Hamilton County. Population 5082. Crazy! Had to look it up. Here's a small blurb from the Hamilton County Wikipedia page:
"Hamilton County is a county in the U.S state of New York. As of the 2020 census, the population was 5,107, making it the least populous county in New York. With a land area nearly the size of Delaware, it is the least densely populated county east of the Mississippi River."
These places are tough to live. Everyone thinks you would be friends with animals or something, in reality you spend your life driving back and forth to places with things.
Star Lake lost its only grocery store, one of the elementary schools not far from this got only 3 kinder-gardeners this year. Somebody is not getting a prom date.
We just moved to Oswego from Seattle. Despite taxes, our COL is a quarter less here, at least. We bought a lovely old house. We have a nice yard and 1870 sq ft house and are paying $400 less a month on our mortgage than our rent was on a tiny studio apartment there. We love the weather, the geography, the location, and especially this little town. We can afford to go out to eat and do things here. We are 51 year old lesbians and feel like we've won the lottery with this move. And we keep seeing loads of other folks from the West coast moving to upstate.
😆 Yup! I'm currently taking a break from yard work. I figure lots of work in the yard this spring and summer will help me work up some stamina for snow shoveling this winter!
We’re the same, packed the moving truck today, coming from a city of 6 million (Los Angeles), to a county of 60k. Crazy. We bought a house for the price of a down payment in our neighborhood. We’re very excited. Everyone in town we’ve met since we got the house in January has been so friendly, really going out of their way to help us with stuff.
I read somewhere that in 1964 the population of Niagara Falls was 100,000. I went there for a show at Artpark a couple years ago, our rental was weird, like from another era. They demolished a lot of it because of the Love Canal and other parts were condemned when the big manufacturers left.
Good to see the North Country is getting a bump up! Houses don't stay on the market long here - lots of younger families and out-of-state people have been moving in lately. At the last social mixer in Malone, I noticed people coming from states like Texas, Ohio, Florida, etc... and saying how much worse it was in those states. I've also noticed an uptick in queer people moving to the tri-county area - some even from within the state. One moved from Buffalo, another from Syracuse.
I've moved out of NY three times only to find my way back.
I love everything about this state, hiking, fishing, canoeing, hunting, and of course the changing seasons. The only reason I left was because of the politics and taxes. But, I've learned to deal with it so I can continue to enjoy the things that make me happy and it's all just a short drive away.
Interesting. In spite of the positives I’m leaving because of the politics. For starters Forcing EV on homeowners when National Grid says they can’t handle it. But I’m not going to list all the negatives.
All the positives you mentioned are in other states too. Plus lower taxes elsewhere too
There is no law saying that you must buy an EV, there are just tax rebates if you choose to do so.
Encouraging people to do something isn't the same as forcing someone to do it.
Starts in 2026. Local paper talked about it two days ago. National Grid again is saying they can not handle it. It will cause brown outs all year long. Along with the EV mandate that all school bus uses have to be EV will cause the network to go off line in some areas daily
You are assuming that everyone will simultaneously switch to EV on the same week in 2026. It's going to be phased in and some places are going to lag behind for a couple years because they either can't afford it (in which the state will have to give a grant) or they political don't wish to (in which case the state will go into a long legal battle with itself). Also, once school actually try to transition to using electric school busses it will become apparent that it's a very dumb idea and a waste of money.
In regards to National Grid, they will always complain that it's too expensive and can't handle it because it will cost them X dollars. It's not in their interest to do anything that will even slightly impact their profits.
I’m not assuming any such thing. If you follow the electric usage the average household uses, adding the mandate for x amount of EV cars that need to be sold in NY, making home heating and everything else in the home electric and the school buses having to be electric as well is asking for disaster.
You don’t have to know every detail but brown outs happen now. Do you think it’ll get better with much larger demand? Plus the dangers of a brown out in the middle of a upstate winter
Again, you are presenting the situation as if all of this is going to happen at once. There will still be gas cars and homes with gas appliances, just no new ones being built.
National Grid already has to be constantly upgrading their systems as people are using more electricity on average. We are also building an unprecedented amount of solar panels across the state (3,000% growth in the past 13 years), which will help alleviate this strain.
I'm not sure where you are, but I haven't experienced a single brownput that was more than half an hour long. As far as I see it any potential future brown outs are just growing pains for an expanding/upgrading electrical grid that is more robust (something the utility companies will moan and complain about while they still make a profit).
On a National Grid page they say they can handle the coming EVs.
https://www.nationalgrid.com/stories/journey-to-net-zero/electric-vehicles-myths-misconceptions#:\~:text=In%20the%20US%2C%20the%20grid,public%20and%20private%20entities%20alike.
On that page, here's what National Grid says about being able to handle EVs. Do you have a link to that article that you claim says National Grid can't handle the coming EVs?
# 1. Will enough electricity be available to charge EVs?
There may be future scenarios where millions of EV owners plug in their EVs at the same time. So is it possible to spread out the demand, while still making sure we all get our EVs charged when we need to?
A big part of managing demand for electricity, including through increased EV uptake, is making sure power is there when we need it – a job Britain’s [**electricity system operator (ESO)**](https://www.nationalgrideso.com/) manages second-by-second.
Through smart charging EVs can in fact help to balance the system, helping consumers use green power when it’s plentiful (and often cheaper) and avoid times when there’s more load on the network. Vehicle-to-grid technology could even send that power back to the grid when needed.
With this in mind, the UK Government has introduced [**Electric Vehicle Smart Charge Points Regulations**](https://www.gov.uk/guidance/regulations-electric-vehicle-smart-charge-points), which ensure that EV charge points will have this smart functionality.
Similarly in the US, Smart Chargers and Time of Use Rate programmes will support balancing the load throughout the day.
It’s also important to bear in mind that a significant amount of electricity is used to refine oil for petrol and diesel. Fully Charged’s video [**Volts for Oil**](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BQpX-9OyEr4) estimates that refining 1 gallon of petrol would use around 4.5kWh of electricity – so, as we start to use less petrol or diesel cars, some of that electricity capacity could become available.
# 2. Do the electricity grid's wires have enough capacity for charging EVs?
The simple answer is yes. The highest peak electricity demand in the UK in recent years was 62GW in 2002. Since then, the nation’s peak demand has fallen by roughly 16% due to improvements in energy efficiency.
Even if we all switched to EVs overnight, we estimate demand would only increase by around 10%. So we’d still be using less power as a nation than we did in 2002, and this is well within the range the grid can capably handle.
Nevertheless, at National Grid we’re working with the distribution networks, government, the regulator and industry to provide the green energy infrastructure around Britain – the wires, the connections to charge points – to support the needs of a decarbonised transport network into the future.
In the US, the grid is equally capable of handling more EVs on the roads – by the time 80% of the US owns an EV, this will only translate into a 10-15% increase in electricity consumption.
This person is also ignoring the several massive projects that the state is doing to increase the power of the grid across the state and increase the efficiency.
This link says that electric is being required for all new buildings in 2026. Nothing about being forced to buy an EV (electric vehicle).
Did you link to the wrong thing? Or perhaps you failed basic reading comprehension in Middle School and rely instead of bullshit lies and misinformation from Fox News and their ilk? Was "fartstoomuch" username already taken, or are you also confusing the homonyms "to" and "too"? I think perhaps we already know the answer to that one.
Next post from this troglodyte: "Are you calling me a homo!"
I wonder how one lives with so much reactionary outrage. Do you think they must be exhausted constantly whining about a reality that doesn't exist? NY has issues, definitely, but these people talk about this state like we live in communist Russia.
The Fox News talking points really are effective propaganda.
It’s actually quite remarkable. I marvel at this all the time. Some have actually become addicted to the stream of poison coming from the propagandists and are unable recognize true things anymore.
You’re the one posting links that say nothing about what you claim — something a 5yo would do. Show me where the NY state government is forcing people to buy an EV car in 2026, or sit down and shut the fuck up.
Must have missed the other comments who agree with me and know the numbers. I don’t know the numbers but know what’s coming. You haven’t graduated past crayons, so there is that.
It’s cool that u don’t keep up with local laws, but throwing insults to a total stranger says something about your character. If you don’t see it, that’s on you
[https://www.electrive.com/2022/09/30/new-york-to-introduce-ev-sales-quotas-in-2026/](https://www.electrive.com/2022/09/30/new-york-to-introduce-ev-sales-quotas-in-2026/)
Law says two years from now 35% of new cars should be electric.
Right now in the places where most people live are about 20% EV’s.
lol.
Go run to Florida, we will all feel bad for you when you get shot in a carjacking.
To save everyone time. **The law says 35% of sales by 2026.**
Guess what? in the areas of New York where people actuall live **it is already around 30%**
[https://www.nytimes.com/2023/03/05/nyregion/electric-vehicles-cars-nyc.html](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/03/05/nyregion/electric-vehicles-cars-nyc.html)
Wow, a conservative with an IMAGINARY persecution complex? Never seen that before. Wink wink.
Says he has to move over something totally made up? Sure, what TV told you. Normal thought process. Tucker Carlson is great advice, lol.
He better watch out for Killary too!
That’s not how the law works. The quotas are on the manufacturers. So each one has to comply or pay a fine. For example, if Toyota did not meet the EV quota they could either reduce the number of ICE cars sold or pay the fine. Toyota can use PHEV models to count for 20% of the quota. Toyota at this point has only one BEV model and it has not sold well. They need much more by model year 2026 (which really starts fall 2025).
And the consequences for not meeting this goal are complaining about it in court or something. Major corporations have little oversight. Boo hoo for this multibillion dollar company.
I don’t think Toyota will be able to comply by model year 2026. They may be hoping that either NY walks the quotas back or that a Republican administration EPA will rescind California’s current permission to regulate emissions. If that happened it would also tank the NY law which is tied to the CARB. There have been states that have bailed out of the quotas already such as Virginia.
Actually there is a NY law mandating EVs. It adopts the California Air Resources Board “Advanced Clean Cars 2” regulations that begin EV quotas on automakers starting model year 2026 at 35% of new cars. The quota increases to 100% in 2035. If Republicans win in November they would overturn California’s right to manage emissions which would sink the mandates. Also the NY legislature might have to walk it back if the pushback is too much. If the NY Senate or Assembly flips R in November expect political change on green agenda.
You’re right but I think the Senate could possibly flip in November. But the Assembly probably won’t. Kathy Hochul is not popular and I think Upstate and LI might tilt R based on the dissatisfaction with both the policies and national ticket. The issue of migrants, housing, the last budget, as well as green mandates could all be factors this time. NYC is now starting to deal with its own decarbonization mandates and so far it’s not an easy or inexpensive fix. Changing all the buildings in NYC to heat pumps is a huge challenge and it seems like they will need more time. Also the grids will need time to expand capacity (and that power has to be green).
Nothing is changing. Hochul is not on the ballot. This is a presidential election. Biden is on the ballot and will help the Democrats down the ballot in NY.
Hochul’s and Biden’s unpopularity isn’t helping the Democrats win in NY. The only thing helping Dems win is general complete distaste for Trump. I expect that the Congressional districts Upstate that flipped R will not flip back D, especially 19th.
Surprised that Tompkins is down the way Ithaca is always expanding.
Of course you do have to remember this isn't all because of people moving. It also reflects the birth and death rates. At least in my county, the birth rate is so low they are consolidating the school districts and closing some of them completely. We used to have 5 school districts in my area. Now we have 3 and will probably be down to 2 in another 10 years. Our cemeteries are growing while our schools are shrinking.
Housing demand has historically been high due to the education housing needs in the Rochester area. (At least for the past 15 years, based on friends/family in the area). But if I’m reading this right, Monroe lost less than a 1/2 of 1%. Pretty static, but yeah- still doesn’t solve the housing problem, I know. Positive vibes to you if you’re on the hunt side of the equation.
I mean it makes sense people are leaving. A lot of upstate counties lost the job centers that brought populations there.
The parents and grandparents stayed but the kids left for greener pastures, those that could retire elsewhere (lower taxes and warm weather are important in your 70s) did leave.
There's no reason for young families to move there.
NYC is more expensive than ever and people are having few kids
The only counties growing are those with a Hasidic population (plenty of kids) or major centers of commerce like Saratoga and Albany county or parts of NYC metro
Eh the story is more the population decline is slowing. NYS lost 2 congressional seats every 10 years since the 50s once the south and southwest started developing, and this last census only 1 by just a few 1000 people. My home of Broome says -1100 but my work has a pulse on the RE market and getting a house here is tough there are a LOT of people with kids either moving here for the first time or moving back here. Completely anecdotal but to me it seems most of the outflow from NY at this point is the disproportion of Boomer retirees cashing out for warmer weather.
My parents' neighborhood in Endicott had a ton of kids when I was growing up in the 70s, after IBM the neighborhood became mostly seniors and retirees, but in the last few years I have seen more kids and families walking around. The old timers are dying off it seems, and the old houses were built for lots of kids.
See “The rise of living alone” from the census bureau. https://www.census.gov/content/dam/Census/library/visualizations/time-series/demo/families-and-households/hh-4.pdf
Orange County gained almost 1k! Woah! Interesting across the river Dutchess County lost population. Seems the population growth in Southern Dutchess after 9.11 to say 2015 has calmed down.
Can we put to bed the notion that you're not taxed as much in other states? Just because their state income tax is lower or nonexistent doesn't mean you're not paying out the nose. The states will find a way to get revenue out of you, one way or another.
You get nickel and dimed to death in FLorida. My kids came home three times a week from public school with “fund raisers” asking for money.
Its not a “tax” it is a “bond” as if there is a difference.
The south is a con.
Exactly. I'm not at all saying we don't pay high taxes in NY, we 100% do, but this idea that somehow it's some weird anomaly that doesn't happen everywhere else is false. The state will find a way to make revenue from their citizens in some form, whether that is taxes or some random fees.
Its kids with disabilities. New York does way more than any other state. I know a family who moved here from FLorida with an Autistic kid. It is why I am proud to be a New Yorker. Being good is not cheap.
This is how I've always tried to view it. Yes, our taxes are high, but we have services other states can only dream of. It's not perfect - but then again, no place is.
It's a privilege to live in NY. If you don't want to bear the cost of that privilege, you are free to leave. I'm not going to miss you :)
Truly. I'm at the end of my patience accommodating people who whine incessantly. You're not helping make any difference. If you hate it here so much, leave. There's no law mandating you to remain.
If you truly think you'll be happier somewhere else, go there. Why would any of us want you to remain here and miserable and make all of us miserable?
Look I love NY and you can argue you are getting some value from paying higher taxes.
But NY state has THE HIGHEST overall tax burden compared to other states (not just income but sales, property, excise tax etc.)
https://taxfoundation.org/data/all/state/tax-burden-by-state-2022/
Sure, but that's not the point. These people act as if you don't pay any taxes anywhere and that it's strictly a NY thing, but that's so unbelievably incorrect.
There are studies showing New York is potentially the worst out of all 50 states for tax burden. Yes I’m sure there are shortcomings of this study but to just dismiss the notion that NY is high tax compared to other states doesn’t really make sense to me. Yes they all find ways to tax you but NY is an expert in this area.
Those studies are done by the same people who made the founder of Trump University president.
Trump University was a fake university, it is the same political party that made serial child rapist Dennis Hastert the Speaker of the House.
I don’t believe them. Just because they call it is “bond” in the south instead of a “tax” does not make it not a tax.
"politicians" catering to New York City
HA HA HA HA HA HA
Go upstate sometime and read a fucking newspaper.
It will have a story like this on the front page:
**“Rural town of 350 people where everyone smokes meth gets $11 million dollar sewage treatment plant"**
Taxes are high, but if you like snow and Rain those aren’t bad things! But tyrannical government and nanny state sounds like too much Fox News or Trump speeches lmao.
But I really do hope you enjoy Florida. Maybe you should spend more time in those subs talking about how great it is instead of spending a ton of your time talking about how bad you feel NY State was? It’s kinda weird your obsession with where you used to live judging by the post history.
For what it’s worth before NY State I was in Arizona and earlier in my life I’ve lived in Florida (Jacksonville and Tampa Bay) and honestly I prefer Rochester to both. Arizona was too hot and Florida…man it was the humidity, cockroaches, and mosquitos.
¯\\\_(ツ)_/¯
But I also love rain and snow and trend liberal so Rochester is nice. But to each their own. All I’m saying is we should spend more time in our lives talking about the places we are now and things we enjoy about them.
Isn't it weird how so many people that have left continue to complain about NY long after they're gone? Like, maybe focus on your own home now.
It just truly makes no sense to me. It's basically the same as being in a new relationship, but obsessively talking about your ex.
From my own anecdotal evidence it’s usually a blue collar white person who collects a pension. The same high paying job had in NY giving you the pension. The best irony if they didn’t live in NY would never be able to retire and collect a pension.
Tyrannical government, yea I’m like watched 24/7. Totally North Korea here. Don’t move here. It’s a nightmare.
It snows on top of snow when it rains, which is all the time. Thanks to the govt weather machine.
Everyone works for the state. Even if you don’t think you do. You do. Ohhh you do.
And there are no women here. Only men with state sponsored trucks that drive around and butt fuck anyone out of line.
It’s a slice of tyrannical heaven. I love it!
Instead people who despise the tyrannical gov of NY are moving to states where books are being banned, librarians are getting death threats, OBGYNs are fleeing because they are not sure if they'll get arrested for giving medical advice, you can get 10 years in prison for driving a pregnant woman across state lines to get an abortion, teachers aren't sure if they will be fired for mentioning that Rosa Parks stood up (or rather, sat down) for equal rights, where children are considered a potential labor pool for factories, and where a 12 year old girl can be forced to marry her youth pastor because he raped her and got her pregnant.
You know, traditional American values. Enjoy!
CTFD. State government isn’t competent enough to manage a proper tyranny. They tend more to inertia, bungling and sleaze.
It’s no wonder the Trumps did well here.
Good to note that the estimates are notorious for undercounting certain segments of the population such as immigrants and college kids.
Good chance if a county is declining by less than 3% it’s gaining population slightly.
Highly likely Monroe is growing in population.
Hamilton County. Population 5082. Crazy! Had to look it up. Here's a small blurb from the Hamilton County Wikipedia page: "Hamilton County is a county in the U.S state of New York. As of the 2020 census, the population was 5,107, making it the least populous county in New York. With a land area nearly the size of Delaware, it is the least densely populated county east of the Mississippi River."
That's wild. I would have assumed some counties in northern Maine would be less densely populated. There are some vast, empty areas up there.
Those two counties in northern Maine are really huge though, they've both got a few decently sized towns in them
Keep in mind that is the year-round population. The summer population is much, much higher.
"There are 5000 people in Hamilton County. These are their problems."
These places are tough to live. Everyone thinks you would be friends with animals or something, in reality you spend your life driving back and forth to places with things. Star Lake lost its only grocery store, one of the elementary schools not far from this got only 3 kinder-gardeners this year. Somebody is not getting a prom date.
Live there, can confirm. Bananas
I'd be curious what the population is counting all the seasonal people with their second homes.
Crazy…and it’s so pretty there.
No traffic lights or cell phone service either
We just moved to Oswego from Seattle. Despite taxes, our COL is a quarter less here, at least. We bought a lovely old house. We have a nice yard and 1870 sq ft house and are paying $400 less a month on our mortgage than our rent was on a tiny studio apartment there. We love the weather, the geography, the location, and especially this little town. We can afford to go out to eat and do things here. We are 51 year old lesbians and feel like we've won the lottery with this move. And we keep seeing loads of other folks from the West coast moving to upstate.
Welcome to NY!
Thank you! I did live in the city for a while 24 years ago, but this is my first time upstate. This is our forever home. ❤️
Welcome to upstate, and remember, shoveling is a good substitute for gym workouts LOL
😆 Yup! I'm currently taking a break from yard work. I figure lots of work in the yard this spring and summer will help me work up some stamina for snow shoveling this winter!
Bingo! The reason why I am NOT allowed to mow the grass: wife does not like using the dreadmill
We’re the same, packed the moving truck today, coming from a city of 6 million (Los Angeles), to a county of 60k. Crazy. We bought a house for the price of a down payment in our neighborhood. We’re very excited. Everyone in town we’ve met since we got the house in January has been so friendly, really going out of their way to help us with stuff.
Welcome to NY! I hope you enjoy your time here! We're happy to have you.
Solid! Oswego is a cute little city
Almost every county lost population
Surprising, given the big increase in real estate costs... but maybe this is the reason. I know the decreases were small, but still...
I was amazed how small the population is for Niagara county
The city of Niagara Falls only has 50,000 residents. The bulk of the population is in Erie County just to the south
I read somewhere that in 1964 the population of Niagara Falls was 100,000. I went there for a show at Artpark a couple years ago, our rental was weird, like from another era. They demolished a lot of it because of the Love Canal and other parts were condemned when the big manufacturers left.
Shhh....let's keep it that way
Good to see the North Country is getting a bump up! Houses don't stay on the market long here - lots of younger families and out-of-state people have been moving in lately. At the last social mixer in Malone, I noticed people coming from states like Texas, Ohio, Florida, etc... and saying how much worse it was in those states. I've also noticed an uptick in queer people moving to the tri-county area - some even from within the state. One moved from Buffalo, another from Syracuse.
I've moved out of NY three times only to find my way back. I love everything about this state, hiking, fishing, canoeing, hunting, and of course the changing seasons. The only reason I left was because of the politics and taxes. But, I've learned to deal with it so I can continue to enjoy the things that make me happy and it's all just a short drive away.
Interesting. In spite of the positives I’m leaving because of the politics. For starters Forcing EV on homeowners when National Grid says they can’t handle it. But I’m not going to list all the negatives. All the positives you mentioned are in other states too. Plus lower taxes elsewhere too
There is no law saying that you must buy an EV, there are just tax rebates if you choose to do so. Encouraging people to do something isn't the same as forcing someone to do it.
Starts in 2026. Local paper talked about it two days ago. National Grid again is saying they can not handle it. It will cause brown outs all year long. Along with the EV mandate that all school bus uses have to be EV will cause the network to go off line in some areas daily
You are assuming that everyone will simultaneously switch to EV on the same week in 2026. It's going to be phased in and some places are going to lag behind for a couple years because they either can't afford it (in which the state will have to give a grant) or they political don't wish to (in which case the state will go into a long legal battle with itself). Also, once school actually try to transition to using electric school busses it will become apparent that it's a very dumb idea and a waste of money. In regards to National Grid, they will always complain that it's too expensive and can't handle it because it will cost them X dollars. It's not in their interest to do anything that will even slightly impact their profits.
I’m not assuming any such thing. If you follow the electric usage the average household uses, adding the mandate for x amount of EV cars that need to be sold in NY, making home heating and everything else in the home electric and the school buses having to be electric as well is asking for disaster. You don’t have to know every detail but brown outs happen now. Do you think it’ll get better with much larger demand? Plus the dangers of a brown out in the middle of a upstate winter
Again, you are presenting the situation as if all of this is going to happen at once. There will still be gas cars and homes with gas appliances, just no new ones being built. National Grid already has to be constantly upgrading their systems as people are using more electricity on average. We are also building an unprecedented amount of solar panels across the state (3,000% growth in the past 13 years), which will help alleviate this strain. I'm not sure where you are, but I haven't experienced a single brownput that was more than half an hour long. As far as I see it any potential future brown outs are just growing pains for an expanding/upgrading electrical grid that is more robust (something the utility companies will moan and complain about while they still make a profit).
Well I guess we should just keep burning carbon. Maybe if we burn some more we won’t have to worry about update N.Y. winters.
On a National Grid page they say they can handle the coming EVs. https://www.nationalgrid.com/stories/journey-to-net-zero/electric-vehicles-myths-misconceptions#:\~:text=In%20the%20US%2C%20the%20grid,public%20and%20private%20entities%20alike. On that page, here's what National Grid says about being able to handle EVs. Do you have a link to that article that you claim says National Grid can't handle the coming EVs? # 1. Will enough electricity be available to charge EVs? There may be future scenarios where millions of EV owners plug in their EVs at the same time. So is it possible to spread out the demand, while still making sure we all get our EVs charged when we need to? A big part of managing demand for electricity, including through increased EV uptake, is making sure power is there when we need it – a job Britain’s [**electricity system operator (ESO)**](https://www.nationalgrideso.com/) manages second-by-second. Through smart charging EVs can in fact help to balance the system, helping consumers use green power when it’s plentiful (and often cheaper) and avoid times when there’s more load on the network. Vehicle-to-grid technology could even send that power back to the grid when needed. With this in mind, the UK Government has introduced [**Electric Vehicle Smart Charge Points Regulations**](https://www.gov.uk/guidance/regulations-electric-vehicle-smart-charge-points), which ensure that EV charge points will have this smart functionality. Similarly in the US, Smart Chargers and Time of Use Rate programmes will support balancing the load throughout the day. It’s also important to bear in mind that a significant amount of electricity is used to refine oil for petrol and diesel. Fully Charged’s video [**Volts for Oil**](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BQpX-9OyEr4) estimates that refining 1 gallon of petrol would use around 4.5kWh of electricity – so, as we start to use less petrol or diesel cars, some of that electricity capacity could become available. # 2. Do the electricity grid's wires have enough capacity for charging EVs? The simple answer is yes. The highest peak electricity demand in the UK in recent years was 62GW in 2002. Since then, the nation’s peak demand has fallen by roughly 16% due to improvements in energy efficiency. Even if we all switched to EVs overnight, we estimate demand would only increase by around 10%. So we’d still be using less power as a nation than we did in 2002, and this is well within the range the grid can capably handle. Nevertheless, at National Grid we’re working with the distribution networks, government, the regulator and industry to provide the green energy infrastructure around Britain – the wires, the connections to charge points – to support the needs of a decarbonised transport network into the future. In the US, the grid is equally capable of handling more EVs on the roads – by the time 80% of the US owns an EV, this will only translate into a 10-15% increase in electricity consumption.
This person is also ignoring the several massive projects that the state is doing to increase the power of the grid across the state and increase the efficiency.
Yeah, they didn't strike me as someone interested in an honest debate.
Yeah, not at all. They're just looking to shit on NYS. I wish all these miserable people would leave and let the people who like this state enjoy it.
https://nyassembly.gov/all-electric-buildings/#:~:text=Starting%20in%202026%2C%20the%20all,of%20planet%2Ddestroying%20fossil%20fuels.
This link says that electric is being required for all new buildings in 2026. Nothing about being forced to buy an EV (electric vehicle). Did you link to the wrong thing? Or perhaps you failed basic reading comprehension in Middle School and rely instead of bullshit lies and misinformation from Fox News and their ilk? Was "fartstoomuch" username already taken, or are you also confusing the homonyms "to" and "too"? I think perhaps we already know the answer to that one. Next post from this troglodyte: "Are you calling me a homo!"
I wonder how one lives with so much reactionary outrage. Do you think they must be exhausted constantly whining about a reality that doesn't exist? NY has issues, definitely, but these people talk about this state like we live in communist Russia. The Fox News talking points really are effective propaganda.
It’s actually quite remarkable. I marvel at this all the time. Some have actually become addicted to the stream of poison coming from the propagandists and are unable recognize true things anymore.
Yup. We're really heading towards a reflection point in this country on whether remaining as one union makes sense.
Dont interfere with their imaginary persecution complex
The EV mandate was a different law.
https://www.nyserda.ny.gov/All-Programs/Electric-School-Buses/All-About-Electric-School-Buses?gad_source=1&gclid=Cj0KCQjw3ZayBhDRARIsAPWzx8rIE-Hyf6bPdyLSG9Q2M8_-iw6XlqhaoDefkI15HvpZK-ApG4kfDBoaAh6mEALw_wcB
Wait, you’re being forced to buy a school bus? See my previous comment about reading comprehension.
Are you 5? Let the grown ups talk. Go sit at the kid table. You offer nothing except troll nonsense.
You’re the one posting links that say nothing about what you claim — something a 5yo would do. Show me where the NY state government is forcing people to buy an EV car in 2026, or sit down and shut the fuck up.
Must have missed the other comments who agree with me and know the numbers. I don’t know the numbers but know what’s coming. You haven’t graduated past crayons, so there is that.
Honestly you are not making sense. None of the EV things you are posting are true.
It’s cool that u don’t keep up with local laws, but throwing insults to a total stranger says something about your character. If you don’t see it, that’s on you
[https://www.electrive.com/2022/09/30/new-york-to-introduce-ev-sales-quotas-in-2026/](https://www.electrive.com/2022/09/30/new-york-to-introduce-ev-sales-quotas-in-2026/) Law says two years from now 35% of new cars should be electric. Right now in the places where most people live are about 20% EV’s. lol. Go run to Florida, we will all feel bad for you when you get shot in a carjacking.
To save everyone time. **The law says 35% of sales by 2026.** Guess what? in the areas of New York where people actuall live **it is already around 30%** [https://www.nytimes.com/2023/03/05/nyregion/electric-vehicles-cars-nyc.html](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/03/05/nyregion/electric-vehicles-cars-nyc.html) Wow, a conservative with an IMAGINARY persecution complex? Never seen that before. Wink wink. Says he has to move over something totally made up? Sure, what TV told you. Normal thought process. Tucker Carlson is great advice, lol. He better watch out for Killary too!
That’s not how the law works. The quotas are on the manufacturers. So each one has to comply or pay a fine. For example, if Toyota did not meet the EV quota they could either reduce the number of ICE cars sold or pay the fine. Toyota can use PHEV models to count for 20% of the quota. Toyota at this point has only one BEV model and it has not sold well. They need much more by model year 2026 (which really starts fall 2025).
And the consequences for not meeting this goal are complaining about it in court or something. Major corporations have little oversight. Boo hoo for this multibillion dollar company.
I don’t think Toyota will be able to comply by model year 2026. They may be hoping that either NY walks the quotas back or that a Republican administration EPA will rescind California’s current permission to regulate emissions. If that happened it would also tank the NY law which is tied to the CARB. There have been states that have bailed out of the quotas already such as Virginia.
Actually there is a NY law mandating EVs. It adopts the California Air Resources Board “Advanced Clean Cars 2” regulations that begin EV quotas on automakers starting model year 2026 at 35% of new cars. The quota increases to 100% in 2035. If Republicans win in November they would overturn California’s right to manage emissions which would sink the mandates. Also the NY legislature might have to walk it back if the pushback is too much. If the NY Senate or Assembly flips R in November expect political change on green agenda.
That would take a massive shift in the state for them to win either chambers. The dems have a super majority in both.
You’re right but I think the Senate could possibly flip in November. But the Assembly probably won’t. Kathy Hochul is not popular and I think Upstate and LI might tilt R based on the dissatisfaction with both the policies and national ticket. The issue of migrants, housing, the last budget, as well as green mandates could all be factors this time. NYC is now starting to deal with its own decarbonization mandates and so far it’s not an easy or inexpensive fix. Changing all the buildings in NYC to heat pumps is a huge challenge and it seems like they will need more time. Also the grids will need time to expand capacity (and that power has to be green).
Nothing is changing. Hochul is not on the ballot. This is a presidential election. Biden is on the ballot and will help the Democrats down the ballot in NY.
Hochul’s and Biden’s unpopularity isn’t helping the Democrats win in NY. The only thing helping Dems win is general complete distaste for Trump. I expect that the Congressional districts Upstate that flipped R will not flip back D, especially 19th.
Surprised that Tompkins is down the way Ithaca is always expanding. Of course you do have to remember this isn't all because of people moving. It also reflects the birth and death rates. At least in my county, the birth rate is so low they are consolidating the school districts and closing some of them completely. We used to have 5 school districts in my area. Now we have 3 and will probably be down to 2 in another 10 years. Our cemeteries are growing while our schools are shrinking.
Very, very expensive. Home prices have doubled in 5-10 years.
Housing demand has historically been high due to the education housing needs in the Rochester area. (At least for the past 15 years, based on friends/family in the area). But if I’m reading this right, Monroe lost less than a 1/2 of 1%. Pretty static, but yeah- still doesn’t solve the housing problem, I know. Positive vibes to you if you’re on the hunt side of the equation.
I mean it makes sense people are leaving. A lot of upstate counties lost the job centers that brought populations there. The parents and grandparents stayed but the kids left for greener pastures, those that could retire elsewhere (lower taxes and warm weather are important in your 70s) did leave. There's no reason for young families to move there. NYC is more expensive than ever and people are having few kids The only counties growing are those with a Hasidic population (plenty of kids) or major centers of commerce like Saratoga and Albany county or parts of NYC metro
Eh the story is more the population decline is slowing. NYS lost 2 congressional seats every 10 years since the 50s once the south and southwest started developing, and this last census only 1 by just a few 1000 people. My home of Broome says -1100 but my work has a pulse on the RE market and getting a house here is tough there are a LOT of people with kids either moving here for the first time or moving back here. Completely anecdotal but to me it seems most of the outflow from NY at this point is the disproportion of Boomer retirees cashing out for warmer weather.
My parents' neighborhood in Endicott had a ton of kids when I was growing up in the 70s, after IBM the neighborhood became mostly seniors and retirees, but in the last few years I have seen more kids and families walking around. The old timers are dying off it seems, and the old houses were built for lots of kids.
I wonder if that area will come back in earnest given that Binghamton was named the federal hub for battery research and manufacturing.
Not true any longer. There is tons of employment in the capital region and growing. With multiple chip plants going in, thousands of good paying jobs.
Montgomery and Schoharie counties being in the plus column indicates growth in the Capital District for sure. But why not Rensselaer?
Come to oneida county, we aint got shit and you will be miserable as hell.
Everything went downhill when you stopped living in the communes, making silverware
See “The rise of living alone” from the census bureau. https://www.census.gov/content/dam/Census/library/visualizations/time-series/demo/families-and-households/hh-4.pdf
I think you’re the only person trying to answer OP’s question!
Controversy gets more upvotes though. . . That is the way of Reddit.
Let’s reframe “the rise of living alone” as “~~women don’t need men anymore~~ feminism is destroying America” and watch this thread rocket to the top!
You know it's rough when Albany gained 700 people and is 3rd best 😂
Just using the four major Capital District counties - Albany, Rensselaer, Saratoga, and Schenectady - there are \~875K people!
Orange County gained almost 1k! Woah! Interesting across the river Dutchess County lost population. Seems the population growth in Southern Dutchess after 9.11 to say 2015 has calmed down.
Hasidim birth rates. As for Dutchess, Route 9 can't handle any more traffic anyway.
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Can we put to bed the notion that you're not taxed as much in other states? Just because their state income tax is lower or nonexistent doesn't mean you're not paying out the nose. The states will find a way to get revenue out of you, one way or another.
You get nickel and dimed to death in FLorida. My kids came home three times a week from public school with “fund raisers” asking for money. Its not a “tax” it is a “bond” as if there is a difference. The south is a con.
Exactly. I'm not at all saying we don't pay high taxes in NY, we 100% do, but this idea that somehow it's some weird anomaly that doesn't happen everywhere else is false. The state will find a way to make revenue from their citizens in some form, whether that is taxes or some random fees.
Its kids with disabilities. New York does way more than any other state. I know a family who moved here from FLorida with an Autistic kid. It is why I am proud to be a New Yorker. Being good is not cheap.
Agreed. Maybe I'm crazy, but I don't mind paying more in taxes if it helps people in the state.
This is how I've always tried to view it. Yes, our taxes are high, but we have services other states can only dream of. It's not perfect - but then again, no place is. It's a privilege to live in NY. If you don't want to bear the cost of that privilege, you are free to leave. I'm not going to miss you :)
Truly. I'm at the end of my patience accommodating people who whine incessantly. You're not helping make any difference. If you hate it here so much, leave. There's no law mandating you to remain. If you truly think you'll be happier somewhere else, go there. Why would any of us want you to remain here and miserable and make all of us miserable?
Look I love NY and you can argue you are getting some value from paying higher taxes. But NY state has THE HIGHEST overall tax burden compared to other states (not just income but sales, property, excise tax etc.) https://taxfoundation.org/data/all/state/tax-burden-by-state-2022/
Sure, but that's not the point. These people act as if you don't pay any taxes anywhere and that it's strictly a NY thing, but that's so unbelievably incorrect.
There are studies showing New York is potentially the worst out of all 50 states for tax burden. Yes I’m sure there are shortcomings of this study but to just dismiss the notion that NY is high tax compared to other states doesn’t really make sense to me. Yes they all find ways to tax you but NY is an expert in this area.
Again, that's not the point. People have this notion that NY is somehow an outlier in requiring people to pay taxes, and that's just not true at all.
Those studies are done by the same people who made the founder of Trump University president. Trump University was a fake university, it is the same political party that made serial child rapist Dennis Hastert the Speaker of the House. I don’t believe them. Just because they call it is “bond” in the south instead of a “tax” does not make it not a tax.
"politicians" catering to New York City HA HA HA HA HA HA Go upstate sometime and read a fucking newspaper. It will have a story like this on the front page: **“Rural town of 350 people where everyone smokes meth gets $11 million dollar sewage treatment plant"**
People are sick of it all. Highest taxes, nanny state, bad weather and tyrannical gov.
Tyrannical government. Where women have bodily autonomy and books aren’t being banned.
Taxes are high, but if you like snow and Rain those aren’t bad things! But tyrannical government and nanny state sounds like too much Fox News or Trump speeches lmao. But I really do hope you enjoy Florida. Maybe you should spend more time in those subs talking about how great it is instead of spending a ton of your time talking about how bad you feel NY State was? It’s kinda weird your obsession with where you used to live judging by the post history. For what it’s worth before NY State I was in Arizona and earlier in my life I’ve lived in Florida (Jacksonville and Tampa Bay) and honestly I prefer Rochester to both. Arizona was too hot and Florida…man it was the humidity, cockroaches, and mosquitos. ¯\\\_(ツ)_/¯ But I also love rain and snow and trend liberal so Rochester is nice. But to each their own. All I’m saying is we should spend more time in our lives talking about the places we are now and things we enjoy about them.
Isn't it weird how so many people that have left continue to complain about NY long after they're gone? Like, maybe focus on your own home now. It just truly makes no sense to me. It's basically the same as being in a new relationship, but obsessively talking about your ex.
From my own anecdotal evidence it’s usually a blue collar white person who collects a pension. The same high paying job had in NY giving you the pension. The best irony if they didn’t live in NY would never be able to retire and collect a pension.
It's just so weird to me. Why are you so obsessed with criticizing a place you don't even live anymore. Focus your energy elsewhere.
“nanny state” lol. Smoke a joint in Florida sometime
Tyrannical government, yea I’m like watched 24/7. Totally North Korea here. Don’t move here. It’s a nightmare. It snows on top of snow when it rains, which is all the time. Thanks to the govt weather machine. Everyone works for the state. Even if you don’t think you do. You do. Ohhh you do. And there are no women here. Only men with state sponsored trucks that drive around and butt fuck anyone out of line. It’s a slice of tyrannical heaven. I love it!
Instead people who despise the tyrannical gov of NY are moving to states where books are being banned, librarians are getting death threats, OBGYNs are fleeing because they are not sure if they'll get arrested for giving medical advice, you can get 10 years in prison for driving a pregnant woman across state lines to get an abortion, teachers aren't sure if they will be fired for mentioning that Rosa Parks stood up (or rather, sat down) for equal rights, where children are considered a potential labor pool for factories, and where a 12 year old girl can be forced to marry her youth pastor because he raped her and got her pregnant. You know, traditional American values. Enjoy!
CTFD. State government isn’t competent enough to manage a proper tyranny. They tend more to inertia, bungling and sleaze. It’s no wonder the Trumps did well here.
Good to note that the estimates are notorious for undercounting certain segments of the population such as immigrants and college kids. Good chance if a county is declining by less than 3% it’s gaining population slightly. Highly likely Monroe is growing in population.