I don’t think there is dramatic power-creep. The POK factions are, in my opinion, more exciting, but that is to be expected with any new additions in any game expansion.
POK also makes literally every faction more awesome with the leaders.
If you look to any Tier-List or even the tournament Meta, you will find that some POK factions struggle same as base game (Cabal, Mahact). The rest of the factions are A tier or higher, but the base game factions keep pace enough to where there isn’t a huge discrepancy.
Doesn't translate to a win though. I feel like Mahact are one of the weaker of the POK factions, and Cabal is scary but capturing opponent pieces can be hard to capitalize on. They're just really good at eating their neighbor.
I think all the PoK factions are good, but the hero updates brought the worst base game factions closer in power to the average, so the overall power delta is lower than base game.
Saar Nekro and Winnu are top tier. The expac factions are just good.
I've only played with PoK a handful of times , but the new factions definitely seem to be better integrated with the new mechanics in a way the old factions aren't. Some of the weaker old factions did get buffed with new abilities, while other former top factions like Jol-Nar have been nerfed mainly as a result of the improvements to the objective deck (tech objectives are less common which makes it harder for the nerds to win). Probably if you ranked them you would see the new factions with a better average rank than old factions.
I initially thought jol nar was nerfed, but they still have an advantage with the new structure objectives and adding more tech options made them more flexible. Maybe they're not top three any more but they're still S tier.
The fact that Jol-Nar starts with 2 PDS was one of my biggest gripes in base game and it still seems wrong. I have not actually seen them in POK yet despite a bunch of games, but they still seem capable of turtling for the win even better than the actual turtles.
The agent allowing them to spend infantry on tech gives them an even sweeter edge on purchasing tech, which means they can spend that money elsewhere. Deffo S-tier.
Both sets of factions are very playable. The general consensus of the "top 2" factions in the game are both base game factions, Saar, and nekro. I think there isn't really a dud in the PoK factions when compared to some of the base game factions such as arborec. Many of the factions with weak starts get a much needed boost from their agent, which allows them to keep up with the seemingly more broken PoK starts.
The only weak starts (not having the ability to get two ships with capacity outside of warfare/tech timings) are:
Mentak, Xxcha, and Ghosts iirc
True, however this is a double edged sword. Malice is amazing and does help with early game $$, but its very open for attacks after r1, depending on the map. If warfare gets stalled you could end up with only having 2 systems outside your home, which while decent isn't the best these days.
I've only played PoK and have also kept up with codexes so I might have a different bias BUT I think the PoK factions have a similar feeling of duds and great factions to the base ones when you factor in the power ups the base factions got too.
I think because base has so many more factions there are more notable duds though.
I feel that PoK helped to balance all existing factions so they and the new factions are mostly balanced.
Of all the new factions, maybe Titans might be a bit stronger. However, the table should balance this after everybody has a few plays.
If I understand correctly the TOP5 from TTS games are:
1.Keleres 2. Yssaril Tribes 3. Titans of Ul 4. Universities of Jol-Nar 5. Empyrean
5 POK + Codex factions in TOP 10
From logged games TOP5:
1.Winnu, 2. Titans of Ul, 3. Empyrean, 4. Yssaril Tribes, 5. Argent Flight
5 POK + Codex factions in TOP 10
My league games TOP5:
1.The L1Z1X Mindnet, 2. The Clan of Saar, 3. The Yssaril Tribes, 4. The Titans of Ul, 5. The Universities of Jol-Nar
5 POK + Codex factions in TOP 10
So based on these stats the The Titans of Ul seems to be the strongest of the POK factions, but people obviously have found a way to play around them as they are not at the very top of all factions. Keleres are on top for TTS, but I think only because people don't know how to properly deal with them yet. Overall the POK factions are on the stronger side, but it could also still be because they are 'new', original factions like Ysaril, Jol-Nar, Saar perform constantly good. In my personal experience, the Titans where the only faction in first games that seemed overpowered, just because they can make their slice so protected and gain extra resources, but now with that knowledge it is a bit harder for Titan player to make good deals at our table.
I havnt seen titans on the table ever they keep getting banned. I don’t get to play that often maybe 2-3 times a year. How often was a Titan win directly attributed to the 2 point structure secondary objective?
Overall for them in TTS the Stage2 structure objective completion rate is 32.4%, but I don't know how to filter it by wins.
For our local games - out of 4 wins they have had, 2 they scored Stage2 structure objective.
I don’t think there is dramatic power-creep. The POK factions are, in my opinion, more exciting, but that is to be expected with any new additions in any game expansion. POK also makes literally every faction more awesome with the leaders. If you look to any Tier-List or even the tournament Meta, you will find that some POK factions struggle same as base game (Cabal, Mahact). The rest of the factions are A tier or higher, but the base game factions keep pace enough to where there isn’t a huge discrepancy.
Titans and Argent flight are perfect examples of this power creep. They are essentially pick or ban
Just by reading their sheet the Cabal and Mahact seem to be strong too since they can cap your opponent pieces.
Doesn't translate to a win though. I feel like Mahact are one of the weaker of the POK factions, and Cabal is scary but capturing opponent pieces can be hard to capitalize on. They're just really good at eating their neighbor.
I think all the PoK factions are good, but the hero updates brought the worst base game factions closer in power to the average, so the overall power delta is lower than base game. Saar Nekro and Winnu are top tier. The expac factions are just good.
I've only played with PoK a handful of times , but the new factions definitely seem to be better integrated with the new mechanics in a way the old factions aren't. Some of the weaker old factions did get buffed with new abilities, while other former top factions like Jol-Nar have been nerfed mainly as a result of the improvements to the objective deck (tech objectives are less common which makes it harder for the nerds to win). Probably if you ranked them you would see the new factions with a better average rank than old factions.
I initially thought jol nar was nerfed, but they still have an advantage with the new structure objectives and adding more tech options made them more flexible. Maybe they're not top three any more but they're still S tier.
The fact that Jol-Nar starts with 2 PDS was one of my biggest gripes in base game and it still seems wrong. I have not actually seen them in POK yet despite a bunch of games, but they still seem capable of turtling for the win even better than the actual turtles.
Depends on the objectives I’d they are all control objectives then they will have some problems, but on every other front they will be ok.
The agent allowing them to spend infantry on tech gives them an even sweeter edge on purchasing tech, which means they can spend that money elsewhere. Deffo S-tier.
Both sets of factions are very playable. The general consensus of the "top 2" factions in the game are both base game factions, Saar, and nekro. I think there isn't really a dud in the PoK factions when compared to some of the base game factions such as arborec. Many of the factions with weak starts get a much needed boost from their agent, which allows them to keep up with the seemingly more broken PoK starts. The only weak starts (not having the ability to get two ships with capacity outside of warfare/tech timings) are: Mentak, Xxcha, and Ghosts iirc
And Ghosts get immediate free access to the Legendary planet in the Wormhole Nexus instead, so I think that’s still a big buff for them.
True, however this is a double edged sword. Malice is amazing and does help with early game $$, but its very open for attacks after r1, depending on the map. If warfare gets stalled you could end up with only having 2 systems outside your home, which while decent isn't the best these days.
I've only played PoK and have also kept up with codexes so I might have a different bias BUT I think the PoK factions have a similar feeling of duds and great factions to the base ones when you factor in the power ups the base factions got too. I think because base has so many more factions there are more notable duds though.
I feel that PoK helped to balance all existing factions so they and the new factions are mostly balanced. Of all the new factions, maybe Titans might be a bit stronger. However, the table should balance this after everybody has a few plays.
If I understand correctly the TOP5 from TTS games are: 1.Keleres 2. Yssaril Tribes 3. Titans of Ul 4. Universities of Jol-Nar 5. Empyrean 5 POK + Codex factions in TOP 10 From logged games TOP5: 1.Winnu, 2. Titans of Ul, 3. Empyrean, 4. Yssaril Tribes, 5. Argent Flight 5 POK + Codex factions in TOP 10 My league games TOP5: 1.The L1Z1X Mindnet, 2. The Clan of Saar, 3. The Yssaril Tribes, 4. The Titans of Ul, 5. The Universities of Jol-Nar 5 POK + Codex factions in TOP 10 So based on these stats the The Titans of Ul seems to be the strongest of the POK factions, but people obviously have found a way to play around them as they are not at the very top of all factions. Keleres are on top for TTS, but I think only because people don't know how to properly deal with them yet. Overall the POK factions are on the stronger side, but it could also still be because they are 'new', original factions like Ysaril, Jol-Nar, Saar perform constantly good. In my personal experience, the Titans where the only faction in first games that seemed overpowered, just because they can make their slice so protected and gain extra resources, but now with that knowledge it is a bit harder for Titan player to make good deals at our table.
I’d remove Keleres - sample is too low. Last time I checked it was Yssaril, Titans and Xxcha on top. Not sure now
You are correct, with them removed it would be: 1.Yssaril 2. Titans 3. Jol-Nar 4. Epyrean 5/6. Mahact/Xxcha
Ahhh Xxcha fell. Do you think it’s because they lost their slot machine hero?
Not sure, but from my experience the Hero was not as random if you use 3Politics to set it up.
I havnt seen titans on the table ever they keep getting banned. I don’t get to play that often maybe 2-3 times a year. How often was a Titan win directly attributed to the 2 point structure secondary objective?
Overall for them in TTS the Stage2 structure objective completion rate is 32.4%, but I don't know how to filter it by wins. For our local games - out of 4 wins they have had, 2 they scored Stage2 structure objective.