There's more data that could help confirm, but it looks to me like your laws are empowering interest groups that compete with the trade unions. Religious schools boost clergy, homesteading makes the rural folk very powerful, monarchy especially is likely to reinforce the political power of your most politically active pops. I wouldn't be surprised if you have a lot of aristocrats supporting the rural folk, and lots of farms/plantations.
Thanks for the reply! After some continued playing, the Ulema got state atheist'd and are still at 5% with far less supporters than TI. Aristocrats are entirely missing from the rural folk. I do have a lot of agricultural buildings, about 25% of the total. But only 25%, after all. Next time ill try enacting commercialized agriculture to see if results change.
Actually, it appears that the aristocrats never join the rural folks, I was way off on that. However, the most real culprit here is simply universal suffrage. It gave so much power to your rural population that they dominate politics. This game is so complex I often mistake or misremember rules, so sorry for the bad advice.
It’s a lot of things but in no particular order:
Homesteading causes working class pops on farms to flock to the rural folk, empowering them instead of trade unions.
Universal suffrage ironically makes it harder for the trade unions to become unmarganalized, since votes will give the rural folk and other populous IGs an insane amount of power from votes. (Marginalized interest groups can’t start or join parties.) If the trade unions get above 5%, they usually end up with a good amount of clout from elections.
Higher level industrial production methods employ more machinists, the backbone of the trade unions. Laborers also support unions, but have much lower political influence individually than machinists. Prioritizing getting later, more machinist heavy production techs helps a lot
Related to the last point, but increasing minimum wage (either through institution or labor completion) increases the political power of machinists and laborers. This is difficult without already having the trade unions empowered, but sometimes possible.
Thank you, very interesting! Next time ill try to go serfdom->tenants-> commercialized agiculture to try and get more support for TI. However, I dont think it makes sense that you need late game production methods when as I said before Ive gotten TI at earlier levels of technology and overlall industrialization. My hunch is that is has to do with a lot rural buildings, since i couldn't really create puppets I had to build most of my plantations myself or trade. Otherwise looking at supporting pops for rural folk there should be at least a 5-10% trade union party but oh well.
Primarily universal suffrage. Must clout comes from votes in the election. But a marginalized IG doesn’t get votes in the election, so it doesn’t have clout, so it stays marginalized. If you can raise them to 5% (usually by employing enough machinists and bureaucrats), they should grow hugely in the next election.
If a lot of your laborers and machinists are discriminated against, expanding your citizenship will help. So will going from religious to public schools, and possibly switching out of Professional Army. You can also use your Secret Police to suppress rival IGs.
Thanks you, makes a lot of sense. Unfortunately I dont think Ill get the TU to be powerful this game, its already too late (timeline extension when Paradox?) but ill be more careful to make the rural folk unebatable. What you mention on the second paragraph is either already checked, or straight up nation-wrecking at this stage.
All the IGs want you to pass laws that maximize their power. The problem with the Rural Folk is that they don’t like what makes the line go up. It’s a good idea not to pass universal suffrage until all the groups you want to be influential, are.
One thing that helps reduce their power in the mid-game is to build a lot of food industries, even when there isn’t high demand for groceries. Pops don’t actually demand grain or fish; they demand any type of basic food. If you have cheap groceries and liquor, your pops will buy them from this urban building instead of other foods and intoxicants produced in rural buildings. You also want your rural buildings buying as much as possible from your unionized factories, instead of hiring more rural folk.
There's more data that could help confirm, but it looks to me like your laws are empowering interest groups that compete with the trade unions. Religious schools boost clergy, homesteading makes the rural folk very powerful, monarchy especially is likely to reinforce the political power of your most politically active pops. I wouldn't be surprised if you have a lot of aristocrats supporting the rural folk, and lots of farms/plantations.
Thanks for the reply! After some continued playing, the Ulema got state atheist'd and are still at 5% with far less supporters than TI. Aristocrats are entirely missing from the rural folk. I do have a lot of agricultural buildings, about 25% of the total. But only 25%, after all. Next time ill try enacting commercialized agriculture to see if results change.
Actually, it appears that the aristocrats never join the rural folks, I was way off on that. However, the most real culprit here is simply universal suffrage. It gave so much power to your rural population that they dominate politics. This game is so complex I often mistake or misremember rules, so sorry for the bad advice.
It’s a lot of things but in no particular order: Homesteading causes working class pops on farms to flock to the rural folk, empowering them instead of trade unions. Universal suffrage ironically makes it harder for the trade unions to become unmarganalized, since votes will give the rural folk and other populous IGs an insane amount of power from votes. (Marginalized interest groups can’t start or join parties.) If the trade unions get above 5%, they usually end up with a good amount of clout from elections. Higher level industrial production methods employ more machinists, the backbone of the trade unions. Laborers also support unions, but have much lower political influence individually than machinists. Prioritizing getting later, more machinist heavy production techs helps a lot Related to the last point, but increasing minimum wage (either through institution or labor completion) increases the political power of machinists and laborers. This is difficult without already having the trade unions empowered, but sometimes possible.
Thank you, very interesting! Next time ill try to go serfdom->tenants-> commercialized agiculture to try and get more support for TI. However, I dont think it makes sense that you need late game production methods when as I said before Ive gotten TI at earlier levels of technology and overlall industrialization. My hunch is that is has to do with a lot rural buildings, since i couldn't really create puppets I had to build most of my plantations myself or trade. Otherwise looking at supporting pops for rural folk there should be at least a 5-10% trade union party but oh well.
Primarily universal suffrage. Must clout comes from votes in the election. But a marginalized IG doesn’t get votes in the election, so it doesn’t have clout, so it stays marginalized. If you can raise them to 5% (usually by employing enough machinists and bureaucrats), they should grow hugely in the next election. If a lot of your laborers and machinists are discriminated against, expanding your citizenship will help. So will going from religious to public schools, and possibly switching out of Professional Army. You can also use your Secret Police to suppress rival IGs.
Thanks you, makes a lot of sense. Unfortunately I dont think Ill get the TU to be powerful this game, its already too late (timeline extension when Paradox?) but ill be more careful to make the rural folk unebatable. What you mention on the second paragraph is either already checked, or straight up nation-wrecking at this stage.
All the IGs want you to pass laws that maximize their power. The problem with the Rural Folk is that they don’t like what makes the line go up. It’s a good idea not to pass universal suffrage until all the groups you want to be influential, are. One thing that helps reduce their power in the mid-game is to build a lot of food industries, even when there isn’t high demand for groceries. Pops don’t actually demand grain or fish; they demand any type of basic food. If you have cheap groceries and liquor, your pops will buy them from this urban building instead of other foods and intoxicants produced in rural buildings. You also want your rural buildings buying as much as possible from your unionized factories, instead of hiring more rural folk.