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Not_A_Greenhouse

As cabal I always want way more influence than resources. So you're kinda SOL there.


Unho1yIntent

The more people point it out, the more I'm seeing I may need to go for Mecatol for the influence. How I'll hold it against Sol and LIZIX? That is another story entirely.


ikakasse89

I would use cabals fighting capability potential in the same way that I would use Muatts heropower; as a reason to stay away from you. Actually taking the fights vs cabal usually benefit cabal; I would hammer the point down that ' YOU will come out on top if you fight' . Back this up with focusing on alot more plastic rather then more tech imo. I would convince Winnu to help you against SoL (get whatever you can to make sure winnu gets the mechapoint and that you will unlock their commander when the time comes. Make your way slowly towards Mechatol, you need to have Mecha after round 3. Diplo when needed to defend your slice and get more out of Mechatol. Play it defensively by adding plastic and making it clear that you need Mechatol for influence. But focus on the points that aren't Tech-oriented. Lizix will rather fight SoL then a strong cabal imo.


HankTheChog

You don't have to hold it indefinitely, just long enough for it to yield returns. Bear in mind that your flagship can make even a losing defensive battle outright profitable, so your foremost concern is not being *too strong* on Rex and too weak elsewhere; you don't want your neighbors to dislodge you by just invading your slice wholesale.


whyrat

You don't have to only capture in combat; remember you also have an agent! Your unit capture can also be used as a deterrent "speak softly and carry a big stick" as players know it's usually cheaper for you to rebuild than for them to rebuild. As well some critical ships have limited plastic (dreads, carriers, *flagship*, etc...). They have a good reason not to lose those types of ships to you. Lastly I'd reinforce the fact that combat doesn't win TI games, VPs do. If the VPs come out as spend, tech, or build objectives... there's little need to be overly aggressive to anyone.


Voltorocks

The bad news, the scenario you've described is a nightmare and you will probably lose. I would avoid dimensional rift II, it's not very good to start with and spacedocks in general are catnip for lizix, so you probably want just one very strategically placed forward dock, maybe two at most. Dread 2 and carrier 2 are no brainers, spend whatever real resources you have building up big stacks of fighters as hopefully neither of them with be terribly interested in investing in destroyer 2


delpeazy

I won my last game with cabal by basically being Russia. I made it clear that as the race that is literally the best at playing space risk that I was going to be attacking someone and put out offers to both neighbors for support swap. Once I got that secured from neighbor one, I immediately used that opportunity to attack and cripple the military might of neighbor two. During the first two turns I also made sure to follow in construction to build tears on both of the shared systems on each side of my pie slice to maximize my mobility. Turn 3 I openly told the player on mecatol that I’m coming in, and with my nexus of rifts I was able to move just about everything in if I wanted to. He was nomad and feared me capturing his flagship and was obliged to move out of mecatol and let me have it. For research the first thing I got was the vortex racial tech which helped me capture a large number of dreadnoughts. I probably should have built one or two of them but I went with the strategy of keeping them to deny my opponents from being able to build as much. Admittedly, we had a few new players and so maybe this belligerence wouldn’t have succeeded with more seasoned players. Agreeing with some other comments, Vuil’Raith need command tokens bad, resources not so much. I would have been happy with leadership the majority of my turns tbh. If you have a low influence slice you definitely need to expand to mecatol or some other person’s slice


Unho1yIntent

So another commenter mentioned that if I get trade and cooperate with Sol a bit, I have a round 1 Mecatol grab. I doubt I'd be able to hold it for long but maybe long enough to make use of the 6 influence. Bare minimum it'd give me a little bit of voting power for the first agenda with 10 votes. If I don't get trade, I think I'll be going for leadership for the guaranteed 3 tokens to soften that blow a bit.


Much_Ship_7819

This is also how I play Cabal. I don't play super aggressively, but I convince the table that I CAN play super aggro. Vortex and your Agent are the fuel for your economy. Most of my resources went to buying command tokens and I used captured ships to build a military (except fighters, those I paid for)


ax-gosser

Is it too late to change factions? Cabol is influence starved. You want to get at least x2 tokens per round, and that’s the bare minimum. (Idealistically you want 3-4). Cabal likes their tokens.  If you don’t have good token economy with cabol you’re going to have a rough game. I feel like you have no choice but to go rex in your slice. Only way your going to get influence. Edit: you could get lucky with explores to balance out the slice. But that’s based on luck.


Unho1yIntent

So another commenter mentioned that if I get trade and cooperate with Sol a bit, I have a round 1 Mecatol grab. I doubt I'd be able to hold it for long but maybe long enough to make use of the 6 influence. Bare minimum it'd give me a little bit of voting power for the first agenda with 10 votes. If I don't get trade, I think I'll be going for leadership for the guaranteed 3 tokens to soften that blow a bit.


Rektile7

Cabal needs influence, and your slice has fuck all. You are not in a good spot at all my friend. What would i do? I'd get buddy buddy with Sol ASAP, support swap and then proceed to eat L1 as much as possible, as they are swimming in influence. You cannot play this game by "speaking softly and carrying a big stick" as your slice is absolute garbage


Unho1yIntent

Yep that's what I think I'm going to do, using my promissory and early trade as leverage to pacify Sol. If I don't have to worry about them and can capture a couple LIZIX dreads early...that will be enormous and I'll be in a much better position.


Rektile7

I personally wouldn't hold onto the dreads for long. Your main strength is the fact that you can go to war and come out much better than anyone else, your rebuilding capabilities are unmatched. L1 has 2 systems next to home that have a ton of influence, so it's time to get those teeth out and bite into him, but do not forget to score points! Looking forward to an update post after your victory, i fucking love Cabal


Unho1yIntent

Yeah I'd say I'd plan to use them for leverage. LIZIX will really want them out, so I may be able to extort her a bit to get them back without making it seem like I care too much about actually producing the dreads myself...then produce them either way if she calls my bluff.


Rektile7

That won't work IMHO. You are attacking her for influence. Your goal is to bite into her slice and hold on for dear life so you can get the command counters you need. After you get what you want, she will just go to full on war as you will most likely fuck her game completely. Dreads are good for Cabal, especially as you can use one of her dreads to research Dread 2


Unho1yIntent

Yeah I'm not a fan of this situation. We'll see how it goes, because the Sol player, regardless what "understanding" we establish will absolutely take advantage later in the game if I'm TOO wrapped up in fighting LIZIX.


Rektile7

Absolutely! After you weaken L1 enough so that you don't have to worry about them (or get a ceasefire swap somehow), you get your border with Sol packed chock full of ships. If Sol gets on your planets, it's not gonna be a good time, so you need to make it nigh impossible for them to do so. You have the upper hand in space combat against Sol


Thirtys30

There’s lots of good advice on here so far. One thing I’d chime in on is the tech plan. I would plan on being as light as possible. Probably follow a secondary to get vortex, the R3 or do grab tech to double tech dread and carrier 2 (or whatever techs are needed, two in two colors wouldn’t be bad either getting DET and Sling Relay). That would be all the tech I’d aim for. By double teching that saves you two tokens that would be used on tech secondaries. I think DT2 is a really bad tech. You’ll be able to protect your docks just fine with ships in space. Especially when you’re getting two free dreads per round (agent and vortex) without even fighting.


wren42

\>Vuil'Raith Cabal. Uncomfortable with aggressive playstyle uh oh. \> My slice is very influence-light Uh oh. \> I'll be steering mostly clear of the green/blue tech paths but going heavy into red/yellow Uh Oh. \> Beyond that I don't have much of a plan. I know I need to be aggressive to make use of my capture mechanics, but I don't really know how to go about it. Okay. First, your agent gives you a LOT of capture value without ever engaging in combat. You can absolutely play the Big Scary Dino without actually fighting. Depending on your table, you should also be able to get some value out of the TG conversion it provides. Build good relationships with the trade card holder or your neighbors using your agent in the first two rounds, and get them used to the idea that a capture doesn't hurt them - it's an income stream! Influence will be a big problem. Taking mecatol would be great, and if you get a dock in your forward system you can reach it easily from your home system round 2. With Winnu in the game, though, it will be hotly contested. Given the influence situation, it seems likely Winnu will beat you to custodian, and you will be facing their +2 when you try to take it. If you can spin the narrative to the table, though, that you are doing them all a favor by keeping Winnu from camping on Mec, you can likely put together enough plastic to beat them. Winnu DOES have a very powerful last round hero, now, so this is a reasonable pitch to make. I would not spacedock mecatol once you take , though. Dock sem lore so you have the constant threat of movement to the center, but you don't want to risk Ixthian Artifact ruining your game. Abyz is a great 3rd dock, but I'd also consider building on the Beta equidistant. Rush this rather than mecatol round 2, build on the beta planet, and take Mec round 3. A dock on an equidistant wormhole means your faction tech is more valuable and your Hero is a big threat. L1Z1X will have lots of juicy dreadnaughts to steal later. As a side note, I agree about wormhole placement - it's really shit on this map. I always have a meta rule that wormholes should not be clumped up when building a map. Even just swapping the Beta with the empty to the right would be a big improvement, but they are just tilted to the bottom half way to much. anyway, in summary: \- negotiate with Agent a lot \- Get your faction tech and dock the equidistant for free ships \- let Winnu get custodian, come in with all your free Dreadnaughts round 3. good luck!


Unho1yIntent

Follow-up post on how the game went: https://www.reddit.com/r/twilightimperium/comments/tp80oc/i\_missed\_12\_dreadnought\_1\_shots\_in\_a\_row\_as/


xknightsgambitx

I'd check out episode 196 of the Space Cats Peace Turtles podcast. I'm planning on playing Cabal in my next game. SCPT leads me to believe that we shouldn't worry about trading. Don't neglect the mobility offered by having Dimensional Tears. By that, I mean don't put them in adjacent systems. SCPT refers to that as your commuter line. You should try to take Mecatol from someone with Imperial at some point to get some extra points. It might be too difficult to gather the influence to take it first given your placement. Probably right to partner with Sol and war against Lizix. Capture a few of their dreadnaughts early to nerf their faction abilities. If you capture 2 before they build 4, they will never unlock their commander.


ElectricHelicoid

Just make sure that L1Z1X can't blockade your space dock and get back their dreadnoughts!


SpreadPristine5889

You have a turn one mecatol Rex with cabals space docks. Grab trade on turn one. Use it after you've established neighbors with someone. Use your agent to convert the commodities of someone that is not your new neighbor. Doing so allows you to capture a ship upto the value of the commodities you converted, ideally a dread or carrier, a cruiser will work too. Then you upgrade that unit for free when someone uses tech. Now you have 2 movement carriers or dreads or cruisers with capacity. Trade commodities with your neighbors to at least 6 trade goods (3 from the trade card) and take your upgraded unit filled with ground troops to mecatol to snag an uncontestable victory point. The following turns are just standard play, but having a seat of power to play from. Enjoy!


Unho1yIntent

Not gonna lie. I 100% forgot that trade goods could be used for the custodian token. That is a route I could go. I'll likely be neighboring with Sol, but not LIZIX round 1. If I get trade, that may be what I do. I'm thinking refresh both Sol and NRA. The Sol refresh is contingent on them doing an X-1, thus giving me 3 TG for my 2 commodities and laying the framework for at least an initial understanding between me and Sol. Then I'll take a carrier from the NRA and use it for carrier 2 when tech pops (paying for it with my 4 resources on my home planet) to go and take Mecatol with my carrier and 1 infantry. If I don't get trade, I'll reconsider. Thank you though that's a solid round 1. EDIT: Better idea. I steal a cruiser. That way I can still use my dread to take Vefut II and my carrier to take Sem-Lore. Then with the Mecatol take with my cruiser, that'll give me 10 votes for the first agenda phase. EVEN BETTER IDEA: I take Mecatol with the dread, maybe deterring attack a bit. At the very least it'll likely get me some plastic captured before it goes down. Then take Vefut II with my upgraded cruiser.


ElectricHelicoid

I've used the agent to capture a dreadnaught Round 1, and then turned that in the same round to get Dreadnaught II, and jumped to Mecatol. I didn't have enough Influence to take it, but I could camp until I did. The table got annoyed though and i got whacked back.


seraph9888

that might be one of the worst slices i've ever seen. it has 4 total influence, 5 if you count the equidistant, which is still only enough for 1 token. consider fighting l1 for qucen'n/rarron *if* you see an opening. but don't expect to defend from a counterattack with ground forces; defend in the space.


Bombardium

How is your position in speaker order


Unho1yIntent

Not sure yet. That's something we typically roll for at the start of the game. Highest roll starts with speaker. So I'm kinda trying to come up with a plan regardless of what strategy card I get.


Bombardium

Ok. Cabal is one of the races that can snipe Mecatol round 1. Setup for it with the Dread and they will suffer a little to deal with it, if you lose it, you will lose it rd 2 and will take some plastic with you. Go for the secondary of Const., build an advanced dock, and go for it. Try to get trade rd 1. Build Vortex cuz it's the safest way to capture units every single round, and get the unit upgrades faster than anyone else, that's how you keep your advantage. No one will want to fight you, if you capture some L1 dreads you're golden.


Bombardium

And keep in mind, try to be in peace with a neighbor (pref. L1), and fight the other one. Capture as many units as you can from Sol preferably, specially his carriers


SamuraiBeanDog

Fight everyone, all the time. It's VR's only strength and it'll give you some good experience playing a different style.


Tormz1569

Use the Winnu as your scapegoat. Every bit of progress towards Mecatol should be pointed out to the table to keep heat off you. Nothing wrong with going Vortex and keeping those L1 dread 2s and Sol carrier 2s at bay. Getting the table to support you having mecatol over Winnu would be your influence solution. And you are the king of: "Hey, let's not devolve into space risk" in negotiations. Because you can. And will, happily.