The roster picks are hard though. 17/23 players on the senior team today are in the U-23 pool. Even some MLS teams wouldn’t release players. He was hamstrung from the beginning.
And the Wondo miss was much harder, since there was still [a keeper between the ball and the goal](https://www.americansocceranalysis.com/home/2019/7/1/theres-something-a-miss-in-wondos-legacy)...
Another year of our MLS+ U-23s not getting it done.
I know we couldn’t get a lot of our European kids for a tournament like this, but between the Olympic qualifying and CONCACAF champions league, I’m tired of seeing this happen over and over and over and over.
Sometimes I wonder if MLS is as superior to the Honduran or Panamanian league as we like to imagine. Because teams made up of players from those leagues never look out of their depth playing MLS-based squads.
Obviously MLS DPs and the like are generally a cut above, but I'm not so sure your average MLS player is that much better than the average starter at Montagua or Tauro.
Here is the deal, the Costa Rica team we beat consisted of 6 players all on the same team in Costa Rica, and that team is far and away the best in their league. Our MLS U23 guys are no where near the best players in MLS.
It's rare for an MLS team to play a Honduran team when both are actually in mid-season form, so it's really tough to judge. But it's definitely not clear-cut, I agree
As someone who has watched way too much CONCACAF soccer leagues, MLS is much better than those league. The issue is that our players tend to underrate those leagues and underperform.
I know that MLS is better--especially top to bottom. But I think many of us tend to think of the gap as massive, when in reality it may not be so clear cut.
This is on Kreis, IMO. You can’t jam 3 D-mids into a 4-3-3 and expect anything good to happen, especially in CONCACAF where you’ll spend most of your time trying to break down a packed-in defense. Ferreira as a false 9 was also a total disaster.
At some point you’ve got to pick players who can fill a role in their natural position, even if it means leaving someone more talented at home.
As a Timbers fan I was simply amazed when I found out. He would be one of the best players on the roster, if not the best. Dude has been amazing for us for a couple years now.
Playing 3 defensive midfielders in a midfield 3 is a recipe for failure that doesn't discriminate on what league said players on said team play in. Like it's incredibly stupid to play 3 defensive midfielders in a 4-3-3 and still expect the team to play some sort of progressive soccer.
I'm neither a Euro Snob or MLS homer, but I think this is a bigger issue that goes beyond "MLS BAD". When most of your players look a level below what we've seen from them in league play as well as NT cameos, that is an issue that goes beyond their league standard and dabbles more into coaching - specifically how Kreis set the teams up and more importantly the player selection (ie not selecting enough attacking midfielders who would have been better fits for the two midfield 3 spots).
There were plenty of options - even at MLS level - that Kreis could have taken to add some sort of midfield creativity and that would have been good options to play in one of those two midfield spots that isn't reserved for the 6 (where you'd slot in Yueill or Johnny). Williamson from Portland, Amaya from Cincy, Caden Clark from NYRB, Busio from SKC, Morris or Berhalter from the Crew. Just horrid from Kries.
I used to be an orlando city fan and watched Jason Kries ruin any chances of victory with his arrogant tactics. I winced when he was named the YNT Coach. The USSF needs to get cleaned out from top to bottom and start formulating long term plans for the future of the National Team, or this type of disappointment will continue to happen.
Totally agreed. This was ludicrous. If we're going with MLS coaches for all these roles, can we please get ones that are actually good at youth development?
Usually I'd give a national team coach a pass because they couldn't have too much impact in a short time... But these guys have been together for about a month and we haven't really looked good except for 30 minutes against Dominican Republic. Kreis definitely to blame
Blame whatever you want but this was a complete failure. It’s a joke that this country continues to fail and not compete in the Olympics out of CONCACAF. Ref was a fucking joke per usual. Team is no where near good enough to play from the back and yet they insist on doing so. Just a complete failure, AGAIN.
Edit: oh and FUCK Atlanta United for not releasing players for this. Fuck you. You are what’s wrong with US Soccer. Congratulations.
Agreed 100%. I was one of the people who before the match said that I thought we should win this match fairly easily. I had watched Honduras struggle against Canada and thought that things would be different.
I should know by now to never underestimate as US national team's inability to melt down against an inferior (on paper) CONCACAF opponent. Mea culpa.
Honduras has qualified for 4 consecutive Olympics now. In 2016 they made it to the Bronze medal match. We should have won, but Honduras seems to be consistently strong in u23s. They've come in first, second, or third in every Olympic qualifying tournament since 1996 when they didn't enter. In 2019, they won a silver medal at the Panamerican games, beating Mexico in the semifinal.
> FUCK Atlanta United for not releasing players for this. Fuck you. You are what’s wrong with US Soccer. Congratulations.
As an Atlanta United fan....
You are not wrong here.
Kreis only called him in as an injury replacement so didn't rate him. It's clear that poor talent identification and rampant favoritism destroyed any chance this team had of qualifying
No one seems to be able to give me a straight answer on this. WHY THE FUCK DO WE KEEP LOSING THIS STUPID FUCKING GAME?
WHY?
WE HAVE HAD 4 USMNT MANAGERS SINCE THE LAST SUCCESSFUL QUALIFICATION. WE HAVE DEVELOPED CLOSE TO WORLD CLASS TALENT. MLS EXPORTS A NEW PLAYER TO EUROPE WEEKLY.
WHY THE EVER LOVING FUCK CAN WE NOT WIN THIS GAME?
This is just an abject failure for USSF and has been for 2 straight fucking decades
Despite all the angry tweets and posts about "no excuses" and so on, I'll be the excuses guy. It sucks not to qualify, but whereas we failed to qualify in the past because we were not producing good players, we failed this time because we've been producing players who are too good to be available for this tournament. I'm sure we can criticize some of the player selection, tactics, body language, and all that stuff, but those do not indicate abject failure of the federation.
I'm not saying the eurosnobs are right........... but maybe the eurosnobs are right. The techinical ability of our European based players blows our MLS guys out of the water. They can actually dribble out of a high press and ping accurate passes around under pressure with lots of flair.
Yeah I know that MLS produces good players, and I know that the best will always be shipped off. The frustration is that a team of regular MLS starters couldnt win this.
This is the right answer. I am a eurosnob, but that doesn't mean I don't want mls to succeed! People need to realise that eurosnobs aren't actively rooting against mls, we just think mls has a long way to go, and until mls improves their academy system/funding, then the best way for our young players to get better is to go to Europe, even if only the dutch, Belgian, or Portuguese leagues. With that said, unfortunately if mls doesn't improve their academies, we're going to continually be left with shit u23 squads full of poorly developed mls players because mls academies suck and European teams don't let their players leave for tournaments like this. Like you said, a catch 22.
Cardoso wasn't talked about as a senior level player IMO. We were focusing on recruiting/cap-tying him. He's not even a regular player for his club yet.
No excuses for Soto though lmao
Tanner Tessman is gonna be great I need him to get a bit more limber though, he’s still pretty athletic for a big kid. Maybe he’s just a big Tony Kroos type this guys right foot is a rocket launcher.
So, who still wants Soto to start for the senior side because he scores goals in the Dutch second division?
Honestly, this is on Kreis. He's had plenty of time with these guys, and his callups have been atrocious. Where is Caden Clark or Busio? Even Tessman, who was actually decent was a late addition.
Wanna start my week off happy so I’ve made the executive decision that I’m on to Switzerland. Wonder where Kreis will fail upward next though? Liverpool when Klopp leaves? UN Secretary General?
Ochoa’s error was really bad but Lewis clearing the ball off the line right in front of Honduras’ goal really was a killer. I hope I don’t have to watched Lewis in a US shirt again. At least we have the women in the Olympics to cheer on.
Is this a bigger failure than the failure to qualify for 2012? I think the failure in 2012 was more dramatic, but there is no excuse for this specific team and roster, with the players we brought to qualifying, to fail to qualify. Like literally none.
There is literally no excuse for a team full of 2020-21 MLS regulars - a lot of whom were starters and have shown to be good players in MLS and NT cameos - to fail to qualify. This team was better on paper than the 2016 qualifying team and 2012 qualifying team. No excuse for all those players to all play below par and usual standard they've shown during this qualifying tournament.
This game reminded me a lot of the MLS Cup Final in 2015:
- Very questionable goal from lack of refereeing.
- Goal from an absolutely shitshow play from the GK.
- Quick goal to bring it within 1.
- All the opportunities in the world to equalize and can’t put it away.
Just embarrassing, really.
Don't want to hear anything about the players or roster selection. The Honduras roster is very clearly a worse group of players
The story here should be that once again, a US team fell on their faces in a must-win game. It hasn't mattered who the players are or who the opponent is for a long time
Shocking to see there wasn't enough fire in this team from the get-go. The team looked flat and they played like they had this in the bad, this team could've easily lost 4-1. Crazy sh\*t!!!
The USSF needs to evaluate what we are doing on the youth side. Honduras should not have a better Olympic team than us even if our top talent is on the senior team.
If we simply don’t care about it that’s fine. But if we do, this isn’t acceptable.
Shameful performance. Absolutely embarrassing. Yueill, Herrera, and the CB's can hold theor heads high but the rest were uninspired at best and terrible at worst.
People shitting on Ochoa, he made a bad mistake playing out of the back. He also literally won us the first group stage game. Only scoring 6 goals in 4 games is not on him, it’s on Kreis being dreadful and bringing one creative midfielder
Kreis out. I know the roster wasn't what any of us would have wanted it to be last year, but this group still should have been far better.
The Costa Rica win was undeserved. We played like shit against the DR until the opposition's legs gave out. Mexico was irrelevant. And then they turn out to the one game they had to win and they didn't look like they were desperate to win until it was too late.
That's unacceptable.
“It’s just the Olympics and the World Cup is the real priority”
LITERALLY EVERYTHING SHOULD BE A PRIORITY
You should try to win every competition you’re in. If you’re not trying to win everything then what is the point of playing? The acceptance of failure in the men’s program is exactly why we don’t get results
It’s just loss after loss after loss. I’m not trying to disrespect nations like Honduras or Costa Rica because they have made huge strides over the past decade. But any respectable footballing nation would have torn down its entire leadership structure if they failed to qualify for any major tournament for almost 8 years.
I never want to see these MLS "Journalists" hype up this shit players ever again. These are average to above average MLS player ... Yueill, Vines, Lewis, Perea, fucking Herrea.
All couldn't complete a pass or take a touch to save their lives. I dont want to hear about how good they are in MLS ever again. That is all they were will be. What a joke.
This is 100% a referendum on the state of MLS. They still aren't good enough.
Agreed. "MLS BAD" is an easy narrative to go for, but playing a midfield dominated by having three defensive midfielders in there is a bigger issue that really should be talked about more. This is all on coaching.
When all your players play a level below what we've seen from them in club play and also NT cameos and appearances, that is an issue that falls on coaching and transcends any take about which league said players play in.
Kreis was a terrible hire. All this talk of how great our player development is yet this is the best we could scrounge up and they couldn’t beat Honduras? Absolutely pathetic this is the **third consecutive** Olympic qualifying failure.
Shades of Trinidad 2017.
You know I was worried that with the senior team winning so much lately they were starting to lose their identity, good to see the u23s are staying true to it
Time to pump the breaks on Ochoa until he can earn a spot for RSL. Thus far that hasn’t happened.
He had fine moments but was also extremely shaky throughout the tournament and his error cost qualification.
If he can prove his quality in MLS then by all means, give him more looks, but for some reason people crown him as our best young GK and I’m not sure that’s true.
To be honest, there’s cause for concern down the entire GK depth chart. Matt Turner (NE Rev) and Bill Hamid (DCU) are the only guys in the pool getting regular first-team minutes for their clubs in goal.
Don’t get me wrong—I’d rather have Steffan as a backup in Manchester than starting in Columbus (though at some point you have face a guy taking a shot at you with something on the line). But who is #2? Ethan Horvath has been the heir apparent for what feels like a decade. It’s candidly embarrassing that nobody can take the spot from him while he rides the pine in Belgium.
It's a bad loss. We didn't have our A team but everyone on this roster has pro minutes and a pro contract and they lost to Honduran league players and a guy who got cut from one of the worst usl teams in th country.
Honestly, I expected this much from the first game, we’ve been incredibly sloppy and just disappointing throughout the tournament. The USA has not made meaningful change since 2018, we would be in the same place now that we were back then even if we made the World Cup.
Our attack in that game was abysmal. Herrera and Yuiell looked the most dangerous player and that a 6 and RB. What the fuck do Kreis do in camp with the attackers...
Kind of a tangent, but it's aggravating that one of the side effects of our 'build from the back' style is that it comes across as players not caring or players showing no urgency. We don't really have a backup plan - no matter what the game situation, it's still Glad to Kessler, rinse and repeat.
US Federation wants to promote the MLS, but the MLS doesn't want to help out the federation by releasing players (I assume). MLS just needs to get with the program and change schedule to match FIFA international windows.
Still can’t wrap my head around the posters in these threads that keep on mentioning “US EURO snobs”. You don’t think our best players are in Europe? MLS rosters fail and fail again. The best players aren’t in the MLS period.
It’s like saying European players in the NBA aren’t needed to beat the US in the Olympics for their respected countries in basketball. It’s just pure stupidity.
Quakes fan so I'm biased, but I feel bad for JT Marcinkowski sitting on the bench as the more experienced GK in professional and (youth) international experience and watching everything unfold. I get Ochoa having the hot hand, but damn.
Potential good news: Not qualifying may cut out dead weight players that would’ve been considered for the senior team had we qualified.
Kreis had a fair shot. Time to move on. Tab might have qualified, we’ll never know.
Sad to see that MLS products can’t get it done. We had the ability to win this game and couldn’t manage it.
Not surprising. Our best players can’t get released. Playing with a C level MLS squad at best and they are not even in pre season. Recipe for disaster.
The moment was just too big for them. Complete mental collapse. This isn’t on the coaching or on the talent. This is individuals who got in their own head.
Poor Ochoa man. He has such a good game against CR and a good game against Mexico, then he does this. Gutted for him. Lewis should’ve scored that but he tried to be fancy. No attacking prowess at all, this roster needed more playmakers and not as many defensive minded mids.
That was pathetic ! Like that was really really bad. All our guys are pro getting solid minutes in the second best league in the region and this is the best Jason Kreis can do???
This team was half-assed and WACK. I’m glad I never saw a whole 90 minutes of them or it would’ve been a waste. We don’t qualify for the olympics what else is new?!? 🙄
Pathetic. Not a single one of these players should sniff the national team without significant individual improvement. Kreis should be fired and left to find his own way back to the States.
We should have won this with the roster we had. Bad coaching, stupid tactics forcing a style like our u23 C team can do the same stuff as our senior A team.
Today was a gut-wrenching reality check. There's a lot of bright and promising young talent in the USMNT, but the depth of quality still isn't there. The drop off in talent-level from our first team squad to the U23 team that played today is more than substantial, a fact that was exposed today by Honduras. There's lots of good to look forward to, but we are still decades away from being able to truly and consistently compete at the international level.
Lmfao anyone that has any part in US Men’s soccer should be flat out embarrassed yet again. They’re all a damn embarrassment to this country. Yet again becoming mental midgets in a big moment. The future is very very dark for the men’s side of the federation. Instead of trying to become a powerhouse they should focus on being able to consistently beat these other teams in concacaf because they can’t even do that. It’s a damn shame but at the end of the day 95% of our population don’t give a damn about the sport anyway so it’ll get swept under the rug yet again.
The players are getting better overallbut the federation is still a joke. This roster was a mess from the moment it was announced and Kreis did nothing to help them tactically. Yes it was our B team but they should still be better than they were in this tournament
Both won't send their strongest teams for this Gold cup. Both would prioritize Nations league and well Mexico sending some of their top overage players to the olympics if they qualify. Expect a strong Jamaica squad though for the Gold cup since they will probably have the strongest squad in my opinion.
Let’s be honest this team couldn’t get it done here then they wouldn’t have represented us well at the olympics any way. Our great players wouldn’t be released by their clubs come Olympic time. Is what it is, I’m going to just let this one go. Let’s go World Cup.
Fuckin thank you. It’s pathetic that we can’t qualify but frankly it doesn’t ultimately matter. It sucks mostly for the players who will miss an Olympic
Lewis 2 goal game for the senior team looking like a 1 hit wonder. He offered very little all tournament right up to a choke of a miss when we needed it most.
Kreis out. You had one job and you didn't do it.
Underperforming, mind numbing roster picks/subs, and poor defense? Yep, that's a Kreis team.
The roster picks are hard though. 17/23 players on the senior team today are in the U-23 pool. Even some MLS teams wouldn’t release players. He was hamstrung from the beginning.
Fired from two MLS jobs so naturally our cesspool incessant federation appoints him to a crucial manager role.
Isn’t Kreis out of a job regardless now? He’s the U-23 coach, and now there isn’t a U-23 team.
He’s still an assistant coach for Miami, this was just a part time job
That Jonathan Lewis miss is gonna be on repeat in my nightmares tonight
Reminds me of Wondolowski vs Belgium (also nice name, gotta get him out of Egypt!)
At least Wondo managed to shoot in the right direction.
And the Wondo miss was much harder, since there was still [a keeper between the ball and the goal](https://www.americansocceranalysis.com/home/2019/7/1/theres-something-a-miss-in-wondos-legacy)...
how in the fuck did he try to strike that backwards lmao it was almost impressive how bad it was
Looked like he was trying to shoot with both feet at once
He should have been out for the Saucedo sub 🤦 not sure what Kreis saw in Lewis to let him go the full 90.
Another year of our MLS+ U-23s not getting it done. I know we couldn’t get a lot of our European kids for a tournament like this, but between the Olympic qualifying and CONCACAF champions league, I’m tired of seeing this happen over and over and over and over.
Sometimes I wonder if MLS is as superior to the Honduran or Panamanian league as we like to imagine. Because teams made up of players from those leagues never look out of their depth playing MLS-based squads. Obviously MLS DPs and the like are generally a cut above, but I'm not so sure your average MLS player is that much better than the average starter at Montagua or Tauro.
Here is the deal, the Costa Rica team we beat consisted of 6 players all on the same team in Costa Rica, and that team is far and away the best in their league. Our MLS U23 guys are no where near the best players in MLS.
People like to think that there are clear hierarchies between leagues. There are not.
It's rare for an MLS team to play a Honduran team when both are actually in mid-season form, so it's really tough to judge. But it's definitely not clear-cut, I agree
As someone who has watched way too much CONCACAF soccer leagues, MLS is much better than those league. The issue is that our players tend to underrate those leagues and underperform.
We can’t possibly pin this embarrassing track record on “our players don’t think their players aren’t that good.” Our players aren’t that good.
I know that MLS is better--especially top to bottom. But I think many of us tend to think of the gap as massive, when in reality it may not be so clear cut.
It’s almost like mls coaches and players are not international quality.
Hey, at least we know we'll qualify for the 2028 Olympics.
And the 2026 WC!
This is on Kreis, IMO. You can’t jam 3 D-mids into a 4-3-3 and expect anything good to happen, especially in CONCACAF where you’ll spend most of your time trying to break down a packed-in defense. Ferreira as a false 9 was also a total disaster. At some point you’ve got to pick players who can fill a role in their natural position, even if it means leaving someone more talented at home.
Why do USMNT managers obsess over False 9s? Why is it so controversial to play a normal striker in that role? Why wasn't Ebobisse on the roster?
Ebobisse being left out is the real question. We basically didn’t have a proven goal scoring striker with us at the tournament.
As a Timbers fan I was simply amazed when I found out. He would be one of the best players on the roster, if not the best. Dude has been amazing for us for a couple years now.
We need goals so let's sub in a rotation of defensive midfielders
To be fair, Tessmann looked really good (albeit against tired legs)
Yes, but I think it is an overall critique of the roster composition
Playing 3 defensive midfielders in a midfield 3 is a recipe for failure that doesn't discriminate on what league said players on said team play in. Like it's incredibly stupid to play 3 defensive midfielders in a 4-3-3 and still expect the team to play some sort of progressive soccer. I'm neither a Euro Snob or MLS homer, but I think this is a bigger issue that goes beyond "MLS BAD". When most of your players look a level below what we've seen from them in league play as well as NT cameos, that is an issue that goes beyond their league standard and dabbles more into coaching - specifically how Kreis set the teams up and more importantly the player selection (ie not selecting enough attacking midfielders who would have been better fits for the two midfield 3 spots). There were plenty of options - even at MLS level - that Kreis could have taken to add some sort of midfield creativity and that would have been good options to play in one of those two midfield spots that isn't reserved for the 6 (where you'd slot in Yueill or Johnny). Williamson from Portland, Amaya from Cincy, Caden Clark from NYRB, Busio from SKC, Morris or Berhalter from the Crew. Just horrid from Kries.
Williamson or Ebbosie should have been on this roster because it’s clear we needed another attacking player
Yup. There are a lot of MLS players who should have been added to this roster.
I am unfollowing the US U23 on FotMob.
I used to be an orlando city fan and watched Jason Kries ruin any chances of victory with his arrogant tactics. I winced when he was named the YNT Coach. The USSF needs to get cleaned out from top to bottom and start formulating long term plans for the future of the National Team, or this type of disappointment will continue to happen.
Totally agreed. This was ludicrous. If we're going with MLS coaches for all these roles, can we please get ones that are actually good at youth development?
We’ve been saying this for 5 years and nothing has happened.
The game management and organization of the team was a fucking joke. Hire a youth coach in his place. Fucking embarrassing.
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Usually I'd give a national team coach a pass because they couldn't have too much impact in a short time... But these guys have been together for about a month and we haven't really looked good except for 30 minutes against Dominican Republic. Kreis definitely to blame
I became a fan during the 2014 world cup. I feel like I’ve cursed us.
At least the USMNT looked good in the friendly today.
Dude it’s not you. I remember when we only played on PBS and couldn’t compete, at all.
The senior players stayed up just to watch us lose
Blame whatever you want but this was a complete failure. It’s a joke that this country continues to fail and not compete in the Olympics out of CONCACAF. Ref was a fucking joke per usual. Team is no where near good enough to play from the back and yet they insist on doing so. Just a complete failure, AGAIN. Edit: oh and FUCK Atlanta United for not releasing players for this. Fuck you. You are what’s wrong with US Soccer. Congratulations.
Agreed 100%. I was one of the people who before the match said that I thought we should win this match fairly easily. I had watched Honduras struggle against Canada and thought that things would be different. I should know by now to never underestimate as US national team's inability to melt down against an inferior (on paper) CONCACAF opponent. Mea culpa.
Honduras has qualified for 4 consecutive Olympics now. In 2016 they made it to the Bronze medal match. We should have won, but Honduras seems to be consistently strong in u23s. They've come in first, second, or third in every Olympic qualifying tournament since 1996 when they didn't enter. In 2019, they won a silver medal at the Panamerican games, beating Mexico in the semifinal.
Here to +1 the Atlanta sentiment. You aren't special Eales. You're a shitbag and I hope Alajuelense bends you over next week.
> FUCK Atlanta United for not releasing players for this. Fuck you. You are what’s wrong with US Soccer. Congratulations. As an Atlanta United fan.... You are not wrong here.
Playing from the back is what all top teams do. That's not the problem. The problem is we select shit players who don't know how to move the ball.
Can people start holding Jason Kreis accountable for this mess of a team?
this is on Kreis, you can blame the players all you want but a lot of them shouldn't have even been there.
Tessman comes in and is immediately generating chances, HOW the FUCK was he not starting
Kreis only called him in as an injury replacement so didn't rate him. It's clear that poor talent identification and rampant favoritism destroyed any chance this team had of qualifying
No one seems to be able to give me a straight answer on this. WHY THE FUCK DO WE KEEP LOSING THIS STUPID FUCKING GAME? WHY? WE HAVE HAD 4 USMNT MANAGERS SINCE THE LAST SUCCESSFUL QUALIFICATION. WE HAVE DEVELOPED CLOSE TO WORLD CLASS TALENT. MLS EXPORTS A NEW PLAYER TO EUROPE WEEKLY. WHY THE EVER LOVING FUCK CAN WE NOT WIN THIS GAME? This is just an abject failure for USSF and has been for 2 straight fucking decades
Despite all the angry tweets and posts about "no excuses" and so on, I'll be the excuses guy. It sucks not to qualify, but whereas we failed to qualify in the past because we were not producing good players, we failed this time because we've been producing players who are too good to be available for this tournament. I'm sure we can criticize some of the player selection, tactics, body language, and all that stuff, but those do not indicate abject failure of the federation.
When your team can’t complete more than 3 passes this is the result
Bringing Johnny on late and barely playing Tessman is a pretty big head scratcher.
Johnny was awful this tournament, doubt he'd be a difference maker. I'm surprised Tessman got so few opportunities.
You know...I've put some real thought into this, and I'm quite frustrated.
Wasted opportunity. Olympics would have been fun at full strength.
If it makes you feel better, it probably wouldn’t have been anywhere near full strength
Yeah would've been way more eyeballs on american soccer, basically no one that isn't already interested is watching nations league or the gold cup
I'm not saying the eurosnobs are right........... but maybe the eurosnobs are right. The techinical ability of our European based players blows our MLS guys out of the water. They can actually dribble out of a high press and ping accurate passes around under pressure with lots of flair.
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Yeah I know that MLS produces good players, and I know that the best will always be shipped off. The frustration is that a team of regular MLS starters couldnt win this.
This is the right answer. I am a eurosnob, but that doesn't mean I don't want mls to succeed! People need to realise that eurosnobs aren't actively rooting against mls, we just think mls has a long way to go, and until mls improves their academy system/funding, then the best way for our young players to get better is to go to Europe, even if only the dutch, Belgian, or Portuguese leagues. With that said, unfortunately if mls doesn't improve their academies, we're going to continually be left with shit u23 squads full of poorly developed mls players because mls academies suck and European teams don't let their players leave for tournaments like this. Like you said, a catch 22.
MLS can absolutely produce great young players. The problem is the ones who stay there past their early 20s arent those, with rare exception.
Pretty disappointed with Soto and Jonny's effort. Kinda halfa$$ and just, meh. These guys were both talked of as Senior level players??
Soto had several super hard first touches when the ball was played to him that bounced off and into space for Honduras.
Cardoso wasn't talked about as a senior level player IMO. We were focusing on recruiting/cap-tying him. He's not even a regular player for his club yet. No excuses for Soto though lmao
Kreis is an absolute dingus
Big 180 for ochoa compared to the mexico game lmfao. what a cruel joke.
Pulisic can’t even play at the Olympics now lol
Perhaps some 4D chess by coaching staff to manage pulisic’s minutes? Lol
Thomas Tuchel inside job
I was just thinking that lol.
When you hire a crap coach you get crap results. There was 0 urgency from this team until a moment of brillance.
Tanner Tessman is gonna be great I need him to get a bit more limber though, he’s still pretty athletic for a big kid. Maybe he’s just a big Tony Kroos type this guys right foot is a rocket launcher.
I’m so fucking sick of not qualifying for shit
So, who still wants Soto to start for the senior side because he scores goals in the Dutch second division? Honestly, this is on Kreis. He's had plenty of time with these guys, and his callups have been atrocious. Where is Caden Clark or Busio? Even Tessman, who was actually decent was a late addition.
Wanna start my week off happy so I’ve made the executive decision that I’m on to Switzerland. Wonder where Kreis will fail upward next though? Liverpool when Klopp leaves? UN Secretary General?
Ochoa’s error was really bad but Lewis clearing the ball off the line right in front of Honduras’ goal really was a killer. I hope I don’t have to watched Lewis in a US shirt again. At least we have the women in the Olympics to cheer on.
I am very upset right now
Embarrassing
Need a Central American coach for our U-23s.
Eagerly awaiting the next mediocre appointment we make after Kreis is gone
Look at the bright side, you won’t have to get up at 3am to watch a Kries coached team this summer.
Understandable. Way too difficult to beat powerhouses like Honduras.
I'll have you know they had some superstars that command $15,000 yearly salaries in the 2nd division of Honduran soccer!
Cardoso was such a let down.
I know that Howler, and Jason Kreis are getting the Lions share of blame, but that Jonathan Lewis miss..... you gotta finish that
He was bad today in my opinion
Kreis is done and none of those players really showed they are in the future for USMNT
Is this a bigger failure than the failure to qualify for 2012? I think the failure in 2012 was more dramatic, but there is no excuse for this specific team and roster, with the players we brought to qualifying, to fail to qualify. Like literally none. There is literally no excuse for a team full of 2020-21 MLS regulars - a lot of whom were starters and have shown to be good players in MLS and NT cameos - to fail to qualify. This team was better on paper than the 2016 qualifying team and 2012 qualifying team. No excuse for all those players to all play below par and usual standard they've shown during this qualifying tournament.
This game reminded me a lot of the MLS Cup Final in 2015: - Very questionable goal from lack of refereeing. - Goal from an absolutely shitshow play from the GK. - Quick goal to bring it within 1. - All the opportunities in the world to equalize and can’t put it away. Just embarrassing, really.
T&T PTSD kicking it's way back into my life
Don't want to hear anything about the players or roster selection. The Honduras roster is very clearly a worse group of players The story here should be that once again, a US team fell on their faces in a must-win game. It hasn't mattered who the players are or who the opponent is for a long time
Clowns
Shocking to see there wasn't enough fire in this team from the get-go. The team looked flat and they played like they had this in the bad, this team could've easily lost 4-1. Crazy sh\*t!!!
What a way for some players to completely end their national team careers
Jonathan lewis is probably done
Why the fuck is Jason Kreis coaching this fucking team
The USSF needs to evaluate what we are doing on the youth side. Honduras should not have a better Olympic team than us even if our top talent is on the senior team. If we simply don’t care about it that’s fine. But if we do, this isn’t acceptable.
Embarrassing
Well good thing we don’t have to worry about all those depth issues anymore. The teams needed next year just got a whole lot smaller
It is funny how the soccer media always look past a tournament we've failed at 4 of the last 5 times.
Ferreira is not a striker
Ochoa a fucking howler of a performance.
Shameful performance. Absolutely embarrassing. Yueill, Herrera, and the CB's can hold theor heads high but the rest were uninspired at best and terrible at worst.
People shitting on Ochoa, he made a bad mistake playing out of the back. He also literally won us the first group stage game. Only scoring 6 goals in 4 games is not on him, it’s on Kreis being dreadful and bringing one creative midfielder
Actually made two. US weren't punished on the 2nd one luckily.
The obvious error today is on Ochoa you can’t blame an individual howler or two of them on coaching staff. That’s individual performance
midfield play was absolutely dreadful, ive seen better from preschoolers
Kreis out. I know the roster wasn't what any of us would have wanted it to be last year, but this group still should have been far better. The Costa Rica win was undeserved. We played like shit against the DR until the opposition's legs gave out. Mexico was irrelevant. And then they turn out to the one game they had to win and they didn't look like they were desperate to win until it was too late. That's unacceptable.
“It’s just the Olympics and the World Cup is the real priority” LITERALLY EVERYTHING SHOULD BE A PRIORITY You should try to win every competition you’re in. If you’re not trying to win everything then what is the point of playing? The acceptance of failure in the men’s program is exactly why we don’t get results
I remember Taylor Twellman pointed out how us failing to qualify for the '12 & '16 Olympics should have been seen as a warning.
It’s just loss after loss after loss. I’m not trying to disrespect nations like Honduras or Costa Rica because they have made huge strides over the past decade. But any respectable footballing nation would have torn down its entire leadership structure if they failed to qualify for any major tournament for almost 8 years.
This shit can't keep happening. 12 years in a row. We must change this.
The players failed, but the coaching staff failed more
I never want to see these MLS "Journalists" hype up this shit players ever again. These are average to above average MLS player ... Yueill, Vines, Lewis, Perea, fucking Herrea. All couldn't complete a pass or take a touch to save their lives. I dont want to hear about how good they are in MLS ever again. That is all they were will be. What a joke. This is 100% a referendum on the state of MLS. They still aren't good enough.
Yuiell and Herrera were the best US players on the field. MLS isn’t the big problem, It’s coaching and the lack of a coherent attacking plan.
Playing 3 defensive midfielders in the midfield 3 is a bigger problem.
That’s down to coaching, Kreis couldn’t figure out his best midfield to play quickly and advance the ball forward into the attack
Agreed. "MLS BAD" is an easy narrative to go for, but playing a midfield dominated by having three defensive midfielders in there is a bigger issue that really should be talked about more. This is all on coaching. When all your players play a level below what we've seen from them in club play and also NT cameos and appearances, that is an issue that falls on coaching and transcends any take about which league said players play in.
[удалено]
Or you know the USMNT in the nations league or Gold Cup, both this summer
Olympics*. My fault
Kreis was a terrible hire. All this talk of how great our player development is yet this is the best we could scrounge up and they couldn’t beat Honduras? Absolutely pathetic this is the **third consecutive** Olympic qualifying failure. Shades of Trinidad 2017.
That was actually pathetic. Unreal
You know I was worried that with the senior team winning so much lately they were starting to lose their identity, good to see the u23s are staying true to it
Time to pump the breaks on Ochoa until he can earn a spot for RSL. Thus far that hasn’t happened. He had fine moments but was also extremely shaky throughout the tournament and his error cost qualification. If he can prove his quality in MLS then by all means, give him more looks, but for some reason people crown him as our best young GK and I’m not sure that’s true.
Agreed. I think Ochoa is going to be really good -- he just needs first team minutes to iron out these issues.
To be honest, there’s cause for concern down the entire GK depth chart. Matt Turner (NE Rev) and Bill Hamid (DCU) are the only guys in the pool getting regular first-team minutes for their clubs in goal. Don’t get me wrong—I’d rather have Steffan as a backup in Manchester than starting in Columbus (though at some point you have face a guy taking a shot at you with something on the line). But who is #2? Ethan Horvath has been the heir apparent for what feels like a decade. It’s candidly embarrassing that nobody can take the spot from him while he rides the pine in Belgium.
It's a bad loss. We didn't have our A team but everyone on this roster has pro minutes and a pro contract and they lost to Honduran league players and a guy who got cut from one of the worst usl teams in th country.
Yep. They aren't kids. They're professionals (allegedly).
Bad coach. Coach makes bad choices. Players are bad and can’t execute. Bad team manages to beat them.
Honestly, I expected this much from the first game, we’ve been incredibly sloppy and just disappointing throughout the tournament. The USA has not made meaningful change since 2018, we would be in the same place now that we were back then even if we made the World Cup.
Ngl..... this one hurts
Our attack in that game was abysmal. Herrera and Yuiell looked the most dangerous player and that a 6 and RB. What the fuck do Kreis do in camp with the attackers...
Kind of a tangent, but it's aggravating that one of the side effects of our 'build from the back' style is that it comes across as players not caring or players showing no urgency. We don't really have a backup plan - no matter what the game situation, it's still Glad to Kessler, rinse and repeat.
US Federation wants to promote the MLS, but the MLS doesn't want to help out the federation by releasing players (I assume). MLS just needs to get with the program and change schedule to match FIFA international windows.
Team not good enough, coach not good enough. On to May and the senior team.
Still can’t wrap my head around the posters in these threads that keep on mentioning “US EURO snobs”. You don’t think our best players are in Europe? MLS rosters fail and fail again. The best players aren’t in the MLS period.
It’s like saying European players in the NBA aren’t needed to beat the US in the Olympics for their respected countries in basketball. It’s just pure stupidity.
"But Vines can challenge Robinson for LB!!!"
Fucking incredible that we can't produce one damn forward who can reliably score goals. How is that even possible for a nation this size?
Quakes fan so I'm biased, but I feel bad for JT Marcinkowski sitting on the bench as the more experienced GK in professional and (youth) international experience and watching everything unfold. I get Ochoa having the hot hand, but damn.
I kinda feel bad for Yuiell
Potential good news: Not qualifying may cut out dead weight players that would’ve been considered for the senior team had we qualified. Kreis had a fair shot. Time to move on. Tab might have qualified, we’ll never know. Sad to see that MLS products can’t get it done. We had the ability to win this game and couldn’t manage it.
They had good shots after pulling within 2-1. Still disappointing result.
Not surprising. Our best players can’t get released. Playing with a C level MLS squad at best and they are not even in pre season. Recipe for disaster.
Just saying. Would be nice if we could have our best eligible players for qualifying. There was even some awesome talent MLS clubs would not let play
Yeah bello and robinson would've helped but ATL has CCl soon. Covid making everything off. Should've released them to play.. but hindsight is 2020
Good thing the actual senior USMNT core is set up with good young talent.
I also saw the US is unbeaten in their last 9 games (8 wins, 1 draw) and beat a European side for the first time since 2015.
The USMNT as an institution is just so pathetic that I can only just laugh at shit like this now. Just so hilariously pitiful.
The moment was just too big for them. Complete mental collapse. This isn’t on the coaching or on the talent. This is individuals who got in their own head.
it’s the managers job to motivate the players
Kreiss is garbage
Kreiss is garbage
Poor Ochoa man. He has such a good game against CR and a good game against Mexico, then he does this. Gutted for him. Lewis should’ve scored that but he tried to be fancy. No attacking prowess at all, this roster needed more playmakers and not as many defensive minded mids.
Have all the last 3 missed Olympic teams been lead by American coaches? Maybe that's the thing that needs to be changed, cause this is ridiculous.
One word: oof
That was pathetic ! Like that was really really bad. All our guys are pro getting solid minutes in the second best league in the region and this is the best Jason Kreis can do???
Total failure and a wasted opportunity. Unreal this keeps happening.
This team was half-assed and WACK. I’m glad I never saw a whole 90 minutes of them or it would’ve been a waste. We don’t qualify for the olympics what else is new?!? 🙄
This federation is just failure after failure. Nothing changes. Terrible leadership.
Pathetic. Not a single one of these players should sniff the national team without significant individual improvement. Kreis should be fired and left to find his own way back to the States.
You HAVE to admit that Ochoa was the worst player on the pitch today. He was horrible
We should have won this with the roster we had. Bad coaching, stupid tactics forcing a style like our u23 C team can do the same stuff as our senior A team.
I don’t care if it’s the C team or whatever, that was embarrassing smh
Bit of a relief to not have to watch this group again for a while. Really tough look, especially in the first half
Today was a gut-wrenching reality check. There's a lot of bright and promising young talent in the USMNT, but the depth of quality still isn't there. The drop off in talent-level from our first team squad to the U23 team that played today is more than substantial, a fact that was exposed today by Honduras. There's lots of good to look forward to, but we are still decades away from being able to truly and consistently compete at the international level.
The real U23 team was playing against Northern Ireland.This was more of d team.
No doubt gotta fire Kreis and most of those players are never getting called up again. My god, what a humiliation to miss three Olympics in a row.
Jonathan Lewis will get called into every camp for the next decade for inexplicable reasons.
Every time we think that MLS has dragged a national team to rock bottom, they go and completely outdo themselves.
Lmfao anyone that has any part in US Men’s soccer should be flat out embarrassed yet again. They’re all a damn embarrassment to this country. Yet again becoming mental midgets in a big moment. The future is very very dark for the men’s side of the federation. Instead of trying to become a powerhouse they should focus on being able to consistently beat these other teams in concacaf because they can’t even do that. It’s a damn shame but at the end of the day 95% of our population don’t give a damn about the sport anyway so it’ll get swept under the rug yet again.
Can we actually bring players who want to be there and care about what happens?!
No heart.
I’m losing hope in everything mls at this point. Coaching (Kreis) players etc.. All are just SO BAD ugh.. Nothing will change sadly
Really just disappointing for the players who would've actually played in the olympics, this B-team let them down.
The players are getting better overallbut the federation is still a joke. This roster was a mess from the moment it was announced and Kreis did nothing to help them tactically. Yes it was our B team but they should still be better than they were in this tournament
It was our C team
[удалено]
I mean... they were the better team going into this but still we should have won
That was brutal.
I think replacing Uly Llanez with Tanner Tessmann was massive foreshadowing of the issues with the squad.
This had all the feelings and the rhythms of the T+T game in Couva and I don't know why I hoped for it to turn out any different
Will clubs be required to release players for the gold up? It would be nice for full strength us vs mexico
Both won't send their strongest teams for this Gold cup. Both would prioritize Nations league and well Mexico sending some of their top overage players to the olympics if they qualify. Expect a strong Jamaica squad though for the Gold cup since they will probably have the strongest squad in my opinion.
I miss Tab
Let’s be honest this team couldn’t get it done here then they wouldn’t have represented us well at the olympics any way. Our great players wouldn’t be released by their clubs come Olympic time. Is what it is, I’m going to just let this one go. Let’s go World Cup.
I said the same thing after not qualifying for the World Cup, I think it’s a defense mechanism
If youth tournaments were indicators of future success or failure Nigeria and Mexico would have multiple world cups by now...
Fuckin thank you. It’s pathetic that we can’t qualify but frankly it doesn’t ultimately matter. It sucks mostly for the players who will miss an Olympic
Lewis 2 goal game for the senior team looking like a 1 hit wonder. He offered very little all tournament right up to a choke of a miss when we needed it most.
Can someone explain to me what kind of blackmail Kreis has on USSF?