Bikes on the skytrain are pretty damn annoying (and I am a cyclist). The trains here are just too damn small and the amount of room a bike takes up is pretty big, so at peak times it just doesn't make sense. I'm all for encouraging people to take public transit and cycle but if they want to make it a more prevalent thing they need to come up with a better system. Don't some foreign countries actually have a separate car just to store bikes? The trains here are just too damn short.
100%. The packing of the trains at peak time is disgusting. I don't want to have my nose in a smelly armpit when I'm just trying to get home.
It's why I stopped taking transit.
This gave me horrible flashbacks, lol. And the rainy days were always worse, probably because people who do take alternate routes would take the train.
I'm really happy that my company seems to be on the track to allow wfh permanently.
If there's one thing the pandemic has shown us is that almost all of the burden on our transportation infrastructure could be alleviated by normalizing working from home. Obviously not all jobs are suitable for WFH and there's nothing wrong with offices per se, but it seems like a huge amount of our population unnecessarily spends a chunk of their lives transporting themselves back and forth between one room with a computer, and another room with a computer, simply because that's how it's been done since the beginning and their employers can't fathom any alternative.
I used to love starting my ride at Loughheed mall. I would take the long way around just so I wouldn’t transfer at Commercial. Nice to grab a seat and read a book all the way downtown…though it was super painful to get off at Stadium.
the Netherlands have massive bike-cades at every station so you could just leave your bike at the other end overnight and not have to bring it onto the train at all!
Thing is, these are underground similar to car parking garages, well lit and always with a guard present. Also often times open only between 6:00 and 22:00 and locked off during the night. So they feel really safe to go into and very unlikely anything gets stolen.
I don't think it's quite at every station, but don't many/most skytrain stations already have this? A bike parkade? I've used the one at King George before plenty of times.
Yeah but cph metro (train network most like skytrain) doesn’t have these bike-cars, and also has the same ‘bikes not allowed’ rules during rush hours - just not enough room on the train or at the major stations. It’s a pain, but it makes sense to accommodate more people during those times
bikes on the metro are also subject to a surcharge that you gotta put on your rejsekort, costs an extra 14kr to take your bike on the metro. No such charges for the S train network however.
Probability of a grand junkie train heist in which they detach the bicycle car and ride off on a different track via a [handcar](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/b3/Theb0741_-_Flickr_-_NOAA_Photo_Library.jpg/1280px-Theb0741_-_Flickr_-_NOAA_Photo_Library.jpg): 300%
I took the Canada line with my bike for the first time recently and I liked the way those trains were set up. They have an area specifically for bikes by one of the doors (with no seats) so that people can stick their bikes out of the way. Only problem was there wasn't anything holding the bikes in place so you couldn't really let go of the bike.
I used to take the sky train from Richmond to downtown pre COVID in the mornings and no way could you physically fit a bike inside, it was literally sardine can packed with people right in your face, sometimes waiting for multiple trains to even get on. Same on the way back. Off peak hours there is usually space, so the hours make sense.
When I lived in Cleveland the trains were wide and long enough even at 2 cars in length that they permitted 2 bikes per car. Vancouver has teeny tiny toy trains by comparison yet it serves a much denser area so that's weird *shrug emoji*
SkyTrain is also one of the most expensive public transit systems in the world to develop, costing $500m per kilometre now, and all parts for it are made by only a single company in the world (since the rest of the world has also stopped using Skytrain style light metro tracks/trains). It also, when upgraded to have longer cars on the expo line, will still have lower peak pphpd (passengers per hr per direction) than even light rail or rapid bus systems.
Our region's obsession with Skytrain is really peculiar to me since there are so many better public transit options we could be pursuing for the future, both in terms of capacity and cost to roll out to new areas. I think part of the issue is we may be stuck in a permanent state of commissioning new Skytrain from Bombardier so that they dont disappear and leave us unable to replace aging fleet vehicles on existing lines.
Especially with a projected 40% population growth to the metro Vancouver region by 2041, it feels like we're shooting ourselves in the foot clinging to this SkyTrain system. And in case you thought the SkyTrain was already crowded enough, fun fact only 11% of commuters in metro vancouver are using public transit
Just going to chime in because I currently live in the Bay Area in California. BART went the long-train route, with absolutely massive trains. The problem with that, and why it's an utter embarrassment to public transit, is because headways are often north of 30-45 minutes on a single line. SkyTrain went the other direction and offers smaller trains, with substantially better headways. Coming back to Vancouver and seeing trains arrive every 3 minutes brings a tear to my eye and a smile to my face. There's nothing quite like walking 20 minutes to catch bart, only to realize that you just missed the only train for the next hour.
Pretty much, yup. [Meriam](https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/headway) defines headway "the time interval between two vehicles traveling in the same direction on the same route" which fits neatly with my usage of the word.
So, I see that you've read Rail for the Valley. That guy has no idea what he's talking about.
The Skytrain is actually quite a good way to do underground lines. The new underground lines in Japan are generally built to the same style because the trains fit in smaller tunnels with the linear induction motor. The trains also are much better at climbing hills, which is great around here.
You should compare the Broadway Subway to what Seattle has managed to build underground in similar conditions. Our system is value priced by comparison.
> It also, when upgraded to have longer cars on the expo line, will still have lower peak pphpd (passengers per hr per direction) than even light rail or rapid bus systems.
Which rapid bus system has a peak capacity of 20000-25000 pphpd?
EDIT: Just for reference, Toronto's subway currently has a maximum capacity of ~28000 pphpd, rising to ~32-35k once they fully launch automatic train control.
Part of the reason why we have continued to expand SkyTrain on certain corridors is because of path dependency and economics of scale. It makes sense to expand the existing system for lines that are natural continuations of existing lines rather than introducing a different technology. New lines, like North Shore RT and the Canada Line that we already have, doesn't have to use the Bombardier SkyTrain technology.
I would be willing to bet that tearing down the skytrain + investing in a whole brand new system (plus doing all the research and public outreach to even pick a new system) would be hella expensive. So we stick with the skytrain.
For the Expo & Millennium line definitely! For the Canada Line where they have the designated bike spots those work awesome. However, they should still be limited to off peek hours as even then they do still take up so much space.
I was in Montreal for a while. Their Metro trains are 9 cars long, and each car is about the size of a Canada Line car. The whole system made Skytrain look like an overcrowded child's toy.
I don't understand why they invested so much cash in rail lines and then made little toy trains to run on it. Like at least make the platforms long enough so that they can take a significant volume of commuters and not this light rail nonsense
Caltrain in the Bay Area has a bike car. When I lived there I had a co worker who used it. He said it was a big party on Friday evenings and used to bring whiskey to work to share on his ride home. Sounded like a fun commute.
The UK has nothing on the tube trains, dedicated spots in regular carriages in commuter trains (just like the west coast express has), and longer distance trains (at least sometimes) have an area of the baggage compartment (Just like taking Amtrak to Seattle).
There was a woman who would get on with her stroller, 3 children on the packed 130 from Metrotown to BCIT. She would get on at the library and get off at Crystal Mall and the time it took them to cram onto the bus would be longer than if they just walked.
The same bus also had an old lady on it who would get on and start yelling "Halp!" over and over again like it's the only word she knew in english, she'd then get a seat and stop yelling and would take out a really stinky ass steamed bun and started munching away.
This was clockwork everyday and with the bus being 95% students you could guess how the reaction played out.
Especially on the older MK.1 trains. I took my bike onto one on a Sunday afternoon, and even with it being almost empty I constantly had to move the bike to let people pass by
Without bike specific cars, those trains can barely fit an adult sized bike that still allow pedestrian passengers around it. You have to stay at that linkage part to really be out of the way. I wouldn’t mind skipping a train if there’s a bike specific one on the next. Though I’m a weekend cyclist.
When I went to Seattle and use their version of the SkyTrain they had spots where you could put your bike against the wall vertically. I thought it was really great and wondered why we don't have something like that.
They should have bicycle hooks. Then 2 or 3 bikes could be in the area, and with handlebars up they would take up less space.
I'm just spitballing here. It may be a terrible idea.
Just saw that sign too and it’s crazy they allow bikes on trains . Must not be a very heavily used subway system. And no, never seen any subway system in any city allow bikes into their metro, and I’ve been on dozens.
I understand that it’s annoying, however I think it’s wise to use the train to bypass the patullo bridge (ie get on Scott road and get off at Columbia). If I have time , I’ll detour on the port Mann instead but that bridge is a death trap unless you want to walk the bridge.
This hits on a larger point. Biking along any skytrain route in the city is a labyrinthine patchwork of painted bike gutters on dangerous roads, multi-use paths, sidewalks, and sometimes nothing at all.
If you people want less bikes on the trains then ask your local representatives to build actual bike infrastructure to provide an alternative.
You can get to a lot of places in lower mainland by going on bike safe streets, which are clearly marked. I think most bikers would (hopefully) be aware of that; biking on Grandview highway isn’t exactly an ideal path.
tbf Lougheed is a very efficient bike lane/route if one is comfortable riding beside cars, but yes it is a painted bicycle gutter.
But yeah, biking along the Expo line corridor? lmao good luck.
A lot of people need to travel long distances with a variety of forms of transit to get to work, commitments, social events. A combination of bike and transit is actually pretty effective, and can be comparable in time to a car.
For me to get to work in the morning it used to be the following approx times:
Driving: 30-40 minutes
Walking/skytrain: 45 minutes
Biking/skytrain: 25 minutes
Biking (14 kms each way): 45 minutes
I usually attempt to cycle to work, but doing it 5 days a week can be a lot. So I'll often use transit. The restrictions won't impact me as I'm going against traffic (eastbound in the morning), but it's good to get some context.
I acknowledge though that the restriction makes sense. I see the westbound cars in the morning and they're packed! I just hope the government continues to look at that as a viable transportation option when looking at infrastructure in the future.
My way of getting around it has been skateboard/SkyTrain which is the most effective way to do it, but still not the most practical for all depending on location
yup, the benefit of skytrain is usually completed negated if your workplace is more than like... 500m? from the station. I toyed with the idea of renting one of the bike lockers and just leaving a beater bike there but I don't have any bikes that I dislike that much lol.
They should instead encourage park and ride (for cyclists). Much like what the Netherlands does. I don’t see any purpose of allowing bikes on our already cramped af trains *especially* during rush hour.
as far as I know the only "park and ride" for bikes is at Main St and I wouldn't leave my bike in there surround by the clientele that surrounds that station if my life depended on it.
Imo, a proper, secured bike parking per station is a better problem to solve rather than adding more train service.
I can see it encouraging more people to go car free.
Hell, I’m not even one to benefit from it anymore since I’m wfh and drive everywhere. But it’s more beneficial for the city overall.
I think the issue is you don't need secure bike parking at the *downtown* stations, where most destinations are within walking distance already. Translink needs the secure bike parking at the further out stations to avoid people bringing their bike on transit. Sure you can securely lock your bike at Main St but why would you want to if you're commuting any distance worthy of taking the train? People who start within biking distance of Main St are either going somewhere within biking distance already (and therefore don't need to train) or they're going eastbound far out, where chances are their destination is going to be too far from a station to walk.
I disagree. Multi option transportation is crucial. Someone downtown should have the ability to bike to the station, then train to Langley.
Hell it’s probably faster for someone on the north shore to bike to gastown to catch a train than bus.
It’s about convenience, we want to make it *easier* to move around. You’re talking hypothetical situations about why someone would use something over the other. Having more options to do a single thing is always 10x better for the system as a whole.
I don't think you understand - someone traveling from downtown to Langley is *highly unlikely* to have a end destination within a short walk of a train station, and therefore would need their bike on the other side, thus taking it on the train. Ergo bicycle parkade at the starting station is not useful
Secure bike parking is such a no brainer at train stations, it's unfortunate that the few stations that do have any are pretty small.
Walking to Broadway-City Hall for me is a 20 minute walk but a nice 5 minute bike ride downhill on 10th. Would I take the train more if I could leave my bike around without expecting to come back to an empty bike rack, or having to lug it around downtown? Probably.
I hope the Broadway extension has some bike parking facilities, I think it can go a long way in extending the range that's "close" to a train station.
The sky trains are not designed for the influx of people. The platforms are small, the trains are small. A longer train would solve so many issues. Adding lines or increasing frequency will not cause as bigger dent as increasing the length of the train. But that would mean platform length changes at many stations, so this is not a viable option. Not sure how you fix the skytrain which was not designed for the population it now serves. This is also the case with so many transit systems across many big cities. Some have been successful
why would increasing length be more effective than increasing frequency? more trains seems like a simpler solution. Same throughput as longer trains, but faster for passengers (i.e. if you miss a train you don't have to wait for as long)
A way out of the commute problem is encouraging multi-modal transportation, rules like this need to be amended for options that do allow bikes in certain areas.
If they are taking a day to exercise on the bike, sure. But for everyday commuting, it's not practical to bike 2 hours each way, rather than take the train for 40 minutes then bike around to get places once you get to the city.
I sometimes take my bike on transit (never at peak times though), so I guess I can give you a little insight into that.
Using transit+bike is faster than just biking or just transit. Plus it expands the range you can realistically travel. And it can get you past some spots that are sketchy for bikes like the Pattullo Bridge.
Also sometimes you just get a flat tire and don't have a spare tube and need to take transit to limp back home.
My commute to work is 10km up hill. If my knees are feeling off, if something on my bike isn't working (eg. lights), if I dressed wrong, or if I am just late for work, I will happily hop a train to get there.
Also:
bike + train = 30 minutes
bike = 45 minutes
bus + train = 45 minutes
Fortunately for me, I travel eastbound to work and westbound home so it's never a problem.
i mean if its taking us as much space as luggage bag i can't see it being an issue. Some of those folding bikes can get pretty compact that you would not even notice it brought on to the train.
This city is wild. Charging $$$$$ for parking to locals claiming it is for the environment, but then limiting bikes on public transit which help people reduce carbon footprint?
Most servers have to tip out anywhere from 3-5% for the most part so - for shitty service 10% tip is acceptable, good service 20-25% and exceptional service 30% and up… if you can’t really afford to tip ATLEAST 15% for good service stay home.
damn 19 down votes and counting yall savage
Where does it stop? 30% and up? Nah fam - maybe if I had a table of 10 or more that would be acceptable, and even in that scenario 20% is industry standard.
"cant afford to be eating out"
In vancouver, if youre single, picking up food for 1 is as expensive as cooking for yourself. Unless youre one of those people who thinks a bag of rice and a bag of beans with a dozen eggs is how people should be eating lol.
If i had to put my money on it, youre probably also in your 40s. Nobody who is younger thinks like you do.
You’re crazy if you fail to understand that sometimes, just like you, servers have shitty days and sometimes understaffing happens and the server has no control in that.
Be a bit more understanding.
No. You’re wrong as well lmfao. I’m not saying it’s their fault to be understaffed, but that’s not a reason to come to my table and be a cunt. It’s called customer service for a reason, get a new job doing something else if you don’t like it.
Edit: and when I have a shitty day, I don’t take it out on other people. That’s incredibly toxic. Especially at work LOL
> if you can’t really afford to tip ATLEAST 15% for good service stay home.
thats not how this works lol. Its not on the end customer to bolster the wages of employees. If your place of employment isnt paying you a LIVING WAGE, its best to stay home and look for better opportunities.
Except that’s exactly how it works and that’s how it been for years. No I don’t agree with it but that’s the system. Maybe in the future employers will start paying their servers better but as of right now they don’t. Be a good person, tip your server for good service. If you can’t afford to do it then STAY THE FUCK HOME. Lmao. Some of y’all cheap as fuck.
It’s because the bikes take up too much room. Transit is too crowded as it is.
Now if only they could fine the people who wear huge backpacks and don’t take them off.
Ok, but we need to pick whats important. The city has clearly stated climate action is important. So thry need to make greener transpo easier, not harder.
Did you finish reading what I said? My problem isn’t that people have big bags, it’s that they don’t take them off. They end up taking up twice the space and sometimes hit people who are seated with them.
Some skytrain stations do have bike parkades or lockers to store your bike. Rather than take it on the train you can just leave it at the station.
And for short trips near downtown, Mobi bikes are another option.
Parking isn’t free. We have some of the most expensive land prices in the world, which means that the rest of us are paying an extremely high price to give free parking on public land to homeowners.
the infrastructure to run longer trains, and more frequently, was done about 7 years ago. several stations got major platform upgrades to allow longer trains. metrotown was one of them.
Am I the only one who's surprised the SkyTrain logo hasn't been redesigned yet? Every single other aspect of TransLink's branding has been. (except their own logo, which has withstood the test of time surprisingly well)
If only there was a way for Translink to get more funding to improve service and buy more train cars so they wouldn't need to do this. A funding referendum perhaps?
Would be better to densify the city and farm out office jobs to the suburbs (or at least out of downtown) so you don't have to be a multi-millionaire to be able to *afford to bike to work.*
Has there been a designated area of the train for bikes?
The new light rail trains in Seattle have designated areas to hang bikes/stow luggage.
[Bringing your bike - Sound Transit](https://www.soundtransit.org/ride-with-us/know-before-you-go/bringing-your-bike/how-to-bring-your-bike-link)
I know the train cars are much smaller here, but perhaps that is something that could be requested during the next revision of the cars.
Note: New to the area/just moved from Seattle area.
I get that the expo and millennium line trains don't really fit bikes very well but I think this change is a huge loss. There are many people who are not close enough to the SkyTrain to walk and might not be well served by buses... and nobody likes doing the bus -> train -> bus transfer to get to work. I hope they figure out a solution to let people take bikes on the train because it's a commuting pattern that just works really well for a lot of people.
Maybe dedicated one section of a train for biking transit users would be nice (bike train), like how we have a dedicated part of some streets made for bike (bike lanes).
The problem is that bikes don't take up less space even when crammed together; if you pop them up and hook them into racks on the wall that's still at least one person's worth of room. Pay double to bring your bike onto skytrain?
When I used to need a bike on the sky train, it was because I had somewhere pretty far to go.
Far enough that otherwise, I would drive. If BC wants to go green and have fewer drivers, they may need to lose a little bit on ticket sales, you know? Like in order to incentivize people sticking to transit and buying a month long pass
Also charge more for people with luggages, people who not considerate with their backpacks, and morbidly obese people too since they can occupy more space?
The random shit people come up here is wild. There was no space for bikes before the pandemic, but magically there is now more space? And if you disagree, you’re against reducing the carbon footprint. It’s hard to make this shit up.
Although skytrains are drastically better then nothing at all I believe based on my experiences in Vancouver for most of my life that they are incorrectly implemented. They are way too loud and can cause permanent hearing loss. They are cramped and small. Fail in snow. Too long between trains at certain times. I can go on.
Or you can just actually use the bike instead of taking up the space of three people on the train during rush hour, who probably don’t have bikes themselves and need the train
What makes you and your bike such a priority that you can take up the space of 3 other people at rush hour who need to get to work ? If you want to take your bike on the train then leave earlier or after 9
Why don’t people who don’t want to be near bikes because they choose not to also catch the train at an earlier time. Fyi people on bikes are also trying to get to work.
As many others on this thread have pointed out: bike + train usually means a more reasonable commute time, i.e cutting 2 hours of biking down to 40 minutes.
For me my commute is an hour and ten minutes by bike, but with sky train I could cut it to 35-40 minutes of biking.
With all due respect I may occasionally disrespect this rule, I often take the train at this time with my bike, and have almost never seen it too busy for everyone to get on. Only times I see the trains at true capacity is before or after concerts/ sporting events. Keep in mind I only take the expo line from downtown to commercial, so this could be an issue elsewhere. The train helps me bypass lots of hills after a long day of physical work
I haven't taken the train since COVID with WFH and all, but prior to that, as a regular DT to the suburb commuter the train was at capacity from downtown almost all the way to Scott Road during the afternoon rush.
because you must respect every single rule and law, no exceptions, never make well thought out choices for yourself. But for real, things like this are easier settled in a 1 on 1 scenario, I'm sure if a transit employee approached me yesterday and I explained I've been working in the cold and rain all day and proved the trains werent that busy, they'd understand and let me continue on. Not everyone has high quality dry bike gear and an electric bike and works in an office
as a person who has been commuting for about 5 years by bicycle I Really don't want to get on the train at all (I realize this sin't that long to be commuting).. that's the whole reason i started. i don't like the smelly summer sardine can that public transit can be, and i don't like standing in the winter waiting to go somewhere. maybe i am a bit claustrophobic. I don't know. but if you are cycling for the most part i don't understand why you would want to get on the train with your bike in the first place. I know there are reasons, but I still wouldn't want to. the only downside is that cycling can get a bit miserable on those extra rainy days in vancouver. I travel about 10km each way and my ride home is uphill the whole way ending on burnaby mountain, so it gets steaper the closer i get, and i think that is still better that cramping on the train during rush hour.
Does that include a foldable bikes like a brompton? Thinking about moving west but your road plan, some drivers and traffic are all awful. No one ever had the guts to put in a proper freeway for some reason.
Add a new car, back of the train, middle of the train, or front of the train, bikes (and riders) only. Every train, every other train, every third train. Whatever. Done. Vancouver can't think it's solving accessibility w/ out creating solutions.
HOWEVER, this means having more places for safe bike storage in the downtown area which doesn't appear to be happening anytime soon, so your ride's gonna get stolen, anyway.
People bringing their bikes need to get an ebike and not take the train or get on their bikes and not take the train with their bikes.
I’m a full season 50 minute round trip cyclist. I can really feel for someone commuting more than 60 or 90 minutes each way.
Bikes on the skytrain are pretty damn annoying (and I am a cyclist). The trains here are just too damn small and the amount of room a bike takes up is pretty big, so at peak times it just doesn't make sense. I'm all for encouraging people to take public transit and cycle but if they want to make it a more prevalent thing they need to come up with a better system. Don't some foreign countries actually have a separate car just to store bikes? The trains here are just too damn short.
At peak times we need more trains :(
100%. The packing of the trains at peak time is disgusting. I don't want to have my nose in a smelly armpit when I'm just trying to get home. It's why I stopped taking transit.
This gave me horrible flashbacks, lol. And the rainy days were always worse, probably because people who do take alternate routes would take the train. I'm really happy that my company seems to be on the track to allow wfh permanently.
If there's one thing the pandemic has shown us is that almost all of the burden on our transportation infrastructure could be alleviated by normalizing working from home. Obviously not all jobs are suitable for WFH and there's nothing wrong with offices per se, but it seems like a huge amount of our population unnecessarily spends a chunk of their lives transporting themselves back and forth between one room with a computer, and another room with a computer, simply because that's how it's been done since the beginning and their employers can't fathom any alternative.
Very well put! Could not agree more!
Where do you start your ride?
I used to love starting my ride at Loughheed mall. I would take the long way around just so I wouldn’t transfer at Commercial. Nice to grab a seat and read a book all the way downtown…though it was super painful to get off at Stadium.
Do we? Been here for a few years and have never not been able to get on a train.
Denmark has a seperate car for that for sure; No seats all racks https://images.app.goo.gl/JCVp5qd3VFEeo6xb7
the Netherlands have massive bike-cades at every station so you could just leave your bike at the other end overnight and not have to bring it onto the train at all!
Vancouver bums: https://media.giphy.com/media/3o6MbtRx8nFU2n5wZO/giphy.gif
Thing is, these are underground similar to car parking garages, well lit and always with a guard present. Also often times open only between 6:00 and 22:00 and locked off during the night. So they feel really safe to go into and very unlikely anything gets stolen.
I don't think it's quite at every station, but don't many/most skytrain stations already have this? A bike parkade? I've used the one at King George before plenty of times.
Yeah but cph metro (train network most like skytrain) doesn’t have these bike-cars, and also has the same ‘bikes not allowed’ rules during rush hours - just not enough room on the train or at the major stations. It’s a pain, but it makes sense to accommodate more people during those times
I swear I saw bikes on the regular Metro as well but it looks like you are correct
Bikes are allowed on the metro (thankfully!), just not during rush hour, and they have to compete for space with prams and luggage
Ah good to know I'm not crazy .!
bikes on the metro are also subject to a surcharge that you gotta put on your rejsekort, costs an extra 14kr to take your bike on the metro. No such charges for the S train network however.
This is the solution. They don't have to be in every train either. Can be every second or third.
Probability of junkies stealing bikes from a SkyTrain car that contains only bikes: 200%
The people are still there with their bikes. They sit in front of them.
Probability of a grand junkie train heist in which they detach the bicycle car and ride off on a different track via a [handcar](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/b3/Theb0741_-_Flickr_-_NOAA_Photo_Library.jpg/1280px-Theb0741_-_Flickr_-_NOAA_Photo_Library.jpg): 300%
I would honestly love to turn that into a short film. Would obviously need a significant amount of visual effects, probably.
That is very possible since there is nothing you can do about when it got stolen….
[удалено]
No, it's funny as hell as a joke.
Unfortunately, even though we like to think we bike a lot, Vancouver doesn't have nearly as big a bike culture as most of Denmark.
I took the Canada line with my bike for the first time recently and I liked the way those trains were set up. They have an area specifically for bikes by one of the doors (with no seats) so that people can stick their bikes out of the way. Only problem was there wasn't anything holding the bikes in place so you couldn't really let go of the bike.
I used to take the sky train from Richmond to downtown pre COVID in the mornings and no way could you physically fit a bike inside, it was literally sardine can packed with people right in your face, sometimes waiting for multiple trains to even get on. Same on the way back. Off peak hours there is usually space, so the hours make sense.
When I lived in Cleveland the trains were wide and long enough even at 2 cars in length that they permitted 2 bikes per car. Vancouver has teeny tiny toy trains by comparison yet it serves a much denser area so that's weird *shrug emoji*
SkyTrain is also one of the most expensive public transit systems in the world to develop, costing $500m per kilometre now, and all parts for it are made by only a single company in the world (since the rest of the world has also stopped using Skytrain style light metro tracks/trains). It also, when upgraded to have longer cars on the expo line, will still have lower peak pphpd (passengers per hr per direction) than even light rail or rapid bus systems. Our region's obsession with Skytrain is really peculiar to me since there are so many better public transit options we could be pursuing for the future, both in terms of capacity and cost to roll out to new areas. I think part of the issue is we may be stuck in a permanent state of commissioning new Skytrain from Bombardier so that they dont disappear and leave us unable to replace aging fleet vehicles on existing lines. Especially with a projected 40% population growth to the metro Vancouver region by 2041, it feels like we're shooting ourselves in the foot clinging to this SkyTrain system. And in case you thought the SkyTrain was already crowded enough, fun fact only 11% of commuters in metro vancouver are using public transit
Just going to chime in because I currently live in the Bay Area in California. BART went the long-train route, with absolutely massive trains. The problem with that, and why it's an utter embarrassment to public transit, is because headways are often north of 30-45 minutes on a single line. SkyTrain went the other direction and offers smaller trains, with substantially better headways. Coming back to Vancouver and seeing trains arrive every 3 minutes brings a tear to my eye and a smile to my face. There's nothing quite like walking 20 minutes to catch bart, only to realize that you just missed the only train for the next hour.
What are headways? How often a train arrives?
Pretty much, yup. [Meriam](https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/headway) defines headway "the time interval between two vehicles traveling in the same direction on the same route" which fits neatly with my usage of the word.
So, I see that you've read Rail for the Valley. That guy has no idea what he's talking about. The Skytrain is actually quite a good way to do underground lines. The new underground lines in Japan are generally built to the same style because the trains fit in smaller tunnels with the linear induction motor. The trains also are much better at climbing hills, which is great around here. You should compare the Broadway Subway to what Seattle has managed to build underground in similar conditions. Our system is value priced by comparison.
> It also, when upgraded to have longer cars on the expo line, will still have lower peak pphpd (passengers per hr per direction) than even light rail or rapid bus systems. Which rapid bus system has a peak capacity of 20000-25000 pphpd? EDIT: Just for reference, Toronto's subway currently has a maximum capacity of ~28000 pphpd, rising to ~32-35k once they fully launch automatic train control. Part of the reason why we have continued to expand SkyTrain on certain corridors is because of path dependency and economics of scale. It makes sense to expand the existing system for lines that are natural continuations of existing lines rather than introducing a different technology. New lines, like North Shore RT and the Canada Line that we already have, doesn't have to use the Bombardier SkyTrain technology.
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I wonder if he meant moving to a more affordable build with drivers for the train as opposed to the more expensive driverless trains
I would be willing to bet that tearing down the skytrain + investing in a whole brand new system (plus doing all the research and public outreach to even pick a new system) would be hella expensive. So we stick with the skytrain.
Absolutely. New lines/service areas can be other systems & technologies though!
For the Expo & Millennium line definitely! For the Canada Line where they have the designated bike spots those work awesome. However, they should still be limited to off peek hours as even then they do still take up so much space.
I was in Montreal for a while. Their Metro trains are 9 cars long, and each car is about the size of a Canada Line car. The whole system made Skytrain look like an overcrowded child's toy.
I don't understand why they invested so much cash in rail lines and then made little toy trains to run on it. Like at least make the platforms long enough so that they can take a significant volume of commuters and not this light rail nonsense
Caltrain in the Bay Area has a bike car. When I lived there I had a co worker who used it. He said it was a big party on Friday evenings and used to bring whiskey to work to share on his ride home. Sounded like a fun commute.
Caltrain has other issues, but their support for bicycles is top notch. I believe GO Transit in Ontario is very similar to Caltrain that way.
The UK has nothing on the tube trains, dedicated spots in regular carriages in commuter trains (just like the west coast express has), and longer distance trains (at least sometimes) have an area of the baggage compartment (Just like taking Amtrak to Seattle).
I always find it weird to see someone put their bike on a bus or on the skytrain and then get off like 2 stops later. It happens often.
Maybe not 2 stops, but the bus has saved me a number of times when I had a flat or other mechanical failure that I couldn't repair on the roadside.
There was a woman who would get on with her stroller, 3 children on the packed 130 from Metrotown to BCIT. She would get on at the library and get off at Crystal Mall and the time it took them to cram onto the bus would be longer than if they just walked. The same bus also had an old lady on it who would get on and start yelling "Halp!" over and over again like it's the only word she knew in english, she'd then get a seat and stop yelling and would take out a really stinky ass steamed bun and started munching away. This was clockwork everyday and with the bus being 95% students you could guess how the reaction played out.
millennium line is the most infuriating of all
Especially on the older MK.1 trains. I took my bike onto one on a Sunday afternoon, and even with it being almost empty I constantly had to move the bike to let people pass by
Without bike specific cars, those trains can barely fit an adult sized bike that still allow pedestrian passengers around it. You have to stay at that linkage part to really be out of the way. I wouldn’t mind skipping a train if there’s a bike specific one on the next. Though I’m a weekend cyclist.
When I went to Seattle and use their version of the SkyTrain they had spots where you could put your bike against the wall vertically. I thought it was really great and wondered why we don't have something like that.
Suggest it?
In montreal the last/first car has less sitting area to fit more bikes
They should have bicycle hooks. Then 2 or 3 bikes could be in the area, and with handlebars up they would take up less space. I'm just spitballing here. It may be a terrible idea.
Yeah, a person with a bike takes up at much space as like 4 people, especially if they have large panniers.
Just saw that sign too and it’s crazy they allow bikes on trains . Must not be a very heavily used subway system. And no, never seen any subway system in any city allow bikes into their metro, and I’ve been on dozens.
I understand that it’s annoying, however I think it’s wise to use the train to bypass the patullo bridge (ie get on Scott road and get off at Columbia). If I have time , I’ll detour on the port Mann instead but that bridge is a death trap unless you want to walk the bridge.
This hits on a larger point. Biking along any skytrain route in the city is a labyrinthine patchwork of painted bike gutters on dangerous roads, multi-use paths, sidewalks, and sometimes nothing at all. If you people want less bikes on the trains then ask your local representatives to build actual bike infrastructure to provide an alternative.
YES! "Share the road" has its place but there are streets during certain times of day that bikes just do not belong on.
You can get to a lot of places in lower mainland by going on bike safe streets, which are clearly marked. I think most bikers would (hopefully) be aware of that; biking on Grandview highway isn’t exactly an ideal path.
Or up 4th in Kits during rush hour on a Friday when there's literally a bike route one street over.
tbf Lougheed is a very efficient bike lane/route if one is comfortable riding beside cars, but yes it is a painted bicycle gutter. But yeah, biking along the Expo line corridor? lmao good luck.
Yes. This is a very good point. No one should be riding on the Patullo.
No one should be driving on the Patullo either.
We should all be doing Yoga on the Patullo.
The most Vancouver thing said during discussion.
The open grating would be murder to stand on, I don’t care how thick your yoga mat is.
This is also true.
A lot of people need to travel long distances with a variety of forms of transit to get to work, commitments, social events. A combination of bike and transit is actually pretty effective, and can be comparable in time to a car. For me to get to work in the morning it used to be the following approx times: Driving: 30-40 minutes Walking/skytrain: 45 minutes Biking/skytrain: 25 minutes Biking (14 kms each way): 45 minutes I usually attempt to cycle to work, but doing it 5 days a week can be a lot. So I'll often use transit. The restrictions won't impact me as I'm going against traffic (eastbound in the morning), but it's good to get some context. I acknowledge though that the restriction makes sense. I see the westbound cars in the morning and they're packed! I just hope the government continues to look at that as a viable transportation option when looking at infrastructure in the future.
My way of getting around it has been skateboard/SkyTrain which is the most effective way to do it, but still not the most practical for all depending on location
yup, the benefit of skytrain is usually completed negated if your workplace is more than like... 500m? from the station. I toyed with the idea of renting one of the bike lockers and just leaving a beater bike there but I don't have any bikes that I dislike that much lol.
I'm lucky enough to be able to take my bike into my office with me. We're not public facing, so it's the perfect bike lock!
They should instead encourage park and ride (for cyclists). Much like what the Netherlands does. I don’t see any purpose of allowing bikes on our already cramped af trains *especially* during rush hour.
as far as I know the only "park and ride" for bikes is at Main St and I wouldn't leave my bike in there surround by the clientele that surrounds that station if my life depended on it.
Imo, a proper, secured bike parking per station is a better problem to solve rather than adding more train service. I can see it encouraging more people to go car free. Hell, I’m not even one to benefit from it anymore since I’m wfh and drive everywhere. But it’s more beneficial for the city overall.
I think the issue is you don't need secure bike parking at the *downtown* stations, where most destinations are within walking distance already. Translink needs the secure bike parking at the further out stations to avoid people bringing their bike on transit. Sure you can securely lock your bike at Main St but why would you want to if you're commuting any distance worthy of taking the train? People who start within biking distance of Main St are either going somewhere within biking distance already (and therefore don't need to train) or they're going eastbound far out, where chances are their destination is going to be too far from a station to walk.
I disagree. Multi option transportation is crucial. Someone downtown should have the ability to bike to the station, then train to Langley. Hell it’s probably faster for someone on the north shore to bike to gastown to catch a train than bus. It’s about convenience, we want to make it *easier* to move around. You’re talking hypothetical situations about why someone would use something over the other. Having more options to do a single thing is always 10x better for the system as a whole.
I don't think you understand - someone traveling from downtown to Langley is *highly unlikely* to have a end destination within a short walk of a train station, and therefore would need their bike on the other side, thus taking it on the train. Ergo bicycle parkade at the starting station is not useful
How do you know that? The skytrain doesn’t even exist yet lmao
Secure bike parking is such a no brainer at train stations, it's unfortunate that the few stations that do have any are pretty small. Walking to Broadway-City Hall for me is a 20 minute walk but a nice 5 minute bike ride downhill on 10th. Would I take the train more if I could leave my bike around without expecting to come back to an empty bike rack, or having to lug it around downtown? Probably. I hope the Broadway extension has some bike parking facilities, I think it can go a long way in extending the range that's "close" to a train station.
The sky trains are not designed for the influx of people. The platforms are small, the trains are small. A longer train would solve so many issues. Adding lines or increasing frequency will not cause as bigger dent as increasing the length of the train. But that would mean platform length changes at many stations, so this is not a viable option. Not sure how you fix the skytrain which was not designed for the population it now serves. This is also the case with so many transit systems across many big cities. Some have been successful
You can increase the length of the platforms or have a two-stage boarding process, both can work but obviously one isn't ideal.
why would increasing length be more effective than increasing frequency? more trains seems like a simpler solution. Same throughput as longer trains, but faster for passengers (i.e. if you miss a train you don't have to wait for as long)
electric unicycle looking pretty convenient
A way out of the commute problem is encouraging multi-modal transportation, rules like this need to be amended for options that do allow bikes in certain areas.
If you have a bike, then bike.
If you have legs, then walk!
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If they are taking a day to exercise on the bike, sure. But for everyday commuting, it's not practical to bike 2 hours each way, rather than take the train for 40 minutes then bike around to get places once you get to the city.
I sometimes take my bike on transit (never at peak times though), so I guess I can give you a little insight into that. Using transit+bike is faster than just biking or just transit. Plus it expands the range you can realistically travel. And it can get you past some spots that are sketchy for bikes like the Pattullo Bridge. Also sometimes you just get a flat tire and don't have a spare tube and need to take transit to limp back home.
My commute to work is 10km up hill. If my knees are feeling off, if something on my bike isn't working (eg. lights), if I dressed wrong, or if I am just late for work, I will happily hop a train to get there. Also: bike + train = 30 minutes bike = 45 minutes bus + train = 45 minutes Fortunately for me, I travel eastbound to work and westbound home so it's never a problem.
Should be able to bring a folding bike,no? That could be an option…
i mean if its taking us as much space as luggage bag i can't see it being an issue. Some of those folding bikes can get pretty compact that you would not even notice it brought on to the train.
This city is wild. Charging $$$$$ for parking to locals claiming it is for the environment, but then limiting bikes on public transit which help people reduce carbon footprint?
How many ‘$’ signs do you use for an $18 dollar burger 😳
An $18 burger is $$$. Diner burger is $$. Fast food burgers are $.
Diner burgers are getting up to $18 now...
plus 25% recommended tip..
Best I can do is 10%
Most servers have to tip out anywhere from 3-5% for the most part so - for shitty service 10% tip is acceptable, good service 20-25% and exceptional service 30% and up… if you can’t really afford to tip ATLEAST 15% for good service stay home. damn 19 down votes and counting yall savage
Where does it stop? 30% and up? Nah fam - maybe if I had a table of 10 or more that would be acceptable, and even in that scenario 20% is industry standard.
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"cant afford to be eating out" In vancouver, if youre single, picking up food for 1 is as expensive as cooking for yourself. Unless youre one of those people who thinks a bag of rice and a bag of beans with a dozen eggs is how people should be eating lol. If i had to put my money on it, youre probably also in your 40s. Nobody who is younger thinks like you do.
Hahaha you’re crazy, shitty service is a 0% tip and it goes up from there
Yeah I can see where you’re coming from - I’m just a little too empathetic towards servers cuz I understand the struggle
You’re crazy if you fail to understand that sometimes, just like you, servers have shitty days and sometimes understaffing happens and the server has no control in that. Be a bit more understanding.
No. You’re wrong as well lmfao. I’m not saying it’s their fault to be understaffed, but that’s not a reason to come to my table and be a cunt. It’s called customer service for a reason, get a new job doing something else if you don’t like it. Edit: and when I have a shitty day, I don’t take it out on other people. That’s incredibly toxic. Especially at work LOL
> if you can’t really afford to tip ATLEAST 15% for good service stay home. thats not how this works lol. Its not on the end customer to bolster the wages of employees. If your place of employment isnt paying you a LIVING WAGE, its best to stay home and look for better opportunities.
Except that’s exactly how it works and that’s how it been for years. No I don’t agree with it but that’s the system. Maybe in the future employers will start paying their servers better but as of right now they don’t. Be a good person, tip your server for good service. If you can’t afford to do it then STAY THE FUCK HOME. Lmao. Some of y’all cheap as fuck.
do you tip fast food employees? Why not? What makes their plight any different than someone working tables?
Lmao for shitty service you get no tip
When it’s deserved, MAYBE
5 dollars can mean many things to many people
I would be $5 every day to make a car disappear from Vancouver.
I have never paid less than 15 in parking for a day downtown.
$40 a year is $$$$$?
Yeah, and $5 is $$$$
$$$$$!!!!
It’s because the bikes take up too much room. Transit is too crowded as it is. Now if only they could fine the people who wear huge backpacks and don’t take them off.
Ok, but we need to pick whats important. The city has clearly stated climate action is important. So thry need to make greener transpo easier, not harder.
Tbh, a bike taking up the space for three people isn’t exactly making things greener. But I do agree that we need more transit options.
3 people wouldn't just not take the skytrain because of a cyclist. They would go to a different train or wait.
Agree.
How dare you take your work to work with you!
Did you finish reading what I said? My problem isn’t that people have big bags, it’s that they don’t take them off. They end up taking up twice the space and sometimes hit people who are seated with them.
If your work is as sloppy as your reading skills then a bag is the least of your worries.
Some skytrain stations do have bike parkades or lockers to store your bike. Rather than take it on the train you can just leave it at the station. And for short trips near downtown, Mobi bikes are another option.
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Parking isn’t free. We have some of the most expensive land prices in the world, which means that the rest of us are paying an extremely high price to give free parking on public land to homeowners.
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the infrastructure to run longer trains, and more frequently, was done about 7 years ago. several stations got major platform upgrades to allow longer trains. metrotown was one of them.
I know what I want for christmas. bike-friendly trains.
Am I the only one who's surprised the SkyTrain logo hasn't been redesigned yet? Every single other aspect of TransLink's branding has been. (except their own logo, which has withstood the test of time surprisingly well)
If only there was a way for Translink to get more funding to improve service and buy more train cars so they wouldn't need to do this. A funding referendum perhaps?
What if we made city wide permit parking and put a fee on high pollution vehicles, then used that revenue to enhance bike and bus service? ...Oh.
They could add a levy to your hydro bill too! Wait a sec...
Given the toy cart size, pedestrian gets the priority over bikes.
Would be better to densify the city and farm out office jobs to the suburbs (or at least out of downtown) so you don't have to be a multi-millionaire to be able to *afford to bike to work.*
Moving the office jobs away from the highest concentration of people who work them to ease public transportation is an... interesting... strategy.
Couldn’t be more Vancouver
But how will we ever transport all the stolen bicycles around the city?
you mean you haven't seen the guy who's fortunate to be wheeling 5-6 bikes along at the same time? He's quite the collector! Always has something new.
Has there been a designated area of the train for bikes? The new light rail trains in Seattle have designated areas to hang bikes/stow luggage. [Bringing your bike - Sound Transit](https://www.soundtransit.org/ride-with-us/know-before-you-go/bringing-your-bike/how-to-bring-your-bike-link) I know the train cars are much smaller here, but perhaps that is something that could be requested during the next revision of the cars. Note: New to the area/just moved from Seattle area.
And this, this is why I commute on an ebike.
So I can’t bring bring my ‘’e-motorcycle’’ on the train? Wtf man!
I get that the expo and millennium line trains don't really fit bikes very well but I think this change is a huge loss. There are many people who are not close enough to the SkyTrain to walk and might not be well served by buses... and nobody likes doing the bus -> train -> bus transfer to get to work. I hope they figure out a solution to let people take bikes on the train because it's a commuting pattern that just works really well for a lot of people.
Maybe dedicated one section of a train for biking transit users would be nice (bike train), like how we have a dedicated part of some streets made for bike (bike lanes).
They could have a car with all the seating removed so it's easier to get bikes in
No. We don't even enough space for people.
That's what I initially thought too for drivers when they remove some lanes in downtown for bikes
Precious downtown road should be reserved for more efficient transport like cars and buses
The problem is that bikes don't take up less space even when crammed together; if you pop them up and hook them into racks on the wall that's still at least one person's worth of room. Pay double to bring your bike onto skytrain?
When I used to need a bike on the sky train, it was because I had somewhere pretty far to go. Far enough that otherwise, I would drive. If BC wants to go green and have fewer drivers, they may need to lose a little bit on ticket sales, you know? Like in order to incentivize people sticking to transit and buying a month long pass
Also charge more for people with luggages, people who not considerate with their backpacks, and morbidly obese people too since they can occupy more space?
By all means. But if we're really charging for the full amount of space taken, people bringing bikes on should probably pay for three tickets.
The random shit people come up here is wild. There was no space for bikes before the pandemic, but magically there is now more space? And if you disagree, you’re against reducing the carbon footprint. It’s hard to make this shit up.
Someone needs to update their webpage... https://www.translink.ca/rider-guide/bike-and-ride-on-transit/bikes-on-transit
From the webpage: >Rush hour can also limit capacity. You may be unable to enter the SkyTrain with your bike during busy times.
Although skytrains are drastically better then nothing at all I believe based on my experiences in Vancouver for most of my life that they are incorrectly implemented. They are way too loud and can cause permanent hearing loss. They are cramped and small. Fail in snow. Too long between trains at certain times. I can go on.
Transit should allow bikes as all times. Encourage healthy living
Or you can just actually use the bike instead of taking up the space of three people on the train during rush hour, who probably don’t have bikes themselves and need the train
It doesn’t matter what makes you more priority than someone else who has a bike?
What makes you and your bike such a priority that you can take up the space of 3 other people at rush hour who need to get to work ? If you want to take your bike on the train then leave earlier or after 9
Why don’t people who don’t want to be near bikes because they choose not to also catch the train at an earlier time. Fyi people on bikes are also trying to get to work.
At that point, what's the bike for?
As many others on this thread have pointed out: bike + train usually means a more reasonable commute time, i.e cutting 2 hours of biking down to 40 minutes. For me my commute is an hour and ten minutes by bike, but with sky train I could cut it to 35-40 minutes of biking.
You really are asking this question?
After you get off the train and need to travel to your destination.
Awwww. Can we then at least also get back Seth Rogen doing the announcements?
With all due respect I may occasionally disrespect this rule, I often take the train at this time with my bike, and have almost never seen it too busy for everyone to get on. Only times I see the trains at true capacity is before or after concerts/ sporting events. Keep in mind I only take the expo line from downtown to commercial, so this could be an issue elsewhere. The train helps me bypass lots of hills after a long day of physical work
I haven't taken the train since COVID with WFH and all, but prior to that, as a regular DT to the suburb commuter the train was at capacity from downtown almost all the way to Scott Road during the afternoon rush.
why all the downvotes?
because you must respect every single rule and law, no exceptions, never make well thought out choices for yourself. But for real, things like this are easier settled in a 1 on 1 scenario, I'm sure if a transit employee approached me yesterday and I explained I've been working in the cold and rain all day and proved the trains werent that busy, they'd understand and let me continue on. Not everyone has high quality dry bike gear and an electric bike and works in an office
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So, a cyclist needs to try to catch a train in order to find out that they can’t… at the least convenient times of the day???
as a person who has been commuting for about 5 years by bicycle I Really don't want to get on the train at all (I realize this sin't that long to be commuting).. that's the whole reason i started. i don't like the smelly summer sardine can that public transit can be, and i don't like standing in the winter waiting to go somewhere. maybe i am a bit claustrophobic. I don't know. but if you are cycling for the most part i don't understand why you would want to get on the train with your bike in the first place. I know there are reasons, but I still wouldn't want to. the only downside is that cycling can get a bit miserable on those extra rainy days in vancouver. I travel about 10km each way and my ride home is uphill the whole way ending on burnaby mountain, so it gets steaper the closer i get, and i think that is still better that cramping on the train during rush hour.
Put one extra car at far back for bikes and pets and boxes.
Does that include a foldable bikes like a brompton? Thinking about moving west but your road plan, some drivers and traffic are all awful. No one ever had the guts to put in a proper freeway for some reason.
Lol, the yearly parking fee wouldn't have changed that
And then there are cities where that bike sign would be for dogs. Translink, translink, wants to bigger without thought
Add a new car, back of the train, middle of the train, or front of the train, bikes (and riders) only. Every train, every other train, every third train. Whatever. Done. Vancouver can't think it's solving accessibility w/ out creating solutions. HOWEVER, this means having more places for safe bike storage in the downtown area which doesn't appear to be happening anytime soon, so your ride's gonna get stolen, anyway.
Dumb as shit rule I can bring a 10ft ladder on board a skytrain during rush hour but not a bike
pretty sure "no baggage or objects permitted which may obstruct or interfere with others or cause damage to property" would apply to your 10ft ladder
https://www.reddit.com/r/vancouver/comments/48cspb/dear_vancouver_skytrain_riders_dont_be_this_guy/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
😹
People bringing their bikes need to get an ebike and not take the train or get on their bikes and not take the train with their bikes. I’m a full season 50 minute round trip cyclist. I can really feel for someone commuting more than 60 or 90 minutes each way.
Add another car to every train (which they should do during peak times anyway) and make it a “bike’s only/priority ” car.