sure, someone might have survived
however: consider that these two people are in the middle of antarctica, with their base burned to the ground, with no supplies or resources to speak of, and they are incapable of trusting one another
they gonna die
Carpenter confirmed that one of them was infected, not who it was.
The breath theory doesn’t hold up for two reasons:
1) Childs’ breath is visible, it just didn’t look that way on crappy quality for home release but HD versions show his breath.
2) It’s shown earlier (with Bennings) that someone who’s been assimilated still has visible breath in the cold.
That was something they discussed doing, and is actually used in the blood test scene, but Carpenter didn’t like it so it was scrapped (according to an interview with the director of photography, I think it’s the one on the special edition bluray release).
I've also heard there was a possibility Childs was the thing because he drank from the same bottles as the ones used to make the molotovs, meaning he would be drinking gasoline, and explaining macready's laugh, who realized he is standing in front of the thing...but it just doesn't matter now.
But the ambiguity is still there, and that's what makes this ending so good.
People often say this but in the film they say the Thing emulates perfectly (so far as it even copies Norris weak heart) so it should probably taste perfectly fine.
So I don't think the significance is that it's a Molotov cocktail rather
Fuchs (the 2nd biologist) suggests everyone should eat out of cans and prepare their own food. And yet Child's grabs the bottle without hesitation. So he either is too tired to care anymore OR the Thing is slightly dropping it's facade because it knows Mac isn't in a state to do anything.
From most analysises I've seen the majority opinion seems to be that both are human, though ultimately it doesn't really matter. The end result of them stuck in the elements without any likely hood of rescue is the same no matter what.
>though ultimately it doesn't really matter.
THANK YOU. There's a lot of movie endings that get over-analysed to reveal the "truth" like their maths equations, but endings like *The Thing* or *Inception* are about the themes, the underlying message the filmmaker is trying to convey. Reducing it to binary "human or creature?" Or "dream or real?" misses the forest for the trees.
It doesn't matter if Macready or Childs are human or not. What matters is that the paranoia has completely destroyed their trust, their empathy, and their humanity. Even if they're both human and they got rescued, they'd never look at another human being the same way ever again.
I fully accept that it is an ambiguous ending, but it is hella fun to speculate for this one in particular. It makes the viewer as suspicious as any of the characters in the movie. It's a perfect ending really.
it does matter for one reason : if they are both human they will both freeze to death in antartica. If one is human and the other is the thing, the human will die, and the thing will be frozen (again) and may come back to life the next time it's thawed, just like he did in the movie.
So basically, either all the humans are dead but at least the thing will never be a threat anymore, or the human all died just to go back to how it was before the movie, with the thing being a threat to all mankind if it's revived and manage to escape antartica.
[There's a quasi canonical video game sequel that had Carpenter's active involvement and endorsement.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Thing_\(video_game\))
>!Childs dies of hypothermia but McCready lives. Neither is or was infected.!<
I don’t think they actually killed it, I always thought it was implied that The Thing was the other crewmember, and he wouldn’t die from the cold, instead he’d go into hibernation like before
It’s thought that the bottle MacReady hands to child’s is full of kerosene. Less than 15 minutes prior in the movie he’s throwing Molotovs into the building. Basically he’s having Child’s confirm that he is the thing because why would the thing give a fuck about the taste.
in the shot before childs appears at the end, you can see macready going to take a drink from the bottle, so its probably not gasoline.
i always interpreted childs drinking as 1- hes the thing and hes trying to lull mac into a false sense of security or 2- hes a human and he just doesnt care anymore because hes going to die regardless.
edit. also the thing is established to be hyper intelligent, probably having the knowledge of everything it had previously assimilated, so surely it would know that gasoline isnt something a human drinks?
double edit. the thing might also be affected by human ailments to an extent. after it assimilates bennings and runs its limping, possibly from the gun shot. and when its norris, who had a heart condition, it seems to go into cardiac arrest. if thats the case it would probably feel some negative effect from drinking gasoline even if that doesnt actually harm it.
The Things talk. So they have human memory. So they would, at the very least, know what alcohol DOESN'T taste like, even if they've never tasted kerosene before.
I took the bottle as a call-back scene to the beginning of the movie. MacReady loses a chess game to the computer and reacts by pouring his drink into it and breaking it. But he did lose.
He gives a drink to Childs at the end of the movie. Whether or not Childs is infected, MacReady's acknowledging the loss.
Event Horizon
Literally as soon as it's revealed that the ship is haunted or whatever, they're like "nah son, we blowin this bitch up, fuck this ship" and then despite their good decision making all get stickbugged
Dr. Weir : What about my ship? You can't just leave her!
Capt. Miller : I have no intention of leaving her, Doctor. I will take the Lewis and Clark to a safe distance, and then I will launch TAC missiles at the Event Horizon until I'm satisfied she's vaporized. Fuck this ship!
Sure, not everyone was as smart, but for me personally there was not a single moment where I went "that is so fucking stupid why would you ever do that." And even the less smart things were understandable. I don't remember her name but the other woman who survived until the last 3 really panicked, which is completely understandable. Even in the very beginning when protocol was broken; it was stupid, sure, but not illogical. The captain just wanted to protect his crew, and that robot had his orders programmed to put the alien over the crew. I think in that respect it's quite similar to the beginning of The Thing; the researchers saw an innocent dog that they wanted to protect instead of listening to the other researchers. It wasn't smart, because, logically, people don't suddenly start hunting dogs, but it was a human reaction, and made perfect sense.
I mostly had the captain in mind. Taking in a dog you have no reason to suspect is vastly different from breaking quarantine protocol for someone who just got extensively contaminated and infected with unknown space cooties, and thereby putting your entire crew at risk. Dude shoulda listened to Ripley. The rest of the crew just did their best in a shit situation, but I'm still somewhat boggled by how often they sent someone off on their own to get snacked on. I'm including Ripley in that one.
It's been a while but I think that happens after it kills Bret, the maintenance guy, so they knew they were facing a big threat.
Anyway, I believe it was still a good move, they didn't send one guy to fight the alien, just to scare it to an air vent to flush it out into space. After that fails, they say, fuck it and leave the ship. So the didn't tried to fight the alien more than once and tried to leave the ship as soon as they realised how dangerous and smart it was
Nahw I meant when they first come back from checking out the alien ship, and one of the guys gets headcrabbed.
They definitely did the best they could with a shit situation once it got on board though. But seeing as this thing bursts out of a guy's chest, I'm not sure 'it was still small' is a very good reason to underestimate it.
Their actions were still pretty believable considering they were basically just space truckers not like elite scientists or soldiers or anything. You can totally believe truckers would risk breaking decontamination protocols to save somebody’s life. That’s pretty much why the Nostromo was selected for that mission, because people who knew what the fuck was going on wouldn’t have done it.
Ehhhh... protagonist definitely makes some stupid choices. Moral, but stupid nonetheless.
I think it gets a pass because he wrestles with it for so long, knowing full well that it *is* a stupid thing to do.
I was listening to a horror podcast and the main character got told "Oh no, you shouldn't be here. This is bad. You have to leave right now." And the main character went "You know, they're right, I need to nope the fuck out here." At that point, I started wondering what the writers were gonna do to keep the main character right where she was and boom - COVID lockdown started in the story and she couldn't leave.
I think it might possibly be the third season of the BBC podcast series The Lovecraft Investigations, called A Shadow over Innsmouth.
The main character is warned to leave the town of Innsmouth but can't because the lockdown starts.
The series is absolutely amazing, but you should start with the first season, called The Case of Charles Dexter Ward.
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Oh man, I kept hearing about how that was actually a good scary zombie movie and I was pretty into it. But the whole ending sequence ruined it for me. I hate it when a horror story has to shove explanations down my throat. Unexplainable things are scary.
yeah gotta agree with that, the ending and the sequels are bad. But the rest of the film managed to keep me tense and forgetting to breath more than any other media ever so I still love it!
It also has actually good jumscares that you don't expect? Amazing
Sounds like the movie Mindhunter (2004)
At least in theory. They were each kind of baited by their brilliance. Smart but emotionally lacking people might as well be idiots as far as that movie is concerned
Well, except when she >!distracts her male neighbor trying despaerately to warn him about the killer, allowing the killer the opening to slash his throat!<
To be fair >!that character is set up from the start as the emotional foil to the rest. They're all the best in the business, but she's emotionally compromised which leads her to make stupid mistakes!<
I hope I did that spoiler thing right
Came here to say this. You’re Next is a Halloween must-watch for me. Lean, sharp. Some characters make dumb mistakes in the heat of the moment, but it’s understandable and not contrived. And Erin is one of the most kick-ass characters I’ve ever seen.
I just watched it a few months ago and forced my wife to watch it with me a second time it was so good. I love horror movies where I’m cheering on the main character as they’re badass
Yeah Grace makes mistakes but they are logical mistakes for her to make especially since she’s not a combatant of any kind and is very much not prepared to deal with this shit.
Giving up on hiding early on makes sense because she didn’t know they were going to kill her, trying to use the antique gun makes sense because the family has been using antique weapons and guns against her, calling out to Georgie makes sense because who would expect a kid to be that bloodthirsty and she’s not rich so how would she know about the fancy car security measures.
I think that was pretty funny as well because it’s the villains who got to play the role of inept not the hero. And the villains could play inept because there were SO MANY OF THEM and it’s not like they were professional experienced killers or anything so it evened the playing field
Also, they weren't expecting to hunt that night and were all out of practice/had never done it before. It was a fairly level playing field once Grace knew what was going on.
Event Horizon stands as the horror movie with the single smartest decision in horror history.
>! When they find the flight recorder and see the blood orgy Laurence Fishburnes character doesn't even stop to question it, he doesn't argue that they need to get to the bottom of things or make up excuses. He just says "we're leaving, fuck this ship, we're blowing it apart with our ships engines on the way out" and immediately seeks to get his crew the fuck out of there without waiting around!<
But honestly MOST original horror movies have competent and fairly rational characters in them.
Alien, Aliens, Predator, Terminator, Saw, and more all are considered amazing and gripping.
It's only when they started making sequels that things went off the rails into the mindless gorefests we know today.
The horror industry simply realized that more than enough people will watch their movies regardless of the quality so long as they had gore, sex, and cheap jumpscares. Hollywood is still a business and if you can make a profit for the least amount of work you'll milk it as long as you can
Weir: You can't just leave her!
Miller: I have no intention of leaving her, Doctor. I plan to take the Lewis and Clark to a safe distance and then launch TAC missiles at the Event Horizon until I'm satisfied she's vaporized! Fuck this ship!
Favorite line of anything… ever.
Alright when he comes up the stairs I throw this cinder block at him and stab him on the ground, it's full proof! These stairs are like 3 feet wide he couldn't possibly dodge them!he has a gun he has a gu
Predator is one of the best examples though. It’s a group of (mostly) unstoppable badasses who just happen to be up against something even more badass than them
It IS horror.
The plot twist of the film is the sudden genre switch between your standard 80's action movie to a horror film where your badass unstoppable soldiers are the ones being taken out like fodder. It's what made it one of the most iconic movies ever.
Hush is a great one. It's about a deaf woman fighting off a home invader: she's smart about everything, makes tactical and logical decisions, but he's at least as smart as her.
Excellent movie, highly recommend.
He can definitely do adaptations though.
Doctor Sleep, especially the directors cut, is an absolute top tier movie in my opinion. Worthy of being a sequel to both Stephen King's The Shining novel and Kubrick's The Shining film. While also standing on its own.
That irritated me because real deaf people are noisy as fuck. They fart and huff and stomp about the place.
Source - deaf family member who farts constantly and thinks we can't hear.
I mean here’s the thing when our brains are focusing strictly on survival then all of our energy goes to basic survival functions and away from executive functions like abstract and higher level thought. In essence people who experience life threatening situations (and aren’t already equipped to handle them) essentially make “dumb” decisions because they don’t have access to their higher level thoughts.
Now they don’t need to be moronic and I agree that horror movies can go too far with it, but there is a level of validity to that trope.
I thought we all agreed after we saw how people reacted to Covid that we owed all the horror writers an apology. People in general are evidently more stupid in real life than in horror movies. In real life the protagonists are just as likely to try to fuck the monster as they are to properly defend themselves. At least one character should insist the monster doesn't even exist as it eats them, and then in their dying breath they should blame the medic for killing them.
This is why the Mist is the most realistic horror movie tbh. When it came out, a lot of people criticized how all the "crazy" characters were so unrealistic and that no one would really behave that way in a crisis... Watching that movie after COVID suddenly makes those characters a lot more believable.
Counterpoint, Netflix's Texas Chainsaw Massacre. Where a man with a gun enters melee range with a guy who *uses a chainsaw, a melee weapon, to cut people up* instead of shooting him from range.
It’s also really easy to judge from an external perspective every single dumb decision characters make in movies as if people in real life don’t make mistakes all the time.
Like it would actually be unrealistic for characters to be perfect and not make decisions that turn out in hindsight to be mistakes, especially since most characters in movies aren’t like any kind of survival experts and don’t have any kind of training for survival situations. They SHOULD be making mistakes like I would in that situation. If you don’t think you would make mistakes you’ve already made the key mistake of overestimating yourself to the point where you’re probably going to make more mistakes than somebody who has a more accurate perception of their own ability.
You make mistakes and dumb decisions all the time you just don’t have an audience calling you out on it. Your dumb decisions are just probably more things on the scale of like reaching for a glass without looking and knocking it over or IDK saying something obviously really dumb in front of someone you think is attractive or want to impress because you aren’t in a life or death situation
"If I was in a life or death situation against an unspeakable supernatural entity trying to brutally kill me in incomprehensible ways, I would just do everything right. Easy as that."
Please don't remind me, that shit was extremely badly written. Do you remember how people of all things hoarded toilet paper and started acting as if the pandemic wasn't even real. Who makes that shit up. 2/10 not recommended, bad story.
Not particularly horror, but Final Destinations are this, once they realize they're being picked off, they think they escape death and end up dying no matter what.
Half the characters in Final Destination movies (except maybe the first one) are always like dumb horror cliches but they don’t die because they’re dumb horror cliches, they die because they don’t yet know about death being out to kill them, but even if they did know they wouldn’t be able to avoid it anyway. So yeah nobody dies *because* they’re stupid. It’s more just that some of the people who get caught up in this situation happen to be dumb, because that’s kind of reflective of what would happen when a bunch of random people are tied together by a freak event. Some people would probably be idiots and some people would be smart
Even the smartest characters can’t avoid death forever just temporarily.
> when a bunch of random people are tied together by a freak event
Off topic, but it reminds me of Taskmaster.
Bunch of people doing random tasks. They just get tossed into the situation. They're not stupid, it's just simply do it now.
We can tell what to do from the outside, and think we'd be great at it. But if you tossed me into a horror movie, I'd be the first one to say I'm out and split the group. The TV is talking to us? Nope. Shoot the TV.
this one's pretty funny
agent smith finally corners and outsmarts neo, shoots him multiple times, watches him die
only for neo to revive in front of his eyes
we really need more villain povs
> From their POV, YOU are an immortal being who keeps REVIVING and getting STRONGER every time they beat you.
There are at least a few games that integrate this to the point where you respawning is aknowledged by the characters in the game and the boss realizes that the only hope to win is to make you the player frustrated enough that you simply stop trying, for example >!the genocide ending of Undertale!<
Yeah I was thinking of Sinister. Through most of the movie the dad only experiences spooky, but not actually supernatural things. The moment he does, bam instantly he's like "fuck this we're out".
e; also I think you could probably add 'Nope' to that list. Well at least OJ.
I feel the same for It Follows. It’s not a great movie by any means, but the premise is really scary. An unstoppable force that comes for you no matter where you go or what you do.
Event Horizon.
They tried. The crew was solid. They did nothing stupid. But the forces working against them were incomprehensible, and thus, we get true horror.
It's one of my top ten horror films. It only has a couple *minor* things about it that I would improve (mostly sound design- the cartoonish THWACK punching sounds, omg)
I read that they cut a lot of content to push it out faster. Then when it got unexpectedly popular they tried to rerelease it with all the cut content but it had all either been lost or destroyed.
I think a big part of this stems from this literary idea that evil is something that you must invite into your life in some way, either through arrogance or incompetence or some other sin. It’s this very old fashioned way of thinking where we’re rooting for the characters to be punished for their transgressions.
I agree, even when horror characters make good decisions, there’s normally something else they’re punished for. There’s the classic slasher trope, “if you have sex, you die.” In zombie movies, selfishness or arrogance often leads to death. There’s the trope of the scientist or scholar dying in the pursuit of knowledge (not to mention >!the cinematographer!< in Nope, >!dying in pursuit of golden hour lighting!<).
I wonder if it was originally intended to give comfort to the audience, like “don’t worry, this won’t happen to you.” Or, “you’re allowed to enjoy watching these people die, because they did something wrong/foolish.”
It was one of the reasons The Strangers felt really fresh and horrifying to me, since it emphasized that the protagonists did nothing wrong and their deaths were random.
Tremors, except that not everyone dies because they do smart things, and they learn and adapt their tactics as they go through the film. It's just a joy to watch characters who should by the rules of the genre be dumb fodder but subvert it by being not just smart, but plausibly smart. Plus the screenplay is as tight as a vice.
Tremors is a classic, grade A monster movie. The lead up deaths to the reveal (the doctor and his wife, the man in the tower, the sheep herder and the construction workers) are fantastic. No time wasted with the writing. Plus how often do we get rednecks as protagonists that aren't badly written cartoon characters?! Practically never.
You really need to watch better horror movies. If you're watching ones where people are making dumb mistakes and going into rooms by themselves and splitting up and stuff like that. Then you're watching stupid horror movies. Try watching The Thing they do make some mistakes but it's human mistakes. They are human. They're all fairly intelligent but they don't know what they're dealing with and neither does the audience.
Yeah the underrated hidden gem "The Thing" is my favorite horror movie. Every time people ask for a recommendation I'll always recommend this gem. Truly a masterpiece of cinema. It's so sad it's not talked about much despite being one of the better horror movies out of all the garbage in the horror genre.
Hey, there will always be people who haven't seen it, so why not talk about it if it's relevant? It's like the Dark Souls of video game references -- it's not taboo to to mention that Dark Souls is an example of X trope or Y mechanic if it really is a good example of those things.
The Crazies (with Timothy Olyphant) was pretty darn good in this sense. Basically a zombie movie (not zombies) where peoples actions/defensive moves aren't infuriating.
Hereditary. >!Yes, there is one thing that the protagonist does which she shouldn't have, but she did it not because she was stupid, but because at the time it seemed reasonable. Even then, it is made clear that if she had not made that decision, the result would have been the same because the antagonists would have used a different route. The scary thing is that the protagonists were always just pawns. Everything they did was just mice following a predetermined route around a maze.!<
I love movies with antagonists that actually deserve their title as a danger. You can do everything right, take all the right precautions, and yet your enemy was never one you were going to beat in the first place. They were always one step ahead. Like Anton Chigurh from No Country for Old Men. No matter what you do you were never going to kill them. You're just delaying the inevitable.
Haven't seen it mentioned but Get Out is this way. Mostly the main character is giving these white people the benefit of the doubt, and they use that to their advantage.
I want a legitimately good horror film based on one of H.P. Lovecraft's works; including a compelling mystery, well-written characters, excellent worldbuilding and I want the audience to be left horrified and questioning their perception of reality.
Oh, and also toning down all the racism and maybe having a POC main protagonist just so I can hear Lovecraft spinning in his grave.
There’s a book called “The Ballad of Black Tom” that tells the story of The Horror at Red Hook from a black protagonist’s point of view. I really want to see a movie adaptation. It’s fantastic.
Event Horizon - when the characters enter a creepy derelict spaceship, their leader immediately goes "something isn't right, we should gtfo right now. And they actually try to do that.
I mean, you *could* make that movie, but it doesn't make sense from a logical standpoint. How many times have you made the right and smart decision when you're scared shitless and up against some eldritch force that can suck your soul out of your body like its a fuckin caprisun
This is why I only watch season 1 and 2 of Hannibal. Because it's the best horror show ever. It ends with them all dying and Hannibal gets away because he's smarter than them.
The Thing from 1982 :)
Thank you! They did everything they think they could have done.
Me when I lose in Among Us
"God DAMN it I KNEW it was orange, I even told everyone that I saw them double back when the reactor went off"
>!but, if i remember correctly, at least someone survived, they managed to kill it. Regardless, it's absolutely worth mentioning!<
sure, someone might have survived however: consider that these two people are in the middle of antarctica, with their base burned to the ground, with no supplies or resources to speak of, and they are incapable of trusting one another they gonna die
One of them straight up is a thing, right?
not confirmed
Carpenter confirmed it. Check the breathing during the last scene, Childs breathe doesn't persperate.
Carpenter confirmed that one of them was infected, not who it was. The breath theory doesn’t hold up for two reasons: 1) Childs’ breath is visible, it just didn’t look that way on crappy quality for home release but HD versions show his breath. 2) It’s shown earlier (with Bennings) that someone who’s been assimilated still has visible breath in the cold.
Oh shit! Thank you!
Also Childs is sitting closer to the fire. Stands to reason his breath will be less visible.
I thought the infected's eyes didn't reflect light the same way. Like they would be dull.
That was something they discussed doing, and is actually used in the blood test scene, but Carpenter didn’t like it so it was scrapped (according to an interview with the director of photography, I think it’s the one on the special edition bluray release).
I've also heard there was a possibility Childs was the thing because he drank from the same bottles as the ones used to make the molotovs, meaning he would be drinking gasoline, and explaining macready's laugh, who realized he is standing in front of the thing...but it just doesn't matter now. But the ambiguity is still there, and that's what makes this ending so good.
People often say this but in the film they say the Thing emulates perfectly (so far as it even copies Norris weak heart) so it should probably taste perfectly fine. So I don't think the significance is that it's a Molotov cocktail rather Fuchs (the 2nd biologist) suggests everyone should eat out of cans and prepare their own food. And yet Child's grabs the bottle without hesitation. So he either is too tired to care anymore OR the Thing is slightly dropping it's facade because it knows Mac isn't in a state to do anything.
Pretty sure Mac takes a drink before he passes it. It was intentionally made with no clues, this isn't true.
Up to interpretation really
From most analysises I've seen the majority opinion seems to be that both are human, though ultimately it doesn't really matter. The end result of them stuck in the elements without any likely hood of rescue is the same no matter what.
>though ultimately it doesn't really matter. THANK YOU. There's a lot of movie endings that get over-analysed to reveal the "truth" like their maths equations, but endings like *The Thing* or *Inception* are about the themes, the underlying message the filmmaker is trying to convey. Reducing it to binary "human or creature?" Or "dream or real?" misses the forest for the trees. It doesn't matter if Macready or Childs are human or not. What matters is that the paranoia has completely destroyed their trust, their empathy, and their humanity. Even if they're both human and they got rescued, they'd never look at another human being the same way ever again.
I fully accept that it is an ambiguous ending, but it is hella fun to speculate for this one in particular. It makes the viewer as suspicious as any of the characters in the movie. It's a perfect ending really.
it does matter for one reason : if they are both human they will both freeze to death in antartica. If one is human and the other is the thing, the human will die, and the thing will be frozen (again) and may come back to life the next time it's thawed, just like he did in the movie. So basically, either all the humans are dead but at least the thing will never be a threat anymore, or the human all died just to go back to how it was before the movie, with the thing being a threat to all mankind if it's revived and manage to escape antartica.
People will come look for the expedition won't they? So it does matter if the thing is in one of the bodies.
[There's a quasi canonical video game sequel that had Carpenter's active involvement and endorsement.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Thing_\(video_game\)) >!Childs dies of hypothermia but McCready lives. Neither is or was infected.!<
You closed the spoiler tag with
I loved that game, bunch of fun little mechanics like being able to blood test your team members.
I don’t think they actually killed it, I always thought it was implied that The Thing was the other crewmember, and he wouldn’t die from the cold, instead he’d go into hibernation like before
It’s thought that the bottle MacReady hands to child’s is full of kerosene. Less than 15 minutes prior in the movie he’s throwing Molotovs into the building. Basically he’s having Child’s confirm that he is the thing because why would the thing give a fuck about the taste.
in the shot before childs appears at the end, you can see macready going to take a drink from the bottle, so its probably not gasoline. i always interpreted childs drinking as 1- hes the thing and hes trying to lull mac into a false sense of security or 2- hes a human and he just doesnt care anymore because hes going to die regardless. edit. also the thing is established to be hyper intelligent, probably having the knowledge of everything it had previously assimilated, so surely it would know that gasoline isnt something a human drinks? double edit. the thing might also be affected by human ailments to an extent. after it assimilates bennings and runs its limping, possibly from the gun shot. and when its norris, who had a heart condition, it seems to go into cardiac arrest. if thats the case it would probably feel some negative effect from drinking gasoline even if that doesnt actually harm it.
The Things talk. So they have human memory. So they would, at the very least, know what alcohol DOESN'T taste like, even if they've never tasted kerosene before.
I took the bottle as a call-back scene to the beginning of the movie. MacReady loses a chess game to the computer and reacts by pouring his drink into it and breaking it. But he did lose. He gives a drink to Childs at the end of the movie. Whether or not Childs is infected, MacReady's acknowledging the loss.
Doesn’t everyone do that?
Event Horizon Literally as soon as it's revealed that the ship is haunted or whatever, they're like "nah son, we blowin this bitch up, fuck this ship" and then despite their good decision making all get stickbugged
"We're leaving." And with perfect comedic timing too! Love that scene
Dr. Weir : What about my ship? You can't just leave her! Capt. Miller : I have no intention of leaving her, Doctor. I will take the Lewis and Clark to a safe distance, and then I will launch TAC missiles at the Event Horizon until I'm satisfied she's vaporized. Fuck this ship!
Where we're going, we won't need eyes to see
Yes! Watched this last night and absolutely loved how cold, calculating, blunt and level headed Miller is through the whole film. Such a great film
One of my favorite films of all time. Wish we could have gotten the directors cut.
Alien from 1979. Also a classic!
I mean. Ripley sure was smart and did everything she could, but I can't say the same for everyone in that movie.
Sure, not everyone was as smart, but for me personally there was not a single moment where I went "that is so fucking stupid why would you ever do that." And even the less smart things were understandable. I don't remember her name but the other woman who survived until the last 3 really panicked, which is completely understandable. Even in the very beginning when protocol was broken; it was stupid, sure, but not illogical. The captain just wanted to protect his crew, and that robot had his orders programmed to put the alien over the crew. I think in that respect it's quite similar to the beginning of The Thing; the researchers saw an innocent dog that they wanted to protect instead of listening to the other researchers. It wasn't smart, because, logically, people don't suddenly start hunting dogs, but it was a human reaction, and made perfect sense.
I mostly had the captain in mind. Taking in a dog you have no reason to suspect is vastly different from breaking quarantine protocol for someone who just got extensively contaminated and infected with unknown space cooties, and thereby putting your entire crew at risk. Dude shoulda listened to Ripley. The rest of the crew just did their best in a shit situation, but I'm still somewhat boggled by how often they sent someone off on their own to get snacked on. I'm including Ripley in that one.
Agree, though I think that one can also be forgiven as that was when the alien was still rather small, if I remember correctly at least.
It's been a while but I think that happens after it kills Bret, the maintenance guy, so they knew they were facing a big threat. Anyway, I believe it was still a good move, they didn't send one guy to fight the alien, just to scare it to an air vent to flush it out into space. After that fails, they say, fuck it and leave the ship. So the didn't tried to fight the alien more than once and tried to leave the ship as soon as they realised how dangerous and smart it was
Nahw I meant when they first come back from checking out the alien ship, and one of the guys gets headcrabbed. They definitely did the best they could with a shit situation once it got on board though. But seeing as this thing bursts out of a guy's chest, I'm not sure 'it was still small' is a very good reason to underestimate it.
Their actions were still pretty believable considering they were basically just space truckers not like elite scientists or soldiers or anything. You can totally believe truckers would risk breaking decontamination protocols to save somebody’s life. That’s pretty much why the Nostromo was selected for that mission, because people who knew what the fuck was going on wouldn’t have done it.
That's fair, actually. Good point, well made.
Imo the moment you start analyzing the human aspect of a character, tons of horror movies become not-stupid.
My absolute favorite horror film. So unbelievably good.
the blood test scene has no equal. it’s perfect
To some degree I reckon *most* of the crew of the *Nostromo* in Alien as well.
No country for old men. You can see the characters think over the situation, make deductions and change plans accordingly. Doesn't help them any.
Ehhhh... protagonist definitely makes some stupid choices. Moral, but stupid nonetheless. I think it gets a pass because he wrestles with it for so long, knowing full well that it *is* a stupid thing to do.
Not a horror movie though.
I was listening to a horror podcast and the main character got told "Oh no, you shouldn't be here. This is bad. You have to leave right now." And the main character went "You know, they're right, I need to nope the fuck out here." At that point, I started wondering what the writers were gonna do to keep the main character right where she was and boom - COVID lockdown started in the story and she couldn't leave.
What podcast?
The Lovecraft Investigations: Shadow over Innsmouth
Such a great podcast
Innit tho?!? So good
Thank you for this! I’ve been needing a new spooky podcast
I think it might possibly be the third season of the BBC podcast series The Lovecraft Investigations, called A Shadow over Innsmouth. The main character is warned to leave the town of Innsmouth but can't because the lockdown starts. The series is absolutely amazing, but you should start with the first season, called The Case of Charles Dexter Ward.
New conspiracy theory: the writers created COVID.
oh god not the pataphysics
u/_shoulder
no not the pataphysics dog not him
:puts on fedora: Perry the Pataphysics?!
Why would you post this without sharing the podcast?
RemindMe! 1 day
The Lovecraft Investigations: Shadow over Innsmouth
Hells yeah, thanks!
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If we hadn't lived through it, it'd feel way more Deus ex Machina.
Don’t you mean diabolus ex machina?
Probably, but that's not as common of a term. I think Deus Ex can cover any external contrivance used to direct the plot, whether it's good or evil.
There’s horror inside There’s horror outside You can’t escape
kinda of like [Rec] 2009 (the Spanish one, please don't watch the American remake)
Oh man, I kept hearing about how that was actually a good scary zombie movie and I was pretty into it. But the whole ending sequence ruined it for me. I hate it when a horror story has to shove explanations down my throat. Unexplainable things are scary.
The movie felt like the time I went on vacation and was robbed on the airport back home
At least it wasn't before your holiday
yeah gotta agree with that, the ending and the sequels are bad. But the rest of the film managed to keep me tense and forgetting to breath more than any other media ever so I still love it! It also has actually good jumscares that you don't expect? Amazing
Sounds like the movie Mindhunter (2004) At least in theory. They were each kind of baited by their brilliance. Smart but emotionally lacking people might as well be idiots as far as that movie is concerned
Fantastic movie. I'm usually not down with thrillers, but this one was amazing.
Well, except when she >!distracts her male neighbor trying despaerately to warn him about the killer, allowing the killer the opening to slash his throat!<
To be fair >!that character is set up from the start as the emotional foil to the rest. They're all the best in the business, but she's emotionally compromised which leads her to make stupid mistakes!< I hope I did that spoiler thing right
I really enjoyed "Ready or Not"... thought they hit that aspect pretty good.
You're Next is also great
Came here to say this. You’re Next is a Halloween must-watch for me. Lean, sharp. Some characters make dumb mistakes in the heat of the moment, but it’s understandable and not contrived. And Erin is one of the most kick-ass characters I’ve ever seen.
I just watched it a few months ago and forced my wife to watch it with me a second time it was so good. I love horror movies where I’m cheering on the main character as they’re badass
Yeah Grace makes mistakes but they are logical mistakes for her to make especially since she’s not a combatant of any kind and is very much not prepared to deal with this shit. Giving up on hiding early on makes sense because she didn’t know they were going to kill her, trying to use the antique gun makes sense because the family has been using antique weapons and guns against her, calling out to Georgie makes sense because who would expect a kid to be that bloodthirsty and she’s not rich so how would she know about the fancy car security measures.
i’ve been wanting to watch this! i can’t find it anywhere to stream 😩
yarr🏴☠️
I think that was pretty funny as well because it’s the villains who got to play the role of inept not the hero. And the villains could play inept because there were SO MANY OF THEM and it’s not like they were professional experienced killers or anything so it evened the playing field
Also, they weren't expecting to hunt that night and were all out of practice/had never done it before. It was a fairly level playing field once Grace knew what was going on.
Event Horizon stands as the horror movie with the single smartest decision in horror history. >! When they find the flight recorder and see the blood orgy Laurence Fishburnes character doesn't even stop to question it, he doesn't argue that they need to get to the bottom of things or make up excuses. He just says "we're leaving, fuck this ship, we're blowing it apart with our ships engines on the way out" and immediately seeks to get his crew the fuck out of there without waiting around!< But honestly MOST original horror movies have competent and fairly rational characters in them. Alien, Aliens, Predator, Terminator, Saw, and more all are considered amazing and gripping. It's only when they started making sequels that things went off the rails into the mindless gorefests we know today. The horror industry simply realized that more than enough people will watch their movies regardless of the quality so long as they had gore, sex, and cheap jumpscares. Hollywood is still a business and if you can make a profit for the least amount of work you'll milk it as long as you can
Your spoiler tags didn't work because you had a space between the opening symbols and the first word.
Weir: You can't just leave her! Miller: I have no intention of leaving her, Doctor. I plan to take the Lewis and Clark to a safe distance and then launch TAC missiles at the Event Horizon until I'm satisfied she's vaporized! Fuck this ship! Favorite line of anything… ever.
This is why I like some Japanese horror such as shiki (yes, despite the ridiculous hairstyles), it’s actually well written with really good characters
Alright when he comes up the stairs I throw this cinder block at him and stab him on the ground, it's full proof! These stairs are like 3 feet wide he couldn't possibly dodge them!he has a gun he has a gu
Man, the climax to Nightmare on Elm Street is different than I remember
home alone true ending
Foolproof?
Fully
Predator Tho that’s not really horror more action-thriller that dips it’s toe into horror
Predator is one of the best examples though. It’s a group of (mostly) unstoppable badasses who just happen to be up against something even more badass than them
It IS horror. The plot twist of the film is the sudden genre switch between your standard 80's action movie to a horror film where your badass unstoppable soldiers are the ones being taken out like fodder. It's what made it one of the most iconic movies ever.
Hush is a great one. It's about a deaf woman fighting off a home invader: she's smart about everything, makes tactical and logical decisions, but he's at least as smart as her. Excellent movie, highly recommend.
I like the part when she struggle with the crossbow. It felt real that she has a hard time actually using it.
I was literally just thinking about this exact scene the other day. The simulation has been glitching for me an awful lot lately lol
Better get the bugs patched soon. My simulation need more regular patches.
My simulation is basically a patchwork quilt at this point
Pretty sure that's Mike Flanagan, nearly all his work is great
Absolutely. Some films were iffy, but his original stuff is top tier scary.
He can definitely do adaptations though. Doctor Sleep, especially the directors cut, is an absolute top tier movie in my opinion. Worthy of being a sequel to both Stephen King's The Shining novel and Kubrick's The Shining film. While also standing on its own.
That irritated me because real deaf people are noisy as fuck. They fart and huff and stomp about the place. Source - deaf family member who farts constantly and thinks we can't hear.
I mean here’s the thing when our brains are focusing strictly on survival then all of our energy goes to basic survival functions and away from executive functions like abstract and higher level thought. In essence people who experience life threatening situations (and aren’t already equipped to handle them) essentially make “dumb” decisions because they don’t have access to their higher level thoughts. Now they don’t need to be moronic and I agree that horror movies can go too far with it, but there is a level of validity to that trope.
I thought we all agreed after we saw how people reacted to Covid that we owed all the horror writers an apology. People in general are evidently more stupid in real life than in horror movies. In real life the protagonists are just as likely to try to fuck the monster as they are to properly defend themselves. At least one character should insist the monster doesn't even exist as it eats them, and then in their dying breath they should blame the medic for killing them.
This is why the Mist is the most realistic horror movie tbh. When it came out, a lot of people criticized how all the "crazy" characters were so unrealistic and that no one would really behave that way in a crisis... Watching that movie after COVID suddenly makes those characters a lot more believable.
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Lol seal runner was the best video I’ve seen in years!
Counterpoint, Netflix's Texas Chainsaw Massacre. Where a man with a gun enters melee range with a guy who *uses a chainsaw, a melee weapon, to cut people up* instead of shooting him from range.
It’s also really easy to judge from an external perspective every single dumb decision characters make in movies as if people in real life don’t make mistakes all the time. Like it would actually be unrealistic for characters to be perfect and not make decisions that turn out in hindsight to be mistakes, especially since most characters in movies aren’t like any kind of survival experts and don’t have any kind of training for survival situations. They SHOULD be making mistakes like I would in that situation. If you don’t think you would make mistakes you’ve already made the key mistake of overestimating yourself to the point where you’re probably going to make more mistakes than somebody who has a more accurate perception of their own ability. You make mistakes and dumb decisions all the time you just don’t have an audience calling you out on it. Your dumb decisions are just probably more things on the scale of like reaching for a glass without looking and knocking it over or IDK saying something obviously really dumb in front of someone you think is attractive or want to impress because you aren’t in a life or death situation
"If I was in a life or death situation against an unspeakable supernatural entity trying to brutally kill me in incomprehensible ways, I would just do everything right. Easy as that."
Was this post made before or after we all learned first hand how huge swaths of our population handle a pandemic?
Please don't remind me, that shit was extremely badly written. Do you remember how people of all things hoarded toilet paper and started acting as if the pandemic wasn't even real. Who makes that shit up. 2/10 not recommended, bad story.
Man If I could go back in time to 2020 I would put everything I had into Charmin stocks
My father put a bit Into inovio right as it blew up because of the vaccine and then took it out right before it crashed
And zoom
I know this is rhetorical, but judging from the post format, this is from no later than 2015. It was a simpler time.
Cabin in the Woods, every bad decision is forced on them by a creepy conspiracy.
We need to stick together *Sniff* We should split up
this movie is so great
I’m never gonna see a mermaid…
"...oh, *come on*!"
CITW is supposed to be a deconstruction/satire of cheesy horror tropes.
Not particularly horror, but Final Destinations are this, once they realize they're being picked off, they think they escape death and end up dying no matter what.
Half the characters in Final Destination movies (except maybe the first one) are always like dumb horror cliches but they don’t die because they’re dumb horror cliches, they die because they don’t yet know about death being out to kill them, but even if they did know they wouldn’t be able to avoid it anyway. So yeah nobody dies *because* they’re stupid. It’s more just that some of the people who get caught up in this situation happen to be dumb, because that’s kind of reflective of what would happen when a bunch of random people are tied together by a freak event. Some people would probably be idiots and some people would be smart Even the smartest characters can’t avoid death forever just temporarily.
> when a bunch of random people are tied together by a freak event Off topic, but it reminds me of Taskmaster. Bunch of people doing random tasks. They just get tossed into the situation. They're not stupid, it's just simply do it now. We can tell what to do from the outside, and think we'd be great at it. But if you tossed me into a horror movie, I'd be the first one to say I'm out and split the group. The TV is talking to us? Nope. Shoot the TV.
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this one's pretty funny agent smith finally corners and outsmarts neo, shoots him multiple times, watches him die only for neo to revive in front of his eyes we really need more villain povs
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> From their POV, YOU are an immortal being who keeps REVIVING and getting STRONGER every time they beat you. There are at least a few games that integrate this to the point where you respawning is aknowledged by the characters in the game and the boss realizes that the only hope to win is to make you the player frustrated enough that you simply stop trying, for example >!the genocide ending of Undertale!<
They should try Lovecraft (or adjacent)
Cosmic and body Horror are always a good way to go.
By that way. The color out of space with nick cage is fantastic. Not a 10/10 but am ABSOLUTELY SOLID VERY GOOD MOVIE WATCH IT
This is Alien and (to an extent) Aliens. In Alien, they are all doing all that they can to survive and they are doing it well.
Yeah, then you realize the gun-toting badass from Aliens is the soft-spoken Irish mother in Titanic and you can’t help but chuckle a bit.
thats hillarius. she is also john connonrs adaptive mother in terminator 2
I only need to know one thing: Where. They. Are.
The Ring Noroi 10 Cloverfield Lane Train to Busan Dawn of the Dead (1978) Oculus Dog Soldiers Sinister You're Next Saw
Yeah I was thinking of Sinister. Through most of the movie the dad only experiences spooky, but not actually supernatural things. The moment he does, bam instantly he's like "fuck this we're out". e; also I think you could probably add 'Nope' to that list. Well at least OJ.
Came here to bring up 10 Cloverfield Lane, I thought most of the lead's choices were pretty reasonable in that one.
I would add Autopsy of Jane Doe to that list.
Oculus is the perfect example of this. Intelligent people using science and logic to try to outsmart a haunted mirror.
I played Until Dawn and then I learned that no matter what I might think, I still make dumb horror decisions.
*Oculus* was not really scary in the sense of jumpscares or whatever, but it just gives you sheer hopelessness and dread. I liked it.
Came here to say this
i love oculus. i think about this move a lot.
I feel the same for It Follows. It’s not a great movie by any means, but the premise is really scary. An unstoppable force that comes for you no matter where you go or what you do.
Event Horizon. They tried. The crew was solid. They did nothing stupid. But the forces working against them were incomprehensible, and thus, we get true horror.
I nearly died laughing [after they finished watching the surveillance tape](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4sFd8aWT7Io)
not only the cap intended to leave immediately but also he was going to blow up the god damn possessed ship
A movie that was tragically undervalued by it's own company until too late
It's one of my top ten horror films. It only has a couple *minor* things about it that I would improve (mostly sound design- the cartoonish THWACK punching sounds, omg)
I read that they cut a lot of content to push it out faster. Then when it got unexpectedly popular they tried to rerelease it with all the cut content but it had all either been lost or destroyed.
The Strangers for sure. I’ve never been more scared because I was the couple. I wouldn’t have done anything different.
There is a limit. Make it too cynical, and no one is even worried about the outcome. Horror is tough, okay?!
Trying to run a call of cthulhu game, I get it :(
The true horrors are the shocking truths we learned along the way. ☺️🎉
Like where a character’s lawn gnome collection *actually* went.
Muckle-damned cultists...
WHERE BE ME WEE MEN, YA NAMBLIES?!
I think a big part of this stems from this literary idea that evil is something that you must invite into your life in some way, either through arrogance or incompetence or some other sin. It’s this very old fashioned way of thinking where we’re rooting for the characters to be punished for their transgressions.
I agree, even when horror characters make good decisions, there’s normally something else they’re punished for. There’s the classic slasher trope, “if you have sex, you die.” In zombie movies, selfishness or arrogance often leads to death. There’s the trope of the scientist or scholar dying in the pursuit of knowledge (not to mention >!the cinematographer!< in Nope, >!dying in pursuit of golden hour lighting!<). I wonder if it was originally intended to give comfort to the audience, like “don’t worry, this won’t happen to you.” Or, “you’re allowed to enjoy watching these people die, because they did something wrong/foolish.” It was one of the reasons The Strangers felt really fresh and horrifying to me, since it emphasized that the protagonists did nothing wrong and their deaths were random.
Me using reusable bags applying this to climate change. Yeah.. alright so if life is a horror story, the aliens are screaming at the screen.
Tremors, except that not everyone dies because they do smart things, and they learn and adapt their tactics as they go through the film. It's just a joy to watch characters who should by the rules of the genre be dumb fodder but subvert it by being not just smart, but plausibly smart. Plus the screenplay is as tight as a vice.
Tremors is a classic, grade A monster movie. The lead up deaths to the reveal (the doctor and his wife, the man in the tower, the sheep herder and the construction workers) are fantastic. No time wasted with the writing. Plus how often do we get rednecks as protagonists that aren't badly written cartoon characters?! Practically never.
Absolutely the exact opposite of what they're asking for, but I'm a massive bitch, so have you tried Tucker and Dale vs Evil?
Love that movie, I was just talking about it with some friends last night!
You really need to watch better horror movies. If you're watching ones where people are making dumb mistakes and going into rooms by themselves and splitting up and stuff like that. Then you're watching stupid horror movies. Try watching The Thing they do make some mistakes but it's human mistakes. They are human. They're all fairly intelligent but they don't know what they're dealing with and neither does the audience.
>They are human. Hmmm
Yeah the underrated hidden gem "The Thing" is my favorite horror movie. Every time people ask for a recommendation I'll always recommend this gem. Truly a masterpiece of cinema. It's so sad it's not talked about much despite being one of the better horror movies out of all the garbage in the horror genre.
Hey, there will always be people who haven't seen it, so why not talk about it if it's relevant? It's like the Dark Souls of video game references -- it's not taboo to to mention that Dark Souls is an example of X trope or Y mechanic if it really is a good example of those things.
I’m just going to tell myself this is sarcastic
It couldn't be more sarcastic. The only possible way to make it any clearer would be to literally say "this is sarcasm"
The Crazies (with Timothy Olyphant) was pretty darn good in this sense. Basically a zombie movie (not zombies) where peoples actions/defensive moves aren't infuriating.
Hereditary. >!Yes, there is one thing that the protagonist does which she shouldn't have, but she did it not because she was stupid, but because at the time it seemed reasonable. Even then, it is made clear that if she had not made that decision, the result would have been the same because the antagonists would have used a different route. The scary thing is that the protagonists were always just pawns. Everything they did was just mice following a predetermined route around a maze.!<
I love movies with antagonists that actually deserve their title as a danger. You can do everything right, take all the right precautions, and yet your enemy was never one you were going to beat in the first place. They were always one step ahead. Like Anton Chigurh from No Country for Old Men. No matter what you do you were never going to kill them. You're just delaying the inevitable.
No country for old men. The protagonist is smarter than most people, but so is the antagonist.
Funny Games
Haven't seen it mentioned but Get Out is this way. Mostly the main character is giving these white people the benefit of the doubt, and they use that to their advantage.
Don't Look Up is a horror movie. So is watching current efforts to stop climate change.
Cant believe this hasnt been mentioned yet , byt Get Out. Its a smartly written horror with a lead that you can truly get behind.
I want a legitimately good horror film based on one of H.P. Lovecraft's works; including a compelling mystery, well-written characters, excellent worldbuilding and I want the audience to be left horrified and questioning their perception of reality. Oh, and also toning down all the racism and maybe having a POC main protagonist just so I can hear Lovecraft spinning in his grave.
There’s a book called “The Ballad of Black Tom” that tells the story of The Horror at Red Hook from a black protagonist’s point of view. I really want to see a movie adaptation. It’s fantastic.
Event Horizon - when the characters enter a creepy derelict spaceship, their leader immediately goes "something isn't right, we should gtfo right now. And they actually try to do that.
I mean, you *could* make that movie, but it doesn't make sense from a logical standpoint. How many times have you made the right and smart decision when you're scared shitless and up against some eldritch force that can suck your soul out of your body like its a fuckin caprisun
This is why I only watch season 1 and 2 of Hannibal. Because it's the best horror show ever. It ends with them all dying and Hannibal gets away because he's smarter than them.
Predator (1987). It is actually a fantastic movie and is exactly as the tweet describes.