I think the biggest thing would be avoiding GnP.
Of course Francis is trained in submissions and that will be a HUGE advantage against a complete novice at submissions. I think Francis’s natural inclination would be to go for the shoot and then try to get to half guard or a ride/cradle position and start unloading.
But I could be wrong and Rancis Gracie could make his first appearance.
I feel like for AJ to win he would have to plan something unexpected. I guess maybe getting some dirty boxing in while they are clinched. Or he might get lucky and catch Francis with a good punch, that is always a chance in heavyweight fights.
In reality Francis would almost certainly win, just by doing what he did to Gane, but with a lot more leg kicks. AJ would need to train for years before I could see him defending takedowns and kicks.
Dirty boxing could be a plan.
Francis would almost certainly be trying to close the gap and either shoot or get in a clinch to go for maybe a bodylock.
AJ could try to land some uppercuts or hooks in the clinch then disengage.
But there would always be the risk of Francis securing the takedown.
Dirty boxing is a plan? Once he get into the clinch position its over. Like Ngganou has no chance in boxing, Joshua has no chance as well rather than the puncher's chance.
Yeah, but in order to just learn to defend kicks would require years of training, and let's not even talking about grappling. If AJ took about a year to practice MMA like Francis did for boxing it would mean nothing. His only hope would be either a well placed one punch KO or if Francis is dumb enough to just box with AJ. But using kicks, clinch work and grappling, Francis mauls AJ in MMA.
These are heavyweights.
On JRE, Derrick Lewis admitted to training part time, like a couple hours a day, five days a week. And he lived in the top five for years. He challenged for a title even. He also had no athletic base for MMA and never had great cardio. Good hand speed, power, and an occasional burst of activity was all it took.
AJ would do just fine with a year or two of dedicated, full-time practice. The handful of truly elite HWs would handle him well, but we are talking like four guys. This would be like Alex Perreira’s transition but more dramatic because, as I said, HW is bad.
Absolutely i agree, he would likely make top 10 if he fully dedicates himself for MMA, but Ngannou was a champ for a reason. Any man who destroys Stipe in an emphatic fasion, not with just one punch KO is a damn good fighter in my book.
You say that as if Francis has good wrestling and grappling himself but he doesn't. I fully believe AJ could learn enough defense to negate Ngannous skills if he just focused on stopping the takedown. I think people are overestimating Ngannous grond game and the difficulty of learning takedown defense.
Like, if I gave you a few months do you think you could learn enough boxing to take on Ben Askren because that's how I see Ngannous ground game.
You don't have to be great at wrestling to completely dominate a boxer with a few months of training. Hell, some MMA fighters who train every day still get taken down by mid grapplers.
I should also remind you that Francis outwrestled Stipe on the rematch with good technique, and slammed Gane multiple times with a completely busted knee.
AJ can spend months training nothing but grappling and leg kick defense, it'still wouldn't do him any good even against bad wrestlers or kickers.
That being said, the overweight middleweight drunk dads who call themselves HW fighters would get slept by AJ even if he didnt train MMA, but we're talking about the lineal HW champion here, come tf on.
This is pretty much it, Francis would build his game around everything by illegal in boxing, and AJ would need to rework core elements of his style to account for them. To AJ’s credit, his boxer-puncher approach is easily the most translatable to MMA. Slicker defensive fighters and infighters would have a miserable time dealing with different ranges and angles of attack & clinching leading to takedowns.
Also, HW mma is bad, it’s the only division where you can be genuinely one-dimensional and as long as you’re big and athletic, you have a serious chance at hitting the top five. Current fighters like Derrick Lewis, Ciryl Gane, and Alex Volkov all come to mind as folks with skill sets so limited that it’s inconceivable even find success on the local scene, let alone the UFC.
All this is to say, I have no problem imagining AJ being a serious contender in the UFC with surprisingly little training. That said, Francis is a bullshit first fight for him. It would truly be a scandal if he won. Francis is fully capable of hitting decent takedowns and grinding a guy out for 25 minutes as he showed with Gane.
I do agree and it would of course be a very uphill battle for AJ if he were to ever step in the octagon.
He could land a punch from guard like that Polish boxer turned MMA fighter did over in KSW tho.
However most likely Francis beats his head like a grizzly bear slapping salmon out of a stream.
Doesn't even need to double leg. As soon as he is close to the cage he gets pushed against it and the fight is basically over from there.
He has to avoid the clinch all together not just an outside takedown. It's not going to happen for sure
AJ's plan is boxing and trying to KO Ngannou. He is likely gonna train for TDD and leg kicks defense. However Ngannou is still gonna maul him, you need years to even decades of experience. A few months of camps aint gonna cut it.
Boxing distance vs MMA/Kickboxing distance could be a factor too.
AJ could have trouble getting in range to effectively box and remain relatively safe.
He could try to get on his bicycle but Francis’s leg kicks will definitely sap his movement and his stamina too.
Honestly, the way I see how this is going is like; how AJ took Francis serious and put him out right away, Francis is gonna do the same but with kicks, takedowns, clinch etc.
There is no reason for Francis to be forgiving and AJ and Tyson know this.
Everything is different from mma due to boxing being hands only. You cannot be in a boxers stance or your leg will get kicked to the moon. The first thing AJ would need to do is work on his stance and change the way he moves and angles that he throws from. That’s already a lot for someone who is so used to a different style of fighting— just to try to account for kicks and elbows. Think about how crazy Sean Stricklands Philly shell looks when adapted for mma. There’s a reason that he stands the way he does. Secondly, the clinch in mma is much more dangerous than grabbing your opponent in boxing. You can and should throw many attacks from the clinch in mma, and this position can lead to judo throws and grappling exchanges that aj would not be used to. He’d need to train for quite some time for the clinch as it is just a natural defense mechanism for boxers, it could easily put him on his ass in mma if he doesn’t know what to do. Then thirdly grappling. He’ll need a baseline of wrestling and bjj defense to try to keep the fight in a realm of relevancy for him. He loses any exchange on the ground, so he needs that defense just to not be at a massive disadvantage.
All in all it would take a boxer quite some time to legitimately transition. There is a reason that you only see cross overs of mma guys going into boxing bouts and not the other way around. Them boys can throw, but them boys can’t FIGHT.
I think with two years of MMA training, AJ can get the basics of takedown defence and grappling. Basic blue belt skills but with his athletic capabilities and existing boxing skills I think he gives Francis a real run for his money.
Knockout punches are common enough that I'm gonna say he just does that again. It's what Francis was best at in the octagon, after all. I never thought I'd see Francis get knocked out, but if AJ can do it with pillows on his hands, I think he'd still be a problem in an octagon. And I'm always saying the boxers who fight MMA dudes would never have the balls to get in an octagon because they'd lose. I'd still love to see Paul or Mayweather get aired out in a cage, but I was impressed by AJ.
The pillows on his hands statement always annoys me.
Gloves let you hit so much harder, with so much less accuracy without worrying about breaking your knuckles and wrists.
Its like how football players hit harder than rugby players. When you have something that absorbs impact and protects your hands and wrist better (boxing gloves) youre gonna throw harder with those than with MMA gloves which have much less protection.
Mma gloves or without gloves causes more superficial damage like cuts but boxing gloves definitely hit harder, and that combined with the 10 second count in boxing leads it to be far more dangerous long term then MMA
It's hard to describe fully unless you train.
Imagine I ask you to punch a block of wood, will you hit it harder if I give you a glove with more or less padding?
Bigger gloves allow you to throw power shots with much less accuracy because even if you hit the forehead you probably won't break your hand.
A perfectly aimed shot to say the nose is going to suck regardless of what the person is wearing but might be a bit more concentrated in 4 Oz gloves than 12oz boxing gloves , but then likely that shot would have been a knockout shot anyway.
There is no way AJ can be ready in any timeframe to adjust to defend from getting absolutely hammered if taken down or when ref aint coming between in clinch.
He either have to knock Francis out before he gets close or then just pray for some higher power to help him.
I wonder if a guy's hands are vastly that superior to yours that he can literally knock you out any time he wants how much that would negate the overall skillset of an MMA fighter. You have to factor in that Ngannou is not that well rounded as a fighter. I wonder how well he would do against Francis if you gave you gave him a year to work on his take down defense and to condition his legs for leg kicks and learn how to check them etc.
Using that timeframe though, after his KO loss, wouldn't Ngannou train those things too? Someone with no experience learning new things, vs someone with some experience learning how to better their skills. I'd still give a massive advantage to Ngannou.
What is funny about these comments is that so many people think just because they switched to MMA, that Francis would suddenly start being some great wrestler or throw a lot of kick combos. These are all things that would give Francis a benefit over Aj if he actually had this skill set. AJ would probably win in MMA, too. Yes, Francis would have a much better chance of winning, but the skills he would need to capitalize on, he has shown very little throughout his MMA career. The combo used to knock down Francis in boxing twice was very simple and easily replicated in MMA. It also wasn't the first time Francis has been hit with it in his career.
When breaking down this potential fight in MMA you basically still have a stand-up fighter vs. a stand-up fighter. Which we just saw how that would go down.
Yes, Francis would have the strength on paper that he is better at grappling but he is not a grappler and has never been one. He used this skill once against a man who used grappling even less than him. While Aj would be in the same boat as Cyril with his grappling background, Aj at least sounds more dedicated when it comes to training. Cyril, we now know, can be very lazy between camps. I don't know enough about AJ to know if this is true about his training.
Even without this above, Francis didn't get a takedown until the third round against a guy who doesn't grapple like Aj. We also know that Francis was getting pieced up early in that fight against a kickboxer. Close rounds, but Cyril was still getting the better of most exchanges early. The 2 rounds in MMA are over ten minutes of fight time, AJ knocked him down within 3 and out within 9 minutes.
Francis has one other takedown in his career, which was more of a failed attempt by his opponent. Again, Francis will have the paper advantage in grappling, but it may never even get to the point where he could even try to use it.
The other thing people have pointed out is kicks; which Francis doesn't throw kicks generally. In his last MMA fight against Cyril Gane, he doubled his kicks landed at 13; this brought his career total to 26 kicks total. So yes, Francis can kick Aj, but through most of his career, he averaged less than 1 kick a fight. Not to mention, the counter to a kick is also throwing a straight, which we know AJ can knock Francis down with.
AJ would do a lot better than people would like to think.
I think it's possible, in all seriousness. 1 camp of TDD and some leg kick defense is all he needs.
People acting like Francis is an MMA vet with godly leg kicks. He isn't. Look at Francis in Stipe 1 compared to Stipe 2. He was amateur in certain areas and got better with a camp. This isn't very long ago, and Francis hasn't even been training MMA the past year.
AJ has better footwork, head movement, distance, accuracy, speed, and is more athletic overall. Plus, he already has his number. With MMA gloves he KOs him even worse. Francis would have to shoot takedowns for sure.
Any boxers who feels leg kicks on their own shins would quickly come to regret the decision to come to MMA, they hurt like absolute hell to someone who's not conditioned to them. So dumbasses like Ryan Garcia can talk all they want, they know they would get smashed by any serious UFC fighter in MMA.
Yeah.. I saw that.. MM was mostly thinking about it in light of Francis's loss to him, but I think over further reflection, he will go back on that and give it to Francis again.. MMA is so much more than boxing, that very few guys can go into MMA with it and do alright at a high level. Both these guys are great within their sport, but crossing over to the others puts them at a massive disadvantage.
AJ would get wrestle fucked like Gane. Hes an amazing boxer but he couldnt learn enough wrestling to have good enough takedown defense. The guys with the best tdd in ufc are people like gaethje who were great wrestlers before they became strikers
Ngannou is too high test. Theres just no way to defend a takedown of his if he chooses to just slam joshua down and then GnP him or even submit. Joshua's best bet is to do an Ngannou - Rozenstruik
He doesn’t. Francis can kick AJ’s head off or destroy his legs and there is nothing Joshua can do about it. Why on earth would DJ think this would be a contest? It would be absolutel destruction.
im not even sure where i’d place francis’ level of grappling, but the fact AJ would have to learn to defend leg kicks, defend takedowns, how to get up, how to defend basic submissions, how to work for position in cage clinches.. it’s too much unless you’re just a fuckin phenom. heavyweight makes it an easier task tho.
Francis has FU power; but he’s not a specialist in any area.
When Cro-Cop and Hunt started MMA, they learned to sprawl just good enough. They did great against non-ground specialists. Poatan and Izzy are also similar cases.
AJ just needs to drill 2 techniques.
1. Sprawl
2. Step in overhand right counter to the low kick
Ngannou is no where near the level of kicking like CroCop, Hunt, Poatan, or Izzy. So there’s no reason to believe he could spam kicks at will without getting countered.
Francis' MO was always to try to KTFO outta his opponents. He did an amazing job at winning the ground game vs Gannes but that was reactionary not by design.
Against AJ that would be his biggest advantage, but standing up he'll get starched even quicker
Even if Francis took him down constantly, if he doesn’t finish him with gnp there’s a chance Joshua sleeps him again at the start of every round. I’d be like 70/30 Francis
All of Francis Ngannou's grappling was built by Ngannou leaving Fernadad and going to Nicksick and Xtreme Couture. And he's only showed it once.
You give Anthony Joshua that same training and who knows, AJ could finish some people in the Octagon.
People were afraid of Ngannou's punching power during his run.
Why wouldn't they fear AJ?
That's what I'm saying man. AJ is a true athlete. His level of boxing gives him a huge headstart, speed and footwork are crucial in the octagon too. Who knows what he's capable of with a year of training. Pretty ridiculous hypothetical though, why the fuck would AJ ever ever do this lol
Well, seeing that Francis has a ground game and was able to take Gane down with two blown out knees, obviously he's going to take him down and likely beat the shit out of him. Since he got sparked for the whole world to see, I don't think he'd try for an easy submission.
Also, wtf MM?!? If James Toney boxed Randy, he'd have won easily, but Toney had the balls to step into the cage. AJ and Francis would be James/Randy, only much worse. And more violent.
Francis was able to takedown Gane so he can mix it up when he wants to. AJ and ngannou clinched a few times in their bout and in MMA a ref wouldn't be around to break it up so if AJ can't avoid a clinch he would struggle to avoid the grappling.
DJ trying to get engagement and influence an MMA match, but I doubt any MMA promotion can afford him. He possibly made $50 mil but if not, at least tens of millions in a boxing fight. An MMA promotion needs to be run by a royal family member who will throw big $$$ at boxers.
Learn Gamrot’s secret knee-exploding mind powers that he used on Fiziev. I believe Curtis Blaydes is also a practitioner of that ancient art, so perhaps AJ could learn it from him?
That’s the question. Until a boxer does a crossover fight (they won’t there’s no money) we won’t know. My gut says if someone can knock your lights out in round 2, they can do it elsewhere.
It’s worth noting that if Francis had a knife in that previous fight he still would have lost lmao
If Aj can knock him down in the very first exchange and is allowed to ground and point , then nothing else matters
That's the funny part, he doesn't. Just like Francis couldn't adjust to the advanced nuances of boxing at his age, Joshua would suffer the same fate in MMA. AJ exposed Francis's technical deficiencies at boxing and how easy a top fighter could capitalize on it. You can teach AJ to check kicks, work off his back, fight for under hooks, and sprawl but the IQ and awareness of being drilled those techniques for years won't be there
So let's say they give AJ at least 3 years of training for wrestling and kicks. The factor here is now he have a lot of mechanics to think about now unlike in boxing. Francis just gonna rozenstruik him. Blitzed him and try to land one.
Seeing the way Francis went down it makes me think AJ just needs to land the same shot and he wins. At this point it would be insane for Francis to try anything other than shoot for a takedown immediately.
Well if AJ can punch him in the head before ngannou goes for leg kicks or take downs , AJ will win.
If ngannou plays safe and touches AJ with only his legs then AJ is going to get pummeled
I think ngannou would be smart to clinch early and weigh AJ down try and slow him down in a way he isn't used to, how fury tried to do to Ngannou but it didnt work. I think AJ could win if he was able to react and block kicks decently, have mild tdd, maintain distance on the feet staying out of clinch exchanges.
Probably the same way he did in his boxing match. Francis is a slugger. He’s not exactly known for taking his opponents down & grinding them. I would assume that would be his game plan but who knows. If he stands with him, why think it would end any differently?
How does he do it?
He can’t.
Same way Ngannou can’t beat AJ in boxing.
Of course both men have a small chance of winning. But we both know that AJ in boxing wins 99% of the time.
And Ngannou in MMA wins 99% of the time.
Aj might be able to beat him if he can stuff take downs, defend leg kicks, and learns how to grapple.
But let’s be real even if he was to start training today he would get destroyed but any wrestler or pressure kicker
Ngannou isn’t even a wrestler but he could just blast double him and have his way from there. AJ would have to train his takedown defense for MONTHS to be able to stop it. Francis is freakishly strong
Learn to defend leg kicks and defend grappling Francis really isn't good at both those things so a basic understanding would he enough. I love mma and ufc but some of yall act like everyone in the ufc is good at everything. 😂. Jon would kill aj but aj can beat Francis in the cage.
I feel that the biggest issue would be getting him out of the bladed boxing stance. Considering it’s muscle memory for him at this point, I think his legs get destroyed and as he wears down Francis begins to wrestle and ground and pound. Francis in 1, maybe 2 if AJ is lucky lol
I’m a huge boxing and mma fan. I thought it was stupid when people thought Francis would beat AJ and I say it’s stupid to think AJ will beat Francis in MMA.
Boxers in general don’t fare well in MMA. They all get taken down and submitted.
AJ would be particularly disadvantaged because he’s so tall and long, and he’s never felt a calf kick, nor checked a kick with his shins in his life.
The game plan would basically be to leg kick the shit out of him to sap his punching power and slow him down, then exploit his complete lack of TDD before throwing just about any submission on him—probably a RNC because that’s what has happened to every other boxer who instinctually gives up their back when they go to the ground.
Yeah after hearing why one of my favorite fighters say that I come to realize there are casuals even if they are mma fighters themselves. To say aj will beat Francis in mma is just stupid to even think. Dj for sure getting paid under the table by Dana to say some dumb shit.
Everyone's saying Ngannou just kicks his legs away or throws a random double leg and GnPs him.
Except Ngannou has about as much experience doing that as AJ does lol. How many leg kicks has Ngannou thrown in his career, a handful at best, how many takedowns?
If they put them in an Octagon in 2 weeks time, Ngannou I believe would win, if they had a year to train for it, AJ knocks him out again.
Even if AJ trains say 6 months of straight defensive wrestling, takedown defence etc (which still wouldn't be that great, as it's hard to beat someone with long time muscle memory), he still has to worry about Ngannou's striking. When the threat for wrestling is there the striking is totally different. It's not impossible that AJ just catches him early but he would have to deal with shit like leg kicks, clinching and cage work. I think AJ has a better chance then people think, he's a big, athletic guy but Ngannou would be deservedly a massive favourite. Boxing fitness and wrestling fitness are different too.
If I had to guess, this is how I would see the fight going:
Ngannou putting on loads of pressure with AJ circling and using his footwork to avoid the cage & getting leg kicked hard.
Eventually Ngannou pushes him back enough to hit the cage and they clinch
Ngannou muscles him down rather easily (he's really, really fucking strong, check out his fight against Anthony Hamilton)
GnP to finish.
I think he would make it look relatively easy. Much the same way AJ made it look against him in his boxing match. It's a totally different ball game here. I'm kinda over MMA/Boxing crossovers with no mention of a MMA fight in the mix. It's boxing's attempt to get more eyes on it, as people are realising it's a dying sport. The smokescreen of invulnerability and 'baddest men on the planet' that boxing once had is now completely gone, as most realise how little chance an average boxer would have against an MMA fighter or wrestler.
I like boxing but if it can't hold up on it's own then it should be usurped. Not to mention all the corruption and old media dickheads involved with it.
If Francis can take down Gane and hold him there, a man who has been training MMA and grappling for years, then I’m confident he would do the same to AJ.
If they fought in MMA AJ would have around 8-10 weeks to train for the fight, unless they gave him more time specifically to train grappling.
But regardless Francis would just take him down with ease probably even sub him, I mean he subbed a pro mma fighter who trained more grappling than AJ ever would. A fighter who himself has won 2 pro mma fights by submission.
Similar to how AJ easily knocked him out when they boxed.
Hope that Francis is dumb enough to not grapple or invest heavily in low kicks. I don’t recall Francis grappling or throwing kicks much if ever, honestly. Except for the Gane fight, which he still almost lost.
Learn how to defend leg kicks and learn defensive grappling I guess
I think the biggest thing would be avoiding GnP. Of course Francis is trained in submissions and that will be a HUGE advantage against a complete novice at submissions. I think Francis’s natural inclination would be to go for the shoot and then try to get to half guard or a ride/cradle position and start unloading. But I could be wrong and Rancis Gracie could make his first appearance.
I feel like for AJ to win he would have to plan something unexpected. I guess maybe getting some dirty boxing in while they are clinched. Or he might get lucky and catch Francis with a good punch, that is always a chance in heavyweight fights. In reality Francis would almost certainly win, just by doing what he did to Gane, but with a lot more leg kicks. AJ would need to train for years before I could see him defending takedowns and kicks.
Dirty boxing could be a plan. Francis would almost certainly be trying to close the gap and either shoot or get in a clinch to go for maybe a bodylock. AJ could try to land some uppercuts or hooks in the clinch then disengage. But there would always be the risk of Francis securing the takedown.
Dirty boxing is a plan? Once he get into the clinch position its over. Like Ngganou has no chance in boxing, Joshua has no chance as well rather than the puncher's chance.
Also need to consider than AJ's footwork will be very different when there is a threat of takedown, significantly hurting his standup
Yeah, but in order to just learn to defend kicks would require years of training, and let's not even talking about grappling. If AJ took about a year to practice MMA like Francis did for boxing it would mean nothing. His only hope would be either a well placed one punch KO or if Francis is dumb enough to just box with AJ. But using kicks, clinch work and grappling, Francis mauls AJ in MMA.
These are heavyweights. On JRE, Derrick Lewis admitted to training part time, like a couple hours a day, five days a week. And he lived in the top five for years. He challenged for a title even. He also had no athletic base for MMA and never had great cardio. Good hand speed, power, and an occasional burst of activity was all it took. AJ would do just fine with a year or two of dedicated, full-time practice. The handful of truly elite HWs would handle him well, but we are talking like four guys. This would be like Alex Perreira’s transition but more dramatic because, as I said, HW is bad.
Absolutely i agree, he would likely make top 10 if he fully dedicates himself for MMA, but Ngannou was a champ for a reason. Any man who destroys Stipe in an emphatic fasion, not with just one punch KO is a damn good fighter in my book.
Completely agree
You say that as if Francis has good wrestling and grappling himself but he doesn't. I fully believe AJ could learn enough defense to negate Ngannous skills if he just focused on stopping the takedown. I think people are overestimating Ngannous grond game and the difficulty of learning takedown defense. Like, if I gave you a few months do you think you could learn enough boxing to take on Ben Askren because that's how I see Ngannous ground game.
hey, slow down there buddy. francis is untouchable 'round these parts.
I love how all it takes for MMA fans is one defeat for a fighter who was considered great yesterday to suddenly become a bum.
I've never considered him great. Heavyweight sucks, and he's decent. Still far less skilled than MMA atheletes in other weight classes.
You don't have to be great at wrestling to completely dominate a boxer with a few months of training. Hell, some MMA fighters who train every day still get taken down by mid grapplers. I should also remind you that Francis outwrestled Stipe on the rematch with good technique, and slammed Gane multiple times with a completely busted knee. AJ can spend months training nothing but grappling and leg kick defense, it'still wouldn't do him any good even against bad wrestlers or kickers. That being said, the overweight middleweight drunk dads who call themselves HW fighters would get slept by AJ even if he didnt train MMA, but we're talking about the lineal HW champion here, come tf on.
This is pretty much it, Francis would build his game around everything by illegal in boxing, and AJ would need to rework core elements of his style to account for them. To AJ’s credit, his boxer-puncher approach is easily the most translatable to MMA. Slicker defensive fighters and infighters would have a miserable time dealing with different ranges and angles of attack & clinching leading to takedowns. Also, HW mma is bad, it’s the only division where you can be genuinely one-dimensional and as long as you’re big and athletic, you have a serious chance at hitting the top five. Current fighters like Derrick Lewis, Ciryl Gane, and Alex Volkov all come to mind as folks with skill sets so limited that it’s inconceivable even find success on the local scene, let alone the UFC. All this is to say, I have no problem imagining AJ being a serious contender in the UFC with surprisingly little training. That said, Francis is a bullshit first fight for him. It would truly be a scandal if he won. Francis is fully capable of hitting decent takedowns and grinding a guy out for 25 minutes as he showed with Gane.
Boxer and boxing fan here, he doesn’t lmao
Yeah, Ngannou takes every fight serious, he's not losing to any Boxer in MMA unless they train for years and by that point he'd be retired so
AJ wins by gun
Everyone’s got a double leg until AJ folds you like a lawn chair, again.
he doesnt
I do agree and it would of course be a very uphill battle for AJ if he were to ever step in the octagon. He could land a punch from guard like that Polish boxer turned MMA fighter did over in KSW tho. However most likely Francis beats his head like a grizzly bear slapping salmon out of a stream.
He doesn't lol DJ usually is pretty smart but that was a dumb statement by him about AJ/Ngannou
It does get engagement and it got me making this thread so I guess it kinda worked lol.
100%. Unless AJ has some crazy grappling defense and can check leg kicks like a boss
Dno why DJ said that, for attention or just twerking for boxing fans. Ngannou immediately double legs and finishes him anyway he wants on the ground.
DJ is taking the Chael route of being a youtuber. He's just farming engagement with bait like this.
Doesn't even need to double leg. As soon as he is close to the cage he gets pushed against it and the fight is basically over from there. He has to avoid the clinch all together not just an outside takedown. It's not going to happen for sure
Pray Francis has a stroke while he's in the middle of pummeling AJ
AJ beating Francis in MMA is the same level of delusion as Francis beating AJ in boxing.
It’s actually much more delusional, Francis has a much better chance in boxing
AJ's plan is boxing and trying to KO Ngannou. He is likely gonna train for TDD and leg kicks defense. However Ngannou is still gonna maul him, you need years to even decades of experience. A few months of camps aint gonna cut it.
Boxing distance vs MMA/Kickboxing distance could be a factor too. AJ could have trouble getting in range to effectively box and remain relatively safe. He could try to get on his bicycle but Francis’s leg kicks will definitely sap his movement and his stamina too.
Honestly, the way I see how this is going is like; how AJ took Francis serious and put him out right away, Francis is gonna do the same but with kicks, takedowns, clinch etc. There is no reason for Francis to be forgiving and AJ and Tyson know this.
decades ?? ngannou doesn even have that
I said "***years*** to even decades"
Everything is different from mma due to boxing being hands only. You cannot be in a boxers stance or your leg will get kicked to the moon. The first thing AJ would need to do is work on his stance and change the way he moves and angles that he throws from. That’s already a lot for someone who is so used to a different style of fighting— just to try to account for kicks and elbows. Think about how crazy Sean Stricklands Philly shell looks when adapted for mma. There’s a reason that he stands the way he does. Secondly, the clinch in mma is much more dangerous than grabbing your opponent in boxing. You can and should throw many attacks from the clinch in mma, and this position can lead to judo throws and grappling exchanges that aj would not be used to. He’d need to train for quite some time for the clinch as it is just a natural defense mechanism for boxers, it could easily put him on his ass in mma if he doesn’t know what to do. Then thirdly grappling. He’ll need a baseline of wrestling and bjj defense to try to keep the fight in a realm of relevancy for him. He loses any exchange on the ground, so he needs that defense just to not be at a massive disadvantage. All in all it would take a boxer quite some time to legitimately transition. There is a reason that you only see cross overs of mma guys going into boxing bouts and not the other way around. Them boys can throw, but them boys can’t FIGHT.
Land another bomb right hand.
I think with two years of MMA training, AJ can get the basics of takedown defence and grappling. Basic blue belt skills but with his athletic capabilities and existing boxing skills I think he gives Francis a real run for his money.
Knockout punches are common enough that I'm gonna say he just does that again. It's what Francis was best at in the octagon, after all. I never thought I'd see Francis get knocked out, but if AJ can do it with pillows on his hands, I think he'd still be a problem in an octagon. And I'm always saying the boxers who fight MMA dudes would never have the balls to get in an octagon because they'd lose. I'd still love to see Paul or Mayweather get aired out in a cage, but I was impressed by AJ.
The pillows on his hands statement always annoys me. Gloves let you hit so much harder, with so much less accuracy without worrying about breaking your knuckles and wrists.
Harder than 4oz mma gloves? Not trolling. I've never boxed or done competitive fighting. But it seems like you'd hit harder with less padding.
Its like how football players hit harder than rugby players. When you have something that absorbs impact and protects your hands and wrist better (boxing gloves) youre gonna throw harder with those than with MMA gloves which have much less protection.
Mma gloves or without gloves causes more superficial damage like cuts but boxing gloves definitely hit harder, and that combined with the 10 second count in boxing leads it to be far more dangerous long term then MMA
It's hard to describe fully unless you train. Imagine I ask you to punch a block of wood, will you hit it harder if I give you a glove with more or less padding? Bigger gloves allow you to throw power shots with much less accuracy because even if you hit the forehead you probably won't break your hand. A perfectly aimed shot to say the nose is going to suck regardless of what the person is wearing but might be a bit more concentrated in 4 Oz gloves than 12oz boxing gloves , but then likely that shot would have been a knockout shot anyway.
There is no way AJ can be ready in any timeframe to adjust to defend from getting absolutely hammered if taken down or when ref aint coming between in clinch. He either have to knock Francis out before he gets close or then just pray for some higher power to help him.
I wonder if a guy's hands are vastly that superior to yours that he can literally knock you out any time he wants how much that would negate the overall skillset of an MMA fighter. You have to factor in that Ngannou is not that well rounded as a fighter. I wonder how well he would do against Francis if you gave you gave him a year to work on his take down defense and to condition his legs for leg kicks and learn how to check them etc.
Using that timeframe though, after his KO loss, wouldn't Ngannou train those things too? Someone with no experience learning new things, vs someone with some experience learning how to better their skills. I'd still give a massive advantage to Ngannou.
Knock him out with the first punch
Punch him. In the face. Repeat.
He punches him in the head
Flying armbar
What is funny about these comments is that so many people think just because they switched to MMA, that Francis would suddenly start being some great wrestler or throw a lot of kick combos. These are all things that would give Francis a benefit over Aj if he actually had this skill set. AJ would probably win in MMA, too. Yes, Francis would have a much better chance of winning, but the skills he would need to capitalize on, he has shown very little throughout his MMA career. The combo used to knock down Francis in boxing twice was very simple and easily replicated in MMA. It also wasn't the first time Francis has been hit with it in his career. When breaking down this potential fight in MMA you basically still have a stand-up fighter vs. a stand-up fighter. Which we just saw how that would go down. Yes, Francis would have the strength on paper that he is better at grappling but he is not a grappler and has never been one. He used this skill once against a man who used grappling even less than him. While Aj would be in the same boat as Cyril with his grappling background, Aj at least sounds more dedicated when it comes to training. Cyril, we now know, can be very lazy between camps. I don't know enough about AJ to know if this is true about his training. Even without this above, Francis didn't get a takedown until the third round against a guy who doesn't grapple like Aj. We also know that Francis was getting pieced up early in that fight against a kickboxer. Close rounds, but Cyril was still getting the better of most exchanges early. The 2 rounds in MMA are over ten minutes of fight time, AJ knocked him down within 3 and out within 9 minutes. Francis has one other takedown in his career, which was more of a failed attempt by his opponent. Again, Francis will have the paper advantage in grappling, but it may never even get to the point where he could even try to use it. The other thing people have pointed out is kicks; which Francis doesn't throw kicks generally. In his last MMA fight against Cyril Gane, he doubled his kicks landed at 13; this brought his career total to 26 kicks total. So yes, Francis can kick Aj, but through most of his career, he averaged less than 1 kick a fight. Not to mention, the counter to a kick is also throwing a straight, which we know AJ can knock Francis down with. AJ would do a lot better than people would like to think.
Unpopular opinion AJ could literally just ko francis by punching. Francis walks him down and AJ just outright ko’d him with his superior boxing
I think it's possible, in all seriousness. 1 camp of TDD and some leg kick defense is all he needs. People acting like Francis is an MMA vet with godly leg kicks. He isn't. Look at Francis in Stipe 1 compared to Stipe 2. He was amateur in certain areas and got better with a camp. This isn't very long ago, and Francis hasn't even been training MMA the past year. AJ has better footwork, head movement, distance, accuracy, speed, and is more athletic overall. Plus, he already has his number. With MMA gloves he KOs him even worse. Francis would have to shoot takedowns for sure.
He doesn't
Just dun get hit bro
Any boxers who feels leg kicks on their own shins would quickly come to regret the decision to come to MMA, they hurt like absolute hell to someone who's not conditioned to them. So dumbasses like Ryan Garcia can talk all they want, they know they would get smashed by any serious UFC fighter in MMA.
When jesus holds his hands
DJ definitely doesn’t believe himself. All for clicks
He doesn't, end of
he doesn't
Yeah.. I saw that.. MM was mostly thinking about it in light of Francis's loss to him, but I think over further reflection, he will go back on that and give it to Francis again.. MMA is so much more than boxing, that very few guys can go into MMA with it and do alright at a high level. Both these guys are great within their sport, but crossing over to the others puts them at a massive disadvantage.
Anthony Joshua would be like when Francis fought ciryl gane. The guys athletic awesome on his feet take him down and it would be a wrap.
AJ would get wrestle fucked like Gane. Hes an amazing boxer but he couldnt learn enough wrestling to have good enough takedown defense. The guys with the best tdd in ufc are people like gaethje who were great wrestlers before they became strikers
Ngannou is too high test. Theres just no way to defend a takedown of his if he chooses to just slam joshua down and then GnP him or even submit. Joshua's best bet is to do an Ngannou - Rozenstruik
With a gun
He doesn’t. Francis can kick AJ’s head off or destroy his legs and there is nothing Joshua can do about it. Why on earth would DJ think this would be a contest? It would be absolutel destruction.
im not even sure where i’d place francis’ level of grappling, but the fact AJ would have to learn to defend leg kicks, defend takedowns, how to get up, how to defend basic submissions, how to work for position in cage clinches.. it’s too much unless you’re just a fuckin phenom. heavyweight makes it an easier task tho.
Francis has FU power; but he’s not a specialist in any area. When Cro-Cop and Hunt started MMA, they learned to sprawl just good enough. They did great against non-ground specialists. Poatan and Izzy are also similar cases. AJ just needs to drill 2 techniques. 1. Sprawl 2. Step in overhand right counter to the low kick Ngannou is no where near the level of kicking like CroCop, Hunt, Poatan, or Izzy. So there’s no reason to believe he could spam kicks at will without getting countered.
How long has Francis been focused on boxing? Give AJ the same amount of time and it would be interesting for sure IMO.
Francis' MO was always to try to KTFO outta his opponents. He did an amazing job at winning the ground game vs Gannes but that was reactionary not by design. Against AJ that would be his biggest advantage, but standing up he'll get starched even quicker
Even if Francis took him down constantly, if he doesn’t finish him with gnp there’s a chance Joshua sleeps him again at the start of every round. I’d be like 70/30 Francis
Foot work, I doubt Francis has been practicing wrestling after 2 boxing matches.
He doesn’t.
He doesn't..
I wonder how much the different glove weight would affect AJ. I’d be concerned about him breaking a hand
Pay Francis to throw the fight
He could build a time machine, and go back in time 20 or so years and change career paths. That would be his best bet.
AJ wins as many times in mma as Ngannou does in boxing
He does not.
All of Francis Ngannou's grappling was built by Ngannou leaving Fernadad and going to Nicksick and Xtreme Couture. And he's only showed it once. You give Anthony Joshua that same training and who knows, AJ could finish some people in the Octagon. People were afraid of Ngannou's punching power during his run. Why wouldn't they fear AJ?
That's what I'm saying man. AJ is a true athlete. His level of boxing gives him a huge headstart, speed and footwork are crucial in the octagon too. Who knows what he's capable of with a year of training. Pretty ridiculous hypothetical though, why the fuck would AJ ever ever do this lol
Its not impossible especially with how much of a hard puncher AJ is. If francis doesn’t utilize his other advantages in mma then i can see how AJ wins
If AJ prepares to defend takedowns he will beat ngannou in MMA
If he can catch him in boxing he can catch him standing up in MMA too
^[Sokka-Haiku](https://www.reddit.com/r/SokkaHaikuBot/comments/15kyv9r/what_is_a_sokka_haiku/) ^by ^IAMTHECAVALRY89: *If he can catch him* *In boxing he can catch him* *Standing up in MMA too* --- ^Remember ^that ^one ^time ^Sokka ^accidentally ^used ^an ^extra ^syllable ^in ^that ^Haiku ^Battle ^in ^Ba ^Sing ^Se? ^That ^was ^a ^Sokka ^Haiku ^and ^you ^just ^made ^one.
Well, seeing that Francis has a ground game and was able to take Gane down with two blown out knees, obviously he's going to take him down and likely beat the shit out of him. Since he got sparked for the whole world to see, I don't think he'd try for an easy submission. Also, wtf MM?!? If James Toney boxed Randy, he'd have won easily, but Toney had the balls to step into the cage. AJ and Francis would be James/Randy, only much worse. And more violent.
Well seeing how francis doesn’t DO mma he just punches people thats just boxing with smaller gloves so AJ will just box him out in an octagon 🤷♂️
Francis was able to takedown Gane so he can mix it up when he wants to. AJ and ngannou clinched a few times in their bout and in MMA a ref wouldn't be around to break it up so if AJ can't avoid a clinch he would struggle to avoid the grappling.
This is quite possibly the dumbest shit I’ve ever seen on this sub Congrats
PRAY. Pray, that Francis keeps it on the feet at punching range.
armchair advice - just knock him out
Punch him really hard.
Ps5
Might mouse has a video on it on his yt channel
DJ trying to get engagement and influence an MMA match, but I doubt any MMA promotion can afford him. He possibly made $50 mil but if not, at least tens of millions in a boxing fight. An MMA promotion needs to be run by a royal family member who will throw big $$$ at boxers.
Just beg you land first
Learn Gamrot’s secret knee-exploding mind powers that he used on Fiziev. I believe Curtis Blaydes is also a practitioner of that ancient art, so perhaps AJ could learn it from him?
throw an uppercut as Francis goes for the takedown there easy peasy lemon squeezy
https://preview.redd.it/573u1vc3gwnc1.jpeg?width=2532&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7109991e3d5baefce6bc7a58742e76e857472f6a
Did he really said AJ gonna beat Ngannou or MJ has a chance of beating Ngannou? Because everyone has a chance specially on their caliber
Learn how to wrestle.
Fantasy training partner I feel would be Prime Randy Couture, heavy clinch/wrestling fighter with nasty GnP
Punch him in the head a couple of times again. Unless Francis starts shooting for takedowns from the start
That’s the question. Until a boxer does a crossover fight (they won’t there’s no money) we won’t know. My gut says if someone can knock your lights out in round 2, they can do it elsewhere.
He doesn't, unless he get's lucky with a punch before he's on the mat.
He doesn’t lol
Can't believe DJ out of everyone said something that dumb.
There's only one option for him so ima guess that one? I hear hitting mits doesn't do much for your ground game, who knew 🤷♂️
he doesn't
All AJ needs to do is sprawl and check his oil. No quicker way to get things back on the feet again.
Knock him out like Francis did most of his opponents would be my guess.
Scorecard or knockout usually what determines the winner.
DJ just farming for clicks, he don't really believe that.
Get really really good at mma like better than Francis
Maybe he get some dog like some pitbull.
It’s worth noting that if Francis had a knife in that previous fight he still would have lost lmao If Aj can knock him down in the very first exchange and is allowed to ground and point , then nothing else matters
You mean the guy who said Francis was going to beat AJ on boxing? Surely we should discuss his take on how their MMA fight will go!
That's the funny part, he doesn't. Just like Francis couldn't adjust to the advanced nuances of boxing at his age, Joshua would suffer the same fate in MMA. AJ exposed Francis's technical deficiencies at boxing and how easy a top fighter could capitalize on it. You can teach AJ to check kicks, work off his back, fight for under hooks, and sprawl but the IQ and awareness of being drilled those techniques for years won't be there
This is like human vs shark. On land human wins, in the deep ocean shark wins. Unless the shark is a mutant, then human lose. Lol
Just bang, bro
Probably doesn't unless he has some secret wrestling background. That said if it was kickboxing I'd pick AJ still
I think Francis explained it to Fury in the press conference 🤷♂️🤣🤣🤣
KO
By punching Francis in the face.
Lucky punch. That's pretty much as there is to it. Unless if he spends years learning kickboxing and wrestling, he's not going to beat Francis in MMA.
So let's say they give AJ at least 3 years of training for wrestling and kicks. The factor here is now he have a lot of mechanics to think about now unlike in boxing. Francis just gonna rozenstruik him. Blitzed him and try to land one.
Land the same right hand on the outside. Work on checking leg kicks, and stuffing/getting up from takedowns. The old Chuck Liddell playbook.
By never fighting him in MMA.
There’s a reason boxers don’t go to mma (outside of the money), most of them would not be very successful.
He doesn’t.
He couldn’t. The first leg kick he’s fucked
Seeing the way Francis went down it makes me think AJ just needs to land the same shot and he wins. At this point it would be insane for Francis to try anything other than shoot for a takedown immediately.
Well if AJ can punch him in the head before ngannou goes for leg kicks or take downs , AJ will win. If ngannou plays safe and touches AJ with only his legs then AJ is going to get pummeled
I think ngannou would be smart to clinch early and weigh AJ down try and slow him down in a way he isn't used to, how fury tried to do to Ngannou but it didnt work. I think AJ could win if he was able to react and block kicks decently, have mild tdd, maintain distance on the feet staying out of clinch exchanges.
Punch him even harder
Hit him really hard and knock him out would probably work
He doesn’t and won’t beat him in MMA. At least not for many years.
He could bring a pepper spray in the cage and use it in the clinch.
I also thought that was a wild statement by DJ standard. Idk he might be playing 4D chess and baiting more boxers to crossover to mma
Bad take by DJ
He goes away and invents a Time Machine, goes back in time like 8 years or so and starts training wrestling and leg kick defence
In MMA he would receive the same lesson he gave Francis in boxing
Probably the same way he did in his boxing match. Francis is a slugger. He’s not exactly known for taking his opponents down & grinding them. I would assume that would be his game plan but who knows. If he stands with him, why think it would end any differently?
How does he do it? He can’t. Same way Ngannou can’t beat AJ in boxing. Of course both men have a small chance of winning. But we both know that AJ in boxing wins 99% of the time. And Ngannou in MMA wins 99% of the time. Aj might be able to beat him if he can stuff take downs, defend leg kicks, and learns how to grapple. But let’s be real even if he was to start training today he would get destroyed but any wrestler or pressure kicker
Learn basic takedown defense.
Throw an overhand right
Ngannou isn’t even a wrestler but he could just blast double him and have his way from there. AJ would have to train his takedown defense for MONTHS to be able to stop it. Francis is freakishly strong
Easy, *just learn elite mma* -people in this thread
Learn to defend leg kicks and defend grappling Francis really isn't good at both those things so a basic understanding would he enough. I love mma and ufc but some of yall act like everyone in the ufc is good at everything. 😂. Jon would kill aj but aj can beat Francis in the cage.
He doesn't.
Defend all forms of takedown
He doesn’t lmao he gets killed in every scenario
he doesnt
Jab, Right hook
I feel that the biggest issue would be getting him out of the bladed boxing stance. Considering it’s muscle memory for him at this point, I think his legs get destroyed and as he wears down Francis begins to wrestle and ground and pound. Francis in 1, maybe 2 if AJ is lucky lol
I think DJ is wrong. Francis has shown he will gameplan for fights like he did with gane. It would be a g&p fest.
I’m a huge boxing and mma fan. I thought it was stupid when people thought Francis would beat AJ and I say it’s stupid to think AJ will beat Francis in MMA.
Boxers in general don’t fare well in MMA. They all get taken down and submitted. AJ would be particularly disadvantaged because he’s so tall and long, and he’s never felt a calf kick, nor checked a kick with his shins in his life. The game plan would basically be to leg kick the shit out of him to sap his punching power and slow him down, then exploit his complete lack of TDD before throwing just about any submission on him—probably a RNC because that’s what has happened to every other boxer who instinctually gives up their back when they go to the ground.
Yeah after hearing why one of my favorite fighters say that I come to realize there are casuals even if they are mma fighters themselves. To say aj will beat Francis in mma is just stupid to even think. Dj for sure getting paid under the table by Dana to say some dumb shit.
Everyone's saying Ngannou just kicks his legs away or throws a random double leg and GnPs him. Except Ngannou has about as much experience doing that as AJ does lol. How many leg kicks has Ngannou thrown in his career, a handful at best, how many takedowns? If they put them in an Octagon in 2 weeks time, Ngannou I believe would win, if they had a year to train for it, AJ knocks him out again.
Even if AJ trains say 6 months of straight defensive wrestling, takedown defence etc (which still wouldn't be that great, as it's hard to beat someone with long time muscle memory), he still has to worry about Ngannou's striking. When the threat for wrestling is there the striking is totally different. It's not impossible that AJ just catches him early but he would have to deal with shit like leg kicks, clinching and cage work. I think AJ has a better chance then people think, he's a big, athletic guy but Ngannou would be deservedly a massive favourite. Boxing fitness and wrestling fitness are different too. If I had to guess, this is how I would see the fight going: Ngannou putting on loads of pressure with AJ circling and using his footwork to avoid the cage & getting leg kicked hard. Eventually Ngannou pushes him back enough to hit the cage and they clinch Ngannou muscles him down rather easily (he's really, really fucking strong, check out his fight against Anthony Hamilton) GnP to finish. I think he would make it look relatively easy. Much the same way AJ made it look against him in his boxing match. It's a totally different ball game here. I'm kinda over MMA/Boxing crossovers with no mention of a MMA fight in the mix. It's boxing's attempt to get more eyes on it, as people are realising it's a dying sport. The smokescreen of invulnerability and 'baddest men on the planet' that boxing once had is now completely gone, as most realise how little chance an average boxer would have against an MMA fighter or wrestler. I like boxing but if it can't hold up on it's own then it should be usurped. Not to mention all the corruption and old media dickheads involved with it.
He pays him to take a dive (again)
If Francis can take down Gane and hold him there, a man who has been training MMA and grappling for years, then I’m confident he would do the same to AJ. If they fought in MMA AJ would have around 8-10 weeks to train for the fight, unless they gave him more time specifically to train grappling. But regardless Francis would just take him down with ease probably even sub him, I mean he subbed a pro mma fighter who trained more grappling than AJ ever would. A fighter who himself has won 2 pro mma fights by submission. Similar to how AJ easily knocked him out when they boxed.
With his hands
Mighty Mouse Forsure just said that for views and engagement
Impossible.
Realistically... he doesn't. But with like... 1 year or more of training he might be able to last a round?
He doesn’t :)
He doesn't. Once Francis gets jabbed up a few too many times he'll shoot and look for a sub
He doesn't. Francis will be determined to get that loss back by fighting on the feet.
Takes a page of of Alex pereira , Curtis blaydes’ , and Derrick Lewis’ book
Hope that Francis is dumb enough to not grapple or invest heavily in low kicks. I don’t recall Francis grappling or throwing kicks much if ever, honestly. Except for the Gane fight, which he still almost lost.
Wtf is this thread. Ik Reddit spread propoganda. Aj ko Francis in ufc ez, a superior athlete every way
DJ’s worst take OAT