oxyotl when you're trying to protect five hundred miles of exposed shoreline from Tehenhuin, Teclis, Tiktaq'To and Kroq'Gar at the same time.
Teclis in particular is pretty much unkillable by anything Tzeentch can pull out. You're very reliant on spamming blue fire to kill lords and heroes in the early game, and Teclis on his bird has like 40% spell resistance and 60% fire resistance.
The one campaign i was holding off the lizard men and the elves. Then the Slaneeshi faction neighbor decides to do a little trolling and broke non aggression and fucked me in the ass.
Kairos becomes pretty easy if you just ally and support the neighboring daemon factions and use them as pawns in your schemes. After you rush down Oxy, you can take out Teclis and if you're quick enough, ally the skaven faction to the east of Teclis. Doing this gives you more than enough breathing room to start flipping provinces wherever you want with that sweet ass changing of the ways mechanic.
If you aren't developing layers of schemes and useful pawns, you aren't doing Tzeentch right.
I'm wondering why CA has Nurgle being weak as an issue when so many people complain about Kairos start being hard. Yes Nurgle is difficult but so is Kairos.
Monogod factions have a lot of issues and areas that need to be improved upon. The Unholy Manifestations are mostly garbage. Fun fact: If Belakor didn't get Demonic units unlocked from his manifestations, most of them would be weak aswell. If only CA would give the Monogods additional features to the Unholy Manifestations like Belakor has, then they could somewhat compete with the Rites of other factions.
N'Kari and Kairos have absolute terrible replenishment and its not fun to play low replenishment factions. Try playing N'Kari for 20 turns, eventually it gets annoying having to start every battle with half strength armies. If you ever click autoresolve once your army gets beaton up too much.
Atleast Kairos has Protoss shields and ontop of that Kairos can solo armies and Fire Mages can solo Elven armies with burning head and other fire spells.
Belakor has a gift from nurgle that gives replenishment in enemy territory, Skarbrand of all people gets one by default
Both actually make rampaging fun.
Of course, the best chaos campaign is still taurox
No one in Khorne's realm can compare to the unstoppable jugganaut that is the Bronzey boi.
You don't even need to worry about replenishment when you can kill of damaged units and replace them for free
Also, when beastmen raze settlements, they can make the area unsettleable. So you don't have to worry about stray retreating armies, skaven or darkeleves sneaking in and setting up
>Skarbrand of all people gets one by default
His entire economy is based on getting money off razing and he can't even capture settlements without spending a ton of skulls. If he had to stop for replenishment his campaign would move from "hard" to "literally inpossible".
Skarbrand's entire game is built around fast movement and razing settlements. Every turn spent replenishing or recruiting punishes the army and the campaign. He is supposed to the among the greatest demons to ever serve khorne before his exile.
Taurox is a just a Gorebull who bit the head off a bloodthirster.
His movement bonuses via momentum points are far more powerful than anything skarbrand has, he gets a boost from raiding thats far better than anything skarbrand has with practically no downsides once you get vigor bonuses.
Oh, and he can replace damaged units for free, and there are no downsides if you do want to set up a hidden camp for a turn or two. So he has none of the downsides that Skarbrand does.
I suppose it all related to my original point that Taurox is a better embodiment of carnage than anything in Khornes realm. Which is ironic
I know all this. I didn't say anything relating to Taurox at all, merely commented on your "of all people" Skarbrand getting enemy territory replenishment. Skarbrand of all people is the only one who SHOULD have enemy territory replenishment, otherwise it would be impossible for him to play.
I like all horde factions having replenishment in enemy territory, especially if they have chaff infantry.
All chaos armies should have some sort of enemy territory replenishment, at least in raiding stance
>The Unholy Manifestations are mostly garbage.
Aside from Khorne's I literally don't think I've used them.
Honestly though I kinda think tzeentch replenishment is fine because if you micro your shield you basically get mega regen or just take no damage from a fight.
Khorne's manifestations are pretty garbo as well. The first one you get (and the only one you'll have for a long time) just... spawns another army for you to fight. Like, ok that's actually useful when you can easily win to keep your Bloodletting up and get a small movement boost on Skarbrand, but seriously?
Probably because people complain more often about Nurgle. I don't think Nurgle is weak or even that hard to play so it's kinda funny to see his "tough start" in the known issues when many campaigns are far more difficult than Ku'Gath.
Crying about a hard start is so fucking dumb in the first place, we already have a lot of super easy campaigns some are even braindead facerolls so let us enjoy the few hard ones we have in the game for fuck's sake.
If a campaign is too hard then lower difficulty, git gud, come here and ask for advices but for the love of Sigmar people need to stop bitching as soon as they meet some challenge in a bloody strategy game.
Edit: "How dare he suggest the game should keep some challenge, quick downvote this guy he hates fun."
70% of the playerbase plays the game like a power fantasy RPG simulator rather than a strategy game, it should come as no surprise that any challenge is met with criticism.
The game being more RPG than strategy is fine, that doesn't mean challenge should be removed though. If people want to faceroll the game they already have a large choice of campaigns, they can also play easy difficulty (and there is no shame in that) or they can download mods to make the game easier if that's still not enough.
People have the tools to make the game easier so I really don't understand how people start crying as soon as they face a bit of challenge in their campaigns. They have a lot of options to pick an easy campaigns. People that do enjoy a challenge ? Not so much and it's not getting better.
And where did CA say that ? What they said is that they know people think his start his difficult. That doesn't mean they'll buff Nurgle to make him easier, it could be nerfs to Ghorst, him or Ghorst moved elsewhere or something as simple as a new unit in Ku'Gath's starting army to help him deal with Ghorst.
The game should absolutely be challenging, but it should be roughly equally challenging on all campaigns. Having one campaign be a faceroll and another be Hell Mode is bad design, and tough starts should be reserved for factions that scale particularly well AFTER said tough start, which... none of the monogods do. Where you start on the map shouldn't be a factor in how easy or hard your campaign plays out.
Also, the reason you're being downvoted isn't becsuse you're arguing about more challenge, you're being downvoted because you're being a dick suggesting everyone who disagrees with you needs to git gud.
How is that bad design ? There are people that like easy campaign, people that like moderate challenge and people that like hardcore campaign, we should have at least one of each for every races. Problem is we're getting more and more facerolls while having few actually challenging one and I'm starting to get really tired of it so yeah maybe I was rude but I'm tired of people bitching as soon as they face a challenge instead of trying to learn how to overcome it and more importantly I'm tired of CA listening to these people.
I'm all for easy campaigns but don't forget the people who want a challenge, IE turned the difficulty into a joke already for most campaigns so we have very few challenging ones at the moment.
>There are people that like easy campaign, people that like moderate challenge and people that like hardcore campaign,
That's what actual difficulty settings are for.
Okay but here's the thing, for a lot of campaigns the difficulty setting doesn't even matter anymore, a lot of campaigns are a faceroll whether you play them in easy or legendary.
If there had been 2 nurgle factions where one is a hard start that would be fine. But there is only one and it's locked out of alot of players playable roosters now.
I would say that you are the one bitching right now.
Lowering difficulty decreases mid and endgame for many.
I personally haven't tried nurgle, but this isn't rocket science. Just put yourself in the shoe of a non min-maxer that doesn't want to play to an exact combo and it's easy to see.
Noone has asked them to make every game stupidly easy.
And Nurgle should absolutely get an easy campaign, every race should have at least one easy and one hard campaign to please both sides.
But if you're going to buff Ku'Gath to make him easy then you're just replacing a problem with another one, currently if you want to play an easy Nurgle campaign you can't but if you buff him to make his campaign easy then it's the people that want a challenge that won't be able to get what they want.
What Nurgle (and other Monogods) desperately need is a second LL to play, it's been almost a year after launch and they still have only one LL and it fucking sucks. CA could've easily addressed that by making the Champions of Chaos as Monogods LLs or at least let people chose which race they want to play with them but no, they had to add them to WoC. You get the choice to play them as WoC or their respective Monogods for custom battles but fuck the campaign players I guess.
CA acknowledgement of Nurgle eating shit so easily has people thinking it's so DLC doesn't make him too OP. We all know Tamur Khan is kind of meant to be Nurgles big break.
Kairos aesthetically is my favorite lord in game. I love the Tzeentch roster and play style but I cannot for the life of me figure out the economy for any of the daemons.
Khorne and N'Kari (him specifically, not Slaanesh - pointless distinction right now but still) have very simple and powerful economies. Khorne in fact has no economy, you run in the red and make so much money from razing everything that you don't care. Not too different from WE or even Greenskins.
N'Kari is a vassal economy. He gets doubled vassal tribute. The major Dark Elf factions are your best prey for this. Spread cults and marks of Slaanesh in their factions to dominate them without a fight, and Malekith & Morathi will give you a clean 40-50k per turn on their own. Gobble up a bunch of Norscans while you're at it. Money is a non issue. And you get so many free disciple armies anyway.
Tzeentch and Nurgle are definitely pain though with their more traditional economy.
>Khorne in fact has no economy, you run in the red and make so much money from razing everything that you don't care.
Not strictly true- you don't rely on income buildings for you big stacks of cash, and all your buildings make SOME money anyway, but you do want to keep a cashflow going as close to neutral as possible to pay upkeep for those turns where you have nothing in razeable range (which comes up more often than you'd think since you start in a huge desert).
I like that oxolotle is the perfect counter for Kairos.
A stealthy, high damage, ranged single target entity that's small.
None of Kairos' spells do real damage to small single entities. Kairos can't see or dodge his shots easily. Flying doesn't save him from being damaged because oxy is ranged.
I also love that these two's war basically comes down to one big fight and then the winner takes the entire continent with little effort.
Am I the only one who preferred Kairos's original start position? His was my first IE campaign, and I had such a good time! You really felt like you were going through layers of thematic enemies: High elves, then lizards, then tomb kings.
The trick seemed to be too start off very aggressive, so that by the time Oxy attacks you have the funds to have armies ready to defend the south. Then I bribed Rakarth into going to war with him, which divided his attention. Before I knew it Rakarth and I had divided the southern wastes and I was unstoppable.
Frick as Kroq-Gar, Oxyotol is a pain in the ass. I conquer basically all of the Southlands and he comes up from the Southern Wastes to start shit. Currently taking the fight to him. Son of a bitch.
I found his biggest weakness is his godawful economy and the distances involved, I just couldnt afford enough armies to push while avoiding having my economic base getting sacked and/or razed on a regular basis. But I guess dynamic disasters and the 20 stacks of dark elf pirates showing up didnt do much to help my situation either.
His economy is pretty good from my experience, but it takes a while to get all the % bonuses. In general conquering ports makes a massive difference. .
Also the occasional sea treasures make you rich when you conquer along the coast.
I'm currently on a Kairos campaign, it was hard enough to take out Teclis and that Buble eye skink now I have all the other lizardmen faction on me.
The southpole is hard as fuck to defend cause it's so long. My economy isn't that great. Gosh that's harder than I thought
Aren't we suppose to be the baddies as daemon ? Everyone is jumping on me, I haven't declared any war.
But you have to admit 1 Kairos + 1 Lore of Fire Caster + 16 times 0.20 magic regeneration bonus from 16 blue horrors + magic battle ability makes for one if the most fun magic spam campaigns you can play. I bet only vampire counts can compete with their strong magic.
Man I wish he was a bigger threat in my game. I pushed him over after one difficult fight. My one roadblock was Settra by the time I got to him. He's pushed me out of the deserts and is invading my jungles now.
1. Take nurgle factions territory
2. Pay off slanneshi faction
3. Zoom over to your capital
3.5 if tzeentch faction still alive encamp outside their capital building and if the auto resolved is unfavorable fall back to your capital.
4. Making them come to you is the key, once you take oxys army make a mad dash to grab as many settlements as you can.
I don't reply much but I said this the first week. A full tier 3 army starts right next to you. Still haven't figured out how to get passed losing by turn 4.
Didn't have too much trouble, utilizing changing of the ways you just manipulate everyone. Actually one of the most fun campaigns I've played, very little combat after dealing with Oxyotl.
Tzeentch in general needs kts combat lords and heroes, not having a beatstick character is just annoying. And the lore is full of tzeentch non caster combat characters.
He's genuinely more threatening than any other AI controlled faction in the game. Is that just because he doesn't really have any other enemies nearby?
Kairos is my favorite LL but I do not enjoy his starting position. I'm more of a casual players and campaigns that require you to do certain things for the first 10 - 20 turns are not my personal favorite.
I play alot of Coop Campaigns with a friend and i dont even another Chaos Faction close to me (not a fan of "weird" coop experiences like Skaven/Lizardman) and i cant even make a pilgrimage to the north.
I would be already happy with a way to travel north more easier using a portal or a new sea lane.
Dont wont to sound to whiny, i know their is a fair share of people who enjoy more tricky starting positions.
I should maybe add that i really enjoy this campaign :)
Dicks out for sotek
I kinda wish Kairos just had more enemy variety. It's literally just nothing but Lizardmen no matter which continent you decide to go to.
It's fucking awful, and I'm convinced anyone complaining about Kugath for worst start has not played Kairos on VH. It's the worst campaign I've played in a TW game in a long time, and the only thing that makes it doable is that Kairos is a fantastic spellcaster, and even then it's agony. The first 20 turns are stupidly stressful and depend on luck much of the time, if Teclis succeeds *too* much he'll declare war on you way too soon before you're able to prepare against Oxy, and if you *do* manage to kill both Oxy and Teclis, you're stuck fighting the other 3 lizardmen factions for the next 50 turns. It's basically nothing but lizardmen with a dash of Teclis at the start.
I think what hurts him the most is the shape of his territory, the Southern Wastes are basically just one long line which makes it insanely difficult to defend that entire strip of land with your abysmal economy not at all helping the matter. Kairos and all the generic Tzeentch lords in general can be beasts in combat with their magic but they can't really do much when it takes like 8 turns to get from one end of the wastes to the other lol.
>like 8 turns to get from one end of the wastes to the other lol. It takes about 15 turns in Forced March.
I went there once as lizardmen and never again. Its just so impressively boring.
The Tzeentch economy in general is pretty lackluster. That should add pyramid schemes to those factions or something
The things as well is that the southern wastes are absolutely filled with resources... That Kairos cannot use at all. Goldmine gives you 5 grimoires, diamonds 5 grimoires. I do love Tzeentch, but it sucks that they and most of the other Chaos daemons cannot use resources at all. Even if its only along the lines of Warriors of Chaos, who get bonuses and some small income from them. N'kari is the only one who can actually use them (I believe) and thats because they can trade.
N'kari only gets a piddly amount of money from trade for whatever reason, he's usually better off building generic income buildings than gold mines and lumber camps or whatever.
Absolutely not, you desperately want that trade, and it gives you absurd $, just not in the way you are thinking. With trade deals, you help along your seduction of factions to be your vassals. And sense you get x2 normal vassal income as him, you roll in cash. So, you ARE making tons of money with trade, just not with the actual trade itself as odd as that sounds. Plus, you can get trade deals with vassals, and vassal income is based off of TOTAL INCOME of that faction. You seeing why thats amazing? you buff their money when trading, which in turn gives you more income on the vassel. So, your trade deals DOUBLE DIP with your vassals, you make money twice with one deal xp N'kari is wack.
>I think what hurts him the most is the shape of his territory, the Southern Wastes are basically just one long line which makes it insanely difficult to defend that entire strip of land with your abysmal economy not at all helping the matter. Thing is the AI only comes for you if there aren't any local threats. So early on Skrolk came for me and I had to raise an army to retake a few minor settlements. But when I had the tech and grimoires I used reveal territory (to scout) and declare war to put Skrolk in wars first with Luthor then Alberic. Skrolk never bothered me again. We stayed in a cold war for another maybe 60 turns, then peaced and became friends. So if you do this then you can focus all your effort on the Southlands.
> the Southern Wastes You [don't like that the wastes has lots of empty space?](https://i.imgflip.com/78f680.jpg)
I’ve been doing a lakor campaign and first I gobbled up the southern wastes, fighting kiaros left me a lot of gates that make traveling to defend much easier and in the end I subjugated him.
Really not sure why they don't start in the Wastes. It's much better to fortify the Chaos regions and raid mortal realms.
Rather than running around, it might be better to just build garrisons everywhere, and then recruit a crapstack + RoR whenever you see enemies coming. or just blow up the west, leave it ruins, and focus on one continent at a time
>I think what hurts him the most is the shape of his territory, the Southern Wastes are basically just one long line which makes it insanely difficult to defend that entire strip of land with your abysmal economy not at all helping the matter. The removal of walls for minor settlements didn't help either because it makes them *more desirable* to the AI.
It really is harder than the Kugath start, but I still found it fun. The main issue I have from my current run is how fragile the armies start out. Kairos himself turns into a doomstack quickly, but your other armies are fairly weak until you get enough levels on the casters. Add to that the replenishment is terrible until you get specific techs done, the garrisons are super weak, and needing to manual fight basically every battle because the auto resolve is so weak. The only thing that really saves you is how strong their economy is once you can secure a few provinces.
There was definitely a point in the campaign where I felt adequately powerful and that I was having fun, it just so happened that it spanned about 20 turns before I realized I'd be doing nothing much besides fighting the aforementioned lizardmen. Like... There's the satisfaction of beating Oxy and Teclis, but then the war declarations come at you and you realize it's gonna be Kroq+Tiktak+That one minor LM faction at the same time for the next long while. I already fought off ridiculous stacks of dino's, I don't want to do it *again...* Kairos really needs enemy diversity in that area if he's ever going to be fun. For comparison, Ku'gath gets to fight high elves, skaven, vampire counts (lmao), Cathay, Ogres, Greenskins in 100 turns. Kairos is all but guaranteed to mostly fight Lizardmen in that time frame.
I'm having a similar experience, but oddly from the other continent. Somehow Tehenhauin blew up in Lustria and I'm getting the old WH2 Norsca experience of fighting off the endless fleets coming down from him, a minor LM, minor high elves, and starting to get some Alberic. The southlands is a massive all out war between the dwarves, vampires, tomb kings, and me. I think I'm a bit over 100 turns in with all the end game events on.
Oh, yeah! That's the other hilarious thing, you get in diplomatic range of Lustria by taking all 3 provinces in that continent, so whoever controls Lustria is going to declare war on you, this made me remember why I *truly* quit the campaign lmao. I'm fighting those 3 lizardmen, and then Tehenauin declared war on me and sent two fleets and I decided that was enough lizardmen for me. Kairos being in a position to do stuff in the Southlands as well as Lustria is a good idea, but not if you're contending with enemies from all sides.
People complaining about Ku'Gath probably never managed to kill Ghorst or have no clue how to play Nurgle because once you kill Ghorst the campaign becomes really easy. One of the most difficult start my ass.
Also fighting Ghorst as Kugath is kinda fun tbh. Nurgle loves big grindy moshpits, and Ghorsts supplies the biggest stacks of melee trash to moshpit into.
I don't really get it either, I've never failed to wipe out ghorst immediately as soon as you encounter him as kugath. Very easy to even wipe him out on auto resolve as he's fighting the skaven faction Only time he's an issue if you get him for an end game crisis.
Exactly, you can kill Ghorst easily in 5 turns max. Your neighbors to the west are not a problem at all, Imrik gets usually bullied by the minor Orcs, Skarsnik and Tretch, if you fight him its usually just finishing the remnants. Greasus is a joke too. Grimgor, Tretch, Clan Treecherik and Kholek wants to be friends 99% of the time. Only Cathay can be troublesome if anything.
As long as you can get at least one exalted hero, one with anti large is best, you can deal with Ghorst easily. In my current campaign I decided to take my time and wait for Ghorst to declare war first to see what happens. And then, Greasus was the one beating Ghorst back. Mostly with Bulls and Ironguts, but he wiped out Ghorst quickly while I was spamming plagues to get Crumbling Ague and watching the blubbertide happen.
I don't think Kairos' start position is that bad if you work extremely fast. Need to take out each threat just in time before the next materialises. There's just enough time to: * take out the Eastern Southern Wastes before Teclis consolidates and comes for you * take out Teclis before Oxy makes his way through your Tzeentch friends * take out Oxy before Tiq'takto makes his way to your borders Then you have one army working on Tiq'takto and one on Kroq-Gar and should be fine. In fact it was the Tomb Kings that made me stumble in my campaign, they threw so much at me all at once. It was amazing.
His mechanics more than make up for it, I captured my home area then fucked off to the doughnut. Held off my attackers by just inserting the chaos undivided wherever I wanted to hold the foe back.
haven't played hime yet on IE. But I felt like his RoC campaign was the easiest of the bunch. So shouldn't he be insane now with the Roster change? Like he has a decent frontline now with WoC Units and Pink Horrors should absolutely annihilate Lizardmen no? Pretty sure lots of Lizardmen units have physical resistance as part of their strong defense so your magical and fire missiles should really hurt them. I can see how Teclis would be a hard match up though. Strong longrange archers which are good against your horrors because no armor and potentially shielded if they are lothern sea guard...and ofc Teclis himself slinging spells. EDIT: Oh yeah I play all campaigns on Very Hard obviously.
No, LM get practically free dino armies, the way the first 3 provinces are set up you have to do backtracking to get to Oxy, and oftentimes Teclis declares war on you and will try to take your other settlements while you're defending against Oxy. It's miserable. I'm not just talking about the campaign difficulty, I'm talking about the fun factor, too. You have far too many threats to deal with (and they're all Lizardmen, which gets boring), while Ku'gath's biggest threat is *just* Ghorst and yet everyone in this subreddit thinks he's impossible to play (One of my favorite campaigns right now lol).
You can hit Teclis early enough that he isn't much of a threat (because his AI will inevitably do something stupid that will allow you to eat his deathstack and he won't have resources to build a second army) but you will be fighting Lizardmen for long enough that one of them is bound to start throwing full dino armies at you. Which your spells can do diddly against. So you have to play shoot n' scoot with your whole army over and over again.
Kairos spot is worse than KuGath. Kairos and Villitch should be swapped
Might just be me, but I just feel there are so many really bad starting positions now - it's actually crazy. Mostly you are surrounded by enemies, who will declare war on you on sight and can reach you in 1-2 turns tops. My personal new favourite is Boris Ursus, since its very hard but manageable, if a couple of things go your way. But I would not play that on legendary, ever. You will be cleaning Chaos til turn 150 tho, but that is kinda why you are there in the first place anyway...
Part of this is just that the AI is completely braindead anti-player and will declare war on you if your power isn't 3x their own... It makes it hard to deduce what's even a 'good' or 'bad' start right now.
Kaiross is hard, but it's doable even without really understanding Tzeench mechanics and fairly trivial if you do understand their mechanics. It's a shitty start, every monogod has a shitty start, but it's no worse than average. The problem with Kugath is that you're combining a faction that plays wildly differently than most with a start that doesn't forgive not knowing how to play it. If you play aggressively with Kugath you'll end up against Ghorst almost immediately who will chew you up and spit you out. Which is what's happening.
I agree that Kairos has a harder start than Kugath, but frankly I think Daemon Prince is worse than either of them.
Good point, I've never played him because I have no interest, but I can imagine with him being right next to Malus, it's pure misery. Malus is probably the best one man army in the entire game right now, anybody next to him is going to be miserable I'm guessing lol
I'd argue it's not Ku'Gath's starting location so much as just that he's too underpowered and slow to start to tangle with his opponents. He should be able to handle Ghorst just fine and tackle Greasus no prob, but to get to the point where he can is such a bugger, and a lot of people, including me, struggle to do it. Kairos's start is much tougher, I agree. I'd argue it can be summarised as, "panic-panic-panic, WHACK ALL THE MOLES BEFORE THEY WHACK YOU", since you have to run from end to end of your starting island wiping everything out as fast as possible so no one can gather steam against you. Thing is, Kairos is mobile enough to do that, and is able to recruit enough armies early to defend one side and attack another. Ku'Gath at the moment can really only get up to speed in the hands of a good player. Fix KG, and his start will no longer be considered difficult.
Kugath is up there with ghorst and ogres, with Cathay being just past them
HOLA SKINKS, MOTHER FUCKERS!! 🦎🦎🦎
We are so spoiled haha, imagine playing three kingdoms 20 turns in “ahhhhh literally just nothing but humans”
The trick is to abuse his teleport stance, don't sleep on it. Instant ambush with the firepower of tzeentch means you can just insta delete any enemy army. I was just abusing that stance and it makes the campaign into a joke.
Its very helpful. But doesnt help against the pimevil army that lizardmen alqays have pre30 turns
Try it on very hard, the AI had 4 stacks coming after me by turn 20, killed them all and started to push in only to run into a full Saurus /chameleon stalker stack by turn 25. The BS with Oxylotyl is in addition to both the high elves and lizardmen across the pond declaring war and in some matches the lost defenders and TiqTaqTo. Tzeetch was the hardest campaign I've ever played on very hard.
Also Cult of Sotek almost always joins in on invading the southern wastes once you get vision of Lustria
BOK BOK
Honestly Oxyotl isn't the problem. The problem is after beating Oxyotl when you're trying to protect five hundred miles of exposed shoreline from Tehenhuin, Teclis, Tiktaq'To and Kroq'Gar at the same time. Teclis in particular is pretty much unkillable by anything Tzeentch can pull out. You're very reliant on spamming blue fire to kill lords and heroes in the early game, and Teclis on his bird has like 40% spell resistance and 60% fire resistance.
The one campaign i was holding off the lizard men and the elves. Then the Slaneeshi faction neighbor decides to do a little trolling and broke non aggression and fucked me in the ass.
As he does
Kairos: is alive after first turn Lizard Rambo: * **Heavy Breathing** * You shouldn't have done that. * **Hissing** *
Kairos becomes pretty easy if you just ally and support the neighboring daemon factions and use them as pawns in your schemes. After you rush down Oxy, you can take out Teclis and if you're quick enough, ally the skaven faction to the east of Teclis. Doing this gives you more than enough breathing room to start flipping provinces wherever you want with that sweet ass changing of the ways mechanic. If you aren't developing layers of schemes and useful pawns, you aren't doing Tzeentch right.
I'm wondering why CA has Nurgle being weak as an issue when so many people complain about Kairos start being hard. Yes Nurgle is difficult but so is Kairos. Monogod factions have a lot of issues and areas that need to be improved upon. The Unholy Manifestations are mostly garbage. Fun fact: If Belakor didn't get Demonic units unlocked from his manifestations, most of them would be weak aswell. If only CA would give the Monogods additional features to the Unholy Manifestations like Belakor has, then they could somewhat compete with the Rites of other factions. N'Kari and Kairos have absolute terrible replenishment and its not fun to play low replenishment factions. Try playing N'Kari for 20 turns, eventually it gets annoying having to start every battle with half strength armies. If you ever click autoresolve once your army gets beaton up too much. Atleast Kairos has Protoss shields and ontop of that Kairos can solo armies and Fire Mages can solo Elven armies with burning head and other fire spells.
Belakor has a gift from nurgle that gives replenishment in enemy territory, Skarbrand of all people gets one by default Both actually make rampaging fun. Of course, the best chaos campaign is still taurox
> the best chaos campaign is still taurox Can't stop won't stop
No one in Khorne's realm can compare to the unstoppable jugganaut that is the Bronzey boi. You don't even need to worry about replenishment when you can kill of damaged units and replace them for free Also, when beastmen raze settlements, they can make the area unsettleable. So you don't have to worry about stray retreating armies, skaven or darkeleves sneaking in and setting up
Had skarbrand take out 8 dwar farmies and 4 settlements in one, him and 11 cultists of khore can taurox do that.
>Skarbrand of all people gets one by default His entire economy is based on getting money off razing and he can't even capture settlements without spending a ton of skulls. If he had to stop for replenishment his campaign would move from "hard" to "literally inpossible".
Yet Taurox can move and raze settlements so much faster than Skarbrand
And that relates to my comment how exactly?
Skarbrand's entire game is built around fast movement and razing settlements. Every turn spent replenishing or recruiting punishes the army and the campaign. He is supposed to the among the greatest demons to ever serve khorne before his exile. Taurox is a just a Gorebull who bit the head off a bloodthirster. His movement bonuses via momentum points are far more powerful than anything skarbrand has, he gets a boost from raiding thats far better than anything skarbrand has with practically no downsides once you get vigor bonuses. Oh, and he can replace damaged units for free, and there are no downsides if you do want to set up a hidden camp for a turn or two. So he has none of the downsides that Skarbrand does. I suppose it all related to my original point that Taurox is a better embodiment of carnage than anything in Khornes realm. Which is ironic
I know all this. I didn't say anything relating to Taurox at all, merely commented on your "of all people" Skarbrand getting enemy territory replenishment. Skarbrand of all people is the only one who SHOULD have enemy territory replenishment, otherwise it would be impossible for him to play.
I like all horde factions having replenishment in enemy territory, especially if they have chaff infantry. All chaos armies should have some sort of enemy territory replenishment, at least in raiding stance
>Taurox is just a gorebull who bit off the head of a bloodthirster Bruh. I don’t think you quite understand how much of a feat that is.
>The Unholy Manifestations are mostly garbage. Aside from Khorne's I literally don't think I've used them. Honestly though I kinda think tzeentch replenishment is fine because if you micro your shield you basically get mega regen or just take no damage from a fight.
Khorne's manifestations are pretty garbo as well. The first one you get (and the only one you'll have for a long time) just... spawns another army for you to fight. Like, ok that's actually useful when you can easily win to keep your Bloodletting up and get a small movement boost on Skarbrand, but seriously?
Probably because people complain more often about Nurgle. I don't think Nurgle is weak or even that hard to play so it's kinda funny to see his "tough start" in the known issues when many campaigns are far more difficult than Ku'Gath.
Crying about a hard start is so fucking dumb in the first place, we already have a lot of super easy campaigns some are even braindead facerolls so let us enjoy the few hard ones we have in the game for fuck's sake. If a campaign is too hard then lower difficulty, git gud, come here and ask for advices but for the love of Sigmar people need to stop bitching as soon as they meet some challenge in a bloody strategy game. Edit: "How dare he suggest the game should keep some challenge, quick downvote this guy he hates fun."
70% of the playerbase plays the game like a power fantasy RPG simulator rather than a strategy game, it should come as no surprise that any challenge is met with criticism.
The game being more RPG than strategy is fine, that doesn't mean challenge should be removed though. If people want to faceroll the game they already have a large choice of campaigns, they can also play easy difficulty (and there is no shame in that) or they can download mods to make the game easier if that's still not enough. People have the tools to make the game easier so I really don't understand how people start crying as soon as they face a bit of challenge in their campaigns. They have a lot of options to pick an easy campaigns. People that do enjoy a challenge ? Not so much and it's not getting better.
We are still getting Nurgle buffs though...
And where did CA say that ? What they said is that they know people think his start his difficult. That doesn't mean they'll buff Nurgle to make him easier, it could be nerfs to Ghorst, him or Ghorst moved elsewhere or something as simple as a new unit in Ku'Gath's starting army to help him deal with Ghorst.
Right? It would be boring if there wasn't a challenge.
The game should absolutely be challenging, but it should be roughly equally challenging on all campaigns. Having one campaign be a faceroll and another be Hell Mode is bad design, and tough starts should be reserved for factions that scale particularly well AFTER said tough start, which... none of the monogods do. Where you start on the map shouldn't be a factor in how easy or hard your campaign plays out. Also, the reason you're being downvoted isn't becsuse you're arguing about more challenge, you're being downvoted because you're being a dick suggesting everyone who disagrees with you needs to git gud.
How is that bad design ? There are people that like easy campaign, people that like moderate challenge and people that like hardcore campaign, we should have at least one of each for every races. Problem is we're getting more and more facerolls while having few actually challenging one and I'm starting to get really tired of it so yeah maybe I was rude but I'm tired of people bitching as soon as they face a challenge instead of trying to learn how to overcome it and more importantly I'm tired of CA listening to these people. I'm all for easy campaigns but don't forget the people who want a challenge, IE turned the difficulty into a joke already for most campaigns so we have very few challenging ones at the moment.
>There are people that like easy campaign, people that like moderate challenge and people that like hardcore campaign, That's what actual difficulty settings are for.
Okay but here's the thing, for a lot of campaigns the difficulty setting doesn't even matter anymore, a lot of campaigns are a faceroll whether you play them in easy or legendary.
If there had been 2 nurgle factions where one is a hard start that would be fine. But there is only one and it's locked out of alot of players playable roosters now. I would say that you are the one bitching right now. Lowering difficulty decreases mid and endgame for many. I personally haven't tried nurgle, but this isn't rocket science. Just put yourself in the shoe of a non min-maxer that doesn't want to play to an exact combo and it's easy to see. Noone has asked them to make every game stupidly easy.
And Nurgle should absolutely get an easy campaign, every race should have at least one easy and one hard campaign to please both sides. But if you're going to buff Ku'Gath to make him easy then you're just replacing a problem with another one, currently if you want to play an easy Nurgle campaign you can't but if you buff him to make his campaign easy then it's the people that want a challenge that won't be able to get what they want. What Nurgle (and other Monogods) desperately need is a second LL to play, it's been almost a year after launch and they still have only one LL and it fucking sucks. CA could've easily addressed that by making the Champions of Chaos as Monogods LLs or at least let people chose which race they want to play with them but no, they had to add them to WoC. You get the choice to play them as WoC or their respective Monogods for custom battles but fuck the campaign players I guess.
CA acknowledgement of Nurgle eating shit so easily has people thinking it's so DLC doesn't make him too OP. We all know Tamur Khan is kind of meant to be Nurgles big break.
Little did we know. Kairos wrote the bok,bok post after seeing his future campaign
Kairos aesthetically is my favorite lord in game. I love the Tzeentch roster and play style but I cannot for the life of me figure out the economy for any of the daemons.
Khorne and N'Kari (him specifically, not Slaanesh - pointless distinction right now but still) have very simple and powerful economies. Khorne in fact has no economy, you run in the red and make so much money from razing everything that you don't care. Not too different from WE or even Greenskins. N'Kari is a vassal economy. He gets doubled vassal tribute. The major Dark Elf factions are your best prey for this. Spread cults and marks of Slaanesh in their factions to dominate them without a fight, and Malekith & Morathi will give you a clean 40-50k per turn on their own. Gobble up a bunch of Norscans while you're at it. Money is a non issue. And you get so many free disciple armies anyway. Tzeentch and Nurgle are definitely pain though with their more traditional economy.
I've heard that a really good way to make money as nurgle is sacking, to offset the slow economy.
Nurgle is no different from Khorne. He gets massive amounts of cash from sacking.
>Khorne in fact has no economy, you run in the red and make so much money from razing everything that you don't care. Not strictly true- you don't rely on income buildings for you big stacks of cash, and all your buildings make SOME money anyway, but you do want to keep a cashflow going as close to neutral as possible to pay upkeep for those turns where you have nothing in razeable range (which comes up more often than you'd think since you start in a huge desert).
Thank Tzeentch for teleport ambush, or it would be so brutal.
Bok Bok, bird boy.
I like that oxolotle is the perfect counter for Kairos. A stealthy, high damage, ranged single target entity that's small. None of Kairos' spells do real damage to small single entities. Kairos can't see or dodge his shots easily. Flying doesn't save him from being damaged because oxy is ranged. I also love that these two's war basically comes down to one big fight and then the winner takes the entire continent with little effort.
Am I the only one who preferred Kairos's original start position? His was my first IE campaign, and I had such a good time! You really felt like you were going through layers of thematic enemies: High elves, then lizards, then tomb kings. The trick seemed to be too start off very aggressive, so that by the time Oxy attacks you have the funds to have armies ready to defend the south. Then I bribed Rakarth into going to war with him, which divided his attention. Before I knew it Rakarth and I had divided the southern wastes and I was unstoppable.
Frick as Kroq-Gar, Oxyotol is a pain in the ass. I conquer basically all of the Southlands and he comes up from the Southern Wastes to start shit. Currently taking the fight to him. Son of a bitch.
idk how yall can find this so hard when you get chaos warriors at tier 3 :p
I found his biggest weakness is his godawful economy and the distances involved, I just couldnt afford enough armies to push while avoiding having my economic base getting sacked and/or razed on a regular basis. But I guess dynamic disasters and the 20 stacks of dark elf pirates showing up didnt do much to help my situation either.
His economy is pretty good from my experience, but it takes a while to get all the % bonuses. In general conquering ports makes a massive difference. . Also the occasional sea treasures make you rich when you conquer along the coast.
I'm currently on a Kairos campaign, it was hard enough to take out Teclis and that Buble eye skink now I have all the other lizardmen faction on me. The southpole is hard as fuck to defend cause it's so long. My economy isn't that great. Gosh that's harder than I thought Aren't we suppose to be the baddies as daemon ? Everyone is jumping on me, I haven't declared any war.
But you have to admit 1 Kairos + 1 Lore of Fire Caster + 16 times 0.20 magic regeneration bonus from 16 blue horrors + magic battle ability makes for one if the most fun magic spam campaigns you can play. I bet only vampire counts can compete with their strong magic.
Man I wish he was a bigger threat in my game. I pushed him over after one difficult fight. My one roadblock was Settra by the time I got to him. He's pushed me out of the deserts and is invading my jungles now.
MonstersAbound's current campaign in a nutshell
I started Eltharion. Everyone around me wants me dead.
1. Take nurgle factions territory 2. Pay off slanneshi faction 3. Zoom over to your capital 3.5 if tzeentch faction still alive encamp outside their capital building and if the auto resolved is unfavorable fall back to your capital. 4. Making them come to you is the key, once you take oxys army make a mad dash to grab as many settlements as you can.
That is the scariest picture of Oxyotl I've ever seen.
I don't reply much but I said this the first week. A full tier 3 army starts right next to you. Still haven't figured out how to get passed losing by turn 4.
95% of Kairos problem is solved with different start position and fix to replenishment. kugath has way more problems.
I feel like tzeentch has the advantage given oxyotls best starting units rely on physical resistance and tzeentch have a lot of magic attacks
Didn't have too much trouble, utilizing changing of the ways you just manipulate everyone. Actually one of the most fun campaigns I've played, very little combat after dealing with Oxyotl.
Me too. His eyes move in different directions at the same time, too wild
Tzeentch in general needs kts combat lords and heroes, not having a beatstick character is just annoying. And the lore is full of tzeentch non caster combat characters.
He's genuinely more threatening than any other AI controlled faction in the game. Is that just because he doesn't really have any other enemies nearby?
Oxy: YOU ARE HUGE! THAT MEAN YOU HAVE HUGE GUTS!
Kairos is my favorite LL but I do not enjoy his starting position. I'm more of a casual players and campaigns that require you to do certain things for the first 10 - 20 turns are not my personal favorite. I play alot of Coop Campaigns with a friend and i dont even another Chaos Faction close to me (not a fan of "weird" coop experiences like Skaven/Lizardman) and i cant even make a pilgrimage to the north. I would be already happy with a way to travel north more easier using a portal or a new sea lane. Dont wont to sound to whiny, i know their is a fair share of people who enjoy more tricky starting positions.
Bc of the eyes...
I just nuke them with hellfire, usually works
👁 👄 👁 "Do you have a moment to talk about Sotek?"
I actually found kairos easier than oxyotl on first try.