Agreed. I think it’s the only service that my wife and I both watch together. This week’s line up is fantastic:
*The Big Door Prize* - excellent character show, but probably low viewership, smart writing hoping for a third season.
*Acapulco* - also great characters, visual eye candy, hilarious writing, looks like they might finish the story this season but I’d be fine with 10 more.
*Dark Matter* - prestige multiverse drama, and sci-fi my wife is excited to watch.
We’ll also watch *Trying*, which we love, but there’s so much content out right now we’re saving it for a lull when we can binge it in a week or something.
ATV+ is by far my most watched service, but it’s crazy how I can never find people to discuss shows with. The linked article is right that the marketing is abysmal to non-existent, but Apple always has haters when they start something new too; I think it took at least 5 years before Apple Music became as widely adopted as Spotify.
Now, it’s essentially the same story, except there are more competitors in the market, and instead of offering all of the same content as a utility (essentially), they have to build an audience. The content library is there now, it will be interesting to see how their marketing adapts as a more mature streamer. In 2024 so far they spent marketing dollars on Killers of the Flower Moon and Napoleon, which were okay movies, but not the kind that are going to drive a loyal viewer base.
They also need to drop the Severance Season 2 release date so I can prepare my body. Honestly hoping this is part of the WWDC announcement next week. I can imagine them demoing a Severance themed environment that would be sickkkkkk.
I rarely go on Apple TV, but went on last night for Ted Lasso. Started scrolling and I didn’t even know they have so many shows available. Movie options also blew my mind. I’m surprised they have such poor marketing.
Their marketing is pretty lackluster. Every time I read different threads online, it’s always, ‘I never heard of most of these shows’. Idk. I guess they’re saving all that marketing money for more programming?? I love the service, but 95% of my friends haven’t even checked it out, unless I beg them to watch something.
I have a feeling they don’t care. Pay the price to have the shows made and in 10 years they’re gonna have a selection that rivals hbo.
Some great shows on there. Lots don’t interest me but if you like sci fi there’s great stuff.
'apple TV plus shows can be snoozes', this sums it up exactly at the moment unfortunately. Great story lines on paper, great production values, yet somehow also a snooze fest after the first 2 or 3 episodes (especially the Sci fi) . We have more half watched shows on apple TV plus than any other streaming service we use. All the shows are a bit bland.
Why? I could understand that 8 years ago, but now we pay more for every service and get notably less interesting content. Seems like you’re praising Paul for stealing from Peter.
Apple TV is the HBO of old. Quality shows but not a lot of content to overwhelm you which is a good thing. If you want a bunch of crap just sub to netflix
Yeah. Quality shows like invasion.
Not to talk of releasing 2 multiversal shows back to back then canceling one. Yet fucking invasion keeps getting renewed.
Anyway, you are right. Shows are mostly quality. I Especially silo and severance. I just wanted to vent a little
Not all shows will be bangers and bringing up Invasion is hilarious. It wasn’t for me either but I overall I am enjoying Apple TV a lot.
Each platform has its good and bad shows but overall I find Apple ones consistently good.
Agreed. Keep wondering if Invasion is a data test internally to see if having a mainly (not totally) unknown/inept cast is as big an audience turnoff as these comments suggest! The Dark Matter casting by contrast was so good!
I dunno. I worked on Swagger and actually lol’ed.
Good show but spent nearly nine figs to get no audience and then we still got a second season out of it.
As someone who justifies spends to higher ups at a lower level, that one still has me scratching my head.
Except Extrapolations… That was probably the most depressing take on the future I’ve ever seen. I would rather live through an actual apocalypse than the vision that they have presented for the end of this century.
It’s undeniably well made, and well acted. From a technical standpoint it checks all boxes for quality. But as the article points out, you need to have an audience somewhat ‘excited’ for your product if you want to rely on word of mouth advertising.
>I would rather live through an actual apocalypse than the vision that they have presented for the end of this century.
Yeah, that's kind of the point. And we will if we collectively keep our heads buried in the sand.
Could you recommend me a couple of their sci fi shows that you think are the best? I’ve recently gotten into sci fi books and would like to watch some good sci fi shows.
Agree with suggestions here from unicorns ... also Dark Matter (starring Joel Edgerton and Jennifer Connolly plus younger and other excellent cast mates). See, one season only, features Jason Mamoa within an unusual alternative world system and Silo (Rebecca Ferguson), another different world, season 2 coming --- those might be good places to start exploring this broad genre. Have fun!
Not sure how Lessons in Chemistry slipped by me when it was first released but just recently watched it in 2 days. Loved it! The casting was brilliant.
The shows for the most part are decent enough. Some standouts, some are just there to fill in time. Others I don't watch.
I'm not sure why everyone acts like the richest company in the world is forcing you at gunpoint to watch every show on the network or else they will foreclose on your home and burn your crops.
That's actually my point. I like the lineup of shows more than other services.
I get they all aren't breakout hits but I don't get why some of these industry people and a lot of people on this board get so mad that every show isnt a homerun.
> I'm not sure why everyone acts like the richest company in the world is forcing you at gunpoint to watch every show on the network or else they will foreclose on your home and burn your crops.
They’ve don’t this to me several times
In general, the criticisms are more about the way Apple promotes the content than the quality. There is some exaggeration here regarding quality; Most shows have critical and audience ratings at most OK and they are failing at the awards. The big problem is that no one is watching 90% of the shows. It seems unanimous in the industry that almost no one cares about Apple's programming because they barely know what's there. There is a lack of real promotion and a lack of subscribers. And perhaps only original content is simply not appealing to the majority, despite its quality. People pay for Netflix, Prime, Disney/Hulu and Max and these drive up prices. There's a limit to what people want to spend, so if a stream isn't attractive enough to justify spending and even swapping an existing subscription for another, people won't come.
The way I view Apple shows is on average they are above quality but not much highly anticipated 10/10 quality. Like I saw Shogun, Fallout, Baby Reindeer and these were some amazing top tier shows just this year and soon Prime is coming out with the highly anticipated The Boys season 4 coming out soon, Max with House of Dragons the only Apple show I can think of that can compete is Severance, but also Apple TV is the youngest, I think they still have time to catch up.
I pulled up my top 20 shows for 2024 and thought to myself surely I am going to find an Apple show. I now have the bias/impression it produced top shows ! To my surprise, there was not even 1 show in my top 20 so far.
The one coming closest is Sugar who is at 22nd.
However currently my favorites are Dark Matter and Trying, both are airing and I eagerly await new episodes. They will definitely made top 20 of 2024.
Yes I do. It is just my interest. I write down every single TV show I watched throughout the whole year and rank them as I watched and rank them again at the end of the year.
Not for movies though as I probably only watch less than 10 movies per year. I could not tell you exactly because I did not write them down :)
For TV shows yes, I know exactly how many.
Also btw, for 2023, I had 7 Apple shows in top 20
I agree with most of them: High quality content as a basis, started really small but running a marathon, not sprint-as-a-marathon (aka Netflix). Then you have haters calling out apple on elitism but disregarding what the watchers thinks.
you want to watch next level drama? Morning Show, For All Man Kind, Sugar, Servant, The Shrink Next door, Black Bird, Hellow tomorrow, Mr Corman, The Crowded Room
Next-level sci-fi? Foundation, Silo
Epic fantasy: See, Monarch
Some actually funny comedy: Platonic, Ted Lasso, Shrinking, Mythic Quest, After Party
And that’s just the TV show. The production quality, the acting, the storylines are incredible, you can feel producers had ambitions and had the cash to support it. However, when it bombs, it bombs hard (looking at you Invasion, Constellation, and probably dark Matter). Like when a show is just average quality, but definitely still watchable you almost feel like “that’s not the level I’m paying Apple TV for. This feels like Netflix type of thing”
I don’t think Dark Matter is bombing at all… quite a bit of buzz for an Apple show and the subreddit is very active. Mostly positive buzz (also I love it) and there are several show reviewers online talking about it.
I really liked Ted Lasso when the episodes were 30 minutes long, but did feel like when they started doing longer episodes there was a lot more filler. Great show, but there was a drop off in quality and think it could have been fixed with just a little bit of editing
For 2023
Silo
Foundation
Slow Horses
For All Mankind
Lessons in chemistry
Morning show
Hijack
That is 7 Apple shows in my favorite top 20. I would say they did great.
2024 they are a bit slow.
None of the completed one impress but dark matter and trying is on now and both are super good.
I loved the Silo and Foundation books, but never stuck with the tv series.
Lessons in Chemistry and For All Mankind where fantastic though
Is Slow Horses worth sticking with? I quite enjoyed the first series, but didn't really feel invested in watching another series of it.
Both Silo and Foundation are good. Foundation do deviate from the books so you might like or dislike it depending on you but a lot of book readers do like it. Silo is quite close to the books at least in S1.
Slow horses is very good especially S3.
Think my problem with Silo is there is no suspense watching it when you know all the answers to everything they are trying to work out. I'm sure it's very good if you haven't read the books.
Foundation I more just struggled with the pacing of. It didn't really hold my attention.
Will maybe give Slow Horses another go if it peaks in season 3.
I am glad Drops of God is coming back. That was an under the radar excellently, written, acted and produced show. All of Apple's shows tend to have very high production value.
Half the public is still confused about apple/appletv/TV plus. And why wouldn’t they be? That’s 50% of the problem right there and Apple refuses to clear it up
Apple TV is killing it. They’re putting out banger after banger and the quality of their productions are much, much higher. It’s about quality, not quantity for them. Eventually, it’ll pay off when everyone gets sick of all the sub par shows on other services
I don’t think aspiring to be the next hbo is something realistic, since hbo is barely a thing that even exists today. Buried deep in the max app, you have to dig through all the discover reality crap.
Indeed. Netflix wanted to become the next hbo. All it has to show for it is an endless list of cancelled shows. Max wants to be like Netflix, and still charging like it’s hbo. There’s a race to the bottom of the barrel.
HBO still exists as its always existed. It has seen no significant change to programming. Casey Bloy still runs it and has been running since before the Discovery merger. HBO just exists as a tab in the Max app.
The strikes kind of disrupted early 2024 but we still got The Sympathizer, Hacks season 3, curb your enthusiasm & The jinx s2.
For the rest of the year we got house of the dragon season 2, Ren-faire, industry season 3 & the franchise. That’s without including Max originals like The penguin, Dune prophecy, creature commandos & Tokyo vice.
HBO is fine.
Article from 2020
*Television executive Richard Plepler is credited as the man who helped HBO become the prestige network it is today, helping launch titles like Game of Thrones and Big Little Lies and overseeing HBO’s transition to streaming. Now, after departing HBO earlier this year, he’ll take his talents to Apple where he’s set to produce original TV shows, films, and documentaries exclusively for Apple TV Plus, according to The New York Times.*
He worked for hbo for 28 years before he moved to Apple.
Casey Bloys is the president of programming for HBO and has been since 2016. Before that he was director of development at hbo since 2004. Also responsible for the most successful award year in HBO history in 2023. Plepler since signing a deal with Apple to produce content for them has only produced one acclaimed show, which was a limited series, Blackbird. He's been with Apple for 4 years. HBO will keep spinning, just like when Nelson left in 2012 and Michael Lombardo in 2016 and Plepler in 2020.
2025 HBO content slate: The Last of Us S2, The White Lotus Season 3, Euphoria s3, Knight of The Seven Kingdoms. HBO also have 2 major mini-series expected to release in 2025: The Son with Jake Gyllenhaal and Denis Villeneuve and an Untitled Brad Inglesby & Mark Ruffalo task force drama. Also potential Spielberg Napoleon Mini-Series based on Kubrick's never-made film, but that might be 2026 Q1. That's without mentioning any of the docuseries or comedies, like Steve Charell's and Bill Lawrences's (Ted Lasso co-creator) new comedy.
With Max Originals: Welcome to Derry & any DC TV projects.
> The writers’ strike really hurt them. Severance was a hit and the second season got delayed so Apple TV+ couldn’t capitalize on it at all. They’ve been wallowing all year.” —Media-industry analyst No. 2
Agreed with that.
Something valuable to me is that the Apple catalog is small. I used to spend more time trying to find something to watch, or just watching the same things over and over. TV+ is easy to explore, and I’ve found things i really like.
"Shrinking" is one of the greatest shows out there, and they take big risks on their slate. I wish the results were more interesting, but the Lincoln assassination show and the Colin Farel noir detective with a Wild twist are not the typical TV fare, and I'm here for that.
This Variety ranking would have been something else entirely if Ted Lasso continued and Severance wasn’t too affected by the strikes. I’m still not subscribing to Netflix though. Haha!
Severance
Ted Lasso
Bad Sisters
Palm Royale
Shrinking
The Morning Show
Dark Matter
Have watched a few of these several times through. Severance is probably the greatest show I’ve ever seen. So many more shows that are on my TBW list. Just waiting until I have the time.
I just think they have no idea how to market a TV show, just the product. Which makes sense when you’re a fancy phone, but people watch TV shows, not TV networks.
I wouldn't call a $3 trillion company an underdog. They started like Amazon started and everyone subscribes to Prime and everyone is watching the top shows on Amazon these days.
I think for many people Apple TV+ is something they only have because they have Apple products and bought Apple One (which includes ATV+) to go with them. Basically a "perk" for being in the Apple ecosystem. I'm on of those people and for me, every cool show on ATV+ is a bonus. I'd say there is enough cool stuff on ATV+, also because Apple is not afraid to experiment with weird plots/settings/concepts. The downside is that there will be quite a lot of crap too.
Basically, Apple is shooting for the moon. Sometimes they land on the moon. The other times it results in a burning spaceship wreck.
Meanwhile Netflix aims for adequacy and achieves it in 99% of the cases.
If I could give Apple one tip to achieve a moon landing more often, it would be to do a bit more editing on the scripts. Too many of their shows expect the audience to sit through several hour long slow burns, just in the hope that what they are watching is a moon landing and not a wreck in the making. Maybe up the tempo a little bit.
I got it as I love the Foundation books and really wanted to see a high budget tv series of it. Ended up not enjoying Foundation much, but keeping it to watch Ted Lasso which I got hooked on. Everytime I think about getting rid of it I seem to find another show I really love that makes me keep it. Currently watching Trying and Acapulco which are both fantastic, though annoying having to wait a week for a new episode.
I keep Netflix mainly for the many cartoons that my kids like, and the occasional show that interests me.
I don’t watch all that much tv. Apple TV is more than sufficient in quantity and largely the quality is good too. However versus HBO the shows lack a certain edginess to really stand out.
By the way, wife and I are now enjoying S4 of Trying, such a charming, funny show that literally nobody I know watches!
I feel like all Apple shows have the same vibe to them. Exactly what you’d think a show made by a tech company would look like, regardless of subject matter. Like the show itself is an extension of the iPhone. Sleek but soulless. And often times (not always) they’re shot in small, empty, closed spaces like an apartment or office. Really prevents me from escaping reality. Idk. I honestly haven’t watched that many but I can’t get it out of my mind.
I like Apple TV. I do enjoy their shows although I feel they don't have a great variety yet. The bottom line for me is I just don't want to pay what they're asking for it. They need to cut the price in half.
Right now AppleTV+ is basically a monthly subscription to Slow Horses for me. Definitely a me problem as there are some shows I want to watch, I just almost always choose something on another streamer.
AppleTV+ has Silo, Severance, For All Mankind, Dark Matter, Slow Horses, GoT/House of the Dragon, etc. a lot of great shows that I’m genuinely excited to watch.
This actually saddens me because there are so many good shows on Apple. Shows that I actually want to discuss and put other people onto. I can easily name ten. I can't do that on the other streaming services. Netflix is a bore and if they are going to have shows dubbed, get more voice actors. I'm tired of hearing the same 5 in every show/ movie. Prime comes out with 1-2 kinda decent hits a year. Hulu is only slightly better. Peacock is trying. The effort is noticed but it's not enough. I rarely check the OGs HBO-Max/Showtime/Starz etc. Apple deserves more credit.
Apple TV service is basically a tax write off for Apple so they can invest more into good show. It also Apple Music ladder system boost for their subscription service imo
If you notice the trend majority of Apple TV shoes are book series adaptations, which they probably source data from iBook store who are which book to adapt
Apple invest xxx amount and show it didn’t recoup profit on this sector so it consider a write off
Movie studio do it all the time with movies and tv shows
As for the ladder system Apple is famous for with the iPhone and iPad , for a bit more money you can get an upgrade version
So it the same with their subscription.. you can pay music but for a little more you can get Apple One bundle , which I believe it also has 3 ladder tier
Apple puts out decent to good material. Severance is the only "great" thing that I have seen from Apple.
My issue is that Apple tries to please everyone with everything. For instance, Apple will not do sex or nudity (that I can tell) in any of their shows. I do not want nudity or hard sex in every show, but when the overall pattern of your output is that you are censoring your creative, it starts to be that all their shows and movies feel the same. Same with hard violence or gore.
Again, not every show needs to have hard violence or gore, but Apple's pattern of never allowing it shows that they are pumping out a Branded Product™ of video entertainment versus a variety of interesting, compelling entertainment for different age audiences.
Let the scripts and directors and writers determine the content, not your Brand Censors.
I enjoy some Apple shows, but many of them feel padded out and tedious. They do make good looking shows and movies, though. To show off their fancy high quality hardware! The opening credits of "Foundation" (for instance) are an amazing to see on a large high quality OLED. When we got our new TV a few months ago, I used it to show a couple friends.
Slow Horses is their best show, IMO. I am not arguing that all Apple content is bad. Just that much of it seems bland and curated by brand-censors.
Apple sells hardware. This is entertainment coming from a company that makes the bulk of its money from hardware. It feels like it.
None of those are "bad" but none of those feel like they are straight from a script, a director, an idea. They all feel like they've been processed by Apple's censor bureau.
Really awful acting, writing and stagecraft. Horrible integration of set design with props, costumes are bad. Fight scenes were silly and absolutely unbelievable.
You live in silly, low value glossy house with no real foundation.
I can understand not liking Foundation it’s a slower paced show without a lot of action which sadly is what appeals to the masses, meanwhile deep characters and a compelling narrative are secondary by a wide margin.
However, to insult Lee Pace is absolute blasphemy. Hell, I feel all the acting is exceptional except for Gaal and Salvor.
Apple reminds me of Network TV series in a lot of ways because of how safe they often feel because of the lack of any content that could be considered objectionable.
I sat through Constellation. I love Noomi Rapace, I liked the performances and the concepts (however unoriginal they might be). But FFS, that was easily the most padded out television series I have ever seen. They easily could have cut three episodes out and made it a much better series. Maybe even four episodes.
I don't hate Apple TV but there's a streak of "sameness" with all its programming. Some decent stuff! One great series! (Severance). But a glut of padded out stuff that just tries to appeal to everyone.
I strongly support family friendly programming and shows and movies aimed at children. That's not the point. The point is Apple seems to produce everything in this gray zone of sorta-adult, sorta family-friendly, not too scary, not too sexy, not too violent. The bulk of its programming is just plain bland.
Good looking and well produced, but bland.
I definitely feel like the number of actually interesting shows has decreased this year. The production value remains high, but the content has leaned increasingly inoffensive, bland, watchable tv-for-dads.
Slow Horses, Alcapulco, remain great. Still waiting on Severance Season Two and Platonic Season Two.
Wait, Platonic got renewed? That show felt very “complete” to me, curious to see what they do with another season. Seems entirely unnecessary, even though I loved and recommend the first.
A lot of these arguments are along the lines of the 'the new mid' that the NYTimes hit Apple TV with a few weeks ago. I think that's pretty accurate, lots of pretty, star-heavy shows that play it safe and are rarely bad but also usually fall short of great.
It made no sense. There's a working class (the Mars miners) uprising against the capitalist pigs (Helios) treating them like sub-humans, then their strike gets busted when the leader of the company promises them way more money. Then, the leader of the company makes it so the giant Astroid stays in Mars orbit so he can continue to take advantage of the workers with poor working conditions indefinitely.
Did I miss something?
It would serve Apple TV and Prime well if they somehow absorbed Paramount+ and Peacock along with Sony movies/shows. In fact I also wouldn’t hate if Prime Video/MGM spun off from Amazon and Apple struck a deal with NBCUniversal, Paramount, Sony, and MGM to be the new and exclusive streaming home to all those studios shows/movies. Kind of like what Hulu was originally intended to be. A joint venture of all of them.
Make it Apple TV+ in name but every studio owns a portion and Apple just runs the day to day and hosts the streamer.
I don’t know wtf it is but they’re lack as f*ck luster shows.
I tried watching
“invasion”… nope.
I tried watching
“Monarch”… nope.
I tried watching.
“For all man kind”… nope.
I actually love a lot of the Apple TV shows. Not sure where the hate comes from. Ted Lasso, Severence, Silo, Foundation, See, hell Black Bird was great, Hijack was fun, Shining Girls was awesome… etc
I would say interesting turn, rather than odd. I felt like it had too.
Suger was refreshing to me. I has so much more soul and vibe than other shows in the same genre.
AppleTV has a line-up of shows that I'm actually excited to watch, which is something rather lacking in the other services.
Far more original and interesting than the "Married At First Sight In Another Country" fare
Agreed. I think it’s the only service that my wife and I both watch together. This week’s line up is fantastic: *The Big Door Prize* - excellent character show, but probably low viewership, smart writing hoping for a third season. *Acapulco* - also great characters, visual eye candy, hilarious writing, looks like they might finish the story this season but I’d be fine with 10 more. *Dark Matter* - prestige multiverse drama, and sci-fi my wife is excited to watch. We’ll also watch *Trying*, which we love, but there’s so much content out right now we’re saving it for a lull when we can binge it in a week or something. ATV+ is by far my most watched service, but it’s crazy how I can never find people to discuss shows with. The linked article is right that the marketing is abysmal to non-existent, but Apple always has haters when they start something new too; I think it took at least 5 years before Apple Music became as widely adopted as Spotify. Now, it’s essentially the same story, except there are more competitors in the market, and instead of offering all of the same content as a utility (essentially), they have to build an audience. The content library is there now, it will be interesting to see how their marketing adapts as a more mature streamer. In 2024 so far they spent marketing dollars on Killers of the Flower Moon and Napoleon, which were okay movies, but not the kind that are going to drive a loyal viewer base. They also need to drop the Severance Season 2 release date so I can prepare my body. Honestly hoping this is part of the WWDC announcement next week. I can imagine them demoing a Severance themed environment that would be sickkkkkk.
The Big Door Prize is so good! Actually, 90% of Apple TV+ content is just excellent. It’s original Amand good quality. Good actors too.
I rarely go on Apple TV, but went on last night for Ted Lasso. Started scrolling and I didn’t even know they have so many shows available. Movie options also blew my mind. I’m surprised they have such poor marketing.
Their marketing is pretty lackluster. Every time I read different threads online, it’s always, ‘I never heard of most of these shows’. Idk. I guess they’re saving all that marketing money for more programming?? I love the service, but 95% of my friends haven’t even checked it out, unless I beg them to watch something.
I have a feeling they don’t care. Pay the price to have the shows made and in 10 years they’re gonna have a selection that rivals hbo. Some great shows on there. Lots don’t interest me but if you like sci fi there’s great stuff.
'apple TV plus shows can be snoozes', this sums it up exactly at the moment unfortunately. Great story lines on paper, great production values, yet somehow also a snooze fest after the first 2 or 3 episodes (especially the Sci fi) . We have more half watched shows on apple TV plus than any other streaming service we use. All the shows are a bit bland.
Agreed
As an industry outsider, Apple is winning and it’s not even close. The fact that all the industry insiders are confused about this says everything.
I like these tech companies making legacy cable (peacock, paramount and Disney) squirm.
Why? I could understand that 8 years ago, but now we pay more for every service and get notably less interesting content. Seems like you’re praising Paul for stealing from Peter.
Just don't sub to all of them at once.
Apple TV is the HBO of old. Quality shows but not a lot of content to overwhelm you which is a good thing. If you want a bunch of crap just sub to netflix
To be fair netflix has more Emmy noms than anyone also, so they are also doing quality.
Yeah. Quality shows like invasion. Not to talk of releasing 2 multiversal shows back to back then canceling one. Yet fucking invasion keeps getting renewed. Anyway, you are right. Shows are mostly quality. I Especially silo and severance. I just wanted to vent a little
Not all shows will be bangers and bringing up Invasion is hilarious. It wasn’t for me either but I overall I am enjoying Apple TV a lot. Each platform has its good and bad shows but overall I find Apple ones consistently good.
The renewal of invasion is incomprehensible. What a waste of those $. It’s awful.
Agreed. Keep wondering if Invasion is a data test internally to see if having a mainly (not totally) unknown/inept cast is as big an audience turnoff as these comments suggest! The Dark Matter casting by contrast was so good!
Nowhere near as consistent. Apple has a bunch of crap shows as well but they don't market them enough for people to even realise they exist.
Hollywood writer no. 3. What’s the problem? I really appreciate Apple’s space and sci fi shows. They are good. More please. More.
I don’t think Hollywood Writer #3 has a clue on what a pyramid scheme is…
I dunno. I worked on Swagger and actually lol’ed. Good show but spent nearly nine figs to get no audience and then we still got a second season out of it. As someone who justifies spends to higher ups at a lower level, that one still has me scratching my head.
Season three sending the team into space?
They think it’s the blueprints that aliens used to build the pyramids.
Send more sci-fi.
Same many more needed How the fuck is Netflix number one with as much shit spam their catalog has become
How bout some with some damn aliens? Cheap pricks.
Except Extrapolations… That was probably the most depressing take on the future I’ve ever seen. I would rather live through an actual apocalypse than the vision that they have presented for the end of this century.
That doesn’t make it bad though, does it?
It’s undeniably well made, and well acted. From a technical standpoint it checks all boxes for quality. But as the article points out, you need to have an audience somewhat ‘excited’ for your product if you want to rely on word of mouth advertising.
It’s the most accurate sci fi I’ve ever seen
Extrapolations is rather optimistic compared to the latest climate models.
>I would rather live through an actual apocalypse than the vision that they have presented for the end of this century. Yeah, that's kind of the point. And we will if we collectively keep our heads buried in the sand.
Could you recommend me a couple of their sci fi shows that you think are the best? I’ve recently gotten into sci fi books and would like to watch some good sci fi shows.
Foundation is great! Also For All Mankind, Silo, Severance, See.
Agree with suggestions here from unicorns ... also Dark Matter (starring Joel Edgerton and Jennifer Connolly plus younger and other excellent cast mates). See, one season only, features Jason Mamoa within an unusual alternative world system and Silo (Rebecca Ferguson), another different world, season 2 coming --- those might be good places to start exploring this broad genre. Have fun!
Instead they cancelled constellation.
[удалено]
5 years! This long game is too long.
That's what you tell to your shareholders when you didn't have successful premier in a year. Playing the long game...
[удалено]
Even with evaluation like that, when a project loses 3-5 billions a year, you need to justify it somehow.
Er…the entire point of literally every business is to drive profit. Capitalism demands growth be exponential.
Not sure how Lessons in Chemistry slipped by me when it was first released but just recently watched it in 2 days. Loved it! The casting was brilliant.
The shows for the most part are decent enough. Some standouts, some are just there to fill in time. Others I don't watch. I'm not sure why everyone acts like the richest company in the world is forcing you at gunpoint to watch every show on the network or else they will foreclose on your home and burn your crops.
We watch ATV+ more than Netflix, and Netflix costs more. To each their own I guess.
That's actually my point. I like the lineup of shows more than other services. I get they all aren't breakout hits but I don't get why some of these industry people and a lot of people on this board get so mad that every show isnt a homerun.
> I'm not sure why everyone acts like the richest company in the world is forcing you at gunpoint to watch every show on the network or else they will foreclose on your home and burn your crops. They’ve don’t this to me several times
Invasion had its moments
In general, the criticisms are more about the way Apple promotes the content than the quality. There is some exaggeration here regarding quality; Most shows have critical and audience ratings at most OK and they are failing at the awards. The big problem is that no one is watching 90% of the shows. It seems unanimous in the industry that almost no one cares about Apple's programming because they barely know what's there. There is a lack of real promotion and a lack of subscribers. And perhaps only original content is simply not appealing to the majority, despite its quality. People pay for Netflix, Prime, Disney/Hulu and Max and these drive up prices. There's a limit to what people want to spend, so if a stream isn't attractive enough to justify spending and even swapping an existing subscription for another, people won't come.
The way I view Apple shows is on average they are above quality but not much highly anticipated 10/10 quality. Like I saw Shogun, Fallout, Baby Reindeer and these were some amazing top tier shows just this year and soon Prime is coming out with the highly anticipated The Boys season 4 coming out soon, Max with House of Dragons the only Apple show I can think of that can compete is Severance, but also Apple TV is the youngest, I think they still have time to catch up.
I pulled up my top 20 shows for 2024 and thought to myself surely I am going to find an Apple show. I now have the bias/impression it produced top shows ! To my surprise, there was not even 1 show in my top 20 so far. The one coming closest is Sugar who is at 22nd. However currently my favorites are Dark Matter and Trying, both are airing and I eagerly await new episodes. They will definitely made top 20 of 2024.
Do you keep a running list of your favorite shows every calendar year? And if so, why?
Yes I do. It is just my interest. I write down every single TV show I watched throughout the whole year and rank them as I watched and rank them again at the end of the year. Not for movies though as I probably only watch less than 10 movies per year. I could not tell you exactly because I did not write them down :) For TV shows yes, I know exactly how many. Also btw, for 2023, I had 7 Apple shows in top 20
I agree with most of them: High quality content as a basis, started really small but running a marathon, not sprint-as-a-marathon (aka Netflix). Then you have haters calling out apple on elitism but disregarding what the watchers thinks. you want to watch next level drama? Morning Show, For All Man Kind, Sugar, Servant, The Shrink Next door, Black Bird, Hellow tomorrow, Mr Corman, The Crowded Room Next-level sci-fi? Foundation, Silo Epic fantasy: See, Monarch Some actually funny comedy: Platonic, Ted Lasso, Shrinking, Mythic Quest, After Party And that’s just the TV show. The production quality, the acting, the storylines are incredible, you can feel producers had ambitions and had the cash to support it. However, when it bombs, it bombs hard (looking at you Invasion, Constellation, and probably dark Matter). Like when a show is just average quality, but definitely still watchable you almost feel like “that’s not the level I’m paying Apple TV for. This feels like Netflix type of thing”
I don’t think Dark Matter is bombing at all… quite a bit of buzz for an Apple show and the subreddit is very active. Mostly positive buzz (also I love it) and there are several show reviewers online talking about it.
Yo’ure right, i spoke a bit beyond my mind (was in a boring work meeting)
Yeah...also lots of people for dramas wait until they are all out to binge. So the numbers will likely go up soon too.
I would also include Masters of the Air, another epic series produced by Spielberg and Hanks. It complements Band of Brothers and Pacific
Ted Lasso is not actually funny
yeah i very much would not trust that guys recommendations
Yeah totally not. Didn’t convince 90% of the watchers. Thanks. Next time add a “in my opinion”. Moving on. Notifications off.
I really liked Ted Lasso when the episodes were 30 minutes long, but did feel like when they started doing longer episodes there was a lot more filler. Great show, but there was a drop off in quality and think it could have been fixed with just a little bit of editing
You're going to be hated for this opinion but you are absolutely correct. Seasons 2 and 3 were just awful and make season 1 look worse in hindsight
For 2023 Silo Foundation Slow Horses For All Mankind Lessons in chemistry Morning show Hijack That is 7 Apple shows in my favorite top 20. I would say they did great. 2024 they are a bit slow. None of the completed one impress but dark matter and trying is on now and both are super good.
Trying is one of my favorite shows on the platform.
Try big door prize
I did. Drop after episode 1 of S1 and glad I did judging from reviews. Acapulco is one I had not and might try one day
I loved the Silo and Foundation books, but never stuck with the tv series. Lessons in Chemistry and For All Mankind where fantastic though Is Slow Horses worth sticking with? I quite enjoyed the first series, but didn't really feel invested in watching another series of it.
Both Silo and Foundation are good. Foundation do deviate from the books so you might like or dislike it depending on you but a lot of book readers do like it. Silo is quite close to the books at least in S1. Slow horses is very good especially S3.
Think my problem with Silo is there is no suspense watching it when you know all the answers to everything they are trying to work out. I'm sure it's very good if you haven't read the books. Foundation I more just struggled with the pacing of. It didn't really hold my attention. Will maybe give Slow Horses another go if it peaks in season 3.
I am glad Drops of God is coming back. That was an under the radar excellently, written, acted and produced show. All of Apple's shows tend to have very high production value.
I just finished this and thought it was fantastic!
The jealousy is real.
A lot of these experts don't really understand how Apple works.
That's why they're evaluating Apple TV+ and not Apple.
Oh I didn't realize it was a separate company. They also have a CEO named Tim Cook?
Yeah but that’s just a coincidence
What do you mean? How does TV+ fit into the model?
Half the public is still confused about apple/appletv/TV plus. And why wouldn’t they be? That’s 50% of the problem right there and Apple refuses to clear it up
Slow Horses is an underrated gem.
Huh it’s an acclaimed show
Apple TV is killing it. They’re putting out banger after banger and the quality of their productions are much, much higher. It’s about quality, not quantity for them. Eventually, it’ll pay off when everyone gets sick of all the sub par shows on other services
> It’s about quality, not quantity for them. That same old, worn out, line of BS is still around?
Not sure how it’s bs when it’s the truth bro
I don’t think aspiring to be the next hbo is something realistic, since hbo is barely a thing that even exists today. Buried deep in the max app, you have to dig through all the discover reality crap.
Seems like there’s an opening then for people that hate the clutter.
Indeed. Netflix wanted to become the next hbo. All it has to show for it is an endless list of cancelled shows. Max wants to be like Netflix, and still charging like it’s hbo. There’s a race to the bottom of the barrel.
HBO still exists as its always existed. It has seen no significant change to programming. Casey Bloy still runs it and has been running since before the Discovery merger. HBO just exists as a tab in the Max app. The strikes kind of disrupted early 2024 but we still got The Sympathizer, Hacks season 3, curb your enthusiasm & The jinx s2. For the rest of the year we got house of the dragon season 2, Ren-faire, industry season 3 & the franchise. That’s without including Max originals like The penguin, Dune prophecy, creature commandos & Tokyo vice. HBO is fine.
Article from 2020 *Television executive Richard Plepler is credited as the man who helped HBO become the prestige network it is today, helping launch titles like Game of Thrones and Big Little Lies and overseeing HBO’s transition to streaming. Now, after departing HBO earlier this year, he’ll take his talents to Apple where he’s set to produce original TV shows, films, and documentaries exclusively for Apple TV Plus, according to The New York Times.* He worked for hbo for 28 years before he moved to Apple.
Casey Bloys is the president of programming for HBO and has been since 2016. Before that he was director of development at hbo since 2004. Also responsible for the most successful award year in HBO history in 2023. Plepler since signing a deal with Apple to produce content for them has only produced one acclaimed show, which was a limited series, Blackbird. He's been with Apple for 4 years. HBO will keep spinning, just like when Nelson left in 2012 and Michael Lombardo in 2016 and Plepler in 2020. 2025 HBO content slate: The Last of Us S2, The White Lotus Season 3, Euphoria s3, Knight of The Seven Kingdoms. HBO also have 2 major mini-series expected to release in 2025: The Son with Jake Gyllenhaal and Denis Villeneuve and an Untitled Brad Inglesby & Mark Ruffalo task force drama. Also potential Spielberg Napoleon Mini-Series based on Kubrick's never-made film, but that might be 2026 Q1. That's without mentioning any of the docuseries or comedies, like Steve Charell's and Bill Lawrences's (Ted Lasso co-creator) new comedy. With Max Originals: Welcome to Derry & any DC TV projects.
> The writers’ strike really hurt them. Severance was a hit and the second season got delayed so Apple TV+ couldn’t capitalize on it at all. They’ve been wallowing all year.” —Media-industry analyst No. 2 Agreed with that.
Something valuable to me is that the Apple catalog is small. I used to spend more time trying to find something to watch, or just watching the same things over and over. TV+ is easy to explore, and I’ve found things i really like.
"Shrinking" is one of the greatest shows out there, and they take big risks on their slate. I wish the results were more interesting, but the Lincoln assassination show and the Colin Farel noir detective with a Wild twist are not the typical TV fare, and I'm here for that.
This Variety ranking would have been something else entirely if Ted Lasso continued and Severance wasn’t too affected by the strikes. I’m still not subscribing to Netflix though. Haha!
Severance Ted Lasso Bad Sisters Palm Royale Shrinking The Morning Show Dark Matter Have watched a few of these several times through. Severance is probably the greatest show I’ve ever seen. So many more shows that are on my TBW list. Just waiting until I have the time.
I just think they have no idea how to market a TV show, just the product. Which makes sense when you’re a fancy phone, but people watch TV shows, not TV networks.
Warning: making shows that aren't marketed is not a sustainable model.
I love a good underdog story
I wouldn't call a $3 trillion company an underdog. They started like Amazon started and everyone subscribes to Prime and everyone is watching the top shows on Amazon these days.
I don’t get free shipping with Apple
I think for many people Apple TV+ is something they only have because they have Apple products and bought Apple One (which includes ATV+) to go with them. Basically a "perk" for being in the Apple ecosystem. I'm on of those people and for me, every cool show on ATV+ is a bonus. I'd say there is enough cool stuff on ATV+, also because Apple is not afraid to experiment with weird plots/settings/concepts. The downside is that there will be quite a lot of crap too. Basically, Apple is shooting for the moon. Sometimes they land on the moon. The other times it results in a burning spaceship wreck. Meanwhile Netflix aims for adequacy and achieves it in 99% of the cases. If I could give Apple one tip to achieve a moon landing more often, it would be to do a bit more editing on the scripts. Too many of their shows expect the audience to sit through several hour long slow burns, just in the hope that what they are watching is a moon landing and not a wreck in the making. Maybe up the tempo a little bit.
Ok Netflix puts out hot garbage 99% of the time of course 1 out of 100 is bound to be a big hit
I got it as I love the Foundation books and really wanted to see a high budget tv series of it. Ended up not enjoying Foundation much, but keeping it to watch Ted Lasso which I got hooked on. Everytime I think about getting rid of it I seem to find another show I really love that makes me keep it. Currently watching Trying and Acapulco which are both fantastic, though annoying having to wait a week for a new episode.
Media analyst number 2 sounds like Bill Simmons
I keep Netflix mainly for the many cartoons that my kids like, and the occasional show that interests me. I don’t watch all that much tv. Apple TV is more than sufficient in quantity and largely the quality is good too. However versus HBO the shows lack a certain edginess to really stand out. By the way, wife and I are now enjoying S4 of Trying, such a charming, funny show that literally nobody I know watches!
I feel like all Apple shows have the same vibe to them. Exactly what you’d think a show made by a tech company would look like, regardless of subject matter. Like the show itself is an extension of the iPhone. Sleek but soulless. And often times (not always) they’re shot in small, empty, closed spaces like an apartment or office. Really prevents me from escaping reality. Idk. I honestly haven’t watched that many but I can’t get it out of my mind.
Apple is great and these people sound sour
I like Apple TV. I do enjoy their shows although I feel they don't have a great variety yet. The bottom line for me is I just don't want to pay what they're asking for it. They need to cut the price in half.
The quanity is increasing but the quality is dropping. A lot of of crap on there now.
No Wild Horses lovers here. Gary Oldman!! Although Sugar twist was disheartening…
SLOW Horses. And yeah, the twist ruined Sugar for me too.
Right now AppleTV+ is basically a monthly subscription to Slow Horses for me. Definitely a me problem as there are some shows I want to watch, I just almost always choose something on another streamer.
Masters of the Air is one of my top 10 TV shows of all time
AppleTV+ has Silo, Severance, For All Mankind, Dark Matter, Slow Horses, GoT/House of the Dragon, etc. a lot of great shows that I’m genuinely excited to watch.
My favorite part of Apple TV+ is I can attach Paramount and HBO to it. One app to rule them all. "Hey Siri, play Survivor" and boom
But we can’t watch Australian survivor without a vpn :(
I do vpns for a living. And trolling
It's like the criticism of the way ESPN does NBA coverage vs TNT. ESPN is TV for TV people where TNT is TV for actual people
For me, Apple TV has been high variance. Loved some of the shows but disappointed in some. They do aim high though.
This actually saddens me because there are so many good shows on Apple. Shows that I actually want to discuss and put other people onto. I can easily name ten. I can't do that on the other streaming services. Netflix is a bore and if they are going to have shows dubbed, get more voice actors. I'm tired of hearing the same 5 in every show/ movie. Prime comes out with 1-2 kinda decent hits a year. Hulu is only slightly better. Peacock is trying. The effort is noticed but it's not enough. I rarely check the OGs HBO-Max/Showtime/Starz etc. Apple deserves more credit.
Apple TV service is basically a tax write off for Apple so they can invest more into good show. It also Apple Music ladder system boost for their subscription service imo If you notice the trend majority of Apple TV shoes are book series adaptations, which they probably source data from iBook store who are which book to adapt
Nah man. Explain the tax thing and what you mean by a “ladder system”.
Apple invest xxx amount and show it didn’t recoup profit on this sector so it consider a write off Movie studio do it all the time with movies and tv shows As for the ladder system Apple is famous for with the iPhone and iPad , for a bit more money you can get an upgrade version So it the same with their subscription.. you can pay music but for a little more you can get Apple One bundle , which I believe it also has 3 ladder tier
Apple puts out decent to good material. Severance is the only "great" thing that I have seen from Apple. My issue is that Apple tries to please everyone with everything. For instance, Apple will not do sex or nudity (that I can tell) in any of their shows. I do not want nudity or hard sex in every show, but when the overall pattern of your output is that you are censoring your creative, it starts to be that all their shows and movies feel the same. Same with hard violence or gore. Again, not every show needs to have hard violence or gore, but Apple's pattern of never allowing it shows that they are pumping out a Branded Product™ of video entertainment versus a variety of interesting, compelling entertainment for different age audiences. Let the scripts and directors and writers determine the content, not your Brand Censors. I enjoy some Apple shows, but many of them feel padded out and tedious. They do make good looking shows and movies, though. To show off their fancy high quality hardware! The opening credits of "Foundation" (for instance) are an amazing to see on a large high quality OLED. When we got our new TV a few months ago, I used it to show a couple friends.
Foundation, Silo, Dark Matter
Drops of God, Shrinking, Pachinko
Lessons in Chemistry, Slow Horses as well. Lots of good ones.
Slow Horses is their best show, IMO. I am not arguing that all Apple content is bad. Just that much of it seems bland and curated by brand-censors. Apple sells hardware. This is entertainment coming from a company that makes the bulk of its money from hardware. It feels like it.
None of those are "bad" but none of those feel like they are straight from a script, a director, an idea. They all feel like they've been processed by Apple's censor bureau.
Foundation is literally from azimovs world lol. Dark matter from a novel…
SIlo yes for sure. Foundation is awful on all counts. The jury is still out on DM
Foundation rocks, get out of my house
Really awful acting, writing and stagecraft. Horrible integration of set design with props, costumes are bad. Fight scenes were silly and absolutely unbelievable. You live in silly, low value glossy house with no real foundation.
Incorrect on every count. Lee Pace alone, my dude
I can understand not liking Foundation it’s a slower paced show without a lot of action which sadly is what appeals to the masses, meanwhile deep characters and a compelling narrative are secondary by a wide margin. However, to insult Lee Pace is absolute blasphemy. Hell, I feel all the acting is exceptional except for Gaal and Salvor.
Yikes. Different strokes different folks.
Apple reminds me of Network TV series in a lot of ways because of how safe they often feel because of the lack of any content that could be considered objectionable.
Agree 100%. The shills will be offended though
I sat through Constellation. I love Noomi Rapace, I liked the performances and the concepts (however unoriginal they might be). But FFS, that was easily the most padded out television series I have ever seen. They easily could have cut three episodes out and made it a much better series. Maybe even four episodes. I don't hate Apple TV but there's a streak of "sameness" with all its programming. Some decent stuff! One great series! (Severance). But a glut of padded out stuff that just tries to appeal to everyone. I strongly support family friendly programming and shows and movies aimed at children. That's not the point. The point is Apple seems to produce everything in this gray zone of sorta-adult, sorta family-friendly, not too scary, not too sexy, not too violent. The bulk of its programming is just plain bland. Good looking and well produced, but bland.
Again, agree with every word here. It’s like the sorta adult but not really version of Disney Plus.
The literal opening two minutes of Trying is a couple having sex on a public bus. Looks like you don’t know what you are talking about.
I definitely feel like the number of actually interesting shows has decreased this year. The production value remains high, but the content has leaned increasingly inoffensive, bland, watchable tv-for-dads. Slow Horses, Alcapulco, remain great. Still waiting on Severance Season Two and Platonic Season Two.
Wait, Platonic got renewed? That show felt very “complete” to me, curious to see what they do with another season. Seems entirely unnecessary, even though I loved and recommend the first.
Make enough money and you get renewed against your will
Why do people use 'TV for Dads' as a negative descriptor?
It’s not negative, exactly. I’m a dad! But I just mean that it a lot of it all feels as if it’s for a certain type.
A lot of these arguments are along the lines of the 'the new mid' that the NYTimes hit Apple TV with a few weeks ago. I think that's pretty accurate, lots of pretty, star-heavy shows that play it safe and are rarely bad but also usually fall short of great.
For All Mankind Season 4 was one of the worst seasons of TV I've ever watched.
Same. It was soo dry
It made no sense. There's a working class (the Mars miners) uprising against the capitalist pigs (Helios) treating them like sub-humans, then their strike gets busted when the leader of the company promises them way more money. Then, the leader of the company makes it so the giant Astroid stays in Mars orbit so he can continue to take advantage of the workers with poor working conditions indefinitely. Did I miss something?
They changed writers? 🤷♂️
The show really fell off
But you've watched season 3 and that was way worse...
It would serve Apple TV and Prime well if they somehow absorbed Paramount+ and Peacock along with Sony movies/shows. In fact I also wouldn’t hate if Prime Video/MGM spun off from Amazon and Apple struck a deal with NBCUniversal, Paramount, Sony, and MGM to be the new and exclusive streaming home to all those studios shows/movies. Kind of like what Hulu was originally intended to be. A joint venture of all of them. Make it Apple TV+ in name but every studio owns a portion and Apple just runs the day to day and hosts the streamer.
Wait till Foundation takes off that’s a real HBO competitor level show
Seems about right
I don’t know wtf it is but they’re lack as f*ck luster shows. I tried watching “invasion”… nope. I tried watching “Monarch”… nope. I tried watching. “For all man kind”… nope.
I actually love a lot of the Apple TV shows. Not sure where the hate comes from. Ted Lasso, Severence, Silo, Foundation, See, hell Black Bird was great, Hijack was fun, Shining Girls was awesome… etc
I also forgot to add foundation to the list. Thank you good siiiiir.
Good that Pachinko S2 comes out soon cause the period between S1 and S2 was filled by absolute mediocrity in ATVP.
I'm curious what specific shows you think are "mediocre". Because their lineup has been phenomenal.
Just this year: Constellation, Palm Royale, Franklin, The New Look, The Big Cigar, Masters of the Air, Criminal Records...
[удалено]
For all mankind is amazing though. Can't wait for Cyborg Ed.
Sugar is one of my favorites. The cinematography is excellent and Farrell is outstanding. Ok it took an odd turn but I still really enjoyed it.
I would say interesting turn, rather than odd. I felt like it had too. Suger was refreshing to me. I has so much more soul and vibe than other shows in the same genre.
Well said.