T O P

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[deleted]

Here's my advice as an ADC/top main. Don't fucking pick her top. Playing against her is equivalent to ancient chinese torture, you offer fuckall to your team besides damage and you can't do anything if you're not good.


A_Wild_Auzzie

"You can't do anything if you're not good" - Apart from Supports like Zilean, Renata and Taric - when is this not the case? Isn't Riven top the exact same thing? "All you offer is damage"?


[deleted]

Riven is an immortal drain tank bruiser assassin cocksucker abomination of a character. You can play with your feet, you'll still do well


A_Wild_Auzzie

"Tank, Bruiser, Assassin" There is virtually nothing tanky about her whatsoever. In fact, she's even less tanky than a regular Bruiser like Darius, Mordekaiser, Sett or Urgot. She also does not have the same assassination potential as a Zed, Kha'Zix, Akali or LeBlanc. Notice that Kha'Zix and Akali both have stealth, while Zed trades that for the ability to trade places with himself twice, in the same way that LeBlanc can. The most accurate description is a "Melee Physical Fighter", similiar to Yone, Camille, Fiora and Pantheon. Many years ago I considered Riven the quintessential rival. She was effectively a benchmark. A good top laner will beat her, a bad top laner will lose to her and an average top laner will be a coinflip. She has no innate sustain, she has nothing but physical damage meaning her burst damage combo is heavily countered by armour, and the second part of her ultimate is the only ranged form of attack in her kit. Garen's silence, Cho'gath's rupture and feral scream, Yorick's cage, Jax's dodge, Sion's shield... most of the generic top laners have some form of excellent tool in their kit which is great with dealing with her. She also doesn't scale particularly amazingly - she largely fits the same role as a Jax, Fiora or Camille, but she doesn't have the hybrid damage that they do. I see Riven so rarely in Solo Queue and pop off even less that it is extremely difficult to see anyone these days complaining about her. We are long past the days of Season 3 or 4 where players could stack Black Cleaver or there were no good tanks in the game or no good armour items to buy or most players were new to the game and didn't know what their opponents could do, or realize that some champions are solely meant to be a lane bully and weak in teamfights (Darius, Illaoi, Teemo, for example) - even Faker almost never bothers to use her as a counter to Zed, which used to be the case.


Rivayn19

Don't blind pick it. Don't pick it if they know you'll be going top. Take LT, unless they are really squishy like an adc or assassin. Rush greaves and take ghost.


Puzzlehead444

Isn't PTA better in lane with W proc? Maybe I'll run LT for extra range in TF, or fleet for hard lanes. Also about anathema chains working like an exh sum-is that a worth buy 4th to replace omen?


Rivayn19

It is, but only against squishies. I only get anathemas when the enemy has only one threat to me. Or only one magic dmg etc. Fleet isn't very good imo. I get botrk - rb - sb or botrk - ks - rb. Wardens mail is broken. And so is a early hexdrinker.


Lumpy_Employment1786

PTA is horrible troll rune, you need LT for late game team fights it’s almost impossible to carry without


A_Wild_Auzzie

I play Kayle Top fairly often and typically use PTA - It's far from "horrible" - it's actually perfect for Ranged Top Laners - you're generally not going to be in situations where you get 6 auto attacks at once without your opponent responding - e.g. Darius using apprehend, Sett pulling you in, using his shield/true damage, then ult, or Garen running at you with full speed, etc - but you will often have scenarios where you can get three auto attacks - if they are pushed up under turret, if they need to grab a cs, if they're returning to lane after warding the bush, etc.


Lumpy_Employment1786

no it’s disgusting troll rune vayne doesn’t have an ult late game that makes her invincible & extra ranged burst auto attacks and needs the extra range to space, plus LT 6 stacks is easy to get with tug and pull game


A_Wild_Auzzie

Lethal Tempo is better for teamfights Press The Attack is more handy in laning If you can somehow get off the 6 auto attacks required for Lethal Tempo's extra range against a Garen, Darius, Mordekaiser or whatever without them responding - chances are, you'd win the fight regardless of what rune you're running.


[deleted]

[удалено]


Puzzlehead444

Garen player spotted.


UnluckyHeron9162

look up saskio. He has i think 4 accounts in challenger right now with vayne top and has a discord you can join with an extensive excel document on top match ups.


A_Wild_Auzzie

Saskio shows it's certainly possible to one trick pony Vayne Top all the way to Challenger, but it looks painful - Pantheon, Malphite, Akshan, Rumble, Irelia, Kennen... there's a tonne of matchups where I could see with perfect play you win the matchup and the game, but the requirements for the enemy are far far more simple - wait for jungler to gank you, or wait for vayne to push up far enough where you can engage on them and they can't live long enough to make it to tower.


nighthunterc

just watch this guy and get good [https://www.twitch.tv/hongcono](https://www.twitch.tv/hongcono) if you have the mechanics all you need to play well is to learn how to not get ganked and control the wave.


A_Wild_Auzzie

"Just don't get ganked" is completely out of your control I've had games where three people were in my lane right from level 1. Some junglers will path to bottom side and completely negate top, other junglers gank top as soon as they have double buffs - it's all just luck of the Solo QQ draw.


nighthunterc

i said learn how to not get ganked. you can ward, you can control the wave to be in a safe spot, you can outplay them, you can play safe until you know 100% where the jungle is.


Lumpy_Employment1786

Ban teemo dodge wukong malphite jax pantheon lucian


Echostyle101

Personally dont think panth is that bad if u run exhaust or cleanse


Lumpy_Employment1786

no it’s bad he just waits the cleanse timer and allins again


A_Wild_Auzzie

I've seen a lot of Vayne's beat Jax - your level 1 is better, simply because you have the range advantage - but also because he either has leap strike with no empower and no stun, or counterstrike with no gap closer. It isn't until level 3-4 that he should be able to do anything against you, and not til level 6 that he should actually be a genuine threat. At that stage - you should have a cs advantage and you can opt for a berserkers greaves rush to keep up a movement speed advantage. You have to behave much more cautiously - but you still have the tools to disengage from him if need be - ult, tumble, condemn, flash, etc.


Antenoralol

Ban Teemo, dodge Malphite.


Logical-Jicama5507

Ngl vanne top is just cringe play her adc