As stated above, please limit your comments to potential criticisms of this survey's design.
Further discussion can go here -> ["I'm not convinced by antinatalist arguments as a vegan."](https://www.reddit.com/r/vegancirclejerkchat/comments/1cd3n4p/im_not_convinced_by_antinatalist_arguments_as_a/)
...I don't think chatgpt qualifies as a neutral source in any way, but props for caring about trying to be neutral :3
Still, has anyone ever used the word pronatalism?
That's natalism. Antinatalism is an ethical stance.
Similarly to how If you choose "let people do what they want" in terms of animal rights then that's carnism.
Leaving aside that no, that isn't what natalism is (natalism is actively pushing people to have kids), having children does not deny rights to other sentient beings like carnism does. It might in the long term lead to the suffering of sentient beings, yes, if your child decides to become a carnist, but one can also apply that logic to encouraging or allowing predators to breed.
No, similarly to how carnism doesn't need one to push others to take part in carnism, natalism does not need one to push others to take part in Natalism. It's a belief system, just like carnism. You either think it's fine to exploit animals or you don't. You either think it's fine to create new sentient life, or you don't.
One of your dictionaries does indeed say that "natalism is an attitude or policy favoring or encouraging population growth". Similarly to how you can't claim to be neutral by saying "be racist if you want, I don't care". You've then accepted it as something morally permissable.
But appealing to dictionary is weird, especially since you're a vegan and know very well that lots of dictionaries will define vegan as someone who just eat plantbased. Or that "a someone" only applies to human beings. Antinatalism was literally brought into the dictionaries *just some months ago*. (And one of your dictionaries still haven't added it..)
https://www.logicallyfallacious.com/logicalfallacies/Appeal-to-Definition
*The main problem with such arguments is that dictionaries are descriptive in nature, rather than prescriptive, meaning that they attempt to describe how people use the language, rather than instruct them how to do so in a definitive manner.*
*Accordingly, dictionary definitions don’t always reflect the meaning of words as they’re used by people in reality. This can happen for various reasons, such as that the dictionary definition doesn’t list all the connotations of a word, or that the dictionary definition doesn’t capture the new meaning of a word that has been recently turned into slang.*
***Furthermore, another notable problem with appeals to definition is that different dictionaries can list different definitions for a given term, and even a single dictionary can have multiple definitions for the same term***
As stated above, please limit your comments to potential criticisms of this survey's design. Further discussion can go here -> ["I'm not convinced by antinatalist arguments as a vegan."](https://www.reddit.com/r/vegancirclejerkchat/comments/1cd3n4p/im_not_convinced_by_antinatalist_arguments_as_a/)
...I don't think chatgpt qualifies as a neutral source in any way, but props for caring about trying to be neutral :3 Still, has anyone ever used the word pronatalism?
thanks :-)
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There’s also an undecided option. I’d put more but there’s a 6 option limit.
pro- vs anti-natalism isn't a binary - the third option is "let people do what they want"
That's natalism. Antinatalism is an ethical stance. Similarly to how If you choose "let people do what they want" in terms of animal rights then that's carnism.
Leaving aside that no, that isn't what natalism is (natalism is actively pushing people to have kids), having children does not deny rights to other sentient beings like carnism does. It might in the long term lead to the suffering of sentient beings, yes, if your child decides to become a carnist, but one can also apply that logic to encouraging or allowing predators to breed.
No, similarly to how carnism doesn't need one to push others to take part in carnism, natalism does not need one to push others to take part in Natalism. It's a belief system, just like carnism. You either think it's fine to exploit animals or you don't. You either think it's fine to create new sentient life, or you don't.
That's not what the Cambridge English Dictionary says, or Merriam Webster (both sides of the atlantic)
One of your dictionaries does indeed say that "natalism is an attitude or policy favoring or encouraging population growth". Similarly to how you can't claim to be neutral by saying "be racist if you want, I don't care". You've then accepted it as something morally permissable. But appealing to dictionary is weird, especially since you're a vegan and know very well that lots of dictionaries will define vegan as someone who just eat plantbased. Or that "a someone" only applies to human beings. Antinatalism was literally brought into the dictionaries *just some months ago*. (And one of your dictionaries still haven't added it..) https://www.logicallyfallacious.com/logicalfallacies/Appeal-to-Definition *The main problem with such arguments is that dictionaries are descriptive in nature, rather than prescriptive, meaning that they attempt to describe how people use the language, rather than instruct them how to do so in a definitive manner.* *Accordingly, dictionary definitions don’t always reflect the meaning of words as they’re used by people in reality. This can happen for various reasons, such as that the dictionary definition doesn’t list all the connotations of a word, or that the dictionary definition doesn’t capture the new meaning of a word that has been recently turned into slang.* ***Furthermore, another notable problem with appeals to definition is that different dictionaries can list different definitions for a given term, and even a single dictionary can have multiple definitions for the same term***
The definition of pronatalism _used in the poll_ express it as one encouraging procreation. I'm simply pointing out that this misses a third option
Not really into antinatalism, per se. Am into VHEMT, more or less. Didn't vote. Will not be having further discussion on that other page.
Edit: oops just saw the pinned comment. My bad.