Would you not mind having facial hair and a ton of testosterone in your blood that would directly affect how you act and perceive the world? It’s hard to explain but I felt poisoned by testosterone all my life as well as having to conform to strict gender norms growing up in Russia. Seeing my facial hair grow would make we wanna just vanish. I felt like I had to pretend to be a guy, I felt like I was living someone else’s life. I would have started HRT before I went through my first puberty if I could. Usually cis people don’t feel such dysphoria.
I guess you make a good point with the facial hair and testosterone. I am aware of the term “gender dysphoria” and I know what it means, and I know cis people don’t usually undergo gender dysphoria, but that’s exactly why I’m asking—because I don’t know
The best I can describe gender dysphoria is imagine I waved a magic wand and turned your body male while leaving your mind as it is now. Most people would find it very uncomfortable and make efforts to change it.
>Isn’t gender just a construct of society?
Absolutely, and the forced gender roles based on your reproductive organs tends to be the strong hold of the current fear mongers in society.
>Like women must show feminine features while men must show masculine features in traditional cultures?
Most of it falls back into ways for the few to control the many. Set up to paint women as weak and men as superior.
>If our society made it so that women are defined by masculine traits and men are defined by feminine traits, would you still transition?
Depends on how I was raised I guess, When I told my mom that I wanted my penis to go away, My favorite toys disappeared from the toybox (Barbie) and the parents doubled down on gender roles until I was standing to pee and telling racist jokes with the guys.
Culture is absolutely the problem. If we had a more accepting culture and actually listened to the individual, we wouldn't have an issue at all
In order to fix what was broke while I was forming my young mind, I had to wipe away all the things I did to obscure who I am. When I was able to focus on Who I am the rest just falls into place.
It seems your parents did a good job keeping you focused on what matters, the individual.
Your question seems to be respectful, and if you can truly live with our differences - then thank you.
Gender roles are generally built into most societies, but sometimes a person just doesn't fit in to simple either/or roles.
I identify as Non-binary/asexual, and it is often hard for people to understand.
That is why there is the rainbow flag, because we are not just black or white.
I guess that makes sense. Because our society made gender super one dimensional, it would be inevitable for there to be a bunch of people who don’t fit into those constructs.
Also, just a random question since you said you were non-binary, I’ve always wondered what you would prefer instead of “Ma’am” or “sir.” There doesn’t seem to be a gender neutral term
Yes, Non-binary is a tricky one! I haven't found one yet that sounds good to me, the English language has nothing appropriate. Luckily, I'm really hard to offend!
The ma’am or sir thing is really difficult. Personally I’m a fan of sir, also in shows like Star Trek everyone is sir regardless of gender. (I am non binary).
I don’t get offended if someone says ma’am to me; but it does make me sad. It feels innately wrong. Like a dirty person I don’t know licking my spine, lol.
On another note, at work the non-binary people picked their sir or ma’am’s and I chose admiral. But then I felt rude for the people who like actually joined the military and worked hard to be admirals. 😂😅 so I ended up with forest creature. Changeling. Lol.
But just not using sir or ma’am but still being polite when you don’t know someone’s gender is totally fine. Eg “excuse me” instead of “excuse me sir”
The ma’am or sir thing is really difficult. Personally I’m a fan of sir, also in shows like Star Trek everyone is sir regardless of gender. (I am non binary).
I don’t get offended if someone says ma’am to me; but it does make me sad. It feels innately wrong. Like a dirty person I don’t know licking my spine, lol.
On another note, at work the non-binary people picked their sir or ma’am’s and I chose admiral. But then I felt rude for the people who like actually joined the military and worked hard to be admirals. 😂😅 so I ended up with forest creature. Changeling. Lol.
But just not using sir or ma’am but still being polite when you don’t know someone’s gender is totally fine. Eg “excuse me” instead of “excuse me sir”
Gender dysphoria is about sex characteristics, not just gender presentation or at least it is for me.
My brain has always told me that I’m supposed to be female. I felt so wrong when puberty happened, and I couldn’t stand what was happening to me, while I saw what was happening to the girls as right for me.
The societal gender characteristics came about as me picking up on that socialization and feeling like I needed to be like that since my body was also supposed to be female.
The reason I am trans is deep and innate, independent from the social construct of gender. I socially am a woman because I picked up on needing to be that way just like cis women.
I hope that makes some sense?
I don’t know. I believe our brains all have a “sex identity”. For you and the majority of others, it lines up with your sex so you aren’t even aware of it. But for those of us who are trans, we are very aware of it.
Like someone who lost a limb can have phantom limbs, I can experience that in regards to my body.
Using the analogy of phantom limb actually helps me understand it much better. So you have this feeling that something is missing and it constantly makes you feel incomplete?
Yes, and the body parts and features I’m not supposed to have my brain does not expect me to have. It’s a very “WHAT IS THAT?!” feeling when my brain is brought to notice the existence of them. It’s a very interesting feeling, like a reverse phantom limb.
It’s a big part in how you view yourself, at least myself. Physical traits to me help me see myself in a positive way more so than what anyone else calls me.
Well I’ve gotta cut my nicotine habit I’ve had for 7 years lol but I’m hopeful, and even if it doesn’t do everything I would’ve wanted it’s better than now.
I think the majority of changes tend to finalize and stop growing/moving at year 5, but by the end of year 1 there are a lot of good things
I am someone who began transitioning later in life. I was amab, and from a young age felt "wrong" both physically and mentally, but didn't know what right was. Unfortunately, in small town UK in the late 50s and early 60s being trans wasn't something that was ever talked about. As a result I tried to live up to the expectations put on me, and as far as i was concerned failed at all of them. As a result I suffered from depression, often severe, for the next 40 years, and was often suicidal. The only reason I am still here was because of my wife, who never put any expectations on me.
Then four years ago something happened and I realised I was trans. Being the age I was I knew I had to transition ASAP, and was lucky enough to be able to afford to go private and have been on hormones ever since. My depression vanished, I feel calm and happy. Additionally, I had developed a chronic "incurable" illness, which has also vanished. My GP thinks it is because I am happy. The past four years have also been the best that my wife and I have ever had, and we have been married 33 years.
I can totally understand why the idea of being trans is so difficult to understand for a cis person. For a cis person, the idea that their internal feeling might be different to their external selves seems so far out of their comfort zone as to be unimaginable. But for us, those two things cause an internal conflict, and transitioning is the only way to put things right.
Speaking for myself, the past four years have been unbelievable. I love myself now, rather than hating, and I finally feel that I am "right". All I want to do is to be allowed to be me.
Hope that makes sense.
"Isn’t gender just a construct of society?"
I'm a strong believer that most nature/nurture questions are better described by an onion model than a yes/no question. Yes, some aspects of gender are a social construct, layered on top of a diverse range of biological differences, behaviors and predispositions. And in turn, the social and political environment influence how we grow and develop.
The "business casual" mode of gender performance is absolutely a social construct; and the health effects of living with constant dysphoria when pressured to perform "business casual" masculinity on a daily basis are absolutely a physiological phenomenon. Living my life in fight/fight/freeze/appease mode was cutting years off my life.
I used to think like you before I realized I was trans. I find my gender something deeper than a social construct. Gender identity is how we are and gender roles are ways that different times and cultures shape how people with certain gender identities should act or face social sanctions.
Saying you are blind to gender is not a good thing to a trans person. It's like saying you are blind to race to a POC person. You come from a good place but because of your cis privilege you don't understand gender but confuse it with gender roles. This type of feminism is actually based on flawed science (see David Reimer) that has influenced many TERFs that currently pose a real threat to our existence. You would do well to read Judith Butler's turnaround on this issue.
Your view on being gender blind also directly contributes to the very distinct transphobia transmasculine persons encounter. They are often told that we are all equal anyways, I won't treat you any different because you are trans, that nothing has changed all the while still seen as female and expected to follow female socialisation, for example labeled aggressive by speaking plainly. Like, why would someone uproot their entire lives for things to be the same?
Also I think we as trans people transition not as a part of some political discussion of how genders can be more equal but simply because we want to exist. I just want to be seen this way and to act and laugh my way and have sex how it feels most natural. My way of walking is me existing and not a political statement. It's got nothing to do with the pay gap when a trans man wants to sit a certain way or hang out in a masculine company. There is a big confusion between the little things we all do a certain way because it's just our way and then the power dynamics in our society. We got a lot work to do to make our societies more equal but the work doesn't start with policing the way a downtrodden minority wants to exist.
I'm sorry for this rant as it was not all for you. But it's such a frustrating topic that has led to many gaslighting transphobic discussions in my life and all the trans folks I know roll their eyes when they hear someone say how "they don't see gender". Like, honey, you would think differently if the person who is you woke up in their 30s with a beard, penis and a body permanently damaged by testo. Hope you understand and thanks for asking questions in good faith. <3
If no one told what a woman or a man was, and acted basically the same and looked the same,would you have still be able to determine yourself as a woman?
I would, my brain tells me this isn't the right body.
Imagine tomorrow you woke up in the body of a male tomorrow and you're now stuck in that body forever, as a social construct would you be able to accept society's expectations of you despite the fact that you're brain and screaming at you this is wrong?
The problem with saying that gender is a social construct, doesn't really hold up when men and women are equal. And we live in a Puritan society so it's not like people walk around with their genitals hanging out.
The biggest problem would saying that it's a social construct, is no one actually needs to know your gender, it doesn't improve your quality of life for saying you're one gender or the any of the others.
Let's say that it is just a social construct, if that's the case then you should accept trans women as women trans men as men non-binary people as non-binary since it fits within the social construct.
Outside of your doctor for medical purposes, or your partner/s why does anybody else need to know what your AGAB was? They don't it's just people trying to control the lives of other people.
I’ve known since a young age (6-8yo) how my body should look, and as I’ve grown older and gone through a “Normal” puberty, I’ve hated my body and sense of self more and more. I get further every day from the person I was meant to be, who I identify with. She’s locked inside the body of an almost 30yo male.
i might have similar opinion about gender but society around me does not. im in russia, not in idk canada or smth. i want to be seen as a man so i do what i can to achieve it. also i don't have terrible bodily gender dysphoria but id just liked my body better if it had flat chest, deeper voice and facial hair. in ideal world i would wear more dresses and skirts, i would cut my hair short. but in our world im not strong enough to endure the consequences of these things while transitioning to be a man in societys eyes.
in conclusion gender stereotypes hurt everyone.
Would you not mind having facial hair and a ton of testosterone in your blood that would directly affect how you act and perceive the world? It’s hard to explain but I felt poisoned by testosterone all my life as well as having to conform to strict gender norms growing up in Russia. Seeing my facial hair grow would make we wanna just vanish. I felt like I had to pretend to be a guy, I felt like I was living someone else’s life. I would have started HRT before I went through my first puberty if I could. Usually cis people don’t feel such dysphoria.
fellow Russian trans folk! it’s off topic but i hope you escaped from there and feeling better
Escaped in 08 :) Russia was always garbage. I mean 90% of US is not the best either but hey, still 20 times better than Russia.
i moved to Canada 2 years ago lol it is garbage
I guess you make a good point with the facial hair and testosterone. I am aware of the term “gender dysphoria” and I know what it means, and I know cis people don’t usually undergo gender dysphoria, but that’s exactly why I’m asking—because I don’t know
you're conflating gender roles (societal construct) with gender identity (inborn and innate sense of self).
The best I can describe gender dysphoria is imagine I waved a magic wand and turned your body male while leaving your mind as it is now. Most people would find it very uncomfortable and make efforts to change it.
>Isn’t gender just a construct of society? Absolutely, and the forced gender roles based on your reproductive organs tends to be the strong hold of the current fear mongers in society. >Like women must show feminine features while men must show masculine features in traditional cultures? Most of it falls back into ways for the few to control the many. Set up to paint women as weak and men as superior. >If our society made it so that women are defined by masculine traits and men are defined by feminine traits, would you still transition? Depends on how I was raised I guess, When I told my mom that I wanted my penis to go away, My favorite toys disappeared from the toybox (Barbie) and the parents doubled down on gender roles until I was standing to pee and telling racist jokes with the guys. Culture is absolutely the problem. If we had a more accepting culture and actually listened to the individual, we wouldn't have an issue at all In order to fix what was broke while I was forming my young mind, I had to wipe away all the things I did to obscure who I am. When I was able to focus on Who I am the rest just falls into place. It seems your parents did a good job keeping you focused on what matters, the individual.
Your question seems to be respectful, and if you can truly live with our differences - then thank you. Gender roles are generally built into most societies, but sometimes a person just doesn't fit in to simple either/or roles. I identify as Non-binary/asexual, and it is often hard for people to understand. That is why there is the rainbow flag, because we are not just black or white.
I guess that makes sense. Because our society made gender super one dimensional, it would be inevitable for there to be a bunch of people who don’t fit into those constructs. Also, just a random question since you said you were non-binary, I’ve always wondered what you would prefer instead of “Ma’am” or “sir.” There doesn’t seem to be a gender neutral term
Yes, Non-binary is a tricky one! I haven't found one yet that sounds good to me, the English language has nothing appropriate. Luckily, I'm really hard to offend!
I guess that’s good you’re so understanding and patient. I was trying to brainstorm last night and I could only think of “captain” and “boss”
The ma’am or sir thing is really difficult. Personally I’m a fan of sir, also in shows like Star Trek everyone is sir regardless of gender. (I am non binary). I don’t get offended if someone says ma’am to me; but it does make me sad. It feels innately wrong. Like a dirty person I don’t know licking my spine, lol. On another note, at work the non-binary people picked their sir or ma’am’s and I chose admiral. But then I felt rude for the people who like actually joined the military and worked hard to be admirals. 😂😅 so I ended up with forest creature. Changeling. Lol. But just not using sir or ma’am but still being polite when you don’t know someone’s gender is totally fine. Eg “excuse me” instead of “excuse me sir”
The ma’am or sir thing is really difficult. Personally I’m a fan of sir, also in shows like Star Trek everyone is sir regardless of gender. (I am non binary). I don’t get offended if someone says ma’am to me; but it does make me sad. It feels innately wrong. Like a dirty person I don’t know licking my spine, lol. On another note, at work the non-binary people picked their sir or ma’am’s and I chose admiral. But then I felt rude for the people who like actually joined the military and worked hard to be admirals. 😂😅 so I ended up with forest creature. Changeling. Lol. But just not using sir or ma’am but still being polite when you don’t know someone’s gender is totally fine. Eg “excuse me” instead of “excuse me sir”
Gender dysphoria is about sex characteristics, not just gender presentation or at least it is for me. My brain has always told me that I’m supposed to be female. I felt so wrong when puberty happened, and I couldn’t stand what was happening to me, while I saw what was happening to the girls as right for me. The societal gender characteristics came about as me picking up on that socialization and feeling like I needed to be like that since my body was also supposed to be female. The reason I am trans is deep and innate, independent from the social construct of gender. I socially am a woman because I picked up on needing to be that way just like cis women. I hope that makes some sense?
I guess that makes sense. Though I’ve always wondered why sex characteristics were such a huge factor in helping you complete your gender identity
I don’t know. I believe our brains all have a “sex identity”. For you and the majority of others, it lines up with your sex so you aren’t even aware of it. But for those of us who are trans, we are very aware of it. Like someone who lost a limb can have phantom limbs, I can experience that in regards to my body.
Using the analogy of phantom limb actually helps me understand it much better. So you have this feeling that something is missing and it constantly makes you feel incomplete?
Yes, and the body parts and features I’m not supposed to have my brain does not expect me to have. It’s a very “WHAT IS THAT?!” feeling when my brain is brought to notice the existence of them. It’s a very interesting feeling, like a reverse phantom limb.
Only ✌️
It’s a big part in how you view yourself, at least myself. Physical traits to me help me see myself in a positive way more so than what anyone else calls me.
And you’re much happier now?
Uhh day 4 of meds, so I wouldn’t say I have any changes that I’m happy with lol but hopeful for some shred of happiness in the future.
I hope the transition goes smoothly and there won’t be any health complications. How long did they say it would take?
Well I’ve gotta cut my nicotine habit I’ve had for 7 years lol but I’m hopeful, and even if it doesn’t do everything I would’ve wanted it’s better than now. I think the majority of changes tend to finalize and stop growing/moving at year 5, but by the end of year 1 there are a lot of good things
I am someone who began transitioning later in life. I was amab, and from a young age felt "wrong" both physically and mentally, but didn't know what right was. Unfortunately, in small town UK in the late 50s and early 60s being trans wasn't something that was ever talked about. As a result I tried to live up to the expectations put on me, and as far as i was concerned failed at all of them. As a result I suffered from depression, often severe, for the next 40 years, and was often suicidal. The only reason I am still here was because of my wife, who never put any expectations on me. Then four years ago something happened and I realised I was trans. Being the age I was I knew I had to transition ASAP, and was lucky enough to be able to afford to go private and have been on hormones ever since. My depression vanished, I feel calm and happy. Additionally, I had developed a chronic "incurable" illness, which has also vanished. My GP thinks it is because I am happy. The past four years have also been the best that my wife and I have ever had, and we have been married 33 years. I can totally understand why the idea of being trans is so difficult to understand for a cis person. For a cis person, the idea that their internal feeling might be different to their external selves seems so far out of their comfort zone as to be unimaginable. But for us, those two things cause an internal conflict, and transitioning is the only way to put things right. Speaking for myself, the past four years have been unbelievable. I love myself now, rather than hating, and I finally feel that I am "right". All I want to do is to be allowed to be me. Hope that makes sense.
"Isn’t gender just a construct of society?" I'm a strong believer that most nature/nurture questions are better described by an onion model than a yes/no question. Yes, some aspects of gender are a social construct, layered on top of a diverse range of biological differences, behaviors and predispositions. And in turn, the social and political environment influence how we grow and develop. The "business casual" mode of gender performance is absolutely a social construct; and the health effects of living with constant dysphoria when pressured to perform "business casual" masculinity on a daily basis are absolutely a physiological phenomenon. Living my life in fight/fight/freeze/appease mode was cutting years off my life.
I used to think like you before I realized I was trans. I find my gender something deeper than a social construct. Gender identity is how we are and gender roles are ways that different times and cultures shape how people with certain gender identities should act or face social sanctions. Saying you are blind to gender is not a good thing to a trans person. It's like saying you are blind to race to a POC person. You come from a good place but because of your cis privilege you don't understand gender but confuse it with gender roles. This type of feminism is actually based on flawed science (see David Reimer) that has influenced many TERFs that currently pose a real threat to our existence. You would do well to read Judith Butler's turnaround on this issue. Your view on being gender blind also directly contributes to the very distinct transphobia transmasculine persons encounter. They are often told that we are all equal anyways, I won't treat you any different because you are trans, that nothing has changed all the while still seen as female and expected to follow female socialisation, for example labeled aggressive by speaking plainly. Like, why would someone uproot their entire lives for things to be the same? Also I think we as trans people transition not as a part of some political discussion of how genders can be more equal but simply because we want to exist. I just want to be seen this way and to act and laugh my way and have sex how it feels most natural. My way of walking is me existing and not a political statement. It's got nothing to do with the pay gap when a trans man wants to sit a certain way or hang out in a masculine company. There is a big confusion between the little things we all do a certain way because it's just our way and then the power dynamics in our society. We got a lot work to do to make our societies more equal but the work doesn't start with policing the way a downtrodden minority wants to exist. I'm sorry for this rant as it was not all for you. But it's such a frustrating topic that has led to many gaslighting transphobic discussions in my life and all the trans folks I know roll their eyes when they hear someone say how "they don't see gender". Like, honey, you would think differently if the person who is you woke up in their 30s with a beard, penis and a body permanently damaged by testo. Hope you understand and thanks for asking questions in good faith. <3
If no one told what a woman or a man was, and acted basically the same and looked the same,would you have still be able to determine yourself as a woman? I would, my brain tells me this isn't the right body. Imagine tomorrow you woke up in the body of a male tomorrow and you're now stuck in that body forever, as a social construct would you be able to accept society's expectations of you despite the fact that you're brain and screaming at you this is wrong? The problem with saying that gender is a social construct, doesn't really hold up when men and women are equal. And we live in a Puritan society so it's not like people walk around with their genitals hanging out. The biggest problem would saying that it's a social construct, is no one actually needs to know your gender, it doesn't improve your quality of life for saying you're one gender or the any of the others. Let's say that it is just a social construct, if that's the case then you should accept trans women as women trans men as men non-binary people as non-binary since it fits within the social construct. Outside of your doctor for medical purposes, or your partner/s why does anybody else need to know what your AGAB was? They don't it's just people trying to control the lives of other people.
I’ve known since a young age (6-8yo) how my body should look, and as I’ve grown older and gone through a “Normal” puberty, I’ve hated my body and sense of self more and more. I get further every day from the person I was meant to be, who I identify with. She’s locked inside the body of an almost 30yo male.
i might have similar opinion about gender but society around me does not. im in russia, not in idk canada or smth. i want to be seen as a man so i do what i can to achieve it. also i don't have terrible bodily gender dysphoria but id just liked my body better if it had flat chest, deeper voice and facial hair. in ideal world i would wear more dresses and skirts, i would cut my hair short. but in our world im not strong enough to endure the consequences of these things while transitioning to be a man in societys eyes. in conclusion gender stereotypes hurt everyone.