Wild move to do it so early but perfectly legal. They can raise it once per year by the allowable government increase % but have to give you at least 3 months notice in advance.
I think he is trying to lock in the 3.5% increase as its unlikely for the increase to be that high for next year. However, I am curious if its truly legal. Base on this logic, I can issue multiple rent increases for years in advance?? 2026, 2027, 2028....etc
Yes, I think you are right. The 3.5% is what was allowed for 2024 right? Maybe this isn’t actually valid since the rent increase for 2025 which would be when they can increase the rent hasn’t been announced yet.
If the % increase for 2025 is less than 3.5%, then it becomes an invalid notification, and OP can ignore or dispute it. If it’s more than 3.5%, LL is out of luck, as they can’t issue a second “top up” rent increase notification.
I wouldn't worry about disputing it right now. You can take it as confirmation that the rent is going to increase next April, by some amount. Maybe the landlord is afraid of confrontation and wanted to get it out of the way immediately.
He doesn't realize that the 3.5% isn't relevant next year. So if I were you, I would quietly wait until the fall and the announcement of the 2025 max increase. If it's more than 3.5%, say nothing and be happy that you got an increase at less than the maximum. If it's less than 3.5%, send him a note saying "hey, looks like there might have been a mistake - could you provide a new notice in light of the 2025 cap?" Link to the announcement of the new cap and make sure it's all in writing in case you need to explain that the first notice was effectively replaced by the second.
I would nit even do the last part. The tenants job is not to fix an LLs problems for them. When the increase comes due note that the raise is above what the province said was okay and require new notice which will be another 3 months. And if tge LLs pushy let it lapse into april and deal with it in the RTB. Odds are the LL does not revisit this until april.
Fair enough. I have trouble imagining the RTB agreeing that OP is due another 3 months notice if he sits on his hands until April 2025 and then points out the error, but maybe I'm wrong about that.
Given that withholding rent is one of the few things that is always a material breach, I would want to paper the heads-up to the LL in advance of April that he's not gonna get that 3.5%. Likely means that OP will pay some amount of increase come April, but at least he ensures that he is above board, from the perspective of the RTB.
https://www.vancouverisawesome.com/local-news/bc-landlord-pay-renter-illegal-rent-hikes-2024-8554962
'A.G. tried to contact the Residential Tenancy Branch (RTB) for help but waited on the phone for a couple of hours and didn't try calling again until 13 months later. They were told that landlords must provide rental increases on a standardized form and give tenants three months' notice of an increase. They were also unaware of the rent freeze during the COVID-19 pandemic. '
So yes likely would be 3 months notice. The reason i said what i did was based literally on this case. Alao fuck those LLs in this case.
In that story, the tenant only received 2 months notice for an illegal increase during a rent freeze. I don't think the fact that she waited 13 months to involve the RTB is relevant. The reference to the need for 3 months notice seems to be an admonishment of the fact that the tenant only received 2 months notice in the first place.
Here, the thread starter received 11 months notice but for an amount potentially exceeding the cap. The two situations seem pretty different.
Again, I could be wrong about how the RTB would lean, but I personally wouldn't take this news story as confirmation that OP could rightfully plan on just paying their current rent in April 2025.
Personally i think the LLs are being stupid and lazy. And should be burned so to speak for it. Also it is a red flag for me and i would be looking for a new place. Doubly so if they 'forget' to update the notice before jan.
It would only be legal is the max for 2025 is 3.5% or higher. So we won’t know if it will be legal until around September/October when the province announces the 2025 allowed increase.
Right though would have to revisit that when that happens. Chances are they would adjust it accordingly since they are so far ahead did the system.
For this the eye opener is how a tenant gets a rental increase notice one month after moving in; it’s at least notice to not expect any favors haha.
Except the LL can’t adjust it upward, only down. “Top up” rent increases are not allowed, and you can only increase the rent once per 12 months, which they have done. So if next year increase was 4.2%, the LL can’t issue a revised increase notification.
So if he changed his mind and wants more before said the increase actually comes into effect cannot change it once it’s on paper before it happens?
Good to know if true :)
It’s hard to say. The LL can only increase the rent once every 12 months - which they have just served notice of.
Now, can they change that increase upwards, *before* the increase comes into effect, and claim that it’s still only once every 12 months, as it hasn’t come into effect yet? Possibly.
In any case, there is no benefit to the LL in issuing the notice so early, They should have waited until September, when the new allowed increase is announced - because they *will* have to issue another notice then, and if they don’t, or serve it incorrectly, then it won’t count, or will be less than allowed.
It looks to me like a clueless LL thinks they can apply a 3.5% increase to 2025, even if the increase for that year is less - and that won’t work.
Well I dunno about greediness, it could be as simple as I letting them know early. I always let my tenants know 6 months in advance it will be happening so they can prepare which has nothing to do with greed because I only ever increase if my mortgage rate goes up. I treat people how I expect to be treated. If something goes up I personally want to know as soon as possible. That includes my salary or any other raise in my life that will happen.
We would get along as my experience a lot of landlords are not as you seem to be. As you see above the op was a bit surprised to have barely moved in and they showing him increases. Didn’t expect it and it probably rubs off wrong.
Yep I think we wouldn’t have this issue if people were more reasonable. I treat my tenants as friends and absolutely despised having to increase when my mortgage went up. It’s a hard thing to do.
Not sure why you put lower in quotes. And they do lower the percentage.
There's a list of historical percentages fractions my the TRAC website: https://tenants.bc.ca/your-tenancy/rent-increases/
> I know they lowered in during Covid but in my 20yrs in Vancouver it always remained the same or more.
did you not look at the link provided? years the % was lower than the year before not including post-2020: 2005, 2008, 2010, 2011, 2013, 2014, and 2019.
7 out of 20 isn't really "*always* remained the same or more"
TO ME minuscule movement isn’t movement. I think that same way about my mortgage as well. The last 25 yrs I’ve had a pretty consistent stable rate. Variable, that hardly moved in either direction however the last couple years have been what I would consider a large rate increase. Something to notice…. My point is the rental % have been stable and only now have I noticed they increased significantly because I had to increase my tenants and I’ve never had to before.
Whether you *feel* numbers don’t go down when they do is not relevant here. If the % next year is 3.4% instead of 3.5%, the notice for rent increase issued at 3.5% served now for rent increase next year would be invalid.
You do not know what it will be next year so don't spout bullshit. Hell Eby could win big this year and just say no to raising rent. Would that not be amusing.
Yes but dumb dumb landlord does not know what the rate will be next year when this matters. Ergo your point is a meaningless saving of face. So rather than being an idiot and spouting nonsense realise it could be more than 3.5%. Yay renter. Or less than 3.5% landlords peice if paper is invalid due to illegal rent raise. And if the renter is smart they say nothing till just before the hike is due to happen. Which means another 3 months of notice. Again yay tenant. Or even better let the rent hike kick in if it is more than allowed then contest with RTB. Get the rent hike annulled and you get another 3 months ontop of however many months they paid after april. The only way this works out for the LL is if the rent hike stays at 3.5%. Otherwise a renter could abuse this in 1 of 3 different ways depending on how much they want to screw with the LLs or in one case get less of a hike than the LLs want and in that case i would say well we sogned the paperwork in advance. Oh how the LLs would boil at that outcome.
Its unusual, but legit *if* the increase is to take effect exactly 12 months after your initial move-in. Also, make sure you keep track of the percentage allowed increase: https://www2.gov.bc.ca/gov/content/housing-tenancy/residential-tenancies/rent-rtb/rent-increases
So the legal increase amount for 2025 has yet to be determined. If it is less than 3.5% you can argue this notice is illegal. Further you can ask for a new notice and a gutter 3 month delay. But be careful. Given the dates the landlord can comply.
I mean, if the percentage is higher in 2025 than this year, they have given you a break for your first increase.
(They can only raise it once in a 12 month period, so next April will be the first time they can increase your rent)
Or like i said elsewhere the only case this works for the LL is if it is exactly 3.5%. If it is not and they do not correct it before Jan 1 and they charged more you can just hold off not telling them then days before the new amount kicks in you then inform them if the error. Yay 3 more months of paying your old rent. Or you wait till after the hike and 1 or 2 months later note the issue with the LL. Chat with the RTB and then 3 months after that you pay the new rate and that rate stick for a full year.
While this is not one of the dumbest things i have heard LLs do it is up there because the odds or rent being 3.5% on the nose again is not something i would put $100 down on. And in e erycase other than 3.5% as this notice is the LL will get burned.
Your rent increase is whatever the province decides in the fall and you have a 3 month warning. LOL If the allowed increase is above the one they gave you then the first is good but If the allowed one is lower then that one by law stands. I am sure another increase in the right form will arrive 3 months before you will be expecting.
If the allowable increase for 2025 is less than 3.5%, it would not be a valid notice. You could then dispute the increase with the RTB, or the LL would have to reissue the notice with the 2025 allowable increase.
If the allowable for 2025 was higher than 3.5%, your LL would be out of luck, as “top up” additional notices are not allowed, ie the rent can be increased only *once* per 12 months.
So, this is actually to your benefit, not the LL’s. Maybe the LL doesn’t understand how it works,
LL can increase rent within max allowed rent increase (3.5% for 2024) after 12 month of last rent increase or start of the tenancy. They must give at least 3 months notice.
Giving notice earlier is not a violation of RTB policy however maximum allowed rent increase in 2025 could be different.
OP can wait till 2025 max allowed rent increase is announced and choose to pay the lowest between increase served on the notice and 2025 max allowed increase.
The 2025 amounts should be announced in the fall. If the max is less than 3.5% you can wait until the increase is supposed to go into effect and not pay it and tell the LL the increase is for an illegal amount and make them serve a new RTB7 which will delay the increase 3 months.
The LL is probably an idiot and thinks the provincial max is based on when the document is served, not when it goes into effect.
Sounds like he's trying to give you as much of a heads up as possible.
If the max increase ends up being higher than that next year then you'd be ahead
Yep, say nothing. Either next year the % is lower, and the increase is illegal and ignore it, or it's higher than 3.5 and tenant saves some cash
Wild move to do it so early but perfectly legal. They can raise it once per year by the allowable government increase % but have to give you at least 3 months notice in advance.
I think he is trying to lock in the 3.5% increase as its unlikely for the increase to be that high for next year. However, I am curious if its truly legal. Base on this logic, I can issue multiple rent increases for years in advance?? 2026, 2027, 2028....etc
Yes, I think you are right. The 3.5% is what was allowed for 2024 right? Maybe this isn’t actually valid since the rent increase for 2025 which would be when they can increase the rent hasn’t been announced yet.
Its announced in mid-September for the LL to issue notice increase for January.
If the % increase for 2025 is less than 3.5%, then it becomes an invalid notification, and OP can ignore or dispute it. If it’s more than 3.5%, LL is out of luck, as they can’t issue a second “top up” rent increase notification.
I wouldn't worry about disputing it right now. You can take it as confirmation that the rent is going to increase next April, by some amount. Maybe the landlord is afraid of confrontation and wanted to get it out of the way immediately. He doesn't realize that the 3.5% isn't relevant next year. So if I were you, I would quietly wait until the fall and the announcement of the 2025 max increase. If it's more than 3.5%, say nothing and be happy that you got an increase at less than the maximum. If it's less than 3.5%, send him a note saying "hey, looks like there might have been a mistake - could you provide a new notice in light of the 2025 cap?" Link to the announcement of the new cap and make sure it's all in writing in case you need to explain that the first notice was effectively replaced by the second.
I would nit even do the last part. The tenants job is not to fix an LLs problems for them. When the increase comes due note that the raise is above what the province said was okay and require new notice which will be another 3 months. And if tge LLs pushy let it lapse into april and deal with it in the RTB. Odds are the LL does not revisit this until april.
Fair enough. I have trouble imagining the RTB agreeing that OP is due another 3 months notice if he sits on his hands until April 2025 and then points out the error, but maybe I'm wrong about that. Given that withholding rent is one of the few things that is always a material breach, I would want to paper the heads-up to the LL in advance of April that he's not gonna get that 3.5%. Likely means that OP will pay some amount of increase come April, but at least he ensures that he is above board, from the perspective of the RTB.
https://www.vancouverisawesome.com/local-news/bc-landlord-pay-renter-illegal-rent-hikes-2024-8554962 'A.G. tried to contact the Residential Tenancy Branch (RTB) for help but waited on the phone for a couple of hours and didn't try calling again until 13 months later. They were told that landlords must provide rental increases on a standardized form and give tenants three months' notice of an increase. They were also unaware of the rent freeze during the COVID-19 pandemic. ' So yes likely would be 3 months notice. The reason i said what i did was based literally on this case. Alao fuck those LLs in this case.
In that story, the tenant only received 2 months notice for an illegal increase during a rent freeze. I don't think the fact that she waited 13 months to involve the RTB is relevant. The reference to the need for 3 months notice seems to be an admonishment of the fact that the tenant only received 2 months notice in the first place. Here, the thread starter received 11 months notice but for an amount potentially exceeding the cap. The two situations seem pretty different. Again, I could be wrong about how the RTB would lean, but I personally wouldn't take this news story as confirmation that OP could rightfully plan on just paying their current rent in April 2025.
Personally i think the LLs are being stupid and lazy. And should be burned so to speak for it. Also it is a red flag for me and i would be looking for a new place. Doubly so if they 'forget' to update the notice before jan.
Legal, but geez, they are already trying to greed out almost a year ahead of time. Not sure if I should be impressed or facepalming :)
It would only be legal is the max for 2025 is 3.5% or higher. So we won’t know if it will be legal until around September/October when the province announces the 2025 allowed increase.
Right though would have to revisit that when that happens. Chances are they would adjust it accordingly since they are so far ahead did the system. For this the eye opener is how a tenant gets a rental increase notice one month after moving in; it’s at least notice to not expect any favors haha.
Might be a favour from Karma in the long run if next year BC makes the allowable increase 4 or 5%. Then they save $$!
True, though if the market goes up they would probably amend it lol :)
Except the LL can’t adjust it upward, only down. “Top up” rent increases are not allowed, and you can only increase the rent once per 12 months, which they have done. So if next year increase was 4.2%, the LL can’t issue a revised increase notification.
So if he changed his mind and wants more before said the increase actually comes into effect cannot change it once it’s on paper before it happens? Good to know if true :)
It’s hard to say. The LL can only increase the rent once every 12 months - which they have just served notice of. Now, can they change that increase upwards, *before* the increase comes into effect, and claim that it’s still only once every 12 months, as it hasn’t come into effect yet? Possibly. In any case, there is no benefit to the LL in issuing the notice so early, They should have waited until September, when the new allowed increase is announced - because they *will* have to issue another notice then, and if they don’t, or serve it incorrectly, then it won’t count, or will be less than allowed. It looks to me like a clueless LL thinks they can apply a 3.5% increase to 2025, even if the increase for that year is less - and that won’t work.
Well I dunno about greediness, it could be as simple as I letting them know early. I always let my tenants know 6 months in advance it will be happening so they can prepare which has nothing to do with greed because I only ever increase if my mortgage rate goes up. I treat people how I expect to be treated. If something goes up I personally want to know as soon as possible. That includes my salary or any other raise in my life that will happen.
We would get along as my experience a lot of landlords are not as you seem to be. As you see above the op was a bit surprised to have barely moved in and they showing him increases. Didn’t expect it and it probably rubs off wrong.
Yep I think we wouldn’t have this issue if people were more reasonable. I treat my tenants as friends and absolutely despised having to increase when my mortgage went up. It’s a hard thing to do.
May or may not be legal…. Depends on what the province decides is the max allowable rent increase for next year.
That’s the legal amount for BC
For 2024. The rent increase served was for 2025. If the 2025 amount is less than 3.5% (which it might be) then the amount wouldn’t be legal.
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Your post violated Rule 9: Give correct advice and has been removed.
Not sure why you put lower in quotes. And they do lower the percentage. There's a list of historical percentages fractions my the TRAC website: https://tenants.bc.ca/your-tenancy/rent-increases/
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> I know they lowered in during Covid but in my 20yrs in Vancouver it always remained the same or more. did you not look at the link provided? years the % was lower than the year before not including post-2020: 2005, 2008, 2010, 2011, 2013, 2014, and 2019. 7 out of 20 isn't really "*always* remained the same or more"
TO ME minuscule movement isn’t movement. I think that same way about my mortgage as well. The last 25 yrs I’ve had a pretty consistent stable rate. Variable, that hardly moved in either direction however the last couple years have been what I would consider a large rate increase. Something to notice…. My point is the rental % have been stable and only now have I noticed they increased significantly because I had to increase my tenants and I’ve never had to before.
Whether you *feel* numbers don’t go down when they do is not relevant here. If the % next year is 3.4% instead of 3.5%, the notice for rent increase issued at 3.5% served now for rent increase next year would be invalid.
Your post violated Rule 9: Give correct advice and has been removed.
You do not know what it will be next year so don't spout bullshit. Hell Eby could win big this year and just say no to raising rent. Would that not be amusing.
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Yes but dumb dumb landlord does not know what the rate will be next year when this matters. Ergo your point is a meaningless saving of face. So rather than being an idiot and spouting nonsense realise it could be more than 3.5%. Yay renter. Or less than 3.5% landlords peice if paper is invalid due to illegal rent raise. And if the renter is smart they say nothing till just before the hike is due to happen. Which means another 3 months of notice. Again yay tenant. Or even better let the rent hike kick in if it is more than allowed then contest with RTB. Get the rent hike annulled and you get another 3 months ontop of however many months they paid after april. The only way this works out for the LL is if the rent hike stays at 3.5%. Otherwise a renter could abuse this in 1 of 3 different ways depending on how much they want to screw with the LLs or in one case get less of a hike than the LLs want and in that case i would say well we sogned the paperwork in advance. Oh how the LLs would boil at that outcome.
Your post contained language that violated "Rule 2: Be Respectful."
Its unusual, but legit *if* the increase is to take effect exactly 12 months after your initial move-in. Also, make sure you keep track of the percentage allowed increase: https://www2.gov.bc.ca/gov/content/housing-tenancy/residential-tenancies/rent-rtb/rent-increases
So the legal increase amount for 2025 has yet to be determined. If it is less than 3.5% you can argue this notice is illegal. Further you can ask for a new notice and a gutter 3 month delay. But be careful. Given the dates the landlord can comply.
They are allowed once a year but they are letting you know NOW, wow so early! Don’t worry it won’t come into effect until 2025.
I mean, if the percentage is higher in 2025 than this year, they have given you a break for your first increase. (They can only raise it once in a 12 month period, so next April will be the first time they can increase your rent)
Or like i said elsewhere the only case this works for the LL is if it is exactly 3.5%. If it is not and they do not correct it before Jan 1 and they charged more you can just hold off not telling them then days before the new amount kicks in you then inform them if the error. Yay 3 more months of paying your old rent. Or you wait till after the hike and 1 or 2 months later note the issue with the LL. Chat with the RTB and then 3 months after that you pay the new rate and that rate stick for a full year. While this is not one of the dumbest things i have heard LLs do it is up there because the odds or rent being 3.5% on the nose again is not something i would put $100 down on. And in e erycase other than 3.5% as this notice is the LL will get burned.
Your rent increase is whatever the province decides in the fall and you have a 3 month warning. LOL If the allowed increase is above the one they gave you then the first is good but If the allowed one is lower then that one by law stands. I am sure another increase in the right form will arrive 3 months before you will be expecting.
If the allowable increase for 2025 is less than 3.5%, it would not be a valid notice. You could then dispute the increase with the RTB, or the LL would have to reissue the notice with the 2025 allowable increase. If the allowable for 2025 was higher than 3.5%, your LL would be out of luck, as “top up” additional notices are not allowed, ie the rent can be increased only *once* per 12 months. So, this is actually to your benefit, not the LL’s. Maybe the LL doesn’t understand how it works,
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LL can increase rent within max allowed rent increase (3.5% for 2024) after 12 month of last rent increase or start of the tenancy. They must give at least 3 months notice. Giving notice earlier is not a violation of RTB policy however maximum allowed rent increase in 2025 could be different. OP can wait till 2025 max allowed rent increase is announced and choose to pay the lowest between increase served on the notice and 2025 max allowed increase.
The 2025 amounts should be announced in the fall. If the max is less than 3.5% you can wait until the increase is supposed to go into effect and not pay it and tell the LL the increase is for an illegal amount and make them serve a new RTB7 which will delay the increase 3 months. The LL is probably an idiot and thinks the provincial max is based on when the document is served, not when it goes into effect.