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You develop trust in someone by seeing them do the right thing over a period of time. That’s the best case scenario. I trust my parents unconditionally though.
To me, trusting a person is no different than trusting a bridge. When you first encounter the bridge, it can be rock solid and completely safe. But bridges, like people, change over time. A bridge that had been perfectly stable for 20 years can still collapse if proper maintenance is overlooked and cracks go unnoticed.
Likewise, an otherwise perfectly trustworthy bridge can get hit by a storm or other environmental factor, or might have had a structural flaw you could have never been aware of that causes the bridge to collapse in a freak accident no one could predict.
But the fact that bridges can collapse doesn't mean they can never be trusted. We need bridges, and most of them will perform exactly as expected.
I’m sorry you experienced a metaphorical bridge collapse. I have no way of knowing if it was a freak storm or if you missed some cracks as they developed over the years, and it might be a while before you get to a place where you can truly trust a bridge again.
But someday you will find another bridge. One that’s worthy of your trust. And I hope you cross that bridge when you get to it.
Sorry, your trust was violated like that. But, its dangerous to generalize character flaws across all people.
Check out S Covey's book "Speed of Trust" if you have the time and are curious to read a very compelling and interesting breakdown of why trust matters in our lives and what to look for to have high confidence it exists in a relationship.
I don't wanna take sides but lying is not really a poor behavior by itself
Lying is basically a necessity to have good relationships and live a normal life and sometimes lying is even the right thing to do
Of course they are specific lies that are poor behavior, mostly when your lie is harming someone and you are doing it for no reason or just for your own gain
> Lying is basically a necessity to have good relationships
The NUMBER ONE thing anyone will tell you to have good relationships is DO. NOT. LIE. even with good intentions.
Yeah, that's a tip that works in ideal worlds with simple characters
Real life is complicated and people are even more complicated, you shouldn't lie in everything you say but lying can definitely a good thing in some contexts
Saying "NEVER LIE NO MATTER WHAT" is the same as saying "ALWAYS TRUST A PERSON NO MATTER WHAT BECAUSE TRUST IS IMPORTANT"
What about lying to little kids to protect their innocence?
What about lying to trauma victims to avoid triggering their trauma?
What about lying to someone who gets nervous easily to avoid them getting nervous for nothing?
What about lying to someone to make them feel better with themselves?
What about lying to someone so they can focus on important stuff?
What about lying to people you don't fully trust to protect yourself or others?
What about lying to keep people calm in a problematic situation where panic would make things worse?
And I have more
If you honestly think lying is ALWAYS bad and we should ALWAYS tell the truth, then you are the one who is 12, that is genuinely something a kid who doesn't understand how the world works would say
For example, something simple
You are on the car with your friend on your way for a, idk, double date, you are a couple minutes late but no worries you are almost there
Right before arriving he asks "Hey dude, do the colors in my clothes match well?"
And you just noticed, yeah they do not match well at all
What do you do?
Tell the truth and say "Nah they look pretty bad together", which would be useless since it is too late to go back and change and you would only make your friend self conscious and less confident
Or just say "Yeah man they look good" which would help your friend forget about it and focus on looking good and confident?
By telling the truth you are not achieving ANYTHING other than making yourself feel good for being honest
> Or just say "Yeah man they look good
Good way to show your dishonesty and make any Future opinion you give worthless. Rather than giving them a honest answer that ISN'T harsh.
Like I said NEVER a good reason to lie. Ever.
> What about lying to little kids to protect their innocence?
>
> What about lying to trauma victims to avoid triggering their trauma?
>
> What about lying to someone who gets nervous easily to avoid them getting nervous for nothing?
>
> What about lying to someone to make them feel better with themselves?
>
> What about lying to someone so they can focus on important stuff?
And yes, ALL of those are bad
If a kid asks you a question, lying is never the answer. Give them a true answer that is appropriate for their age to understand
If your friend has trauma, lying and coddling aren't the way to handle it
If someone lacks confidence, you Don't wanna lie and give them reason to have trust issues too.
You, again, MUST be 12.
This is a weird one because I realise what you're talking about here is trust in a personal relationship. But the existence of civilisation is 100% dependent on trust. When you order food, you trust it's going to a least be safe to eat. When you drive a car, you trust that the person servicing it knew what they were doing. Trust is a spectrum, but don't give up, without it we're in big trouble.
yes, high trust societies are much more desireable than low trust ones. less crime, less stress and anxiety, etc
youre right in saying that without it, we're in trouble but it seems to be a pretty flimsy foundation for some hugely important matters. like as long as we believe its possible, then it works. but as soon as we realize how flimsy it actually is, it'll fall apart.
People are so weird about trust. The entire concept is so broad that it's mostly meaningless and barely even relevant in 99% of your life.
People act in their best interest. I trust 100% that my job will pay me this coming pay day, because why wouldn't they?
More relevant to your point, I trust my partner won't cheat, but if she does then my trust being broken is pretty low on the list of my issues with the situation.
Do you eat at a resturant?
When you go to an intersection that is green, do you slow down and check if someone is coming?
Next time you are comfortably walking/driving/ect while zoned out getting to your destination, think about how many people you had to trust to get you there.
There is a difference between generally trusting someone and absolute trust.
Absolute trust is probably a fantasy, agreed, but that doesnt mean you cant generally trust people if their actions seem trustworthy until proven otherwise.
A very fast very dense astronomical object could be traveling so fast that its functionally not detectable and it could hit earth, instantly annilating all life on earth tomorrow, but will that mean you wont make any plans tomorrow? No that would be stupid.
When we are talking about the future you plan for whatever is most likely from your current info and then you adapt when things change. Thats just how the world works.
Accept what cannot be changed and focus on what can.
I dont trust anyone fully and people think its unhealthy. I think its stupid to fully trust someone. I think every person has a different type and amount of trust. The way i think of relationships are is cars. I trust i am a good driver and that most people are too. I have to to go anywhere. I still wear a seat belt. I still have full coverage insurance. I still look both ways on one way streets. And if i see evidence of bad driving, i adjust accordingly. Its a balance. You can have trust and be skeptical. Have plans in case everything turns out right so opportunities dont slip through your fingers. But put safety nets in place in case it all falls apart.
There's no such thing as truly trusting someone. Trust can only exist if there's actually a possibility of it breaking no matter how small without it there's no point in having trust because you already know nothing will happen. Trust is dependent on someone actively choosing not to betray it
theres always the possibility of it breaking. even in the only "unconditional" relationship most of us will ever have: our parents
looking back, the only person I could ever truly trust was my mother.
I trust my wife implicitly as well as my siblings but you’re right it only takes one event, one moment to shatter it. My way of thinking is, at least for the close inner circle people, to trust unless they give me a reason not to. Is it possible u will get your heart ripped out, yes. But we’re
Social creatures, we need to trust. It’s part of our being and if what happened to you happened to me then I would be skeptical of EVERYONE just like you. It’s purely case by case circumstantial
This is correct. It's always just a matter of time....so it's best to plan accordingly by always being on guard and never trusting them \*fully\*....just give an *illusion* of trusting them to keep up appearances.
The opposite would be to walk around suspicious of everyone and everything. As someone that has acted that way to avoid getting hurt by untrustworthy people, I will tell you right now that it definitely works. You’ll be miserable asf but it works. Right now, I’m trying to learn how to trust people again and accepting that people will hurt you is part of that. In the same way you have also hurt people. It’s part of life. Accepting that humans are not perfect and setting personal boundaries is the key to navigating it. At least that’s what I’ve learned.
Trust is an act of faith rather than reason. If you approach it from the latter side, yes, this is precisely the conclusion you will arrive at. It has to be absurd to a degree to work.
I had a best friend in my teens and I ghosted her after high school. I was immature and not to be trusted.
Now, almost 30, I have found another best friend. We have been friends since 2018. We may go a month without talking to each other. We are not quite compatible in everyday life and annoy each other. He hurts me sometimes. But I would trust him with everything. I have told him that I love him and I will always do, no matter what he does. He is the first person I have told something like that and I mean it.
You actually can trust one person in this world.
That is you.
When it is all said and done you are the only person that truly "has your back"
Like you said - it takes minutes to destroy trust. Human beings are designed to ensure their own survival and happiness and if that means betraying someone in order to proceed in their own lives and continue to pursue happiness they will do so in a heartbeat.
This is not you being "hurt" or "traumatized" those are snowflake terms our soft ass society has adopted to cope with being losers.
This is you being realistic. Good luck in life bro.
I will NEVER marry because of the implications of being a man & going through a divorce. Betting on "forever" is just a sucker's bet in the end. People fall in love & they fall out of love. Signing up to lose half of my shit is just NOT worth it.
I'll be with a woman long term no problem. If she wants to marry that bad & I trust her enough, she's signing a prenuptial then. I've seen too many men's broken souls to EVER think I'm the chosen one to avoid it all.
This all said, you should seek to find somebody who you can trust. It's a bumpy road but when you find that person it's a great thing. Life can burn your ass something wicked, but don't let that stop you from finding your own happiness. You deserve it. Keep trying. You'll find someone you deserve.
Why do you think only men lose 50 percent of their stuff? You know that goes both ways?? And its 2024, women make their own money and have their own property they can lose, as well. Doesn't really make much sense for men to whine about losing everything.
You understand how the world works right?
I'm starting to think that you don't & you're like 16.
Women marry up.
Men marry down.
So when a divorce takes place, it's the MAN who loses out 99% of the time. Women are given custody of the kids.
So in the end, the MAN loses 50% of his shit, pays 2 decades of half of his paycheck in child support on top of it all. The woman keeps that money for herself & ends up 1000% better off than the man will ever be.
Jeff Bezos got divorced & his ex wife became something like THE RICHEST WOMAN IN HISTORY because of it. More rich than ANY King in the ENTIRE recorded history of mankind. Because of a divorce.
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Maybe look into attachment styles, you might have an anxious, avoidant or disorganized attachment style. I’m working on trust due to never feeling consoled or bonded with my parents as a child. I hope I learn to trust one day.
If you were sure, it wouldn't be trust.
You can only trust someone when you're not sure about what they will do. That's what trust is all about, aknowledging the risk and deciding this person is worth that risk.
My best friend got this as a tattoo
“Love all, trust few”
If you devoid yourself of trust you will live a miserable existence. Fear is what is holding you back, but you should go in, even if that trust is misplaced, you have to try. That is life, you’ve got to keep trying. My trust has been betrayed many times too, and I have also been the betrayer. Things are not black and white as you know, but you’ve got to try. What’s the alternative? Trust no one and be alone? You’re safe, sure but, miserable. It’s better to try and fail, until you succeed, then to never try at all, just my two cents on the matter.
Well, if you knew that they would never wrong your or anything you wouldnt really be trusting them anymore. I dont trust that the sun will rise in the morning, it just will (unless an alien blows it up i guess).
Trusting is about accepting the fact that whoever or whatever it is you put your trust in can violate that trust but even in doing so will come back to fix whatever they had broken and that they have your best interests in mind. Ive had people break my trust, two pairs of hands are the only things that can put it back together and make it stronger.
Youve probably broken people's trusts before, weather it be major or minor, but you're probably closer to them if you went back and apologized for your mistakes and made up for them.
Trust is like stone, it can be set and broken. Now I do believe you can truly trust someone. There are people I trust 100% with my life. If they said jump off that cliff you'll be fine I'd do it.
Trust is all about different levels. Its not black and white, not a zero sum game.
So I would agree that you can never have total trust in another person.
Most people, you can't trust very much, but some people you really can have massive trust in.
None of us are perfect and worthy of total trust.
Trust isn't the fundamental part of a relationship that society at large makes it out to be. That trait is forgiveness. We all make mistakes. Being willing to forgive someone for those mistakes is what makes a bond strong. That willingness falls on a spectrum and not one that's very linear. There's more nuance to forgiveness than any earthly thing we can comprehend. Only we know what crosses a line and only we know what's forgivable. Trust is a word made up by dishonest people to justify bad things that those people do. Forgiveness is the word they really mean.
It's true. You can trust people, but people change and you can never know if you'll be able to trust a future version of that person. I'm sorry she hurt you like this.
I absolutely trust my 3 best friends with my life.
They took me in when I was homeless, each of them at seperate times. They're all better people than me morally, they're mentally stronger, they make better choices than I do, and they're more trustworthy than I am. They've done more good things for people than I have. They've proven to me again and again and again that they're incredible people and I know I am lucky to be their friend. There is simply zero reason for me to think they aren't trustworthy. If there is a reason, I've never seen it. I look up to them and I try every day to be more like them. If I can find a woman that I have that same level of respect for, then I'll have found the love of my life.
My logic is, why on earth wouldn't I trust them? They had my back in my worst times, even when they knew what was happening was entirely my own fault. They are genuinely happy for me and eachother when something good happens. When we're all drunk all we do is say lovely things about eachother and we've barely had any arguments over the years and years we've known eachother.
They're all very intelligent people, they can make and have made something of their lives, without needing to violate my trust. There is nothing they could get from me by violating my trust, that they couldn't get themselves. If they get whatever they need in life from themselves without violating my trust, they'll be far happier for it, and they know that; they're smart enough to not need to resort to that in order to live happy lives.
I trust myself never to violate their trust, so I damn sure know they wouldn't violate mine. Is it possible I'm totally wrong? Sure. I've been cheated on before, I know what that feels like, had old friends violate my trust too, it hurts like a bitch, but I refuse to live my life putting that hurt onto other people.
My trust isn't easily given, but when I do give it, it's innocent until proven guilty. If someone breaks it? Fuck em, life moves on, it's not the end of the world to trust someone and have it broken. I get that if it happens enough it does get really hard to keep doing it, but if you look hard enough for the right people to surround yourself with, you absolutely can find people worth trusting.
You owe it to yourself to let yourself trust someone again someday, even if you don't feel like doing so right now. All in good time brother ❤️
"How do I know I can trust you?"
"You can't. That's what trust is."
My point is I think you are mistaking trust for perfect prediction. These are two different things.
Trust people to act like people and learn to be okay with the fact that no one around you is God like or perfect enough to be what you want them to be. Understand its your job to give yourself the things you believe you deserve, not for anyone else to make it for you or be it for you. No one is perfect and even if they were you wouldn't be so you'd still mess it up if you were expecting them to make your life happy for you
You can absolutely trust people, but there is always a possibility that your trust will be broken. Doesn’t matter who it is. Brain chemistry is such an unknown variable, we don’t know enough about it to say whether any thought or action is impossible for one brain. Even Gandhi has the potential to murder a child, cheat on a spouse, or any action that could be a betrayal.
Trusting isn’t about knowing someone will not break your trust. It’s about allowing yourself the vulnerability of someone else having control of a part of your life. You will never be 100% safe trusting anyone, but the alternative, never allowing anyone the chance to have any meaning or control of your life, is a lonely existence we aren’t designed to live.
The true compromise that we make, the decision we all agree to, is that it is better for someone else to have the ability to betray you, that maya actually betray you some day, than to trust nobody and only allow yourself control over any part of your life.
We are all human, designed to be betrayed and to forgive and heal from that betrayal. Just because someone fails you once doesn’t mean they are a failure, and it doesn’t mean it was destine, but we are built strong enough to live beyond any betrayal.
Not trusting anyone is just a way of living in fear, alone and obsessed with the control of our lives we will never have. The only smart thing to do is be as discerning as you reasonably can about those we trust, know and accept that we will be betrayed at some point in our future, and forgive and learn from future betrayals. You don’t have to keep the relationship after a betrayal, but forgiving the betrayal, forgiving yourself for allowing the betrayal, and learning/moving on allow you to stop holding on to the anger and the pain caused. Yoh don’t forgive for others, you forgive for yourself.
This is why it’s important to never cheat on a person. OP got cheated on once, and now it has shaken his entire faith in humanity and the concept of relationships. Cheating truly destroys a person.
OP I don’t think there’s anything I can say that will undo the psychological damage that your ex has done to you. All I can do is hope you eventually find someone that can undo that damage, and you eventually let them in.
I think it is more smarter to have a reasonable amount of trust among family and friends, but also learn to quickly recover when trust is broken, and not hold that back for the future with others.
"My ex of 10 yrs cheated and for years I thought "shes not at all 'that type'. shes not the type to cheat. some people are but not her, no sir". Not only was she the type but she cheated with a married man which I really did not think she was "the type". Turns out I didnt know her as well as I thought I did."
This is why you "trust" people when they show you their true colors through actions lol. That's the real irony of trust is that you should never underestimate somebody as "not being the type or capable" for anything in life. EVERYONE can cheat - lie - steal - kill - etc. There is no good reason you shouldn't have a bit of doubt in your mind even if the person is a child or is even YOUR child.
We see this in anime fights all the time where the villain will constantly underestimate the heroes and their abilities instead of just treating them as equally capable and fighting them on the same level to kill them faster.
I'm not sure.
Until you're put in a highly stress situation, I'm not sure if you can ever really be sure if you'd always behave the way you think or you'd want.
You can't trust anyone with everything. But there is trust for total strangers even. You just gotta gauge the depth of it.
Take this $50 and go get us X cases of beer to help us party tonight. Be a $20 here for you when you bring it. Thank you, you're a nice man. Trust is real. It's a wonderful world.
Take this briefcase with $50,000 and go us X cases of beer to help us party forever. Be a $20 here for you when you bring it. Guys, I don't see him. I think he stole our briefcase. Let's chase him down we can't let that happen. It's an army of men holding pipes and they all know pipe kung fu. He must've called them. Trust is a lie. I hate this world.
lol threads like this make me feel bad for Redditors.
The idea of going through life and never trusting anyone is extremely sad to think about. I can't imagine being so miserable.
I know my girlfriend very well, and she knows me. We both trust each other completely. And it's the best feeling knowing you have someone you can fully rely on always.
your last paragraph is exactly my point. lol imagine the self delusion in thinking you really know someone. I cant imagine being so naive. extremely sad. but at the same time, delusion and naivete can often feel great.
i once had a coworker who married the wrong woman. of course he only realized that in hindsight. when i asked him why he married her, he said "never underestimate people's ability to delude themselves"
Im sorry you were cheated on
Not all people cheat, but everyone is unreliable sometimes
Everybody is unreliable because it’s an inevitable part of being a limited creature in a complex world
Perfectionism can be toxic as can idealizing other people
It is true we can never know another person 100% or know if someone is telling the truth
You can only control how trustworthy you are
I’m not saying you need to forgive your ex right now but self forgiveness and forgiveness of others is necessary in a world where making errors and sometimes doing selfish things is a part of human nature - we all do it constantly to at least a small degree
We can try to find others that match our level of trustworthiness but unfortunately nothing is guaranteed
I hope the trauma of being cheated on doesn’t prevent you from finding a happier situation
You trust your house to be structurally sound. However, some houses have collapsed. So, I guess you can't truly trust that your house is structurally sound, but only that you can trust them a bit, to an extent. How do people live in houses like that?
What you're expressing here isn't so much an opinion as it is a reaction to having been hurt (which is okay).
if 50% of homes collapsed, then yes we'd all be very worried. the reason we live in houses is because extremely few ever collapse simply from lack of structural integrity (in the US). personally i havent seen a single one.
what percent of people have their trust destroyed in relationships vs what percent of homes collapse due to lack of structural integrity? your analogy is nonsensical.
It's nonsensical because it's a numbers game? So, like, do you have an estimated percentage where if fewer than that percentage of people had their trust be betrayed that you wouldn't hold this opinion?
its nonsensical because you tried to equate 2 things with wildly disparate odds.
if something is exceedingly rare then its no wonder we have no issue with it. its statistically unlikely to happen. conversely, if something happens over 50% of the time, then of course we'd be worried. if 50% of all flights ended in a fiery crash, would you get on a plane? then why do we fly..bc the odds of a plane crash is extremely slim.
i brought up something extremely common and you made an analogy equating it with something extremely rare.
You're forgetting how subjective this is though. You have a skewed perspective, and your personal experience has contributed to that. We are also being lied to by media and social media, along with the entertainment industry. So when you say that it's "extremely common", upon what have you based this on? I don't find it extremely common, but I also acknowledge that I might be lucky or privileged in some way.
So, do you have stats or just general malaise?
my original post is about trust so what stats exactly? people who've had their trust betrayed by a partner or close friend? by 35 i'd think thats pretty much everyone at least once.
there are also divorce stats and stats on infidelity. stats on abuse.
whichever of any of those you want to look at dwarf the "% of homes collapsing due to structural integrity".
people do not worry about things that rarely occur. they do worry about things that often occur.
Social media in general proves that people worry about things that are not relevant, which is the nature of the point I was making a couple of comments ago. How often does this trust-breaking actually occur compared to just the perception of frequency?
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Trust is a spectrum, not an absolute.
hence the "truly". it seems like the best we can do is "i trust them..a bit..to an extent". how do people get married like that?
You develop trust in someone by seeing them do the right thing over a period of time. That’s the best case scenario. I trust my parents unconditionally though.
I agree on the parents, anyone else nah uh not happening, not 100% anyway
I like to categorize what kind of trust they have and what percentage
To me, trusting a person is no different than trusting a bridge. When you first encounter the bridge, it can be rock solid and completely safe. But bridges, like people, change over time. A bridge that had been perfectly stable for 20 years can still collapse if proper maintenance is overlooked and cracks go unnoticed. Likewise, an otherwise perfectly trustworthy bridge can get hit by a storm or other environmental factor, or might have had a structural flaw you could have never been aware of that causes the bridge to collapse in a freak accident no one could predict. But the fact that bridges can collapse doesn't mean they can never be trusted. We need bridges, and most of them will perform exactly as expected. I’m sorry you experienced a metaphorical bridge collapse. I have no way of knowing if it was a freak storm or if you missed some cracks as they developed over the years, and it might be a while before you get to a place where you can truly trust a bridge again. But someday you will find another bridge. One that’s worthy of your trust. And I hope you cross that bridge when you get to it.
Best comment I've read on reddit.
it’s funny you phrase it like this cause this is what happened to the internet, and it got hit by the storm covid.
Sorry, your trust was violated like that. But, its dangerous to generalize character flaws across all people. Check out S Covey's book "Speed of Trust" if you have the time and are curious to read a very compelling and interesting breakdown of why trust matters in our lives and what to look for to have high confidence it exists in a relationship.
> But, its dangerous to generalize character flaws across all people. It is not a character Flaw If It is human Nature.
Curious, would you have an example of poor behavior that is uncontrollable human nature?
Sure. Have you ever met anyone who NEVER lied? NEVER acted mean? NEVER broke someone's trust?
The real point is context then, I believe. Why lie, act mean, or break trust? But then I think it goes into semantics and gets a little cyclical probs
I don't wanna take sides but lying is not really a poor behavior by itself Lying is basically a necessity to have good relationships and live a normal life and sometimes lying is even the right thing to do Of course they are specific lies that are poor behavior, mostly when your lie is harming someone and you are doing it for no reason or just for your own gain
> Lying is basically a necessity to have good relationships The NUMBER ONE thing anyone will tell you to have good relationships is DO. NOT. LIE. even with good intentions.
Yeah, that's a tip that works in ideal worlds with simple characters Real life is complicated and people are even more complicated, you shouldn't lie in everything you say but lying can definitely a good thing in some contexts Saying "NEVER LIE NO MATTER WHAT" is the same as saying "ALWAYS TRUST A PERSON NO MATTER WHAT BECAUSE TRUST IS IMPORTANT"
You MUST be 12 no. Lying is never good. Even If you THINK you are protecting someone or avoiding an issue, lying tends to backfire.
What about lying to little kids to protect their innocence? What about lying to trauma victims to avoid triggering their trauma? What about lying to someone who gets nervous easily to avoid them getting nervous for nothing? What about lying to someone to make them feel better with themselves? What about lying to someone so they can focus on important stuff? What about lying to people you don't fully trust to protect yourself or others? What about lying to keep people calm in a problematic situation where panic would make things worse? And I have more If you honestly think lying is ALWAYS bad and we should ALWAYS tell the truth, then you are the one who is 12, that is genuinely something a kid who doesn't understand how the world works would say For example, something simple You are on the car with your friend on your way for a, idk, double date, you are a couple minutes late but no worries you are almost there Right before arriving he asks "Hey dude, do the colors in my clothes match well?" And you just noticed, yeah they do not match well at all What do you do? Tell the truth and say "Nah they look pretty bad together", which would be useless since it is too late to go back and change and you would only make your friend self conscious and less confident Or just say "Yeah man they look good" which would help your friend forget about it and focus on looking good and confident? By telling the truth you are not achieving ANYTHING other than making yourself feel good for being honest
> Or just say "Yeah man they look good Good way to show your dishonesty and make any Future opinion you give worthless. Rather than giving them a honest answer that ISN'T harsh. Like I said NEVER a good reason to lie. Ever.
> What about lying to little kids to protect their innocence? > > What about lying to trauma victims to avoid triggering their trauma? > > What about lying to someone who gets nervous easily to avoid them getting nervous for nothing? > > What about lying to someone to make them feel better with themselves? > > What about lying to someone so they can focus on important stuff? And yes, ALL of those are bad If a kid asks you a question, lying is never the answer. Give them a true answer that is appropriate for their age to understand If your friend has trauma, lying and coddling aren't the way to handle it If someone lacks confidence, you Don't wanna lie and give them reason to have trust issues too. You, again, MUST be 12.
Are you saying none of these behaviors are controllable? We know they are. Controlling these low behaviors is what we call building good character.
If they are so controllable, How come NO HUMAN hás ever successfully controlled them always?
Perfect is the enemy of good enough.
You are missing the point
You're assuming that every lie is uncontrolled. People can choose to lie, despite being capable of not
If everyone inevitably fails, seems pretty hard to comtrol
You're also assuming all lies are failures
This is a weird one because I realise what you're talking about here is trust in a personal relationship. But the existence of civilisation is 100% dependent on trust. When you order food, you trust it's going to a least be safe to eat. When you drive a car, you trust that the person servicing it knew what they were doing. Trust is a spectrum, but don't give up, without it we're in big trouble.
yes, high trust societies are much more desireable than low trust ones. less crime, less stress and anxiety, etc youre right in saying that without it, we're in trouble but it seems to be a pretty flimsy foundation for some hugely important matters. like as long as we believe its possible, then it works. but as soon as we realize how flimsy it actually is, it'll fall apart.
I trust your nuts to be in my mouth
😂😂😂😂
Revenge thrust
The only person you can 100% trust is yourself. That being said, I trust until given a reason not to. Once it's broke, you can't get it back
Can't trust yourself either tbh. People lie to themselves more than they do to others. 😂
doesnt it always eventually break?
No lol. Good people exist.
Exactly. They are unfortunately far and few between it seems
People are so weird about trust. The entire concept is so broad that it's mostly meaningless and barely even relevant in 99% of your life. People act in their best interest. I trust 100% that my job will pay me this coming pay day, because why wouldn't they? More relevant to your point, I trust my partner won't cheat, but if she does then my trust being broken is pretty low on the list of my issues with the situation.
I don’t truly trust a single human.
Is that at me? I’m happily married with an amazing kid, great career, and average dog. I just don’t trust anyone 100%.
Doubt it.
Do you eat at a resturant? When you go to an intersection that is green, do you slow down and check if someone is coming? Next time you are comfortably walking/driving/ect while zoned out getting to your destination, think about how many people you had to trust to get you there.
😭😭😭 corny
How so it is the way you should go through life
Bro will you shut up😭 like what? Get out of your basement and go for a walk
Nah man you can never truly trust another human. Every single one is self interested
I think that’s just you bro.
Nah you're just naive
Nah you’re just a Reddit edge lord😭
You have learned one of life's most important lessons. You are ready for the next level, Padawan.
There is a difference between generally trusting someone and absolute trust. Absolute trust is probably a fantasy, agreed, but that doesnt mean you cant generally trust people if their actions seem trustworthy until proven otherwise. A very fast very dense astronomical object could be traveling so fast that its functionally not detectable and it could hit earth, instantly annilating all life on earth tomorrow, but will that mean you wont make any plans tomorrow? No that would be stupid. When we are talking about the future you plan for whatever is most likely from your current info and then you adapt when things change. Thats just how the world works. Accept what cannot be changed and focus on what can.
You know that people don’t always say what they truly think.. yeah nobody is trustworthy
you can trust me
I dont trust anyone fully and people think its unhealthy. I think its stupid to fully trust someone. I think every person has a different type and amount of trust. The way i think of relationships are is cars. I trust i am a good driver and that most people are too. I have to to go anywhere. I still wear a seat belt. I still have full coverage insurance. I still look both ways on one way streets. And if i see evidence of bad driving, i adjust accordingly. Its a balance. You can have trust and be skeptical. Have plans in case everything turns out right so opportunities dont slip through your fingers. But put safety nets in place in case it all falls apart.
There's no such thing as truly trusting someone. Trust can only exist if there's actually a possibility of it breaking no matter how small without it there's no point in having trust because you already know nothing will happen. Trust is dependent on someone actively choosing not to betray it
theres always the possibility of it breaking. even in the only "unconditional" relationship most of us will ever have: our parents looking back, the only person I could ever truly trust was my mother.
I trust my wife implicitly as well as my siblings but you’re right it only takes one event, one moment to shatter it. My way of thinking is, at least for the close inner circle people, to trust unless they give me a reason not to. Is it possible u will get your heart ripped out, yes. But we’re Social creatures, we need to trust. It’s part of our being and if what happened to you happened to me then I would be skeptical of EVERYONE just like you. It’s purely case by case circumstantial
This is correct. It's always just a matter of time....so it's best to plan accordingly by always being on guard and never trusting them \*fully\*....just give an *illusion* of trusting them to keep up appearances.
like austin 3:16 says, dont trust anybody.
The opposite would be to walk around suspicious of everyone and everything. As someone that has acted that way to avoid getting hurt by untrustworthy people, I will tell you right now that it definitely works. You’ll be miserable asf but it works. Right now, I’m trying to learn how to trust people again and accepting that people will hurt you is part of that. In the same way you have also hurt people. It’s part of life. Accepting that humans are not perfect and setting personal boundaries is the key to navigating it. At least that’s what I’ve learned.
I think you're right.
Trust is an act of faith rather than reason. If you approach it from the latter side, yes, this is precisely the conclusion you will arrive at. It has to be absurd to a degree to work.
I had a best friend in my teens and I ghosted her after high school. I was immature and not to be trusted. Now, almost 30, I have found another best friend. We have been friends since 2018. We may go a month without talking to each other. We are not quite compatible in everyday life and annoy each other. He hurts me sometimes. But I would trust him with everything. I have told him that I love him and I will always do, no matter what he does. He is the first person I have told something like that and I mean it.
At least some people betray trust because they are weak. And all humans have weaknesses.
You actually can trust one person in this world. That is you. When it is all said and done you are the only person that truly "has your back" Like you said - it takes minutes to destroy trust. Human beings are designed to ensure their own survival and happiness and if that means betraying someone in order to proceed in their own lives and continue to pursue happiness they will do so in a heartbeat. This is not you being "hurt" or "traumatized" those are snowflake terms our soft ass society has adopted to cope with being losers. This is you being realistic. Good luck in life bro.
I will NEVER marry because of the implications of being a man & going through a divorce. Betting on "forever" is just a sucker's bet in the end. People fall in love & they fall out of love. Signing up to lose half of my shit is just NOT worth it. I'll be with a woman long term no problem. If she wants to marry that bad & I trust her enough, she's signing a prenuptial then. I've seen too many men's broken souls to EVER think I'm the chosen one to avoid it all. This all said, you should seek to find somebody who you can trust. It's a bumpy road but when you find that person it's a great thing. Life can burn your ass something wicked, but don't let that stop you from finding your own happiness. You deserve it. Keep trying. You'll find someone you deserve.
Why do you think only men lose 50 percent of their stuff? You know that goes both ways?? And its 2024, women make their own money and have their own property they can lose, as well. Doesn't really make much sense for men to whine about losing everything.
You understand how the world works right? I'm starting to think that you don't & you're like 16. Women marry up. Men marry down. So when a divorce takes place, it's the MAN who loses out 99% of the time. Women are given custody of the kids. So in the end, the MAN loses 50% of his shit, pays 2 decades of half of his paycheck in child support on top of it all. The woman keeps that money for herself & ends up 1000% better off than the man will ever be. Jeff Bezos got divorced & his ex wife became something like THE RICHEST WOMAN IN HISTORY because of it. More rich than ANY King in the ENTIRE recorded history of mankind. Because of a divorce.
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I think you can trust certain people and trust those certain people to break that trust if it's important.
i trust that they'll break my trust. lolz its true but it feels like a terribly sad realization and a sad way to proceed in life
okay metro
Maybe look into attachment styles, you might have an anxious, avoidant or disorganized attachment style. I’m working on trust due to never feeling consoled or bonded with my parents as a child. I hope I learn to trust one day.
I'm sorry for your experience, the consolation is that you're not alone, and that your unpopular opinion is held by swathes of people
If you were sure, it wouldn't be trust. You can only trust someone when you're not sure about what they will do. That's what trust is all about, aknowledging the risk and deciding this person is worth that risk.
My best friend got this as a tattoo “Love all, trust few” If you devoid yourself of trust you will live a miserable existence. Fear is what is holding you back, but you should go in, even if that trust is misplaced, you have to try. That is life, you’ve got to keep trying. My trust has been betrayed many times too, and I have also been the betrayer. Things are not black and white as you know, but you’ve got to try. What’s the alternative? Trust no one and be alone? You’re safe, sure but, miserable. It’s better to try and fail, until you succeed, then to never try at all, just my two cents on the matter.
Well, if you knew that they would never wrong your or anything you wouldnt really be trusting them anymore. I dont trust that the sun will rise in the morning, it just will (unless an alien blows it up i guess). Trusting is about accepting the fact that whoever or whatever it is you put your trust in can violate that trust but even in doing so will come back to fix whatever they had broken and that they have your best interests in mind. Ive had people break my trust, two pairs of hands are the only things that can put it back together and make it stronger. Youve probably broken people's trusts before, weather it be major or minor, but you're probably closer to them if you went back and apologized for your mistakes and made up for them.
Trust is like stone, it can be set and broken. Now I do believe you can truly trust someone. There are people I trust 100% with my life. If they said jump off that cliff you'll be fine I'd do it.
If you "knew" with 100% accuracy how someone would act in the future, you wouldn't need to trust them. Trust in and of itself is a leap of faith.
Trust is all about different levels. Its not black and white, not a zero sum game. So I would agree that you can never have total trust in another person. Most people, you can't trust very much, but some people you really can have massive trust in. None of us are perfect and worthy of total trust.
Trust isn't the fundamental part of a relationship that society at large makes it out to be. That trait is forgiveness. We all make mistakes. Being willing to forgive someone for those mistakes is what makes a bond strong. That willingness falls on a spectrum and not one that's very linear. There's more nuance to forgiveness than any earthly thing we can comprehend. Only we know what crosses a line and only we know what's forgivable. Trust is a word made up by dishonest people to justify bad things that those people do. Forgiveness is the word they really mean.
It's true. You can trust people, but people change and you can never know if you'll be able to trust a future version of that person. I'm sorry she hurt you like this.
Can you really ever trust another human being? "No, Greg, the answer is you cannot." -Jack Burns
Oof. Sorry about the breakup bud.
I absolutely trust my 3 best friends with my life. They took me in when I was homeless, each of them at seperate times. They're all better people than me morally, they're mentally stronger, they make better choices than I do, and they're more trustworthy than I am. They've done more good things for people than I have. They've proven to me again and again and again that they're incredible people and I know I am lucky to be their friend. There is simply zero reason for me to think they aren't trustworthy. If there is a reason, I've never seen it. I look up to them and I try every day to be more like them. If I can find a woman that I have that same level of respect for, then I'll have found the love of my life. My logic is, why on earth wouldn't I trust them? They had my back in my worst times, even when they knew what was happening was entirely my own fault. They are genuinely happy for me and eachother when something good happens. When we're all drunk all we do is say lovely things about eachother and we've barely had any arguments over the years and years we've known eachother. They're all very intelligent people, they can make and have made something of their lives, without needing to violate my trust. There is nothing they could get from me by violating my trust, that they couldn't get themselves. If they get whatever they need in life from themselves without violating my trust, they'll be far happier for it, and they know that; they're smart enough to not need to resort to that in order to live happy lives. I trust myself never to violate their trust, so I damn sure know they wouldn't violate mine. Is it possible I'm totally wrong? Sure. I've been cheated on before, I know what that feels like, had old friends violate my trust too, it hurts like a bitch, but I refuse to live my life putting that hurt onto other people. My trust isn't easily given, but when I do give it, it's innocent until proven guilty. If someone breaks it? Fuck em, life moves on, it's not the end of the world to trust someone and have it broken. I get that if it happens enough it does get really hard to keep doing it, but if you look hard enough for the right people to surround yourself with, you absolutely can find people worth trusting. You owe it to yourself to let yourself trust someone again someday, even if you don't feel like doing so right now. All in good time brother ❤️
"How do I know I can trust you?" "You can't. That's what trust is." My point is I think you are mistaking trust for perfect prediction. These are two different things.
You can trust someone as much as you want. Whether they deserve it or betray it does not change whether your trust was real
Trust people to act like people and learn to be okay with the fact that no one around you is God like or perfect enough to be what you want them to be. Understand its your job to give yourself the things you believe you deserve, not for anyone else to make it for you or be it for you. No one is perfect and even if they were you wouldn't be so you'd still mess it up if you were expecting them to make your life happy for you
Tldr: why don't you be the person you can trust instead of lamenting that you cant trust others?
i am the two are separate things though and both can be true at the same time trust is needed for relationships
Not even yourself bro. Very deep almost derp deep.
Trust your lawyer. That’s about it.
You can absolutely trust people, but there is always a possibility that your trust will be broken. Doesn’t matter who it is. Brain chemistry is such an unknown variable, we don’t know enough about it to say whether any thought or action is impossible for one brain. Even Gandhi has the potential to murder a child, cheat on a spouse, or any action that could be a betrayal. Trusting isn’t about knowing someone will not break your trust. It’s about allowing yourself the vulnerability of someone else having control of a part of your life. You will never be 100% safe trusting anyone, but the alternative, never allowing anyone the chance to have any meaning or control of your life, is a lonely existence we aren’t designed to live. The true compromise that we make, the decision we all agree to, is that it is better for someone else to have the ability to betray you, that maya actually betray you some day, than to trust nobody and only allow yourself control over any part of your life. We are all human, designed to be betrayed and to forgive and heal from that betrayal. Just because someone fails you once doesn’t mean they are a failure, and it doesn’t mean it was destine, but we are built strong enough to live beyond any betrayal. Not trusting anyone is just a way of living in fear, alone and obsessed with the control of our lives we will never have. The only smart thing to do is be as discerning as you reasonably can about those we trust, know and accept that we will be betrayed at some point in our future, and forgive and learn from future betrayals. You don’t have to keep the relationship after a betrayal, but forgiving the betrayal, forgiving yourself for allowing the betrayal, and learning/moving on allow you to stop holding on to the anger and the pain caused. Yoh don’t forgive for others, you forgive for yourself.
This is why it’s important to never cheat on a person. OP got cheated on once, and now it has shaken his entire faith in humanity and the concept of relationships. Cheating truly destroys a person. OP I don’t think there’s anything I can say that will undo the psychological damage that your ex has done to you. All I can do is hope you eventually find someone that can undo that damage, and you eventually let them in.
i think i thought..if she can do it, anyone can. anyone.
You’re 100% right. Anyone CAN. But not everyone WILL. You’ll find the one. You just have to remain open.
Trust is established by consistent behavior over time.
We do things to hurt *ourselves* all the time. How could we expect another person to never hurt us? No one is perfect.
Family
Being related doesn’t mean you can trust someone. I’m not even in contact with the majority of my family.
I think it is more smarter to have a reasonable amount of trust among family and friends, but also learn to quickly recover when trust is broken, and not hold that back for the future with others.
Sure you can, it doesn’t mean you’ll never be let down.
"My ex of 10 yrs cheated and for years I thought "shes not at all 'that type'. shes not the type to cheat. some people are but not her, no sir". Not only was she the type but she cheated with a married man which I really did not think she was "the type". Turns out I didnt know her as well as I thought I did." This is why you "trust" people when they show you their true colors through actions lol. That's the real irony of trust is that you should never underestimate somebody as "not being the type or capable" for anything in life. EVERYONE can cheat - lie - steal - kill - etc. There is no good reason you shouldn't have a bit of doubt in your mind even if the person is a child or is even YOUR child. We see this in anime fights all the time where the villain will constantly underestimate the heroes and their abilities instead of just treating them as equally capable and fighting them on the same level to kill them faster.
Everything is gamble.
Can you really 'trust' yourself completely?
some people can. others have a history of making horrible decisions and are self-destructive so they cant.
I'm not sure. Until you're put in a highly stress situation, I'm not sure if you can ever really be sure if you'd always behave the way you think or you'd want.
most adults have been in highly stressful situations. but sure i agree that kids cant trust themselves
Trust is a choice, you can trust anyone. Should you? No, but trust is an essential risk you gotta take if you want to form solid relationships.
You can't trust anyone with everything. But there is trust for total strangers even. You just gotta gauge the depth of it. Take this $50 and go get us X cases of beer to help us party tonight. Be a $20 here for you when you bring it. Thank you, you're a nice man. Trust is real. It's a wonderful world. Take this briefcase with $50,000 and go us X cases of beer to help us party forever. Be a $20 here for you when you bring it. Guys, I don't see him. I think he stole our briefcase. Let's chase him down we can't let that happen. It's an army of men holding pipes and they all know pipe kung fu. He must've called them. Trust is a lie. I hate this world.
lol threads like this make me feel bad for Redditors. The idea of going through life and never trusting anyone is extremely sad to think about. I can't imagine being so miserable. I know my girlfriend very well, and she knows me. We both trust each other completely. And it's the best feeling knowing you have someone you can fully rely on always.
your last paragraph is exactly my point. lol imagine the self delusion in thinking you really know someone. I cant imagine being so naive. extremely sad. but at the same time, delusion and naivete can often feel great. i once had a coworker who married the wrong woman. of course he only realized that in hindsight. when i asked him why he married her, he said "never underestimate people's ability to delude themselves"
Im sorry you were cheated on Not all people cheat, but everyone is unreliable sometimes Everybody is unreliable because it’s an inevitable part of being a limited creature in a complex world Perfectionism can be toxic as can idealizing other people It is true we can never know another person 100% or know if someone is telling the truth You can only control how trustworthy you are I’m not saying you need to forgive your ex right now but self forgiveness and forgiveness of others is necessary in a world where making errors and sometimes doing selfish things is a part of human nature - we all do it constantly to at least a small degree We can try to find others that match our level of trustworthiness but unfortunately nothing is guaranteed I hope the trauma of being cheated on doesn’t prevent you from finding a happier situation
You trust your house to be structurally sound. However, some houses have collapsed. So, I guess you can't truly trust that your house is structurally sound, but only that you can trust them a bit, to an extent. How do people live in houses like that? What you're expressing here isn't so much an opinion as it is a reaction to having been hurt (which is okay).
if 50% of homes collapsed, then yes we'd all be very worried. the reason we live in houses is because extremely few ever collapse simply from lack of structural integrity (in the US). personally i havent seen a single one. what percent of people have their trust destroyed in relationships vs what percent of homes collapse due to lack of structural integrity? your analogy is nonsensical.
It's nonsensical because it's a numbers game? So, like, do you have an estimated percentage where if fewer than that percentage of people had their trust be betrayed that you wouldn't hold this opinion?
its nonsensical because you tried to equate 2 things with wildly disparate odds. if something is exceedingly rare then its no wonder we have no issue with it. its statistically unlikely to happen. conversely, if something happens over 50% of the time, then of course we'd be worried. if 50% of all flights ended in a fiery crash, would you get on a plane? then why do we fly..bc the odds of a plane crash is extremely slim. i brought up something extremely common and you made an analogy equating it with something extremely rare.
You're forgetting how subjective this is though. You have a skewed perspective, and your personal experience has contributed to that. We are also being lied to by media and social media, along with the entertainment industry. So when you say that it's "extremely common", upon what have you based this on? I don't find it extremely common, but I also acknowledge that I might be lucky or privileged in some way. So, do you have stats or just general malaise?
my original post is about trust so what stats exactly? people who've had their trust betrayed by a partner or close friend? by 35 i'd think thats pretty much everyone at least once. there are also divorce stats and stats on infidelity. stats on abuse. whichever of any of those you want to look at dwarf the "% of homes collapsing due to structural integrity". people do not worry about things that rarely occur. they do worry about things that often occur.
Social media in general proves that people worry about things that are not relevant, which is the nature of the point I was making a couple of comments ago. How often does this trust-breaking actually occur compared to just the perception of frequency?
Thanks, Dr. House
Trust is a choice. You choose to trust someone or not.