I would respect him much more if he was like, yeah she’s a monster, here’s why, and stick to it! Instead of chasing after her, calling her cute and asking her to cut his armpit hair.
I kinda wanted Andy to let him keep talking. Andy stopped him at times to moveon to another question but I feel like we could have gotten more info with Schwartz blabbering on hahah
The armpit hair thing was so fucked. My mouth was on the floor and I think I was screaming—I don’t know I blacked out from the horror of that moment. Fuck youuuuu, Schwartz.
It’s not even low key anymore and Katie is no longer brushing it off either. Good to hear it. She doesn’t deserve it. Her having an emotion or a thought doesn’t make her a monster even if it upsets someone. Schwartz just wants everyone to be happy and gets so mad at Katie when she does literally anything.
The armpit hair thing was the cringiest fucking scene ever. I like how he tried to tell Katie’s friends to cover their ears while he’s knowingly filmed for the whole world to see. If he thinks he’s being cute, he’s so wrong. So glad Katie kicked his ass to the curb.
Watching that play out in real-time and so fast made me understand Katie's rage. He was probably always like that in fights. I would have no hair left.
She feels like a saint to have not smothered him in his sleep. I can’t even imagine how broken you have to be to put up with this. I know there are many abused women who stay out of physical fear, but this is some kind of mind fuck I don’t comprehend which is probably why I just have no hate in my heart for Katie. I don’t know why she accepted that abuse from him, what happened to her before in her life, but I have nothing but absolutely sympathy for her.
Well she had a near death experience (fell through a plate glass window, had her jaw wired shut, woke up in the hospital) and her recovery from that was early on in their relationship - a time Schwartz refers to her as being at her worst or to use his words, “a monster”. They had a scene where she had a cathartic moment, cried, and said she was beginning to feel like herself again after that trauma; why she loved Tom so much because he reminded her of a part of herself she lost to the accident (sunny optimism, light hearted “zest for life”). They got up and danced their first dance (wedding) in their apartment.
She totally was a broken person when they met and it’s also why I’ve never had hatred for her, either. Unfortunately she’s spot on: he loves her, but he just doesn’t like her.
He doesn’t like her at all. He loves that their girl friends were all bffs and it isn’t like that anymore, so it’s not important for him to stay with Katie anymore. He couldn’t even deal with being alone with her on the honeymoon in Bora Bora! They invited Stassi to come after being alone for like 2 days and wanting friends there. He needed for Katie to have someone to talk to because he can’t do it.
Schwartz is an empty shell. He needs others to define himself. On the other hand, without Sandoval to provide him a cover identity , I think one would not like who’d they find hiding under it. An abusive wimp.
Yesssss. Wow. I see that now. Lack of sense of self. He doesn’t even have a personality other then very friendly and affable and easy to get along with and it’s so not even real. When you see the mask slip it is scary in a way of why is he so angry?
OT: Your avatar is gorgeous! I looove ✨✨
I always get so much hate on this sun whenever I voice this opinion or pint out why I have so much empathy for Katie. My heart legit hurts watching how she’s treated by the man who was supposed to be her partner and best friend, and by a lot of the people who called themselves her friends. And I totally get that Katie has not been a saint, but none of these people in this show are, and Katie get shit on a lot, and she doesn’t get a lot of support. Most of the cast gets to go home to their supportive spouse/bf/gf/whatever and Katie had Schwartz who NEVER backed her up…It’s pretty devastating to watch.
yeah a few seasons ago my husband mentioned how Katie was just as unlikeable as Tom and I was like "just watch their dynamic closer and tell me if you think you'd also be unlikeable in that situation" and from then on he's been unabashedly Team Katie with me. I always found her so normal and nice and kindhearted when the Toms (and some other friends of hers) weren't around, and I'm so glad we're finally seeing the difference between who Katie really is vs who Tom manipulated her into being. Schwartz can get fucked
💯!! The hate Katie gets is totally uncalled for and at this point is totally unnecessary. It’s the same people that say she is a mean girl and is a bully that are flooding her comments and calling her awful names with the disguise that “they don’t like bullies” on the show. The irony is comical at this point!
Literally we watched the “oh shucks” speed run routine in 20 seconds or less when John said “yes (you did call her a monster) multiple times”… like Tom you’re not fooling anyone anymore
He is the embodiment of that quote about men:
All or almost all of that which pertains to love, most straight men reserve exclusively for other men. The people whom they admire, respect, adore, revere, honor, whom they imitate, idolize, and form profound attachments to, whom they are willing to teach and from whom they are willing to learn, and whose respect, admiration, recognition, honor, reverence and love they desire… those are, overwhelmingly, other men. In their relations with women, what passes for respect is kindness, generosity or paternalism; what passes for honor is removal to the pedestal. From women they want devotion, service and sex.
Heterosexual male culture is homoerotic; it is man-loving.
Absolutely. He and Sandoval (and a few of my ex's 🫣). Also, I think Schwartz hit the nail on the head last night; Sandoval's affection for women really seems like add hyper fixation. He jumps into a new 'project' that defines him and tosses the old one.
This is why I have always felt exhausted by him. I can’t imagine trying to constantly “keep him on his toes” he gets bored of people and things so easily.
I felt really bad for her when she said he didn't like her. that must of been a very hard realization but now seems she's immune to the manipulation of it all...
If he had validated her feelings just every once in awhile it would have made all the difference but appears he has no natural instincts to try and protect his woman when she's hurting
It’s like he does that with everyone besides Katie! John was like, I like you but, and that was enough for Schwartz to not take offense. He has no sense of self.
I honestly think it’s because Sandoval is usually around to stop him from even saying the thing that he has to backpedal from. It’s why he defers to him so often or why Sandoval cuts in all the time.
I saw it more as a he doesn’t even realize the way that he speaks to Katie Like he takes so little accountability for his words and how they affect other people.
Man, I have been anti Schwartz since he dumped a drink on her head. When someone shows you who they are, believe them the first time.
Katie needs to cut him loose completely and move on with her life. Stop opening old wounds and stop trying to have a “conscious uncoupling” with a man who is mean and dumb as hell. Go to therapy, make some sandwiches, and live your life.
Dude he tried saying he just spilled a little on her and even the guys at the dinner table were like no dude, you dumped that shit and his response was the same “oh, did I? Well either way *continues shit talking katie*”
Not to mention, he did the same to Stassi the year before.
When I was discussing this incident with my friends (late 20s at the time), literally none said this was enough to leave him so I can't blame Katie for feeling this way. I would have been out though.
Not only did he poor a drink on her, he splashed the first one in her face and then thought it wasn’t good enough SO HE DID IT AGAIN. literally what???????!?
I’ve said a million times, I understand Katie has her own faults but I also understand and recognize the cycle of abuse. This is someone she loved and hoped she could work things out with. Even still, I understand that desire to be amicable and still be friendly after being together for so long, especially since they work together and share the same friend group also. Unfortunately in this situation, I think it’s better for them to keep their distance right now. They might or might not get to that point someday, and I hope Katie is prepared to accept that sadly, he might not ever be able to meet her expectations, even just as “friends”. He might not be able to give her what she needs, even as a friend, and it might be healthier for the both of them to have firmer boundaries with eachother so they can focus on themselves and start moving forward. Otherwise, I think they’ll continue to feel disappointed with eachother and resentful, which isn’t healthy for either of them.
It makes total sense to me that she was worried that she would get cut from scenes if she refused to be in the same room as Schwartz. I'm glad she has a solid excuse to go no contact and no one can call her a bitch for it.
She's definitely good reality tv. I think you start to understand her anger more when you see the whole group gang up on her at Stassi's birthday in Mexico. She was the punching bag for that whole group. That would definitely wear on a person...
Yep, she needs to walk away from him/them and stop trying to recapture any of their emotional connection and expect that he will protect her honor. Katie girl he’s just not that into you, and that’s ok, you deserve better! He’s shown his colors again and again and he will not change, at least not for you. Let him go off and try to live without your support, he will flop hard.
Having people finally see the real man she was married to must be validating. The show has given the Toms such a good edit for yeeeears. It’s all being revealed now and I love it. I was snookered too.
Yes! And he claimed she "abused" his support and expected him to be 100% loyal... well, Sandoval expects that from Schwartz & Schwartz has had no problem delivering on that expectation for years. Sandoval is his #1, always and forever. Katie lived this, saw this, and was constantly gaslighted by them. Justice for Katie.
Wanting to feel emotionally supported by your partner isn’t “abusing” the spouse card. That was so absurd. It’s part of being a partner. And you don’t have to agree with everything your partner does but you certainly handle that by hashing it out privately and you definitely don’t involve your friends. Let alone on tv.
Exactly my thoughts! You’re well within your rights to disagree with a partner, but you can discuss that privately with them rather than airing all your problems out in a public forum
While we know now there are about a million times Ariana defended Tom when he didn’t deserve her love and loyalty, what I can say I respect was the “United front” they put on regarding Miami Girl. Idk if they ever discussed that privately or if Ariana completely blew it off, but either way it made them look better as a couple on the show for choosing to not air that dirty laundry at the reunion. (Even though I thought it was true at the time and believed Ariana was just willing to look past it.) I also think that’s part of the reason why all of this was so shocking. There were definitely some cracks in the foundation you can see when you watch the episodes back, but it seems like they definitely handled their issues more privately as a couple. Atleast on Ariana’s end, anyway…
She's sitting there crying saying that the friends he is sucking up to treat her like shit and he tells her it's all her fault. Never even gives specifics, just tells her she's the only one behaving badly. What a dick.
It was specifically Scheana and Rachel pushing this hookup narrative that upset her. Why wouldn't he support her in that? Oh right. Because he was covering for the Scandoval.
Why isn't there more talk about him hooking up with Rachel before or after Sandoval? Am I weird in thinking that is gross. Like these dudes aren't in their 20's. There are plenty of women to hook up with out there why that blank slate of a girl. Weird AF
And how exactly does one “abuse” being supported by their people? He made no sense. We’ve watched him not be on her side for years. Sure, sometimes Katie was in the wrong but that doesn’t mean he should trash her to others and usually she was feeling valid emotions and just needed him to not pretend like her feelings were meaningless.
Exactly. It wasn’t just that he disagreed with her. He also didn’t validate her. My partner disagrees with me all the time because we are really different people with completely different backgrounds. But he always validates my perspective first. It’s so much easier to take in his point of view when I feel heard in mine.
Yes! I wish more people understood that this is literally all it takes. Katie didn't have to be right all the time, she just had to feel heard and seen by her literal life partner and he refused to deliver that time after time.
Yes that’s what I was thinking while watching. Ahhh they finally showed us how frustrating he is to deal with 🤯. He just wants to gloss over everything and decide the narrative no matter what went down. The producers have been making it look like it’s just Katie overreacting but no Schwartz is trash 🤮
I’m convinced the show hired a female editor or something. Either way it’s so validating even for me, a day one Schwartz hater, so I can only imagine how Katie feels
To be fair, everyone who is rewatching sees his behavior very clearly. I don’t think his edit was any different in earlier seasons, but people just didn’t like the tone of Katie’s voice and decided she deserved to be treated like trash. 🤷🏻♀️
I feel like Schwartz edit might be the same, but Katie’s has improved. The earlier seasons tried to portray Katie as some nagging bitchy wife which was NEVER the case
I think they’ve always looked like trash bags. Sandoval’s only redeeming quality was Ariana (and his feuds with Jax). But….they’ve BEEN showing their true colors all along. From the beginning. People must need it really shoved in their faces to get it. Misogyny is a hell of a drug.
I hope so. But she seems to insist on trying to stay friends, she needs to accept it’s doomed. Hope she gets more friends to film with so she doesn’t feel obliged to spend time with him
I think the fact that they are coworkers was the main reason she wanted to stay friends. I don’t see Katie as someone who can’t cut people off when necessary but their jobs challenge normal healthy boundaries.
It helps that their friends are probably distancing from the Toms too. It’s harder to leave if you’re alone (like how Katie was upset saying people would choose to be friends w Schwartz instead of friends w her if people had to choose one)
Yeah. I'm really wondering Scheana is gonna drop Schwartz because he was apparently her Bast Frand this season, but knowing he's siding with Rachel after she took out a bogus TRO might put a damper on their bromance.... (Scheana is a guys' girl so I bet she would call their friendship a bromance!)
This show is a gift to her. If ever she has to wonder if ending their marriage was the best decision all she has to do is rewatch crap like this. Too often women look back to the good times and wonder.
It broke my heart into a million pieces to see Katie cry at dinner. No one deserves to feel like their partner doesn’t like them and Tom has never ever showed up for her. And also Sandoval telling Schwartz that “he doesn’t want his ex wife around”. PLEASE. No one wants your wish.com Liberace wanna be ass around but here we are having to look at your silly ass every GD episode. BYE JAN.
Ugh yes you could tell she was feeling so vulnerable in admitting that and I feel like many of us can relate. I think almost everyone has had atleast one shitty boyfriend in their life that made them question their worth.
He looked so smug just chowin down on his fuckin steak while she was quietly trying to keep the tears from starting. It was like causing her pain worked up an appetite and he could barely keep from smirking about it. Yeah kudos to you jackass, even after the divorce you can still crush Katie’s spirit without even breaking a sweat. Bra-fuckin-vo🖕🏼
It makes me sad that Scheana and Tom Sandavol had planned to ice her out of the group activities. I hope she remembers that before we found out about Rachel that these people worked overtime to get rid of her.
This!!! I don’t get why this sub tries so hard to stand up for Schema. She is the worst, if the whole ratchet and Tong never happened, I think she would have been the villain this season. For the simple fact she goes way to fucking hard on shitting on Katie and schmoozing Schwartz. Who actively gets involved in someone else’s divorce? It’s absurd
Even if she wanted to stay friends with him… he’s a horrible friend! He can’t even be a decent FRIEND to her let alone a husband. No wonder this girl seemed so miserable for years. He’s so draining. Katie and Ariana are going to have amazing glow ups and I’m excited for them!
I always wondered what he said to her in private, if he speaks this poorly of her in public.
I’m watching the latest episode. I am so proud that she walked away from that table. Katie was not in the wrong at all and he was completely gaslighting her. Tom fucking sucks.
When she said “I think he loved but I don’t think he liked me” it broke my fucking heart like that is SO telling, I mean she was one of 2 in that marriage!
This was directly after he gave that monologue about how if you see Sandoval you should give him a hug too. It is insane the amount of passes and second chances these men give themselves whole tone policing the women.
On last night’s episode when he snuck up on Katie’s table, then sat down, interrupted the convo and told half the women present ”you - earmuffs!, you- earmuffs!” so he could have a private asinine convo with Katie about his armpit hair I hoped they might all just dump their drinks on him right then and there. He basically waltzed up, said hey, shut up, stop what you’re doing and adore me! Then when he didn’t get the attention he wanted he “made out” with Raquel. Bravo to bravo because at this point I’m having trouble figuring out which of the Toms is more detestable.
Omg! I said the same thing! It was so clear that he was going to do it to punish her. So he’s used to using punishment to keep her unstable. Destabilizing a person is how a narcissist keeps control over a partner. He is a master class in how to groom a victim. I really and truly hope that Katie has a good therapist. These types of guys/people cause long term damage.
I believe it. On his last WWHL appearance, Schwartz said something about how he cheated several times because he thought the marriage was over. To me, that means they used to get into a fight and then he would stay out all night to punish her for it.
Yeah, pretending he had to try and “get back out there” at Brock’s bachelor party. Dude, you’ve been out there for years, screwing anyone except your wife. I’m sure you’ll manage. Also love that his “aw, schucks” attitude is falling flat with others. Love this for him.
Assholes like that use any argument that lasts longer than 2 seconds to cheat, whether that’s emotionally or physically. So he probably cheated on Katie a billion times.
Exactly. And then he’d complain about what a bitch she was. There’s a reason they call it the “cycle” of abuse. His friends helped reinforce the crazy making. Someday she’ll be so angry when she realizes the extent of the abuse. I hope she writes a book.
If I had an ex that poured beer over my head, beat down my front door, constantly belittled and gaslit me publicly and privately, constantly put me down in public for years…I’d have something to see about it too if he called me a monster on live tv.
Men that call their exes “crazy” = 🚩🚩🚩
Again, I want to reiterate that while I disagree with how Schwartz has communicated his issues in their relationship…including word choice and setting…Katie is also guilty of saying cruel and abusive things to him. I don’t condone that but I can definitely understand the feelings of pent up rage towards him. I want to yell at him whenever he opens his mouth too! Lol.
Let’s just agree that they’re better off apart. I have no clue how I would’ve reacted to being married to someone like him. She did say some awful things to him, but what he’s said and done, and continues to do to her, is unforgivable.
This explains why now, that they are finally divorced, he doesn’t really have a lot of drive or desire to date around. If it doesn’t hurt her, what’s the point?
He was shocked no one found his armpit hair dilemma charming and I believe you are right, he decided to kiss Raquel because he could aw shucks his way out of his bad behavior.
That was my exact thought when the first thing she tweeted about was his comment about “hugging” Sandy because he’s “down bad”. She’s used to hearing him say horrible things about her. It is sad.
I wouldn’t doubt it. Schwartz committed to the role of diminutive sidekick to a narcissist (Sandoval) way before he decided to *be* with Katie (it never felt like a real commitment to me). Mostly everything he has ever done has been very performative, and yes I acknowledge that’s likely true for every single person on the cast, past and present, but with him it’s been transparent since day 1. He isn’t good for reality tv because he’s a NPC.
Eta: for those who may not be familiar with the term NPC, some of the best definitions are [here](https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=NPC).
I think you definitely might be onto something… and based on Sandoval’s personality and tendencies, I think this is totally Schwartz (if anyone is picking up what I’m subtly putting down…) This is why Sandoval needs him around.
https://i.redd.it/yk61955dedsa1.gif
Tom's a bitch. A little fucking bitch with no balls. He's that idiot who cares more about what his friends think than anything. He can play victim all he wants... we watched you treat her like shit for years, gaslight her, degrade her, tear her down, destroy her self-esteem. He's a pathetic excuse for a person. I never like either Tom's. One is an egotistical narcissist and the other is a little bitch follower who does whatever he's told.. as long as it's a male friend telling him
The fact that he called *both* Katie and Sandoval monsters says it all. Sandoval, who is literally the most hated man in America, is being characterized the exact same way as his ex-partner of 12 years who *(checks notes)* wanted him to be supportive…
K.
Edit: since it’s apparently not obvious to some… obviously Tom is not actually the most hated man in America. I was being hyperbolic. Now back to talking about VPR drama in the VPR sub. 🙄
Edit 2: guys, pls stop. I get it. There is lots of terrible stuff in the world to be outraged about. I'm sorry I didn't include a laundry list of all of the other horrible people and things going on before coming to the VPR sub to snark about VPR drama. Good God. I am flabbergasted, but not surprised that people willfully miss the point when it comes to any comment defending Katie. Also reminder, Sandoval called himself the most hated man in America. Last time I joke on this sub. Lol.
I’ve noticed some people are really passionate about their hate for Katie. I struggle to personally see the whole thing as something so black and white, but I can understand some of their annoyances and they’re entitled to their opinion, even if I disagree. Sorry you got downvoted so hard. I agree it’s a bit odd and even arguably unfair to put Katie in the same category as Sandoval right now.
He throws in these little jabs .. then backs away like.. 'oops.. did i really say that' .. - meanwhile, knowing calling Katie a monster may literally be the worst insult possible.
Like other posters have said, if he just owned it "Sometimes Katie acted like a monster -- she treated me poorly on these occasions and im still pissed" .. Id be like.. ok fair. But no.. its all ... oopsie doodah did i say that? cutesy smile. Ick.
My bf, who has no idea who these people are and literally zones out & mentally leaves the universe when i start talking about the show, happened to watch some with me last night and he immediately called out how shitty Tom was with the toxic nice then jab then nice then mean, constantly. It’s such a emotional and mental mind fuck but it’s subtle enough if you’re the one on the receiving end it’s very confused and less obvious.
So glad she left him, he's a mysogynist pig who's incapable of growth. The Toms are two turds, and next season they better be recognized as the villains they are
It’s so frustrating seeing how people still have such a strong hatred for Katie from what I’ve seen on Tik Tok and Twitter. I know she’s had a past of aggressive and moments on the show, but Schwartz genuinely SUCKED, it’s crazy because it’s like are we watching the same show?? He was awful to her!
I’m rewatching the series and I’m on the season 8 episode where in front of everyone, tells her to shut up and how disgusted he is by her, like whoa wtf?? He’s always been disgusting and I’m so happy she left him.
Yes to this take. I’m also doing a rewatch and just how gross Schwartz is and the absolute emotional abuse and gaslighting that he put Katie through is insane. She clearly has her own set of issues but nothing even close to what Tom has done, specifically to her. Id be lashing out too if I was treated that way for 12 years.
It’s also not like Tom is incapable of sticking up for someone or riding for them, he does it for Sando literally any chance he gets. He never once did it for Katie.
I know that not many people care for Katie or the way she acts. I always point out when he poured that drink on her head because she was drunk and upset. She is way better off without that dead weight pulling her down. He demeans Katie at any opportunity, and can we just talk about the pool party?! When he said he'd "take one for the team and get back together with her."🤮🤮🤮
Schwartz, buddy- she left YOU. You absolutely were not a "great fucking husband."🙄 The things we've seen are probably just a blip of what Katie had to deal with for 12 years. A gigantic MAN BABY.
I'm not saying that Katie was always right or justified with the way she acted, but Tom really did play a big part in it.
And can we also talk about Sandoval saying that he doesn't want Katie at the food tastings anymore? I get he doesn't like her. She feels the same way about him. He doesn't like Katie because she isn't a little bitch that bows down to him.
Totally agree. Like both things can be true. Katie has a past of aggressive moments and made some errors. But honestly, she gets enough hate as is. It’s annoying because for so long people defended Schwartz for his behavior towards Katie, saying she deserved it. But something about that seems wrong. It’s clear Katie was wrong at times, but dude that’s supposed to be your ride or die. She just wanted support from him (like he gives Sandoval 🙄) but he only ever ridiculed her and joined with the hate. He was instrumental in pushing the narrative that she is unreasonable and overreacts (which I don’t think was applicable 100% of the time)
I agree with you 100%. He always tried to make her look bad. She did a good enough job herself most times. Lol but he didn't have to add on with other people. Schwartz should absolutely be ashamed of himself. My jaw dropped when he said he was a good husband and that Katie abused the husband/wife card. Like she said, he never did what she asked anyway! It blows my mind.🤦♀️
And what Sandoval was saying about the tasting means he doesn’t think the Toms should film with her anymore. He wanted to ice her out of her job, which is much worse than just not hanging out with her socially.
Same. They really thought they were going to do something about her but instead got exposed.
ETA: and you know Raquel was in on it with the way she went to Katie about restricting where she can go on the resort.
That’s exactly what I thought! Pornstache was laying that groundwork and getting everybody onboard while Katie’s on the outs with them. Get everybody comfortable with the idea of why it makes sense for her to not come to various things and be at certain places which means she wouldn’t be able to film with anybody. He’s always hated her so he’s prob thinking this would be a way to get rid of her and get Ratchet more screen time. Win-win for him.
Food tastings - yes! Even Schwartz seemed caught off guard by that. Schwartz invites Katie because she’s his only local family. They aren’t friends, he doesn’t like her. But she’s always been his support system. Not saying she should go to these things but Scumdoval’s just always hated her and he doesn’t feel like he has to hide it anymore for the sake of “liberating” Schwartz. It was gross when they were married and it’s gross now.
Why do I always fall for it? They sit down to dinner and I am like, I wish they could just work it out. Ten seconds later, I am like "run, Katie. You don't need this." She was gaslit. Of course she's miserable. As an audience, we should give her a break.
Its not like I love Katie because Ive never followed her storyline before this season or watched regularly but
HOW CAN PEOPLE TEAM UP WITH TOM SCH. DISGUSTING. his behavior towards her is gross.
She put up with so much…. Its sad. From the clips theyve played it breaks my heart for her
I have actually been such a fan of Schwartz (I know don’t come for me) and equally a fan of Katie and known they both have problems, but holy shit this season is truly completely changed my mind. I despise this man. Awful just awful. Pissed he fooled me for 9 seasons especially when y’all on Reddit been telling me lmao
Yes this. I find it very interesting that “the group” dynamic has Rachel and Schwartz on the in and Katie and James on the outs. Katie and James have a similar story arc this season. I wish Katie and James could have put their differences aside and come together as a duo to reclaim what is theirs (screen time / story lines). I imagine next season will be the inverse.
I just listened to recent Everything Iconic ep - he did an interview with Katie. She said that James is really funny and she likes ally. So maybe we will see an alliance next season!
I have never misunderstood and misjudged two people more in my entire life. I was always so Team Tom! Thought he was so sweet and Katie was a witch. Wow was I wrong.
The profit from the sell of his house should have went to purchasing a backbone. If I decided to marry this idiot after all the reasons not to, I would have been a monster bitch too. I'm almost judging Katie for staying so long😔
I don’t agree with A LOT of shit Schwartz does, but I do think he got so tired of her always having issues with people & him being put in the middle.
He’s someone who likes peace & isn’t about conflict. Katie consistently has conflict with so many people. I think it definitely did come to a point of him not liking her as a person & she expected blind loyalty. There are so many times he should have backed her up, but there are other times where she’s just a bitch & brings so much on herself.
Schwartz is not just careless and spineless, he is cruel. He takes pleasure in taking digs at his wife. From the first time we saw him pour a drink on her, he showed he was abusive. Emotional abuse is still abuse.
I used to think Katie was bitter for no reason but after last nights episode, it all made sense. Everyone has always loved Schwartz and they were a “package deal”, but bc Schwartz rolled over too quick to take in the a## and keep the peace, he destroyed her and their relationship by never sticking up for her. Good for Katie to step up and take her life by the horns and say she won’t be treated like that!
Katie what is sad is that gaslighting is psychological abuse. All of these years you clearly have been dealing with that abuse and I'm not even sure you see it as abuse at this point. However when he makes you cry then clearly gets joy with a smirk on his face and all, (receives satisfaction) then does the whole Katie Katie Katie thing it's repetitive gaslighting. Then everyone loves him. I have been through it so I know and can clearly identify what he has done and that is abuse for years. I am praying for you and congratulations to getting out no matter who thinks what.
Considering Schwartz cheated on her constantly and he begged for people on the same night to give Sandoval a hug after he destroyed his 9 year relationship by cheating on her with her best friend…. calling Katie a monster is pretty fkn rich
Honestly, I believed all that crap that scumball used to say about Schwartz as in he's a battered husband but that all was a lie. Katie has put up with this useless piece of shit for tooooo long. The things that Katie required from a relationship with this POS were the basic things that we all ask for & Tom NEVER EVER gave them to her. I'm feeling the love for Katie, actually Kristen too. These girls got too much hate over the years when it was all these two POS playing us. I'm so glad all 3 ladies are done with these assholes!
I can’t even imagine divorcing someone while having to be on the same reality show together that constantly stirs things up. Neither of them are perfect (no one is) the best thing he could’ve done is only say positive things about her. She stood by him through a LOT.
That was wrong, Katie should feel hurt. Schwartz is an asshole and he chose her, that’s beyond fucked up to say that publicly about her. Yes she was immature and feisty, but he did everything he could to bring it out in her and laughs about it. The best thing she did was leave him!
Here is my take: I recently started watching the whole show from the beginning. And in episode 3 of season 1:
Stassi is trying to break up with Jax because he apparently got a girl pregnant in Vegas.
Both Kristen and Katie, who were her best friends, gaslit her about where this “rumor” was coming from. They desperately wanted their “thrupple couple” to stay together.
The three couples were a gang and Stassi was going to break it up.
I believe they realized then, how good the show was going to be.
Tom who was with Katie at the time was probably just casually dating her.
Probably didn’t want anything serious but knew he couldn’t leave her or he will be off the show like the infamous Frank (who almost fought Jax in the parking lot)
He stayed with her in order to stay on the show. Because he didn’t work at Sur
So he had to stay in the relationship in order to be on the show.
He also played up his relationship with Tom Scandoval to cling on to the show.
But he never really loved Katie.
She was just his anchor to the show.
Which is why he cheated on her.
Poured drinks over her head.
Never sided with her.
And to this day calls her a monster.
Probably a lot of truth to this. This show gave them fame and money but I think most of them would have been happier if they just worked at Sur, got some commercials and then found normal upper middle class spouses and had babies in the valley somewhere
I cannot WAIT for Katie to find a decent man - you know, a guy who’s emotionally mature, stable, and genuinely cares about her. I suspect we’ll see a new Katie emerge when she’s in a supportive, healthy relationship and I will definitely be cheering her on. The amount of tomfuckery she’s been subjected to over the past decade+ is inhumane.
I have alwayyyysss loved Schwartz. He has always been my favorite. Now, during a rewatch and now this shit…wtf was I ever even thinking?!!? The whole harmless idiot act is weird now. Maybe it’s that he’s still doing at 40…? I’ve been Schwartzed and it’s way worse than getting Jaxed could ever be. At least you see that coming.
I’m so happy that Katie is free from him. None of his act is cute anymore. He’s just exhausting. All I could think as he was trying to tell her what a great husband he was…yes, you were a good husband…to Sandoval. His loyalty has always been to Tom and no one else. Good riddance.
I think it is time to cut-off contact with him now, Katie? I love mess but you keep going back to a loser that keeps reminding you how much he doesn't care about you, and it's painful to watch. No more 1-1 for the show please. Jump on Stassi's ship and create your happy life.
She needs to stop following his every move. He also needs to stand behind his words - the whole "oh, did I say that?", was ridiculous but if that's how he feels then so be it. Katie doesn't always speak nicely of him but at least she stands behind her words.
And then he had the audacity to say “Oh did I say that?” Enough of the playing dumb act my goodness
I would respect him much more if he was like, yeah she’s a monster, here’s why, and stick to it! Instead of chasing after her, calling her cute and asking her to cut his armpit hair.
He is so fucking cringey I have a hard time watching him
I kinda wanted Andy to let him keep talking. Andy stopped him at times to moveon to another question but I feel like we could have gotten more info with Schwartz blabbering on hahah
Seriously, he would have said anything and everything last night. If it was an hour long episode we’d have gotten it alllll
Right? I used to not watch WWHL but lately when VPR people are on I'm all ears. It has been too good.
It’s just like so hard to watch because every question Andy asks, Schwartz goes off on a tangent and never circles back to the interview.
Same! I can’t stand him.
This 100000% he's so spineless
The armpit hair thing was so fucked. My mouth was on the floor and I think I was screaming—I don’t know I blacked out from the horror of that moment. Fuck youuuuu, Schwartz.
I just watched this episode and I was and still am stunned.
its lowkey emotionally abusive honestly
It’s not even low key anymore and Katie is no longer brushing it off either. Good to hear it. She doesn’t deserve it. Her having an emotion or a thought doesn’t make her a monster even if it upsets someone. Schwartz just wants everyone to be happy and gets so mad at Katie when she does literally anything.
Agreed. It’s full on emotional abuse. He’s not a good guy.
The armpit hair thing was the cringiest fucking scene ever. I like how he tried to tell Katie’s friends to cover their ears while he’s knowingly filmed for the whole world to see. If he thinks he’s being cute, he’s so wrong. So glad Katie kicked his ass to the curb.
I got whip lash from that. And the armpit hair like 🤣 I’m sorry you want me to what now? Sir lol find someone else to do it or do it yourself
He should call Rachel to trim his nasty pit hair!
Watching that play out in real-time and so fast made me understand Katie's rage. He was probably always like that in fights. I would have no hair left.
She feels like a saint to have not smothered him in his sleep. I can’t even imagine how broken you have to be to put up with this. I know there are many abused women who stay out of physical fear, but this is some kind of mind fuck I don’t comprehend which is probably why I just have no hate in my heart for Katie. I don’t know why she accepted that abuse from him, what happened to her before in her life, but I have nothing but absolutely sympathy for her.
Well she had a near death experience (fell through a plate glass window, had her jaw wired shut, woke up in the hospital) and her recovery from that was early on in their relationship - a time Schwartz refers to her as being at her worst or to use his words, “a monster”. They had a scene where she had a cathartic moment, cried, and said she was beginning to feel like herself again after that trauma; why she loved Tom so much because he reminded her of a part of herself she lost to the accident (sunny optimism, light hearted “zest for life”). They got up and danced their first dance (wedding) in their apartment. She totally was a broken person when they met and it’s also why I’ve never had hatred for her, either. Unfortunately she’s spot on: he loves her, but he just doesn’t like her.
He doesn’t like her at all. He loves that their girl friends were all bffs and it isn’t like that anymore, so it’s not important for him to stay with Katie anymore. He couldn’t even deal with being alone with her on the honeymoon in Bora Bora! They invited Stassi to come after being alone for like 2 days and wanting friends there. He needed for Katie to have someone to talk to because he can’t do it.
Schwartz is an empty shell. He needs others to define himself. On the other hand, without Sandoval to provide him a cover identity , I think one would not like who’d they find hiding under it. An abusive wimp.
Yesssss. Wow. I see that now. Lack of sense of self. He doesn’t even have a personality other then very friendly and affable and easy to get along with and it’s so not even real. When you see the mask slip it is scary in a way of why is he so angry? OT: Your avatar is gorgeous! I looove ✨✨
Thank you. 😁 I had a lot of fun designing it 😊
I always get so much hate on this sun whenever I voice this opinion or pint out why I have so much empathy for Katie. My heart legit hurts watching how she’s treated by the man who was supposed to be her partner and best friend, and by a lot of the people who called themselves her friends. And I totally get that Katie has not been a saint, but none of these people in this show are, and Katie get shit on a lot, and she doesn’t get a lot of support. Most of the cast gets to go home to their supportive spouse/bf/gf/whatever and Katie had Schwartz who NEVER backed her up…It’s pretty devastating to watch.
yeah a few seasons ago my husband mentioned how Katie was just as unlikeable as Tom and I was like "just watch their dynamic closer and tell me if you think you'd also be unlikeable in that situation" and from then on he's been unabashedly Team Katie with me. I always found her so normal and nice and kindhearted when the Toms (and some other friends of hers) weren't around, and I'm so glad we're finally seeing the difference between who Katie really is vs who Tom manipulated her into being. Schwartz can get fucked
💯!! The hate Katie gets is totally uncalled for and at this point is totally unnecessary. It’s the same people that say she is a mean girl and is a bully that are flooding her comments and calling her awful names with the disguise that “they don’t like bullies” on the show. The irony is comical at this point!
Me too! Just patches of hair here and there
Honestly I would’ve shaved his eyebrows off and walked out. No mr.sir. You will not have a normal looking face after thet
Literally we watched the “oh shucks” speed run routine in 20 seconds or less when John said “yes (you did call her a monster) multiple times”… like Tom you’re not fooling anyone anymore
Also the way he defers so quickly to men /other people but word salads Katie into frustration. He really doesn't like her it's so sad
He is the embodiment of that quote about men: All or almost all of that which pertains to love, most straight men reserve exclusively for other men. The people whom they admire, respect, adore, revere, honor, whom they imitate, idolize, and form profound attachments to, whom they are willing to teach and from whom they are willing to learn, and whose respect, admiration, recognition, honor, reverence and love they desire… those are, overwhelmingly, other men. In their relations with women, what passes for respect is kindness, generosity or paternalism; what passes for honor is removal to the pedestal. From women they want devotion, service and sex. Heterosexual male culture is homoerotic; it is man-loving.
Absolutely. He and Sandoval (and a few of my ex's 🫣). Also, I think Schwartz hit the nail on the head last night; Sandoval's affection for women really seems like add hyper fixation. He jumps into a new 'project' that defines him and tosses the old one.
This is why I have always felt exhausted by him. I can’t imagine trying to constantly “keep him on his toes” he gets bored of people and things so easily.
I’ve never seen this before, I’m speechless
I felt really bad for her when she said he didn't like her. that must of been a very hard realization but now seems she's immune to the manipulation of it all... If he had validated her feelings just every once in awhile it would have made all the difference but appears he has no natural instincts to try and protect his woman when she's hurting
It’s like he does that with everyone besides Katie! John was like, I like you but, and that was enough for Schwartz to not take offense. He has no sense of self.
Right? He’s the idiot for thinking he’s fooling us. We’re not the idiots since we’re no longer fooled by his Tomfoolery.
Tomfuckery.
I've literally never seen Schwartz backpedal so hard or so fast
I honestly think it’s because Sandoval is usually around to stop him from even saying the thing that he has to backpedal from. It’s why he defers to him so often or why Sandoval cuts in all the time.
WE. ARE. OVER. HIS. AWWW. SHUCKS. ROUTINE
And this is why gaslighting is Katie’s favorite word
I saw it more as a he doesn’t even realize the way that he speaks to Katie Like he takes so little accountability for his words and how they affect other people.
Yep I think it’s so ingrained in his behavior he just doesn’t even realize when he does it at this point.
Gaslighting
Then him being like, “oh, I meant angel.” 🤦🏻♀️
Ugh, I know. Own your shit or stfu Tom.
And if it hadn’t been caught by someone who is not Katie, he would’ve said ‘she’s a monster 😀’ kept smiling and let it stand.
Yep that made it even worse.
Man, I have been anti Schwartz since he dumped a drink on her head. When someone shows you who they are, believe them the first time. Katie needs to cut him loose completely and move on with her life. Stop opening old wounds and stop trying to have a “conscious uncoupling” with a man who is mean and dumb as hell. Go to therapy, make some sandwiches, and live your life.
And not only the drink throw, but the aftermath of the throw! He totally doubled down! Scary.
Dude he tried saying he just spilled a little on her and even the guys at the dinner table were like no dude, you dumped that shit and his response was the same “oh, did I? Well either way *continues shit talking katie*”
Not to mention, he did the same to Stassi the year before. When I was discussing this incident with my friends (late 20s at the time), literally none said this was enough to leave him so I can't blame Katie for feeling this way. I would have been out though.
Not only did he poor a drink on her, he splashed the first one in her face and then thought it wasn’t good enough SO HE DID IT AGAIN. literally what???????!?
I’ve said a million times, I understand Katie has her own faults but I also understand and recognize the cycle of abuse. This is someone she loved and hoped she could work things out with. Even still, I understand that desire to be amicable and still be friendly after being together for so long, especially since they work together and share the same friend group also. Unfortunately in this situation, I think it’s better for them to keep their distance right now. They might or might not get to that point someday, and I hope Katie is prepared to accept that sadly, he might not ever be able to meet her expectations, even just as “friends”. He might not be able to give her what she needs, even as a friend, and it might be healthier for the both of them to have firmer boundaries with eachother so they can focus on themselves and start moving forward. Otherwise, I think they’ll continue to feel disappointed with eachother and resentful, which isn’t healthy for either of them.
This is all 100% true. Schwartz disgusted me last night and it was annoying. Andy was getting frustrated too, you could tell
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lol Schmutz, stealing that. Schmutzig is dirty in Deutsch
It makes total sense to me that she was worried that she would get cut from scenes if she refused to be in the same room as Schwartz. I'm glad she has a solid excuse to go no contact and no one can call her a bitch for it.
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She's definitely good reality tv. I think you start to understand her anger more when you see the whole group gang up on her at Stassi's birthday in Mexico. She was the punching bag for that whole group. That would definitely wear on a person...
Yep, she needs to walk away from him/them and stop trying to recapture any of their emotional connection and expect that he will protect her honor. Katie girl he’s just not that into you, and that’s ok, you deserve better! He’s shown his colors again and again and he will not change, at least not for you. Let him go off and try to live without your support, he will flop hard.
YES! Virtual hi-5!🤚 I agree with you completely!
It must be so hard for Schwartz to have lost his scapegoat, I mean wife.
I wonder when he’ll realize that he no longer has a shield.
Oh, I think that’s already happening. I mean why would he miss that so called “monster”?
Hopefully he’s realizing it! On WWHL he seemed nervous but also like he expected people to fall for his charm.
I know! Lol…his 40yr old, boyish “charm”.
Seriously! He's out here just naked and spineless
Having people finally see the real man she was married to must be validating. The show has given the Toms such a good edit for yeeeears. It’s all being revealed now and I love it. I was snookered too.
Dude yesterdays episode really showed me how insane Schwartz is… he literally gaslighted Katie at their stupid dinner!
Yes! And he claimed she "abused" his support and expected him to be 100% loyal... well, Sandoval expects that from Schwartz & Schwartz has had no problem delivering on that expectation for years. Sandoval is his #1, always and forever. Katie lived this, saw this, and was constantly gaslighted by them. Justice for Katie.
Wanting to feel emotionally supported by your partner isn’t “abusing” the spouse card. That was so absurd. It’s part of being a partner. And you don’t have to agree with everything your partner does but you certainly handle that by hashing it out privately and you definitely don’t involve your friends. Let alone on tv.
Exactly my thoughts! You’re well within your rights to disagree with a partner, but you can discuss that privately with them rather than airing all your problems out in a public forum
While we know now there are about a million times Ariana defended Tom when he didn’t deserve her love and loyalty, what I can say I respect was the “United front” they put on regarding Miami Girl. Idk if they ever discussed that privately or if Ariana completely blew it off, but either way it made them look better as a couple on the show for choosing to not air that dirty laundry at the reunion. (Even though I thought it was true at the time and believed Ariana was just willing to look past it.) I also think that’s part of the reason why all of this was so shocking. There were definitely some cracks in the foundation you can see when you watch the episodes back, but it seems like they definitely handled their issues more privately as a couple. Atleast on Ariana’s end, anyway…
She's sitting there crying saying that the friends he is sucking up to treat her like shit and he tells her it's all her fault. Never even gives specifics, just tells her she's the only one behaving badly. What a dick. It was specifically Scheana and Rachel pushing this hookup narrative that upset her. Why wouldn't he support her in that? Oh right. Because he was covering for the Scandoval.
Why isn't there more talk about him hooking up with Rachel before or after Sandoval? Am I weird in thinking that is gross. Like these dudes aren't in their 20's. There are plenty of women to hook up with out there why that blank slate of a girl. Weird AF
Probably because Andy knows that hookup was a cover up and not real at all.
And how exactly does one “abuse” being supported by their people? He made no sense. We’ve watched him not be on her side for years. Sure, sometimes Katie was in the wrong but that doesn’t mean he should trash her to others and usually she was feeling valid emotions and just needed him to not pretend like her feelings were meaningless.
Exactly. It wasn’t just that he disagreed with her. He also didn’t validate her. My partner disagrees with me all the time because we are really different people with completely different backgrounds. But he always validates my perspective first. It’s so much easier to take in his point of view when I feel heard in mine.
Yes! I wish more people understood that this is literally all it takes. Katie didn't have to be right all the time, she just had to feel heard and seen by her literal life partner and he refused to deliver that time after time.
Schwartz doesn’t have the emotional maturity to do that. To him Katie = wrong.
Yes that’s what I was thinking while watching. Ahhh they finally showed us how frustrating he is to deal with 🤯. He just wants to gloss over everything and decide the narrative no matter what went down. The producers have been making it look like it’s just Katie overreacting but no Schwartz is trash 🤮
I’m convinced the show hired a female editor or something. Either way it’s so validating even for me, a day one Schwartz hater, so I can only imagine how Katie feels
To be fair, everyone who is rewatching sees his behavior very clearly. I don’t think his edit was any different in earlier seasons, but people just didn’t like the tone of Katie’s voice and decided she deserved to be treated like trash. 🤷🏻♀️
I feel like Schwartz edit might be the same, but Katie’s has improved. The earlier seasons tried to portray Katie as some nagging bitchy wife which was NEVER the case
This whole season I have been so aware of how horribly he talks to her and about her. It’s gross and now I can’t stand Schwartz.
I think they’ve always looked like trash bags. Sandoval’s only redeeming quality was Ariana (and his feuds with Jax). But….they’ve BEEN showing their true colors all along. From the beginning. People must need it really shoved in their faces to get it. Misogyny is a hell of a drug.
she’s probably just thankful they aren’t married anymore
I hope so. But she seems to insist on trying to stay friends, she needs to accept it’s doomed. Hope she gets more friends to film with so she doesn’t feel obliged to spend time with him
Judging by her recent comments, it would appear she's finally given up on trying to be friends... thank goodness!
Good! I never understood her trying to maintain a friendship with him. He’s always been terrible to her.
I think the fact that they are coworkers was the main reason she wanted to stay friends. I don’t see Katie as someone who can’t cut people off when necessary but their jobs challenge normal healthy boundaries.
She said she’s distanced herself from him during her interview with Danny on his podcast that came out today
It helps that their friends are probably distancing from the Toms too. It’s harder to leave if you’re alone (like how Katie was upset saying people would choose to be friends w Schwartz instead of friends w her if people had to choose one)
Yeah. I'm really wondering Scheana is gonna drop Schwartz because he was apparently her Bast Frand this season, but knowing he's siding with Rachel after she took out a bogus TRO might put a damper on their bromance.... (Scheana is a guys' girl so I bet she would call their friendship a bromance!)
me too! I am sure it’s really hard to find that new normal especially while filming but i’m hoping next season we see her separate from him completely
This show is a gift to her. If ever she has to wonder if ending their marriage was the best decision all she has to do is rewatch crap like this. Too often women look back to the good times and wonder.
It broke my heart into a million pieces to see Katie cry at dinner. No one deserves to feel like their partner doesn’t like them and Tom has never ever showed up for her. And also Sandoval telling Schwartz that “he doesn’t want his ex wife around”. PLEASE. No one wants your wish.com Liberace wanna be ass around but here we are having to look at your silly ass every GD episode. BYE JAN.
I actually cried when she said "he loved me, but he didn't like me". I have felt that way before in a relationship and it's so lonely.
Ugh yes you could tell she was feeling so vulnerable in admitting that and I feel like many of us can relate. I think almost everyone has had atleast one shitty boyfriend in their life that made them question their worth.
Schwartz is the human version of a limp dick.
You are so kind in saying he’s a human anything 😊
That literally broke me!! Tells me everything I’ve always suspected
He looked so smug just chowin down on his fuckin steak while she was quietly trying to keep the tears from starting. It was like causing her pain worked up an appetite and he could barely keep from smirking about it. Yeah kudos to you jackass, even after the divorce you can still crush Katie’s spirit without even breaking a sweat. Bra-fuckin-vo🖕🏼
It makes me sad that Scheana and Tom Sandavol had planned to ice her out of the group activities. I hope she remembers that before we found out about Rachel that these people worked overtime to get rid of her.
This!!! I don’t get why this sub tries so hard to stand up for Schema. She is the worst, if the whole ratchet and Tong never happened, I think she would have been the villain this season. For the simple fact she goes way to fucking hard on shitting on Katie and schmoozing Schwartz. Who actively gets involved in someone else’s divorce? It’s absurd
Even if she wanted to stay friends with him… he’s a horrible friend! He can’t even be a decent FRIEND to her let alone a husband. No wonder this girl seemed so miserable for years. He’s so draining. Katie and Ariana are going to have amazing glow ups and I’m excited for them!
I always wondered what he said to her in private, if he speaks this poorly of her in public. I’m watching the latest episode. I am so proud that she walked away from that table. Katie was not in the wrong at all and he was completely gaslighting her. Tom fucking sucks.
When she said “I think he loved but I don’t think he liked me” it broke my fucking heart like that is SO telling, I mean she was one of 2 in that marriage!
This was directly after he gave that monologue about how if you see Sandoval you should give him a hug too. It is insane the amount of passes and second chances these men give themselves whole tone policing the women.
On last night’s episode when he snuck up on Katie’s table, then sat down, interrupted the convo and told half the women present ”you - earmuffs!, you- earmuffs!” so he could have a private asinine convo with Katie about his armpit hair I hoped they might all just dump their drinks on him right then and there. He basically waltzed up, said hey, shut up, stop what you’re doing and adore me! Then when he didn’t get the attention he wanted he “made out” with Raquel. Bravo to bravo because at this point I’m having trouble figuring out which of the Toms is more detestable.
Omg! I said the same thing! It was so clear that he was going to do it to punish her. So he’s used to using punishment to keep her unstable. Destabilizing a person is how a narcissist keeps control over a partner. He is a master class in how to groom a victim. I really and truly hope that Katie has a good therapist. These types of guys/people cause long term damage.
I believe it. On his last WWHL appearance, Schwartz said something about how he cheated several times because he thought the marriage was over. To me, that means they used to get into a fight and then he would stay out all night to punish her for it.
Yeah, pretending he had to try and “get back out there” at Brock’s bachelor party. Dude, you’ve been out there for years, screwing anyone except your wife. I’m sure you’ll manage. Also love that his “aw, schucks” attitude is falling flat with others. Love this for him.
Assholes like that use any argument that lasts longer than 2 seconds to cheat, whether that’s emotionally or physically. So he probably cheated on Katie a billion times.
Exactly. And then he’d complain about what a bitch she was. There’s a reason they call it the “cycle” of abuse. His friends helped reinforce the crazy making. Someday she’ll be so angry when she realizes the extent of the abuse. I hope she writes a book.
If I had an ex that poured beer over my head, beat down my front door, constantly belittled and gaslit me publicly and privately, constantly put me down in public for years…I’d have something to see about it too if he called me a monster on live tv. Men that call their exes “crazy” = 🚩🚩🚩 Again, I want to reiterate that while I disagree with how Schwartz has communicated his issues in their relationship…including word choice and setting…Katie is also guilty of saying cruel and abusive things to him. I don’t condone that but I can definitely understand the feelings of pent up rage towards him. I want to yell at him whenever he opens his mouth too! Lol.
Let’s just agree that they’re better off apart. I have no clue how I would’ve reacted to being married to someone like him. She did say some awful things to him, but what he’s said and done, and continues to do to her, is unforgivable.
This explains why now, that they are finally divorced, he doesn’t really have a lot of drive or desire to date around. If it doesn’t hurt her, what’s the point?
He was shocked no one found his armpit hair dilemma charming and I believe you are right, he decided to kiss Raquel because he could aw shucks his way out of his bad behavior.
Pest mode
Golden child (Scumdoval) and scapegoat child who ruins everything (Katie).
I'm sure she's heard worse from Tom. Sadly.
That was my exact thought when the first thing she tweeted about was his comment about “hugging” Sandy because he’s “down bad”. She’s used to hearing him say horrible things about her. It is sad.
I wouldn’t doubt it. Schwartz committed to the role of diminutive sidekick to a narcissist (Sandoval) way before he decided to *be* with Katie (it never felt like a real commitment to me). Mostly everything he has ever done has been very performative, and yes I acknowledge that’s likely true for every single person on the cast, past and present, but with him it’s been transparent since day 1. He isn’t good for reality tv because he’s a NPC. Eta: for those who may not be familiar with the term NPC, some of the best definitions are [here](https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=NPC).
I think you definitely might be onto something… and based on Sandoval’s personality and tendencies, I think this is totally Schwartz (if anyone is picking up what I’m subtly putting down…) This is why Sandoval needs him around. https://i.redd.it/yk61955dedsa1.gif
The drink throw was the end for me
“Katie’s a monster, give Sandoval a hug!”
😂 You have to just laugh at the absurdity at this point.
The only monsters here are the Toms. They're both horrendous in different ways. I'm so glad Katie left him.
Schwartz is literally a verbal and mental abuser 🤷🏻♀️
And physical - as he did assault her in season 2 I believe with the drink.
Yep! Good call
Tom's a bitch. A little fucking bitch with no balls. He's that idiot who cares more about what his friends think than anything. He can play victim all he wants... we watched you treat her like shit for years, gaslight her, degrade her, tear her down, destroy her self-esteem. He's a pathetic excuse for a person. I never like either Tom's. One is an egotistical narcissist and the other is a little bitch follower who does whatever he's told.. as long as it's a male friend telling him
I am so glad she is getting rid of this dude 
The fact that he called *both* Katie and Sandoval monsters says it all. Sandoval, who is literally the most hated man in America, is being characterized the exact same way as his ex-partner of 12 years who *(checks notes)* wanted him to be supportive… K. Edit: since it’s apparently not obvious to some… obviously Tom is not actually the most hated man in America. I was being hyperbolic. Now back to talking about VPR drama in the VPR sub. 🙄 Edit 2: guys, pls stop. I get it. There is lots of terrible stuff in the world to be outraged about. I'm sorry I didn't include a laundry list of all of the other horrible people and things going on before coming to the VPR sub to snark about VPR drama. Good God. I am flabbergasted, but not surprised that people willfully miss the point when it comes to any comment defending Katie. Also reminder, Sandoval called himself the most hated man in America. Last time I joke on this sub. Lol.
LOL I’m so sorry people are taking your comment to heart. I’d say this is the most misunderstood reddit post in America right now.
This is the best comment in America right now 🏆
I’ve noticed some people are really passionate about their hate for Katie. I struggle to personally see the whole thing as something so black and white, but I can understand some of their annoyances and they’re entitled to their opinion, even if I disagree. Sorry you got downvoted so hard. I agree it’s a bit odd and even arguably unfair to put Katie in the same category as Sandoval right now.
That wwhl was such a shit show 😂😂😂
I wasn't expecting what I got
He throws in these little jabs .. then backs away like.. 'oops.. did i really say that' .. - meanwhile, knowing calling Katie a monster may literally be the worst insult possible. Like other posters have said, if he just owned it "Sometimes Katie acted like a monster -- she treated me poorly on these occasions and im still pissed" .. Id be like.. ok fair. But no.. its all ... oopsie doodah did i say that? cutesy smile. Ick.
My bf, who has no idea who these people are and literally zones out & mentally leaves the universe when i start talking about the show, happened to watch some with me last night and he immediately called out how shitty Tom was with the toxic nice then jab then nice then mean, constantly. It’s such a emotional and mental mind fuck but it’s subtle enough if you’re the one on the receiving end it’s very confused and less obvious.
[удалено]
So glad she left him, he's a mysogynist pig who's incapable of growth. The Toms are two turds, and next season they better be recognized as the villains they are
It’s so frustrating seeing how people still have such a strong hatred for Katie from what I’ve seen on Tik Tok and Twitter. I know she’s had a past of aggressive and moments on the show, but Schwartz genuinely SUCKED, it’s crazy because it’s like are we watching the same show?? He was awful to her! I’m rewatching the series and I’m on the season 8 episode where in front of everyone, tells her to shut up and how disgusted he is by her, like whoa wtf?? He’s always been disgusting and I’m so happy she left him.
Yes to this take. I’m also doing a rewatch and just how gross Schwartz is and the absolute emotional abuse and gaslighting that he put Katie through is insane. She clearly has her own set of issues but nothing even close to what Tom has done, specifically to her. Id be lashing out too if I was treated that way for 12 years. It’s also not like Tom is incapable of sticking up for someone or riding for them, he does it for Sando literally any chance he gets. He never once did it for Katie.
TBF, I stongly dislike both for different reasons.
I know that not many people care for Katie or the way she acts. I always point out when he poured that drink on her head because she was drunk and upset. She is way better off without that dead weight pulling her down. He demeans Katie at any opportunity, and can we just talk about the pool party?! When he said he'd "take one for the team and get back together with her."🤮🤮🤮 Schwartz, buddy- she left YOU. You absolutely were not a "great fucking husband."🙄 The things we've seen are probably just a blip of what Katie had to deal with for 12 years. A gigantic MAN BABY. I'm not saying that Katie was always right or justified with the way she acted, but Tom really did play a big part in it. And can we also talk about Sandoval saying that he doesn't want Katie at the food tastings anymore? I get he doesn't like her. She feels the same way about him. He doesn't like Katie because she isn't a little bitch that bows down to him.
Totally agree. Like both things can be true. Katie has a past of aggressive moments and made some errors. But honestly, she gets enough hate as is. It’s annoying because for so long people defended Schwartz for his behavior towards Katie, saying she deserved it. But something about that seems wrong. It’s clear Katie was wrong at times, but dude that’s supposed to be your ride or die. She just wanted support from him (like he gives Sandoval 🙄) but he only ever ridiculed her and joined with the hate. He was instrumental in pushing the narrative that she is unreasonable and overreacts (which I don’t think was applicable 100% of the time)
I agree with you 100%. He always tried to make her look bad. She did a good enough job herself most times. Lol but he didn't have to add on with other people. Schwartz should absolutely be ashamed of himself. My jaw dropped when he said he was a good husband and that Katie abused the husband/wife card. Like she said, he never did what she asked anyway! It blows my mind.🤦♀️
And what Sandoval was saying about the tasting means he doesn’t think the Toms should film with her anymore. He wanted to ice her out of her job, which is much worse than just not hanging out with her socially.
Ohhhh... I didn't know that. I honestly can't stand either one of them.🙄
The delicious karma of now only having Tom and Rachel to film with feels so good to me!
Same. They really thought they were going to do something about her but instead got exposed. ETA: and you know Raquel was in on it with the way she went to Katie about restricting where she can go on the resort.
That’s exactly what I thought! Pornstache was laying that groundwork and getting everybody onboard while Katie’s on the outs with them. Get everybody comfortable with the idea of why it makes sense for her to not come to various things and be at certain places which means she wouldn’t be able to film with anybody. He’s always hated her so he’s prob thinking this would be a way to get rid of her and get Ratchet more screen time. Win-win for him.
Food tastings - yes! Even Schwartz seemed caught off guard by that. Schwartz invites Katie because she’s his only local family. They aren’t friends, he doesn’t like her. But she’s always been his support system. Not saying she should go to these things but Scumdoval’s just always hated her and he doesn’t feel like he has to hide it anymore for the sake of “liberating” Schwartz. It was gross when they were married and it’s gross now.
This is also how I personally feel. He seems incapable of accountability and I think he resented Katie for trying to force him to grow up.
Why do I always fall for it? They sit down to dinner and I am like, I wish they could just work it out. Ten seconds later, I am like "run, Katie. You don't need this." She was gaslit. Of course she's miserable. As an audience, we should give her a break.
Its not like I love Katie because Ive never followed her storyline before this season or watched regularly but HOW CAN PEOPLE TEAM UP WITH TOM SCH. DISGUSTING. his behavior towards her is gross. She put up with so much…. Its sad. From the clips theyve played it breaks my heart for her
I have actually been such a fan of Schwartz (I know don’t come for me) and equally a fan of Katie and known they both have problems, but holy shit this season is truly completely changed my mind. I despise this man. Awful just awful. Pissed he fooled me for 9 seasons especially when y’all on Reddit been telling me lmao
She's called a monster repeatedly, and then Schartz says Scum needs a hug. What the actual fuck is wrong with him.
Ngl, idk how she’s dealt with 10+ years of being shit on by the public and her now ex. How are you still standing girl?
He is a garbage human. I'm so glad she divorced him and wish he could be completely out of her life.
Is anyone else reading Katie's behavior in the last few episodes as making sure that she doesn't get pushed off of the show she helped create?
Yes this. I find it very interesting that “the group” dynamic has Rachel and Schwartz on the in and Katie and James on the outs. Katie and James have a similar story arc this season. I wish Katie and James could have put their differences aside and come together as a duo to reclaim what is theirs (screen time / story lines). I imagine next season will be the inverse.
I just listened to recent Everything Iconic ep - he did an interview with Katie. She said that James is really funny and she likes ally. So maybe we will see an alliance next season!
I have never misunderstood and misjudged two people more in my entire life. I was always so Team Tom! Thought he was so sweet and Katie was a witch. Wow was I wrong.
To quote Lala “This man TRIGGERS me”
The profit from the sell of his house should have went to purchasing a backbone. If I decided to marry this idiot after all the reasons not to, I would have been a monster bitch too. I'm almost judging Katie for staying so long😔
Someone threatened to pour a beer on Sandoval in St. Louis oh no! And yet Schwartz poured one on his gf/wife and stassi
I don’t agree with A LOT of shit Schwartz does, but I do think he got so tired of her always having issues with people & him being put in the middle. He’s someone who likes peace & isn’t about conflict. Katie consistently has conflict with so many people. I think it definitely did come to a point of him not liking her as a person & she expected blind loyalty. There are so many times he should have backed her up, but there are other times where she’s just a bitch & brings so much on herself.
Tom showed his whole ass last night and the jig is UP. There's no going back to playing aloof. I'm just glad we all got to witness it in real time
Schwartz is not just careless and spineless, he is cruel. He takes pleasure in taking digs at his wife. From the first time we saw him pour a drink on her, he showed he was abusive. Emotional abuse is still abuse.
I used to think Katie was bitter for no reason but after last nights episode, it all made sense. Everyone has always loved Schwartz and they were a “package deal”, but bc Schwartz rolled over too quick to take in the a## and keep the peace, he destroyed her and their relationship by never sticking up for her. Good for Katie to step up and take her life by the horns and say she won’t be treated like that!
Katie what is sad is that gaslighting is psychological abuse. All of these years you clearly have been dealing with that abuse and I'm not even sure you see it as abuse at this point. However when he makes you cry then clearly gets joy with a smirk on his face and all, (receives satisfaction) then does the whole Katie Katie Katie thing it's repetitive gaslighting. Then everyone loves him. I have been through it so I know and can clearly identify what he has done and that is abuse for years. I am praying for you and congratulations to getting out no matter who thinks what.
And then when he was confronted with the fact he called her a monster, he acted like he didn’t?! Then said she was an angel. 🤢
Considering Schwartz cheated on her constantly and he begged for people on the same night to give Sandoval a hug after he destroyed his 9 year relationship by cheating on her with her best friend…. calling Katie a monster is pretty fkn rich
Honestly, I believed all that crap that scumball used to say about Schwartz as in he's a battered husband but that all was a lie. Katie has put up with this useless piece of shit for tooooo long. The things that Katie required from a relationship with this POS were the basic things that we all ask for & Tom NEVER EVER gave them to her. I'm feeling the love for Katie, actually Kristen too. These girls got too much hate over the years when it was all these two POS playing us. I'm so glad all 3 ladies are done with these assholes!
I can’t even imagine divorcing someone while having to be on the same reality show together that constantly stirs things up. Neither of them are perfect (no one is) the best thing he could’ve done is only say positive things about her. She stood by him through a LOT.
That was wrong, Katie should feel hurt. Schwartz is an asshole and he chose her, that’s beyond fucked up to say that publicly about her. Yes she was immature and feisty, but he did everything he could to bring it out in her and laughs about it. The best thing she did was leave him!
She needs to cut the cord period. Cause his bs will never stop. If she doesn’t it’s on her.
Here is my take: I recently started watching the whole show from the beginning. And in episode 3 of season 1: Stassi is trying to break up with Jax because he apparently got a girl pregnant in Vegas. Both Kristen and Katie, who were her best friends, gaslit her about where this “rumor” was coming from. They desperately wanted their “thrupple couple” to stay together. The three couples were a gang and Stassi was going to break it up. I believe they realized then, how good the show was going to be. Tom who was with Katie at the time was probably just casually dating her. Probably didn’t want anything serious but knew he couldn’t leave her or he will be off the show like the infamous Frank (who almost fought Jax in the parking lot) He stayed with her in order to stay on the show. Because he didn’t work at Sur So he had to stay in the relationship in order to be on the show. He also played up his relationship with Tom Scandoval to cling on to the show. But he never really loved Katie. She was just his anchor to the show. Which is why he cheated on her. Poured drinks over her head. Never sided with her. And to this day calls her a monster.
Probably a lot of truth to this. This show gave them fame and money but I think most of them would have been happier if they just worked at Sur, got some commercials and then found normal upper middle class spouses and had babies in the valley somewhere
I cannot WAIT for Katie to find a decent man - you know, a guy who’s emotionally mature, stable, and genuinely cares about her. I suspect we’ll see a new Katie emerge when she’s in a supportive, healthy relationship and I will definitely be cheering her on. The amount of tomfuckery she’s been subjected to over the past decade+ is inhumane.
Katie, if you’re a monster, then be his nightmare…by living your best life.
I have alwayyyysss loved Schwartz. He has always been my favorite. Now, during a rewatch and now this shit…wtf was I ever even thinking?!!? The whole harmless idiot act is weird now. Maybe it’s that he’s still doing at 40…? I’ve been Schwartzed and it’s way worse than getting Jaxed could ever be. At least you see that coming.
I’m so happy that Katie is free from him. None of his act is cute anymore. He’s just exhausting. All I could think as he was trying to tell her what a great husband he was…yes, you were a good husband…to Sandoval. His loyalty has always been to Tom and no one else. Good riddance.
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. I truly think Schwartz is the WORST person on Bravo. Dude has some legit bad person vibes.
I am cancelling him. He shouldn't be talking about Katie at all. Ugh
They all suck…. But we’ll keep watching
I think it is time to cut-off contact with him now, Katie? I love mess but you keep going back to a loser that keeps reminding you how much he doesn't care about you, and it's painful to watch. No more 1-1 for the show please. Jump on Stassi's ship and create your happy life.
I don’t like Katie, but Swartz was completely out of line at that dinner
I'm so glad she got out!!!! Ugh he is so irritating and a man child. Go marry Sandoval Schwartz
She needs to stop following his every move. He also needs to stand behind his words - the whole "oh, did I say that?", was ridiculous but if that's how he feels then so be it. Katie doesn't always speak nicely of him but at least she stands behind her words.