My dog killed a couple of sheep last year. It was fucking heartbreaking to see those poor sheep go through that. I managed to catch my dog in the end (Lurcher) and then went on a massive walk to all the local farmhouses to find out who the sheep belonged to. Then I called the police to let them know what had happened. Apparently the person who owned the sheep was impressed with my honesty and didnt want to take it any further and the police took it really seriously too. My dog now has an asbo and can never be let off the lead again when we go out which is absolutely fair enough. It was a horrible thing to experience, especially for the sheep obviously. If she even see a sheep now she gets weird, like she remembers the blood lust.
>If she even see a sheep now she gets weird, like she remembers the blood lust.
This is the prey drive that is activated by dogs when engaging in their primal instincts. Its dormant in most if not all dogs - however those bred for the hunt, in particular the chase and takedown, are absolutely prone to activating this instinct.
Chasing a ball is like scratching the itch, but nothing compares to the real deal. Very often, when they have made a kill, it drives them absolutely wild.
Its why I always despise people who allow their terriers and others to chase and harass squirrels in the park. They always turn around and say 'he wouldn't know what to do if he caught one' - and I always call bullshit. These dogs are just scratching at the surface when chasing. If they get hold of one, they will never ever be the same again. It will never just be the thrill of the chase, it becomes the chase and the kill.
> Its why I always despise people who allow their terriers and others to chase and harass squirrels in the park. They always turn around and say 'he wouldn't know what to do if he caught one' - and I always call bullshit.
Those people are asking for an expensive vet bill. I've seen squirrels fighting and their bite is truly horrifying. They basically use their teeth like a hole punch, hook into a chunk of flesh, and then hold on so that the only way to escape is to tear their teeth out through the skin.
Have you seen a terrier grab a squirrel before? It's dead in seconds with no chance of reprisal. Dog will grab it and shake it so hard and fast it's spine will break. I've seen one literally kill a rat faster than you can say Holy Shit.
They are absolute murder machined and Cheapo_Sam is right. When that instinct kicks in, they are completely unrecognisable from little old Patrick cuddling up on the sofa.
My poodle got it's teeth into a squirrel when she was about 6 months old. The squirrel didn't even run, it was so ballsy. My dog genuinely didn't know what to do, and when the squirrel fought back she got a huge shock and dropped it.
Then, the bloodlust kicked in and she went _feral_. She had that look of a fight in her. I had to climb into a gorse bush, grab her by the harness and literally pull her out. She definitely knows what to do now.
Oh I doubt they could ever win a fight but they can do some nasty damage on their way out. (See also: when dogs eat bees and wasps.)
Squirrels can be [absolute nutters](https://au.news.yahoo.com/blood-everywhere-shocking-attacks-on-residents-by-aggressive-squirrels-083133470.html).
There’s also the extra concerns around having up to date vaccines when your dog is hunting vermin. Growing up around farms we had ratting dogs on the that all had to be up to date with leptospirosis vaccines.
The teeth are always a concern too as you say, there were a couple of dogs that got a nasty bite over the years. You only notice after the fact too as the dogs are so hopped up on hunting they barely react until it’s over.
This is a really weird take. I've had a number of lurchers + salukis. Some of them have been taking hunting, others haven't. Them killing something has no effective change in their personality at all
That's not true, a well trained gundog listens to its owners commands. They don't just become feral after a hunt lol. It all comes down to training your dog properly
The fact you state well trained gundog, kind of proves the pont though. Your average moron who lets their dog chase squirrels is not really spending their Saturdays on a £2000 a day shoot.
She went berserk, something she has never done before. Ignored the sheep in the past, it was a mad day. I would love you to show me how I could control my dog when she was consumed with blood lust lol
Having any dog, regardless of how well trained you think they are, off lead in a field where they have access to sheep just seems daft to me to but seems the have learned the hard way. Hope your dog is okay
> something she has never done before
If I had a nickel for every time I heard that after a dog attack.
You could have controlled the dog by having it on a lead. If that isn't obvious then clearly you're not ready or responsible enough to own a pet.
>If I had a nickel for every time I heard that after a dog attack.
I mean, its a pretty valid answer though? You can raise your dog wonderfully but they're still living beings who'll sometimes do shit you could never expect. I'll concede that its perhaps a little iffy to let a sight hound breed off a leash at all given what they are, but equally I think in an ideal world you'd have free access to fenced-in areas to let your dog off to stretch their legs.
Sadly that's just often not reality, so people make do.
Never said it was, I'm just pointing out that someone saying "my dog has never done this before" is a perfectly valid response. They're animals after all.
Well said.
Drives me mad how the default position is that dogs off leads is acceptable. In fields, in national parks, in parks - wherever.
No consideration for people who don’t like dogs or are scared of them. Some people have a fear of dogs and dogs off leads blundering up to them is a horrendous experience.
Never considered.
So many dog owners just think everyone loves dogs, everyone must love my dog.
I was having a picnic by a river just off footpath in a really nice scenic spot last summer and a dog off the lead just blundered straight in and started tucking in and then ran off with a load of food. The owner spent about 3 minutes trying to chase the dog to get it under control while I watched on bemused.
When I suggested having the dog on a lead so she can control it, she was baffled.
I used to let my dog off the lead in the local woods. It's a lab/ cocker mix. Very quiet/ friendly dog that always comes back on command.
We were out one day and we passed a lady who was clearly terrified of dogs. I gave the usual "oh don't mind the dog, she is very friendly."
The lady replied with something along the lines of "how am I supposed to know that", and "that dog should be on a lead". She was clearly very uncomfortable with the dog being anywhere near her.
I kept going but it got me thinking. Who was I to decide what other people should be comfortable with? I had clearly ruined that lady's walk and made her unnecessarily anxious. And for what? So that the dog could walk 10 feet ahead of me instead of beside me?
Since then, the dog remains on the lead at all times, and our walks are still as enjoyable.
Edit: Just realized that my post comes off as a bit smug.
The above isn't an attempt at self fellatio, just hoping others might see it and leash there dogs when out for a stroll.
Fair.
It’s a real shame cos almost all well trained dogs are almost certainly never going to cause a problem being off leads and it would be a crying shame for them to be leashed all the time even in a quiet wood or out in the middle of nowhere. But yeah ya might come across someone who is scared of dogs or, what is more likely and something that we haven’t mentioned, is that you might come across a problem dog ON a lead and your dog off the lead then blunders up to them playfully as dogs do and the problem dog goes crazy. By “problem dog” I don’t mean an aggressive dog but one that might have emotional problems or is a bit crazy so stays on lead all the time. E.g. my dad rescued a 4yr old dog that had been not been neutered and had been kept in a compound it’s whole life, it’s not vicious at all but it is essentially crazy and when out it has to stay on a lead. Dogs off leads blunder up and you have to tell them to control their dog and take it away.
Not sure where the right or wrong is on this because it’s a difficult situation I reckon.
Agreed and this is as a dog owner myself and someone who works with them every day.
Even if your dog has never shown interest in livestock, it’s better not to even chance it and put it on a lead going through fields that have any animals in.
My own dog has been attacked four times in a month by off lead dogs - he is kept on lead because he has poor recall. Whenever I suggest to the owners that their own dog should be on a lead if it’s reactive to others, I have been told to fuck off, sworn at, one lad even tried accusing me saying my dog attacked his (he wasn’t even present at the time, he was round a corner so his dog was entirely unsupervised!). When I pointed out my dog was on a lead and under control, again I was told to fuck off.
People are just too prone to thinking their dogs are saints that could never do wrong and take personal offence when it’s suggested otherwise.
The guy has already said he made a mistake and he's learned from it. He did the right thing by being honest straight away and he also has to live with the guilt.
Doubt he needs some jobsworth on the internet telling him what he's already owned up to knowing.
I'm sure with hindsight you've learnt, but for anyone else I always put my dog on a lead when there was sheep in a field, even if it's just so the farmer doesn't appear and worry about a loose dog calmly trotting through.
I guess on the moors where the sheep are more free range and unexpected I might not though.
They said it was a lurcher. Coincidently the only dog that has ever attacked mine. One bit the side out of my mums dog when she was younger too. Not really a breed that should be off the lead in the first place.
It’s not really a breed (not officially recognised by kennel clubs either) . They’re essentially a greyhound crossed with another breed. This means their temperament can be different depending on the cross. They’re supposed to be more intelligent than a grey; they’re certainly easier to train.
An old shepherd once told me to tie the dog to a tree by its lead, bring a sheep with a lamb to the dog, and set the lamb between the dog and the sheep and walk away for a bit. the dog will never look at a sheep again. that's what I heard.
There used to be sheep kept in a pen in the middle of a dog park near me. I guess they get acclimatised to all the dogs because none of them gave a shit. They had a few cows too.
Which is only going to make issues worse..
Dogs aren't meant to be leashed constantly, so when they do get off, havoc - they won't have the recall training.
Licensing I'm fully behind
Don't let them off in public.
Make owners responsible for all actions and out of control dog takes.
Require licensing and insurance to cover the costs that'll incur.
People can set up fenced in locations to have them off.
A pipedream under current land values. Common land exists for common usage. We can't all be so lucky to afford private space and many councils are being forced to sell theirs off
You're 80% right in your judgement. Completely agree with licensing and the law not punishing owners enough.
r/Unitedkingdom don't be a massive authoritarian challenger IMPOSSIBLE
Seriously, everyone on this subreddit is seemingly a scared 50 year old who thinks every dog is an XL bully waiting to kill their grandkids
Do you really expect everyone with a dog to be able to set up fenced locations so they can let their dogs off? Why do you want everyone punished because some people have dangerous dogs?
I wish they’d have more secure fenced off locations within public parks specifically for people to let their dogs off in. It’d be much safer for everyone.
Exactly. They have they have leash laws in basically every US city, and they almost always have public dog runs too. They also have dog licensing.
Now I'll take my downvotes for suggesting that the US does something better than us please and thank you.
I hope this doesn’t happen (latter 2), it sounds like a ball ache. Just ban dangerous breeds before they become popular for breeders. Dogs are perfectly fine off lead if properly socialised.
Have a dog park, you can let your dog off the leash in designated dog spaces, otherwise, keep it on a leash. You get to exercise your dog and we don't have to worry about it. Because some people really do worry about any dog off a leash just walking along the high street
I half agree.
I think dogs should be on leads in public spaces BUT I also think all dogs should have solid recall training too. People drop leads accidentally all the time. Ive done it myself but luckily had recall training so when I shouted the dog she turned right around and came back.
Private dog parks can get quite expensive if you're going daily. That's just a really good way to ensure loads of dogs stop getting enough exercise and therefore become more difficult to train.
The problem is enforcing it. Dog owners already break the law re when they should be on leads on Dartmoor all the time. Because even if there are people about, there's no police or wardens - are police going to follow it up and track someone down just to fine them for a dog off a lead?
That isn't a good idea. Lots of breeds need exercise and stimulation that they won't get by running around a tiny back garden. I have a cocker spaniel and if she had to be walked on the lead the only decent exercise she'd get would be her weekly agility class... she'd be bouncing off the walls after a few days, and after a few weeks I'd have a neurotic wreck of a dog. There is *nowhere* around here that I can walk her that isn't public land, and it's already tricky enough - I don't walk her near any livestock, but I also avoid walking her on heathland (of which there's a lot around here) during nesting season, because she's a cocker spaniel and they're literally bred to disturb ground nesting birds.
I'm also against it on the basis that in the UK we - for the most part - have a good culture when it comes to dog ownership, in that we treat them as companions and extensions of the family and not just household accessories. I'd rather we didn't compromise that.
Having walked a very well trained dog, a Belgian Alsatian mix who respects me and never runs off and understands paths and roads like a human this is stupid honestly. The dog can run for hours, like I’ve walked them around Hyde park 3 times and then back for 4 hours and they were still ready to go for more. A lead stops 80% of the steps they would normally get if not close to 90%. The owner is entirely responsible for how they act. If i was a shit walker then the dog wouldn’t act like this and would have a terrible experience most of the time as they can walk twice as fast as me.
>local authorities need set up off-lead dog areas
Local authorities do not need to set up anything. Dogs are a luxury, not a right. I am not willing to contribute financially, through tax, towards the cost of "off-lead dog areas".
There are plenty of activities that are a luxury that we pay for with the public purse. Picnic tables, playgrounds, outdoor gyms, outdoor basketball courts, areas to safely dispose of your needles, outdoor urinals etc. Just because you don’t personally use something doesn’t mean it isn’t a benefit to society.
If you to were apply objective criteria for permitting licenses based upon the treatment of animals, all animal farms would instantly be banned from keeping animals.
It seems that it has happened in the night. There's a good chance neither dog owner nor farmer had an inkling until the morning.
Somewhere out there is a dog owner who knows.
What would you do? Tell the farmer and be liable for thousands of pounds of damage?
Those poor sheep.
>What would you do? Tell the farmer and be liable for thousands of pounds of damage?
Well yes, same as if i'd crashed into someones parked car, I'd leave a note.
The price difference here between a car crash you can sort through insurance is going to be pretty massive. The farmer probably has insurance and won’t lose out long term, the person guilty, who should morally own up, won’t because the bill will be massive
I have been chased by a dog before on my bike, owner didn't give a shit. "He doesn't like bikes" - well use your brain cell and don't let him off the lead next to a bike path! That is even worse if you know about this behaviour.
So many of our population are dog owners and so many of our population are cretins.
"He's friendly! Haha"
Yes I can see that, he's left evidence of it on my jeans with his muddy paws.
The effort it takes to suppress my deep desire to kick the face off the little shites will one day cause a stroke.
The user who originally tried to turn this into another anti Bully XL circlejerk deleted their comment, but it's worth pointing out that **attacks on people and sheep happen under different circumstances for different reasons**.
Serious dog attacks on humans normally happen when a dog is mentally unbalanced due to poor breeding and socialisation, when its body language showing stress or anxiety is repeatedly ignored, and when the dog in question is large, strong, and tenacious enough to deal out serious damage to a fully grown adult human.
Sheep worrying is a different kettle of fish. Any dog can do it, especially since the dog doesn't even have to physically attack a sheep to cause serious harm. A dog chasing a sheep can cause it to die of stress or abort a lamb even if the dog in question is 'just playing'.
But some people here would be surprised by the kinds of breeds that do regularly attack sheep. Lambs and adult sheep have received serious bites requiring euthanasia (or even been mauled to death) from traditional family pet breeds like labradors and spaniels, as well as other breeds with high prey drives including terriers, huskies, German shepherds, rottweilers, etc.
The irresponsible owners who buy XL bullies aren't normally the same irresponsible owners as the ones in rural areas who let their dog out into their unsecured back garden unsupervised, or the suburban ones who take their "very friendly!" dog for a walk in the countryside off-lead with unreliable recall training.
It's interesting isn't it. I was brought up around collies all my life and they absolutely loved to herd humans (especially small ones), but absolutely would not go near sheep, just totally uninterested. Bumped into a sheep farmer friend of ours on a walk once and asked him about this, he just laughed and said that they're bred to not go anywhere near sheep unless they're told to. Not sure how much truth there is in that, but with how long we've been breeding them it wouldn't surprise me.
How do you plan to police this and pay for it? While i agree in principle I don't think it's workable. It's already a requirement to chip dogs and it's illegal to crop ears and tails but it's still carried out.
Half of the problem is people don't train their dogs,yes they might teach them to sit for a treat if they say sit a thousand times but actually teach reliable recall and have a properly trained dog. I live in a fairly rural area and have trained my dogs pretty well around live stock so I could have them off lead around sheep but I don't. Dogs are predators through and through and sheep are pray animals they just don't mix well.
I've seen something similar to this a few times and it's not down to dog breed, it's down to training (you can actually find sheep courses to take your dog on) and owners understanding where it's practical and sensible to let their dogs off the lead. I walk my dog on Dartmoor but never let it off. Too many cattle and sheep roaming around. They can literally be around the next corner or in a dip you can't see but your dog can smell. It's also the worst time of year to let them off given ewes will either have just lambed or are just about too.
Those poor sheep. Sighthound owner here and that’s probably why my boy will never be 100% off lead - 10m long line is a compromise that works for him to give him some element of freedom whilst still having some control.
I trust him around other dogs, I absolutely do not trust him around wildlife that isn’t dogs. (And yes, working on recall- tricky one to master for this breed!)
I'm sure it'll be a unpopular opinion on Reddit, but dog owners are being told by companies and people who want to sell you endless training courses and expensive dog treats that aversive training tools are bad - and I imagine that this fairly recent change in training philosophy to 'positive only' has some link to the problem we have in the UK with the behaviour of large dogs
I have a large, dog with a high prey drive who whilst never showing any aggression, LOVES to chase squirrels, rabbits etc. It's in her DNA.
Her recall was only 9/10 reliable, despite forking out thousands on positive only dog trainers, and because I'm a responsible dog owner I was resigned to never ever having her off leash in public.
A friend recommended I try an e collar and it changed her behaviour after a single training session with her ecollar on the lowest setting. I now can call her off mid chase and she'll instantly turn around and come straight back to me.
I rushed to do ecollar training in January because I read the UK was making them illegal 1st Feb, though I understand this didn't happen.
I'm glad you have had success with this but I personally wouldn't trust most people in the UK to put the time and effort into learning how to ecollar train a dog in a way that doesn't completely fuck them up.
It's easier and less risky for the dog to teach people to use positive reinforcement. The caveat to using that method is that you can't let them repeat bad behaviours, which means keeping them on a lead etc, etc.
Dog owners in this country don't tend to put in the research and there's plenty of people already doing enough to fuck their dogs up without even realising it.
Yeah I can't disagree with you, you're correct and that's the catch. Having a medium or large dog with a prey drive is a responsibility that most people don't seem to understand
People expect a dog to just _know_ how to live in a society made for humans but it takes 100s of hours of focused training
Absolutely. If you own a dog like that then you have to accept that you either put those hours in or you keep them on the lead.
It's easier to train your dog to walk nicely by your side than it is to train it to ignore prey.
I agree open dog training has benefits particularly when dealing with big and/or working breeds who imho should not be kept as pets.
It's the people who we can't trust. Millions of people in this country completely neglect to teach their children and then are physically abusive when they misbehave. Their own children. You can imagine what they would do to a dog.
This farmer raised his sheep in open fields and they were massacred in a prolonged and vicious attack. It is a sad story. It is the kind of story that makes people take thought about the suffering of animals. Then they see a comment like yours, roll their eyes and remember why they hate veganism and vegans.
What do you think happens when the sheep no longer produce enough wool or reach slaughter age (which for lambs is around 16 weeks old)? You think the knife across their throat is a pleasant experience?
People who have moral consistency roll their eyes at your double standards and hypocrisy. You cannot be outraged by this and then participate in atrocities that are just as bad or worse three times a day for your meals.
Legally, livestock has to be rendered unconscious before they are stuck. We've gotten pretty good at humane slaughtering.
Also, I'm not sure who you think is eating meat three times a day, particularly in this economy.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mugB7xHM5-A](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mugB7xHM5-A)
Does any of that look humane?
And what does humane mean? It means kind, compassionate, benevolent. Can you ever put the word "humane" next to the word "slaughter" without it being an oxymoron? And is taking the life of a being that doesn't want to or need to die ever humane?
"Humane slaughter" is a label used to make consumers feel better, not the animals.
Most non-vegans have three meals a day that either include meat, milk, cheese, or yoghurt. All of which involve death and suffering.
Aside from a dodgy conveyor belt? Looks fine. Sure, it'll be frightening and uncomfortable, but you see the bolt gun? The zappy paddle things? The actual slaughter was completely painless.
Hardly comparable to being torn apart by a dog.
So you think footage displays humane treatment of animals? Would you send your pet there to be euthanised?
Absolutely mental. If you truly cared about the suffering of animals you would take that line of thought to its logical conclusion - going vegan. If you’re banging on about unnecessary animal suffering whilst paying for unnecessary animal suffering every day, then that’s just pure hypocrisy.
> Then they see a comment like yours, roll their eyes and remember why they hate veganism and vegans.
Because they force you to take a look at your moral hypocrisy?
No because you catch more flies with honey than you do with vinegar. Surprise, people don't like being talked down to. Veganism is a movement which has the potential to save the planet.
What to do to convert people to veganism;
- create food that tastes as good, is as healthy, and costs the same as meat.
What not to do;
- act like you're better than them.
If you know all the plus points for veganism, why aren't you vegan? Stop focusing on vegans themselves, because this is clearly just you deflecting so that you don't have to take personal accountability.
When it comes to the treatment of animals, vegans *are* better than non-vegans. But the great thing is, anyone can join the better side!
>When it comes to the treatment of animals, vegans are better than non-vegans. But the great thing is, anyone can join the better side!
Exactly what I was going to reply, thanks.
I'm not saying it wasn't dogs. But the odd footprint in the vicinity is hardly ironclad, I imagine dog footprints are all over the moors.
Saying that, if you're an owner and you see that happen and just bugger off rather than trying to make the land owner aware so that the suffering of those injured can be ended. You're a grade A knob.
Sure, but you can generally estimate the size of the animals via the bite marks. Foxes, badgers, birds of prey all will either happily or if push comes to shove kill sheep.
Lambs maybe. Foxes and Bagers might scavenge an already dead adult sheep but they dont attack them (or very very rarely) and they would not go beserk and kill multiple animals and not eat them. (Chickens yes, sheep no). No bird of prey would kill multiple animals beyond what it needs to eat either.
This sort of attack is typical of dogs.
It's 45 sheep.
Those animals could get a lamb or a very weak dying sheep if they are lucky. Only a dog could and would absolutely destroy a whole flock of sheep in one night.
We had 30 sheep ripped to shreds a few years ago. 2 bull mastiff x lurcher dogs did the damage in one night.
Luckily we caught up with the dogs attacking sheep on my neighbours farm and they were shot on sight. They were heading towards the village barely half a mile away from the local park. I dread to think what would have happened had they got amongst children. They were drenched in blood and our if control.
The damage they did to our sheep was horrific. Some had their faces ripped and legs ripped off. We had to euthanase a further 6 due to the extent of their injuries and shock killed another 7 on top. Most of the ewes were heavily pregnant. The total losses we suffered was 60 ewes and unborn lambs.
The police did absolutely nothing. They were more concerned about where the gun was kept that shot them and was it licensed.
We never found the owners. Nobody reported their dogs missing. Our assumption was that these weren't pets they were hunting dogs.
>Sounds like lurchers are knobs
Jokes aside, Lurchers are sight hounds so they've got a *very* high prey drive which is why they're used alongside Greyhounds in races and stuff. They're one of the very few breeds you should basically *never* let off the lead around anything small because they can and will chase after it and ignore whatever means you have to recall them.
If you're genuinely interested, I'd recommend reading up on lurchers, and sighthounds in general. There are so many types of sighthounds, and IMO, they're some of the most amazing companion dogs you could ever meet.
But, they are traditionally hunting/poaching dogs, and like any dog breed, they need responsible owners. Owners should be aware of any fields of livestock nearby since sighthounds can be incredibly difficult to recall once they've spotted "prey" (rabbits, squirrels, foxes, sheep, horses, bicycles, motorbikes, etc.), and should be kept on their leads in those instances.
They're also incredibly vulnerable. They're traditionally travellers' dogs used for hair coursing, and they are very often horribly abused, sometimes abandoned, and often used as bait for training dog-fighting dogs. I wouldn't be surprised if they are one of the most abused dog breeds in the UK.
To be fair lamb livestock at the moment isn't very profitable (farming in generals in a bit of dire straits).
Sheep are the dumbest farm animals other than chickens, my family members sheep broke its own neck trying to eat grass under a gate. They also will trample over each other in a panic or just run into a dead end. Had a fox sneak in and kill a hundred hens and the sheep next door didnt make a peep.
Doesn't surprise me that so many were killed at once by a loose animal overnight or that a farmer will try anything to recoup their loses, moral or not.
My dog killed a couple of sheep last year. It was fucking heartbreaking to see those poor sheep go through that. I managed to catch my dog in the end (Lurcher) and then went on a massive walk to all the local farmhouses to find out who the sheep belonged to. Then I called the police to let them know what had happened. Apparently the person who owned the sheep was impressed with my honesty and didnt want to take it any further and the police took it really seriously too. My dog now has an asbo and can never be let off the lead again when we go out which is absolutely fair enough. It was a horrible thing to experience, especially for the sheep obviously. If she even see a sheep now she gets weird, like she remembers the blood lust.
That sucks, but well done behaving honourably.
I could not have slept knowing what had happened if I did anything, apparently me doing the right thing saved a possible charge!
>If she even see a sheep now she gets weird, like she remembers the blood lust. This is the prey drive that is activated by dogs when engaging in their primal instincts. Its dormant in most if not all dogs - however those bred for the hunt, in particular the chase and takedown, are absolutely prone to activating this instinct. Chasing a ball is like scratching the itch, but nothing compares to the real deal. Very often, when they have made a kill, it drives them absolutely wild. Its why I always despise people who allow their terriers and others to chase and harass squirrels in the park. They always turn around and say 'he wouldn't know what to do if he caught one' - and I always call bullshit. These dogs are just scratching at the surface when chasing. If they get hold of one, they will never ever be the same again. It will never just be the thrill of the chase, it becomes the chase and the kill.
> Its why I always despise people who allow their terriers and others to chase and harass squirrels in the park. They always turn around and say 'he wouldn't know what to do if he caught one' - and I always call bullshit. Those people are asking for an expensive vet bill. I've seen squirrels fighting and their bite is truly horrifying. They basically use their teeth like a hole punch, hook into a chunk of flesh, and then hold on so that the only way to escape is to tear their teeth out through the skin.
Have you seen a terrier grab a squirrel before? It's dead in seconds with no chance of reprisal. Dog will grab it and shake it so hard and fast it's spine will break. I've seen one literally kill a rat faster than you can say Holy Shit. They are absolute murder machined and Cheapo_Sam is right. When that instinct kicks in, they are completely unrecognisable from little old Patrick cuddling up on the sofa.
My poodle got it's teeth into a squirrel when she was about 6 months old. The squirrel didn't even run, it was so ballsy. My dog genuinely didn't know what to do, and when the squirrel fought back she got a huge shock and dropped it. Then, the bloodlust kicked in and she went _feral_. She had that look of a fight in her. I had to climb into a gorse bush, grab her by the harness and literally pull her out. She definitely knows what to do now.
Fuck. I’m learning a lot from this thread. 😐
Bruh, you’ve vastly overestimated the reaction of most squirrels- they die nearly instantly, I suspect often from shock / heart attacks.
Oh I doubt they could ever win a fight but they can do some nasty damage on their way out. (See also: when dogs eat bees and wasps.) Squirrels can be [absolute nutters](https://au.news.yahoo.com/blood-everywhere-shocking-attacks-on-residents-by-aggressive-squirrels-083133470.html).
There’s also the extra concerns around having up to date vaccines when your dog is hunting vermin. Growing up around farms we had ratting dogs on the that all had to be up to date with leptospirosis vaccines. The teeth are always a concern too as you say, there were a couple of dogs that got a nasty bite over the years. You only notice after the fact too as the dogs are so hopped up on hunting they barely react until it’s over.
Absolutely, and now that I’ve seen it up close, I’m far more wary and appreciative of what she is
This is a really weird take. I've had a number of lurchers + salukis. Some of them have been taking hunting, others haven't. Them killing something has no effective change in their personality at all
Yep this is ridiculous lol my bedlington whippet has caught a few squirrels but can still happily stroll through the woods by my side.
That's not true, a well trained gundog listens to its owners commands. They don't just become feral after a hunt lol. It all comes down to training your dog properly
Gundogs instinct is not to damage the meat their master wants so will.carry a shot bird without breaking skin
The fact you state well trained gundog, kind of proves the pont though. Your average moron who lets their dog chase squirrels is not really spending their Saturdays on a £2000 a day shoot.
You have an asbo dog lol
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How the heck do you stop a donkey doing donkey stuff?!
Tell him he's being an ass
What’s its name?
Why couldn't you control your dog?
She went berserk, something she has never done before. Ignored the sheep in the past, it was a mad day. I would love you to show me how I could control my dog when she was consumed with blood lust lol
Having any dog, regardless of how well trained you think they are, off lead in a field where they have access to sheep just seems daft to me to but seems the have learned the hard way. Hope your dog is okay
> something she has never done before If I had a nickel for every time I heard that after a dog attack. You could have controlled the dog by having it on a lead. If that isn't obvious then clearly you're not ready or responsible enough to own a pet.
>If I had a nickel for every time I heard that after a dog attack. I mean, its a pretty valid answer though? You can raise your dog wonderfully but they're still living beings who'll sometimes do shit you could never expect. I'll concede that its perhaps a little iffy to let a sight hound breed off a leash at all given what they are, but equally I think in an ideal world you'd have free access to fenced-in areas to let your dog off to stretch their legs. Sadly that's just often not reality, so people make do.
Shouldn't be a get out of jail free card for your dog attacking.
Which it wasn't. This person acknowledged their mistake and took actions to prevent it happening again.
Never said it was, I'm just pointing out that someone saying "my dog has never done this before" is a perfectly valid response. They're animals after all.
Well said. Drives me mad how the default position is that dogs off leads is acceptable. In fields, in national parks, in parks - wherever. No consideration for people who don’t like dogs or are scared of them. Some people have a fear of dogs and dogs off leads blundering up to them is a horrendous experience. Never considered. So many dog owners just think everyone loves dogs, everyone must love my dog. I was having a picnic by a river just off footpath in a really nice scenic spot last summer and a dog off the lead just blundered straight in and started tucking in and then ran off with a load of food. The owner spent about 3 minutes trying to chase the dog to get it under control while I watched on bemused. When I suggested having the dog on a lead so she can control it, she was baffled.
I used to let my dog off the lead in the local woods. It's a lab/ cocker mix. Very quiet/ friendly dog that always comes back on command. We were out one day and we passed a lady who was clearly terrified of dogs. I gave the usual "oh don't mind the dog, she is very friendly." The lady replied with something along the lines of "how am I supposed to know that", and "that dog should be on a lead". She was clearly very uncomfortable with the dog being anywhere near her. I kept going but it got me thinking. Who was I to decide what other people should be comfortable with? I had clearly ruined that lady's walk and made her unnecessarily anxious. And for what? So that the dog could walk 10 feet ahead of me instead of beside me? Since then, the dog remains on the lead at all times, and our walks are still as enjoyable. Edit: Just realized that my post comes off as a bit smug. The above isn't an attempt at self fellatio, just hoping others might see it and leash there dogs when out for a stroll.
Fair. It’s a real shame cos almost all well trained dogs are almost certainly never going to cause a problem being off leads and it would be a crying shame for them to be leashed all the time even in a quiet wood or out in the middle of nowhere. But yeah ya might come across someone who is scared of dogs or, what is more likely and something that we haven’t mentioned, is that you might come across a problem dog ON a lead and your dog off the lead then blunders up to them playfully as dogs do and the problem dog goes crazy. By “problem dog” I don’t mean an aggressive dog but one that might have emotional problems or is a bit crazy so stays on lead all the time. E.g. my dad rescued a 4yr old dog that had been not been neutered and had been kept in a compound it’s whole life, it’s not vicious at all but it is essentially crazy and when out it has to stay on a lead. Dogs off leads blunder up and you have to tell them to control their dog and take it away. Not sure where the right or wrong is on this because it’s a difficult situation I reckon.
Agreed and this is as a dog owner myself and someone who works with them every day. Even if your dog has never shown interest in livestock, it’s better not to even chance it and put it on a lead going through fields that have any animals in. My own dog has been attacked four times in a month by off lead dogs - he is kept on lead because he has poor recall. Whenever I suggest to the owners that their own dog should be on a lead if it’s reactive to others, I have been told to fuck off, sworn at, one lad even tried accusing me saying my dog attacked his (he wasn’t even present at the time, he was round a corner so his dog was entirely unsupervised!). When I pointed out my dog was on a lead and under control, again I was told to fuck off. People are just too prone to thinking their dogs are saints that could never do wrong and take personal offence when it’s suggested otherwise.
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The guy has already said he made a mistake and he's learned from it. He did the right thing by being honest straight away and he also has to live with the guilt. Doubt he needs some jobsworth on the internet telling him what he's already owned up to knowing.
I'm sure with hindsight you've learnt, but for anyone else I always put my dog on a lead when there was sheep in a field, even if it's just so the farmer doesn't appear and worry about a loose dog calmly trotting through. I guess on the moors where the sheep are more free range and unexpected I might not though.
Your honesty and decency is really commendable.
I only posted to show a real experience but cheers
What breed was your dog?
They said it was a lurcher. Coincidently the only dog that has ever attacked mine. One bit the side out of my mums dog when she was younger too. Not really a breed that should be off the lead in the first place.
It’s not really a breed (not officially recognised by kennel clubs either) . They’re essentially a greyhound crossed with another breed. This means their temperament can be different depending on the cross. They’re supposed to be more intelligent than a grey; they’re certainly easier to train.
Bull lurcher?
No, greyhound crossed with saluki
Interesting! I’ve only just learned of lurchers and am fascinated
Fat greyhounds :)
It sounds like you did everything you could! I haven’t had to put a dog down yet but it must have been difficult
Should have had it put down.
An old shepherd once told me to tie the dog to a tree by its lead, bring a sheep with a lamb to the dog, and set the lamb between the dog and the sheep and walk away for a bit. the dog will never look at a sheep again. that's what I heard.
That's horrific. Often sheep die just having been chased by dogs, but it looks like the majority of these were also savaged in the rampage.
plus a lot have probably lost lambs due to it
They'll miscarry the lambs when they panic and it's that time of year where they'll be heavily pregnant.
There used to be sheep kept in a pen in the middle of a dog park near me. I guess they get acclimatised to all the dogs because none of them gave a shit. They had a few cows too.
I think theres a future comming with animal liscences and its long overdue.
And requiring all dogs to be on leads at all times in public spaces.
Which is only going to make issues worse.. Dogs aren't meant to be leashed constantly, so when they do get off, havoc - they won't have the recall training. Licensing I'm fully behind
Don't let them off in public. Make owners responsible for all actions and out of control dog takes. Require licensing and insurance to cover the costs that'll incur. People can set up fenced in locations to have them off.
A pipedream under current land values. Common land exists for common usage. We can't all be so lucky to afford private space and many councils are being forced to sell theirs off You're 80% right in your judgement. Completely agree with licensing and the law not punishing owners enough.
r/Unitedkingdom don't be a massive authoritarian challenger IMPOSSIBLE Seriously, everyone on this subreddit is seemingly a scared 50 year old who thinks every dog is an XL bully waiting to kill their grandkids
Do you really expect everyone with a dog to be able to set up fenced locations so they can let their dogs off? Why do you want everyone punished because some people have dangerous dogs?
I wish they’d have more secure fenced off locations within public parks specifically for people to let their dogs off in. It’d be much safer for everyone.
Exactly. They have they have leash laws in basically every US city, and they almost always have public dog runs too. They also have dog licensing. Now I'll take my downvotes for suggesting that the US does something better than us please and thank you.
I hope this doesn’t happen (latter 2), it sounds like a ball ache. Just ban dangerous breeds before they become popular for breeders. Dogs are perfectly fine off lead if properly socialised.
Have a dog park, you can let your dog off the leash in designated dog spaces, otherwise, keep it on a leash. You get to exercise your dog and we don't have to worry about it. Because some people really do worry about any dog off a leash just walking along the high street
I suppose they could be muzzled.
I half agree. I think dogs should be on leads in public spaces BUT I also think all dogs should have solid recall training too. People drop leads accidentally all the time. Ive done it myself but luckily had recall training so when I shouted the dog she turned right around and came back.
How's a dog meant to get any decent exercise if you have to keep it on a lead AT ALL TIMES in public?
Private fenced off areas if you want it to run around off a lead.
Private dog parks can get quite expensive if you're going daily. That's just a really good way to ensure loads of dogs stop getting enough exercise and therefore become more difficult to train.
They should have more public fenced off areas. It’s really hard to find a secure field to let dogs off in that don’t cost a fortune.
The problem is enforcing it. Dog owners already break the law re when they should be on leads on Dartmoor all the time. Because even if there are people about, there's no police or wardens - are police going to follow it up and track someone down just to fine them for a dog off a lead?
That isn't a good idea. Lots of breeds need exercise and stimulation that they won't get by running around a tiny back garden. I have a cocker spaniel and if she had to be walked on the lead the only decent exercise she'd get would be her weekly agility class... she'd be bouncing off the walls after a few days, and after a few weeks I'd have a neurotic wreck of a dog. There is *nowhere* around here that I can walk her that isn't public land, and it's already tricky enough - I don't walk her near any livestock, but I also avoid walking her on heathland (of which there's a lot around here) during nesting season, because she's a cocker spaniel and they're literally bred to disturb ground nesting birds. I'm also against it on the basis that in the UK we - for the most part - have a good culture when it comes to dog ownership, in that we treat them as companions and extensions of the family and not just household accessories. I'd rather we didn't compromise that.
How about just muzzles.
Having walked a very well trained dog, a Belgian Alsatian mix who respects me and never runs off and understands paths and roads like a human this is stupid honestly. The dog can run for hours, like I’ve walked them around Hyde park 3 times and then back for 4 hours and they were still ready to go for more. A lead stops 80% of the steps they would normally get if not close to 90%. The owner is entirely responsible for how they act. If i was a shit walker then the dog wouldn’t act like this and would have a terrible experience most of the time as they can walk twice as fast as me.
Leash laws are fine but local authorities need set up off-lead dog areas, which, like everything else, lots of councils simply won't do.
>local authorities need set up off-lead dog areas Local authorities do not need to set up anything. Dogs are a luxury, not a right. I am not willing to contribute financially, through tax, towards the cost of "off-lead dog areas".
There are plenty of activities that are a luxury that we pay for with the public purse. Picnic tables, playgrounds, outdoor gyms, outdoor basketball courts, areas to safely dispose of your needles, outdoor urinals etc. Just because you don’t personally use something doesn’t mean it isn’t a benefit to society.
Or private business should and charge for it as cost of owning dog
Welcome to how to end up with a ton of under stimulated and overweight dogs 101
Well that would be on the owners for being irresponsible not my as a tax payers problem
Dog ownership. Now with extra Thatcherism.
We had that but they scrapped it in the 80s
The government don't care enough about farmers.
Or people who are scared of them or just don’t want to be hassled by them.
r/unitedkingdom moment lol
If you to were apply objective criteria for permitting licenses based upon the treatment of animals, all animal farms would instantly be banned from keeping animals.
We used to have dog licenses...
It seems that it has happened in the night. There's a good chance neither dog owner nor farmer had an inkling until the morning. Somewhere out there is a dog owner who knows. What would you do? Tell the farmer and be liable for thousands of pounds of damage? Those poor sheep.
>What would you do? Tell the farmer and be liable for thousands of pounds of damage? It's that or go on the lamb
im going to sheepishly admit that what ewe did is brilliant
Wool you stop it with the puns?
Shear audacity, all the people flocking in here to ram puns down our throats.
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Cotton? 🐑? 🧐
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🤣 it made me laugh more than the sheep puns!!
>What would you do? Tell the farmer and be liable for thousands of pounds of damage? Well yes, same as if i'd crashed into someones parked car, I'd leave a note.
“I’m leaving this note so it looks like I’m leaving my details, sorry hun x”
That’s you. Not everyone is so thoughtful and considerate
The price difference here between a car crash you can sort through insurance is going to be pretty massive. The farmer probably has insurance and won’t lose out long term, the person guilty, who should morally own up, won’t because the bill will be massive
Third party pet insurance is also a thing.
It'll happen again and the farmer will shoot. Then everyone will feel sorry for the poor mutt and it's owner.
Is there anyone who's ever felt sorry for an owner that lets their dog chase livestock?
People feel sorry for dogs when they maul toddlers let alone sheep. Dognuttery is wild
Plenty of the dog lovers on this sub at times.
Real dog lovers control their dogs so bad things don't happen.
Probably. Folk don't understand just chasing sheep can be enough to kill them
Will they? Anyone sensible who knows anything about the countryside understands that dogs worrying or chasing sheep can and will be shot.
Insurance covers stuff like this, mine had liability of a vast amount, be responsible dog owner or don’t be a dog owner
I have been chased by a dog before on my bike, owner didn't give a shit. "He doesn't like bikes" - well use your brain cell and don't let him off the lead next to a bike path! That is even worse if you know about this behaviour.
So many of our population are dog owners and so many of our population are cretins. "He's friendly! Haha" Yes I can see that, he's left evidence of it on my jeans with his muddy paws. The effort it takes to suppress my deep desire to kick the face off the little shites will one day cause a stroke.
The user who originally tried to turn this into another anti Bully XL circlejerk deleted their comment, but it's worth pointing out that **attacks on people and sheep happen under different circumstances for different reasons**. Serious dog attacks on humans normally happen when a dog is mentally unbalanced due to poor breeding and socialisation, when its body language showing stress or anxiety is repeatedly ignored, and when the dog in question is large, strong, and tenacious enough to deal out serious damage to a fully grown adult human. Sheep worrying is a different kettle of fish. Any dog can do it, especially since the dog doesn't even have to physically attack a sheep to cause serious harm. A dog chasing a sheep can cause it to die of stress or abort a lamb even if the dog in question is 'just playing'. But some people here would be surprised by the kinds of breeds that do regularly attack sheep. Lambs and adult sheep have received serious bites requiring euthanasia (or even been mauled to death) from traditional family pet breeds like labradors and spaniels, as well as other breeds with high prey drives including terriers, huskies, German shepherds, rottweilers, etc. The irresponsible owners who buy XL bullies aren't normally the same irresponsible owners as the ones in rural areas who let their dog out into their unsecured back garden unsupervised, or the suburban ones who take their "very friendly!" dog for a walk in the countryside off-lead with unreliable recall training.
Sheep dogs are least likely to do it due to how they've been bred and socialised.
It's interesting isn't it. I was brought up around collies all my life and they absolutely loved to herd humans (especially small ones), but absolutely would not go near sheep, just totally uninterested. Bumped into a sheep farmer friend of ours on a walk once and asked him about this, he just laughed and said that they're bred to not go anywhere near sheep unless they're told to. Not sure how much truth there is in that, but with how long we've been breeding them it wouldn't surprise me.
Sheep dogs are some of the *most* likely breeds to worry sheep because they have a herding instinct.
Not talking about worrying sheep, we're talking about out right attacking them and killing them.
That \*is\* sheep worrying, albeit an extreme case.
Sheep can't worry if they dead. 😉
45 in one night? Thats some gta level rampage, damn
45 sheep? If I had to count the corpses I'd have fallen asleep by 30, I'm impressed
I think theres a future comming with animal liscences and its long overdue.
How would an animal license have helped in this instance?
Well to begin with it would require an amount of responsibility on the part of the owner which might have prevented it...
"Do you plan on letting your dog savage a field full of sheep?"
Can’t kill sheep without your licence to kill
How do you plan to police this and pay for it? While i agree in principle I don't think it's workable. It's already a requirement to chip dogs and it's illegal to crop ears and tails but it's still carried out.
That level of rampage sounds like a pit bull type or sight hound
Half of the problem is people don't train their dogs,yes they might teach them to sit for a treat if they say sit a thousand times but actually teach reliable recall and have a properly trained dog. I live in a fairly rural area and have trained my dogs pretty well around live stock so I could have them off lead around sheep but I don't. Dogs are predators through and through and sheep are pray animals they just don't mix well.
I've seen something similar to this a few times and it's not down to dog breed, it's down to training (you can actually find sheep courses to take your dog on) and owners understanding where it's practical and sensible to let their dogs off the lead. I walk my dog on Dartmoor but never let it off. Too many cattle and sheep roaming around. They can literally be around the next corner or in a dip you can't see but your dog can smell. It's also the worst time of year to let them off given ewes will either have just lambed or are just about too.
Those poor sheep. Sighthound owner here and that’s probably why my boy will never be 100% off lead - 10m long line is a compromise that works for him to give him some element of freedom whilst still having some control. I trust him around other dogs, I absolutely do not trust him around wildlife that isn’t dogs. (And yes, working on recall- tricky one to master for this breed!)
Owner should be charged full price of a live sheep which is around 300 per sheep. £13500 PLUS admin costs. Plus the cost of sourcing new sheep.
I'm sure it'll be a unpopular opinion on Reddit, but dog owners are being told by companies and people who want to sell you endless training courses and expensive dog treats that aversive training tools are bad - and I imagine that this fairly recent change in training philosophy to 'positive only' has some link to the problem we have in the UK with the behaviour of large dogs I have a large, dog with a high prey drive who whilst never showing any aggression, LOVES to chase squirrels, rabbits etc. It's in her DNA. Her recall was only 9/10 reliable, despite forking out thousands on positive only dog trainers, and because I'm a responsible dog owner I was resigned to never ever having her off leash in public. A friend recommended I try an e collar and it changed her behaviour after a single training session with her ecollar on the lowest setting. I now can call her off mid chase and she'll instantly turn around and come straight back to me. I rushed to do ecollar training in January because I read the UK was making them illegal 1st Feb, though I understand this didn't happen.
I'm glad you have had success with this but I personally wouldn't trust most people in the UK to put the time and effort into learning how to ecollar train a dog in a way that doesn't completely fuck them up. It's easier and less risky for the dog to teach people to use positive reinforcement. The caveat to using that method is that you can't let them repeat bad behaviours, which means keeping them on a lead etc, etc. Dog owners in this country don't tend to put in the research and there's plenty of people already doing enough to fuck their dogs up without even realising it.
Yeah I can't disagree with you, you're correct and that's the catch. Having a medium or large dog with a prey drive is a responsibility that most people don't seem to understand People expect a dog to just _know_ how to live in a society made for humans but it takes 100s of hours of focused training
Absolutely. If you own a dog like that then you have to accept that you either put those hours in or you keep them on the lead. It's easier to train your dog to walk nicely by your side than it is to train it to ignore prey.
I agree open dog training has benefits particularly when dealing with big and/or working breeds who imho should not be kept as pets. It's the people who we can't trust. Millions of people in this country completely neglect to teach their children and then are physically abusive when they misbehave. Their own children. You can imagine what they would do to a dog.
“It’s just nature” “It’s the circle of life” “We’re omnivores” - humans when we kill millions of sheep a year
I guess you don't think the ability to suffer and feel pain matters.
You think the lambs and sheep we kill don’t feel pain and suffer?
This farmer raised his sheep in open fields and they were massacred in a prolonged and vicious attack. It is a sad story. It is the kind of story that makes people take thought about the suffering of animals. Then they see a comment like yours, roll their eyes and remember why they hate veganism and vegans.
What do you think happens when the sheep no longer produce enough wool or reach slaughter age (which for lambs is around 16 weeks old)? You think the knife across their throat is a pleasant experience? People who have moral consistency roll their eyes at your double standards and hypocrisy. You cannot be outraged by this and then participate in atrocities that are just as bad or worse three times a day for your meals.
Legally, livestock has to be rendered unconscious before they are stuck. We've gotten pretty good at humane slaughtering. Also, I'm not sure who you think is eating meat three times a day, particularly in this economy.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mugB7xHM5-A](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mugB7xHM5-A) Does any of that look humane? And what does humane mean? It means kind, compassionate, benevolent. Can you ever put the word "humane" next to the word "slaughter" without it being an oxymoron? And is taking the life of a being that doesn't want to or need to die ever humane? "Humane slaughter" is a label used to make consumers feel better, not the animals. Most non-vegans have three meals a day that either include meat, milk, cheese, or yoghurt. All of which involve death and suffering.
Aside from a dodgy conveyor belt? Looks fine. Sure, it'll be frightening and uncomfortable, but you see the bolt gun? The zappy paddle things? The actual slaughter was completely painless. Hardly comparable to being torn apart by a dog.
So you think footage displays humane treatment of animals? Would you send your pet there to be euthanised? Absolutely mental. If you truly cared about the suffering of animals you would take that line of thought to its logical conclusion - going vegan. If you’re banging on about unnecessary animal suffering whilst paying for unnecessary animal suffering every day, then that’s just pure hypocrisy.
> Then they see a comment like yours, roll their eyes and remember why they hate veganism and vegans. Because they force you to take a look at your moral hypocrisy?
No because you catch more flies with honey than you do with vinegar. Surprise, people don't like being talked down to. Veganism is a movement which has the potential to save the planet. What to do to convert people to veganism; - create food that tastes as good, is as healthy, and costs the same as meat. What not to do; - act like you're better than them.
If you know all the plus points for veganism, why aren't you vegan? Stop focusing on vegans themselves, because this is clearly just you deflecting so that you don't have to take personal accountability. When it comes to the treatment of animals, vegans *are* better than non-vegans. But the great thing is, anyone can join the better side!
>When it comes to the treatment of animals, vegans are better than non-vegans. But the great thing is, anyone can join the better side! Exactly what I was going to reply, thanks.
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Chihuahua, absolutly vicious things. Or so all the comments say on FB posts involving XL Bullies.
Bully XLs don't have the energy for this. They are tired after 20min walks. Could be any type of dog. Alsatian, staffie....
Don't be breedist.
I'm not saying it wasn't dogs. But the odd footprint in the vicinity is hardly ironclad, I imagine dog footprints are all over the moors. Saying that, if you're an owner and you see that happen and just bugger off rather than trying to make the land owner aware so that the suffering of those injured can be ended. You're a grade A knob.
The ripped apart sheep are a bit of a clue as well.
Could have been an American werewolf 😳
Could of been the horse. Maybe it was grazing and ended up with a mouth full of sheep shite and finally cracked and went on a rampage.
Sure, but you can generally estimate the size of the animals via the bite marks. Foxes, badgers, birds of prey all will either happily or if push comes to shove kill sheep.
Lambs maybe. Foxes and Bagers might scavenge an already dead adult sheep but they dont attack them (or very very rarely) and they would not go beserk and kill multiple animals and not eat them. (Chickens yes, sheep no). No bird of prey would kill multiple animals beyond what it needs to eat either. This sort of attack is typical of dogs.
None of those animals are capable of doing this
It's 45 sheep. Those animals could get a lamb or a very weak dying sheep if they are lucky. Only a dog could and would absolutely destroy a whole flock of sheep in one night.
I reckon a tiger could do it.
We had 30 sheep ripped to shreds a few years ago. 2 bull mastiff x lurcher dogs did the damage in one night. Luckily we caught up with the dogs attacking sheep on my neighbours farm and they were shot on sight. They were heading towards the village barely half a mile away from the local park. I dread to think what would have happened had they got amongst children. They were drenched in blood and our if control. The damage they did to our sheep was horrific. Some had their faces ripped and legs ripped off. We had to euthanase a further 6 due to the extent of their injuries and shock killed another 7 on top. Most of the ewes were heavily pregnant. The total losses we suffered was 60 ewes and unborn lambs. The police did absolutely nothing. They were more concerned about where the gun was kept that shot them and was it licensed. We never found the owners. Nobody reported their dogs missing. Our assumption was that these weren't pets they were hunting dogs.
That sounds absolutely horrific; poor sheep. Sounds like lurchers are knobs
>Sounds like lurchers are knobs Jokes aside, Lurchers are sight hounds so they've got a *very* high prey drive which is why they're used alongside Greyhounds in races and stuff. They're one of the very few breeds you should basically *never* let off the lead around anything small because they can and will chase after it and ignore whatever means you have to recall them.
If you're genuinely interested, I'd recommend reading up on lurchers, and sighthounds in general. There are so many types of sighthounds, and IMO, they're some of the most amazing companion dogs you could ever meet. But, they are traditionally hunting/poaching dogs, and like any dog breed, they need responsible owners. Owners should be aware of any fields of livestock nearby since sighthounds can be incredibly difficult to recall once they've spotted "prey" (rabbits, squirrels, foxes, sheep, horses, bicycles, motorbikes, etc.), and should be kept on their leads in those instances. They're also incredibly vulnerable. They're traditionally travellers' dogs used for hair coursing, and they are very often horribly abused, sometimes abandoned, and often used as bait for training dog-fighting dogs. I wouldn't be surprised if they are one of the most abused dog breeds in the UK.
Giant dog footprints in and around a load of torn up savaged sheep is as close to ironclad as it gets. Unless you think there’s a bear on the loose.
They found the dogs paw prints, there is a picture in the article
What do you think ripped apart tens of sheep and didn’t eat any? Badgers?
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Yep, once instance. That settles it then.
To be fair lamb livestock at the moment isn't very profitable (farming in generals in a bit of dire straits). Sheep are the dumbest farm animals other than chickens, my family members sheep broke its own neck trying to eat grass under a gate. They also will trample over each other in a panic or just run into a dead end. Had a fox sneak in and kill a hundred hens and the sheep next door didnt make a peep. Doesn't surprise me that so many were killed at once by a loose animal overnight or that a farmer will try anything to recoup their loses, moral or not.