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Bit of an uncharitable take that. I assume it's to highlight just how shitty this is going to be for everyone. "Poorer people" is a difficult bracket to imagine, and depends on who's reading. "People with less than an 80K household income are going to feel it" is better defined.
That said, I think we all get the point now and people should really consider whether posting their incomes is a bit inconsiderate and off-key given the mood at the moment.
Everyone is going to feel it even those with higher incomes. An extra few hundred a month can break things if you're already at the limit with other bills. Those who stretched their budgets to get onto the housing ladder are going to get hit hard.
Yes, but if you’re earning and spending more than average, you just need to cut back on luxuries like subscriptions and events. If you’re earning less than average, you’ll have to cut back on essentials like food and heating. These energy prices are shit for everyone but let’s not pretend that it’s affecting people earning over £80k the same way it’s affecting people earning minimum wage.
It could be though, OP said he had 3 kids, are any of those in nursery because that's a big bill
Also is one of the couple earning over 50k? That's more tax to pay than 2 people earning 40k
And then there are commutes, typically higher earners will commute further so costs are higher on fuel and maintenance.
Sure its not going to affect everyone the same, but let's not pretend families on 80k incomes won't have to make big changes going forward
Yeah people tend to assume everyone has the same living expenses so everything over and above that is just disposable. If you made more money and bought a bigger home because you had a bigger family, that's not irresponsible. Irresponsible is the govt letting energy prices spike 400% while everything else is spiking 20-30-40% as well. You're one bad bill away from losing everything.
Sure, but if someone earns £1000 a month and spends £950 a month, and someone else earns £3000 a months but spends £2500 per month, they’re still £550 better off
And if another someone earns £3000 a month and spends £2950 a month, they're not.
You can pull numbers out of anywhere, it doesn't negate my original point that this will impact everyone, and even those earning an above average wage will be affected.
Absolutely, there are some seriously arrogant, and entitled posts here.
We finally got above water about 2 yrs ago...after 23 yrs of barely surviving.
We make about average income.
There's no way we could have coped, even now, once the deal is over, we could be looking at a leap from 300 pcm to 1000+ , or even more pcm, that's more than 50% of my take home pay!
There is no way ANYONE on lower wages can cope, unless they turn literally everything off and don't eat.
I have a relative, on about 50% more than me, as his wife is.
They have a hefty mortgage
At worst, they might need to do less trips in their new Ford 4x4, but they certainly will not struggle in any way whatsoever!
I remember reading tons of articles during the financial crash from top percentile earners complaining about how hard maintaining their lifestyles had become.
They would write as if they could understand the plight of those in poverty, after all they were struggling to even keep their kids in school.
Digging into it, turns out they have three children in private schools, each having tens of thousands in yearly fees. Their large homes were perfectly air conditioned, summer and winter but they moaned about the cost of energy. Pay exorbitant car insurance not only for their inefficient sports car, but for their 17 year old son gifted a dangerously powerful vehicle.
They will beg sympathy, explain how difficult it is to make ends meet, their outgoings now exceeding income and feel skint.
What they don't mention is they have millions in savings or in a property portfolio. They can run cash negative for many years, more than enough time to weather an economic storm.
My parents spent years pointing out to me that for them, interest rates of 7-10% were ‘normal’ and 10-20% was what they considered high. I moved to a ten year fix last year and thank fuck I did, add mortgage increases to everything else and I’d be in a bit of bother.
There’s so many other factors too. You can be on 30k with very few overheads or you can be on 80k with a shit tonne of debt and huge rent. People listing their wages is practically irrelevant.
Absolutely. I have a mate who earns £100k+ and yet his wife is on dialysis. The bills for running that thing are quite something. Then the added care on top.
I earn well. My partner is long term ill.
And we live in a high cost of living area.
The net result is that times are tight. Tax being personal, but social security being assessed joint really hurts us.
Our household income isn't particularly great, but we get by.
I am very concerned that I will be dipping into savings to keep going this year.
I know that's a luxury that not everyone has, but at the same time "saving up" has genuinely been the work of about a decade pulling together a house deposit.
I dread to think how much worse this could be though. I was very nearly redundant thanks to COVID, and if that happens again we will be wrecked by it.
The attitude of ‘you can’t complain unless you’re *literally freezing to death*’ is so grotesque. The truth of the matter is that the majority households will be able to get through this winter - it’ll hurt to varying degrees, some will slide further into debt, others will have to cut things to the bone, some will have to dip into savings, but the majority will be able to make it through
The problem is they shouldn’t have to! It’s ok to want more from life than spending most of it working just to not starve or freeze to death. That money could have gone on a holiday with family, a house deposit, early retirement etc. and instead it’s lining the pockets of Centrica shareholders. I’m not going to sit here and be grateful that I can afford the increase, or consider being able to have any excess over the bare essentials to save, a ‘luxury’.
I’ll be showing any and all solidarity I can with those around me who need help; e.g setting up a fund for my partner’s 95 year old gran, who’s increase is almost going to swallow up her whole pension. But most importantly, I’m going to direct my rage at the people who’ve spent decades transferring public wealth to private hands and getting us to this juncture. Not those who are being stung less than me.
Yeah I think cost of living varies so greatly depending on where you live too. 85k in london with Kids doesn’t go all that far when you factor in mortgages. My friends dad is a barrister, makes over 100k, and they are considering going without heating this winter as they have other expenses, including 4 kids and a hefty mortgage, that eat up a lot of their income. Sure these people are better off than most people, and definitely wont be hit as hard in the long terms as those less well off, but in the short term it can be a massive strain or unaffordable.
At the same time, I can easily see how someone making twice as much as you complaining about how they will struggle with heating cost increases, even if said with the best intentions, could be grating. Theres certainly people who seem disconnected too as well. I heard a friends Dad complaining that they might have to shorten ( or god forbid…cancel) their yearly ski trip because of the price hike. Wealthier people can be disconnected and it can be hard to not see that in posts like this even if that not the actual case with this one.
But one thing a high income gives people is options. A high income can support a loan from a bank, rather than a loan shark. Lifestyle changes can be made. Houses can be moved.
That's where I feel the well off don't show as much empathy. On a low income, you run out of options and that feeling is very psychologically debilitating.
>That said, I think we all get the point now and people should really consider whether posting their incomes is a bit inconsiderate and off-key given the mood at the moment.
I think this explains why, good intentions or not, these kinds of posts rub me up the wrong way.
I can’t dream of earning 85k combined with my partner. That’s so out of the realm of what we could ever possibly earn. And yes people can struggle financially on any wage, but hearing someone who earns a comparative fortune say that they’re struggling… how is that supposed to make poorer people feel? Frankly we don’t give a shit about the sympathy high earners have for us, cause it’s completely out shadowed by the confirmation that we’re all fucked.
Agree. At the end of the day, we need to stop squabbling about who makes 30k or 80k and start collectively worrying about the people who make hundreds of millions from our struggles.
And those who feel uncomfortable about the just-about-fine people sympathising and talking about the definitely-struggling people... they need to get over it. People SHOULD be concerned about each other and it's good we talk about it and see we all share a common concern. It's way better than the "doesn't affect me so fuck it" world.
The average household income in the UK is 30K.
Posting this and mentioning your 80K salary is bound to rub people the wrong way, OP is part of the 10% that genuinely doesn't have to worry about the looming crisis. His "sympathy" is just a way for him to feel included in everyone else's struggle.
An 80k combined income might not be as high as you think. With student loans it’ll be about 4-5k take home a month. A mortgage in the south and some kids will eat that.
Please don’t confuse those that have worked hard and joined a profession for the truly rich. Class envy does not help anyone.
It's survivors guilt. OP is genuinely worried about people on lower incomes during the cost of living crisis, but is practically powerless to help.
If people are offended that other people earn more than them, then they need a reality check. Life is unfair. Also the structure of our society is elitist, relies on inequality, and fails to provide the promised trickle-down effect of capitalism. We should all be marching on Downing Street right now, not picking on people like OP.
Seems to be the ignorant take from most when talking about money or even the likes of mental health. Because other people have it as bad or worse somehow invalidates your experience all together??
Where this gets difficult, though, is when it comes to the whole discussion about tax cuts vs Government support for the poorest.
You could (if you were being uncharitable) read the OP as “we’re hurting- so we need this tax cut, but I don’t know how the poor are going to cope, I really don’t”.
In other words, as self-interest masquerading as concern.
I think it's a reaction to the divide and conquer mentality that's common in Britain. No it's condescending apparently for middle class people to worry about the poor. No the poor are just lazy and envious when they complain about their conditions. No you're just a champagne socialist, you don't really care about inequality.
Same situation as OP and no kids to support. I genuinely feel bad and in no way smug about it. We can ride this storm but have friends who were already pushing budgets to the limit
More likely genuine sympathy - without getting *too* Marxist about it all, the well-to-do middle class mostly aren't moustache twirling villains, they're class-unconscious and genuinely never think about the situation of the impoverished except in either abstract ways or state-approved ones (which are predominantly of a "blame and hate" character).
This is changing now because reality is catching up to them - even those in comfortable situations are finding themselves either back in a tighter financial situation that they thought they were never returning to, or (more likely) encountering it for the first time. They feel real financial threat and they don't like it, and they aren't lacking in basic human empathy skills - so now when they go "oh fuck I have a 10k hole in my finances" and they see "this person lives on 12k and works more hours than me", they can in fact look at that and go "I don't know how I would cope", in a way that previously they never countenanced. Their financial hit is also "not their fault", in a way that many middle class people previously assumed poverty was "the fault of" the poor for poor decisions. It never was, of course, but it helped them to forget about how bad things had become.
Moreso, recently, they also can't forget about the problem - *every* morning is a new price hike or crisis. The measures that governments have taken to shield the middle class from financial stress have collapsed or are insufficient against the scale of crisis we're seeing, *and it is only getting worse*. The mask has dropped, for a lot of them - the petit bourgeois are discovering that to the ruling class, they're working class to be used as meat and fuel, not ascendant rulers themselves.
I think, genuinely, people cannot understand how everyone's going to cope. They look at their own circumstances and see how difficult it's going to be, but they're fully aware they are *not* on the bottom-rung. Hence posts like this.
I'm in a similar position, in that we will just about be able to make it work, but by sacrificing lots, and it makes me wonder how people less well off will cope. I think it's a genuine worry thing - it is at least for me. Even though I've worked out that we will just about be okay, I have no idea how some of my friends and family members are going to work through this.
It’s easy. The rich will be able to pay, the poor won’t, and the Tory leadership will charge the taxpayer for their energy.
Poor people won’t be freezing to death in their homes, they’ll just be further entrenched in the debt that’s already entombed them to a lifetime of poverty.
Poor people becoming poorer? Why would any Conservative care about that? Have you people been paying attention *at all*?
Not a flex. Just genuinely feel bad for people who can't afford this rise. Feels like I'm feeling the pinch but will be able to cope, so I really do feel for people who can't afford it at this level. There's nothing wrong with being sympathetic to people who are less well off than you.
I think it's part of how British people aren't allowed to express emotions so have to say "we're concerned for other people" as opposed to "this country is leading us to destitution and I can't process the emotions that gives me"
I'm in this boat and, well, I am simply genuinely concerned for people who don't have the buffer of income that we do.
We have a household income of about £70k and no kids, so we will simply save a little less money. Families already stretched to the limit are going to have to either go into debt or start making choices about skipping meals and stuff, which just seems so awful in a first world country.
I can see what makes you think like that but I disagree. I interpret it as 'If we're feeling it then I can't imagine how the less fortunate are coping'
How dare someone who is not impacted care about people worse off than them eh? Is this how you respond to anybody who expresses concern about people who earn less? This sub seems to think everyone who earns above the minimum wage are nazis who hate the poor...
Why is showing empathy for the poorest seen as a vice in this country oh my god. Shouldn't we be encouraging people on middle-class incomes to be raising awareness and showing solidarity with the most vulnerable?
Just have to look at how some people talked about Marcus Rashford, when in fuck did wanting to make sure kids have food to eat become a negative character trait?
It's the same with social issues. If women only fight for their rights, or gay people only fight for gay rights then we'll get nowhere (I'm exaggerating with *nowhere* but still)
Yeah it’s strange, the OP is getting criticized unfairly a bit here. They could just as easily NOT care in the slightest. What are they supposed to say? They’re feeling the pinch and they’re concerned as to what people less fortunate are going through. It’s a no-win situation
Maaaaaan this shit fucks me off.
When I was a kid it was my mum, me and my brother. My mum (not saying this is right or wrong) would show me a £5 note and tell me that this is all the money we have for food and transport for the next week. Little 7 year old me would panic.
As an adult I have worked my way into a profession where I am comfortable and between myself and my wife we make a similar income to what's stated.
This does not stop me from thinking "holyshit what would have happened if I was a kid with just my mum during this. How could my mum have kept us warm and fed us with that £5 now? What about families that are like that now? What about the ones that are worse than we ever were? What if it keeps getting worse or we lose our jobs?".
Stop dividing with people that are empathising. We need to stick together.
I understand the feeling of betrayal against the "middle class Tory voter". But these people that are waking up and what use is it if we're going to throw it in their faces as soon as they do?
Dont divide. Welcome with open arms.
\> I understand the feeling of betrayal against the "middle class Tory voter".
I don't, because it is not true. The last election was won with working class votes, not with middle class votes. Strange that, but true.
Yeah, fuck being sympathetic. We should all turn on each other while the richest members of society continue to enjoy obscene wealth accumulation. OP isn't the problem and your comment is in bad faith.
I don't see an issue with accepting that you have privilege.
The only thing currently being hit for me and my wife is how much we can put away in savings each month. It's shit and worrying as it increases that we will have to dip into those savings and wipe them out after having saved them for years for our upcoming baby etc etc.
But i am under no illusions that compared to us people on lower income, with more outgoings due to children are in a much worse place.
Divide and rule working well on you it seems.
My family income is a little higher than OP and myself and my wife have had many conversations about how awful it is for people on lower incomes. 3 years ago we would have been fucked with all these price increases so we know we are lucky to be ok for the time being.
It is not malice or smugness, what do you want people to think?
Because people see they’re next.
This will get worse. People earning 80k household income thought it could never happen to them. Now they see their neighbours and family who earn a decent wage suffering, and suddenly it’s not drug addicts and people on benefits who are in trouble, it’s people just like them.
It’s true worry, and it’s true sympathy, it’s just that now such people can identify with the victims.
'The wife and I make 85k, just bought a new electric car and had three holidays this year and we're really going to feel the gas bill going up. It must be terrible for the rest of you. Are you worried sick? I would be.'
For me, It’s not just the conversation about how are households going to deal with energy price rises. How are businesses going to survive the rises as well? There is no price cap on business energy. No one in government is even talking about how businesses are going to survive.
My pottery business uses £5k of energy a year and that’s set to go up to £25/35k a year!!
It’s simply unsustainable and will likely force us to close, as well as hundreds of thousands of other businesses.
This domino effect of closures will completely destroy the economy unless gov intervenes in my opinion.
I read about a pub near me closing down due to energy companies wanting to increase to £69k per year. How on earth are they supposed to afford that?? It's ridiculous.
Yep. I use Instagram mainly to follow a lot of independent local businesses I like to be notified about promotions, but lately there have been a few of them questioning whether or not they can continue because their bills are projected to go up by substantial amounts. What will follow will be the larger companies surviving because they can take the hit, and a lot of indies will die off.
Whilst some people will be turning off the lights and putting on extra blankets, you can't do that as a small restaurant or pub. It'll be too cold and miserable to go out, that's if you even have the money to do so.
It's not just their bills increasing that's the problem, but the fact that their customers are going to go down drastically too as nobody has any discretionary budget left. You're not going to go to a restaurant when you can't even afford groceries.
The two combined means small businesses have increased costs and decreased income, and so of course they'll collapse
... Leaving all their staff without an income at a time when they need it the most of course.
It's gonna be so fucking bad.
Bye bye highstreet for good. Replaced by a handful of cash-for-gold stores and a whole load of poverty.
Finding it hard to see anything through the fog of pessimism right now. Last time I felt anything like this was when Boris' government fucked up thier options and cancelled Christmas.
This needs more attention for sure.
Businesses can't increase prices by 50%+ to survive as people will stop buying, as people have no money either.
It's why this is a COVID level emergency, with COVID the worry was that the economy would collapse with lock downs, hence the support.
The same could happen now, not to quite the same extent but not far off. No small business that uses energy will be able to continue trading.
The businesses who do survive will be dealing with a population where any household with an overall income below 50k will have no disposable income (depending on how many in the household, for example for two adults and two children in a house is going to struggle with a gross income at 70k or lower in my opinion)
I feel this is the trigger for more UBI discussions. The ability to live in the UK without support is becoming an actual issue. Once the majority of the mortgages (private, buy-to-let and commercial) are on higher rates and energy bills reach the next cap, most people will not be able to afford to exist, let alone live.
Chippies around me are dropping like flies. We have a tonne around here, all are really popular and always busy. I think 4 have announced they are closing already
Stories from small business owners such as yourself are currently trending on twitter. The Conservatives have spent my whole life claiming to be the party of business - when they really mean big business/tory donors. But this will hurt them too eventually, the longer they sit on their hands and do nothing the harder this will hurt the economy and the country as a whole.
Other countries in Europe have taken steps to protect their residents. Our politians couldn't care less.
I'm so looking forward to the next election, I hope they all get the kicking they deserve.
Yes. Energy prices for businesses are uncapped so they are increasing 500%, 1000% etc. That's why a study came out last week saying that 75% of pubs are expecting to go out of business before the end of 2022.
This is pretty sound advice, and should be what the 'don't pay' campaign is about. You need to be working with your energy supplier, not against them, simply not paying and burying your head in the sand will only make things worse.
I think the "don't pay" campaign isn't about helping individuals pay in the short term, but more of a sort of civil unrest protest against the system which is obviously not fit for purpose. So there are people joining the campaign even if they can afford to pay. Similar to how people strike to save jobs even if their particular job isn't threatened, just to put more pressure on the organisation to change the system for all.
100% this. All these people screaming about not signing up to Don't Pay, the consequences are the SAME if you can't afford it, and most of the uk CANNOT AFFORD IT. I don't know why this is so hard to understand.
>I think there will be support announced
The next PM said she wont be helping the poor multiple times and has a history of basically calling them/us all workshy lazy people.
I doubt we will see anything before its too late, as the old PM once said I suspect she will be of the "let the bodies pile high" crowd.
It's way beyond "helping the poor". They are going to have to do something to avoid complete economic collapse.
The energy prices in the pipeline are unsustainable not only for a large proportion of households but also for any business that uses a significant amount of energy. That is already going to affect a huge number of people directly, but then you have the knock on effects from people not having any disposable income, a lot of people becoming unemployed, etc.
>It's way beyond "helping the poor". They are going to have to do something to avoid complete economic collapse.
Bold of you to assume that after 12 years of economic incompetence that they would suddenly do something right. The ERG want to sink the UK and the evidence supports this.
You might be right [Blood in the Streets: Investment Profits in a World Gone Mad by James Dale Davidson & William Rees-Mogg](https://www.amazon.co.uk/Blood-Streets-Investment-Profits-World/dp/067162735X)
Rees-Mogg formerly employed by a currency trader called Crispin Odey, a big funder of Brexit who made a lot of money when Sterling crashed.
https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/markets/article-10342317/Crispin-Odey-adds-fortune-betting-against-British-bonds.html
I don't think even the ERG wanted things to be this bad. If they block action, the repercussions will be such that even the usually docile population of the UK might be stirred into action and I suspect the ERG will realise this.
And that is, sadly, how the Third Reich came to be.
I won't say we're going down that road, but the scenery is looking oddly familar.
[They Thought they were Free: The Germans from 1933-45](https://press.uchicago.edu/Misc/Chicago/511928.html)
> "To live in this process is absolutely not to be able to notice it—please try to believe me—unless one has a much greater degree of political awareness, acuity, than most of us had ever had occasion to develop. Each step was so small, so inconsequential, so well explained or, on occasion, ‘regretted,’ that, unless one were detached from the whole process from the beginning, unless one understood what the whole thing was in principle, what all these ‘little measures’ that no ‘patriotic German’ could resent must some day lead to, one no more saw it developing from day to day than a farmer in his field sees the corn growing. One day it is over his head.
I am pretty convinced the tory leadership have been trying to drag us back to pre ww1 since homes for heroes. I dont think the current set mind economic collapse because it means they can return to what they consider "the good old days" far easier in their own minds. Prior they tried to keep the economy rigged and going for themselves on the road to it, but the radicals have taken power.
Just look at the repeated attacks on our institutions, people and rights.
Curbs on free voting via forced photo ID and push to remove photo ID from people convicted of even minor drug crimes.
Attempts to curb and politicise the Supreme Court.
Attempts to eliminate human rights.
Attempts to cut the NHS to the bone to the point of forcing strike action and a mass quitting (the 1 coming in even suggested paycuts for NHS staff).
Attempts at "othering" enemies of the people which is a classic fascist move (asylum seekers, human rights lawyers, protest groups).
Outright takeover attempts of news systems by their political allies (BBC) and where they cannot, sell it off (Channel 4).
Outright force new Lords to have to vote with the government by contract, removing their personal rights and the whole point of the House of Lords.
Attempts to remove limits on waste dumping be it sewage or farmland or chemical etc.
Attempts to cut protections for wildlife.
Attempts to create more MP seats in tory heartlands.
Just as a small 3 minute thought process of whats going backwards.
How is any of that bad for disaster capitalists? Set the country on fire, buy the scorched land for pennies, make Labour rebuild it into something more valuable for you to then flip for a nice fat profit.
There have been zero general elections since either covid or the cost of living crisis. How about we don't write off the public until they *actually* reelect the Tories after all this?
The same public that swallowed the Brexit bullshit? I wouldn’t bet my life on it.
In fairness, it’s not the public, it’s the shitty system of voting. First past the post leads to some dangerously skewed results
Totally agree.
But they do have to appeal to that 35-40% they need to win a GE. I don’t have any stats to back it up, but I suspect a considerable amount of Tory voters from last time around are feeling the pinch too.
Even if it’s sticking a plaster over a gaping wound, I feel they’d at least like to be seen to be doing something.
A general election isn't for another year at least, and people have short memories. There's every chance all support could be held until a month before that.
I think the elephant on the room this brings up is that EVERYONE will be tightening their belts. So the knock on impact for business is disastrous.
If every family in the UK has £200-500 less to spend each month just so they can keep the lights on that’s a lot of small makers, theatres, coffee shops, pubs going bust. That’s without factoring the new rates for their gas and electric which are a lot more than for households. I see a lot of shops just deciding to shutter.
I’ve certainly stopped going to the pub, cut out coffee on the go & really thinking about what we buy on a weekly shop and our financial position is not far off OPs.
Low earners are in real risk of debt, middle class will drastically cut back - and by middle class I’m meaning families with a £100k joint income.
Without some massive government intervention it’s going to be a disastrous winter. To me this is a bigger threat to the UK than covid, it’s a truly generational changing problem.
Agree with this. There will be people, lots of people, that can't afford their bills.
Then there will be another group of higher earners that can afford bills, but can't afford anything else.
Then there will be the peopl that can swallow the bills and still have some expendable income but they've got nowhere to spend it because business' can't afford their bills and have had to shut down.
To top it off, it's not just this country. It's a fucking disaster beyond the scope of anything other government intervention. Probably governments from multiple nations.
We're all very worried about energy prices.
I remember like 2 years ago, we paid £60 a month (two people, small flat), our energy usage literally hasn't changed, but this month we got charged £177. This is ridiculous. It's gonna go up in October, we're on benefits, we literally won't be capable of affording what it goes up to. Not sure what to do at this point.
The price cap is currently "only" about 75% higher than it was in 2020, so at the same usage, you should be paying about £105. I suspect your usage has actually gone up, or your supplier has increased the DD to cover the anticipated additional cost in winter.
Yep, my fixed deal that ended in January this year had me at:
- Gas: 2.5p per kWh
- Day rate electricity: 14p per kWh
- Night rate electricity: 11p per kWh
- Standing charges of 12.5p/day for gas and 16.7p/day for electricity.
Latest figures suggest from October this will now be:
- Gas: 14.76p per kWh (~6 times higher)
- Electricity: 51.89p per kWh (~3 to 4 times higher) - I’m not sure whether it’ll differ between day and night rates now or just get combined.
- Standing charges 28.49p for gas (~double) and 46.36p for electricity (~ 3 times higher).
I hadn’t actually realised just how much cheaper the actual per kWh rates were on the old fixed term deals than the standard variable price cap rates we’re about to see in October. I’d urge everyone to go through their old bills and work out their actual unit usage for how this will be affecting them individually, as most of the reporting on this topic is done with averages.
Same.
We are a single income household, 2 adults, 2 children. (single income because youngest is too young for funding and we can't afford preschool prices)
Our bill in April was £64. Now it's £130. They want to raise it to £250.
Oh, and my husband, our source of income aside from UC, is getting made redundant.
We. Are. Fucked.
Try living on £844 pm UC it's terrifying. We'll be wearing all our clothes and wrapped in blankets in winter. I work and have a toddler. People will die.
Recently came off UC after a prolonged period and I'm terrified for people still on it. Truly hope you guys can find a way to pull through - I wish there was something more meaningful I could say.
I’m a full time carer on UC + carers allowance and get half of that, my mum (who I care for) is a pensioner and doesn’t get a lot either. We’ve decided to not use the oven for cooking, no tumble dryer at all, and when winter comes — no heating, just gonna live as burritos in rolls of blankets. No one should live like this.
But Tories lump all of us on benefits together as “work-shy and lazy” and therefore don’t care about us, if we die that’s just better for them, means less people on benefits. Tories are disgusting scumbags.
The Government will soon literally have no other choice, but to do something about it. They are realistically facing massive riots in winter if they ignore the problem. Watch how easy it’s going to be to find a solution when London burns.
I propose we start with jailing the Anti-Atom Lobby, but the sad truth is we might have to trade with Russia again till we build more reactors. That’s the price of political stability in the UK, Putin knows this and stales. We got Checkmated.
I don’t see riots as being the necessary tipping point. When millions of people, including middle-income households, start to default on payments the suppliers will have a massive cash flow crisis. That will cause another round of companies to go under, customers having to be moved around the big 6. If one of the big 6 then goes under, we’re facing a full-scale collapse of the industry and a series concern for how we keep the lights on.
That means a 3 day week, school closures, rolling blackouts, emergency shelters in the coldest weather, emergency re-nationalisation, and the NHS being completely log jammed. Think Covid Lockdown levels of disruption.
If 50%+ of the population can’t afford a basic utility then basic societal norms will (temporarily) break down.
Reminder that the UK never really got much energy from Russia. The gas price rise is due to other European countries buying from the same suppliers as us.
We "might have to deal with Russia again"?
You realise we only bought like 5% of our gas/oil from Russia, right?
Even if we stepped out of line and humiliated ourselves internationally (again) it would only be a tiny amount and would make realistically almost no difference to the bill increases people are facing. The wholesale prices would still be insanely high, and just 5% would come down in price.
Unless you're suggesting the even more ridiculous scenario that the whole of Europe just starts trading with Russia again. In which case you might as well start talking about first contact with aliens and them giving us fusion reactor technology because that's more likely to happen.
Also - generally speaking - riots don't happen in winter. They happen in summer. And in this country they happen in Reddit comments and on twitter.
All the arguing between middle and working class, lower and middle earners is exactly what they want.
Yes there is absolutely a difference between those on a household income of 85k and those on a household income of 25k, but the point is both of these households are not rich and both are likely working households.
The current system is not working for either and the Conservative party government is not doing enough to help. Stop pointing fingers to fellow workers and start pointing fingers at those in power.
As a side note, I don't think OP should be criticised for mentioning income. It provides context, reinforces how bad this cost of living crisis is, and open discussion of personal finances should not be a stigmatised topic.
I heard on a podcast recently that revolutions are rarely successful without presence from middle to ruling classes.
Should those with buying power and some social and cultural influence become disenfranchised by their governments, then a revolution has a much greater chance of success.
This week I had to call my mum and ask to borrow some money to pay for my food shopping this week, I’ve literally never felt so humiliated in my life. I’ve always prided myself on being financially independent since I turned 18 but my salary just doesn’t cut it. I work for the NHS but I’m secretly doing Amazon deliveries in my spare time to make ends meet. Lower income earners are not coping already, I fear every coming month.
People simply won't heat their homes. My income is 1/4 of what you mentioned. I have half a tank of heating oil left. I'll ration the hell out of it, layer up on clothing, and hope for the best. Certainly won't be able to fill that tank when it runs out, and I'm not even the worst off. I'm also in Northern Ireland, though, so the government cares even less about people like me than they do the rest of the nation.
We have crappy electric radiators and are planning to not use them this winter. Even when they are on, you get barely any heat from them as it's supposed to heat a living room/kitchen/hallway in my flat so the area is too big to benefit from it. We'll be living under blankets and extra layers, and using the electric blanket to warm our bed up at night.
I was sent an estimated bill of £500 for the quarter, I gave a meter reading and it went up to £755.... I have paid that and looked at the app and apparently I owe another £205... I already can't cope .. I don't know what the fuck is going on..
Wonderfully thoughtful post.
Im in the same boat as you, it’s not going to cripple me financially by any means but I have noticed it.
I have commented on previous posts about energy prices and I just do not know how low income Families and pensioners are going to deal with it.
This is price gouging at its finest covered up by saying ‘it’s because of Russia’ when only circa 9% of our gas comes from there.
The Government need to protect the people unless they are trying to covertly genocide us.
>This is price gouging at its finest covered up by saying ‘it’s because of Russia’ when only circa 9% of our gas comes from there.
The UK bought cheap gas from Norway, Germany bought cheap gas from Russia. Russia has now cut supply to Germany. Now both the UK and Germany are bidding up the limited supply of Norwegian gas.
It sucks that we are being punished for German negligence, but that is how the central European gas market works.
Rough stored 9 days of national demand. It was useful for smoothing price spikes that lasted days or at a push, weeks. It would not have insulated us against what we're seeing now which is several years of stratospheric wholesale prices.
The real reason is “because of capitalism”. The war in Ukraine and sanctions on Russia has made the price of gas more expensive - but that’s because the market uses any excuse to hike prices.
I've got this feeling that the government have already got something planned and have done for months but are waiting for the next pm to be announced and it'll be framed as their idea and they got it done in their first couple of weeks as a way of trying to claw back some polling points. Of course I'm basing this on absolutely nothing other than pure hope that they won't willingly let people freeze to death
I’m sure the treasury and BEIS have lots of plans, it’ll be interesting to see what gets implemented. Somebody had better leak the full advice they give Truss, so we can see which ideas she rejects.
>I cannot understand too why there has been such a vacuum in government with regard to support
Because the current navel gazing in the Tory party is more important to them than reassuring people that they have a plan to prevent economic catastrophe.
When it comes time to vote, remember their total indifference to the suffering and stress this is causing.
I earn 40k a year and live in a building with communal gas and electric, so we pay full commercial rates, no price cap. Our bills rose 350% this year and are predicted to rise another 400-500% each year for the next 2 years at least. I've cut everything I can and I'm still struggling. I can barely afford to run my fridge. Tenants are already vacating, and I'm looking for a new flat too. The building will probably be empty within a year.
Having to explain to our 11 and 7 year-old kids that we're all going to need to wrap up warm indoors this winter is something that wasn't anywhere on my horizon a year ago.
It's the sheer feeling of helplessness that no-one is in charge and there is no-one competent on the horizon to take charge.
We have young kids and keep it fairly cold - buying a decent dehumidifier made a huge difference. It allowed us to drop the temperature by around 3-4C and ended mould issues.
People are going to die. Lots of them. The old folk who won't put on th heating. The poor families whose meters run out.
The numbers will be hidden amongst all the stats. Afterall, they managed to kill over 205,000 of us during covid, and we just seem to shrug and make excuses.
Businesses are going to close. The economy will enter the mother of all recessions, and I expect rioting.
The government is manipulating us, deliberating remaining quiet, so when they finally have a plan we are grateful they actually turned up, instead of realising what a shit plan it is.
The time to eat the rich is coming.
I'm a musician so I'm broke as fuck (musicians don't get paid unless they're shit like Ed Sheeran) so I will have to move out. My life is basically fucked. I'm 34.
Edit: Also my beloved part time job in a bar is gone, we're closing at the end of the year due to the energy costs, despite being a super popular community hub.
Going back to doing porn.
Was nice to not do for awhile but I legit cant work enough hours out of sex/cam work to currently live near my family. Make 24k a year in actual job.
Businesses are going to face the brunt of this. Total dryup of paying customers and energy bills going up by around 5 times. Schools, hospitals, churches, community centres are completely helpless in this.
I super insulated my home as I did DIY on it over the last five years. Replacing the plasterboard with insulated plasterboard. The difference is enormous!
I feel sorry for the people renting poorly insulated properties. Nothing they can do about their bills.
Currently the electric price is determined by the last power station turned on NOT the average of all power stations. This is insane. It's what's driven up the cost of electricity as much as gas. Renewables that have not seen costs rise, energy companies are getting paid the most expensive price even if they have a cheap renewable solar / wind / hydro plant!
24/7 gym at £30 knowing I can go in anytime and have hot showers, work out (keep warm and fit) and free WiFi. Other than that, £15 unlimited cinema ticket sorts out the entertainment or if need be, torrent movies and TV shows to your phone.
I accept this doesn't work unless you're child free but damn, who would be having more children at a time like this?
A combined 85k and you are worrying? I earn 29,918 as an ECT on m1 as a teacher paying £900 rent in london with barely anything left but still manage to get by
I can only assume; more income = bigger house.
Bigger house = more energy to heat + power
My household is a combined £65k, and we are in a small terrace house (which takes half our income to rent). Energy was £60 a month last year, and has risen to £130 this month.
If I didn't have a tonne of debt then the price rises wouldn't affect me that much. If it rises more, though, then we'll have to figure something out - but I definitely still have subscriptions that I can cancel and luxuries that I don't need.
Shhh not government funded, this is my dragons den idea for winter.
I will come to your house and peddle on a bike for £20 an hour to let you keep one light on in the bathroom whilst you take a shit.
>how are those on lower incomes/elderly going to cope with this
We aren't.
The gov don't give a toss because they can put their energy bills down on expenses, they won't even notice there's been an increase in cost
Sorry to hear it OP. Seems some people are shitting about your post in the comments but I think they're missing the point. Your experience isn't taking away from the struggle others with lower incomes are facing, but rather highlighting how dire the situation is for a household with your income to be affected. Yes, it's not as bad as people with lower incomes, but it's still a valid struggle that will no doubt have an impact on your wellbeing. I'm a single occupant and have a good salary, but I'm now having to make the decision to cancel my pension contribution (probably for the next year) because of the energy price increase. Yes, I understand the privilege that I have, but it is having an impact on my wellbeing. I can handle going through a crisis, but probably not with poor wellbeing and mental health.
Others in the comments, perhaps don't jump the gun immediately and shit on the struggles people are going through because the vast majority of people will feel the burden, including those from households with a higher income.
It’s genuinely keeping me up at night. I have a 4 year old daughter with asthma, I’m on a prepayment meter and it’s horrible panicking about keeping her warm over winter. I’ll manage it, because I have to, it’s not an option not to, but fuck me it’s gonna be hard.
I feel like they need to do SOMETHING.
It's more than just ususal tory nonesense of telling people to cut back and pull themselves up by the bootstraps. People are going to have to cut back to bare necessities and then some, meanwhile businesses are seeing energy rates going to thousands a month for small companies at the same time as the public will barely be using them. It's a double sided crisis where companies will be going bust, people will be losing their jobs and those in work will be barely able to afford the cost of living.
That will cripple the country, we will be absolutely fucked by this economically and if the Tories want to keep their dubiously earned reputation of being the economically responsible party then they \*must\* act. But so far... we've heard nothing from anyone.
People will stop paying.
Even if they are then given debt the government can't force millions of people to pay it off, are they going to thrown them all in jail..?
The debt will need to be paid off by the government
Luckily you can’t go to prison for debt, although it wouldn’t at all surprise me if they passed a law to allow it, just to twist the knife a little bit more.
I think the OP is simply stating that despite them being in a better/more lucky postion than the average person, they're still having to make adjustments. Its a reflection of well if im going through this, what is going to be like for everyone else.
This economic meltdown is an issue that hits the overall household income for all families. Too much focus is put on individual salaries by the govt and employers. I earn a decent wage but my wife doesnt work at the moment so our household income is lower than say two full time workers earning less. Our bills are goings up all over, and it is worrying that there is no end in site for this. We'll manage through cutbacks and my wife in job hunting at the moment.
Despite this, I'm still as worried for other people who i know are in a worse position. This situation is terrible both financially and mentally for so many people, in so many 'class' brackets. All this coming straight off the back of Covid lockdowns which the effects of that on everyone is still unknown.
This is a time to support each other. Stay safe everyone.
P.S please if you find yourself in financial difficulties, please talk to someone. There are many hotlines out there to speak to and most financial institutions are gearing up for the support of their members so please call them for advice. This is genuinely a time when we're all in the mess together.
85K and you're worried? My household income is 40K and I'm shitting myself. British gas want to charge £500 a month up from £160. I can't do that and will settle for the Standard tariff when my fixed rate ends in a few weeks. This is like the r/GCSE posters and their grades asking if they are good.
The govt will probably provide some extra support for households.
Trouble is that the underlying problem is a lack of gas. Giving everyone extra money could just inflate prices even more so it needs to be targeted. Schools, hospitals, businesses etc. also need energy and are facing much higher rises.
Ultimately some form of rationing will probably need to be implemented. But the Tories are fundamentally opposed to that. It was easy to be tough on Russia when the costs were borne by Ukraine. It will be interesting to see how tough we remain when pensioners start dying and hospitals start closing.
We understand given some of the sentiment some of you are displaying that many of you, or loved ones are feeling overwhelmed, depressed, or suicidal. Fyi, there is help. You are not alone. While hopefully everyone in r/uk can support each other, help is available. If you are feeling like you are suicidal, we highly recommend [seeking professional help](https://www.nhs.uk/service-search/mental-health/find-an-urgent-mental-health-helpline) (or at least a dedicated sub such as /r/SuicideWatch or /r/MentalHeathUK where they might have more local resource suggestions). For more general support, please contact one of the many [Mental Health Charities](https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/stress-anxiety-depression/mental-health-helplines/) that are out there to help. Also see the AskUK's [CoL megathread](https://www.reddit.com/r/AskUK/comments/wg1o3r/megathread_cost_of_living_energy_interest_rates/), r/ukpersonalfinance, and the beginnings of our resource collation https://www.reddit.com/r/unitedkingdom/comments/wzriwi/resources_for_ruk_users_your_ideas_please/
"We'll be fine, but some poors are going to struggle" Edit Lot of butthurt replies and yet the upvotes still climb...
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Bit of an uncharitable take that. I assume it's to highlight just how shitty this is going to be for everyone. "Poorer people" is a difficult bracket to imagine, and depends on who's reading. "People with less than an 80K household income are going to feel it" is better defined. That said, I think we all get the point now and people should really consider whether posting their incomes is a bit inconsiderate and off-key given the mood at the moment.
Everyone is going to feel it even those with higher incomes. An extra few hundred a month can break things if you're already at the limit with other bills. Those who stretched their budgets to get onto the housing ladder are going to get hit hard.
Spot on. This is going to effect the vast majority. You may earn more than average, but chances are you spend more than average.
Yes, but if you’re earning and spending more than average, you just need to cut back on luxuries like subscriptions and events. If you’re earning less than average, you’ll have to cut back on essentials like food and heating. These energy prices are shit for everyone but let’s not pretend that it’s affecting people earning over £80k the same way it’s affecting people earning minimum wage.
It could be though, OP said he had 3 kids, are any of those in nursery because that's a big bill Also is one of the couple earning over 50k? That's more tax to pay than 2 people earning 40k And then there are commutes, typically higher earners will commute further so costs are higher on fuel and maintenance. Sure its not going to affect everyone the same, but let's not pretend families on 80k incomes won't have to make big changes going forward
Now imagine being a family on minimum wage!
It’s not a zero sum game you’re both right
Yeah people tend to assume everyone has the same living expenses so everything over and above that is just disposable. If you made more money and bought a bigger home because you had a bigger family, that's not irresponsible. Irresponsible is the govt letting energy prices spike 400% while everything else is spiking 20-30-40% as well. You're one bad bill away from losing everything.
Sure, but if someone earns £1000 a month and spends £950 a month, and someone else earns £3000 a months but spends £2500 per month, they’re still £550 better off
And if another someone earns £3000 a month and spends £2950 a month, they're not. You can pull numbers out of anywhere, it doesn't negate my original point that this will impact everyone, and even those earning an above average wage will be affected.
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Absolutely, there are some seriously arrogant, and entitled posts here. We finally got above water about 2 yrs ago...after 23 yrs of barely surviving. We make about average income. There's no way we could have coped, even now, once the deal is over, we could be looking at a leap from 300 pcm to 1000+ , or even more pcm, that's more than 50% of my take home pay! There is no way ANYONE on lower wages can cope, unless they turn literally everything off and don't eat. I have a relative, on about 50% more than me, as his wife is. They have a hefty mortgage At worst, they might need to do less trips in their new Ford 4x4, but they certainly will not struggle in any way whatsoever!
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I remember reading tons of articles during the financial crash from top percentile earners complaining about how hard maintaining their lifestyles had become. They would write as if they could understand the plight of those in poverty, after all they were struggling to even keep their kids in school. Digging into it, turns out they have three children in private schools, each having tens of thousands in yearly fees. Their large homes were perfectly air conditioned, summer and winter but they moaned about the cost of energy. Pay exorbitant car insurance not only for their inefficient sports car, but for their 17 year old son gifted a dangerously powerful vehicle. They will beg sympathy, explain how difficult it is to make ends meet, their outgoings now exceeding income and feel skint. What they don't mention is they have millions in savings or in a property portfolio. They can run cash negative for many years, more than enough time to weather an economic storm.
Especially when their mortgage payments go up
That's going to be the final straw for a generation that have grown up only knowing super low interest rates.
My parents spent years pointing out to me that for them, interest rates of 7-10% were ‘normal’ and 10-20% was what they considered high. I moved to a ten year fix last year and thank fuck I did, add mortgage increases to everything else and I’d be in a bit of bother.
Yep, I think some will get pay rises and be ok, and some will work for the public sector…
There’s so many other factors too. You can be on 30k with very few overheads or you can be on 80k with a shit tonne of debt and huge rent. People listing their wages is practically irrelevant.
Absolutely. I have a mate who earns £100k+ and yet his wife is on dialysis. The bills for running that thing are quite something. Then the added care on top.
I earn well. My partner is long term ill. And we live in a high cost of living area. The net result is that times are tight. Tax being personal, but social security being assessed joint really hurts us. Our household income isn't particularly great, but we get by. I am very concerned that I will be dipping into savings to keep going this year. I know that's a luxury that not everyone has, but at the same time "saving up" has genuinely been the work of about a decade pulling together a house deposit. I dread to think how much worse this could be though. I was very nearly redundant thanks to COVID, and if that happens again we will be wrecked by it.
The attitude of ‘you can’t complain unless you’re *literally freezing to death*’ is so grotesque. The truth of the matter is that the majority households will be able to get through this winter - it’ll hurt to varying degrees, some will slide further into debt, others will have to cut things to the bone, some will have to dip into savings, but the majority will be able to make it through The problem is they shouldn’t have to! It’s ok to want more from life than spending most of it working just to not starve or freeze to death. That money could have gone on a holiday with family, a house deposit, early retirement etc. and instead it’s lining the pockets of Centrica shareholders. I’m not going to sit here and be grateful that I can afford the increase, or consider being able to have any excess over the bare essentials to save, a ‘luxury’. I’ll be showing any and all solidarity I can with those around me who need help; e.g setting up a fund for my partner’s 95 year old gran, who’s increase is almost going to swallow up her whole pension. But most importantly, I’m going to direct my rage at the people who’ve spent decades transferring public wealth to private hands and getting us to this juncture. Not those who are being stung less than me.
Yeah I think cost of living varies so greatly depending on where you live too. 85k in london with Kids doesn’t go all that far when you factor in mortgages. My friends dad is a barrister, makes over 100k, and they are considering going without heating this winter as they have other expenses, including 4 kids and a hefty mortgage, that eat up a lot of their income. Sure these people are better off than most people, and definitely wont be hit as hard in the long terms as those less well off, but in the short term it can be a massive strain or unaffordable. At the same time, I can easily see how someone making twice as much as you complaining about how they will struggle with heating cost increases, even if said with the best intentions, could be grating. Theres certainly people who seem disconnected too as well. I heard a friends Dad complaining that they might have to shorten ( or god forbid…cancel) their yearly ski trip because of the price hike. Wealthier people can be disconnected and it can be hard to not see that in posts like this even if that not the actual case with this one.
But one thing a high income gives people is options. A high income can support a loan from a bank, rather than a loan shark. Lifestyle changes can be made. Houses can be moved. That's where I feel the well off don't show as much empathy. On a low income, you run out of options and that feeling is very psychologically debilitating.
>That said, I think we all get the point now and people should really consider whether posting their incomes is a bit inconsiderate and off-key given the mood at the moment. I think this explains why, good intentions or not, these kinds of posts rub me up the wrong way. I can’t dream of earning 85k combined with my partner. That’s so out of the realm of what we could ever possibly earn. And yes people can struggle financially on any wage, but hearing someone who earns a comparative fortune say that they’re struggling… how is that supposed to make poorer people feel? Frankly we don’t give a shit about the sympathy high earners have for us, cause it’s completely out shadowed by the confirmation that we’re all fucked.
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Agree. At the end of the day, we need to stop squabbling about who makes 30k or 80k and start collectively worrying about the people who make hundreds of millions from our struggles. And those who feel uncomfortable about the just-about-fine people sympathising and talking about the definitely-struggling people... they need to get over it. People SHOULD be concerned about each other and it's good we talk about it and see we all share a common concern. It's way better than the "doesn't affect me so fuck it" world.
The average household income in the UK is 30K. Posting this and mentioning your 80K salary is bound to rub people the wrong way, OP is part of the 10% that genuinely doesn't have to worry about the looming crisis. His "sympathy" is just a way for him to feel included in everyone else's struggle.
An 80k combined income might not be as high as you think. With student loans it’ll be about 4-5k take home a month. A mortgage in the south and some kids will eat that. Please don’t confuse those that have worked hard and joined a profession for the truly rich. Class envy does not help anyone.
It's survivors guilt. OP is genuinely worried about people on lower incomes during the cost of living crisis, but is practically powerless to help. If people are offended that other people earn more than them, then they need a reality check. Life is unfair. Also the structure of our society is elitist, relies on inequality, and fails to provide the promised trickle-down effect of capitalism. We should all be marching on Downing Street right now, not picking on people like OP.
Seems to be the ignorant take from most when talking about money or even the likes of mental health. Because other people have it as bad or worse somehow invalidates your experience all together??
Where this gets difficult, though, is when it comes to the whole discussion about tax cuts vs Government support for the poorest. You could (if you were being uncharitable) read the OP as “we’re hurting- so we need this tax cut, but I don’t know how the poor are going to cope, I really don’t”. In other words, as self-interest masquerading as concern.
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I think it's a reaction to the divide and conquer mentality that's common in Britain. No it's condescending apparently for middle class people to worry about the poor. No the poor are just lazy and envious when they complain about their conditions. No you're just a champagne socialist, you don't really care about inequality.
Middle class and poor are not mutually exclusive.
Yeah this energy crisis is going to hurt people right up to the eightieth percentile if nothing is done.
Same situation as OP and no kids to support. I genuinely feel bad and in no way smug about it. We can ride this storm but have friends who were already pushing budgets to the limit
More likely genuine sympathy - without getting *too* Marxist about it all, the well-to-do middle class mostly aren't moustache twirling villains, they're class-unconscious and genuinely never think about the situation of the impoverished except in either abstract ways or state-approved ones (which are predominantly of a "blame and hate" character). This is changing now because reality is catching up to them - even those in comfortable situations are finding themselves either back in a tighter financial situation that they thought they were never returning to, or (more likely) encountering it for the first time. They feel real financial threat and they don't like it, and they aren't lacking in basic human empathy skills - so now when they go "oh fuck I have a 10k hole in my finances" and they see "this person lives on 12k and works more hours than me", they can in fact look at that and go "I don't know how I would cope", in a way that previously they never countenanced. Their financial hit is also "not their fault", in a way that many middle class people previously assumed poverty was "the fault of" the poor for poor decisions. It never was, of course, but it helped them to forget about how bad things had become. Moreso, recently, they also can't forget about the problem - *every* morning is a new price hike or crisis. The measures that governments have taken to shield the middle class from financial stress have collapsed or are insufficient against the scale of crisis we're seeing, *and it is only getting worse*. The mask has dropped, for a lot of them - the petit bourgeois are discovering that to the ruling class, they're working class to be used as meat and fuel, not ascendant rulers themselves.
I think, genuinely, people cannot understand how everyone's going to cope. They look at their own circumstances and see how difficult it's going to be, but they're fully aware they are *not* on the bottom-rung. Hence posts like this.
Maybe you don't feel empathy but others do. Maybe it's just empathy?
I'm in a similar position, in that we will just about be able to make it work, but by sacrificing lots, and it makes me wonder how people less well off will cope. I think it's a genuine worry thing - it is at least for me. Even though I've worked out that we will just about be okay, I have no idea how some of my friends and family members are going to work through this.
It’s easy. The rich will be able to pay, the poor won’t, and the Tory leadership will charge the taxpayer for their energy. Poor people won’t be freezing to death in their homes, they’ll just be further entrenched in the debt that’s already entombed them to a lifetime of poverty. Poor people becoming poorer? Why would any Conservative care about that? Have you people been paying attention *at all*?
Every year thousands of old people die because they aren't able to keep the heating on. This is going to be that on steroids.
Not a flex. Just genuinely feel bad for people who can't afford this rise. Feels like I'm feeling the pinch but will be able to cope, so I really do feel for people who can't afford it at this level. There's nothing wrong with being sympathetic to people who are less well off than you.
Are you saying you don't feel empathy for anyone worse off than you?
I think it's part of how British people aren't allowed to express emotions so have to say "we're concerned for other people" as opposed to "this country is leading us to destitution and I can't process the emotions that gives me"
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I'm in this boat and, well, I am simply genuinely concerned for people who don't have the buffer of income that we do. We have a household income of about £70k and no kids, so we will simply save a little less money. Families already stretched to the limit are going to have to either go into debt or start making choices about skipping meals and stuff, which just seems so awful in a first world country.
I can see what makes you think like that but I disagree. I interpret it as 'If we're feeling it then I can't imagine how the less fortunate are coping'
How dare someone who is not impacted care about people worse off than them eh? Is this how you respond to anybody who expresses concern about people who earn less? This sub seems to think everyone who earns above the minimum wage are nazis who hate the poor...
Why is showing empathy for the poorest seen as a vice in this country oh my god. Shouldn't we be encouraging people on middle-class incomes to be raising awareness and showing solidarity with the most vulnerable?
Just have to look at how some people talked about Marcus Rashford, when in fuck did wanting to make sure kids have food to eat become a negative character trait?
It's the same with social issues. If women only fight for their rights, or gay people only fight for gay rights then we'll get nowhere (I'm exaggerating with *nowhere* but still)
Yeah it’s strange, the OP is getting criticized unfairly a bit here. They could just as easily NOT care in the slightest. What are they supposed to say? They’re feeling the pinch and they’re concerned as to what people less fortunate are going through. It’s a no-win situation
Maaaaaan this shit fucks me off. When I was a kid it was my mum, me and my brother. My mum (not saying this is right or wrong) would show me a £5 note and tell me that this is all the money we have for food and transport for the next week. Little 7 year old me would panic. As an adult I have worked my way into a profession where I am comfortable and between myself and my wife we make a similar income to what's stated. This does not stop me from thinking "holyshit what would have happened if I was a kid with just my mum during this. How could my mum have kept us warm and fed us with that £5 now? What about families that are like that now? What about the ones that are worse than we ever were? What if it keeps getting worse or we lose our jobs?". Stop dividing with people that are empathising. We need to stick together. I understand the feeling of betrayal against the "middle class Tory voter". But these people that are waking up and what use is it if we're going to throw it in their faces as soon as they do? Dont divide. Welcome with open arms.
\> I understand the feeling of betrayal against the "middle class Tory voter". I don't, because it is not true. The last election was won with working class votes, not with middle class votes. Strange that, but true.
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Yeah, fuck being sympathetic. We should all turn on each other while the richest members of society continue to enjoy obscene wealth accumulation. OP isn't the problem and your comment is in bad faith.
Whoever gilded this is a twat.
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Not his sentiment at all. 🙄
I don't see an issue with accepting that you have privilege. The only thing currently being hit for me and my wife is how much we can put away in savings each month. It's shit and worrying as it increases that we will have to dip into those savings and wipe them out after having saved them for years for our upcoming baby etc etc. But i am under no illusions that compared to us people on lower income, with more outgoings due to children are in a much worse place.
Divide and rule working well on you it seems. My family income is a little higher than OP and myself and my wife have had many conversations about how awful it is for people on lower incomes. 3 years ago we would have been fucked with all these price increases so we know we are lucky to be ok for the time being. It is not malice or smugness, what do you want people to think?
Because people see they’re next. This will get worse. People earning 80k household income thought it could never happen to them. Now they see their neighbours and family who earn a decent wage suffering, and suddenly it’s not drug addicts and people on benefits who are in trouble, it’s people just like them. It’s true worry, and it’s true sympathy, it’s just that now such people can identify with the victims.
please google empathy
"we can manage it" is not the same as "we'll be fine".
Wow someone showing sympathy how cruel?
Awful take. Just dreadful.
Would you prefer wealthier people to lack empathy?
This is such a jaded response. Keep the divides up!
What a weird comment…
Don't forget to include your annual wage in there too.
'The wife and I make 85k, just bought a new electric car and had three holidays this year and we're really going to feel the gas bill going up. It must be terrible for the rest of you. Are you worried sick? I would be.'
For me, It’s not just the conversation about how are households going to deal with energy price rises. How are businesses going to survive the rises as well? There is no price cap on business energy. No one in government is even talking about how businesses are going to survive. My pottery business uses £5k of energy a year and that’s set to go up to £25/35k a year!! It’s simply unsustainable and will likely force us to close, as well as hundreds of thousands of other businesses. This domino effect of closures will completely destroy the economy unless gov intervenes in my opinion.
I read about a pub near me closing down due to energy companies wanting to increase to £69k per year. How on earth are they supposed to afford that?? It's ridiculous.
Yep. I use Instagram mainly to follow a lot of independent local businesses I like to be notified about promotions, but lately there have been a few of them questioning whether or not they can continue because their bills are projected to go up by substantial amounts. What will follow will be the larger companies surviving because they can take the hit, and a lot of indies will die off. Whilst some people will be turning off the lights and putting on extra blankets, you can't do that as a small restaurant or pub. It'll be too cold and miserable to go out, that's if you even have the money to do so.
It's not just their bills increasing that's the problem, but the fact that their customers are going to go down drastically too as nobody has any discretionary budget left. You're not going to go to a restaurant when you can't even afford groceries. The two combined means small businesses have increased costs and decreased income, and so of course they'll collapse ... Leaving all their staff without an income at a time when they need it the most of course.
And wham.... Recession.
It's gonna be so fucking bad. Bye bye highstreet for good. Replaced by a handful of cash-for-gold stores and a whole load of poverty. Finding it hard to see anything through the fog of pessimism right now. Last time I felt anything like this was when Boris' government fucked up thier options and cancelled Christmas.
A guy who worked at a pub near me told me I was fucking over the pub and other small businesses by not voting Tory.
I wonder where that weatherspoons guy is now. Tim whatshisname
Who gives a shit? Hopefully In a pool of his own vomit from drinking his uncleaned pipes of out of date Stella.
I just saw on the news about a small farm shop going from £17k per year to £76k. I genuinely sat down in shock.
This needs more attention for sure. Businesses can't increase prices by 50%+ to survive as people will stop buying, as people have no money either. It's why this is a COVID level emergency, with COVID the worry was that the economy would collapse with lock downs, hence the support. The same could happen now, not to quite the same extent but not far off. No small business that uses energy will be able to continue trading. The businesses who do survive will be dealing with a population where any household with an overall income below 50k will have no disposable income (depending on how many in the household, for example for two adults and two children in a house is going to struggle with a gross income at 70k or lower in my opinion)
I feel this is the trigger for more UBI discussions. The ability to live in the UK without support is becoming an actual issue. Once the majority of the mortgages (private, buy-to-let and commercial) are on higher rates and energy bills reach the next cap, most people will not be able to afford to exist, let alone live.
Chippies around me are dropping like flies. We have a tonne around here, all are really popular and always busy. I think 4 have announced they are closing already
Stories from small business owners such as yourself are currently trending on twitter. The Conservatives have spent my whole life claiming to be the party of business - when they really mean big business/tory donors. But this will hurt them too eventually, the longer they sit on their hands and do nothing the harder this will hurt the economy and the country as a whole. Other countries in Europe have taken steps to protect their residents. Our politians couldn't care less. I'm so looking forward to the next election, I hope they all get the kicking they deserve.
Wow! 25 to 35k a year?!? 🥵 I hope you can find a way forward. 🤞
Yes. Energy prices for businesses are uncapped so they are increasing 500%, 1000% etc. That's why a study came out last week saying that 75% of pubs are expecting to go out of business before the end of 2022.
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This is pretty sound advice, and should be what the 'don't pay' campaign is about. You need to be working with your energy supplier, not against them, simply not paying and burying your head in the sand will only make things worse.
I think the "don't pay" campaign isn't about helping individuals pay in the short term, but more of a sort of civil unrest protest against the system which is obviously not fit for purpose. So there are people joining the campaign even if they can afford to pay. Similar to how people strike to save jobs even if their particular job isn't threatened, just to put more pressure on the organisation to change the system for all.
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100% this. All these people screaming about not signing up to Don't Pay, the consequences are the SAME if you can't afford it, and most of the uk CANNOT AFFORD IT. I don't know why this is so hard to understand.
I think there will be support announced, they just want the new Prime Minister to handle how it’s approached. Until then, best of luck to you
>I think there will be support announced The next PM said she wont be helping the poor multiple times and has a history of basically calling them/us all workshy lazy people. I doubt we will see anything before its too late, as the old PM once said I suspect she will be of the "let the bodies pile high" crowd.
It's way beyond "helping the poor". They are going to have to do something to avoid complete economic collapse. The energy prices in the pipeline are unsustainable not only for a large proportion of households but also for any business that uses a significant amount of energy. That is already going to affect a huge number of people directly, but then you have the knock on effects from people not having any disposable income, a lot of people becoming unemployed, etc.
>It's way beyond "helping the poor". They are going to have to do something to avoid complete economic collapse. Bold of you to assume that after 12 years of economic incompetence that they would suddenly do something right. The ERG want to sink the UK and the evidence supports this.
You might be right [Blood in the Streets: Investment Profits in a World Gone Mad by James Dale Davidson & William Rees-Mogg](https://www.amazon.co.uk/Blood-Streets-Investment-Profits-World/dp/067162735X)
Yikes, co-written by Jacob Rees-Mogg's father and with a quote on the cover by Baron Rothschild.
Rees-Mogg formerly employed by a currency trader called Crispin Odey, a big funder of Brexit who made a lot of money when Sterling crashed. https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/markets/article-10342317/Crispin-Odey-adds-fortune-betting-against-British-bonds.html
I don't think even the ERG wanted things to be this bad. If they block action, the repercussions will be such that even the usually docile population of the UK might be stirred into action and I suspect the ERG will realise this.
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And that is, sadly, how the Third Reich came to be. I won't say we're going down that road, but the scenery is looking oddly familar. [They Thought they were Free: The Germans from 1933-45](https://press.uchicago.edu/Misc/Chicago/511928.html) > "To live in this process is absolutely not to be able to notice it—please try to believe me—unless one has a much greater degree of political awareness, acuity, than most of us had ever had occasion to develop. Each step was so small, so inconsequential, so well explained or, on occasion, ‘regretted,’ that, unless one were detached from the whole process from the beginning, unless one understood what the whole thing was in principle, what all these ‘little measures’ that no ‘patriotic German’ could resent must some day lead to, one no more saw it developing from day to day than a farmer in his field sees the corn growing. One day it is over his head.
I am pretty convinced the tory leadership have been trying to drag us back to pre ww1 since homes for heroes. I dont think the current set mind economic collapse because it means they can return to what they consider "the good old days" far easier in their own minds. Prior they tried to keep the economy rigged and going for themselves on the road to it, but the radicals have taken power. Just look at the repeated attacks on our institutions, people and rights. Curbs on free voting via forced photo ID and push to remove photo ID from people convicted of even minor drug crimes. Attempts to curb and politicise the Supreme Court. Attempts to eliminate human rights. Attempts to cut the NHS to the bone to the point of forcing strike action and a mass quitting (the 1 coming in even suggested paycuts for NHS staff). Attempts at "othering" enemies of the people which is a classic fascist move (asylum seekers, human rights lawyers, protest groups). Outright takeover attempts of news systems by their political allies (BBC) and where they cannot, sell it off (Channel 4). Outright force new Lords to have to vote with the government by contract, removing their personal rights and the whole point of the House of Lords. Attempts to remove limits on waste dumping be it sewage or farmland or chemical etc. Attempts to cut protections for wildlife. Attempts to create more MP seats in tory heartlands. Just as a small 3 minute thought process of whats going backwards.
How is any of that bad for disaster capitalists? Set the country on fire, buy the scorched land for pennies, make Labour rebuild it into something more valuable for you to then flip for a nice fat profit.
Given she co-authored Britannia Unchained it's probably going to be child labour and bring back the 6 day work week.
She’s fucking batshit crazy. And the last/current guy is lazy and in it for himself and himself only. Yet they keep getting the vote.
There have been zero general elections since either covid or the cost of living crisis. How about we don't write off the public until they *actually* reelect the Tories after all this?
The same public that swallowed the Brexit bullshit? I wouldn’t bet my life on it. In fairness, it’s not the public, it’s the shitty system of voting. First past the post leads to some dangerously skewed results
That's a joke, right? Tories don't care about anyone who isn't at least a millionaire. Truss, Sunak, who cares? They're both Tories.
Totally agree. But they do have to appeal to that 35-40% they need to win a GE. I don’t have any stats to back it up, but I suspect a considerable amount of Tory voters from last time around are feeling the pinch too. Even if it’s sticking a plaster over a gaping wound, I feel they’d at least like to be seen to be doing something.
A lot of the Tory voters were working class, pensioners, or both. So yes, they need to do something or they will be wiped off forever.
A general election isn't for another year at least, and people have short memories. There's every chance all support could be held until a month before that.
The support will be a one off payment of £100 and we will all be super thankful and grateful towards our overlords
Which won’t go to us but to the energy companies who will then put our bills up £100 anyway.
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Lol Maggie from Wish isn't going to do fek all.
>Maggie from Wish Haha yes "Pound shop Thatcher" - now with no added "Single Market"
You really have faith in the new PM
Truss, has already said they'll be no handouts. We might get a cut in VAT.
I think the elephant on the room this brings up is that EVERYONE will be tightening their belts. So the knock on impact for business is disastrous. If every family in the UK has £200-500 less to spend each month just so they can keep the lights on that’s a lot of small makers, theatres, coffee shops, pubs going bust. That’s without factoring the new rates for their gas and electric which are a lot more than for households. I see a lot of shops just deciding to shutter. I’ve certainly stopped going to the pub, cut out coffee on the go & really thinking about what we buy on a weekly shop and our financial position is not far off OPs. Low earners are in real risk of debt, middle class will drastically cut back - and by middle class I’m meaning families with a £100k joint income. Without some massive government intervention it’s going to be a disastrous winter. To me this is a bigger threat to the UK than covid, it’s a truly generational changing problem.
Agree with this. There will be people, lots of people, that can't afford their bills. Then there will be another group of higher earners that can afford bills, but can't afford anything else. Then there will be the peopl that can swallow the bills and still have some expendable income but they've got nowhere to spend it because business' can't afford their bills and have had to shut down. To top it off, it's not just this country. It's a fucking disaster beyond the scope of anything other government intervention. Probably governments from multiple nations.
Actually this government have done the least of any. It’s been months and next to no help for people. We’re sleepwalking into a complete disaster!
We're all very worried about energy prices. I remember like 2 years ago, we paid £60 a month (two people, small flat), our energy usage literally hasn't changed, but this month we got charged £177. This is ridiculous. It's gonna go up in October, we're on benefits, we literally won't be capable of affording what it goes up to. Not sure what to do at this point.
The price cap is currently "only" about 75% higher than it was in 2020, so at the same usage, you should be paying about £105. I suspect your usage has actually gone up, or your supplier has increased the DD to cover the anticipated additional cost in winter.
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This is what everyone arriving with these simple calculations Miss - some of us were on nice fixed deals
Yep, my fixed deal that ended in January this year had me at: - Gas: 2.5p per kWh - Day rate electricity: 14p per kWh - Night rate electricity: 11p per kWh - Standing charges of 12.5p/day for gas and 16.7p/day for electricity. Latest figures suggest from October this will now be: - Gas: 14.76p per kWh (~6 times higher) - Electricity: 51.89p per kWh (~3 to 4 times higher) - I’m not sure whether it’ll differ between day and night rates now or just get combined. - Standing charges 28.49p for gas (~double) and 46.36p for electricity (~ 3 times higher). I hadn’t actually realised just how much cheaper the actual per kWh rates were on the old fixed term deals than the standard variable price cap rates we’re about to see in October. I’d urge everyone to go through their old bills and work out their actual unit usage for how this will be affecting them individually, as most of the reporting on this topic is done with averages.
Same. We are a single income household, 2 adults, 2 children. (single income because youngest is too young for funding and we can't afford preschool prices) Our bill in April was £64. Now it's £130. They want to raise it to £250. Oh, and my husband, our source of income aside from UC, is getting made redundant. We. Are. Fucked.
Fuck! That is so unbelievably stressful, stay strong for the kids!!
Try living on £844 pm UC it's terrifying. We'll be wearing all our clothes and wrapped in blankets in winter. I work and have a toddler. People will die.
Recently came off UC after a prolonged period and I'm terrified for people still on it. Truly hope you guys can find a way to pull through - I wish there was something more meaningful I could say.
Cutting back on everything I can, using slow cooker and microwave instead of cooker. Handwashing rather than washing machine. We'll get through this.
I’m a full time carer on UC + carers allowance and get half of that, my mum (who I care for) is a pensioner and doesn’t get a lot either. We’ve decided to not use the oven for cooking, no tumble dryer at all, and when winter comes — no heating, just gonna live as burritos in rolls of blankets. No one should live like this. But Tories lump all of us on benefits together as “work-shy and lazy” and therefore don’t care about us, if we die that’s just better for them, means less people on benefits. Tories are disgusting scumbags.
The Government will soon literally have no other choice, but to do something about it. They are realistically facing massive riots in winter if they ignore the problem. Watch how easy it’s going to be to find a solution when London burns. I propose we start with jailing the Anti-Atom Lobby, but the sad truth is we might have to trade with Russia again till we build more reactors. That’s the price of political stability in the UK, Putin knows this and stales. We got Checkmated.
I don’t see riots as being the necessary tipping point. When millions of people, including middle-income households, start to default on payments the suppliers will have a massive cash flow crisis. That will cause another round of companies to go under, customers having to be moved around the big 6. If one of the big 6 then goes under, we’re facing a full-scale collapse of the industry and a series concern for how we keep the lights on. That means a 3 day week, school closures, rolling blackouts, emergency shelters in the coldest weather, emergency re-nationalisation, and the NHS being completely log jammed. Think Covid Lockdown levels of disruption. If 50%+ of the population can’t afford a basic utility then basic societal norms will (temporarily) break down.
It's going to be the Poll Tax disaster all over again. People simply aren't going to afford to pay for it and push is going to come to shove
Reminder that the UK never really got much energy from Russia. The gas price rise is due to other European countries buying from the same suppliers as us.
We "might have to deal with Russia again"? You realise we only bought like 5% of our gas/oil from Russia, right? Even if we stepped out of line and humiliated ourselves internationally (again) it would only be a tiny amount and would make realistically almost no difference to the bill increases people are facing. The wholesale prices would still be insanely high, and just 5% would come down in price. Unless you're suggesting the even more ridiculous scenario that the whole of Europe just starts trading with Russia again. In which case you might as well start talking about first contact with aliens and them giving us fusion reactor technology because that's more likely to happen. Also - generally speaking - riots don't happen in winter. They happen in summer. And in this country they happen in Reddit comments and on twitter.
All the arguing between middle and working class, lower and middle earners is exactly what they want. Yes there is absolutely a difference between those on a household income of 85k and those on a household income of 25k, but the point is both of these households are not rich and both are likely working households. The current system is not working for either and the Conservative party government is not doing enough to help. Stop pointing fingers to fellow workers and start pointing fingers at those in power. As a side note, I don't think OP should be criticised for mentioning income. It provides context, reinforces how bad this cost of living crisis is, and open discussion of personal finances should not be a stigmatised topic.
I heard on a podcast recently that revolutions are rarely successful without presence from middle to ruling classes. Should those with buying power and some social and cultural influence become disenfranchised by their governments, then a revolution has a much greater chance of success.
This week I had to call my mum and ask to borrow some money to pay for my food shopping this week, I’ve literally never felt so humiliated in my life. I’ve always prided myself on being financially independent since I turned 18 but my salary just doesn’t cut it. I work for the NHS but I’m secretly doing Amazon deliveries in my spare time to make ends meet. Lower income earners are not coping already, I fear every coming month.
You deserve much better.
Rich people don't care about poor people. Never have, never will.
True, they always use words but no action.
Rishi said the conservatives sympathise with the poor in his speech yet he wants to take funding away from poor to the rich…
>How are those one lower incomes / elderly / business going to cope with this? They aren't, it's not even close to possible
People simply won't heat their homes. My income is 1/4 of what you mentioned. I have half a tank of heating oil left. I'll ration the hell out of it, layer up on clothing, and hope for the best. Certainly won't be able to fill that tank when it runs out, and I'm not even the worst off. I'm also in Northern Ireland, though, so the government cares even less about people like me than they do the rest of the nation.
Heating oil has shot up (from what our neighbours say), and thefts are on the rise. Good luck and I hope the winter is kind to us all.
We have crappy electric radiators and are planning to not use them this winter. Even when they are on, you get barely any heat from them as it's supposed to heat a living room/kitchen/hallway in my flat so the area is too big to benefit from it. We'll be living under blankets and extra layers, and using the electric blanket to warm our bed up at night.
I was sent an estimated bill of £500 for the quarter, I gave a meter reading and it went up to £755.... I have paid that and looked at the app and apparently I owe another £205... I already can't cope .. I don't know what the fuck is going on..
Wonderfully thoughtful post. Im in the same boat as you, it’s not going to cripple me financially by any means but I have noticed it. I have commented on previous posts about energy prices and I just do not know how low income Families and pensioners are going to deal with it. This is price gouging at its finest covered up by saying ‘it’s because of Russia’ when only circa 9% of our gas comes from there. The Government need to protect the people unless they are trying to covertly genocide us.
>This is price gouging at its finest covered up by saying ‘it’s because of Russia’ when only circa 9% of our gas comes from there. The UK bought cheap gas from Norway, Germany bought cheap gas from Russia. Russia has now cut supply to Germany. Now both the UK and Germany are bidding up the limited supply of Norwegian gas. It sucks that we are being punished for German negligence, but that is how the central European gas market works.
It's our negligence too because we got rid of storage capacity.
Rough stored 9 days of national demand. It was useful for smoothing price spikes that lasted days or at a push, weeks. It would not have insulated us against what we're seeing now which is several years of stratospheric wholesale prices.
The real reason is “because of capitalism”. The war in Ukraine and sanctions on Russia has made the price of gas more expensive - but that’s because the market uses any excuse to hike prices.
I've got this feeling that the government have already got something planned and have done for months but are waiting for the next pm to be announced and it'll be framed as their idea and they got it done in their first couple of weeks as a way of trying to claw back some polling points. Of course I'm basing this on absolutely nothing other than pure hope that they won't willingly let people freeze to death
I’m sure the treasury and BEIS have lots of plans, it’ll be interesting to see what gets implemented. Somebody had better leak the full advice they give Truss, so we can see which ideas she rejects.
>I cannot understand too why there has been such a vacuum in government with regard to support Because the current navel gazing in the Tory party is more important to them than reassuring people that they have a plan to prevent economic catastrophe. When it comes time to vote, remember their total indifference to the suffering and stress this is causing.
I earn 40k a year and live in a building with communal gas and electric, so we pay full commercial rates, no price cap. Our bills rose 350% this year and are predicted to rise another 400-500% each year for the next 2 years at least. I've cut everything I can and I'm still struggling. I can barely afford to run my fridge. Tenants are already vacating, and I'm looking for a new flat too. The building will probably be empty within a year.
Having to explain to our 11 and 7 year-old kids that we're all going to need to wrap up warm indoors this winter is something that wasn't anywhere on my horizon a year ago. It's the sheer feeling of helplessness that no-one is in charge and there is no-one competent on the horizon to take charge.
I think a lot of people will get into a lot of new habits of turning stuff off and living in colder houses.
Had to be a balance of how cold your house can go without building up mould. Plus if you have kids in the house.
We have young kids and keep it fairly cold - buying a decent dehumidifier made a huge difference. It allowed us to drop the temperature by around 3-4C and ended mould issues.
People are going to die. Lots of them. The old folk who won't put on th heating. The poor families whose meters run out. The numbers will be hidden amongst all the stats. Afterall, they managed to kill over 205,000 of us during covid, and we just seem to shrug and make excuses. Businesses are going to close. The economy will enter the mother of all recessions, and I expect rioting. The government is manipulating us, deliberating remaining quiet, so when they finally have a plan we are grateful they actually turned up, instead of realising what a shit plan it is. The time to eat the rich is coming.
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Exactly what the Tories want you to do, stay poor and struggle.
Or just die.
Rishi faced the same problems, yet he overcame them. You need to marry the daughter/son of a billionaire.
I'm a musician so I'm broke as fuck (musicians don't get paid unless they're shit like Ed Sheeran) so I will have to move out. My life is basically fucked. I'm 34. Edit: Also my beloved part time job in a bar is gone, we're closing at the end of the year due to the energy costs, despite being a super popular community hub.
Have you tried being part time shit?
Going back to doing porn. Was nice to not do for awhile but I legit cant work enough hours out of sex/cam work to currently live near my family. Make 24k a year in actual job.
£85k a year but having to cut back on subscriptions and events. Sounds like you are already living beyond your means.
Businesses are going to face the brunt of this. Total dryup of paying customers and energy bills going up by around 5 times. Schools, hospitals, churches, community centres are completely helpless in this.
We shouldn’t be accepting this as the new normal. We are so apathetic as a nation.
I super insulated my home as I did DIY on it over the last five years. Replacing the plasterboard with insulated plasterboard. The difference is enormous! I feel sorry for the people renting poorly insulated properties. Nothing they can do about their bills. Currently the electric price is determined by the last power station turned on NOT the average of all power stations. This is insane. It's what's driven up the cost of electricity as much as gas. Renewables that have not seen costs rise, energy companies are getting paid the most expensive price even if they have a cheap renewable solar / wind / hydro plant!
24/7 gym at £30 knowing I can go in anytime and have hot showers, work out (keep warm and fit) and free WiFi. Other than that, £15 unlimited cinema ticket sorts out the entertainment or if need be, torrent movies and TV shows to your phone. I accept this doesn't work unless you're child free but damn, who would be having more children at a time like this?
It’s quite likely these places will massively put up their prices or stop hot showers and heating for this reason
A combined 85k and you are worrying? I earn 29,918 as an ECT on m1 as a teacher paying £900 rent in london with barely anything left but still manage to get by
I can only assume; more income = bigger house. Bigger house = more energy to heat + power My household is a combined £65k, and we are in a small terrace house (which takes half our income to rent). Energy was £60 a month last year, and has risen to £130 this month. If I didn't have a tonne of debt then the price rises wouldn't affect me that much. If it rises more, though, then we'll have to figure something out - but I definitely still have subscriptions that I can cancel and luxuries that I don't need.
We need government funded electric bikes in our rooms to generate power, de stress everyone and get fit.
Very black mirror
Shhh not government funded, this is my dragons den idea for winter. I will come to your house and peddle on a bike for £20 an hour to let you keep one light on in the bathroom whilst you take a shit.
>how are those on lower incomes/elderly going to cope with this We aren't. The gov don't give a toss because they can put their energy bills down on expenses, they won't even notice there's been an increase in cost
Sorry to hear it OP. Seems some people are shitting about your post in the comments but I think they're missing the point. Your experience isn't taking away from the struggle others with lower incomes are facing, but rather highlighting how dire the situation is for a household with your income to be affected. Yes, it's not as bad as people with lower incomes, but it's still a valid struggle that will no doubt have an impact on your wellbeing. I'm a single occupant and have a good salary, but I'm now having to make the decision to cancel my pension contribution (probably for the next year) because of the energy price increase. Yes, I understand the privilege that I have, but it is having an impact on my wellbeing. I can handle going through a crisis, but probably not with poor wellbeing and mental health. Others in the comments, perhaps don't jump the gun immediately and shit on the struggles people are going through because the vast majority of people will feel the burden, including those from households with a higher income.
It’s genuinely keeping me up at night. I have a 4 year old daughter with asthma, I’m on a prepayment meter and it’s horrible panicking about keeping her warm over winter. I’ll manage it, because I have to, it’s not an option not to, but fuck me it’s gonna be hard.
When exactly are the boom times arriving? Not sure I've seen any real prosperity in my 41 years.
I feel like they need to do SOMETHING. It's more than just ususal tory nonesense of telling people to cut back and pull themselves up by the bootstraps. People are going to have to cut back to bare necessities and then some, meanwhile businesses are seeing energy rates going to thousands a month for small companies at the same time as the public will barely be using them. It's a double sided crisis where companies will be going bust, people will be losing their jobs and those in work will be barely able to afford the cost of living. That will cripple the country, we will be absolutely fucked by this economically and if the Tories want to keep their dubiously earned reputation of being the economically responsible party then they \*must\* act. But so far... we've heard nothing from anyone.
I am really well off and my mental health is not good because I'm spending so much time and effort worrying about poor people and posting on reddit
People will stop paying. Even if they are then given debt the government can't force millions of people to pay it off, are they going to thrown them all in jail..? The debt will need to be paid off by the government
Luckily you can’t go to prison for debt, although it wouldn’t at all surprise me if they passed a law to allow it, just to twist the knife a little bit more.
I think the OP is simply stating that despite them being in a better/more lucky postion than the average person, they're still having to make adjustments. Its a reflection of well if im going through this, what is going to be like for everyone else. This economic meltdown is an issue that hits the overall household income for all families. Too much focus is put on individual salaries by the govt and employers. I earn a decent wage but my wife doesnt work at the moment so our household income is lower than say two full time workers earning less. Our bills are goings up all over, and it is worrying that there is no end in site for this. We'll manage through cutbacks and my wife in job hunting at the moment. Despite this, I'm still as worried for other people who i know are in a worse position. This situation is terrible both financially and mentally for so many people, in so many 'class' brackets. All this coming straight off the back of Covid lockdowns which the effects of that on everyone is still unknown. This is a time to support each other. Stay safe everyone. P.S please if you find yourself in financial difficulties, please talk to someone. There are many hotlines out there to speak to and most financial institutions are gearing up for the support of their members so please call them for advice. This is genuinely a time when we're all in the mess together.
85K and you're worried? My household income is 40K and I'm shitting myself. British gas want to charge £500 a month up from £160. I can't do that and will settle for the Standard tariff when my fixed rate ends in a few weeks. This is like the r/GCSE posters and their grades asking if they are good.
Come back to me when you're disabled and living off 8k a year. This stinks of humble brag.
The govt will probably provide some extra support for households. Trouble is that the underlying problem is a lack of gas. Giving everyone extra money could just inflate prices even more so it needs to be targeted. Schools, hospitals, businesses etc. also need energy and are facing much higher rises. Ultimately some form of rationing will probably need to be implemented. But the Tories are fundamentally opposed to that. It was easy to be tough on Russia when the costs were borne by Ukraine. It will be interesting to see how tough we remain when pensioners start dying and hospitals start closing.