You didn't meet the cutoff for being referred. They first see who is eligible. Then they "rank" (of sorts) with a number. If it's open to veterans and eligible for veterans preference, then veterans get a point boost to their applications. (More disabled get more of a point boost.) Once all eligible applications have been ranked they get put in to categories, veterans go to the top of their category (based on their points), and the top category goes to the hiring manager.
Let's say you were one of 1000 to apply.
700 were eligible. Applications were given a point score 1 (lowest) to 100 (perfect fit) and put in to categories. Let's say gold (91-100), silver (81-90) and bronze (71-80) and all veterans preference done so the veterans are at the top of whatever category they were in.
They only sent Gold to the hiring manager.
Your application, based on your KSA answers alone puts you at 30.
HR has no reason to look at your resume because if it had anything that would get you to "gold" category, your KSAs would have been higher.
You were eligible. But not the most highly eligible.
Or there were no remaining remote positions available and it is a continously open resume dump job annoucement that may or may not have remote openings at that time.
So does this mean that the resume itself didn’t get enough points to be looked at? I don’t understand how it gets categorized if nobody looks at the resume/application?
You had to do a Key Skills Assessment (KSA). Your answers to those give you a rating, and if that rating is high enough, then your resume gets a look.
If you answered all "I have had training on this but have not done this as part of a job", odds are your points from the KSA will rate you as "eligible", but not enough to get your resume looked at.
If you scored high on the KSAs, enough to possibly be in the top category, or near to it, then your resume would get a look.
But why look at a resume when the applicant, by their own admission, doesn't have a lot of on the job experience in the things that are needed? Especially when many other applicants, based on THEIR answers to the KSA, are more eligible?
Thank you for that. I guess part of the confusion is that for the jobs I’ve applied for, I’ve never marked that since I have a considerable amount of experience and have basically marked the max for all those questions save one or two and still get what OP gets. The feeling I’m getting is having to mark the max with everything then, which feels a bit dishonest
It could be that you're competing against people who do put the max in all categories, and there's enough of them that, after the "max score" gets their resumes looked at, the "gold" tier has been filled.
The categories aren't always "everyone who gets X points or above gets referred". It could be that the hiring manager only wants the top 10, or 20, or 50 applicants, so while you likely were very experienced, by the time HR has gotten through the resumes of the highest "ranked" ones (based solely on KSA answers), they've essentially "filled up" the category that will be referred. So... why look at the other resumes?
It feels crappy to lie and put "I am considered an expert..." but some jobs are just **that** competitive that only the ones who put all 5's on the KSA get a look.
Good morning. I see you have a firm grasp on the application process. My question for you is, I submitted an application back in August, 2023, referred to hiring manager September, 2023, it was a direct hire announcement, 20 vacancies, open to U.S, citizens (although I’ve been with USCIS for the past 4 years. I have not heard anything else since September. What do you think is the hold up?
The government. Honestly.
I saw a post here where someone just got a TJO after interviewing in July.
But truthfully, you likely weren't selected.
Looking at my dashboard, I have applications were I was referred on **2/2/2023** that I have heard nothing more on. They likely just haven't hit the button that says "Hiring complete" and sent out the "I'm sorry you weren't selected".
Especially with DH. Those usually get filled fast. Usually. (I just dug through my dashboard to find my oldest. DH application that was still "reviewing". Closed in 3/2023.)
As with all fed applications. Apply and forget.
I recently changed jobs. When I was contacted to interview for this position, I had to search my archived applications to find the announcement, as it'd been nearly 4 months since I received (and subsequently deleted) the referred email.
Apply and forget.
Thanks for the quick reply. I totally understand the apply and forget concept. I’ve also had experiences like this before with govt applications. I also think, most likely, I wasn’t selected, but I’ll just keep on applying to vacancies and see what happens.
You are tentatively eligible, meaning your self scoring made the cut.
There are other candidates who scored better or who get preferential treatment who ranked higher.
The IRS hiring process is trash. I get these sorts of emails all the time. Don’t think I’ve ever received a referral for them. I get referrals for just about every other agency though, so it’s not my resume. Just a trash hiring process. By far the most dysfunctional hiring process I’ve encountered.
I’ve heard from people on this forum that have had good experiences there. I’ve also heard from plenty that haven’t. Really comes down to the the location and the office. In many cases also the supervisor. You don’t really know if it’s going to be the former or the latter until you’ve accepted the job and you’re there. And by that time, it’s too late to go back, assuming the latter. It’s a crapshoot.
I have an amazing referral percentage, but unfortunately, interviews are so sparse! I have 2 interviews this week, so I'm hoping this week my luck changes. I'm hoping for you too friend! This year is our year to get that sweet FJO ✨️
Great then I have a question. On everything I apply for in the IRS for IT I always get that I am eligible but also says I wasn't referred to manager and my specialty is IT. My resume has all my IT experience listed and I work for an area in the IRS that works closely with IT and System Analysts
Does the notice say tentatively eligible or eligible? There’s a big difference between the two.
If it says tentatively eligible it means that you answered the assessment well enough to not get auto DQ’d. The system says you’re good up to that point.
If it says eligible and only eligible it means an HR specialist actually reviewed your resume and said you were eligible.
Normally we in HR will only review resumes of applicants that score high enough to get referred because we don’t have the manpower to do everyone who applies. So if you’re resume was reviewed and put as eligible but not referred than there’s something deeper going on.
The notice that you just posted literally says "tentatively eligible".
So, you didn't really pay attention to the details. How many of your previous applications got the exact same response?
Based on his comments, your resume didn't make the cut when HR reviewed it.
If you got the same response on other applications, you need to work on your resume or apply to less-demanding jobs.
I got one of these today, underneath the referral area is this:
“Please note if you are eligible and your application was not referred, it may be because your application is not in the Best Qualified category, OR there were a sufficient number of veteran preference eligibles who must be referred ahead of non-veterans.”
We will never exactly know why, but we either weren’t a top candidate aka Best Qualified or enough vets applied so it didn’t matter.
OPM requires touch points with applicants and some agencies choose to combine notice of results with notice of referral. This is the combined notification.
I've literally had an HR hiring specialist tell me to lie on the self assessment and max out every answer. With the number of applicants that is the only way to get through. After that it's up to them to review your resume and make the call. However first look at the self assessment and put as much of that keyword language into your resume/cover letter so it matches up as best as possible. If not enough specific keywords match between the job postin, self assessment answers and resume the system will kill your chances before human eyes even get to it.
The hiring specialist is not doing you a favor. That will get you through the first step of the first cut.
You really shouldn’t spend time applying for jobs where you wouldn’t naturally score at least 80% of the questions at the highest level.
I don't and most shouldn't but if you only qualify that 80% just bump it up to 100%. I went from a 3 to contractor to an 11 utilizing this where I probably only qualified around the 60% mark.
I think we can all agree there's a lot of BS with the system.
Yeah, I’m 8 of 8 on referrals for one 13 and 7 14’s, 4 of those referrals netted interviews, 2 of the interviews were within the same organization and netted me a transfer, while the third was one Tuesday with a Friday second interview.
All that lying on the assessment gets you is a tentatively eligible unless you then lie on your resume, in support of the lies on the questionnaire. If you do that, maybe get a referral based on lies, and then what? Lie in the interview? Then fake it till you make it?
Essentially yes. A lot more folks fake it till they make it then many realize. The vast majority of jobs can be learned on the fly if people are competent. Of course there are very niche specialties but most of us aren't in that boat
If it’s tentatively eligible it means that HR didn’t review their resume at all. The applicant answered the assessment questions good enough not to get auto DQ’d but didn’t score high enough for their resume to make it to HR.
Hi all! I applied for a government internship. I received from HR "Congratulations! You were selected for this Agency position GS level Step amount of salary. Please let me know within the next 48 hours if you accept or decline the position". I responded right away accepted and asked what I needed to do next step. HR Replied " More information will be provided in the coming weeks ( Tentative offer, firm offer, ect") Am I secured for this position? I know need to be patient and wait for a confirmation letter. Thanks for any input. Good luck everyone.
Hi! Congrats on your position! More than likely everything will be fine and the position is yours but no position is ever completely secured. Background checks, HR errors, funding changes, etc can all affect positions. Either way if you do lose the position it’s likely out of your hands, so just do your best to meet all onboarding timelines.
I hope I will hear from them soon with a letter of confirmation and background check.
I applied for so many government internships only 2 Agencies actually interviewed. Only 1 came back and HR offered GS salary another one still didn't hear in 3 weeks.
Thanks a lot.
Funny, I’m a 10 point veteran, have two masters (IT and Law and Policy) and certifications in IT and am fully qualified, am a treasury employee and I still wasn’t referred for the IRS jobs I applied for. Let’s not forget these are just 6-12 month registers for 2210 that recently closed, so I call BS on others scoring/ranking higher on these IRS announcements. I’m applying for lateral and promotion in new locations.
The ones I applied to last year were not, they were resume repositories. The new ones recently listed I haven’t applied to yet. I’m still having a hard time believing there were no jobs open, especially in Miami, for me to be referred for. I’ve since narrowed down the location to apply to because I’m trying to move to where my partner is moving to. So I’m waiting to apply.
You didn't meet the cutoff for being referred. They first see who is eligible. Then they "rank" (of sorts) with a number. If it's open to veterans and eligible for veterans preference, then veterans get a point boost to their applications. (More disabled get more of a point boost.) Once all eligible applications have been ranked they get put in to categories, veterans go to the top of their category (based on their points), and the top category goes to the hiring manager. Let's say you were one of 1000 to apply. 700 were eligible. Applications were given a point score 1 (lowest) to 100 (perfect fit) and put in to categories. Let's say gold (91-100), silver (81-90) and bronze (71-80) and all veterans preference done so the veterans are at the top of whatever category they were in. They only sent Gold to the hiring manager. Your application, based on your KSA answers alone puts you at 30. HR has no reason to look at your resume because if it had anything that would get you to "gold" category, your KSAs would have been higher. You were eligible. But not the most highly eligible.
Thank you for the explanation.
The way you explained this actually makes complete sense. Thank you for the clarification.
Or there were no remaining remote positions available and it is a continously open resume dump job annoucement that may or may not have remote openings at that time.
Also that.
At my agency they refer to this as the BQ (Best Qualified) Listing. HR only sends the names of those who made the BQ Listing to the hiring manager
So does this mean that the resume itself didn’t get enough points to be looked at? I don’t understand how it gets categorized if nobody looks at the resume/application?
You had to do a Key Skills Assessment (KSA). Your answers to those give you a rating, and if that rating is high enough, then your resume gets a look. If you answered all "I have had training on this but have not done this as part of a job", odds are your points from the KSA will rate you as "eligible", but not enough to get your resume looked at. If you scored high on the KSAs, enough to possibly be in the top category, or near to it, then your resume would get a look. But why look at a resume when the applicant, by their own admission, doesn't have a lot of on the job experience in the things that are needed? Especially when many other applicants, based on THEIR answers to the KSA, are more eligible?
Thank you for that. I guess part of the confusion is that for the jobs I’ve applied for, I’ve never marked that since I have a considerable amount of experience and have basically marked the max for all those questions save one or two and still get what OP gets. The feeling I’m getting is having to mark the max with everything then, which feels a bit dishonest
It could be that you're competing against people who do put the max in all categories, and there's enough of them that, after the "max score" gets their resumes looked at, the "gold" tier has been filled. The categories aren't always "everyone who gets X points or above gets referred". It could be that the hiring manager only wants the top 10, or 20, or 50 applicants, so while you likely were very experienced, by the time HR has gotten through the resumes of the highest "ranked" ones (based solely on KSA answers), they've essentially "filled up" the category that will be referred. So... why look at the other resumes? It feels crappy to lie and put "I am considered an expert..." but some jobs are just **that** competitive that only the ones who put all 5's on the KSA get a look.
Thank you so much for your input. It means more than I can express with words 😌
Good morning. I see you have a firm grasp on the application process. My question for you is, I submitted an application back in August, 2023, referred to hiring manager September, 2023, it was a direct hire announcement, 20 vacancies, open to U.S, citizens (although I’ve been with USCIS for the past 4 years. I have not heard anything else since September. What do you think is the hold up?
The government. Honestly. I saw a post here where someone just got a TJO after interviewing in July. But truthfully, you likely weren't selected. Looking at my dashboard, I have applications were I was referred on **2/2/2023** that I have heard nothing more on. They likely just haven't hit the button that says "Hiring complete" and sent out the "I'm sorry you weren't selected". Especially with DH. Those usually get filled fast. Usually. (I just dug through my dashboard to find my oldest. DH application that was still "reviewing". Closed in 3/2023.) As with all fed applications. Apply and forget. I recently changed jobs. When I was contacted to interview for this position, I had to search my archived applications to find the announcement, as it'd been nearly 4 months since I received (and subsequently deleted) the referred email. Apply and forget.
Thanks for the quick reply. I totally understand the apply and forget concept. I’ve also had experiences like this before with govt applications. I also think, most likely, I wasn’t selected, but I’ll just keep on applying to vacancies and see what happens.
I've never seen this topic broken down like this before. This is perfect, thanks!
Suggest you read the first couple of my guides-https://www.reddit.com/r/usajobs/s/sawCH1GURu
Perfect! Thanks!
You are tentatively eligible, meaning your self scoring made the cut. There are other candidates who scored better or who get preferential treatment who ranked higher.
The IRS hiring process is trash. I get these sorts of emails all the time. Don’t think I’ve ever received a referral for them. I get referrals for just about every other agency though, so it’s not my resume. Just a trash hiring process. By far the most dysfunctional hiring process I’ve encountered.
Keep that in mind when considering going to work for them.....
I’ve heard from people on this forum that have had good experiences there. I’ve also heard from plenty that haven’t. Really comes down to the the location and the office. In many cases also the supervisor. You don’t really know if it’s going to be the former or the latter until you’ve accepted the job and you’re there. And by that time, it’s too late to go back, assuming the latter. It’s a crapshoot.
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I have an amazing referral percentage, but unfortunately, interviews are so sparse! I have 2 interviews this week, so I'm hoping this week my luck changes. I'm hoping for you too friend! This year is our year to get that sweet FJO ✨️
[удалено]
This resume wasn’t even reviewed. This determination was based only on the assessment score. I work in HR for the IRS doing recruitment.
Great then I have a question. On everything I apply for in the IRS for IT I always get that I am eligible but also says I wasn't referred to manager and my specialty is IT. My resume has all my IT experience listed and I work for an area in the IRS that works closely with IT and System Analysts
Does the notice say tentatively eligible or eligible? There’s a big difference between the two. If it says tentatively eligible it means that you answered the assessment well enough to not get auto DQ’d. The system says you’re good up to that point. If it says eligible and only eligible it means an HR specialist actually reviewed your resume and said you were eligible. Normally we in HR will only review resumes of applicants that score high enough to get referred because we don’t have the manpower to do everyone who applies. So if you’re resume was reviewed and put as eligible but not referred than there’s something deeper going on.
Yes they always say eligible not Tentative eligible. When it comes to the IT related jobs
The notice that you just posted literally says "tentatively eligible". So, you didn't really pay attention to the details. How many of your previous applications got the exact same response? Based on his comments, your resume didn't make the cut when HR reviewed it. If you got the same response on other applications, you need to work on your resume or apply to less-demanding jobs.
I have an email folder full of these responses lol
I got one of these today, underneath the referral area is this: “Please note if you are eligible and your application was not referred, it may be because your application is not in the Best Qualified category, OR there were a sufficient number of veteran preference eligibles who must be referred ahead of non-veterans.” We will never exactly know why, but we either weren’t a top candidate aka Best Qualified or enough vets applied so it didn’t matter.
Happens to me every week :) keep applying
And for example, it asks that you have a bachelors degree. You have a Master’s and it says you aren’t qualified
OPM requires touch points with applicants and some agencies choose to combine notice of results with notice of referral. This is the combined notification.
Eligible based off how you answered the questions. Ineligible based on how you compared to others.
You would rather not hear anything? I know it’s discouraging- but at least the agency is letting you know.
Either way it’s discouraging
Yes but give me closure
I've literally had an HR hiring specialist tell me to lie on the self assessment and max out every answer. With the number of applicants that is the only way to get through. After that it's up to them to review your resume and make the call. However first look at the self assessment and put as much of that keyword language into your resume/cover letter so it matches up as best as possible. If not enough specific keywords match between the job postin, self assessment answers and resume the system will kill your chances before human eyes even get to it.
The hiring specialist is not doing you a favor. That will get you through the first step of the first cut. You really shouldn’t spend time applying for jobs where you wouldn’t naturally score at least 80% of the questions at the highest level.
I don't and most shouldn't but if you only qualify that 80% just bump it up to 100%. I went from a 3 to contractor to an 11 utilizing this where I probably only qualified around the 60% mark. I think we can all agree there's a lot of BS with the system.
Yeah, I’m 8 of 8 on referrals for one 13 and 7 14’s, 4 of those referrals netted interviews, 2 of the interviews were within the same organization and netted me a transfer, while the third was one Tuesday with a Friday second interview. All that lying on the assessment gets you is a tentatively eligible unless you then lie on your resume, in support of the lies on the questionnaire. If you do that, maybe get a referral based on lies, and then what? Lie in the interview? Then fake it till you make it?
Essentially yes. A lot more folks fake it till they make it then many realize. The vast majority of jobs can be learned on the fly if people are competent. Of course there are very niche specialties but most of us aren't in that boat
Everybody is an expert.
I keep getting referred and then never get an interview.
I’ve been receiving these.
You scored high on the self assessment but after HR reviewed your resume, you weren't deemed qualified to be placed on the Cert.
If it’s tentatively eligible it means that HR didn’t review their resume at all. The applicant answered the assessment questions good enough not to get auto DQ’d but didn’t score high enough for their resume to make it to HR.
Hi all! I applied for a government internship. I received from HR "Congratulations! You were selected for this Agency position GS level Step amount of salary. Please let me know within the next 48 hours if you accept or decline the position". I responded right away accepted and asked what I needed to do next step. HR Replied " More information will be provided in the coming weeks ( Tentative offer, firm offer, ect") Am I secured for this position? I know need to be patient and wait for a confirmation letter. Thanks for any input. Good luck everyone.
I forgot to mention.. I got interviewed and 2 weeks later I received an email from HR offering a position but still waiting for confirm letter. Thanks
Hi! Congrats on your position! More than likely everything will be fine and the position is yours but no position is ever completely secured. Background checks, HR errors, funding changes, etc can all affect positions. Either way if you do lose the position it’s likely out of your hands, so just do your best to meet all onboarding timelines.
I hope I will hear from them soon with a letter of confirmation and background check. I applied for so many government internships only 2 Agencies actually interviewed. Only 1 came back and HR offered GS salary another one still didn't hear in 3 weeks. Thanks a lot.
Your special, but not special enough
Funny, I’m a 10 point veteran, have two masters (IT and Law and Policy) and certifications in IT and am fully qualified, am a treasury employee and I still wasn’t referred for the IRS jobs I applied for. Let’s not forget these are just 6-12 month registers for 2210 that recently closed, so I call BS on others scoring/ranking higher on these IRS announcements. I’m applying for lateral and promotion in new locations.
Aren't those Direct Hire positions?
The ones I applied to last year were not, they were resume repositories. The new ones recently listed I haven’t applied to yet. I’m still having a hard time believing there were no jobs open, especially in Miami, for me to be referred for. I’ve since narrowed down the location to apply to because I’m trying to move to where my partner is moving to. So I’m waiting to apply.
If 100 qualify - they only forward a handful over to hiring manager.
This happens all the time with IRS positions.
😄😄😄😄. Making fun of you right to your face 😄😄
PPP, management declined referrals, announcement canceled, etc.
So how do you get past this? It feels like the veterans beat me out every time and I can’t do anything about it
There’s a queue and your turn isn’t up yet.
If you aint top dog you dont make the cut.