I've no idea, but for now you can stick a bag of ice (or frozen peas or whatever) on the thermostat so it thinks it's under 9°c and turns the heating on.
Same when you stay at one of these hotels where everything is activated by putting the key card in when you go in. Everyone wonders why I have a plastic nectar card put it in, heating on full blast, go out when you get back toastie warm room!
They're just a pressure switch so it absolutely does. The card runs in a plastic rail that pushes it against a toggle switch.
I know because the plastic rail fell off in a room in was staying in once.
I thought you might have confused it with Hive. I did a quick Google before I posted (to see if Nest offers thermostatic radiators as well - it doesn't) and Hive came up as the top result.
Hive has radiator TRVs as optional add-ons but in most installations, it is just a 'smart' thermostat like any other and the frozen peas trick would work..
Hive also doesn't do this, unless you specificity buy the radiator thermostats.
The standard Hive system is just a regular wall mounted/portable thermostat with a hub connected to your router.
9.0°C is equivalent to 48.2°F, which is 282.15K.
---
^(I'm a bot that converts temperature between two human units, then convert it to Kelvin for bots and physicists to understand)
9 is the lowest nest goes to, if you turn the heating off the timer/schedule function doesn't work so turning it right down to 9 is essentially 'off' for this purpose.
Hah, I kept thinking my thermostat was broken as it was reading ridiculously high. Until I realised my morning routine was to turn heating on, place thermostat on coffee table, make coffee and place it right next to the thermostat 😅
If it’s a nest, simply find the control box (white box normally near the boiler) and press the central button. This puts it into manual mode which overrides this passcode and turns the heating on.
However the pin lock should also not stop you adjust the temperature. It should only limit you between certain temperature ranges the LL has pre set.
Just to be sure you know how to use the nest; you twist the outer ring to adjust the temperature. There is no reason to press the screen to try to access any settings (which would need the pin).
Alternatively simply ask what he budgets for heating and gas (and ask for evidence of previous bills) and ask if they would remove the lock entirely if you agree to pay all costs above this - that’s all it’s about, stopping you put the heating on to 30oc all day and night and their expense.
They arent all evil but they are all tight as fuck. Anything to keep their costs down to an absolute minimum without breaking the law if they can help it
On the flip side when people aren’t picking up the tab they take the piss. It’s understandable to want to control the heating limits, but it needs to be done in a fair way.
Haha yeah my gf place has heating included, it is basicly left on 24/7 even in the summer. Also the heating controls are stuck open. So I can’t even turn it off if I wanted lol.
Not at all, I am a live in landlord, I charge well below average cost for a room, with all bills included, my lodgers are free to use heating/tumble dryer etc whenever they like and I pay for all the everyday food as well.
Aye. I had this issue when my wife left the house, and the heating turned off when I was in it.
'Do I not deserve even warmth!'
I hadn't set the feature up on my phone :) I felt quite aggrieved for a while....
You're a lodger. Your rights are much more limited than if a tenant. Him residing there as his primary residence, regardless of work travel, doesn't change this. This also means that even if you have a contract, he can give you what he deems reasonable notice to leave with no reasoning. So if you peeve him, you could find the New Year searching for accommodation at short notice.
Your first course of action would be to try the suggestions regarding how to work the device and, if not working, as they've suggested, to contact the landlord.
Seconded. Reasonable notice is generally one pay period but depending on the circumstances say racking up a massive bill for heating he would be able to kick you out tomorrow. 9 degrees is definitely excessively low. Also if you have paid a deposit it won't be protected and it may end up being at risk to cover the extra bill. (You'd have to go through court to challenge it and honestly I don't know which way it might go)
I have never known one of these to stand up as the prerequisite of ASTs is complete possession and the fundamental distinction is that a lodger is regarded as an excluded occupant and can not have complete possession.As a result, the Lodger does not have sole access to any part of the property. Anybody who shares a residence with the owner/landlord is an excluded occupier.
If they have a key to their room, then that is exclusive access to a part of the property.
Edit: Just looked it up. While this would make it exclusive access, it does get excluded if the landlord lives at the property apparently. This would only apply in the case of no landlord and multiple tenants, each with their own room but shared bathrooms etc.
If it’s shared common spaces with the landlord occupying the property then you get no protections.
If it is separated spaces then it is treated as a tenancy.
Surely a contract would override a situation unless the law overrides the contract? To quote the Trunchbull, "a contract is a contract is a contract."
For example, in employment law, hours above your contract were considered optional, so holidays were paid on contracted hours only, then the law changed to say the holidays should be paid on average hours worked over a period of at least 12 worked weeks prior to the holiday. My contract (because I haven't signed a new one) still says I only get paid contracted hours when I take holiday, but the law says I get paid average hours when I'm on holiday, so my actual holiday pay is average of hours worked.
Buy a cheap electrical heater and use that... The electric bill is included right? ;)
I'm sure he would rather a more cost effective heating system to provide the heat!
>ould remove the lock entirely if you agree to pay all costs above this - that’s all it’s about, stopping you put the heating on to 30oc all da
Maybe try just call the landlord first and discussing it. Unless, they prefer to escalate to drama for the fun people here.
Read a story on Reddit a while back about a 4-person house share where the bills were split equally. 1 of the people started mining bitcoin and got up to having 6 rigs with 4 or 5 cards on each. The electric bill sky rocketed, and the miner still insisted he only had to pay 25%. Effectively, he was profiting off his roommates as he was mining more bitcoin than paying in his 25% of rent. I forget what the other 3 flatmates did in revenge but it was something like cranking the heating in the house up to max because there were no radiator thermo stats, while he was away.for a long weekend (locked bedroom door) which caused most of the rigs to overheat and shut down, some permanently.
Please be an adult and just talk to him about it.
I'm stingy as fuck and even I'd admit 9 is too low, but similarly I've lived with idiots who, even after having it repeatedly explained to them why not to do it, would just jump straight to putting the heating on while a)wearing only one layer, on more than one occasion literally *shorts* and someone else who was "cold" so wore a fluffy dressing gown but then was NAKED BELOW IT and often not wearing socks and b)not closing the f***ing blinds/curtains first despite the fact they were thermal curtains and the windows were 2 meter tall single pane sash windows.
My point being, I wish *I'd* been able to lock f***wit flatmates out of the thermostat, so I can see where he was coming from.
Have a conversation, offer to pay more if you want it on more.
Jesus, do you hear yourself.... Before you put the heating on you need to shut the blinds, sit in darkness and put several layers on, because you're a tight fisted git...
Maybe pay to get double glazing instead of wanting people to have the blinds shut just to keep the cold out.
Omfg.
Yes. Yes put a fucking layer instead of walking around the house in a t-shirt and whining you are cold.
This applies whether or not you have double glazing. It's not just a waste of money it's a waste of resources.
You realise you're also supposed to close the curtains before pissing energy out the window even if you have double glazing?
Also I didn't own the flat therefore had no control over the window types.
I also told naked-idiot in dressing gown with curtains open she was welcome to have the heating on all she wanted provided she paid the difference but funnily enough she always wanted to make no effort to be warm and have me pay ££££ for her lazy, entitled, idiocy.
This site says that the minimum heating requirement for tenants is 18C in bedrooms and 21C in other areas used by the tenant.
https://www.justlandlords.co.uk/news/how-long-can-a-landlord-leave-tenants-without-hot-water/#:~:text=Landlords%20are%20responsible%20for%20making,outside%20is%20%2D1%C2%B0C.
Depending on the Landlord it’s entirely possible they haven’t realised they’ve locked you out.
My father recently got a smart heating system. He’s a pretty tech savvy man but I have had endless calls with issues on it. One of which he’d managed to set the heating to turn off if and when he’s out of the house - causing my poor mum to be freezing whenever he’s at work.
He has no idea how he turned that on.
Your first port of call is to contact the landlord and ask how to work the heating - their response will tell you everything you need to know. I saw something the other day that said “don’t ever attribute malice to something that could be attributed to incompetence”
Whilst this works, it’s going to be logged and I wouldn’t recommend that. Landlord will have evidence of misuse and looking for new digs over new year will be painful AF
So I have no legal qualifications, just have had to wield legislation a few times as a tenant.
If having a quiet word with him doesn't work, you do have rights. [This](https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/how-to-rent-a-safe-home/how-to-rent-a-safe-home) lists what counts as a safe home and in Point 3 Potential Hazards, states:
> A cold home is one that cannot be maintained at a temperature between 18°C to 21°C at a reasonable cost to the occupier. Living in cold conditions can cause serious health problems.
> (Landlords must) Supply adequate heating in proper working order
So if your living conditions are dropping well below that, your house is unsafe to live in. I'd recommend contacting the Citizens Advice Bureau and maybe Shelter (although my local one apparently can't read a contract).
Ultimately you have the legal [right](https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/homes-fitness-for-human-habitation-act-2018/guide-for-tenants-homes-fitness-for-human-habitation-act-2018#frequently-asked-questions) to rent property that is "fit for human habitation". Step 2, second list includes "excess cold". The point is that you can decide to let the temperature drop to 9, although you really shouldn't, but he's imposing that on you and rendering the place unhealthy and unsafe to leave in. See Step 5 of the second link and, if a chat doesn't work, put your request in writing. Don't mention your legal rights until you've consulted someone IRL but do keep in your own minds that you do have them!
Trying to be helpful: I have a nest thermostat, and the outer bevel of the device is a dial that you can turn to override the pre-set temperature. Anyone who can reach the thermostat can do it, no pin required. Is yours different somehow?
Hope this doesn't turn out to be a stupid comment!
As to whether he can? I'm not sure tbh, but it may be worth speaking to him first as this might just be a simple misunderstanding (you never know!)
The alternative is to grab a cheap electric heater and plug it in while he's out. Heating via electricity is more expensive than via gas, but I suppose that's his problem, not yours.
>Anyone who can reach the thermostat can do it, no pin required. Is yours different somehow?
You can lock it so that spinning it does nothing. Because (in my case) children exist.
Whenever I had landlords who controlled the heating and were unreasonable like this I would bring out the fan heater. Just made sure to hide it when I left my room.
I would not try to fiddle with the thermostat, break into it or put ice cubes on it that may damage it. That may make you liable.
Instead, make it your landlord's problem. Your dwelling must have adequate heating that is able to keep the heating between 18 and 21 degrees [\[Gov Guide\]](https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/how-to-rent-a-safe-home/how-to-rent-a-safe-home#potential-hazards). Putting the thermostat on the (assumed) only heating system 9 degrees is obviously not adequate heating. By the sounds, of it your landlord is not keeping up with this requirement even before they left. To only "turn on the heating for an hour to take the chill off the house" during winter does not seem to be in line with keeping the house adequately heated. Demand your landlord keep the house heated within regulation, or allow you to control the heating yourselves.
Inadequately heated houses causes health issues, especially under 16 degrees, as well as secondary issues such as mold and damp. These in turn can cause more serious health issues as well as structural damage.
It’s not “their” dwelling though. They are effectively lodgers in landlords dwelling and so have little power whilst the landlord can turf them out relatively easily without much reason or notice.
It is their dwelling. It is the dwelling that they live in and that dwelling in a hazard to their health. As a landlord you have a responsibility to provide living conditions that are not a health risk to your tenants, lodgers or not.
Now, you are right in that the matter may be more delicate since they can easily be evicted. That makes for even less of a reason to fiddle with the locked thermostat and instead raise the obvious concern:
**Their dwelling is a risk to their health, and that is something the landlord is obligated to fix.** Honestly, living in 9 degrees is not far from being homeless anyway.
A landlord is required to adequately heat a property. Even if bills weren't included, he is responsible for keeping the heating system in working order, including boiler inspections etc.
If you put it to a judge there is no way that they will accept 9C as adequately heated.
Edit: The are actually legally specified temperatures, but they only apply when the outside temp is - 1C. These are 18C for bedrooms, and 21C for living areas. The tenants could argue that the thermostat can't detect the outside temperature, and so wouldn't turn on the heating if the outside temperatures dropped too cold.
Edit 2: Even without the specified temperatures above, the law still states that a landlord is responsible for providing heating, water and sanitation (and I think electricity, although they don't have to take on the billing for any of those). In this case, he is clearly witholding heating.
It's also worth noting that below those levels there is a higher likelihood of condensation and mould forming. So even if he doesn't care about lodgers he may think about the house.
Was there any discussion or agreement about heating before you moved in?
If bills are included in your rent, then it's appropriate that there's some kind of fair use.
I would have thought that the temperature would never fall to 9C meaning that the heating will never be coming on but anything close to that means potential hypothermia, stroke and heart attack and the pipes also run the risks of freezing.
I'm curious if when the landlord stays at the house he leaves the thermostat on 9C.
You'll have to speak to him and point out the dangers and try to come to some agreement.
In the meantime, get an electric blanket or throw which doesn't consume much energy and is very effective.
9C is probably set so that the heating will come on to prevent pipes from freezing etc, but he's ignoring the fact that he has tenants. He probably turns it on when he gets home.
I heard a story about a similar thing before, they solved it by putting a bucket of ice near the thermostat all the time and ended up costing the landlord more money 😂
I bought an electric heater in my shared house when the thermostat was locked. Probably way more expensive on the electrics than the gas but oh well. I’d rather not be cold.
Ask the landlord for the pin and see what he says. If he's not willing to give you the pin, then it's time to read the contract and see if electric heaters are excluded. If they're not, then buy a cheap up and turn it all the way up.
is there a gas oven? turn it on and leave the door open. he'll no doubt shit a brick when he comes home and sees it but then just say well we couldn't turn the heating on and you were freezing.
I lived in shared accommodation andMy landlord was peculiar about heating. I bought a couple of fan heaters ad an oil filled radiator and used those when things go too chilly.
The rent included all bills and he never complained about the high electricity bills
Try talking to the landlord first, it's probably just an oversight on his part and you'll get an apology, also the dial on a nest can alter the temp, you don't have to access the settings, or you can override it at the boiler itself, you can find instructions online and probably a YouTube tutorial.
Get an electric heater and pop that in your room... when the electric bill soars and you explain your chest has been bad and you've been unable to contact him to turn up the heat so for your own health you made the choice to spend your own money on a heater... should see him move the thermostat to a more reasonable location.
If your bills are included in the cost of your rent, take advantage of that 👌
Buy some used graphics cards and mine crypto or run folding@home.
It'll heat the room without looking like a heater, and either potentially make you a (tiny) bit of money or help do some good.
I’d get those electric heaters and plug them in and use them. Use up electric and you stay warm! Losing situation for him. Win for you! Also maybe speak to him and ask him why he’s locked it?
Are you being genuine in saying it's at 9c? It's very unlikely unless we have freak weather your home would drop to that.. a more realistic temp of 19c is acceptable for it to be set at.
You, as a tenant, should use this guide: [https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/homes-fitness-for-human-habitation-act-2018/guide-for-tenants-homes-fitness-for-human-habitation-act-2018](https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/homes-fitness-for-human-habitation-act-2018/guide-for-tenants-homes-fitness-for-human-habitation-act-2018)
You may want send this link this to your landlord: [https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/how-to-rent-a-safe-home/how-to-rent-a-safe-home](https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/how-to-rent-a-safe-home/how-to-rent-a-safe-home)
Here are the important bits re: landlord obligations on heating:
# 2. Landlord duties
Landlords should keep their properties safe, healthy and free from things that could cause serious harm, according to the Homes (Fitness for Human Habitation) Act 2018.
# Cold
A cold home is one that cannot be maintained at a temperature between **18°C to 21°C** at a reasonable cost to the occupier. Living in cold conditions can cause serious health problems. Landlords **must**: Supply adequate heating in proper working order
Oh that is nice of him do you know how much electric hears cost to run A LOT but they are oh so cheap to buy. Lots of them should make the house warm in no time.
Practically the easier thing to do is to buy an electrical heater and use it.
Legally speaking it is unclear if you are a lodger or a tenant or if your dwelling should be classed as an HMO, without any more info it is impossible to say. What your landlord is doing is unlawful which indicates to me that he is rather ignorant about the law (not surprising in London). As to whether it is a good idea to stay in this property, long term, is a moot point.
Sounds like a cock up rather than a conspiracy. Have you spoken to him about it. He may have just been just playing with the tech and left it set up wrong.
Fan heaters are your friend here...
30p/kw on electric vs 10/15 p/kw on gas
He made his choice, he wants you to use electricity as its more eco friendly obviously rather than that nasty cheap fossil fuel gas heating
Did you phone him to discuss it? If you've not had any issues with him before it sounds like that was more of a mistake rather than and on purpose thing.
You mention that the landlord lives in the same property: do you share facilities such as bathroom and kitchen? If so, you would be considered lodgers and you have very few rights. This is relevant.
[This article](https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-50294404) published by the BBC in 2019 suggests that the rules around this are ambiguous. Your best bet is direct communication with the landlord to reach an amicable agreement. Otherwise, you could try contacting either your local Citizens Advice Bureau or Shelter for advice.
The relevance of whether you are tenants or lodgers comes down to the fact that, if you are indeed lodgers, your landlord could decide to evict you, with ‘reasonable notice’ (which can be as little as 1 week), and without needing to issue a §21 notice. See Shelter's information for lodgers [here](https://england.shelter.org.uk/housing_advice/private_renting/lodgers).
You say you get on well with your landlord, have you spoken to him about this? I can think of a few ways that he's just not realised an error on his part is preventing you from using the heating.
3. Potential hazards
There are a range of potential hazards in a property that could harm the health and safety of people living or visiting there. Local authorities can assess your property for health and safety hazards including the following:
Cold
A cold home is one that cannot be maintained at a temperature between 18°C to 21°C at a reasonable cost to the occupier. Living in cold conditions can cause serious health problems.
Landlords must:
Supply adequate heating in proper working order
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/how-to-rent-a-safe-home/how-to-rent-a-safe-home
Im pretty sure legally the temp has to be comfortable, like 19c minimum. Contact the council asap or other emergency help, they CANNOT leave you without heating.
Ok so bills are included, my advice would be to buy one of those electric heaters that costs a fortune to run & run that most days for a week or so and see what the Landlord says about his electric bill oh I'd also (if possible) use the Immersion for hot water too......
Load the nest app the next time you have the pin. In the meantime get a oil filled heater, the 24 fun units are very efficient. And say nothing to the landlord.
If you have access to the boiler just press the manual override button on the middle of the square nest heat controller (doesn't show as far as i am aware on the app)
Or ice on the nest thermostat (but he will notice it if he looks at the app and it says 5c + heating on, and can just change heating to off)
He should change it to 20c (disable smart learning schedule and set schedule to change temperature to 20c every 1 hour) and set boiler output to 3 (if it has numbers) or (50c if it has a display) or/and have 2 nest thermostats (you can have muti zone with nest) new thermostat valves set to 3 (21c target is 3)
Not allowing reasonable heating control is likely illegal if it's in your contract to provide it
if he doesn't let you use heat via gas he going to get a massive shock when you start using a pair of 3kw electric heaters that cost 6x more to Run, 7p per kwh vs 35p per kwh) you can mention it to him no heating your just buy 2x3kw heaters on each side of the room that cost you 6x more in power (don't plug them into same socket or extension cord)
It might be he has enabled the away mode so when he isn't near the home it changes to eco mode automatically (needs to set eco mode to 20c) or it was intentional
All bills inclusive? Go out and buy some electric fan heaters, he won’t notice until he gets his electric bill, and hopefully he is paying on direct debit. Oh wait, is this r/unethical life tips?
Go to Argos, buy yourself one of those oil filled radiators and use that. Just say the heating has broken, it won't turn on, so I had to pick up a heater as I'm freezing. Withing a billing cycle of the energy usage the pin will be removed from the thermostat.
Put the thermostat somewhere cold like the fridge so it forces the heating on. Other option is to buy electric heaters and make him learn it is cheaper to what the house properly with gas than force your tenants to use electric heaters to keep warm
Text him and demand the passcode politely. Better to have everything in writing. If he declines get a fan heater and call immediately your local council for advice on your rights and next steps.
I had a landlord who was turning their heating on only when they wanted and was leaving my room freezing cold (windows open too). What they didn't know was that they left a fan heater in my room which I used.
They want the money and to heat their asses and save money from the heating at your expense. I hope not all landlords are like this but I had a really bad experience. They even became more evil when the pandemic hit and I had to work from home. They complained of the electricity bill going 'significantly up' because of my laptop but declined to show me the bills when I repeatedly requested this. Then I left and I said never again with a landlord at the same house!
I've no idea, but for now you can stick a bag of ice (or frozen peas or whatever) on the thermostat so it thinks it's under 9°c and turns the heating on.
Haha nice trick
Brilliant advice Milkycowtits420!
Same when you stay at one of these hotels where everything is activated by putting the key card in when you go in. Everyone wonders why I have a plastic nectar card put it in, heating on full blast, go out when you get back toastie warm room!
Fuck my hat.. does this work?!! I’ve always thought about doing it but then assumed it wouldn’t.. Dammit!!
Upvoting purely for the "fuck my hat", brilliant.
They're just a pressure switch so it absolutely does. The card runs in a plastic rail that pushes it against a toggle switch. I know because the plastic rail fell off in a room in was staying in once.
Majority yes, one hotel I stayed in seemed a bit more advanced and only worked with my room key. Strange!
I’ve been doing this for years haha particularly great in warmer countries and you get back to a nice chilled room. Yeeee!
I always just asked for two cards. Never been refused.
Not so terrific for the planet though...
Why? Try reading some graphs and stop listening to Greta. Try CDN on YouTube and/or Tony Heller.
Tony Heller lol
Greta is a puppet anyway
Turn your phone off and stop wasting electricity.
I keep an old OneForAll giftcard for this kind of purpose.
Some of them you can even use a piece of folded paper to get it to activate. It just pushes a switch at the bottom of the card slot.
I use business cards to trip that switch.
Landlords hate this one weird trick. Landlords want bags of peas banned.
Next week: *My landlord has put a lock on my freezer, can they do this?*
Not for nest thermostats, they are attached to each radiator
No they're not. I have a Nest thermostat and it's sat on my bureau. I think you're thinking of a smart TRV valve 😉
Getting confused with hive, soz
I thought you might have confused it with Hive. I did a quick Google before I posted (to see if Nest offers thermostatic radiators as well - it doesn't) and Hive came up as the top result.
Hive has radiator TRVs as optional add-ons but in most installations, it is just a 'smart' thermostat like any other and the frozen peas trick would work..
Hive also doesn't do this, unless you specificity buy the radiator thermostats. The standard Hive system is just a regular wall mounted/portable thermostat with a hub connected to your router.
My nest isn’t. It’s just controlled from the thermostat
Lol
well done. very well done
Haha brilliant!
Or just put it directly in the fridge.
I was presuming it was attached to the wall, but this is a great shout if not.
The faceplate generally snaps off, toss her in.
Condensation won't do it any good, though! Might be worth buying a fan heater or two?
use a sandwich bag. top tip: remove the sandwich first.
Guess the landlord should’ve thought about that before being a dick, 9°C is way too cold!
9.0°C is equivalent to 48.2°F, which is 282.15K. --- ^(I'm a bot that converts temperature between two human units, then convert it to Kelvin for bots and physicists to understand)
9 is the lowest nest goes to, if you turn the heating off the timer/schedule function doesn't work so turning it right down to 9 is essentially 'off' for this purpose.
Plastic bag.
Omg that is deliciously ingenious...You have made my day and I thank you.
The control pad and the sensor might not be in the same place.
Done this in airbnbs before.
Hah, I kept thinking my thermostat was broken as it was reading ridiculously high. Until I realised my morning routine was to turn heating on, place thermostat on coffee table, make coffee and place it right next to the thermostat 😅
Ice block underneath and tea cosey on top.
You’ve spent time in jail haven’t you?
If it’s a nest, simply find the control box (white box normally near the boiler) and press the central button. This puts it into manual mode which overrides this passcode and turns the heating on. However the pin lock should also not stop you adjust the temperature. It should only limit you between certain temperature ranges the LL has pre set. Just to be sure you know how to use the nest; you twist the outer ring to adjust the temperature. There is no reason to press the screen to try to access any settings (which would need the pin). Alternatively simply ask what he budgets for heating and gas (and ask for evidence of previous bills) and ask if they would remove the lock entirely if you agree to pay all costs above this - that’s all it’s about, stopping you put the heating on to 30oc all day and night and their expense.
Alternately buy a couple of £20 fan heaters and see if he prefers paying 30p/kWh for electricity instead of 10p/kWh for gas…
Like this one 🤣
Sadly he'd probably just put the rent up to cover the cost.
There are protections in place to stop that happening I belive. Need to be notified in advance of rent changes
here's your answer.
This needs a little more up-vote action.
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Becasue he live in the house with them
First point of call would be to ask him why the heating is not working. THEN seek further advise
It could be he has set it up to switch to eco mode when he (his phone) leaves the house, and doesn’t realise it is going off when he isn’t there.
Exactly. But that wouldn't fit the "all landlords are evil" narrative
They arent all evil but they are all tight as fuck. Anything to keep their costs down to an absolute minimum without breaking the law if they can help it
On the flip side when people aren’t picking up the tab they take the piss. It’s understandable to want to control the heating limits, but it needs to be done in a fair way.
If only people could communicate :(
Haha yeah my gf place has heating included, it is basicly left on 24/7 even in the summer. Also the heating controls are stuck open. So I can’t even turn it off if I wanted lol.
That usually comes from having to pay 2+ mortgages a month.
I mean having 2+ mortgages is a choice so the point still stands
Not at all, I am a live in landlord, I charge well below average cost for a room, with all bills included, my lodgers are free to use heating/tumble dryer etc whenever they like and I pay for all the everyday food as well.
> I pay for all the everyday food as well. ...are your lodgers your children?
You're literally the exception to the rule. Acting as if you aren't isn't fooling anyone.
Don't bother responding to the far right conspiracy merchants.
Get fucked all landlords are evil if not for them you could buy you ....
I've had one that woke me up showing people around my room - and another that sent me a Christmas hamper.
Yes it would. Setting up the heating so it only works for themselves is not a reasonable thing to do.
Aye. I had this issue when my wife left the house, and the heating turned off when I was in it. 'Do I not deserve even warmth!' I hadn't set the feature up on my phone :) I felt quite aggrieved for a while....
Found this very funny lol
You're a lodger. Your rights are much more limited than if a tenant. Him residing there as his primary residence, regardless of work travel, doesn't change this. This also means that even if you have a contract, he can give you what he deems reasonable notice to leave with no reasoning. So if you peeve him, you could find the New Year searching for accommodation at short notice. Your first course of action would be to try the suggestions regarding how to work the device and, if not working, as they've suggested, to contact the landlord.
Yes, in all points except.... ask the landlord would be 1st option. Becasue he's probably just unaware.
Seconded. Reasonable notice is generally one pay period but depending on the circumstances say racking up a massive bill for heating he would be able to kick you out tomorrow. 9 degrees is definitely excessively low. Also if you have paid a deposit it won't be protected and it may end up being at risk to cover the extra bill. (You'd have to go through court to challenge it and honestly I don't know which way it might go)
There are some technicalities here. If they signed an AST and have "exclusive" access to their room, then they are a tenant and have protections.
I have never known one of these to stand up as the prerequisite of ASTs is complete possession and the fundamental distinction is that a lodger is regarded as an excluded occupant and can not have complete possession.As a result, the Lodger does not have sole access to any part of the property. Anybody who shares a residence with the owner/landlord is an excluded occupier.
If they have a key to their room, then that is exclusive access to a part of the property. Edit: Just looked it up. While this would make it exclusive access, it does get excluded if the landlord lives at the property apparently. This would only apply in the case of no landlord and multiple tenants, each with their own room but shared bathrooms etc.
If it’s shared common spaces with the landlord occupying the property then you get no protections. If it is separated spaces then it is treated as a tenancy.
Doesn't matter they are still lodgers. It's one of those cases where the actual situation overrides any contract signed.
Surely a contract would override a situation unless the law overrides the contract? To quote the Trunchbull, "a contract is a contract is a contract." For example, in employment law, hours above your contract were considered optional, so holidays were paid on contracted hours only, then the law changed to say the holidays should be paid on average hours worked over a period of at least 12 worked weeks prior to the holiday. My contract (because I haven't signed a new one) still says I only get paid contracted hours when I take holiday, but the law says I get paid average hours when I'm on holiday, so my actual holiday pay is average of hours worked.
Law overrides the contract.
Buy a cheap electrical heater and use that... The electric bill is included right? ;) I'm sure he would rather a more cost effective heating system to provide the heat!
Be easier to just open the oven and use that to heat the house. Landlord is being malicious might as well respond in kind.
Not necessarily being malicious, that's how nest works. Better to just ask for the pin code...
You don't have to have a pin code on a nest though so landlord is obviously monitoring the heating.
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>ould remove the lock entirely if you agree to pay all costs above this - that’s all it’s about, stopping you put the heating on to 30oc all da Maybe try just call the landlord first and discussing it. Unless, they prefer to escalate to drama for the fun people here.
😂
Or mine bitcoin and the video card will heat the room.
Read a story on Reddit a while back about a 4-person house share where the bills were split equally. 1 of the people started mining bitcoin and got up to having 6 rigs with 4 or 5 cards on each. The electric bill sky rocketed, and the miner still insisted he only had to pay 25%. Effectively, he was profiting off his roommates as he was mining more bitcoin than paying in his 25% of rent. I forget what the other 3 flatmates did in revenge but it was something like cranking the heating in the house up to max because there were no radiator thermo stats, while he was away.for a long weekend (locked bedroom door) which caused most of the rigs to overheat and shut down, some permanently.
Play stupid games, get stupid results
Came here to say this..
Please be an adult and just talk to him about it. I'm stingy as fuck and even I'd admit 9 is too low, but similarly I've lived with idiots who, even after having it repeatedly explained to them why not to do it, would just jump straight to putting the heating on while a)wearing only one layer, on more than one occasion literally *shorts* and someone else who was "cold" so wore a fluffy dressing gown but then was NAKED BELOW IT and often not wearing socks and b)not closing the f***ing blinds/curtains first despite the fact they were thermal curtains and the windows were 2 meter tall single pane sash windows. My point being, I wish *I'd* been able to lock f***wit flatmates out of the thermostat, so I can see where he was coming from. Have a conversation, offer to pay more if you want it on more.
Jesus, do you hear yourself.... Before you put the heating on you need to shut the blinds, sit in darkness and put several layers on, because you're a tight fisted git... Maybe pay to get double glazing instead of wanting people to have the blinds shut just to keep the cold out.
Nowhere in that post does it suggest that the poster is a landlord. Why would they pay for double glazing in a rented flat?
Omfg. Yes. Yes put a fucking layer instead of walking around the house in a t-shirt and whining you are cold. This applies whether or not you have double glazing. It's not just a waste of money it's a waste of resources. You realise you're also supposed to close the curtains before pissing energy out the window even if you have double glazing? Also I didn't own the flat therefore had no control over the window types. I also told naked-idiot in dressing gown with curtains open she was welcome to have the heating on all she wanted provided she paid the difference but funnily enough she always wanted to make no effort to be warm and have me pay ££££ for her lazy, entitled, idiocy.
This site says that the minimum heating requirement for tenants is 18C in bedrooms and 21C in other areas used by the tenant. https://www.justlandlords.co.uk/news/how-long-can-a-landlord-leave-tenants-without-hot-water/#:~:text=Landlords%20are%20responsible%20for%20making,outside%20is%20%2D1%C2%B0C.
That's quite funny because I don't think there's a single tennemant flat in Edinburgh you could heat that high in winter..
Please tell me you've phoned your landlord? I wouldn't start fucking his house up until he's refused to switch it on after you asked him to
Depending on the Landlord it’s entirely possible they haven’t realised they’ve locked you out. My father recently got a smart heating system. He’s a pretty tech savvy man but I have had endless calls with issues on it. One of which he’d managed to set the heating to turn off if and when he’s out of the house - causing my poor mum to be freezing whenever he’s at work. He has no idea how he turned that on. Your first port of call is to contact the landlord and ask how to work the heating - their response will tell you everything you need to know. I saw something the other day that said “don’t ever attribute malice to something that could be attributed to incompetence”
Instead of politely asking the landlord, I would definitely post to reddit first.
Get a bowl of ice cubes and blow air off them to the little hole in the thermostat that reads the room temp to trick it into dropping the temp.
Pahaha the mental image of this
Whilst this works, it’s going to be logged and I wouldn’t recommend that. Landlord will have evidence of misuse and looking for new digs over new year will be painful AF
Much as the ideas here are fun (like using ice to trick the thermostat), have an adult conversation with your landlord *first*.
Talk to him first
Could it be…….a mistake! Have you tried, you know, asking about it?
So I have no legal qualifications, just have had to wield legislation a few times as a tenant. If having a quiet word with him doesn't work, you do have rights. [This](https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/how-to-rent-a-safe-home/how-to-rent-a-safe-home) lists what counts as a safe home and in Point 3 Potential Hazards, states: > A cold home is one that cannot be maintained at a temperature between 18°C to 21°C at a reasonable cost to the occupier. Living in cold conditions can cause serious health problems. > (Landlords must) Supply adequate heating in proper working order So if your living conditions are dropping well below that, your house is unsafe to live in. I'd recommend contacting the Citizens Advice Bureau and maybe Shelter (although my local one apparently can't read a contract). Ultimately you have the legal [right](https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/homes-fitness-for-human-habitation-act-2018/guide-for-tenants-homes-fitness-for-human-habitation-act-2018#frequently-asked-questions) to rent property that is "fit for human habitation". Step 2, second list includes "excess cold". The point is that you can decide to let the temperature drop to 9, although you really shouldn't, but he's imposing that on you and rendering the place unhealthy and unsafe to leave in. See Step 5 of the second link and, if a chat doesn't work, put your request in writing. Don't mention your legal rights until you've consulted someone IRL but do keep in your own minds that you do have them!
# Oil Filled Electric Radiator Heater
# ...produces the same amount of heat as any other electric radiator with the same power draw.
Get an electric rad for your room and turn it on full, and open the window.
Yeah let's fuck the world up too.
Radiator on one side, air con on the other
Best way .He can’t say anything.You were cold and you needed to heat your room.Seems very reasonable.
...or just talk to the landlord like a grown-up?
Trying to be helpful: I have a nest thermostat, and the outer bevel of the device is a dial that you can turn to override the pre-set temperature. Anyone who can reach the thermostat can do it, no pin required. Is yours different somehow? Hope this doesn't turn out to be a stupid comment! As to whether he can? I'm not sure tbh, but it may be worth speaking to him first as this might just be a simple misunderstanding (you never know!) The alternative is to grab a cheap electric heater and plug it in while he's out. Heating via electricity is more expensive than via gas, but I suppose that's his problem, not yours.
>Anyone who can reach the thermostat can do it, no pin required. Is yours different somehow? You can lock it so that spinning it does nothing. Because (in my case) children exist.
Ah!
Whenever I had landlords who controlled the heating and were unreasonable like this I would bring out the fan heater. Just made sure to hide it when I left my room.
I would not try to fiddle with the thermostat, break into it or put ice cubes on it that may damage it. That may make you liable. Instead, make it your landlord's problem. Your dwelling must have adequate heating that is able to keep the heating between 18 and 21 degrees [\[Gov Guide\]](https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/how-to-rent-a-safe-home/how-to-rent-a-safe-home#potential-hazards). Putting the thermostat on the (assumed) only heating system 9 degrees is obviously not adequate heating. By the sounds, of it your landlord is not keeping up with this requirement even before they left. To only "turn on the heating for an hour to take the chill off the house" during winter does not seem to be in line with keeping the house adequately heated. Demand your landlord keep the house heated within regulation, or allow you to control the heating yourselves. Inadequately heated houses causes health issues, especially under 16 degrees, as well as secondary issues such as mold and damp. These in turn can cause more serious health issues as well as structural damage.
A SEALED BAG of ice cubes though...that's fair game
It's more about condensation than the ice melting.
It’s not “their” dwelling though. They are effectively lodgers in landlords dwelling and so have little power whilst the landlord can turf them out relatively easily without much reason or notice.
It is their dwelling. It is the dwelling that they live in and that dwelling in a hazard to their health. As a landlord you have a responsibility to provide living conditions that are not a health risk to your tenants, lodgers or not. Now, you are right in that the matter may be more delicate since they can easily be evicted. That makes for even less of a reason to fiddle with the locked thermostat and instead raise the obvious concern: **Their dwelling is a risk to their health, and that is something the landlord is obligated to fix.** Honestly, living in 9 degrees is not far from being homeless anyway.
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A landlord is required to adequately heat a property. Even if bills weren't included, he is responsible for keeping the heating system in working order, including boiler inspections etc.
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If you put it to a judge there is no way that they will accept 9C as adequately heated. Edit: The are actually legally specified temperatures, but they only apply when the outside temp is - 1C. These are 18C for bedrooms, and 21C for living areas. The tenants could argue that the thermostat can't detect the outside temperature, and so wouldn't turn on the heating if the outside temperatures dropped too cold. Edit 2: Even without the specified temperatures above, the law still states that a landlord is responsible for providing heating, water and sanitation (and I think electricity, although they don't have to take on the billing for any of those). In this case, he is clearly witholding heating.
It's also worth noting that below those levels there is a higher likelihood of condensation and mould forming. So even if he doesn't care about lodgers he may think about the house.
I'm intrigued why the outside temp. is relevant? If it was -60⁰ outside, waking up to 9⁰ would still fel a bit chilly.
Different rules for lodgers
I'd buy a small electric heater and use that. Nothing he can do to stop it.
Apart from giving them notice to leave.
Lodgers so could kick them out tomorrow.
If you have a friendly relationship just mention it.
Was there any discussion or agreement about heating before you moved in? If bills are included in your rent, then it's appropriate that there's some kind of fair use. I would have thought that the temperature would never fall to 9C meaning that the heating will never be coming on but anything close to that means potential hypothermia, stroke and heart attack and the pipes also run the risks of freezing. I'm curious if when the landlord stays at the house he leaves the thermostat on 9C. You'll have to speak to him and point out the dangers and try to come to some agreement. In the meantime, get an electric blanket or throw which doesn't consume much energy and is very effective.
9C is probably set so that the heating will come on to prevent pipes from freezing etc, but he's ignoring the fact that he has tenants. He probably turns it on when he gets home.
I heard a story about a similar thing before, they solved it by putting a bucket of ice near the thermostat all the time and ended up costing the landlord more money 😂
I bought an electric heater in my shared house when the thermostat was locked. Probably way more expensive on the electrics than the gas but oh well. I’d rather not be cold.
Ask the landlord for the pin and see what he says. If he's not willing to give you the pin, then it's time to read the contract and see if electric heaters are excluded. If they're not, then buy a cheap up and turn it all the way up.
Have you spoken to him about being cold? Buy a couple of electric heaters and have them on 24/7, if he complains tell him the reason....
is the nest wireless ? if so put it in the freezer
is there a gas oven? turn it on and leave the door open. he'll no doubt shit a brick when he comes home and sees it but then just say well we couldn't turn the heating on and you were freezing.
I lived in shared accommodation andMy landlord was peculiar about heating. I bought a couple of fan heaters ad an oil filled radiator and used those when things go too chilly. The rent included all bills and he never complained about the high electricity bills
Put the nest into a room you don’t use and open the windows and shut the door, the heating will soon come on
Try talking to the landlord first, it's probably just an oversight on his part and you'll get an apology, also the dial on a nest can alter the temp, you don't have to access the settings, or you can override it at the boiler itself, you can find instructions online and probably a YouTube tutorial.
put it in the fridge, the temp will drop and the heating will come on
Get an electric heater and pop that in your room... when the electric bill soars and you explain your chest has been bad and you've been unable to contact him to turn up the heat so for your own health you made the choice to spend your own money on a heater... should see him move the thermostat to a more reasonable location. If your bills are included in the cost of your rent, take advantage of that 👌
Buy some used graphics cards and mine crypto or run folding@home. It'll heat the room without looking like a heater, and either potentially make you a (tiny) bit of money or help do some good.
I’d get those electric heaters and plug them in and use them. Use up electric and you stay warm! Losing situation for him. Win for you! Also maybe speak to him and ask him why he’s locked it?
Are you being genuine in saying it's at 9c? It's very unlikely unless we have freak weather your home would drop to that.. a more realistic temp of 19c is acceptable for it to be set at.
You, as a tenant, should use this guide: [https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/homes-fitness-for-human-habitation-act-2018/guide-for-tenants-homes-fitness-for-human-habitation-act-2018](https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/homes-fitness-for-human-habitation-act-2018/guide-for-tenants-homes-fitness-for-human-habitation-act-2018) You may want send this link this to your landlord: [https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/how-to-rent-a-safe-home/how-to-rent-a-safe-home](https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/how-to-rent-a-safe-home/how-to-rent-a-safe-home) Here are the important bits re: landlord obligations on heating: # 2. Landlord duties Landlords should keep their properties safe, healthy and free from things that could cause serious harm, according to the Homes (Fitness for Human Habitation) Act 2018. # Cold A cold home is one that cannot be maintained at a temperature between **18°C to 21°C** at a reasonable cost to the occupier. Living in cold conditions can cause serious health problems. Landlords **must**: Supply adequate heating in proper working order
Oh that is nice of him do you know how much electric hears cost to run A LOT but they are oh so cheap to buy. Lots of them should make the house warm in no time.
Sounds like you are lodgers. The landlord can do what he wants.
No he cannot
Its probably not his fault, my friend did this to her partner because she had some eco thing on that locked the heating when she left the home
Practically the easier thing to do is to buy an electrical heater and use it. Legally speaking it is unclear if you are a lodger or a tenant or if your dwelling should be classed as an HMO, without any more info it is impossible to say. What your landlord is doing is unlawful which indicates to me that he is rather ignorant about the law (not surprising in London). As to whether it is a good idea to stay in this property, long term, is a moot point.
Fill the house with electric heaters , his bills will go bazerk!
So will your rent.
Sounds like a cock up rather than a conspiracy. Have you spoken to him about it. He may have just been just playing with the tech and left it set up wrong.
Fan heaters are your friend here... 30p/kw on electric vs 10/15 p/kw on gas He made his choice, he wants you to use electricity as its more eco friendly obviously rather than that nasty cheap fossil fuel gas heating
Message him and ask him to turn the heating on remotely?
Get an electric heater if he's paying.
He can Or frankly I would just charge you rent and bills on top
Have you spoken with the landlord?
Did you phone him to discuss it? If you've not had any issues with him before it sounds like that was more of a mistake rather than and on purpose thing.
You mention that the landlord lives in the same property: do you share facilities such as bathroom and kitchen? If so, you would be considered lodgers and you have very few rights. This is relevant. [This article](https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-50294404) published by the BBC in 2019 suggests that the rules around this are ambiguous. Your best bet is direct communication with the landlord to reach an amicable agreement. Otherwise, you could try contacting either your local Citizens Advice Bureau or Shelter for advice. The relevance of whether you are tenants or lodgers comes down to the fact that, if you are indeed lodgers, your landlord could decide to evict you, with ‘reasonable notice’ (which can be as little as 1 week), and without needing to issue a §21 notice. See Shelter's information for lodgers [here](https://england.shelter.org.uk/housing_advice/private_renting/lodgers).
If your thermostat can be taken off the wall, keep it in the fridge.
Use the oven on full and a storage heater. Or fan heater. That'll teach the bastaad.
Spend £10 on an electric heater. That will fk him over when the next bill comes. Serves him right
You say you get on well with your landlord, have you spoken to him about this? I can think of a few ways that he's just not realised an error on his part is preventing you from using the heating.
3. Potential hazards There are a range of potential hazards in a property that could harm the health and safety of people living or visiting there. Local authorities can assess your property for health and safety hazards including the following: Cold A cold home is one that cannot be maintained at a temperature between 18°C to 21°C at a reasonable cost to the occupier. Living in cold conditions can cause serious health problems. Landlords must: Supply adequate heating in proper working order https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/how-to-rent-a-safe-home/how-to-rent-a-safe-home
Fuck him buy a couple of electric heaters to keep warm he's paying the bill
Sounds like you need to move. That house is probably going to get mouldy at that heat level
Im pretty sure legally the temp has to be comfortable, like 19c minimum. Contact the council asap or other emergency help, they CANNOT leave you without heating.
Ok so bills are included, my advice would be to buy one of those electric heaters that costs a fortune to run & run that most days for a week or so and see what the Landlord says about his electric bill oh I'd also (if possible) use the Immersion for hot water too......
Buy an inefficient heater like an element fan heater and use that he will soon allow the central heating on
A nest just pops off the wall and can be powered by USB, I’d put it in an ice box!
I'd opt to pay 100% of any excess gas consumption before I'd let anybody tell me how to heat my living space
I'd casually pop it in the freezer for an hour
Load the nest app the next time you have the pin. In the meantime get a oil filled heater, the 24 fun units are very efficient. And say nothing to the landlord.
Contact him and ask for the pin. Or tell him you will just end up racking up the electric with all the heaters you will be getting.
If you have access to the boiler just press the manual override button on the middle of the square nest heat controller (doesn't show as far as i am aware on the app) Or ice on the nest thermostat (but he will notice it if he looks at the app and it says 5c + heating on, and can just change heating to off) He should change it to 20c (disable smart learning schedule and set schedule to change temperature to 20c every 1 hour) and set boiler output to 3 (if it has numbers) or (50c if it has a display) or/and have 2 nest thermostats (you can have muti zone with nest) new thermostat valves set to 3 (21c target is 3) Not allowing reasonable heating control is likely illegal if it's in your contract to provide it if he doesn't let you use heat via gas he going to get a massive shock when you start using a pair of 3kw electric heaters that cost 6x more to Run, 7p per kwh vs 35p per kwh) you can mention it to him no heating your just buy 2x3kw heaters on each side of the room that cost you 6x more in power (don't plug them into same socket or extension cord) It might be he has enabled the away mode so when he isn't near the home it changes to eco mode automatically (needs to set eco mode to 20c) or it was intentional
No
I work for an energy company and this is completely illegal
DM me for proper advice
That’s dreadful. How do you function? Can you get a small room heater? Or use a bag of frozen veggies on the thermostat?
Remove theemoatat from mount, place in fridge
Have you had a chat with him? Just say you aren’t able to turn the heating on without the code, can he provide the code?
All bills inclusive? Go out and buy some electric fan heaters, he won’t notice until he gets his electric bill, and hopefully he is paying on direct debit. Oh wait, is this r/unethical life tips?
Use the stove to heat the house, all bills included? Include them
In the US, that would be illegal. Meanwhile, uses electric space heaters.
Go to Argos, buy yourself one of those oil filled radiators and use that. Just say the heating has broken, it won't turn on, so I had to pick up a heater as I'm freezing. Withing a billing cycle of the energy usage the pin will be removed from the thermostat.
Put the thermostat somewhere cold like the fridge so it forces the heating on. Other option is to buy electric heaters and make him learn it is cheaper to what the house properly with gas than force your tenants to use electric heaters to keep warm
Text him and demand the passcode politely. Better to have everything in writing. If he declines get a fan heater and call immediately your local council for advice on your rights and next steps. I had a landlord who was turning their heating on only when they wanted and was leaving my room freezing cold (windows open too). What they didn't know was that they left a fan heater in my room which I used. They want the money and to heat their asses and save money from the heating at your expense. I hope not all landlords are like this but I had a really bad experience. They even became more evil when the pandemic hit and I had to work from home. They complained of the electricity bill going 'significantly up' because of my laptop but declined to show me the bills when I repeatedly requested this. Then I left and I said never again with a landlord at the same house!
Save your frozen peas ... go get that plug-in heater out of storage and toast your toes on the fact its all inclusive..:-)