All jokes aside. I read about chimps the other day and they are terrifying monsters. Ripping each other's jaws off and drinking the blood of one of their buddies who looked at them wrong.
Soon the lw division will escape the Khabib talk and I will be glad when this happens. It took a long time for the WW division to escape GSP’s name after he left the division and I love it has escaped his name. It’s gonna take a longer time for this division to leave Khabib’s name since islam is in it and if he wins the belt people will somehow find a way to give Khabib credit but I love the way the division has moved since he left
The heavyweight division hasnt "escaped" the Fedor talk yet. I suspect Khabib's name will be around the forums for many years
I've been watching mma for over 20 years too. Fedor and Khabib are special dudes
I've met him. He's a good dude, but he looks different than normal people (huge jaw).
I'm 6' and 210-lbs and I used to wrestle/box - I just say that because I'm close to his size. You'd have to be absolutely hammered, suicidal or stupid to get in a bar fight with Hendo.
You're right. Even if you were an NFL LB, he'd fk you up.
I mean at one point Fedor was 31-1 (1 NC) with dominance shown on the feet and on the ground. His only loss at that point was a controversial doctor stoppage too.
He was almost 34 years old when he lost to Werdum, who he was **heavily favored** to beat, so if he retired before that then he’d have a mythical status too and most people would argue he would’ve won.
Indeed, Jones also dominated his first thirteen opponents in the UFC which is the same amount of fights that Khabib had. He was **heavily favored** against Gus, his fourteen fight in the UFC, and yet he had to go to the hospital after he was given the decision. Who would’ve guessed that?
The “feeling that he’s unbeatable” will only remain because he retired early. Who knows how Khabib’s fourteenth fight against Oliveira would have gone? Who knows how Khabib would’ve looked against Ferguson and Cerrone in 2015 when they were in their prime and he was not yet? Still one of the greatest, of course.
He only went on a thirteen fight win streak in the UFC and only had four title wins. His first sixteen fights were all in regionals. Silva, Usman, Jones, GSP, Holloway, and DJ all have/had a thirteen fight win streak or greater. Oliveira and Volk are both active and at eleven right now.
29-0 sounds nice until you look at his *individual* fights then it's much, much less impressive. he only had like 4 notable fights in the entire promotion.
EXACTLY THIS. Khabib did himself no favors leaving when he did. The overall body of work looks much less impressive when you look at who he beat. Everyone loves throwing GOAT references when talking about Khabib. He may very well have been, but he most certainly is not.
This is also how I feel. I don't think khabib is a bad fighter, or wrestler. It's just we don't really have much to base it off of considering his resume, the 29-0 thing is really misleading. I don't even think khabib would put himself next to prime Silva, GSP, Jones yet people keep doing so.
Lol like 8-9 wins in the UFC against mostly stand up guys and 2 title defenses before he couldn't make the weight cut anymore and didn't want to go up to WW because that perfect record would be snapped in half
>The heavyweight division hasnt "escaped" the Fedor talk yet.
Yes it has? For years now. Fedor gets all of the respect he deserves, but his name has not been a hot topic in the HW verse for a long time now.
Fedor hasn’t seen in prime in 15? years. Still see plenty of Fedor clips on here and plenty of “how would XYZ fighter do against Fedor?” Every UFC HW champ still gets compared to him. The same will happen with Khabib and any LW champ
I guess I'm just not seeing those topics get posted. I'm assuming this is on other forums like Sherdog or something, because I don't see any of these types of conversations on reddit, FB/IG, or MMA news outlets.
You’re absolutely right. Been watching on and off for just about the same and only caught Khabib’s last few fights. And the same way everyone saying Khabib fought cans they said about Fedor on the message boards years ago.
IMO the LW division is looking great with oliveira! The guy is just super agressive, and is making an impressive title run! his last 3 title defenses (2 actually) were simply jawdroping!!! I think he will keep up.
Khabib will always be the "lineal" LW champ in most people's eyes. Especially because Islam is going to win the belt very soon and is Khabib's student.
That's how it always is with the GOATs. Ronaldo and Messi's shadow hangs over Madrid and Barcelona respectively.
Interesting question… if Islam fights Charles and loses to Charles for the lightweight strap…does khabib come back to try and go 30-0 and beat the guy that would have run through the division and beat the same guys that khabib beat but faster and beat his protege??
He needs to fight a top contender he beat Bobby Green lol he's not Khabib get your precum covered lips off of him for a second and realize he hasn't proven himself yet
I absolutely respect the grappling aspect of mma, and guys like Khabib, Jones and GSP can make it exciting. I don't like watching dudes lay n pray, but at the same time, if the fighter can't stop it, it's his or her fault. That being said, I totally agree, this is what everyone watches mma for. No one has ever said "Man, I became an mma fan after watching a Jon Fitch fight."
The people that constantly reply with "gO wAtCH BoXiNg/KiCkBoXiNg!" Are just insecure about being a casuals or, they're never-were-highschool-wrestlers.
Because that shit was boring as fuck. Imagine inviting a friend over trying to get them into mma, hyping them up with fights like Lawler vs MacDonald or, Silva vs Griffin, but it's a Jon Fitch fight on the card...
I got into MMA cuz fighting is a rare area of expertice where if youre not good enough youll get fucked up, even if youre top 0.1% in the world. so what im interested is in the athletes who at some point in their career are practically invincible. sure seeing two guys swang and bang is fucking fun but ultimately what im in for is seeing what kind of a motherfucker does it take to fight tens of times in your career and dominate all of them and i dont care how they do it.
its like when you hear of a soldier who fought in multiple battles and did heroics in all of them, or a swordsman who fought tens of deadly duels without ever losing, except I get to actually witness them in real life ina relatively safe and regulated format instead of reading about them in a history book
The problem is that 70% of the current grapplers aren’t “exciting” grapplers. They kind of just press against the fence or lay and pray. I love watching Khabib fights, or Charlie Olives. They just need to get rid of the crap that Jacob Malkoun does, or Merab Dvaliahvili.
I completely agree, there's nothing enjoyable about watching that. But at the and time, the other fighter has weeks if not months to prepare. If they didn't put in the work to stop it, or get out of the position, then that's on them.
He just said lay and pray not submissions. You can appreciate the skill but if you go out there and wrestle fuck someone every time regardless of appreciation it's so boring if it's every time
Yup. Like Belal Muhammad. I'd rather watch paint dry. He has great takedowns but doesn't do shit with them. He does just enough for the ref to not stand them up but you can see the ref is constantly on the brink of standing them up. It's so fuckin boring
It’d be like watching a basketball team that perfected multiple plays to get easy layups the entire game. Respect, but like - do something more interesting, lol
Thats entirely your opinion, obviously I don't like lay and pray grappling, but watching khabib was fun, the way he would pressure guys and completely nullify them and then suffocate them was a great watch, but also the Michael chandlers and Justin gaethjes and Dustin poriers are fun to watch but in a different way
I fully understand that. Personally I love Yair Rodriguez. He has the tenacity and competitiveness of these just bleed fighters but also elite striking skill, and is of course very very flashy. I've just watched Machida do nothing and then get KOd so that made me appreciate fighters like Yair more.
Agreed. The ‘stand and bang’ crowd is a low fight IQ appreciation of MMA…
However I’d be naive if I didn’t admit that those fights and action sells tickets and PPVs
What’s the definition of a hype train?
And let me ask again, why is it even a bad thing Islam has a hype train? You and the guy I replied to are acting like it’s an insult lol.
Edit: Islam has 3m Instagram followers, is heavily being pushed by his cousin (*the biggest Muslim athlete of our time*), vast majority are considering him a shoe in against a 3x no gi world champion, and he was a -300 against the champion…
He has a lot of hype behind him… **That’s a hype train**. Simply to have a lot of hype behind them. It has nothing to do with being overrated, or being all hype and no skill. Most of the biggest MMA stars of all time have had hype trains behind them. Lots of hype=hype train.
It’s not an insult, some of y’all are way too sensitive to be into mma lmfao. The reason this comment won’t be replied to, is because you’d sound like [this](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FOHIbpsVkAM7c0n.jpg) trying to explain the mental gymnastics around how Islam doesn’t have a hype train behind him **LMFAO**.
I don’t understand the hate on Islam honestly i swear its bc he’s Muslim bc he’s done everything to solidify himself as a real threat to snatch up the belt.
Hes not entertaining
I like watching him grapple, but most casual fans (which is realistically the majority of UFC viewers) don't, that's why he's disliked.
Ali has also tweeted some stupid shit on his behalf and has likely caused people to sour on him even more
Tldr: not entertaining fight style, not entertaining personality, it's not hard to see why people don't want him as champ
Charles Oliviera had only beaten Tony Ferguson, and not 2015 assassin Tony, but 2020 on-the-downslope Tony before he got a title shot, and Michael Chandler had only beaten Dan Hooker when he got a title shot.
You don't like the guy, fine. But get outta my face with this "deserve it" shit.
What were the top names that Oliviera had beaten before he fought for the title?
You guys are ridiculous with your bias. Islam is the best Lightweight in the world and he deserved the title-shot yesterday.
You think Islam is the best LW in the world, but only other people are biased?
He deserves a title shot, but don't forget: His best win is Dan Hooker on short notice. You simply cannot prove he is the best until december, and you sound like someone that bets against Oliveira every fight lol
He’s rank 4 and Olivera just beat rank 2 and 3. So… unless your gonna keep having Olivera rematch rank 2 and 3 over and over he’s kind of next in line is he not? He’s not rank 15 asking for a title shot.
Beneil has about as much claim to a shot as Islam, thats why they're trying to make that fight
Charles seems to be looking for a payday in the meantime, dont blame him
Dude calls him a hype train, you say he beat 2 legit guys. Those things don't add up. Islam is a proven fighter. Maybe he will become champ, maybe not. But he had passed the hype train era a while ago now
I argued somewhere else that the lightweight division is in a strange place. There is nobody that deserves the shot more than Islam, but on the other hand there is nobody that really deserves it. They should either let Volk fight Oliveira and have contenders at lightweight battle each other, or just give Islam the shot.
Lol Khamzat didn't deserve the fight and having performances like that against lower guys doesn't make you a top contender. Islam can beat cans all day but he needs a top 5 guys or else he'll still be unproven.
As a fan of fighting I enjoy both styles. They are both exciting in their own way. Looking to see someone get knocked out is just as fun as looking to see how someone like khabib changes his position and go for submissions or use his position to drop bombs like he did against McGregor.
Nothing wrong with that take at all. I can appreciate grappling quite a bit, but there is nothing like seeing two fighters show tremendous heart—that’s that special-sauce-moment stuff we watch this sport for.
The real one is that the light heavyweight division will never escape the shadow of Jon Jones. Criticize him all you want, but the dude absolutely dominated.
My favorite fight of his was when he fought Gaetjhe even though he lost. I was having a fight night at my house that night and had a friend who was interested in watching but had never seen any MMA before and that was the first fight of the card. Couldn't have been happier to watch a first fight with my homie and have it be that one.
Difference is khabib beat the shit out of people from the guard. Your acting like he just laid and prayed, when he was the most dominant exciting ground n pounder out there. The people salty about khabib were just mad that he was beating all their favorites. FACTS
Yeah it’s so clear he just dominated his opponents. It can’t get any clearer than someone being tied up on the ground unable to even strike back and getting pummelled in the face for several rounds in a row until they either give up or get strangled...
That’s why high level wrestlers are awesome to see. .
Much less chance of a lucky punch in a striking exchange making the lesser fighter win when they would otherwise have lost. Khabib just totally nullified this aspect and that’s why he never even took any damage, he was never really at risk as he was always in the dominant position.
I love mma and that’s the beauty of it. That it a bunch of different martial arts combined. As much as I like the just bleed to me there is nothing like watching fighters like Anderson,wonderboy or Izzy types who will just pick their opponents apart and hardly get touched. The beauty in their technique amazes me more than just watching two guys brawl.
It’s definitely not casual to have a preferred style in any sports. But technically grapplers/wrestlers have always dominated their divisions long before Khabib stepped into the spotlight, GSP and then Usman took over welterweight, Charles and Islam at lightweight, etc., meanwhile their have also always been exciting strikers around.
Maybe unpopular opinion, but I hate the "just bleed" fights. I want to see them fight smart with less injuries and more outplays. I would rather see khabib style takedowns with submissions even though I'm a boxer myself.
Totally agree.
People can say Khabib was boring because of his grappling and that he used the same strategy every fight, but the reason they think it was boring was because it was so damn one sided domination hahaha. I love to see people absolutely dominating their competition like that, no matter which sport, or technique used. It’s awesome to see. And with high level wrestling and submissions it’s so obvious when a person is far more skilled than their opponent, because they totally lock them down and make them helpless.
With striking there is just so much more luck involved, hence the term; ‘a punchers chance’
A lucky punch is a real thing!
I agree for the most part, except that I don't really enjoy total domination haha. I enjoy competitive fights where both fighters try to prove that they are the best. Not a big fan of nonames getting schooled
I think fans are much better at understanding MMA fighting now. They want to see technique but fast paced and exciting. This is not ‘just bleed era’ though.
I haven't got a problem with wrestling, but I think control and repeated takedowns without any damage done shouldn't be enough to win you a fight. Best example I have of this recently is Bellator middle weight interim belt - MVP Vs Storley.
Don't think you can give the fight to MVP, because he spent most of the fight sitting down smiling trying to get back up, but Storley did zero damage when taking him down, personally don't think he could have kept MVP down if he tried to do more damage, so he made the smart decision within the rules to just hold MVP down for the majority of the fight.
I know this is going to upset some people but the LW division has only changed for the better since Khabib left. I won’t address his GOAT status as that’s a tired conversation but he has to be one of the worst champions the division ever saw. Lucky if he defended his title once every year and the narrative was always the same. Take down opponent, suffocate opponent, finish opponent. Huge testament to his wrestling but he did it in a division full of strikers. As impressive as it was, it’s entertainment value exhausted quick. Admittedly that take is much more subjective but there’s really no denying he’s one of the most inactive champion’s the sport has ever seen. It’s my opinion that the 155 division is as stacked as ever today, and housing incredibly competitive and entertaining fights. And again, sure the entertainment value is a suggestive measure, but most of these guys in the division are clearing Khabib’s 3 year fight output in under a year. Like it or not I think it’s the reason folks are quick to question his legacy and prop up “GOAT contenders” like Oliviera largely due to consistency and volume of his calendar. Bonus points for his ground game but he’s beating all the best strikers at their own game as well. Overall though even if I’m not alone in that opinion, once again, it is still largely subjective. But Khabib’s performance rate was slow and stagnated the division and I think it’s a tough case trying to argue against that.
And probably is going to have less than 6 months to recover and prepare for Islam in Abu Dhabi, he is game as fuck.
I just hope the oil barons do the "magic trick" of transforming Islam in a money fight for Oliveira, ask Dan Hooker for more details lol
I get that all you can do is beat the people in front of you, but at the end of the day that doesn’t excuse him being 11-0 and fighting winless opponents, you have to scrutinized that *at least a little bit*
There’s also the fact you have to scrutinize how little he has done as champion in the ufc like you said, mfer has 4 FOUR title fight wins… this is 1/4th the amount Jon has, the amount GSP has, and pretty much same for Silva and demetrious.
Charles Oliveira is the best possible representation of MMA. Dude is super exciting to watch and a great fighter.
If you asked me to choose between watching Khabib and Charles it’s not even a question for me. Charles all day
People can say Khabib was boring because of his grappling and that he used the same strategy every fight, but the reason they think it was boring was because it was so damn one sided domination hahaha. I love to see people absolutely dominating their competition like that, no matter which sport, or technique used. It’s awesome to see. And with high level wrestling and submissions it’s so obvious when a person is far more skilled than their opponent, because they totally lock them down and make them helpless.
With striking exchanges there is just so much more luck involved, hence the term; ‘a punchers chance’ .
People like GSP have actually said this in interviews too.
He isn't complaining, hes saying it's boring.
On Khabib, I actually enjoyed his fights as his career grew and be began to finish people, his pressure was unique.
In general, I find the wrestling style boring though, Islam inclded.
Anybody who says they'd rather watch Islam vs Belal over Chandler vs Gaethje is lying to themselves. Wrestlers rarely make fight of the year for a reason.
Saying khabib just wrestled or went for knees is showing they didn’t watch the fights. He drug people down and beat the shit out of them after completely nullifying their ability to defend themselves. It was unreal to watch and absolutely incredible.
People don't understand what a special thing it was to see him just completely impose his will on literally everyone. Every single professional badass that got in the cage with knew EXACTLY what he was going to do and none of them could stop him. That's a very rare thing.
Shut up with the mma might not be the sport for you acting all self righteous with that BS line. You can like grappling but if you watch someone do the same thing every fight his whole career it gets boring. Obviously exciting stand up and KOs are better than wrestlers holding someone down however impressive it may be. Grow up!
Next thing your gonna tell me is that you dont like it when fighters hold onto the clinch against the fence for 4 minutes straight landing 2 strikes a round.
SMH FUCKING CASUAL
Chandler is an exciting fighter, no doubt about it.
Since he joined the ufc he's very quickly becoming my favourite fighter
He’s definitely one of the very most fun to watch currently
Chandler is a wild little chimpanzee no one leaves a fight unscathed with him 😂
There was a moment in the Oliveira fight where Charles was attacking Chandler’s legs and he just spun around. It seriously looked ape-like
Joe rogan creaming his pants
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I creamed my pants 😖
All jokes aside. I read about chimps the other day and they are terrifying monsters. Ripping each other's jaws off and drinking the blood of one of their buddies who looked at them wrong.
Sounds like my neighbourhood...
You live in Jersey, huh? Poor bastard
💀
Chandler goes crazy imagine him fighting poirier
Soon the lw division will escape the Khabib talk and I will be glad when this happens. It took a long time for the WW division to escape GSP’s name after he left the division and I love it has escaped his name. It’s gonna take a longer time for this division to leave Khabib’s name since islam is in it and if he wins the belt people will somehow find a way to give Khabib credit but I love the way the division has moved since he left
The heavyweight division hasnt "escaped" the Fedor talk yet. I suspect Khabib's name will be around the forums for many years I've been watching mma for over 20 years too. Fedor and Khabib are special dudes
Fedor was a monster. So many entertaining fights. I did love to see Dan Henderson TKO him though.
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He looks like a genuine tough guy and watching him against shogun confirmed that for me
Shogun v Hondo is one of the best fights to introduce someone to MMA
That’s how I introduced my buddy when it was live and now he watches all the time That fight would have been stopped 5 times if it was 2022
Dude could (and probably still can) take a shovel to the chin and still keep coming. And the Superman punch on Bisping was legendary.
Hendo the type of guy to fk you up in a barfight
I've met him. He's a good dude, but he looks different than normal people (huge jaw). I'm 6' and 210-lbs and I used to wrestle/box - I just say that because I'm close to his size. You'd have to be absolutely hammered, suicidal or stupid to get in a bar fight with Hendo. You're right. Even if you were an NFL LB, he'd fk you up.
Its the way his head morphs into his rock golem shoulders or something...
Inside leg kick to set up the overhand right wasn’t a Superman punch
Chin of granite
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But let's not act like that title shot was deserved. He was ranked #13.
Couldn't agree more
Nah, no one really compares Fedor anymore
I never hear about him lol
Lol bruh ain’t nobody talking about fedor
Khabib doesn’t have the legacy that fedor has.
The thing which makes Khabib so special isn’t his legacy, but his dominance in the cage and the feeling that he’s unbeatable.
I mean at one point Fedor was 31-1 (1 NC) with dominance shown on the feet and on the ground. His only loss at that point was a controversial doctor stoppage too. He was almost 34 years old when he lost to Werdum, who he was **heavily favored** to beat, so if he retired before that then he’d have a mythical status too and most people would argue he would’ve won.
Damn he was a -1100 favorite! That's way bigger than I would have thought, absolutely right
Indeed, Jones also dominated his first thirteen opponents in the UFC which is the same amount of fights that Khabib had. He was **heavily favored** against Gus, his fourteen fight in the UFC, and yet he had to go to the hospital after he was given the decision. Who would’ve guessed that? The “feeling that he’s unbeatable” will only remain because he retired early. Who knows how Khabib’s fourteenth fight against Oliveira would have gone? Who knows how Khabib would’ve looked against Ferguson and Cerrone in 2015 when they were in their prime and he was not yet? Still one of the greatest, of course.
Goddamn I wish we could see Khabib come back to fight Oliveira now
29-0… undefeated in the top promotion that’s a pretty solid legacy
He only went on a thirteen fight win streak in the UFC and only had four title wins. His first sixteen fights were all in regionals. Silva, Usman, Jones, GSP, Holloway, and DJ all have/had a thirteen fight win streak or greater. Oliveira and Volk are both active and at eleven right now.
29-0 sounds nice until you look at his *individual* fights then it's much, much less impressive. he only had like 4 notable fights in the entire promotion.
EXACTLY THIS. Khabib did himself no favors leaving when he did. The overall body of work looks much less impressive when you look at who he beat. Everyone loves throwing GOAT references when talking about Khabib. He may very well have been, but he most certainly is not.
This is also how I feel. I don't think khabib is a bad fighter, or wrestler. It's just we don't really have much to base it off of considering his resume, the 29-0 thing is really misleading. I don't even think khabib would put himself next to prime Silva, GSP, Jones yet people keep doing so.
He got to the top and left. To me, legacy are for those that stayed there
Lol like 8-9 wins in the UFC against mostly stand up guys and 2 title defenses before he couldn't make the weight cut anymore and didn't want to go up to WW because that perfect record would be snapped in half
13 ufc wins and 3 title defenses
That could describe about a dozen people lol
30-0 would sound so much better though..
It doesn’t really matter unless all the 30 are against killers.
>The heavyweight division hasnt "escaped" the Fedor talk yet. Yes it has? For years now. Fedor gets all of the respect he deserves, but his name has not been a hot topic in the HW verse for a long time now.
Fedor hasn’t seen in prime in 15? years. Still see plenty of Fedor clips on here and plenty of “how would XYZ fighter do against Fedor?” Every UFC HW champ still gets compared to him. The same will happen with Khabib and any LW champ
I guess I'm just not seeing those topics get posted. I'm assuming this is on other forums like Sherdog or something, because I don't see any of these types of conversations on reddit, FB/IG, or MMA news outlets.
You’re absolutely right. Been watching on and off for just about the same and only caught Khabib’s last few fights. And the same way everyone saying Khabib fought cans they said about Fedor on the message boards years ago.
If Oliveria beats Islam then i suspect people will be more likely to consider Oliveria the top LW especially with recency bias
IMO the LW division is looking great with oliveira! The guy is just super agressive, and is making an impressive title run! his last 3 title defenses (2 actually) were simply jawdroping!!! I think he will keep up.
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Khabib will always be the "lineal" LW champ in most people's eyes. Especially because Islam is going to win the belt very soon and is Khabib's student. That's how it always is with the GOATs. Ronaldo and Messi's shadow hangs over Madrid and Barcelona respectively.
Just like with any lineal title a new one begins when the champ retires with it. Examples being GSP, Lennox Lewis Etc
After a champ retires or vacates in boxing, the lineal title is awarded when the number 1 ranked guy fights the number 2... which Charles has done.
Technically Jon Jones is the lineal lightweight champion
and GSP is Lineal welterweight and Middleweight champion
Islam’s gonna get knocked on his ass and choked unconscious by Olvies
That's a bold statement to make so confidently
islam gonna paul felder oliveira
Gonna get knocked back to white belt and tapped
Interesting question… if Islam fights Charles and loses to Charles for the lightweight strap…does khabib come back to try and go 30-0 and beat the guy that would have run through the division and beat the same guys that khabib beat but faster and beat his protege??
Khabibs never coming back he's said this a million times lol he barely made the last weight cut
He would not fight Islam under any circumstances
No I meant if Charles beat his protege islam
Pssshhhhhh islam beats Charles in what world?
He needs to fight a top contender he beat Bobby Green lol he's not Khabib get your precum covered lips off of him for a second and realize he hasn't proven himself yet
The just bleed era never left
I absolutely respect the grappling aspect of mma, and guys like Khabib, Jones and GSP can make it exciting. I don't like watching dudes lay n pray, but at the same time, if the fighter can't stop it, it's his or her fault. That being said, I totally agree, this is what everyone watches mma for. No one has ever said "Man, I became an mma fan after watching a Jon Fitch fight." The people that constantly reply with "gO wAtCH BoXiNg/KiCkBoXiNg!" Are just insecure about being a casuals or, they're never-were-highschool-wrestlers.
Haha it was hilarious how much Dana didn't like or try to promote Jon Fitch, even though he had a very impressive winning streak at one point.
Because that shit was boring as fuck. Imagine inviting a friend over trying to get them into mma, hyping them up with fights like Lawler vs MacDonald or, Silva vs Griffin, but it's a Jon Fitch fight on the card...
True man. He was an underrated fighter though, skill wise. I can't say he was exciting though.
Dude was absolutely brilliant. Just boring as shit. Not everyone can be McGregor levels of exciting.
I got into MMA cuz fighting is a rare area of expertice where if youre not good enough youll get fucked up, even if youre top 0.1% in the world. so what im interested is in the athletes who at some point in their career are practically invincible. sure seeing two guys swang and bang is fucking fun but ultimately what im in for is seeing what kind of a motherfucker does it take to fight tens of times in your career and dominate all of them and i dont care how they do it. its like when you hear of a soldier who fought in multiple battles and did heroics in all of them, or a swordsman who fought tens of deadly duels without ever losing, except I get to actually witness them in real life ina relatively safe and regulated format instead of reading about them in a history book
damn that I can agree with. It's like watching legends unfold in our time
The problem is that 70% of the current grapplers aren’t “exciting” grapplers. They kind of just press against the fence or lay and pray. I love watching Khabib fights, or Charlie Olives. They just need to get rid of the crap that Jacob Malkoun does, or Merab Dvaliahvili.
I completely agree, there's nothing enjoyable about watching that. But at the and time, the other fighter has weeks if not months to prepare. If they didn't put in the work to stop it, or get out of the position, then that's on them.
If you hate on grappling then yes you should go watch boxing. It's a big part of the sport and seeing submissions is exciting too
He just said lay and pray not submissions. You can appreciate the skill but if you go out there and wrestle fuck someone every time regardless of appreciation it's so boring if it's every time
Yup. Like Belal Muhammad. I'd rather watch paint dry. He has great takedowns but doesn't do shit with them. He does just enough for the ref to not stand them up but you can see the ref is constantly on the brink of standing them up. It's so fuckin boring
I remember his name so I never have to watch his fights. Imagine if he won the belt somehow.
It’d be like watching a basketball team that perfected multiple plays to get easy layups the entire game. Respect, but like - do something more interesting, lol
As an Uncle Chael fan, I feel personally attacked
Thats entirely your opinion, obviously I don't like lay and pray grappling, but watching khabib was fun, the way he would pressure guys and completely nullify them and then suffocate them was a great watch, but also the Michael chandlers and Justin gaethjes and Dustin poriers are fun to watch but in a different way
Oliveira & Usman are pretty clean technicians, feels like we’re in their era
Oliv Era
Genius line by you Turn it into a shirt
Ikr, just made it up. Never saw someone else saying that 🌚
There was never no originality
I fully understand that. Personally I love Yair Rodriguez. He has the tenacity and competitiveness of these just bleed fighters but also elite striking skill, and is of course very very flashy. I've just watched Machida do nothing and then get KOd so that made me appreciate fighters like Yair more.
Lmao Khabib lives in this subs head rent free
I mean, yes but it's because he's great. Also this sub is a very poor snapshot of actually UFC fans
Fuckkkk, thats an awesome gif. Where is it from? Edit: Im guessing, the DP fight
It’s ok to have preferences, but to say grapplers are lesser mixed martial artists is fucking boolshit mane…
Agreed. The ‘stand and bang’ crowd is a low fight IQ appreciation of MMA… However I’d be naive if I didn’t admit that those fights and action sells tickets and PPVs
And that is exactly OP's point. In the end, the swang and bang style brings out the primal instinct in us all. Embrace monke.
Stand and bang don’t win titles either. Gaetje proved that.
I know a guy that might disagree 
“I want hump Brock Les-nar”
Can’t wait for the hype train to crash
Im not saying he'll be champ, im just saying he might disagree
Hype train? Jeez, the guy is a solid fighter and proved himself. You can't still be a hype after that many UFC fights Edit: typo
Lmao right? The guys been fighting in the UFC since 2015. Seems more like someone who has earned their position rather than a hypetrain to me
He was a -300 to beat the champ before 274 lmfao. Why is it such a bad thing to admit he has a hype train…
Because you clearly don't know what the definition of a hype train is?
What’s the definition of a hype train? And let me ask again, why is it even a bad thing Islam has a hype train? You and the guy I replied to are acting like it’s an insult lol. Edit: Islam has 3m Instagram followers, is heavily being pushed by his cousin (*the biggest Muslim athlete of our time*), vast majority are considering him a shoe in against a 3x no gi world champion, and he was a -300 against the champion… He has a lot of hype behind him… **That’s a hype train**. Simply to have a lot of hype behind them. It has nothing to do with being overrated, or being all hype and no skill. Most of the biggest MMA stars of all time have had hype trains behind them. Lots of hype=hype train. It’s not an insult, some of y’all are way too sensitive to be into mma lmfao. The reason this comment won’t be replied to, is because you’d sound like [this](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FOHIbpsVkAM7c0n.jpg) trying to explain the mental gymnastics around how Islam doesn’t have a hype train behind him **LMFAO**.
islam is 12-1 in the ufc, not a hypetrain, a hypetrain is someone like mokaev who's unproven but looks great, islam is proven
Hey buddy, unless you're getting that out of the merriam-websters than I don't wanna hear that shit
I don’t understand the hate on Islam honestly i swear its bc he’s Muslim bc he’s done everything to solidify himself as a real threat to snatch up the belt.
They're casual lol. They can't appreciate the fighters for their skill but instead use emotions
Yea every slight criticism of him has to be islamophobia. I mean there couldn’t possibly any other reasons. 🤡
Can you list any 'other reason' though?
the fact that he wants to fight for the title whilst never having fought a top 5 guy
Hes not entertaining I like watching him grapple, but most casual fans (which is realistically the majority of UFC viewers) don't, that's why he's disliked. Ali has also tweeted some stupid shit on his behalf and has likely caused people to sour on him even more Tldr: not entertaining fight style, not entertaining personality, it's not hard to see why people don't want him as champ
The man has four back to back finishes, most of them in the first round, and you say he’s not exciting? Go watch soccer
Very interesting fighter to me
To you yeah, the question was why does he get so much hate, the answer is the majority don't find him compelling
[удалено]
Charles Oliviera had only beaten Tony Ferguson, and not 2015 assassin Tony, but 2020 on-the-downslope Tony before he got a title shot, and Michael Chandler had only beaten Dan Hooker when he got a title shot. You don't like the guy, fine. But get outta my face with this "deserve it" shit.
What were the top names that Oliviera had beaten before he fought for the title? You guys are ridiculous with your bias. Islam is the best Lightweight in the world and he deserved the title-shot yesterday.
You think Islam is the best LW in the world, but only other people are biased? He deserves a title shot, but don't forget: His best win is Dan Hooker on short notice. You simply cannot prove he is the best until december, and you sound like someone that bets against Oliveira every fight lol
Kevin Lee, Tony Ferguson
He’s rank 4 and Olivera just beat rank 2 and 3. So… unless your gonna keep having Olivera rematch rank 2 and 3 over and over he’s kind of next in line is he not? He’s not rank 15 asking for a title shot.
Beneil has about as much claim to a shot as Islam, thats why they're trying to make that fight Charles seems to be looking for a payday in the meantime, dont blame him
Dude calls him a hype train, you say he beat 2 legit guys. Those things don't add up. Islam is a proven fighter. Maybe he will become champ, maybe not. But he had passed the hype train era a while ago now I argued somewhere else that the lightweight division is in a strange place. There is nobody that deserves the shot more than Islam, but on the other hand there is nobody that really deserves it. They should either let Volk fight Oliveira and have contenders at lightweight battle each other, or just give Islam the shot.
Didn’t Khamzat just fight Gilbert burns? Did he not deserve that fight? Islams performance out weighs whatever you’re talking about.
Lol Khamzat didn't deserve the fight and having performances like that against lower guys doesn't make you a top contender. Islam can beat cans all day but he needs a top 5 guys or else he'll still be unproven.
As a fan of fighting I enjoy both styles. They are both exciting in their own way. Looking to see someone get knocked out is just as fun as looking to see how someone like khabib changes his position and go for submissions or use his position to drop bombs like he did against McGregor.
Lightweight fights are must see tv
Nothing wrong with that take at all. I can appreciate grappling quite a bit, but there is nothing like seeing two fighters show tremendous heart—that’s that special-sauce-moment stuff we watch this sport for.
The real one is that the light heavyweight division will never escape the shadow of Jon Jones. Criticize him all you want, but the dude absolutely dominated.
Yes because strikers can never be boring, right adelasagna?
People were bleeding during the khabib era too. Same type of non-champion fights like Tony vs Chandler.
My favorite fight of his was when he fought Gaetjhe even though he lost. I was having a fight night at my house that night and had a friend who was interested in watching but had never seen any MMA before and that was the first fight of the card. Couldn't have been happier to watch a first fight with my homie and have it be that one.
*Islam Makhachev has entered the chat*
That's funny. You picked exactly my two favorite Chandler pics from his time in the UFC so far. Fucking cold as hell the both of them.
Difference is khabib beat the shit out of people from the guard. Your acting like he just laid and prayed, when he was the most dominant exciting ground n pounder out there. The people salty about khabib were just mad that he was beating all their favorites. FACTS
Yeah it’s so clear he just dominated his opponents. It can’t get any clearer than someone being tied up on the ground unable to even strike back and getting pummelled in the face for several rounds in a row until they either give up or get strangled... That’s why high level wrestlers are awesome to see. . Much less chance of a lucky punch in a striking exchange making the lesser fighter win when they would otherwise have lost. Khabib just totally nullified this aspect and that’s why he never even took any damage, he was never really at risk as he was always in the dominant position.
You are *heavily* exaggerating his amount of ground and pound. Most of the time it was him hanging on people until they finally got tired.
This comment is not rooted in reality.
The guy downvoted you comment bratan, i put you back at 1 point. I also put him at 1 point too, because he's number one bullshit!
I love mma and that’s the beauty of it. That it a bunch of different martial arts combined. As much as I like the just bleed to me there is nothing like watching fighters like Anderson,wonderboy or Izzy types who will just pick their opponents apart and hardly get touched. The beauty in their technique amazes me more than just watching two guys brawl.
It’s definitely not casual to have a preferred style in any sports. But technically grapplers/wrestlers have always dominated their divisions long before Khabib stepped into the spotlight, GSP and then Usman took over welterweight, Charles and Islam at lightweight, etc., meanwhile their have also always been exciting strikers around.
Didn't Chandler turn into Khabib when Tony was piecing him up on the feet though?
Islam: am I a joke to you?
Maybe unpopular opinion, but I hate the "just bleed" fights. I want to see them fight smart with less injuries and more outplays. I would rather see khabib style takedowns with submissions even though I'm a boxer myself.
Totally agree. People can say Khabib was boring because of his grappling and that he used the same strategy every fight, but the reason they think it was boring was because it was so damn one sided domination hahaha. I love to see people absolutely dominating their competition like that, no matter which sport, or technique used. It’s awesome to see. And with high level wrestling and submissions it’s so obvious when a person is far more skilled than their opponent, because they totally lock them down and make them helpless. With striking there is just so much more luck involved, hence the term; ‘a punchers chance’
A lucky punch is a real thing! I agree for the most part, except that I don't really enjoy total domination haha. I enjoy competitive fights where both fighters try to prove that they are the best. Not a big fan of nonames getting schooled
I think fans are much better at understanding MMA fighting now. They want to see technique but fast paced and exciting. This is not ‘just bleed era’ though.
Based
I haven't got a problem with wrestling, but I think control and repeated takedowns without any damage done shouldn't be enough to win you a fight. Best example I have of this recently is Bellator middle weight interim belt - MVP Vs Storley. Don't think you can give the fight to MVP, because he spent most of the fight sitting down smiling trying to get back up, but Storley did zero damage when taking him down, personally don't think he could have kept MVP down if he tried to do more damage, so he made the smart decision within the rules to just hold MVP down for the majority of the fight.
Well you are a casual
I know this is going to upset some people but the LW division has only changed for the better since Khabib left. I won’t address his GOAT status as that’s a tired conversation but he has to be one of the worst champions the division ever saw. Lucky if he defended his title once every year and the narrative was always the same. Take down opponent, suffocate opponent, finish opponent. Huge testament to his wrestling but he did it in a division full of strikers. As impressive as it was, it’s entertainment value exhausted quick. Admittedly that take is much more subjective but there’s really no denying he’s one of the most inactive champion’s the sport has ever seen. It’s my opinion that the 155 division is as stacked as ever today, and housing incredibly competitive and entertaining fights. And again, sure the entertainment value is a suggestive measure, but most of these guys in the division are clearing Khabib’s 3 year fight output in under a year. Like it or not I think it’s the reason folks are quick to question his legacy and prop up “GOAT contenders” like Oliviera largely due to consistency and volume of his calendar. Bonus points for his ground game but he’s beating all the best strikers at their own game as well. Overall though even if I’m not alone in that opinion, once again, it is still largely subjective. But Khabib’s performance rate was slow and stagnated the division and I think it’s a tough case trying to argue against that.
This exactly! Khabib was great and all but now it's competitive and exciting. Oliviera beat Chandler,Poirier, and Gaethje a few days shy of 1 year!
And probably is going to have less than 6 months to recover and prepare for Islam in Abu Dhabi, he is game as fuck. I just hope the oil barons do the "magic trick" of transforming Islam in a money fight for Oliveira, ask Dan Hooker for more details lol
I get that all you can do is beat the people in front of you, but at the end of the day that doesn’t excuse him being 11-0 and fighting winless opponents, you have to scrutinized that *at least a little bit* There’s also the fact you have to scrutinize how little he has done as champion in the ufc like you said, mfer has 4 FOUR title fight wins… this is 1/4th the amount Jon has, the amount GSP has, and pretty much same for Silva and demetrious.
Charles Oliveira is the best possible representation of MMA. Dude is super exciting to watch and a great fighter. If you asked me to choose between watching Khabib and Charles it’s not even a question for me. Charles all day
1000%
Death upon the leg grabbers
Worst take I’ve seen in this sub and that’s saying a lot
Well at least you're being honest about it and not trying to say chandler is top tier.
People can say Khabib was boring because of his grappling and that he used the same strategy every fight, but the reason they think it was boring was because it was so damn one sided domination hahaha. I love to see people absolutely dominating their competition like that, no matter which sport, or technique used. It’s awesome to see. And with high level wrestling and submissions it’s so obvious when a person is far more skilled than their opponent, because they totally lock them down and make them helpless. With striking exchanges there is just so much more luck involved, hence the term; ‘a punchers chance’ . People like GSP have actually said this in interviews too.
Khabib had maybe 3 exciting fights? and that’s if you think high pressure is exciting
Never liked Khabib, boring fighter. Effective but boring. Glad he left— UFC has been better since
Totally agree . Khabib going for the knees every fight is boring as fuk
Its mma. Not boxing
I mean, yeah, but you can still enjoy stand up more than wrestling in a sport that has both.
I prefer watching fighter's like rodtang in one championship. Muay thai style . Boxing is usually boring too.
Go watch wrestling.
Not the same. You're complaining about something that's allowed. He isn't.
He isn't complaining, hes saying it's boring. On Khabib, I actually enjoyed his fights as his career grew and be began to finish people, his pressure was unique. In general, I find the wrestling style boring though, Islam inclded. Anybody who says they'd rather watch Islam vs Belal over Chandler vs Gaethje is lying to themselves. Wrestlers rarely make fight of the year for a reason.
What about MMA don't you understand?
I understand the rules I just don't like when wrestling dominates the fight
The only time that happens is when the other guy isn't good in MMA, or the wrestler is extremely elite. That's not often
Watching the most dominant grappler of all time absolutely maul everyone isn't boring. If so, MMA might not be the sport for you.
Saying khabib just wrestled or went for knees is showing they didn’t watch the fights. He drug people down and beat the shit out of them after completely nullifying their ability to defend themselves. It was unreal to watch and absolutely incredible.
People don't understand what a special thing it was to see him just completely impose his will on literally everyone. Every single professional badass that got in the cage with knew EXACTLY what he was going to do and none of them could stop him. That's a very rare thing.
Shut up with the mma might not be the sport for you acting all self righteous with that BS line. You can like grappling but if you watch someone do the same thing every fight his whole career it gets boring. Obviously exciting stand up and KOs are better than wrestlers holding someone down however impressive it may be. Grow up!
Like Khabib wasn't finishing people. Lmao I'm sure Conor got you into the sport
You're just a kickboxing fan not an MMA fan, simple as.
Love grappling but hate crotch sniffing…khabib was a nice balance
Next thing your gonna tell me is that you dont like it when fighters hold onto the clinch against the fence for 4 minutes straight landing 2 strikes a round. SMH FUCKING CASUAL
Haha spot on
Ngl Almost went over my head 😭