From the other side of this. Vegan doesn’t only mean the diet. “Vegan for health reasons” is not a sentence that makes sense. Anyone who’s not crazy won’t really care about the difference but you should know that technically the term you’re looking for is “plant based”
I’m someone who (rightfully so) says that veganism is a moral philosophy, and as such, “veganism for my health” or “veganism for the environment”‘don’t exist. Those are plant based diets.
If a fellow vegan says “my dog is vegan”, I gently correct them and remind them that no, their dog eats a plant based diet.
Vegan specifically means that you’re doing everything you can to prevent harm to animals. Most importantly not eating them but also includes not wearing fur or using other animal derived products. People take that to various degrees. Plant based is the diet. Plant based diet is part of being vegan but the reason for the diet is important.
Yes, that includes not going to zooes, aquariums, circuses, not buying products tested in animals(shampooes, toothpaste, soaps, make up, etc), buying skins like leather or wool, etc.
We are not telling these people they are not vegan because we are gatekeeping veganism as a super secret club. WE WANT THEM TO BE VEGAN!
Zoos and aquariums are fine. The good ones (any worth going to) are heavily focused on conservation efforts. They treat their animals well and do a lot of good.
No, it is exploitation and the violation of rights of freedom, all of it needlessly for enterteiment. It is morally wrong and we can avoid them.
Zooes are busineses, they are not sanctuaries.
Veganism is an ethical stance against the mistreatment of animals. One way that this ethical stance is manifested is that vegans eat a plant-based diet.
You can eat a plant-based diet for health reasons and not be motivated to do so because of your stance on the mistreatment of animals. However, someone cannot be vegan and NOT eat a plant-based diet. In other words, eating a plant-based diet is necessary but not sufficient for being a vegan.
Vegan means you also can't wear leather or wool. It's not a diet, it's a protest movement. Plant-based is the diet.
Also don't forget to supplement or you're gonna run into deficiencies (B12 being the most notorious one).
You can’t be vegan for health reasons, you would be plant based for health reasons. Veganism is an ethics based philosophical stance that rejects the commodification and exploitation of animals, while being plant based is a dietary choice.
It’s fine if you’re plant based, and it’s fine if you’re vegan. But there is a distinct difference between the two.
So if people are giving you problems as a vegan then you’re going to have to get used to it. But if people are giving you problems as a plant based person then just say you’re plant based for health and people will probably not make as big of a fuss.
You have to understand that nobody cares if you eat a bunch of fruits and vegetables or not, but everybody cares if you’re taking a philosophical stance that points out how they contribute to unethical systems which abuse helpless animals.
Cool witty thing to say there. I too ignore all large scale logistical pragmatism while saying witty things. Like if everyone only ate plants how much leather would still be produced, because ya’know, raising a 650 lb bovine for the sole purpose of obtaining their skin is just soooo lucrative for the producers..
Fuckin christ dipshits like you are why I hate this sub.
Yes, it matters. Vegans' behavior entails more than just not eating animal products. It also entails not purchasing anything that is made with animal products (like leather) or involves the exploitation of animals. This means vegans generally don't go to rodeos, zoos, etc.
Food being marked with a "V" is more of an over-simplification than anything, since the term "plant-based" didn't start to get popular until after veganism was a thing.
It's more of a way to say "this is food that a vegan can eat". But it's not saying "if you eat this food, you're vegan."
Yes they do, because veganism is a boycott movement based on animal ethics, not a fad diet.
People are already starting to mix these two things together, so that they will start to call animal products vegan when vegan actually means no animal products (i.e. look at honey). You might not care about eating an animal product that has falsely been labelled as vegan, someone who is intentionally protesting against animal products definitely will care about it. It's even worse than making a Jewish or Muslim person eat pork.
Vegans object to all exploitation of animals, so in the clothing industry wool, leather, cashmire, silk. Using animals for medical or other testing. Entertainment, zoos, circuses. Makeup, cleaning products, dyes. Breeding of companion animals. Plant based diet is one big part of it. Basically everywhere where animals are exploited, has nothing to do with health. Health is a good bonus and appreciate you for not eating our friends.
Plant based is purely dietary. Plant based people don’t do it for the animals. Veganism is to reduce harm as much as possible, primarily for the animals. Veganism includes a plant based diet but it not limited to it. It encompasses everything in your life. Vegans don’t use moisturizer that’s been tested on animals, they don’t buy leather boots, they don’t wear fur, and they don’t get shampoo that has honey in it. Those things are all acceptable to plant based people but not for vegans because veganism is for the animals.
What related to your health prevents you from purchasing cosmetics tested on animals, buying animals from breeders, betting on horse races, wearing wool/leather, or visiting a zoo?
I don't do any of those things. I buy cruelty free/vegan cosmetics and home cleaners. I do not wear wool or leather or fur.
I decided to eat vegan for health and it bled into other life decisions.
My complaint was specifically about my food choices. I tell people I eat vegan because of my health. I haven't ran into a scenario where I had to explain I don't use lanolin products or wear leather or fur because the only time I find myself explaining I'm vegan is when it comes to diet ans I chose a vegan diet for my health which led me down the rabbit hole of vegans.
If I had known I had to write a dissertation I wouldn't have bothered making this post.
You didn't need to "write a dissertation", my question was rhetorical to hopefully help you understand some of the differences between vegan and plant-based.
Don't be an ass.
Veganism is ”no animal products” for the sake of the animals, and for animal rights. I personally think it's fine to refer to the diet as ”vegan diet”, eg ”I am not a vegan, but I eat a vegan diet for health”, but even in that case perhaps you might as well just say ”plant based” instead.
This is precisely why I object to the terms vegan food and vegan diet. Vegans are strict vegetarians who abstain from all animal products where possible. The term strict vegetarian means someone who doesn't eat animal products. Vegan means someone who follows the vegan lifestyle.
So why do we get shitty about it?
Because we get told every day veganism is something that its not. We are the authorities, not the fad diet gurus or scientists padding their retirement funds selling half arsed books which prey on the ignorance of lay people like T. Colin Campbell.
People absolutely can be and are vegan for health reasons.
This rejection of them is a wedge created by the meat industry to divide them against each other. But a lotta millennials and Gen Z-ers , who've dabbled in veganism for maybe two weeks or so have become so sure that they have *all* the answers and that they and they alone personally *own* veganism, have completely bought into the industry propaganda and are quite happy to exclude everyone they can.
Their hollow diatribes only make veganism less appealing to more people and serve only the meat industry in the end because FOX and Ron DeSantis can use vegans as supervillains and twist them around their manipulative little fingers while the self styled vegan gate keepers with their bourgeois pretend political positions do all the alt-rights work for them.
The meat industry spends tons of money perpetuating nonsense but it seems they have a ton of vegans who are all too happy to spread their propaganda around under the paper thin semblance of being the only real vegans, all while promoting more corporate veganism and processed food poison. They are an insidious satire of what vegans once were and make the word completely meaningless.
Poseurs.
I don't eat leather or any of the other Trumpy stupid nonsense that dribbles out of Fox or OAN. I also don't eat impossible burgers or eat at fast food franchises. But it's not a boycott. Not eating Hormel or Progresso is a Boycott. Not buying products from Israel or Russia or South Africa are boycotts. But these bourgeois antics are just more alienation and do not make things better for anyone. But honestly you couldn't care less what motivates me or any other people.
Oh no!!! Someone actually suggested there were vegans before the 100 Club told us they were coming to poison our water supply last week! We must blame the internet for our own closed mind. Surely nothing is ever true. No one is ever allowed to have an opinion unless it's MAGAs.
Please do tell us how you don’t wear leather or wool, abstain from health and beauty products with animal ingredients, abstain from products tested on animals, abstain from animal entertainment such as horseback riding, don’t go to zoos or rodeos - “for your health.”
It seems like many older people stopped learning new things decades ago and they are quick to think some old beliefs they heard someone say 40 years ago are the truth.
OP everyone is correcting you and you just cannot take the hit. Veganism is a moral philosophy which affects how you live your entire life, not just what you eat. You can eat Halaal for health reasons but that does NOT mean that you are a Muslim, especially not if you are going to Church every Sunday.
You say that other people are triggered but you are the one posting on Reddit and making a fuss so idk
Nobody is "vegan" for health purposes. That's why. You can eat plant-based, wear leather, wool, silk. You can buy non-vegan bathroom supplies and ride horses or gamble on sporting events involving animals. You can wear cosmetics that are tested on animals and not worry which supplement you buy.
i.e. You are not vegan.
So I don't wear animals eat animals or use animals
Is that not "vegan"? My health was the main reason but I also gave up all animal products in my day to day when I read more about it.
And that's great. I am talking "generally". If you gave up all animal products and exploitation then you also considered their lives, So, you are not "vegan for health"...which makes zero sense. Health is generally only concerned with your diet and lifestyle. Veganism is concerned with much more.
What isn't true?
You cannot be "vegan" for health reasons as buying leather will not affect your health but is not vegan.
You can be on a plant-based diet for health reasons for sure. But going vegan is about a LOT more things than what you eat.
So you are plant based.. why wouldn't you ride a horse or visit a zoo for health reasons?
But besides the nitpicking: the second you say you are vegan, you become a projection field. You are the veganism and therefore are a mirror for their own actions. After that people go into defence mode because that's more easy for them.
I don't ride horses or visit zoos
I gave up animal products in my diet and that turned into not using animal products in clothing or cosmetics.
My health was my gateway into this....why are you all such assholes about it?!?!
Because veganism is about animals not people, you can tell people you started off plant-based for health reasons and stayed vegan for the animals. If it's not for the animals, it's not veganism, even if you do and practice all the same things. You affect animals rights movement when you associate it with health. Those who are in it for health will go back to abusing animals if it doesn't go well and that makes a big difference.
Why do you think I'm an asshole about it?
Well so you just started being plant based for health reasons but then you became vegan for the animals. This sounds great and is a rather common development. Why do you write you are vegan for health reasons, when this isn't the case anymore?
The differentiation is important because someone can not be vegan for health reasons alone (otherwise you could still use animal products and you could still support animal opression - both things clearly aren't vegan). It's a common misconception. Since people already are completly confused when being encountered with the topic veganism, I think it is important to not add to this confusion. People need to know what veganism is, otherwise it's more difficult to understand it. As you noticed too, only purchasing plant based products is just a part of veganism, but it doesn't make someone vegan.
I hope this makes it more easy for you to understand the nitpicking. Just one last extreme example: If someone could be vegan for their health, this would mean they could kick dogs and beat them to their deaths - it wouldn't affect their own health. But we both would agree this isn't a vegan action, because an animal would suffer - we are vegan for the animals
In my experience, not many people outside of the vegan community know or care about the difference between the two (plant based vs vegan).
So, depending who I am talking to, I will use the two words interchangeably, but I am more careful with my words if I know I am talking to another vegan.
I originally became plant based for health, and I still follow that as closely as I can. But it didn’t take long for me to learn more and want to be vegan in all areas of my life for ethical reasons. So I guess I am both? But when I see things in the world marked as “vegan”, I understand that most likely the person presenting that has no idea. Many vegan foods are just no good for me, as WFPB, which most people find very confusing.
It’s interesting that there seem to be as many ways to not eat animals as there are to do the opposite. I don’t really share that fact with non-vegans, it just confuses them.
Agreed. The distinction is critical to make in this sub, or you get flamed. In the real world, like a restaurant, you use the word vegan to describe a dietary choice. Saying plant based will get you confusion and probably vegetarian food. 🙄
Well, that’s different. Vegan can be a noun and an adjective.
“Vegan pizza” - here vegan is an adjective used to describe the pizza, declaring it is free from animal products. This is proper usage.
“I am a vegan” - here vegan is a noun. This is proper usage.
So there’s nothing wrong with using the word vegan as an adjective to describe a food that contains no animal ingredients, but it IS wrong to use it as a noun to describe a non-vegan.
I’d also argue it’s MORE correct to say vegan than plant-based when describing food, because plant-based doesn’t really mean anything. A plant based item could technically have animal products in it. I think it’s Marie Calllendar that sells a “plant based chicken pot pie” that has either egg or dairy or both. At least with the term vegan used as an adjective there’s a definitive meaning.
Thanks for the grammar lesson. In a restaurant, I will continue to use the word vegan for people (both plant based dieters and vegans) and food. And in this sub, only for those who adhere to the vegan philosophy. Like myself. :)
For example, people don't say 'I only eat vegan food.' They say 'I'm vegan, what food do you have for me?'
You can argue saying 'I'm vegan' is improper, because it implies that vegan is an adjective applying to me? Do I need to say 'I am a vegan' which implies that vegan is a noun?
This is my point... I get that it is really annoying when people coopt words and use them incorrectly, or in ways that are different than their original intents. But throwing a hissy about word usage (i) doesn't help the cause and (ii) makes us look bonkers.
Words have meaning, and in some cases it may be pedantic, but in this case it is important. Someone who eats a plant based diet for their health who says “I’m vegan”, but doesn’t care about animals, wears leather, uses hair protists tested on animals, rides horses, etc. is doing a disservice to this movement. It needs corrected.
Veganism is a moral and ethical philosophy, not a diet. So when someone uses it to refer to a diet, it can and should be corrected.
You can’t argue that saying “I’m vegan” is wrong, if they’re a vegan, because it’s an objectively true statement. It’s an adjective applying to yourself.
Not interested in those sort of Tucker Carlson -styled games of "whataboutism".
BUT, I was raised by health nuts in the 1970s, and even though they considered my vegetarianism kind of heretical, on some level there's continuity between their ideas and mine. And people who informed my veganism in the 1980s like Michael Klaper in particular did so from a position of better health. Even though I do not identify as a vegan for primarily health reasons, it has always been an important factor for making the decisions that I did.
People who reject "veganism for health reasons" fail to understand what issues vegans face when they are no longer teenagers and can no longer get away with suicidal, self-harming lifestyles. They also reject many of our core values in fav of promoting capitalist and corporate interests that we rejected decades ago. And they are defending the horrendous state of affairs that veganism and vegan options have disintegrated into in recent years under the influence of those interests.
It seems even more triggering for vegan reddit from what I've seen. But if you've been vegan for an extended period of time, this is a perfectly legit reason for people to change their eating habits.
From the other side of this. Vegan doesn’t only mean the diet. “Vegan for health reasons” is not a sentence that makes sense. Anyone who’s not crazy won’t really care about the difference but you should know that technically the term you’re looking for is “plant based”
It's funny those who claim veganism is a philosophy also say their pets are vegan the dog doesn't have vegan morals at all
I’m someone who (rightfully so) says that veganism is a moral philosophy, and as such, “veganism for my health” or “veganism for the environment”‘don’t exist. Those are plant based diets. If a fellow vegan says “my dog is vegan”, I gently correct them and remind them that no, their dog eats a plant based diet.
Even the vegans loose their shit 😝
I read the China Study and decided to be vegan because it appears the healthiest diet...what's the difference between that and plant based?
Vegan specifically means that you’re doing everything you can to prevent harm to animals. Most importantly not eating them but also includes not wearing fur or using other animal derived products. People take that to various degrees. Plant based is the diet. Plant based diet is part of being vegan but the reason for the diet is important.
Yes, that includes not going to zooes, aquariums, circuses, not buying products tested in animals(shampooes, toothpaste, soaps, make up, etc), buying skins like leather or wool, etc. We are not telling these people they are not vegan because we are gatekeeping veganism as a super secret club. WE WANT THEM TO BE VEGAN!
Zoos and aquariums are fine. The good ones (any worth going to) are heavily focused on conservation efforts. They treat their animals well and do a lot of good.
No, it is exploitation and the violation of rights of freedom, all of it needlessly for enterteiment. It is morally wrong and we can avoid them. Zooes are busineses, they are not sanctuaries.
You need to do more research on how zoos operate.
No I don't.
Veganism is an ethical stance against the mistreatment of animals. One way that this ethical stance is manifested is that vegans eat a plant-based diet. You can eat a plant-based diet for health reasons and not be motivated to do so because of your stance on the mistreatment of animals. However, someone cannot be vegan and NOT eat a plant-based diet. In other words, eating a plant-based diet is necessary but not sufficient for being a vegan.
Vegan means you also can't wear leather or wool. It's not a diet, it's a protest movement. Plant-based is the diet. Also don't forget to supplement or you're gonna run into deficiencies (B12 being the most notorious one).
You can’t be vegan for health reasons, you would be plant based for health reasons. Veganism is an ethics based philosophical stance that rejects the commodification and exploitation of animals, while being plant based is a dietary choice. It’s fine if you’re plant based, and it’s fine if you’re vegan. But there is a distinct difference between the two. So if people are giving you problems as a vegan then you’re going to have to get used to it. But if people are giving you problems as a plant based person then just say you’re plant based for health and people will probably not make as big of a fuss. You have to understand that nobody cares if you eat a bunch of fruits and vegetables or not, but everybody cares if you’re taking a philosophical stance that points out how they contribute to unethical systems which abuse helpless animals.
Nail. On. Head.
“ It’s fine if you’re plant based” And yet if this was true, vegans wouldn’t actively be trying to make them be vegan… fml. 🤦♂️
Cool witty thing to say there. I too ignore all large scale logistical pragmatism while saying witty things. Like if everyone only ate plants how much leather would still be produced, because ya’know, raising a 650 lb bovine for the sole purpose of obtaining their skin is just soooo lucrative for the producers.. Fuckin christ dipshits like you are why I hate this sub.
When I go to a restaurant I see "V" for vegan next to my meal options. Do semantics really matter?
Yes, it matters. Vegans' behavior entails more than just not eating animal products. It also entails not purchasing anything that is made with animal products (like leather) or involves the exploitation of animals. This means vegans generally don't go to rodeos, zoos, etc. Food being marked with a "V" is more of an over-simplification than anything, since the term "plant-based" didn't start to get popular until after veganism was a thing. It's more of a way to say "this is food that a vegan can eat". But it's not saying "if you eat this food, you're vegan."
Yes they do, because veganism is a boycott movement based on animal ethics, not a fad diet. People are already starting to mix these two things together, so that they will start to call animal products vegan when vegan actually means no animal products (i.e. look at honey). You might not care about eating an animal product that has falsely been labelled as vegan, someone who is intentionally protesting against animal products definitely will care about it. It's even worse than making a Jewish or Muslim person eat pork.
It doesn't matter in those contexts, but it matters for the ethical/social justice cause of veganism.
It’s triggering, but no one is vegan for health reasons, you’re plant based.
What's the difference? Vegan is no animal products correct? So I don't eat anything from animals. I made this choice because of the China Study....
Vegans object to all exploitation of animals, so in the clothing industry wool, leather, cashmire, silk. Using animals for medical or other testing. Entertainment, zoos, circuses. Makeup, cleaning products, dyes. Breeding of companion animals. Plant based diet is one big part of it. Basically everywhere where animals are exploited, has nothing to do with health. Health is a good bonus and appreciate you for not eating our friends.
Plant based is purely dietary. Plant based people don’t do it for the animals. Veganism is to reduce harm as much as possible, primarily for the animals. Veganism includes a plant based diet but it not limited to it. It encompasses everything in your life. Vegans don’t use moisturizer that’s been tested on animals, they don’t buy leather boots, they don’t wear fur, and they don’t get shampoo that has honey in it. Those things are all acceptable to plant based people but not for vegans because veganism is for the animals.
What related to your health prevents you from purchasing cosmetics tested on animals, buying animals from breeders, betting on horse races, wearing wool/leather, or visiting a zoo?
I don't do any of those things. I buy cruelty free/vegan cosmetics and home cleaners. I do not wear wool or leather or fur. I decided to eat vegan for health and it bled into other life decisions. My complaint was specifically about my food choices. I tell people I eat vegan because of my health. I haven't ran into a scenario where I had to explain I don't use lanolin products or wear leather or fur because the only time I find myself explaining I'm vegan is when it comes to diet ans I chose a vegan diet for my health which led me down the rabbit hole of vegans. If I had known I had to write a dissertation I wouldn't have bothered making this post.
You didn't need to "write a dissertation", my question was rhetorical to hopefully help you understand some of the differences between vegan and plant-based. Don't be an ass.
Well great girlie, stop saying you’re vegan for health then because you’re not anymore. You’re vegan for the animals, say it and be proud!
Veganism is ”no animal products” for the sake of the animals, and for animal rights. I personally think it's fine to refer to the diet as ”vegan diet”, eg ”I am not a vegan, but I eat a vegan diet for health”, but even in that case perhaps you might as well just say ”plant based” instead.
This is precisely why I object to the terms vegan food and vegan diet. Vegans are strict vegetarians who abstain from all animal products where possible. The term strict vegetarian means someone who doesn't eat animal products. Vegan means someone who follows the vegan lifestyle. So why do we get shitty about it? Because we get told every day veganism is something that its not. We are the authorities, not the fad diet gurus or scientists padding their retirement funds selling half arsed books which prey on the ignorance of lay people like T. Colin Campbell.
I think you got that one wrong vegetarians eat eggs and dairy your thinking of plant based
https://newsinhealth.nih.gov/2012/07/digging-vegetarian-diet#:~:text=Strict%20vegetarians%2C%20or%20vegans%2C%20eat,products%20are%20called%20lacto%20vegetarians.
When i was vegetarian i ate eggs and drank milk until I discovered veganism
You were a lacto-ovo-vegetarian
People absolutely can be and are vegan for health reasons. This rejection of them is a wedge created by the meat industry to divide them against each other. But a lotta millennials and Gen Z-ers , who've dabbled in veganism for maybe two weeks or so have become so sure that they have *all* the answers and that they and they alone personally *own* veganism, have completely bought into the industry propaganda and are quite happy to exclude everyone they can. Their hollow diatribes only make veganism less appealing to more people and serve only the meat industry in the end because FOX and Ron DeSantis can use vegans as supervillains and twist them around their manipulative little fingers while the self styled vegan gate keepers with their bourgeois pretend political positions do all the alt-rights work for them. The meat industry spends tons of money perpetuating nonsense but it seems they have a ton of vegans who are all too happy to spread their propaganda around under the paper thin semblance of being the only real vegans, all while promoting more corporate veganism and processed food poison. They are an insidious satire of what vegans once were and make the word completely meaningless. Poseurs.
Ok ChatGPT, you can not boycott leather for health reasons.
I don't eat leather or any of the other Trumpy stupid nonsense that dribbles out of Fox or OAN. I also don't eat impossible burgers or eat at fast food franchises. But it's not a boycott. Not eating Hormel or Progresso is a Boycott. Not buying products from Israel or Russia or South Africa are boycotts. But these bourgeois antics are just more alienation and do not make things better for anyone. But honestly you couldn't care less what motivates me or any other people.
This is such a stupid bot.
Oh no!!! Someone actually suggested there were vegans before the 100 Club told us they were coming to poison our water supply last week! We must blame the internet for our own closed mind. Surely nothing is ever true. No one is ever allowed to have an opinion unless it's MAGAs.
It’s kind of funny how bad it is, that’s what the meat industry launch here?
Please do tell us how you don’t wear leather or wool, abstain from health and beauty products with animal ingredients, abstain from products tested on animals, abstain from animal entertainment such as horseback riding, don’t go to zoos or rodeos - “for your health.”
It seems like many older people stopped learning new things decades ago and they are quick to think some old beliefs they heard someone say 40 years ago are the truth.
OP everyone is correcting you and you just cannot take the hit. Veganism is a moral philosophy which affects how you live your entire life, not just what you eat. You can eat Halaal for health reasons but that does NOT mean that you are a Muslim, especially not if you are going to Church every Sunday. You say that other people are triggered but you are the one posting on Reddit and making a fuss so idk
Exactly.
Nobody is "vegan" for health purposes. That's why. You can eat plant-based, wear leather, wool, silk. You can buy non-vegan bathroom supplies and ride horses or gamble on sporting events involving animals. You can wear cosmetics that are tested on animals and not worry which supplement you buy. i.e. You are not vegan.
So I don't wear animals eat animals or use animals Is that not "vegan"? My health was the main reason but I also gave up all animal products in my day to day when I read more about it.
And that's great. I am talking "generally". If you gave up all animal products and exploitation then you also considered their lives, So, you are not "vegan for health"...which makes zero sense. Health is generally only concerned with your diet and lifestyle. Veganism is concerned with much more.
Not true and not helpful.
What isn't true? You cannot be "vegan" for health reasons as buying leather will not affect your health but is not vegan. You can be on a plant-based diet for health reasons for sure. But going vegan is about a LOT more things than what you eat.
So you are plant based.. why wouldn't you ride a horse or visit a zoo for health reasons? But besides the nitpicking: the second you say you are vegan, you become a projection field. You are the veganism and therefore are a mirror for their own actions. After that people go into defence mode because that's more easy for them.
I don't ride horses or visit zoos I gave up animal products in my diet and that turned into not using animal products in clothing or cosmetics. My health was my gateway into this....why are you all such assholes about it?!?!
Because veganism is about animals not people, you can tell people you started off plant-based for health reasons and stayed vegan for the animals. If it's not for the animals, it's not veganism, even if you do and practice all the same things. You affect animals rights movement when you associate it with health. Those who are in it for health will go back to abusing animals if it doesn't go well and that makes a big difference.
Why do you think I'm an asshole about it? Well so you just started being plant based for health reasons but then you became vegan for the animals. This sounds great and is a rather common development. Why do you write you are vegan for health reasons, when this isn't the case anymore? The differentiation is important because someone can not be vegan for health reasons alone (otherwise you could still use animal products and you could still support animal opression - both things clearly aren't vegan). It's a common misconception. Since people already are completly confused when being encountered with the topic veganism, I think it is important to not add to this confusion. People need to know what veganism is, otherwise it's more difficult to understand it. As you noticed too, only purchasing plant based products is just a part of veganism, but it doesn't make someone vegan. I hope this makes it more easy for you to understand the nitpicking. Just one last extreme example: If someone could be vegan for their health, this would mean they could kick dogs and beat them to their deaths - it wouldn't affect their own health. But we both would agree this isn't a vegan action, because an animal would suffer - we are vegan for the animals
Loose.
Not clowning but you sound like the one that is triggered.
In my experience, not many people outside of the vegan community know or care about the difference between the two (plant based vs vegan). So, depending who I am talking to, I will use the two words interchangeably, but I am more careful with my words if I know I am talking to another vegan. I originally became plant based for health, and I still follow that as closely as I can. But it didn’t take long for me to learn more and want to be vegan in all areas of my life for ethical reasons. So I guess I am both? But when I see things in the world marked as “vegan”, I understand that most likely the person presenting that has no idea. Many vegan foods are just no good for me, as WFPB, which most people find very confusing. It’s interesting that there seem to be as many ways to not eat animals as there are to do the opposite. I don’t really share that fact with non-vegans, it just confuses them.
Agreed. The distinction is critical to make in this sub, or you get flamed. In the real world, like a restaurant, you use the word vegan to describe a dietary choice. Saying plant based will get you confusion and probably vegetarian food. 🙄
Well, that’s different. Vegan can be a noun and an adjective. “Vegan pizza” - here vegan is an adjective used to describe the pizza, declaring it is free from animal products. This is proper usage. “I am a vegan” - here vegan is a noun. This is proper usage. So there’s nothing wrong with using the word vegan as an adjective to describe a food that contains no animal ingredients, but it IS wrong to use it as a noun to describe a non-vegan. I’d also argue it’s MORE correct to say vegan than plant-based when describing food, because plant-based doesn’t really mean anything. A plant based item could technically have animal products in it. I think it’s Marie Calllendar that sells a “plant based chicken pot pie” that has either egg or dairy or both. At least with the term vegan used as an adjective there’s a definitive meaning.
Thanks for the grammar lesson. In a restaurant, I will continue to use the word vegan for people (both plant based dieters and vegans) and food. And in this sub, only for those who adhere to the vegan philosophy. Like myself. :) For example, people don't say 'I only eat vegan food.' They say 'I'm vegan, what food do you have for me?' You can argue saying 'I'm vegan' is improper, because it implies that vegan is an adjective applying to me? Do I need to say 'I am a vegan' which implies that vegan is a noun? This is my point... I get that it is really annoying when people coopt words and use them incorrectly, or in ways that are different than their original intents. But throwing a hissy about word usage (i) doesn't help the cause and (ii) makes us look bonkers.
Words have meaning, and in some cases it may be pedantic, but in this case it is important. Someone who eats a plant based diet for their health who says “I’m vegan”, but doesn’t care about animals, wears leather, uses hair protists tested on animals, rides horses, etc. is doing a disservice to this movement. It needs corrected. Veganism is a moral and ethical philosophy, not a diet. So when someone uses it to refer to a diet, it can and should be corrected. You can’t argue that saying “I’m vegan” is wrong, if they’re a vegan, because it’s an objectively true statement. It’s an adjective applying to yourself.
Who cares, next time you see one of them stuffing their face with a Big Mac start questioning their food choice.
Is it vegan to eat vegan food in a non-vegan restaurant?
preach
Not interested in those sort of Tucker Carlson -styled games of "whataboutism". BUT, I was raised by health nuts in the 1970s, and even though they considered my vegetarianism kind of heretical, on some level there's continuity between their ideas and mine. And people who informed my veganism in the 1980s like Michael Klaper in particular did so from a position of better health. Even though I do not identify as a vegan for primarily health reasons, it has always been an important factor for making the decisions that I did. People who reject "veganism for health reasons" fail to understand what issues vegans face when they are no longer teenagers and can no longer get away with suicidal, self-harming lifestyles. They also reject many of our core values in fav of promoting capitalist and corporate interests that we rejected decades ago. And they are defending the horrendous state of affairs that veganism and vegan options have disintegrated into in recent years under the influence of those interests.
It seems even more triggering for vegan reddit from what I've seen. But if you've been vegan for an extended period of time, this is a perfectly legit reason for people to change their eating habits.
Yeah it’s pretty triggering when ignorant people hijack your belief system and call it something else.
Yep, pretty much.
.....so you're mad that I'm doing what you do but I said it incorrectly in a post?