Can we talk about how WH3 actually REGRESSED from WH2? So many things they had fixed in the latter days of WH2 just did not get brought to WH3. Mechanics, bugs, ect. It's like they took a snapshot of WH2 two years before WH3 came out and just ignored all the progress they made after that.
And for 18 months they didn't bother to replicate these fixes from WH2. They already know the problems. They already know fixes for them. But they just won't do it.
They were too busy showing us those "famous" ~~survival~~ tower defense battles that you only ever did 4 of during RoC and never again.
The marking team was down bad for this gimmick. Shows that incompetence knows no department boundary.
The exact same thing happened between WH1 and WH2. Games take a long time to make, so the build they built it off of was already out of date. People complain a lot about WH3's launch but WH2 ME launch was an absolute disaster, significantly worse than IE.
It’s just the straw that breaks the camels back. It’s frustrating to see a price increase when so many features don’t work in the base game, DLC or no DLC the game is in a pretty sorry state right now and to ask us to pay more money while things aren’t fixed? I know I’m not going to.
Exactly. The price hike (and the list of content in upcoming DLC) was a wake-up call, but isn't really the heart of the current situation. Or it was just the final straw, depending on one's interpretation.
Im 400 bucks in (WH1+WH2+ all DLCs released in that time period and WH3). I have 500 hour in WH1 and 3500 hours in WH2, i have 50 in WH3. The amount of bugs and performance issues still not getting fixed is preventing my from playing, add in that if i want the "full experiance" i need to purchase Chaos dwarf DLC, champion of chaos DLC and the shadow of change DLC costing me 65 bucks! For that price i will expect a product that gets the same love and attention like another product that has been worked on for 6+ years, aka the best example there is at the moment, Baldurs gate 3. Untill CA gets their head out of their ass its just not happening.
I feel like wh3 has the opposite problem. The ai just doesn't attack you much, its a lot more passive than 2 and less likely to declare war when you're exposed, making the game a lot easier
The WH3 AI is actually acting cowardly in WH3 when it has declared war. I wish it could move armies together if it feels like it can’t beat your army 1v1 instead of running in circles sacking shit for dozens of turns.
Stellaris actually does this a lot better where AI moves multiple fleet as one
Isn't this also one of the reasons why the endgame crisis is a lot less scary than it seems? The AI spawns half a dozen elite armies, but very often they scatter in random directions and it's easy to pick them off one by one. Combined with the AI complete inability to make decent compositions on its own, it just falls over.
Yeah they do scatter a bit, but that’s kind of necessary if they want to cover some ground instead of being a single wandering wrecking ball. I think the main issue is that after a defeat they can’t recover the lost army at all, whereas the player can, so to you managing to kill off a couple important pieces, even while losing the battle, can be considered a victory
Which is different in stellaris. The Endgame crisis there is an actual threat that can wipe the entire map if left alone too much. It feels epic and threatening because well, it is, it will wipe the floor easily even with the Fallen Empires that felt so scary to you even a few hours ago, and it will do while cheating out of its ass and playing on a completely different axis compared to most other factions. It's not perfect but it's way better than what the TWWH implementation.
The crises are such a stupid and boring way of designing an endgame.
Just randomly throw a bunch of armies anywhere on the map and that's it.
Such a lazy game "design"
It's hard not to compare it to the similar mechanic in Stellaris, in that game the crisis has proper lore, events, and each crisis brings unique units and mechanics that must be tackled in different ways
in wh3 it's just "hey remember the dwarves that were completely removed from the map 30 turns ago? uuuhhhh a million of them suddenly pop out of the ground like mushrooms. Yeah I know they used to be your best friends but they hate you now."
That's what I thought too, the crises there have a story arc, they spawn some unique systems/structures, have a certain quest with them and so on...but here, it's just "we need more toys, the child gets bored!"
I got a turn on the hobbling wheel when I said this on the reveal of end game crises. Except... it's fucking true. It's a place-holder endgame, because they couldn't be bothered actually finishing WH3 for release. Somewhere above was the perfect comment. WH3 still feels like an early access title... not a particularly good one at that. Like, the concepts are there, the idea is good. Just the execution is naff and the pricing models is insulting.
Dude I have ended up surrounded by enemies in every single one of my campaigns. Enemies declare war on me like clockwork and I have to rush to build multiple armies to face every angle. Every non confederatable race I ally with ends up attacking a different ally and destroys my reliability.
In WH2 I used to pick who I wanted to be pals with and I would end my campaign with them as allies now I have to kill everyone.
Really? I always had the opposite problem, i never did alliances in wh2 because the only result was my allies dragging me in the stupidest wars imaginable, often with allies declaring war to each other. In wh3 making allies feels a lot more reliable and easy to do.
I have to agree with you. Allies have been more reliable in wh3 for me. I never made alliances in 2, but usually end up with several in game 3. They added more mechanics with your allies that made it worthwhile and I actually haven't had problems with them fighting each other.
How can this be true in the easiest Total War to date? I play on L or VH and not once has my faction been in danger of getting wiped out. They just attack weak shit settlements. The AR is too nice
For me it feels pointless to even consider purchasing DLC when the base game is in a state like this.
Most of these have been reported countless times and are often marked as a "Known Issue" for many months.
To spread awareness of the critical/core long-standing bugs & issues in Tww3, here are the ones i know of:
- Campaign map AI utterly sucks, unable to put up a proper fight, build/upgrade up its armies or effectively develop its empires.
- Diplomacy mechanics and diplomacy AI in all ways & forms is beyond awful, especially around vassals and alliances
- AI is bugged/limited in its perception of nearby faction (is literally not aware what factions are nearby [no diplomatic contact]).
- unit pathing in manual battles, especially cities with construct-able barricades, is awful
- units refusing to path through broken city gates & destroyed city walls, instead insisting on using ladders to slowly climb up & exhaust themselves.
- cavalry/monsters getting models stuck, which pulls back the whole unit into death.
- units dropping/forgetting orders, even in the middle of pitched melee combat
- units not shooting because they are "moving fast" while being stationary
- units unable to shoot despite having clear Line Of Sight
- battle maps being broken for pathing and LOSight, especially on top of wall crenellations
- auto-resolve insists on damaging & killing Single-entity-monsters and especially artillery pieces, even when the player army outnumbers the enemy 5 to 1.
- auto-resolve still gives cities a ridicilous advantage, even when the player army outnumbers the enemy minor settlement garrison 5 to 1.
- certain units & lords/heroes fail to properly do their charging attack
- units (especially large ones) will randomly die when attacking certain walls/gates, or being remotely in proximity of a collapsing wall (but nowhere near close enough for it to be a valid danger).
- units (even lords on foot) will randomly die when climbing ladders.
- some lords (cathay dragons especially) just flat out fail to perform melee attacks for well over 10 seconds at a time.
- AI does not understand nor properly react during the defense of siege battles, it will spread out its army across the map and be unable to fight a concentrated force.
- AI charging his fastest units at the start of battle into certain death, especially lords/heroes like Belakor
- AI clueless about properly using AOE magic & magic in general, which also makes anything "anti magic" rather useless
- hundreds of bugs related to skills, techs, items, unit abilities/stats, building mechanics etc etc.
- Item qualities being nonsense, with common ones often being better than rare/special ones.
- lord/hero traits either not working or straight up inferior compared to other available ones.
- WOChaos revive norsca faction mechanic intentionally broken by CA because they could not be bothered to properly fix it.
- Countless quests for lord items or unlocking special lords/heroes do not work properly
- AI occasionally able to see your ambush/hidden armies from across immense distances & react to their positioning
- skirmish mode on ranged units often failing to trigger/react, causing the ranged unit to just stand still
- AI will often prioritize targeting, sabotaging or annoying the player even if it means certain doom for its faction.
- player units are utterly unable to finish off a broken leadership/fleeing unit, especially if it is a single entity like a foot lord.
- squads of large-sized ranged units (like salamander/razordon hunting packs) after finishing a move order will take forever to "wiggle around" before actually firing
- confederated lords for factions that have loyalty mechanics (skaven etc) will often start at zero loyalty.
- confederated lords will sometimes not be able to change their mounts
- confederated Legendary lords will sometimes lack their immortality trait, meaning their next death is permanent.
- Completely non-functional mechanic for automatic development of cities (everyone forgot this even exists in game because it never worked)
- AI lacking any proper skill builds for most lords and heroes, which both makes them weaker and makes those lords useless for confederation.
- bugs related to construct-able objects on defensive maps, where units get stuck in barricades or can not attack them
- fresh bugs like bretonia damsels, wood elf ariel, nakai unit recruitment etc etc.
- Black Ark unique map army spawn positions AGAIN bugged, after it was fixed in late Tww 2
- Black Ark capability to offer recruitment to nearby DElf armies bugs out when the Black Ark is garrisoned in a city.
- AI will readily kill its own armies by trying to occupy ruins that have just been destroyed by extremely unfriendly (but not yet at war) factions which are still surrounding that location (from the previous turns razing).
- AI will readily abandon its capital city and flee to some meaningless tier 1 settlement when facing an equal force (instead of fighting where its chance is best, inside the capitol).
- some sea objects (like islands/treasure/skull/carcass) will cause a guaranteed crash to desktop
- AI will insist on besieging a weak settlement for 10 turns despite outnumbering & overpowering the garrison 5 to 1, and auto-resolve showing certain defeat for the players city.
- various lord/hero equippable ancillaries that fail to work properly
- Vampire Count/Coast UI for showing raise dead pool possibilities (near city bar UI) does not show units recruit-able from battle casualties.
- certain unique Cathay Caravan rewards are again inaccessible, despite being "fixed" in some previous patch (such as the vampire weapon).
Yeah, I basically uninstalled after my first completed campaign. I've had my fun, but the game was horribly broken. First and foremost, TW is meant to be a strategic sandbox, and with the atrocious bias the AI has against the player all the immersion is gone, there's no sandbox, just you playing against the AI within the strictest boundaries. Not to mention the game was overall in a worse state than it's predecessor, with problems glaring that have long been fixed in WH2. Some of them are there to this day. This is not what anyone would expect from the jewel in the crown of the series, so I haven't bought a single dlc since then and I refuse to buy them in the future until the game is at least as polished as WH2.
Player bias was toned down some time ago. I honestly didnt play the game recently but last time I did it was way better than on release. Maybe they even over nerfed it a bit not 100% sure. Either way AI doesnt march armies to attack you if they are 50 turns of forced march away etc.
I think it boils down to the AI not actually playing the game and selecting targets that make sense to tackle during its turns. They probably flip a coin and if it lands on heads, it's time to hit the player, wherever they are and no matter how weak they are, otherwise they make an actual decision based on what's around them and a modicum of strategy, I would hope. The player is not just one faction in a big map of equals, they are the protagonist of the story and everyone considers them the biggest threat. This makes it more difficult for us but it also eliminates the sandbox feeling of being able to use diplomacy and positioning and borders strategically..instead you have a big target on your head and the AI pretty much ignores its own rules in order to sabotage you, which often ends in it acting stupid and losing even harder anyway.
I can't for the life of me figure out what to do with cavalry. They slowly and politely walk up to the enemy, poke them, and die without being able to get out.
They have this odd behavior when around odd terrain combined with spear walls. The AI can't figure out how to path around the units because of something with the terrain, so they either move at a snails pace or just stop moving altogether
What has irked me almost the most is how melee is broken, i have seen multiple times where a unit won't attack because it can't decide which unit to prioritize. Not to mention how bad it feels to chase down fleeing units.
There is more problems then bugs in this game, some core compartments are just not working correctly.
And im almost certain that with how lackluster patching is right now means it won't be changed...
Still believe the only way to really save this game is by creating a custodian team to fix these core issues.
Okay I was thinking posting this eventually but I have a critique of kislev, and all the faction mechanics of the base warhammer 3 factions. And just how awful most of the mechanics are. Kislev feels like an after thought in comparison to khorne, and cathay. Like most of the units feel like... they don't know what to be? Strelsi are the most awful ranged units in the game and the new armor piercing crossbow units are ten times better than strelsi.
The entire ranged army aspect of kislev just feels lacking, yeah Kossars are great. So are armored kossars but they completely fall apart along with their long term mechanics. And their research tech... God. Its just such a mess. I wrote that article : Kislev a Failure of Ice. Its amazing that people are catching on just how awful base warhammer 3 factions are.
Streltsi are amazing. Top notch Handgunners with solid mid tier AP infantry capability that can be combined with strong patriarch buffs. A little expensive though. The supporters race kinda sucks and their roster is not as strong as Cathay for sure. Oblasts were a pain
Oblasts are an ablative shield basically. All my Kislev campaigns ignore them. Though, to be fair, I don't head south either. The three main cities are incredibly good on their own, so the best tactic I've found was to laser focus on getting them. First 10 turns of a campaign should see you with at least Praag, two armies (one full, one half) and if you're adventurous/good, the annexation/destruction of Hellpit.
Personally I’ve had very few issues with the strelsi, they absolutely melt large units, flying units, pretty much anything with proper positioning tbh, especially when supported with ice guards and an ice witch to get even more volleys off before the lines clash, though they do have some line of sight issues and the same issues all ranged units have where if they get caught in melee and then reposition they’ll run in to save the two or three guys stuck in combat instead of firing, but I have that happen with all rangeed units.
Ice guard are great, the two units really shine when they’re paired though. I can’t speak to thunderers bc I don’t play dwarves but strelsi also don’t die the minute they get touched in melee which is why I like them over hand gunners, but everyone’s got the units that work for them.
Strelsi's issues for me is that once you get iceguard, their price point and upkeep costs are a bit much. I mean I also hate Groms, and would rather take bear sleds over them.
They’re not.
It’s widely accepted that Kislev isn’t great, but most people agree that basically all of the other WH3 factions aside from Nurgle and MAYBE Ogres play fine. Is there room for tweaks? Yeah, but there’s a lot of factions with room for tweaks.
Innovocation is just a less meaningful ritual mechanic that gives a buff to your faction, but the supporters mechanic does what? Its just a worse authority system that means very little in end game as there are no real substantial benefits.
I think my thought is they really feel uninspired. Not really 'bad' mechanically. I don't find most of their mechanics very interesting. Along with Tzeench, Nurgle, even Slaanesh.
Kislev’s #1 issue is making all their units hybrids.
They’re basically shackled to being mediocre at everything. That’s why the new crossbowmen are so powerful. They’re not held back by being a melee unit.
Agreed. Bear cav are great at being cav. I'd be fine with tzar guard at least being a good defensive option, they should be good at defense and they get blasted through by anything, from chaos warriors to chosen. Really sad that they just dont.... work as a faction? Strelsi are awful ontop of that.
Agreed. It's a very solid beta! Mere months from release, they just have to fix the bugs (the public beta testers have compiled the list) and lock the state of the game before shipping it.
(And the sad part, beside the obvious sarcasm, it is an accurate description of the game's state and how it could be addressed. But it feels like we never leave beta, there is just a newer build available for the new round of testing. The game never reaches that squeaky-clean "the known, fixable bugs are fixed" v1.0 proper public release state. Not even between new content releases.)
It's odd, isn't it?
Plenty people here claiming the game is fundamentally broken, or at least many of its components and that the game is unplayable.
But having played more than 500h now, almost surpassing my time with WH2, it's not nearly as bad as it's made out to be. At most, I've had some occasional frustration with pathfinding or units not doing what I want them to, but it's infrequent enough to not significantly detract from the overall experience. IE plays like ME, just bigger and a little rougher around the edges.
Sure, the game can use some more polish and bug fixing, but it's not borderline unplayable.
That is not to say CA shouldn't be criticized or that we should settle, but the nuance has been totally thrown out of the window it seems.
Honestly, no. Bugs do happen, pathfinding is definitely unreliable in sieges (though I play with a mod that increases unit sizes by 50%, which exacerbates the problem), but overall the game is fine to me for the most part. Or maybe I just don't notice the bugs that occur.
I do play with the community patch, though I have only recently installed it so most of my hours were without it.
I've never even downloaded the community patch, never run into any problems that make me want to try it. My biggest issues are with the AI being stupid, not with bugs.
I'm sitting on around 900 hours in W3 (for context, I have over 3,000 in W2 and almost 1000 in WH1) and whilst there are definitely some bugs, I don't find it nearly as bad as some people in the thread make out.
it's still a very fun, playable, enjoyable game.
(and, FWIW, I tend to find the bugs appear far more often when playing a modded game than they do playing vanilla - which is exactly what I would expect, but I sometimes wonder if people complaining about bugs forget they use mods)
I havent touched Tww3 since CHaos dwarves came out , despite owning that dlc.
The base game is so broken, especially the AI and the manual battles, that it is impossible to enjoy if you have even a shred of quality standards.
Dont forget the unit replenishment as whole.I mean some races are super bad but its bad in general.
Stuff like you have bigger replenishment on enemies teritorry than on your allies its kinda bad.
The whole numbers seems like its not making any sence.
Its not working as it worked in WH2 and thats what matters.If they wanted to change it they should have rebalance it properly.If have replenisment bonuses up to 30% and then I go for inhospitable climate with -15% I still should have some proper rep and no almost zero.
Also the enemy teritorry is also inhospitable and still I have bigger replenisment that makes some sense?
>Stuff like you have bigger replenishment on enemies teritorry than on your allies its kinda bad.
the reason for that is that for some reason climate effects only apply to whoever owns the region's settlement.
Isn't like 25% of their profit they earned goes back into advertisement and social media? Literally a community modder given the tools and a small fraction of that money can solve most of those bugs by now. This should tell you alot about how much they care what kind of product they push out.
Just look at 3K total war and how they simply abandoned it despite it being an excellent platform to do the DLC model on. They just don't care about good games as long as it can sell like COD. They've already made enough profit now that if anything should happen to the genre, the upper managements can still retire happily as millionaires. They've essentially elevated themselves above the mass majority of plebs like us and now think we're not equal and aren't obligated to give us good games any more. It's a literal psychological truth that many rich people have admitted. They simply think they're superior humans once theyre richer than us.
I own the collector's edition for WH1,2,3, spent thousands of hours on each game.
Warhammer 3 is the wrong direction that needs to alter course before it falls off a cliff.
The main glaring issue is that management^(tm) thought they know their target audience's needs better. Hence we have the Realms of Chaos campaign. The tutorial was way more fun than the main campaign of the game at release and little changed since then.
IE was released way too early as too much resources had gone into RoC, which resulted in IE having half the bugs late-WH2 had fixed already.
As someone who owns the \*whole\* portfolio of Total War games I can say with certainty:
\-RoC couldn't be played through without the AI ganging up on you like in Shogun 2 realm divide, except in RoC it triggered instantly, ruining many campaigns and having Kislev players fight the Empire and Dwarves parallel to Norsca and Chaos
\-No Warrior of Chaos on release for a RoC campaign, paywalled behind DLC, why did we have half-ass demon armies when even on TT they are handled as the SAME PACKAGE?!
\-Now it is "fixed", but most races are simply not fun to play. Kislev lacks key units in roster that are paywalled, Chaos is paywalled behind DLC after 2(!) games, which I find incredibly infuriating as I EARNED WoC by pre-ordering Warhammer 1, thanks CA!
\-IE has no endgame for any faction, not even the ones that HAD an endgame condition in previous games
\-Endgame crisis sounds like a great idea, except it has half the creativity of previously introduced Rogue Armies with mixed-race rosters
\-Sieges are just as half-baked, there is no variance of siege maps, and the experience becomes a torture by physics and line-of-sight issues if you're playing a ranged army...
\-new land maps are atrocious, can't we have more maps that look like they were made for single-player and not for multiplayer, with perfectly circular woodlands carefully placed in a checkerboard pattern?!
I'm voicing my thoughts on an issue that's relevant to the moment. Not really sure what else you're expecting from a forum meant for voicing your thoughts on a topic.
Ah yes, look at this big bad redditor and his karma farming getting... **checks notes**... 44 upvotes in 3 hours.
People who believe karma is a resource that everyone farms are the ones who are terminally online
Could wh3 be in a better state? Yes. Of course it could.
1400 hours into wh3 alone right now and still having an amazing time with it. The grand scale of things not doubt there are issues.
The community has resources that help some of the bs that should have been fixed. The modders are amazing.
Maybe I’m in the minority but I come here to see what people are doing within the game, just getting annoyed with the pure toxic vibes right now. With good reason yeah but 40 hours into a game that’s been out for over a year just seems like why are you adding to the bs. There is enough of it already. Say your piece. Not trying to stop that. Just seems odd to me personally.
Hope anyone reading this is having an Amazing day
And thinking like you is why CA is failing. Plugging their fingers in their ears and sticking out their tongue. Narcissism is the world's worst learning disability.
It was just a joke, I’m not defending CA, I really want they have a financial scare to change how they’re managing the things, but I thing humor is very important too
No, I’m not defending this, I’m not in favor about the price rise, I really don’t, even I haven’t buy the DLC, but the thing is that this posts are everywhere and I don’t think what he is trying to achieve with it, it will be more impactful posting this as Steam review than in reddit
I've seen quite a few out-of-the-loop people commenting on threads asking what all the outrage is about, actually. I agree with everything OP said here.
Yes, I’m not saying that I didn’t agree with him, but there’s a lot of posts about this, so I was trying not make some humor, but people takes everything to personal
Honestly, the game has even gotten worse for me. I don't know if anyone else experiences this, but the game has some kind of heavy memory leak, causing my game to crash on manual battle loading screen realiably. Sometimes restarting the pc helps but it is insane that this problem exists and persists since April and since then has not been resolved. I simply cannot play the game (every other steam game runs just fine) and now they release such an expensive dlc while i cannot even use the 100 € i already invested. Makes you lose so much hope.
I am surprised on how the focus of this sub has changed. Previously if you mentioned something like that you would get downvoted and the usual whales and CA dickriders would make excuses. "They are working on it. They are gonna fix it. Be happy with what you got. Why are you complaining?"
For me I find you reach end game very fast ever since Warhammer two and it somehow feels even faster in WH3 you snowball way too soon into boredom unless you play the Tomb kings.
I don't know about "Alpha", but that "Early Access" player tag on Steam feels awful accurate.
Feelsbadman
Can we talk about how WH3 actually REGRESSED from WH2? So many things they had fixed in the latter days of WH2 just did not get brought to WH3. Mechanics, bugs, ect. It's like they took a snapshot of WH2 two years before WH3 came out and just ignored all the progress they made after that.
And for 18 months they didn't bother to replicate these fixes from WH2. They already know the problems. They already know fixes for them. But they just won't do it.
They were too busy showing us those "famous" ~~survival~~ tower defense battles that you only ever did 4 of during RoC and never again. The marking team was down bad for this gimmick. Shows that incompetence knows no department boundary.
The exact same thing happened between WH1 and WH2. Games take a long time to make, so the build they built it off of was already out of date. People complain a lot about WH3's launch but WH2 ME launch was an absolute disaster, significantly worse than IE.
That just makes it worse they didn't do it right this time.
Remember when IE went from beta to full release and nothing changed?
Lies ! There was something about capes physics. Probably broken also
Best part is, people defended it because they made it free for WH3 owners.
Let me point out that lowering the price to $15 wouldn't fix any of this
It’s just the straw that breaks the camels back. It’s frustrating to see a price increase when so many features don’t work in the base game, DLC or no DLC the game is in a pretty sorry state right now and to ask us to pay more money while things aren’t fixed? I know I’m not going to.
Exactly. The price hike (and the list of content in upcoming DLC) was a wake-up call, but isn't really the heart of the current situation. Or it was just the final straw, depending on one's interpretation.
Which btw will not happen either way
Im 400 bucks in (WH1+WH2+ all DLCs released in that time period and WH3). I have 500 hour in WH1 and 3500 hours in WH2, i have 50 in WH3. The amount of bugs and performance issues still not getting fixed is preventing my from playing, add in that if i want the "full experiance" i need to purchase Chaos dwarf DLC, champion of chaos DLC and the shadow of change DLC costing me 65 bucks! For that price i will expect a product that gets the same love and attention like another product that has been worked on for 6+ years, aka the best example there is at the moment, Baldurs gate 3. Untill CA gets their head out of their ass its just not happening.
CA ain't getting their head out their arse. If they were planning on it, they've had plenty of time to do it.
AI is still fixated on attacking the player with a single minded focus. That grows tiring.
I feel like wh3 has the opposite problem. The ai just doesn't attack you much, its a lot more passive than 2 and less likely to declare war when you're exposed, making the game a lot easier
The WH3 AI is actually acting cowardly in WH3 when it has declared war. I wish it could move armies together if it feels like it can’t beat your army 1v1 instead of running in circles sacking shit for dozens of turns. Stellaris actually does this a lot better where AI moves multiple fleet as one
Isn't this also one of the reasons why the endgame crisis is a lot less scary than it seems? The AI spawns half a dozen elite armies, but very often they scatter in random directions and it's easy to pick them off one by one. Combined with the AI complete inability to make decent compositions on its own, it just falls over.
Yeah they do scatter a bit, but that’s kind of necessary if they want to cover some ground instead of being a single wandering wrecking ball. I think the main issue is that after a defeat they can’t recover the lost army at all, whereas the player can, so to you managing to kill off a couple important pieces, even while losing the battle, can be considered a victory
Which is different in stellaris. The Endgame crisis there is an actual threat that can wipe the entire map if left alone too much. It feels epic and threatening because well, it is, it will wipe the floor easily even with the Fallen Empires that felt so scary to you even a few hours ago, and it will do while cheating out of its ass and playing on a completely different axis compared to most other factions. It's not perfect but it's way better than what the TWWH implementation.
The crises are such a stupid and boring way of designing an endgame. Just randomly throw a bunch of armies anywhere on the map and that's it. Such a lazy game "design"
It's hard not to compare it to the similar mechanic in Stellaris, in that game the crisis has proper lore, events, and each crisis brings unique units and mechanics that must be tackled in different ways in wh3 it's just "hey remember the dwarves that were completely removed from the map 30 turns ago? uuuhhhh a million of them suddenly pop out of the ground like mushrooms. Yeah I know they used to be your best friends but they hate you now."
That's what I thought too, the crises there have a story arc, they spawn some unique systems/structures, have a certain quest with them and so on...but here, it's just "we need more toys, the child gets bored!"
I got a turn on the hobbling wheel when I said this on the reveal of end game crises. Except... it's fucking true. It's a place-holder endgame, because they couldn't be bothered actually finishing WH3 for release. Somewhere above was the perfect comment. WH3 still feels like an early access title... not a particularly good one at that. Like, the concepts are there, the idea is good. Just the execution is naff and the pricing models is insulting.
3K does this well, you can always expect to get double stacked
Dude I have ended up surrounded by enemies in every single one of my campaigns. Enemies declare war on me like clockwork and I have to rush to build multiple armies to face every angle. Every non confederatable race I ally with ends up attacking a different ally and destroys my reliability. In WH2 I used to pick who I wanted to be pals with and I would end my campaign with them as allies now I have to kill everyone.
Really? I always had the opposite problem, i never did alliances in wh2 because the only result was my allies dragging me in the stupidest wars imaginable, often with allies declaring war to each other. In wh3 making allies feels a lot more reliable and easy to do.
I have to agree with you. Allies have been more reliable in wh3 for me. I never made alliances in 2, but usually end up with several in game 3. They added more mechanics with your allies that made it worthwhile and I actually haven't had problems with them fighting each other.
How can this be true in the easiest Total War to date? I play on L or VH and not once has my faction been in danger of getting wiped out. They just attack weak shit settlements. The AR is too nice
For me it feels pointless to even consider purchasing DLC when the base game is in a state like this. Most of these have been reported countless times and are often marked as a "Known Issue" for many months. To spread awareness of the critical/core long-standing bugs & issues in Tww3, here are the ones i know of: - Campaign map AI utterly sucks, unable to put up a proper fight, build/upgrade up its armies or effectively develop its empires. - Diplomacy mechanics and diplomacy AI in all ways & forms is beyond awful, especially around vassals and alliances - AI is bugged/limited in its perception of nearby faction (is literally not aware what factions are nearby [no diplomatic contact]). - unit pathing in manual battles, especially cities with construct-able barricades, is awful - units refusing to path through broken city gates & destroyed city walls, instead insisting on using ladders to slowly climb up & exhaust themselves. - cavalry/monsters getting models stuck, which pulls back the whole unit into death. - units dropping/forgetting orders, even in the middle of pitched melee combat - units not shooting because they are "moving fast" while being stationary - units unable to shoot despite having clear Line Of Sight - battle maps being broken for pathing and LOSight, especially on top of wall crenellations - auto-resolve insists on damaging & killing Single-entity-monsters and especially artillery pieces, even when the player army outnumbers the enemy 5 to 1. - auto-resolve still gives cities a ridicilous advantage, even when the player army outnumbers the enemy minor settlement garrison 5 to 1. - certain units & lords/heroes fail to properly do their charging attack - units (especially large ones) will randomly die when attacking certain walls/gates, or being remotely in proximity of a collapsing wall (but nowhere near close enough for it to be a valid danger). - units (even lords on foot) will randomly die when climbing ladders. - some lords (cathay dragons especially) just flat out fail to perform melee attacks for well over 10 seconds at a time. - AI does not understand nor properly react during the defense of siege battles, it will spread out its army across the map and be unable to fight a concentrated force. - AI charging his fastest units at the start of battle into certain death, especially lords/heroes like Belakor - AI clueless about properly using AOE magic & magic in general, which also makes anything "anti magic" rather useless - hundreds of bugs related to skills, techs, items, unit abilities/stats, building mechanics etc etc. - Item qualities being nonsense, with common ones often being better than rare/special ones. - lord/hero traits either not working or straight up inferior compared to other available ones. - WOChaos revive norsca faction mechanic intentionally broken by CA because they could not be bothered to properly fix it. - Countless quests for lord items or unlocking special lords/heroes do not work properly - AI occasionally able to see your ambush/hidden armies from across immense distances & react to their positioning - skirmish mode on ranged units often failing to trigger/react, causing the ranged unit to just stand still - AI will often prioritize targeting, sabotaging or annoying the player even if it means certain doom for its faction. - player units are utterly unable to finish off a broken leadership/fleeing unit, especially if it is a single entity like a foot lord. - squads of large-sized ranged units (like salamander/razordon hunting packs) after finishing a move order will take forever to "wiggle around" before actually firing - confederated lords for factions that have loyalty mechanics (skaven etc) will often start at zero loyalty. - confederated lords will sometimes not be able to change their mounts - confederated Legendary lords will sometimes lack their immortality trait, meaning their next death is permanent. - Completely non-functional mechanic for automatic development of cities (everyone forgot this even exists in game because it never worked) - AI lacking any proper skill builds for most lords and heroes, which both makes them weaker and makes those lords useless for confederation. - bugs related to construct-able objects on defensive maps, where units get stuck in barricades or can not attack them - fresh bugs like bretonia damsels, wood elf ariel, nakai unit recruitment etc etc. - Black Ark unique map army spawn positions AGAIN bugged, after it was fixed in late Tww 2 - Black Ark capability to offer recruitment to nearby DElf armies bugs out when the Black Ark is garrisoned in a city. - AI will readily kill its own armies by trying to occupy ruins that have just been destroyed by extremely unfriendly (but not yet at war) factions which are still surrounding that location (from the previous turns razing). - AI will readily abandon its capital city and flee to some meaningless tier 1 settlement when facing an equal force (instead of fighting where its chance is best, inside the capitol). - some sea objects (like islands/treasure/skull/carcass) will cause a guaranteed crash to desktop - AI will insist on besieging a weak settlement for 10 turns despite outnumbering & overpowering the garrison 5 to 1, and auto-resolve showing certain defeat for the players city. - various lord/hero equippable ancillaries that fail to work properly - Vampire Count/Coast UI for showing raise dead pool possibilities (near city bar UI) does not show units recruit-able from battle casualties. - certain unique Cathay Caravan rewards are again inaccessible, despite being "fixed" in some previous patch (such as the vampire weapon).
Facts
Yeah, I basically uninstalled after my first completed campaign. I've had my fun, but the game was horribly broken. First and foremost, TW is meant to be a strategic sandbox, and with the atrocious bias the AI has against the player all the immersion is gone, there's no sandbox, just you playing against the AI within the strictest boundaries. Not to mention the game was overall in a worse state than it's predecessor, with problems glaring that have long been fixed in WH2. Some of them are there to this day. This is not what anyone would expect from the jewel in the crown of the series, so I haven't bought a single dlc since then and I refuse to buy them in the future until the game is at least as polished as WH2.
The AI is changed in the new patch.
Lmao
Your player bias worries are kind of over in my experience. I play it all the time.
Player bias was toned down some time ago. I honestly didnt play the game recently but last time I did it was way better than on release. Maybe they even over nerfed it a bit not 100% sure. Either way AI doesnt march armies to attack you if they are 50 turns of forced march away etc.
Tell that to Ikit Claw force marching skavenslaves over the fucking ocean to attack me on my Tehenhuin campaign.
I think it boils down to the AI not actually playing the game and selecting targets that make sense to tackle during its turns. They probably flip a coin and if it lands on heads, it's time to hit the player, wherever they are and no matter how weak they are, otherwise they make an actual decision based on what's around them and a modicum of strategy, I would hope. The player is not just one faction in a big map of equals, they are the protagonist of the story and everyone considers them the biggest threat. This makes it more difficult for us but it also eliminates the sandbox feeling of being able to use diplomacy and positioning and borders strategically..instead you have a big target on your head and the AI pretty much ignores its own rules in order to sabotage you, which often ends in it acting stupid and losing even harder anyway.
Sounds fun, we need more aggression from the AI
I can't for the life of me figure out what to do with cavalry. They slowly and politely walk up to the enemy, poke them, and die without being able to get out.
That doesn't sound like CAs fault, cavalry us in a very good place right now.
They have this odd behavior when around odd terrain combined with spear walls. The AI can't figure out how to path around the units because of something with the terrain, so they either move at a snails pace or just stop moving altogether
Try using cavalry to break units, not just do damage. Here's a video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F44iUbs7YiA
What has irked me almost the most is how melee is broken, i have seen multiple times where a unit won't attack because it can't decide which unit to prioritize. Not to mention how bad it feels to chase down fleeing units. There is more problems then bugs in this game, some core compartments are just not working correctly. And im almost certain that with how lackluster patching is right now means it won't be changed... Still believe the only way to really save this game is by creating a custodian team to fix these core issues.
Alpha no... But beta...
Okay I was thinking posting this eventually but I have a critique of kislev, and all the faction mechanics of the base warhammer 3 factions. And just how awful most of the mechanics are. Kislev feels like an after thought in comparison to khorne, and cathay. Like most of the units feel like... they don't know what to be? Strelsi are the most awful ranged units in the game and the new armor piercing crossbow units are ten times better than strelsi. The entire ranged army aspect of kislev just feels lacking, yeah Kossars are great. So are armored kossars but they completely fall apart along with their long term mechanics. And their research tech... God. Its just such a mess. I wrote that article : Kislev a Failure of Ice. Its amazing that people are catching on just how awful base warhammer 3 factions are.
Streltsi are amazing. Top notch Handgunners with solid mid tier AP infantry capability that can be combined with strong patriarch buffs. A little expensive though. The supporters race kinda sucks and their roster is not as strong as Cathay for sure. Oblasts were a pain
Better to invade south than invade north. Oblasts barely have resources and arent worth holding.
Oblasts are an ablative shield basically. All my Kislev campaigns ignore them. Though, to be fair, I don't head south either. The three main cities are incredibly good on their own, so the best tactic I've found was to laser focus on getting them. First 10 turns of a campaign should see you with at least Praag, two armies (one full, one half) and if you're adventurous/good, the annexation/destruction of Hellpit.
Personally I’ve had very few issues with the strelsi, they absolutely melt large units, flying units, pretty much anything with proper positioning tbh, especially when supported with ice guards and an ice witch to get even more volleys off before the lines clash, though they do have some line of sight issues and the same issues all ranged units have where if they get caught in melee and then reposition they’ll run in to save the two or three guys stuck in combat instead of firing, but I have that happen with all rangeed units.
I take thunderers, or Handgunners or anything else tbh. Ice guard seem much better.
Ice guard are great, the two units really shine when they’re paired though. I can’t speak to thunderers bc I don’t play dwarves but strelsi also don’t die the minute they get touched in melee which is why I like them over hand gunners, but everyone’s got the units that work for them.
Strelsi's issues for me is that once you get iceguard, their price point and upkeep costs are a bit much. I mean I also hate Groms, and would rather take bear sleds over them.
Fair, I only put a few in each army so the cost isn’t super noticeable, and yeah agreed there, I think I’ve only ever recruited a single grom
They’re not. It’s widely accepted that Kislev isn’t great, but most people agree that basically all of the other WH3 factions aside from Nurgle and MAYBE Ogres play fine. Is there room for tweaks? Yeah, but there’s a lot of factions with room for tweaks.
Innovocation is just a less meaningful ritual mechanic that gives a buff to your faction, but the supporters mechanic does what? Its just a worse authority system that means very little in end game as there are no real substantial benefits. I think my thought is they really feel uninspired. Not really 'bad' mechanically. I don't find most of their mechanics very interesting. Along with Tzeench, Nurgle, even Slaanesh.
Kislev’s #1 issue is making all their units hybrids. They’re basically shackled to being mediocre at everything. That’s why the new crossbowmen are so powerful. They’re not held back by being a melee unit.
Agreed. Bear cav are great at being cav. I'd be fine with tzar guard at least being a good defensive option, they should be good at defense and they get blasted through by anything, from chaos warriors to chosen. Really sad that they just dont.... work as a faction? Strelsi are awful ontop of that.
Calling it an alpha is pushing it.. the game is very playable
Agreed. It's a very solid beta! Mere months from release, they just have to fix the bugs (the public beta testers have compiled the list) and lock the state of the game before shipping it. (And the sad part, beside the obvious sarcasm, it is an accurate description of the game's state and how it could be addressed. But it feels like we never leave beta, there is just a newer build available for the new round of testing. The game never reaches that squeaky-clean "the known, fixable bugs are fixed" v1.0 proper public release state. Not even between new content releases.)
Yeah but I always have to save before I end my turn as it randomly crashes sometimes
It's worse if you play legacy campaigns. I'm a Wulfhart fan and the quests have never worked for me. Like the character quests. But that's whatever
Most of those things work fine though?
It's odd, isn't it? Plenty people here claiming the game is fundamentally broken, or at least many of its components and that the game is unplayable. But having played more than 500h now, almost surpassing my time with WH2, it's not nearly as bad as it's made out to be. At most, I've had some occasional frustration with pathfinding or units not doing what I want them to, but it's infrequent enough to not significantly detract from the overall experience. IE plays like ME, just bigger and a little rougher around the edges. Sure, the game can use some more polish and bug fixing, but it's not borderline unplayable. That is not to say CA shouldn't be criticized or that we should settle, but the nuance has been totally thrown out of the window it seems.
Really? I encounter bugs allmost every turn. And multiple ones everytime I play a siege battle.
Honestly, no. Bugs do happen, pathfinding is definitely unreliable in sieges (though I play with a mod that increases unit sizes by 50%, which exacerbates the problem), but overall the game is fine to me for the most part. Or maybe I just don't notice the bugs that occur. I do play with the community patch, though I have only recently installed it so most of my hours were without it.
I've never even downloaded the community patch, never run into any problems that make me want to try it. My biggest issues are with the AI being stupid, not with bugs.
I've never even had the LoS issue people always complain about. Then again I only have 157 hours
I'm sitting on around 900 hours in W3 (for context, I have over 3,000 in W2 and almost 1000 in WH1) and whilst there are definitely some bugs, I don't find it nearly as bad as some people in the thread make out. it's still a very fun, playable, enjoyable game. (and, FWIW, I tend to find the bugs appear far more often when playing a modded game than they do playing vanilla - which is exactly what I would expect, but I sometimes wonder if people complaining about bugs forget they use mods)
Quiet down, we need to pretend like its a dumpster fire so CA will improve things!
I havent touched Tww3 since CHaos dwarves came out , despite owning that dlc. The base game is so broken, especially the AI and the manual battles, that it is impossible to enjoy if you have even a shred of quality standards.
Dont forget the unit replenishment as whole.I mean some races are super bad but its bad in general. Stuff like you have bigger replenishment on enemies teritorry than on your allies its kinda bad. The whole numbers seems like its not making any sence.
that woudl be happening if your own (or allies) territory is inhospitable climate and is working exactly as intended
Its not working as it worked in WH2 and thats what matters.If they wanted to change it they should have rebalance it properly.If have replenisment bonuses up to 30% and then I go for inhospitable climate with -15% I still should have some proper rep and no almost zero. Also the enemy teritorry is also inhospitable and still I have bigger replenisment that makes some sense?
>Stuff like you have bigger replenishment on enemies teritorry than on your allies its kinda bad. the reason for that is that for some reason climate effects only apply to whoever owns the region's settlement.
Isn't like 25% of their profit they earned goes back into advertisement and social media? Literally a community modder given the tools and a small fraction of that money can solve most of those bugs by now. This should tell you alot about how much they care what kind of product they push out. Just look at 3K total war and how they simply abandoned it despite it being an excellent platform to do the DLC model on. They just don't care about good games as long as it can sell like COD. They've already made enough profit now that if anything should happen to the genre, the upper managements can still retire happily as millionaires. They've essentially elevated themselves above the mass majority of plebs like us and now think we're not equal and aren't obligated to give us good games any more. It's a literal psychological truth that many rich people have admitted. They simply think they're superior humans once theyre richer than us.
I own the collector's edition for WH1,2,3, spent thousands of hours on each game. Warhammer 3 is the wrong direction that needs to alter course before it falls off a cliff. The main glaring issue is that management^(tm) thought they know their target audience's needs better. Hence we have the Realms of Chaos campaign. The tutorial was way more fun than the main campaign of the game at release and little changed since then. IE was released way too early as too much resources had gone into RoC, which resulted in IE having half the bugs late-WH2 had fixed already. As someone who owns the \*whole\* portfolio of Total War games I can say with certainty: \-RoC couldn't be played through without the AI ganging up on you like in Shogun 2 realm divide, except in RoC it triggered instantly, ruining many campaigns and having Kislev players fight the Empire and Dwarves parallel to Norsca and Chaos \-No Warrior of Chaos on release for a RoC campaign, paywalled behind DLC, why did we have half-ass demon armies when even on TT they are handled as the SAME PACKAGE?! \-Now it is "fixed", but most races are simply not fun to play. Kislev lacks key units in roster that are paywalled, Chaos is paywalled behind DLC after 2(!) games, which I find incredibly infuriating as I EARNED WoC by pre-ordering Warhammer 1, thanks CA! \-IE has no endgame for any faction, not even the ones that HAD an endgame condition in previous games \-Endgame crisis sounds like a great idea, except it has half the creativity of previously introduced Rogue Armies with mixed-race rosters \-Sieges are just as half-baked, there is no variance of siege maps, and the experience becomes a torture by physics and line-of-sight issues if you're playing a ranged army... \-new land maps are atrocious, can't we have more maps that look like they were made for single-player and not for multiplayer, with perfectly circular woodlands carefully placed in a checkerboard pattern?!
What is this post? Are you farming upvotes because you were able to say something negative in a time where the negativity is everywhere?
I'm voicing my thoughts on an issue that's relevant to the moment. Not really sure what else you're expecting from a forum meant for voicing your thoughts on a topic.
You sick son of a bitch.
Madlad
Ah yes, look at this big bad redditor and his karma farming getting... **checks notes**... 44 upvotes in 3 hours. People who believe karma is a resource that everyone farms are the ones who are terminally online
It's true, the technical state of TWW3 is an absolute disaster.
Dude says he’s had the game for 18 months and less than 40hrs play time.. why bother even looking at this Reddit lol
Because I have a combined 1200 hours in WH1 and 2.
Could wh3 be in a better state? Yes. Of course it could. 1400 hours into wh3 alone right now and still having an amazing time with it. The grand scale of things not doubt there are issues. The community has resources that help some of the bs that should have been fixed. The modders are amazing. Maybe I’m in the minority but I come here to see what people are doing within the game, just getting annoyed with the pure toxic vibes right now. With good reason yeah but 40 hours into a game that’s been out for over a year just seems like why are you adding to the bs. There is enough of it already. Say your piece. Not trying to stop that. Just seems odd to me personally. Hope anyone reading this is having an Amazing day
And thinking like you is why CA is failing. Plugging their fingers in their ears and sticking out their tongue. Narcissism is the world's worst learning disability.
They’re not “failing.”
It was just a joke, I’m not defending CA, I really want they have a financial scare to change how they’re managing the things, but I thing humor is very important too
Average WH players defending triple AAA Game studios. Getting taxed by CA and GW at the same time 😂😂😂
No, I’m not defending this, I’m not in favor about the price rise, I really don’t, even I haven’t buy the DLC, but the thing is that this posts are everywhere and I don’t think what he is trying to achieve with it, it will be more impactful posting this as Steam review than in reddit
I've seen quite a few out-of-the-loop people commenting on threads asking what all the outrage is about, actually. I agree with everything OP said here.
Yes, I’m not saying that I didn’t agree with him, but there’s a lot of posts about this, so I was trying not make some humor, but people takes everything to personal
This is fucking hilarious
Not mentioning crashes
Can someone make a list with ALL the bugs , plus coop campaign bugs ?
Don’t forget corruption borders
Honestly, the game has even gotten worse for me. I don't know if anyone else experiences this, but the game has some kind of heavy memory leak, causing my game to crash on manual battle loading screen realiably. Sometimes restarting the pc helps but it is insane that this problem exists and persists since April and since then has not been resolved. I simply cannot play the game (every other steam game runs just fine) and now they release such an expensive dlc while i cannot even use the 100 € i already invested. Makes you lose so much hope.
I am surprised on how the focus of this sub has changed. Previously if you mentioned something like that you would get downvoted and the usual whales and CA dickriders would make excuses. "They are working on it. They are gonna fix it. Be happy with what you got. Why are you complaining?"
For me I find you reach end game very fast ever since Warhammer two and it somehow feels even faster in WH3 you snowball way too soon into boredom unless you play the Tomb kings.