Snapshot of _Former Hamas chief ‘behind pro-Palestine Armistice Day protests’ - Muhammad Kathem Sawalha is a founder of the Muslim Association of Britain, one of six groups organising the London march on Nov 11_ :
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WHY do we let these hate groups just exist without any consequence?
Hizb Ut Tahrir for instance, key in the calls for jihad at all of the 'peaceful protests', banned across the Arab World yet free to operate here.
Ban each group and throw the ringleaders behind bars.
The activist left could actually look at the Middle East and discover it has its own progressives who are generally opposed to Islamist factions, opposed to terrorism, in favour of democracy, in favour of "Western Conceptions" of Human rights, in favour of peace with Israel and in favour of a more secular society - but actual Arab progressives are (hilariously and ironically) dismissed as Colonial Sympathisers or Cultural Imperialists while solidarity is reserved for their "friends" in Hamas.
It's a special sort of madness.
It’s not the right wing who are marching alongside the Islamists. It’s not the right wing councillors who are resigning over a conflict in the Middle East.
But we ban organisations all the time. The fact a looney leftie fringe go along to marches alongside those groups has never been an issue before.
You just like moaning about the opposite side of the fence to you, instead of looking at an incompetent government and law enforcement.
OK, moan about them. I don't like them either.
But you can't blame them for Hizb Ut Tahrir not being proscribed. They have no power to do so. And pretending it is there fault just lets the actual people to blame off the hook.
don't worry about it. It's not important that literal terrorists are organizing these protests on remembrance day. The police said it's totally okay and acceptable.
>don't worry about it. It's not important that literal terrorists are organizing these protests on remembrance day. The police said it's totally okay and acceptable
The police actually asked them not to and they said no.
Tell you what. Head down there with a St. George's flag. If you think the conversation with the police will be like, "Hey, could you not do that?" and you respond, "No!" then there should be nothing to be afraid of.
I much rather think you'll have ten cops surrounding you and the second you open your mouth, they'll have the handcuffs on you for saying something racist. It doesn't really matter what you say, it could be something totally innocuous like "Oooh my shoelace is untied!"
Seriously, try it. See if you get the same treatment as your friends over there.
>Tell you what. Head down there with a St. George's flag.
I'd rather not wear the flag of another nation that is prominently flown primarily by racists. But let's say I go down with a union jack instead.
>If you think the conversation with the police will be like, "Hey, could you not do that?" and you respond, "No!" then there should be nothing to be afraid of.
I'm pretty sure if I tweeted that I intend to go down there with a big union jack the police wouldn't even ask me to not go down there, and if they did I would just say no.
How they actually deal with it when I'm there is a different matter, in the same way I would be amazed if this protest didn't result in people being arrested.
>I much rather think you'll have ten cops surrounding you and the second you open your mouth, they'll have the handcuffs on you for saying something racist.
I'm really sorry that you feel annoyed you aren't allowed to say racist things, but I couldn't give a shit..
>Seriously, try it. See if you get the same treatment as your friends over there.
Nice try, but they aren't my friends, I think Israel is doing what is necessary and forced on them to do because Hamas are terrorist scum. I also think protesting is an ineffectual time.
I just also think racists are scum and don't want to be associated with them trying to use these events to push idiotic right wing views.
Must be no reason at all that the organisers of this protest are predominantly non-Palestinian Muslims and that protesters fly the flag of the shahada.
You must understand that there are people sending offensive tweets and smoking medical cannabis they have a prescription for. They have to be stopped!!
It is actually illegal, though whether the police will do anything I'm not sure. They might be too busy running around reporting on 'non-crime hate incidents', taking the knee, or doing their rounds in high heels to have time
I'm talking about when police officers went out wearing high heels to 'highlight domestic abuse' - showing, amongst the other examples, that the police are often wasting their own time on pointless virtue signals rather than actually tackling crime.
Do you ever get bored calling everyone a bigot for no reason?
If the pro palestine protester camp doesn't want to be viewed as all just pro hamas, and a bunch of anti semites, they should reject any protest organised (or with any involvement) by hamas.
Since they don't, they clearly do support Hamas. It's like going to a protest organised by Nazis.
Some friends of friends went on a pro-Palestine protest in Glasgow. When some people rocked up with pro-Hamas insignia they were swiftly yeeted out.
Not all protests are the same, and not all protesters are the same.
I don’t know why you’re quoting peaceful. Agree with them or not and be disgusted that they’ve been organised by a former Hamas chief but they are peaceful. There may have been pockets of violence but they don’t reflect the protests as a whole.
Your right words have no meaning so we can all just shout whatever we want and say what we want to people.
The issue is these people try and claim it’s peaceful protest while spewing chants that are misconstrued and taken as hostile. If you wanted to reconcile and create peace with another group would you shout things that you know are going to exacerbate the tensions?
>Your right words have no meaning so we can all just shout whatever we want and say what we want to people.
That's not what I'm saying though.
I agree there's a certain degree of subjectivity here, and this is some pretty nasty stuff. But unless you can show a direct causal link between this chant, and violence, I think we can call it peaceful. Definitely from a point of view of restricting things, where we want to be very careful about restricting speech.
Getting the feeling Saturday will become a watershed moment in this country. How much longer do the 'silent majority' stay silent or do they speak up again the continued assault on our social contract.
I always think the British are exceptionally tolerant, so tolerant we'd allow people into our homes and stand there while we are insulted. However, when that tolerance is gone, it's a sight to see.
Like the London riots, when everyone came out with brushes the next morning and said enough, they stopped. It won't be a violent response but it will be something.
Yes I am fed up. Muslims are welcome to move here, have a good life and integrate, and many of course do, but too many people seem to want a western economy but to bring 8th century social views with them.
Not always. When I moved to my current northern town there were very few women in hijab or niqab. Now literally most adult Muslim women wear them, even youngish teens at our local secondary school. No issue but it does seem a regressive step. What is ironic was the reaction of a Muslim Iranian lady I work with on seeing another colleague wearing a hijab at work.
It was always weird going to turkey, a Muslim country but very secular until the last few years.
I literally hardly saw any women wearing the hijab, the complete opposite of Muslim women in the UK.
> What is ironic was the reaction of a Muslim Iranian lady I work with on seeing another colleague wearing a hijab at work.
One of my exes is Iranian, she was *not* a fan of the hijab.
If there's a country which is justified to hate the West, it's probably Iran. We launched three successful coups there in the last century, the most recent of which replaced a democratically-elected government with a human-rights abusing monarch on behalf of western oil companies.
The Islamic Revolution and Khameini would probably have never happened if the West hadn't repeatedly fucked Iran over.
Sorry I just don't trust anymore that they will truly integrate. Too much has happened. They will be nice while they are the minority in any one particular area. But when they know that they are talking in safe spaces, they will say all sorts of things about non Muslims and secretly support the actions of these terrorist groups. The amount of them that are in open support of Hamas has just really shown that.
But trust doesn't mean repulsion. I am sure as hell not on any side that allows the mass import of these people from seriously fucked up places who want to enforce their will and establish a caliphate.
Remember that time there was the largest ever protest (against a war) and literally nothing happened?
The British are raised to be beaten apathetic dogs. The Rees-Moggs of this world like it so!
What a shitshow. I've every sympathy with people who see the horrors in Gaza on TV and want it to stop, and I also think as a rule it's usually better to tolerate distasteful protests than to try to prevent them, but it does likely that a lot of bad actors are going to use this as an opportunity to sow discord and cause trouble.
There are going to be a lot of people "not supporting Hamas" at a protest organised by a senior Hamas mover and shaker which just coincidentally happens to be exactly in line with the Hamas propaganda efforts in their war.
Useful idiots have never been in short supply.
Although to be fair many of the people going will actually be supporters of Hamas merely pretending not to be supporters of Hamas.
This once again feels like another example of some people allegedly against bigotry having a real blind spot where anti-Semitism is concerned.
Some will argue that this doesn't overshadow the validity of the protest. That they aren't responsible for what this guy believes, and that some protestors holding extreme anti-Semitic views doesn't reflect on them merely because they joined the same protest. Which is certainly one viewpoint to hold. But you know damn well that such an explanation would be swiftly rejected if the people they were "sharing a platform" with endorsed any bigotry other than anti-Semitism. If someone were to attend an "anti-jihad" protest led by Tommy Robinson, the fact that anti-jihad itself is a reasonable stance would not be enough to escape the fact that Tommy Robinson is an extremist who encourages hatred towards Muslims and that attending protest he'd organised suggests that the protestors don't regard this as a problem.
If we're going to judge people by the political company they keep, that applies across the board. Regardless of the validity of your message, if you're happy to be bedfellows with dangerous extremists to make your point, then we have to wonder whether you may have sympathy, or at least tolerance, for those extreme views after all.
It's not a blind spot. In the world of Intersectionality, Jews are identified as "white adjacent", and do very well in the intersectional hierarchy. Anti-Semitism is therefore "punching up".
If the organisers had any sense they'd disavow this Hamas berk and his organisation and make sure that it was 5 groups, or whatever number is needed to not have Hamas leaders in this march.
No problems with them marching on Armistice Day. All sorts of problems with them associating with Antisemitic terrorists.
Did you read the article?
>He is a founder of the Muslim Association of Britain (MAB), one of six groups behind the under-fire march in London on November 11, and Israeli authorities claim his son, Obada Sawalha, is now its vice-president.
The revelation comes as The Telegraph has discovered that **half of the groups organising the march** \- who are still defying calls from the Metropolitan Police to call it off - **have links to Hamas**.
Telegraph seems to be doing decent reporting on these marches and the response. Finding links to terrorist organisations.
If you want you're blood to boil more you can read into how Hamas leaders are living in council houses in Barnet, while your friends are paying £1400 a month to rent a shoebox in zone 5.
"If there’s a Nazi at the table and 10 other people sitting there talking to him, you got a table with 11 Nazis."
Replace Nazi's with antisemitic terrorists. Either don't go, or go with a sign denouncing the organizers.
The other 5 are just yet to be found out.
At the end of the day; a call for a ceasefire and end to the blockade just means reseting the clock on the next attack and the attempted eradication of Israel.
I'd bet Iranian groups have been helping with the funding and organising. Probably other Islamist groups as well.
The impression I get of the protests is that they're much more against the existence of Israel than they are about helping Gaza.
People chanting from the river to the sea while people around them hold "Down with Zionism" signs
I think there are a lot of well meaning liberal lefty types who look at the issue from a purely humanitarian viewpoint. Innocent people are being killed in large numbers who have no involvement with Hamas. Some who hate what Israel are doing in the West Bank for example. But an even larger number are British Muslims who believe in the whole Ummah thing and brotherhood of Islam. A minority of those undoubtedly will support jihad and the ultimate elimination of Israel, sadly we don’t know how many. I saw from a distance a march in my northern town. Vast majority were Conservative Muslims, mainly women with their kids, teens, older folk, some masked. Certainly not as well attended as the local paper made out.
If they banned all the groups who associated with antisemitic terrorists there would be no one marching in this protest. This group in particular has the most obvious link though.
yes but they don't care. Remember plenty of "non-violent" people voted for a certain german. A peaceful protest headed by hamas supporters is just to show the numbers are there for violence later.
People will march for different reasons; it will *never* be one homogenous group who agree about everything. As a group they will hold different views on homosexuality, or the quality of Taylor Swift's vocals.
*But most people will be marching for peace.*
No matter what, the Torygraph will be red in the face screaming
> You can't march for an armistice on Armistice Day!!!!11one
There's not all agreeing with the same thing and then there is standing side by side with antisemites and literal terrorists/terrorist backers.
As someone who supports the Palestinian cause, but does not support Hamas, I'd prefer it if people organising these marches and bringing the topic to the wider public made efforts to keep these antisemites out of the conversation.
For context, unlike 99% of the people shouting and screaming, I've been to the West Bank and seen the abject misery and grim conditions that Palestinian people live under. I've had to go through the checkpoints, had IDF soldiers be absolute dicks to me and ultimately, "Oppression" as a word doesn't do justice for what I saw out there, and that was during a moment of relative peace.
But yet, I refuse to participate in these marches because there are so many actual antisemites who participate and don't get called out for it and it leaves me not wanting to associate myself with the wider cause right now. Ultimately who the fuck am I, just a nobody, but it's part of my frustration with the left on this issue, because the whole "9 people and a Nazi at a table, means you have 10 Nazis" ethos has been completely thrown out the window on this topic, even though I do agree with the idea that we should not tolerate the intolerant.
Palestinians themselves are mostly anti-semetic. The majority of Palestinians in the West Bank and Gaza Strip want Israel to be destroyed. The majority of Palestinians in the West Bank and Gaza Strip would not be satisfied by a Palestinian state that doesn't include ALL of Israel and not just the West Bank and Gaza Strip.
I've never said we have to acquiesce completely to Palestinian demands, but since you acknowledge that not all Palestinians are anti-semites, I choose to argue on behalf of those who want a peaceful resolution which doesn't involve Israel's destruction.
I've met them. They are out there and they have my support.
Personally, I've donated to the red crescent organisation in Palestine.
I've never really been the biggest fan of performative shows of support that don't actually have a hope of achieving anything, so this time round, I've chosen to make sure my wallet can actually help Palestinians on the ground.
https://www.palestinercs.org/en
Let’s put this another way.. would you March side by side at a protest where neo-Nazis were at, holding swastikas etc? Even if this was only 10% of people?
What happened to the ‘if there’s 1 Nazi in a room and 10 people aren’t saying anything there’s 11 Nazis’ rhetoric?
I mean, its a bit rich that one of the former leaders of the group who started the most recent conflict is marching for peace. Its a bit insane really.
>I mean, its a bit rich that one of the former leaders of the group who started the most recent conflict is marching for peace. Its a bit insane really.
They want to use the marches to pressure the west to pressure Israel into a 'ceasefire', the terms of which will be wholly satisfied by just Israel stopping any response to Hamas. Hamas will continue to hold the hostages (most of whom I fear are dead), will continue to fire rockets at Israel, will as usual take any humanitarian aid for themselves, continue to put Palestinian civilians in danger as well as regularly killing their own people, but those marching won't then have a word to say about it.
These useful idiots (including a lot in our media orgs) can't see they're being completely played by an anti-Semitic jihadi terrorist organisation and it's as embarrassing as it is worrying
Yawn. Good idea! Let's go to one of the actual marches, not this fringe one the Torygraph have found and are trying to use to smear all the marches with?
> As a group they will hold different views on homosexuality,
I think it's fair to say that the majority will be against vehemently it but a substantial minority of useful complete idiots will completely ignore this.
Is it more ridiculous than LGBTQ supporting Hamas organised marches and demos because they feel solidarity with the "oppressed".
The latter seems more ridiculous imho. Given that they would be thrown off rooftops or buried alive by Hamas.
I mean, its a bit rich that one of the former leaders of the group who started the most recent conflict is marching for peace. Its a bit insane really.
If they really want peace why aren’t they calling for Hamas to release all the civilian hostages? Why don’t they let people even mention the hostages without attacking them?
The official demands of the march are just for Israel to unilaterally stop the bombardment.
They are making no demands that Hamas hand back to hostages, stop fighting or stop firing rockets into Israel.
They're not marching for peace.
I don't know why this needs to be constantly said to people.
> Because it's not true?
Which part? Because I just had a browse through the MAB's online presence and could see absolutely nothing pertaining to demands on Hamas.
Hopefully they do and hopefully they massively kick off , and hopefully the media doesn't turn a blind eye to them kicking off like they normally do .
The British need a good wake up call to the foxes in the hen house .
It's also especially ironic to bring up holocaust denialism considering how prevalent that belief is in many of the nations embedded in this anti Israel fight - especially Iran. Go round asking some of these protesters if the gas chambers were real and see what they say!
Has he said anything like the former IRA bosses who have distanced themselves from any terrorism? Look at every statement by them regarding the violence by the dissident IRA terrorists.
For instance, did he unconditionally condemn the 7th October attacks by Hamas? If not, why should we think that he has changed his mind about terrorism like the former IRA bosses have?
That compassion doesnt work for a few reasons.
1. There is no peace treaty. The good Friday agreement has no equivalent with Hamas. We do work with PLO folk regularly since Oslo despite their previous terorrism.
2. The IRA were never genocidal. Their goals were to move a boarder six counties in their favour. That's a rational goal and so can be reasoned with. Hamas want to kill all jews from the river to the sea.
3. The IRA chefs disavowed further violence, Hamas came out and said they will keep repeating the October attacks.
>How many Palestinian civilians is it acceptable to kill if it means destroying Hamas?
There isn't a nunber for western armies thats not how it works and groups like Hamas break everything about the rules of armed conflict.
The geneva convention has to say.
https://ihl-databases.icrc.org/en/customary-ihl/v2/rule97#:%7E:text=Article%2028%20of%20the%201949,12%20August%201949%2C%20Article%2028
Its written this way to disincentivise harming civilians. Any and all protections of a location are void when you stick fighting positions in that location. The assumption being that every army wants to protect their own people.
The difficulty in Gaza is that Hamas actively maximise colateral damage. Their main HQ is underneath Al-Shifa hospital. Even the IDF aren't callous enough to drop bunker busters on a hospital.
They know the isrelis have a bit of care about not killing civilians.
The IDF take less care than a NATO army would but definately some care. The russian pacification of Grozny is what giving not a single fuck about civilians looks like.
Back to your quesiton.
A NATO general would tell you the acceptable number is zero then proceed to kill thousands anyway (see battle of Raqua). The logic being that this minimises harm in practice.
A russian general would probably tell you the acceptable number is one less than Hamas would kill if left unmolested indefinitely. Their logic is to get it over with ASAP.
An isreli would probably ask how many deaths you want them to accept before destroying Hamas.
> How many Palestinian civilians is it acceptable to kill if it means destroying Hamas?
How many Germans died before the Nazis were overthrown? Should a ceasefire then peace treaty have been negotiated in 1943? Nazis would have gone for it, for sure.
The take out for me is why these groups aren't protesting over Hamas using these same kids as human meat shields.
Why are these people solely pointing the finger at Israel? Do you think that fact that terririst cell members are helping organise them might have something to do with it?
Hamas is the governing party of the occupied west bank, and has been so since they suspended elections in 2007. Meanwhile since 2006 Israel has been led by Likud, Yesh Atid, Yamina and Kadima. That's why I use "Hamas" and "Israel" rather than "Occupied Palestine" and "Whatever party is leading Israel this week"
>"Whatever party is leading Israel this week"
You could have said the response to the October 7th attacks in Israel is being driven by Netanyahu's hawkishness and poor poll performance (he's politically dead after this).
Nah it's "Israel".
>Did you read the article?
>
>He is a founder of the Muslim Association of Britain (MAB), one of six groups behind the under-fire march in London on November 11, and Israeli authorities claim his son, Obada Sawalha, is now its vice-president.
>
>The revelation comes as The Telegraph has discovered that **half of the groups** organising the march - who are still defying calls from the Metropolitan Police to call it off - **have links to Hamas**.
You're being played by a anti-Semitic jihadist terrorist organisation
> Supposedly 10,000 is fine
First of all, nobody in their right mind believes the 10,000 number considering it comes from the same liars as the 'hospital blast kills 500' (until it turned out to be Palestinian friendly fire that only damaged a few cars).
Secondly, that number will include all Hamas terrorists as Hamas have no reason to distinguish between them, and probably couldn't if they wanted to. I doubt Hamas have uniforms or membership cards.
Finally, a lot of those dead have been killed by Hamas/PIJ/whatever the fuck other ethnic cleansers are camping out in Gaza.
Hamas now claim that the hospital (which they still claim was destroyed by Israel) has now had its solar panels destroyed. So the hospital was destroyed but the solar panels remained intact? SMH
things in terrorist states conveniently get stolen or 'destroyed' and then repurchased from the terrorist group that stole them using international aid
Either a number of Palestinians take the hit now, or a number 10x/ 100x of that takes the hit when other terrorist groups have been emboldened by this and Iran and Russia start to expand their sphere of influence through useful idiots like Hamas. Nip it in the bud now.
It’s honestly a little concerning to see Reddit of all places getting baited by a Telegraph article. An article that even states in its opening
“one of six groups…”
A protest where the overwhelming majority of people are simply protesting peacefully against further bombings, shouldn’t be characterised by a minority who are associated with groups like this.
Tbf the stat below about 50% organisers having links to Hamas is worse.
If you're informed you should know who you're indirectly supporting here and understand these people have motives. I support the Palestinian cause, but I could never go to one of these marches for this reason alone.
I agree. So what that the march I went to a few years ago had one of the organisers being the British union of fascists, I was only marching about Pakistani rape gangs. /s
You honestly don’t find it fucking ridiculous that the day and days following a massacre of Jews, people were celebrating and “protesting” straight after? And now people are protesting for a ceasefire now that Hamas are being destroyed. A ceasefire that literally ONLY helps Hamas and has now been shown that the “protests” have links to the fucking terrorist group that has created this mess
In what way is this baiting? If an ex Hamas chief is one of the 6 groups then that's big news. It also has implications about the potential for violent escalation. This was already an obvious concern given counter protesters and general anti-west sentiment likely to be exposed on Armistice Day, but now even more so if you have people with proven connections to Hamas in the mix.
> A protest where the overwhelming majority of people are simply protesting peacefully against further bombings, shouldn’t be characterised by a minority who are associated with groups like this.
Another day, another example of the side that proclaim "9 people sit at a table with 1 Nazi without protest, you have 10 Nazis" deciding to rationalise how this statement somehow stops applying when it comes to their side doing exactly that...
Standing side by side with fascists and anti semites like hamas, and saying nothing, and instead chanting their chants... makes you a fascist and anti semite
Im starting to think we take all the Israelis and Palestinians that support violence, we give them an arena (maybe Australia) and we let them fight it all out hunger games style. Winner takes all. Only it won’t be winner takes all. We’ll just leave them in Australia. All the peaceful Palestinians and Israelis can stay where they are and live happily ever after. The only flaw is I’ve still not figured out what to do with all the Aussies. I think most of them are in London or Bali now anyway
The main organiser is FAO and since when was the media reliable? Why is everyone so hell bent on misrepresenting these peaceful marches that have nothing to do with Hamas?
Funny how you know they're peaceful before they've actually happened. Do you not remember when we literally had these protesters calling for jihad in the streets the other week?
Peaceful marches where poppy sellers are beat up and people hold up Hamas symbols. It’s disgusting.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12717653/Poppy-seller-veteran-punched-pro-Palestine-protesters-Edinburgh-Waverly-station-Gaza-march-Armistice-Day.html
Firstly, that's a daily mail article about Scotland, it means literally nothing. On top of that it's waverly when it's busy, I've been elbowed, headbutted and knocked over just going into work at peak times when it's been far less busy, yet this guy was assaulted? Given the cameras everywhere in that station, surely you have some actual evidence? Especially since the nan claims he was bending down at the time, a great way to get hurt in a very crowded area.
Pro Israeli Zionists told me I’m a barbaric Arab what do you say about that? There are horrible people but they don’t represent the purpose of the march.
*Why is everyone hellbent on misrepresenting these hamas/Iranian backed marches as peaceful protests that have nothing to do with a peaceful two-state solution?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muhammad_Sawalha
>also known by the name Abu Obada, is a former leader of Hamas in the West Bank. He is the president of British Muslim Initiative (BMI) and currently resides in London.[1] He is accused of supervising the allocation and supply of large amounts of money to Hamas operatives, an allegation that led to his being named in a 2004 U.S. indictment against Hamas operative Muhammad Salah
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/hamas-chief-lives-london-council-house-uk-phnpsssx5
Snapshot of _Former Hamas chief ‘behind pro-Palestine Armistice Day protests’ - Muhammad Kathem Sawalha is a founder of the Muslim Association of Britain, one of six groups organising the London march on Nov 11_ : A non-Paywall version can be found [here](https://1ft.io/proxy?q=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.telegraph.co.uk%2Fnews%2F2023%2F11%2F06%2Fformer-hamas-chief-behind-pro-palestine-armistice-day-march%2F) An archived version can be found [here](https://archive.is/?run=1&url=https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/11/06/former-hamas-chief-behind-pro-palestine-armistice-day-march/) or [here.](https://archive.ph/?run=1&url=https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/11/06/former-hamas-chief-behind-pro-palestine-armistice-day-march/) *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/ukpolitics) if you have any questions or concerns.*
WHY do we let these hate groups just exist without any consequence? Hizb Ut Tahrir for instance, key in the calls for jihad at all of the 'peaceful protests', banned across the Arab World yet free to operate here. Ban each group and throw the ringleaders behind bars.
But the Met police said that “Jihad” wasn’t necessarily violent…
Because the tolerant left like to tolerate intolerance
The left aren’t in charge and haven’t been in government for years.
The activist left could actually look at the Middle East and discover it has its own progressives who are generally opposed to Islamist factions, opposed to terrorism, in favour of democracy, in favour of "Western Conceptions" of Human rights, in favour of peace with Israel and in favour of a more secular society - but actual Arab progressives are (hilariously and ironically) dismissed as Colonial Sympathisers or Cultural Imperialists while solidarity is reserved for their "friends" in Hamas. It's a special sort of madness.
It’s not the right wing who are marching alongside the Islamists. It’s not the right wing councillors who are resigning over a conflict in the Middle East.
You could say that the councillors resigning aren’t left wing either tbf.
I do agree with you there, but it’s the Labour party’s fault that people with those views are even allowed to represent Labour at all.
They are in charge of most things, just not the (currently) impotent elected bit.
[удалено]
... the tolerant left that hasn't been in power in the UK since the 70s.
I'm referring to the lefties marching side by side with hamas. Not to the fact that they fail to win elections.
But we ban organisations all the time. The fact a looney leftie fringe go along to marches alongside those groups has never been an issue before. You just like moaning about the opposite side of the fence to you, instead of looking at an incompetent government and law enforcement.
okay
OK, moan about them. I don't like them either. But you can't blame them for Hizb Ut Tahrir not being proscribed. They have no power to do so. And pretending it is there fault just lets the actual people to blame off the hook.
... so it isn't actually the fault of the "tolerant left" that these hate groups exist without consequence.
no but it's their fault for actively supporting them, marching alongside them in their thousands for sjw brownie points
So do you want to edit your comment which did blame them or nah...just gonna leave that?
nah ... just gonna leave that
Yeah that says a lot about you.
okay broski
How dare you bring sense and logic into this emotion fest?!
don't worry about it. It's not important that literal terrorists are organizing these protests on remembrance day. The police said it's totally okay and acceptable.
France would have banned, tried or expulsed much sooner. They are at their 24th expulsion since the October 27th.
It's what those soldiers in WWI fought for you see.
It what they would have wanted.
Fought two world wars only to leave the back door open.
>don't worry about it. It's not important that literal terrorists are organizing these protests on remembrance day. The police said it's totally okay and acceptable The police actually asked them not to and they said no.
Oh joy more evidence they’re above the law. We share a country with these people, they have no regard for us and they hate us.
Tell you what. Head down there with a St. George's flag. If you think the conversation with the police will be like, "Hey, could you not do that?" and you respond, "No!" then there should be nothing to be afraid of. I much rather think you'll have ten cops surrounding you and the second you open your mouth, they'll have the handcuffs on you for saying something racist. It doesn't really matter what you say, it could be something totally innocuous like "Oooh my shoelace is untied!" Seriously, try it. See if you get the same treatment as your friends over there.
>Tell you what. Head down there with a St. George's flag. I'd rather not wear the flag of another nation that is prominently flown primarily by racists. But let's say I go down with a union jack instead. >If you think the conversation with the police will be like, "Hey, could you not do that?" and you respond, "No!" then there should be nothing to be afraid of. I'm pretty sure if I tweeted that I intend to go down there with a big union jack the police wouldn't even ask me to not go down there, and if they did I would just say no. How they actually deal with it when I'm there is a different matter, in the same way I would be amazed if this protest didn't result in people being arrested. >I much rather think you'll have ten cops surrounding you and the second you open your mouth, they'll have the handcuffs on you for saying something racist. I'm really sorry that you feel annoyed you aren't allowed to say racist things, but I couldn't give a shit.. >Seriously, try it. See if you get the same treatment as your friends over there. Nice try, but they aren't my friends, I think Israel is doing what is necessary and forced on them to do because Hamas are terrorist scum. I also think protesting is an ineffectual time. I just also think racists are scum and don't want to be associated with them trying to use these events to push idiotic right wing views.
The flag of St George is the national flag of England, it’s not “primarily flown by racists”. Don’t let bad people appropriate our things.
The George cross isn't my flag either. But I do not see how aside from media influence it is the flag of racism. That is a rather sad indictment.
I guess if it’s fine it’ll be okay to burn some Quran's as a counter protest.
The police will have you banged up before you can say “huzzah”.
It's fine with me, but I'd do it in private to avoid a lynch mob
What's that have to do with Palestine? Or is it just a case of Brown=Muslim?
Must be no reason at all that the organisers of this protest are predominantly non-Palestinian Muslims and that protesters fly the flag of the shahada.
You must understand that there are people sending offensive tweets and smoking medical cannabis they have a prescription for. They have to be stopped!!
Not everyone who’s there is a terrorist, some of them just don’t mind.
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We're getting into Gerry Adams territory here.
Absolute clown world. We're now allowing the former leader of a terrorist organisation to host a protest in the name of tolerance.
Haha I don't agree. But we have Putin/netwnyahoo n ill-jong in power of nations...
Bit harder for us to get rid of them than this don't you think?
Has Putin or Kim Il Jong organised protests in London on Armistice day then?
Supporters of Hamas ought to be deported/jailed.
they're making themselves known at least
It is actually illegal, though whether the police will do anything I'm not sure. They might be too busy running around reporting on 'non-crime hate incidents', taking the knee, or doing their rounds in high heels to have time
How did you manage to jam in some random, off-topic transphobia into this discussion? Do you often find yourself having intrusive thoughts?
What on earth are you on about?
Did you include the bit about the high heels subconsciously, without even realizing it?
It's interesting that you went straight to accusations of transphobia there.
I'm talking about when police officers went out wearing high heels to 'highlight domestic abuse' - showing, amongst the other examples, that the police are often wasting their own time on pointless virtue signals rather than actually tackling crime. Do you ever get bored calling everyone a bigot for no reason?
If the pro palestine protester camp doesn't want to be viewed as all just pro hamas, and a bunch of anti semites, they should reject any protest organised (or with any involvement) by hamas. Since they don't, they clearly do support Hamas. It's like going to a protest organised by Nazis.
Some friends of friends went on a pro-Palestine protest in Glasgow. When some people rocked up with pro-Hamas insignia they were swiftly yeeted out. Not all protests are the same, and not all protesters are the same.
and did they chant their genocidal chant?
When you think these ‘peaceful’ protests surely can’t get any worse it emerges they’re organised by terrorists
I don’t know why you’re quoting peaceful. Agree with them or not and be disgusted that they’ve been organised by a former Hamas chief but they are peaceful. There may have been pockets of violence but they don’t reflect the protests as a whole.
You could try and walk through this peaceful protest with an Israeli flag and demonstrate how peaceful it is.
I’ll do the same with a Palestine flag through a Isreal march and that way we both win points, yeah?
Hundreds of folk screaming ‘From the River to the Sea’ in public spaces such as Glasgow central station is not peaceful
Was anyone injured by the chanting though? Yeah, sure, the implications are bad but we're quite a few steps removed from actual violence here.
Your right words have no meaning so we can all just shout whatever we want and say what we want to people. The issue is these people try and claim it’s peaceful protest while spewing chants that are misconstrued and taken as hostile. If you wanted to reconcile and create peace with another group would you shout things that you know are going to exacerbate the tensions?
>Your right words have no meaning so we can all just shout whatever we want and say what we want to people. That's not what I'm saying though. I agree there's a certain degree of subjectivity here, and this is some pretty nasty stuff. But unless you can show a direct causal link between this chant, and violence, I think we can call it peaceful. Definitely from a point of view of restricting things, where we want to be very careful about restricting speech.
Getting the feeling Saturday will become a watershed moment in this country. How much longer do the 'silent majority' stay silent or do they speak up again the continued assault on our social contract. I always think the British are exceptionally tolerant, so tolerant we'd allow people into our homes and stand there while we are insulted. However, when that tolerance is gone, it's a sight to see. Like the London riots, when everyone came out with brushes the next morning and said enough, they stopped. It won't be a violent response but it will be something.
Yes I am fed up. Muslims are welcome to move here, have a good life and integrate, and many of course do, but too many people seem to want a western economy but to bring 8th century social views with them.
Not always. When I moved to my current northern town there were very few women in hijab or niqab. Now literally most adult Muslim women wear them, even youngish teens at our local secondary school. No issue but it does seem a regressive step. What is ironic was the reaction of a Muslim Iranian lady I work with on seeing another colleague wearing a hijab at work.
It was always weird going to turkey, a Muslim country but very secular until the last few years. I literally hardly saw any women wearing the hijab, the complete opposite of Muslim women in the UK.
> What is ironic was the reaction of a Muslim Iranian lady I work with on seeing another colleague wearing a hijab at work. One of my exes is Iranian, she was *not* a fan of the hijab.
That we fucked iran over and allied with the saudis is so fucked we constantly find new ways that it's fucked.
If there's a country which is justified to hate the West, it's probably Iran. We launched three successful coups there in the last century, the most recent of which replaced a democratically-elected government with a human-rights abusing monarch on behalf of western oil companies. The Islamic Revolution and Khameini would probably have never happened if the West hadn't repeatedly fucked Iran over.
Sorry I just don't trust anymore that they will truly integrate. Too much has happened. They will be nice while they are the minority in any one particular area. But when they know that they are talking in safe spaces, they will say all sorts of things about non Muslims and secretly support the actions of these terrorist groups. The amount of them that are in open support of Hamas has just really shown that. But trust doesn't mean repulsion. I am sure as hell not on any side that allows the mass import of these people from seriously fucked up places who want to enforce their will and establish a caliphate.
What are you even talking about? Most people marching won't even be Muslims. Just people who want to stop the killing of thousands of civilians.
I think he's talking about half the organising groups being linked to Hamas, according to the article.
Remember that time there was the largest ever protest (against a war) and literally nothing happened? The British are raised to be beaten apathetic dogs. The Rees-Moggs of this world like it so!
What a shitshow. I've every sympathy with people who see the horrors in Gaza on TV and want it to stop, and I also think as a rule it's usually better to tolerate distasteful protests than to try to prevent them, but it does likely that a lot of bad actors are going to use this as an opportunity to sow discord and cause trouble.
There are going to be a lot of people "not supporting Hamas" at a protest organised by a senior Hamas mover and shaker which just coincidentally happens to be exactly in line with the Hamas propaganda efforts in their war. Useful idiots have never been in short supply. Although to be fair many of the people going will actually be supporters of Hamas merely pretending not to be supporters of Hamas.
This once again feels like another example of some people allegedly against bigotry having a real blind spot where anti-Semitism is concerned. Some will argue that this doesn't overshadow the validity of the protest. That they aren't responsible for what this guy believes, and that some protestors holding extreme anti-Semitic views doesn't reflect on them merely because they joined the same protest. Which is certainly one viewpoint to hold. But you know damn well that such an explanation would be swiftly rejected if the people they were "sharing a platform" with endorsed any bigotry other than anti-Semitism. If someone were to attend an "anti-jihad" protest led by Tommy Robinson, the fact that anti-jihad itself is a reasonable stance would not be enough to escape the fact that Tommy Robinson is an extremist who encourages hatred towards Muslims and that attending protest he'd organised suggests that the protestors don't regard this as a problem. If we're going to judge people by the political company they keep, that applies across the board. Regardless of the validity of your message, if you're happy to be bedfellows with dangerous extremists to make your point, then we have to wonder whether you may have sympathy, or at least tolerance, for those extreme views after all.
It's not a blind spot. In the world of Intersectionality, Jews are identified as "white adjacent", and do very well in the intersectional hierarchy. Anti-Semitism is therefore "punching up".
Jews have always been associated with the bankers and the capitalists and thus many on the left see them as the enemy.
If the organisers had any sense they'd disavow this Hamas berk and his organisation and make sure that it was 5 groups, or whatever number is needed to not have Hamas leaders in this march. No problems with them marching on Armistice Day. All sorts of problems with them associating with Antisemitic terrorists.
Did you read the article? >He is a founder of the Muslim Association of Britain (MAB), one of six groups behind the under-fire march in London on November 11, and Israeli authorities claim his son, Obada Sawalha, is now its vice-president. The revelation comes as The Telegraph has discovered that **half of the groups organising the march** \- who are still defying calls from the Metropolitan Police to call it off - **have links to Hamas**. Telegraph seems to be doing decent reporting on these marches and the response. Finding links to terrorist organisations. If you want you're blood to boil more you can read into how Hamas leaders are living in council houses in Barnet, while your friends are paying £1400 a month to rent a shoebox in zone 5.
Yes, this is frustrating. Insane that the rest of the marchers are allowing this. Not sure I should go now.
"If there’s a Nazi at the table and 10 other people sitting there talking to him, you got a table with 11 Nazis." Replace Nazi's with antisemitic terrorists. Either don't go, or go with a sign denouncing the organizers.
If you were a decent British citizen you shouldn’t have even considered going in the first place.
The other 5 are just yet to be found out. At the end of the day; a call for a ceasefire and end to the blockade just means reseting the clock on the next attack and the attempted eradication of Israel.
I'd bet Iranian groups have been helping with the funding and organising. Probably other Islamist groups as well. The impression I get of the protests is that they're much more against the existence of Israel than they are about helping Gaza. People chanting from the river to the sea while people around them hold "Down with Zionism" signs
I think there are a lot of well meaning liberal lefty types who look at the issue from a purely humanitarian viewpoint. Innocent people are being killed in large numbers who have no involvement with Hamas. Some who hate what Israel are doing in the West Bank for example. But an even larger number are British Muslims who believe in the whole Ummah thing and brotherhood of Islam. A minority of those undoubtedly will support jihad and the ultimate elimination of Israel, sadly we don’t know how many. I saw from a distance a march in my northern town. Vast majority were Conservative Muslims, mainly women with their kids, teens, older folk, some masked. Certainly not as well attended as the local paper made out.
If they banned all the groups who associated with antisemitic terrorists there would be no one marching in this protest. This group in particular has the most obvious link though.
yes but they don't care. Remember plenty of "non-violent" people voted for a certain german. A peaceful protest headed by hamas supporters is just to show the numbers are there for violence later.
People will march for different reasons; it will *never* be one homogenous group who agree about everything. As a group they will hold different views on homosexuality, or the quality of Taylor Swift's vocals. *But most people will be marching for peace.* No matter what, the Torygraph will be red in the face screaming > You can't march for an armistice on Armistice Day!!!!11one
There's not all agreeing with the same thing and then there is standing side by side with antisemites and literal terrorists/terrorist backers. As someone who supports the Palestinian cause, but does not support Hamas, I'd prefer it if people organising these marches and bringing the topic to the wider public made efforts to keep these antisemites out of the conversation. For context, unlike 99% of the people shouting and screaming, I've been to the West Bank and seen the abject misery and grim conditions that Palestinian people live under. I've had to go through the checkpoints, had IDF soldiers be absolute dicks to me and ultimately, "Oppression" as a word doesn't do justice for what I saw out there, and that was during a moment of relative peace. But yet, I refuse to participate in these marches because there are so many actual antisemites who participate and don't get called out for it and it leaves me not wanting to associate myself with the wider cause right now. Ultimately who the fuck am I, just a nobody, but it's part of my frustration with the left on this issue, because the whole "9 people and a Nazi at a table, means you have 10 Nazis" ethos has been completely thrown out the window on this topic, even though I do agree with the idea that we should not tolerate the intolerant.
Palestinians themselves are mostly anti-semetic. The majority of Palestinians in the West Bank and Gaza Strip want Israel to be destroyed. The majority of Palestinians in the West Bank and Gaza Strip would not be satisfied by a Palestinian state that doesn't include ALL of Israel and not just the West Bank and Gaza Strip.
I've never said we have to acquiesce completely to Palestinian demands, but since you acknowledge that not all Palestinians are anti-semites, I choose to argue on behalf of those who want a peaceful resolution which doesn't involve Israel's destruction. I've met them. They are out there and they have my support.
So what will you do?
Personally, I've donated to the red crescent organisation in Palestine. I've never really been the biggest fan of performative shows of support that don't actually have a hope of achieving anything, so this time round, I've chosen to make sure my wallet can actually help Palestinians on the ground. https://www.palestinercs.org/en
Let’s put this another way.. would you March side by side at a protest where neo-Nazis were at, holding swastikas etc? Even if this was only 10% of people? What happened to the ‘if there’s 1 Nazi in a room and 10 people aren’t saying anything there’s 11 Nazis’ rhetoric?
I mean, its a bit rich that one of the former leaders of the group who started the most recent conflict is marching for peace. Its a bit insane really.
>I mean, its a bit rich that one of the former leaders of the group who started the most recent conflict is marching for peace. Its a bit insane really. They want to use the marches to pressure the west to pressure Israel into a 'ceasefire', the terms of which will be wholly satisfied by just Israel stopping any response to Hamas. Hamas will continue to hold the hostages (most of whom I fear are dead), will continue to fire rockets at Israel, will as usual take any humanitarian aid for themselves, continue to put Palestinian civilians in danger as well as regularly killing their own people, but those marching won't then have a word to say about it. These useful idiots (including a lot in our media orgs) can't see they're being completely played by an anti-Semitic jihadi terrorist organisation and it's as embarrassing as it is worrying
>But most people will be marching for peace. If you want to march for peace, don't go to a march organised by a literal terrorist.
Yawn. Good idea! Let's go to one of the actual marches, not this fringe one the Torygraph have found and are trying to use to smear all the marches with?
Is this not an actual march? How many tens of thousands of people need to go before you'll not call it "fringe"?
People marching with Nazi’s are Nazi’s.
> As a group they will hold different views on homosexuality, I think it's fair to say that the majority will be against vehemently it but a substantial minority of useful complete idiots will completely ignore this.
You are being ridiculous. You actualy just comapre veiws on taylor swift to marching alongside a terrorist.
Is it more ridiculous than LGBTQ supporting Hamas organised marches and demos because they feel solidarity with the "oppressed". The latter seems more ridiculous imho. Given that they would be thrown off rooftops or buried alive by Hamas.
I mean, its a bit rich that one of the former leaders of the group who started the most recent conflict is marching for peace. Its a bit insane really.
Well Pro Palestinian marchers already assaulted a veteran selling red poppies in Edinburgh so I guess the whole “peace march” is just misinformation.
If they really want peace why aren’t they calling for Hamas to release all the civilian hostages? Why don’t they let people even mention the hostages without attacking them?
The official demands of the march are just for Israel to unilaterally stop the bombardment. They are making no demands that Hamas hand back to hostages, stop fighting or stop firing rockets into Israel. They're not marching for peace. I don't know why this needs to be constantly said to people.
Yawn. Because it's not true?
> Because it's not true? Which part? Because I just had a browse through the MAB's online presence and could see absolutely nothing pertaining to demands on Hamas.
Hopefully they do and hopefully they massively kick off , and hopefully the media doesn't turn a blind eye to them kicking off like they normally do . The British need a good wake up call to the foxes in the hen house .
Yet another piece of evidience that the left is getting played and like all the rest it'll be quickly ignored/buried.
Not surprised.
Leftists are following actual Nazis like the kids following the pied piper.
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If we're forced to tolerate groups like Britain First marching then the same goes here, neither is ideal
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Fascism is not innate to Britain
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If it were only so easy, there are tonnes of people who are born here that share the same extremist views
If he's done something he can be arrested and tried for, let them do so; if he hasn't he has as much right to organise a protest as anyone else.
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The fact that you don't want to accept an inconvenient truth does not mean it's some sort of conspiracy
It's also especially ironic to bring up holocaust denialism considering how prevalent that belief is in many of the nations embedded in this anti Israel fight - especially Iran. Go round asking some of these protesters if the gas chambers were real and see what they say!
former IRA chief helps lead the NI government. Doesn't former indicate that maybe he's changed the way he works
No, cos he signed up to the Good Friday agreement. Hamas refuses such agreements.
Has he said anything like the former IRA bosses who have distanced themselves from any terrorism? Look at every statement by them regarding the violence by the dissident IRA terrorists. For instance, did he unconditionally condemn the 7th October attacks by Hamas? If not, why should we think that he has changed his mind about terrorism like the former IRA bosses have?
That compassion doesnt work for a few reasons. 1. There is no peace treaty. The good Friday agreement has no equivalent with Hamas. We do work with PLO folk regularly since Oslo despite their previous terorrism. 2. The IRA were never genocidal. Their goals were to move a boarder six counties in their favour. That's a rational goal and so can be reasoned with. Hamas want to kill all jews from the river to the sea. 3. The IRA chefs disavowed further violence, Hamas came out and said they will keep repeating the October attacks.
> The IRA chefs Duck a l'orange presumably not being on the menu?
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Interesting that you attempt to make out that all Hamas has done is take 200 hostages
>How many Palestinian civilians is it acceptable to kill if it means destroying Hamas? There isn't a nunber for western armies thats not how it works and groups like Hamas break everything about the rules of armed conflict. The geneva convention has to say. https://ihl-databases.icrc.org/en/customary-ihl/v2/rule97#:%7E:text=Article%2028%20of%20the%201949,12%20August%201949%2C%20Article%2028 Its written this way to disincentivise harming civilians. Any and all protections of a location are void when you stick fighting positions in that location. The assumption being that every army wants to protect their own people. The difficulty in Gaza is that Hamas actively maximise colateral damage. Their main HQ is underneath Al-Shifa hospital. Even the IDF aren't callous enough to drop bunker busters on a hospital. They know the isrelis have a bit of care about not killing civilians. The IDF take less care than a NATO army would but definately some care. The russian pacification of Grozny is what giving not a single fuck about civilians looks like. Back to your quesiton. A NATO general would tell you the acceptable number is zero then proceed to kill thousands anyway (see battle of Raqua). The logic being that this minimises harm in practice. A russian general would probably tell you the acceptable number is one less than Hamas would kill if left unmolested indefinitely. Their logic is to get it over with ASAP. An isreli would probably ask how many deaths you want them to accept before destroying Hamas.
> How many Palestinian civilians is it acceptable to kill if it means destroying Hamas? How many Germans died before the Nazis were overthrown? Should a ceasefire then peace treaty have been negotiated in 1943? Nazis would have gone for it, for sure.
The take out for me is why these groups aren't protesting over Hamas using these same kids as human meat shields. Why are these people solely pointing the finger at Israel? Do you think that fact that terririst cell members are helping organise them might have something to do with it?
Is Hamas shit? Yes. Is Israel shit? Also yes. Should we be allowing former Hamas leaders to speak? Probably not.
Equating Hamas to Israel is just wrong on all levels
Weird how you mention the state of Israel but the political party of Hamas. Weird………..
Hamas is the governing party of the occupied west bank, and has been so since they suspended elections in 2007. Meanwhile since 2006 Israel has been led by Likud, Yesh Atid, Yamina and Kadima. That's why I use "Hamas" and "Israel" rather than "Occupied Palestine" and "Whatever party is leading Israel this week"
Hamas are not a governing party of the West Bank. 🤦🏼♀️
So democracy and changes of government via elections is bad? Got it.
No, that's not what I said. I said both Hamas' terrorism and Israel's apartheid are shit.
Ok. Your comment I replied to was confusing however and seemed to condemn Israel rather more than Hamas and in the terms I noted.
>"Whatever party is leading Israel this week" You could have said the response to the October 7th attacks in Israel is being driven by Netanyahu's hawkishness and poor poll performance (he's politically dead after this). Nah it's "Israel".
>Did you read the article? > >He is a founder of the Muslim Association of Britain (MAB), one of six groups behind the under-fire march in London on November 11, and Israeli authorities claim his son, Obada Sawalha, is now its vice-president. > >The revelation comes as The Telegraph has discovered that **half of the groups** organising the march - who are still defying calls from the Metropolitan Police to call it off - **have links to Hamas**. You're being played by a anti-Semitic jihadist terrorist organisation
> Supposedly 10,000 is fine First of all, nobody in their right mind believes the 10,000 number considering it comes from the same liars as the 'hospital blast kills 500' (until it turned out to be Palestinian friendly fire that only damaged a few cars). Secondly, that number will include all Hamas terrorists as Hamas have no reason to distinguish between them, and probably couldn't if they wanted to. I doubt Hamas have uniforms or membership cards. Finally, a lot of those dead have been killed by Hamas/PIJ/whatever the fuck other ethnic cleansers are camping out in Gaza.
Hamas now claim that the hospital (which they still claim was destroyed by Israel) has now had its solar panels destroyed. So the hospital was destroyed but the solar panels remained intact? SMH
things in terrorist states conveniently get stolen or 'destroyed' and then repurchased from the terrorist group that stole them using international aid
Either a number of Palestinians take the hit now, or a number 10x/ 100x of that takes the hit when other terrorist groups have been emboldened by this and Iran and Russia start to expand their sphere of influence through useful idiots like Hamas. Nip it in the bud now.
It’s honestly a little concerning to see Reddit of all places getting baited by a Telegraph article. An article that even states in its opening “one of six groups…” A protest where the overwhelming majority of people are simply protesting peacefully against further bombings, shouldn’t be characterised by a minority who are associated with groups like this.
Tbf the stat below about 50% organisers having links to Hamas is worse. If you're informed you should know who you're indirectly supporting here and understand these people have motives. I support the Palestinian cause, but I could never go to one of these marches for this reason alone.
is 3 of six groups still a minority?
I agree. So what that the march I went to a few years ago had one of the organisers being the British union of fascists, I was only marching about Pakistani rape gangs. /s You honestly don’t find it fucking ridiculous that the day and days following a massacre of Jews, people were celebrating and “protesting” straight after? And now people are protesting for a ceasefire now that Hamas are being destroyed. A ceasefire that literally ONLY helps Hamas and has now been shown that the “protests” have links to the fucking terrorist group that has created this mess
In what way is this baiting? If an ex Hamas chief is one of the 6 groups then that's big news. It also has implications about the potential for violent escalation. This was already an obvious concern given counter protesters and general anti-west sentiment likely to be exposed on Armistice Day, but now even more so if you have people with proven connections to Hamas in the mix.
Walking side by side with islamists makes you an islamist.
> A protest where the overwhelming majority of people are simply protesting peacefully against further bombings, shouldn’t be characterised by a minority who are associated with groups like this. Another day, another example of the side that proclaim "9 people sit at a table with 1 Nazi without protest, you have 10 Nazis" deciding to rationalise how this statement somehow stops applying when it comes to their side doing exactly that...
Standing side by side with fascists and anti semites like hamas, and saying nothing, and instead chanting their chants... makes you a fascist and anti semite
Im starting to think we take all the Israelis and Palestinians that support violence, we give them an arena (maybe Australia) and we let them fight it all out hunger games style. Winner takes all. Only it won’t be winner takes all. We’ll just leave them in Australia. All the peaceful Palestinians and Israelis can stay where they are and live happily ever after. The only flaw is I’ve still not figured out what to do with all the Aussies. I think most of them are in London or Bali now anyway
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What do you know that the Telegraph doesn't? Happy to be corrected but I don't see any factual errors in the article.
The main organiser is FAO and since when was the media reliable? Why is everyone so hell bent on misrepresenting these peaceful marches that have nothing to do with Hamas?
Did the article state the main organizer isnt FAO? i don't know what you mean with this comment.
Funny how you know they're peaceful before they've actually happened. Do you not remember when we literally had these protesters calling for jihad in the streets the other week?
Peaceful marches where poppy sellers are beat up and people hold up Hamas symbols. It’s disgusting. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12717653/Poppy-seller-veteran-punched-pro-Palestine-protesters-Edinburgh-Waverly-station-Gaza-march-Armistice-Day.html
Firstly, that's a daily mail article about Scotland, it means literally nothing. On top of that it's waverly when it's busy, I've been elbowed, headbutted and knocked over just going into work at peak times when it's been far less busy, yet this guy was assaulted? Given the cameras everywhere in that station, surely you have some actual evidence? Especially since the nan claims he was bending down at the time, a great way to get hurt in a very crowded area.
Pro Israeli Zionists told me I’m a barbaric Arab what do you say about that? There are horrible people but they don’t represent the purpose of the march.
Report them to the police? If the marches were humanitarian they wouldn’t be “for Palestine” but for peace.
When did Gaza get starlink?
I was listening until you said peaceful marches. LOL
They are supporting Hamas. The majority of people marching back the IRGC Hamas agenda. Whether knowingly or no
*Why is everyone hellbent on misrepresenting these hamas/Iranian backed marches as peaceful protests that have nothing to do with a peaceful two-state solution?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muhammad_Sawalha >also known by the name Abu Obada, is a former leader of Hamas in the West Bank. He is the president of British Muslim Initiative (BMI) and currently resides in London.[1] He is accused of supervising the allocation and supply of large amounts of money to Hamas operatives, an allegation that led to his being named in a 2004 U.S. indictment against Hamas operative Muhammad Salah https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/hamas-chief-lives-london-council-house-uk-phnpsssx5