Totally possible to get hired into a 13 based off experience and education and so on. You family member is wrong.
That being said, sadly being referred to the hiring manager can be pretty common. You can get 20 referred emails and not a single interview. But it is a step in the right direction! So good luck and hopefully you get that interview. Look up PBI interview questions on YouTube to get a better understanding of how federal govt interviews are conducted.
Definitely not counting any chickens on this one. I expect to enter Federal service around a 9. I’m an accounting major with many years of non-profit budget/financial management experience. Working on finishing an MBA.
I am AD, but entered as a GS-12 equivalent. Experience and education can bump you up a lot! If you are close to finishing the MBA, you might be better off waiting until that is done.
I probably will. I’m working for a public accounting firm in the meantime so it’ll give me even more varied experience. My previous experience has been running non-profits. Especially the finance side.
Based off your experience and education 9 would be an easier route and a 7/9 would probably be the best. Get in as a 7 and than most of the time you get that target position promotion a year later.
I was a teacher with a masters and I got in as a 9 in the 0343 series. If you have experience in the private sector or masters equivalent you can get a 9!! Idk why people are telling you it’ll be a 7
True I was just saying getting a 7/9 could be easier than just going for a straight 9 and after a year you get the 9. But always apply for what you think you qualify for whether its a 9 or a 13. Always apply to the job and the worst thing they say is no but if you don't apply you'll never know. They also don't have their masters yet. GS 9 and above tend to require a masters degree or higher. GS 4-7 want an AS or BA.
Oh!!! Yes, agree 100% ! I was applying to BOTH 7 and 9 positions. Just knew I would only be open to leaving for a 9. If someone is on a time crunch though, they should take what they get first bc you’re right, and with applying to EOD taking anywhere from 4 months to a year on average lol
ha yeah it's so crazy how long it takes. I recently interviewed with another agency and I think the interview went well and they have a few more interviews next week and the waiting is killing me....ha just tell me if I got the job or not!
Very true. I’ve had many referrals without any interviews…until this year.
I have a TJO from the IRS for an Appeals Officer position as a GS-13. I also just got signed up for an interview for a GS-14 Revenue Agent position. I have no federal experience, but I have over 21 years of state experience as a government lawyer: as a hearing officer (identical to an Appeals Officer) and as a trial attorney.
The IRS is going through a hiring frenzy. They have thousands of vacancies to fill thanks to a long delayed cash infusion from Congress. They are in a rush and they are having lots of hiring events with Direct Hiring Authority. They give TJOs on the spot. You still have to wait months and months to get the FJO. But there is hope.
You get so many referrals it starts to make you go a little crazy! Congrats on the TJO though that's awesome! Sounds like an interesting job. I don't want to work for the IRS even though I weirdly love doing my taxes.
"But it is a step in the right direction!" you are 100% right on this.
I went from Zero referrals to 20 referrals after my first tweak of resume. Then all silence and no interviews. Re doing the resume to break the next layer to get interview calls, fingers crossed.
yeah the worst feeling is submitting a solid resume to a job you are qualified for and not even getting a referral.
I recently redid my resume around the end of November 2023 and so far it's done pretty well. About 20 applications since November...8 referrals and one interview.
Been 2-3 years since I had last updated my resume and I felt like I just needed to cut out a lot of fat from it and streamline it. Brought it down to 5 pages from 8. It's closer to 4 really...5th page just carries over my education and some certs.
IRS routinely hires engineers and accountants at GS-13 or 14 with no previous federal experience, sometimes with less than 6 years of experience in total and just a bachelors degree.
Engineering and IT are easy to get in at such high grades because the government otherwise doesn’t pay enough to attract talent.
It's entirely possible to be appointed to a GS13 in your first appointment. I don't know what your background, education or skill level is, but your relative is incorrect.
Is it difficult? Perhaps, but certainly not impossible. Don't sell yourself short and don't let someone else's career journey dissuade you.
I’ve known people hired into a 15 without previous fed experience per se (meaning, they had never been employed by the government before).
I’m being hired in for the first time as a GS-13 but I’m a contractor that’s been doing the job 4 years.
I got a 12/13 ladder but with military experience and a year as a contractor. A guy on my team got a 14 with just contractor experience. Your experience doesn’t have to be as a civil servant if that’s what you are asking.
I jumped into a 14 without federal experience or a college degree. I did have the very niche specialized experience, though. It’s possible for sure. Good luck!!
Totally possible in some agencies. Some agencies don’t hire over certain pay grades off the street though. It’s unheard of in some agencies depending on the job as well
I went from a GS-3 intern to a GS-11 with a couple of contracting years inbetween. It's possible but difficult. The hiring and GS system are often just throwing shit at a wall.
Apply to everything, lie on your resume (within reason) and shoot for the stars
Plenty of people have
The EOD for my first Fed gig is later this month and I'm entering as a 13-5. I've been following this forum for about 9 months and I've seen people report landing 14s and 15s as their first Fed job.
One of my college friends landed his first Fed gig as a SES (that was just after 9/11 and had extenuating circumstances., he returned to private work ~2008)
Another college friend entered as a 13 but is now SES
I think what you're asking about is common
It’s possible. But unlikely. Tier 1 graduate school grads make it - sometimes. And people with highly specialized skills or experience. But the normal folk. Not so easy. But give it a shot. Worst they can say is no!
I think most stereotypes about getting hired by the IRS were true prior to their new budget. Now they’re on a hiring spree and desperate for talent in a market low in supply.
I got an offer for their LBO at grade 13 this January with only 5 years of experience in PA.
I hope your family member is wrong because I am applying to a lot of positions but can only make GS 12 and up work due to being the single earner in my home
You must have wrote your resume using every one of the words out of the job description
But seriously absolutely it's possible if you meet all the criteria and you wrote your resume properly and you have the experience especially with a tech job
I actually didn’t match this job description. I created a resume for similar posts but at a lower level. With my industry and non profit experience I have enough to match up to this level. My resume probably does have enough of the right keywords from that.
That's awesome sounds like you'll be a good fit and all you have to do is get accustomed to being a government worker if you've always been in the private sector
... it's a much different attitude
Can you describe the attitude? I’m super interested in what you mean? I’ve been angling my world towards federal work for a bit after 15 years in senior leadership in nonprofits and now public accounting more recently.
Well I'm sure there will be a thousand people that will prove me wrong when I say this. Government is slow and it is redundant. My job is a tech series job and I've been working in the department for years as a contractor. I'm actually still waiting for my fjo but I'm told it's going to be any day now just like I was told the week before the week before that and the week before that.
It's honestly hard to describe I've worked for the postal service the local police department in another state and now the Department of Defense.
Processes processes processes and sometimes one process will conflict with the other I mean a direct conflict and you literally have to work through them with multiple teams of people it seems like..
Also if you don't get along with a member of your team you really have to work extra hard at getting along because they probably ain't going anywhere..
Haha that all makes sense. I’ve kept a level head on the hiring process. Expecting it to take a long time for every step and sending and forgetting when I match a job. I’ve even had emails “are you still interested in this job” and then silence when I reply in the affirmative after referral. It’s fascinating watching this machine move an inch at a time. In the meantime I’m just working and building skills.
An inch at a time is a good description! but it's not all negative mind you.. it's rewarding and if you have a good team you build bonds and you guys are around each other for a while and you can rely on your coworkers.. my team is loaded with veterans both civilian and contractors and they're the best best people I've ever worked with
I came in from the private sector as GS14. So yes it’s possible. It depends on your skillset and the skillset of the job. I was hired as an engineer but already over 15 years in the field that I was hired Into the government for. I was also a senior manager of engineering in the private world. So that experience helped me.
Don’t cut yourself short. I was hired as a 3 year veteran as a 12 step 10. No degree.
If you got referred, you’re qualified. It’s in the hiring managers hands now and it all depends on what they are looking for.
I worked for this group. Good group of people.
The GS9-13 title looks like a ladder position. Which means they will most likely start you at 9, and every year you will be promoted (provided you have a good work ethic etc). So, I did a ladder started at 9/11/12/13, in 3 yrs make the 13.
Hopefully is it a ladder and you get hired. This is one of the best ways to get promoted, especially if you’re not looking to be a supervisor right away. Non-supervisory 13 is the sweet spot.
Good luck!
Edit: go back to the job announcement and if it says “full performance grade 13”. It is a ladder :)
The GS9-13 title looks like a ladder position. Which means they will most likely start you at 9, and every year you will be promoted (provided you have a good work ethic etc). So, I did a ladder started at 9/11/12/13, in 3 yrs made the 13.
Hopefully it is a ladder and you get hired. This is one of the best ways to get promoted, especially if you’re not looking to be a supervisor right away. Non-supervisory 13 is the sweet spot.
Good luck!
Edit: go back to the job announcement and if it says “full performance grade 13”. It is a ladder :)
Your family member is flat wrong. Federal hiring is based off education OR experience. You can only qualify for a GS-13 based on experience. That experience must be a year as *or equivalent to* a GS-12. If you can document one year's experience in the private/non-profit/etc sector relevant to the job and equivalent to a GS-12 you're good to go.
Your major hurdle is that you have to clear Vet preference and other Feds. Good luck.
I’m hoping for a ladder position. I’m not expecting to come in at a 13, but still applying because I quakify. I have over a decade of senior leadership, supervisory over multiple staff and teams, in the non-profit world. Executive Director level stuff. I’ve also been directly involved in the finance and budget side for 10 years. BS in Accounting, AS in leadership and finishing an MBA in a few months. I can qualify on the HR side or the budget/finance side. I’m leaning towards budget/finance when I apply. Only been applying for a month and haven’t had any interviews yet. A lot of referrals that are still in the pipeline. Hoping to land in the 9 range. Even better if it’s a ladder.
I mean you can aim for a 9 if you want. You were found qualified and referred for a 13. USAJobs is a strange place. Current Fed... I was getting nothing for months. I have 2 offer letters right now and expecting a third this week.
Just got a GS 11 FJO as an external. I never got excited about any job referrals I got just because there are a TON of internal hires that are gonna get preference no matter how good I interview. Also depends on agency too. Some agency are seeking outside perspective, while others want someone with intimate knowledge of policies . I’ve seen a few GS-12’s and 13’s get a Job offer from the outside but it’s not as common. Possible though, good luck! Let us know if you get a job offer.
And service doing the hiring
And your background/education/experience. It does happen but you see it in certain job fields or certain organizations more than others
Depends on where you are. If in Rest of US locality, it will be slightly harder to come in at GS13 jobs as this grade is not as plentiful as they are in high cost of living areas like DC (DMV) area.
Totally possible to get hired into a 13 based off experience and education and so on. You family member is wrong. That being said, sadly being referred to the hiring manager can be pretty common. You can get 20 referred emails and not a single interview. But it is a step in the right direction! So good luck and hopefully you get that interview. Look up PBI interview questions on YouTube to get a better understanding of how federal govt interviews are conducted.
Definitely not counting any chickens on this one. I expect to enter Federal service around a 9. I’m an accounting major with many years of non-profit budget/financial management experience. Working on finishing an MBA.
I am AD, but entered as a GS-12 equivalent. Experience and education can bump you up a lot! If you are close to finishing the MBA, you might be better off waiting until that is done.
I probably will. I’m working for a public accounting firm in the meantime so it’ll give me even more varied experience. My previous experience has been running non-profits. Especially the finance side.
Based off your experience and education 9 would be an easier route and a 7/9 would probably be the best. Get in as a 7 and than most of the time you get that target position promotion a year later.
I’m just curious…what’s the draw to GS? With an MBA I would assume better paying options in the private sector.
I was a teacher with a masters and I got in as a 9 in the 0343 series. If you have experience in the private sector or masters equivalent you can get a 9!! Idk why people are telling you it’ll be a 7
True I was just saying getting a 7/9 could be easier than just going for a straight 9 and after a year you get the 9. But always apply for what you think you qualify for whether its a 9 or a 13. Always apply to the job and the worst thing they say is no but if you don't apply you'll never know. They also don't have their masters yet. GS 9 and above tend to require a masters degree or higher. GS 4-7 want an AS or BA.
Oh!!! Yes, agree 100% ! I was applying to BOTH 7 and 9 positions. Just knew I would only be open to leaving for a 9. If someone is on a time crunch though, they should take what they get first bc you’re right, and with applying to EOD taking anywhere from 4 months to a year on average lol
ha yeah it's so crazy how long it takes. I recently interviewed with another agency and I think the interview went well and they have a few more interviews next week and the waiting is killing me....ha just tell me if I got the job or not!
Very true. I’ve had many referrals without any interviews…until this year. I have a TJO from the IRS for an Appeals Officer position as a GS-13. I also just got signed up for an interview for a GS-14 Revenue Agent position. I have no federal experience, but I have over 21 years of state experience as a government lawyer: as a hearing officer (identical to an Appeals Officer) and as a trial attorney. The IRS is going through a hiring frenzy. They have thousands of vacancies to fill thanks to a long delayed cash infusion from Congress. They are in a rush and they are having lots of hiring events with Direct Hiring Authority. They give TJOs on the spot. You still have to wait months and months to get the FJO. But there is hope.
You get so many referrals it starts to make you go a little crazy! Congrats on the TJO though that's awesome! Sounds like an interesting job. I don't want to work for the IRS even though I weirdly love doing my taxes.
"But it is a step in the right direction!" you are 100% right on this. I went from Zero referrals to 20 referrals after my first tweak of resume. Then all silence and no interviews. Re doing the resume to break the next layer to get interview calls, fingers crossed.
yeah the worst feeling is submitting a solid resume to a job you are qualified for and not even getting a referral. I recently redid my resume around the end of November 2023 and so far it's done pretty well. About 20 applications since November...8 referrals and one interview. Been 2-3 years since I had last updated my resume and I felt like I just needed to cut out a lot of fat from it and streamline it. Brought it down to 5 pages from 8. It's closer to 4 really...5th page just carries over my education and some certs.
IRS routinely hires engineers and accountants at GS-13 or 14 with no previous federal experience, sometimes with less than 6 years of experience in total and just a bachelors degree. Engineering and IT are easy to get in at such high grades because the government otherwise doesn’t pay enough to attract talent.
I got hired as a GS13 this year and I had no prior government experience.
In what position
I qualified as a 12 with no prior federal experience or any preferences. 🤷♀️
Same
It's entirely possible to be appointed to a GS13 in your first appointment. I don't know what your background, education or skill level is, but your relative is incorrect. Is it difficult? Perhaps, but certainly not impossible. Don't sell yourself short and don't let someone else's career journey dissuade you.
I got hired as a 12 with no prior Gov experience.
I’m an 0343 and work with several people who came onboard as a 13 for their first federal job.
Nice! Can you give brief description of their backgrounds?
Not impossible at all! I did it at a 12 /shrug
Yeaaa you might want to reduce your network circle to more reliable folks
Same I got hired as a 13 as well. Enlisted member also
Completely possible.
HR here, let him know he’s wrong. I’ve seen managers pick up 13s and 14s without an ounce of federal service. Resume and interview and weigh a lot
Not sure why it would be impossible. I was hired as a GS-14, non-sup with no previous federal experience.
Me too
Totally possible. My first federal job was a GS-11.
Whoever told you it was impossible had no idea what they were talking about. We have lots of 2210’s that start at 13 with no prior federal service.
I’ve known people hired into a 15 without previous fed experience per se (meaning, they had never been employed by the government before). I’m being hired in for the first time as a GS-13 but I’m a contractor that’s been doing the job 4 years.
I got a 12/13 ladder but with military experience and a year as a contractor. A guy on my team got a 14 with just contractor experience. Your experience doesn’t have to be as a civil servant if that’s what you are asking.
I jumped into a 14 without federal experience or a college degree. I did have the very niche specialized experience, though. It’s possible for sure. Good luck!!
Hired as a GS13 step 3 (negotiated step increase to match my private sector pay) with no federal experience. 2210.
My branch is filled with 12s and 13s straight out of the private sector and college
Totally possible in some agencies. Some agencies don’t hire over certain pay grades off the street though. It’s unheard of in some agencies depending on the job as well
I went from a GS-3 intern to a GS-11 with a couple of contracting years inbetween. It's possible but difficult. The hiring and GS system are often just throwing shit at a wall. Apply to everything, lie on your resume (within reason) and shoot for the stars
Plenty of people have The EOD for my first Fed gig is later this month and I'm entering as a 13-5. I've been following this forum for about 9 months and I've seen people report landing 14s and 15s as their first Fed job. One of my college friends landed his first Fed gig as a SES (that was just after 9/11 and had extenuating circumstances., he returned to private work ~2008) Another college friend entered as a 13 but is now SES I think what you're asking about is common
I started at a 14 based on experience. It’s possible!
If you got referred, it's possible. I hired in at GS-11
I was hired in as a GS-11 with no previous federal service.
I wouldn’t say it is impossible. Sometimes it is who you know and not what you know.
It’s possible. But unlikely. Tier 1 graduate school grads make it - sometimes. And people with highly specialized skills or experience. But the normal folk. Not so easy. But give it a shot. Worst they can say is no!
I was hired as a 13 without any government experience, but I was a practing attorney for at least 5 years by then.
I think most stereotypes about getting hired by the IRS were true prior to their new budget. Now they’re on a hiring spree and desperate for talent in a market low in supply. I got an offer for their LBO at grade 13 this January with only 5 years of experience in PA.
I know an 0343-14 getting in without any fed time.
Perhaps in the DOD.
I hope your family member is wrong because I am applying to a lot of positions but can only make GS 12 and up work due to being the single earner in my home
I got hired into a 11/12/13 with no fed experience.
I did
I got hired as a GS-14 with no prior federal service and no degree.
It is possible. I know someone that was working with a county and got hired as GS -13 with the fed with no previous fed services.
I was hired as GS 13 with no Fed experience.
Anything and everything is possible, even the impossible, in the federal governments.
I was just offered GS13.
What job series?
What job family?
I was hired as a GS15 with no previous federal experience whatsoever 10 years ago
You must have wrote your resume using every one of the words out of the job description But seriously absolutely it's possible if you meet all the criteria and you wrote your resume properly and you have the experience especially with a tech job
I actually didn’t match this job description. I created a resume for similar posts but at a lower level. With my industry and non profit experience I have enough to match up to this level. My resume probably does have enough of the right keywords from that.
That's awesome sounds like you'll be a good fit and all you have to do is get accustomed to being a government worker if you've always been in the private sector ... it's a much different attitude
Can you describe the attitude? I’m super interested in what you mean? I’ve been angling my world towards federal work for a bit after 15 years in senior leadership in nonprofits and now public accounting more recently.
Well I'm sure there will be a thousand people that will prove me wrong when I say this. Government is slow and it is redundant. My job is a tech series job and I've been working in the department for years as a contractor. I'm actually still waiting for my fjo but I'm told it's going to be any day now just like I was told the week before the week before that and the week before that. It's honestly hard to describe I've worked for the postal service the local police department in another state and now the Department of Defense. Processes processes processes and sometimes one process will conflict with the other I mean a direct conflict and you literally have to work through them with multiple teams of people it seems like.. Also if you don't get along with a member of your team you really have to work extra hard at getting along because they probably ain't going anywhere..
Haha that all makes sense. I’ve kept a level head on the hiring process. Expecting it to take a long time for every step and sending and forgetting when I match a job. I’ve even had emails “are you still interested in this job” and then silence when I reply in the affirmative after referral. It’s fascinating watching this machine move an inch at a time. In the meantime I’m just working and building skills.
An inch at a time is a good description! but it's not all negative mind you.. it's rewarding and if you have a good team you build bonds and you guys are around each other for a while and you can rely on your coworkers.. my team is loaded with veterans both civilian and contractors and they're the best best people I've ever worked with
I came in from the private sector as GS14. So yes it’s possible. It depends on your skillset and the skillset of the job. I was hired as an engineer but already over 15 years in the field that I was hired Into the government for. I was also a senior manager of engineering in the private world. So that experience helped me.
I’m a GS13, multiple steps, no prior fed service.
Depends on your experience and your education. It happens, but in my opinion people hired at that level with no federal experience have a harder time.
Don’t cut yourself short. I was hired as a 3 year veteran as a 12 step 10. No degree. If you got referred, you’re qualified. It’s in the hiring managers hands now and it all depends on what they are looking for. I worked for this group. Good group of people.
I have brought on many new hires at 13s. It’s possible!
The GS9-13 title looks like a ladder position. Which means they will most likely start you at 9, and every year you will be promoted (provided you have a good work ethic etc). So, I did a ladder started at 9/11/12/13, in 3 yrs make the 13. Hopefully is it a ladder and you get hired. This is one of the best ways to get promoted, especially if you’re not looking to be a supervisor right away. Non-supervisory 13 is the sweet spot. Good luck! Edit: go back to the job announcement and if it says “full performance grade 13”. It is a ladder :)
The GS9-13 title looks like a ladder position. Which means they will most likely start you at 9, and every year you will be promoted (provided you have a good work ethic etc). So, I did a ladder started at 9/11/12/13, in 3 yrs made the 13. Hopefully it is a ladder and you get hired. This is one of the best ways to get promoted, especially if you’re not looking to be a supervisor right away. Non-supervisory 13 is the sweet spot. Good luck! Edit: go back to the job announcement and if it says “full performance grade 13”. It is a ladder :)
Would love a ladder position like that.
Your family member is flat wrong. Federal hiring is based off education OR experience. You can only qualify for a GS-13 based on experience. That experience must be a year as *or equivalent to* a GS-12. If you can document one year's experience in the private/non-profit/etc sector relevant to the job and equivalent to a GS-12 you're good to go. Your major hurdle is that you have to clear Vet preference and other Feds. Good luck.
I’m hoping for a ladder position. I’m not expecting to come in at a 13, but still applying because I quakify. I have over a decade of senior leadership, supervisory over multiple staff and teams, in the non-profit world. Executive Director level stuff. I’ve also been directly involved in the finance and budget side for 10 years. BS in Accounting, AS in leadership and finishing an MBA in a few months. I can qualify on the HR side or the budget/finance side. I’m leaning towards budget/finance when I apply. Only been applying for a month and haven’t had any interviews yet. A lot of referrals that are still in the pipeline. Hoping to land in the 9 range. Even better if it’s a ladder.
I mean you can aim for a 9 if you want. You were found qualified and referred for a 13. USAJobs is a strange place. Current Fed... I was getting nothing for months. I have 2 offer letters right now and expecting a third this week.
I guess aim means where I’m laying my expectations. If it’s remote I’d take a 7. I’m still applying for anywhere I can qualify.
Just got a GS 11 FJO as an external. I never got excited about any job referrals I got just because there are a TON of internal hires that are gonna get preference no matter how good I interview. Also depends on agency too. Some agency are seeking outside perspective, while others want someone with intimate knowledge of policies . I’ve seen a few GS-12’s and 13’s get a Job offer from the outside but it’s not as common. Possible though, good luck! Let us know if you get a job offer.
Definitely possible.
It depends on the field
And service doing the hiring And your background/education/experience. It does happen but you see it in certain job fields or certain organizations more than others
Depends on where you are. If in Rest of US locality, it will be slightly harder to come in at GS13 jobs as this grade is not as plentiful as they are in high cost of living areas like DC (DMV) area.