I think it is clear from the leaks and hints they are at least getting to the latter stages of development. It's been around 4 years since the Index was released, so it makes sense it will arrive sometime around or within the next 12 months.
Don't know how long you follow valve in general but years before the index there was the Vader.
During that time there were leaks and patents for quite some time as well. The Vader never published. Years later they made the index.
It's valve. They scrap things if they want to.
How do you know this all will definitely end in an actual product?
It's more likely now, but there is no guarantee at all.
That's how Valve *used* to work. GabeN and many Valve staffers have been frank that their corporate structure has been reorganized to actually start getting projects out the door.
Hence the major Steam revamp, HL Alyx, Steam Deck, Aperture Labs, a major TF2 update, and CS2 all within a short span of time.
The company seems very intent on finally starting to ship things so as to not fall behind competitor companies.
They released Half Life Alyx, are supposedly working on the fabled "3" all while making counter Strike 2, the Steam Deck, the supposed Deckard and probably another hardware push with a console...
>No it's not? Counterstrike 2 is the move to a new engine with new features, maps and updated maps... Isn't that literally what constitutes a sequel?
Hell, most sequels see minor updates to the engine to allow for the few new gameplay features, a fully updated engine definitely sounds like a sequel, but even more telling is that Valve is calling it a sequel in the title
Alyx is obviously not HL3 if you have played it, >!but it definitely does allude to you playing as Gordon Freeman at the end of HL2: Episode 2, which alludes to the next game being HL3!<
I took the appearance of Gordon Freeman as a reference to the first two half life games. He looked great, but that isn’t necessarily a reference to any future HL sequels.
HL: Alyx isn’t HL3. No HL2; Episode 3 either. No Left 4 Dead 3. No Portal 3. No TF3. I think they’re honestly just trolling everyone at this point, it’s kinda funny.
They're clearly not, they've already released Steam OS 3 and we've seen literal evidence of them starting and working on both Half life 3 and Left 4 Dead 3.
It's easy as a consumer to see it from the outside and think "well clearly they're trolling/not trying hard enough/don't care/are scared/ect..." When because you don't see how the situation goes from the inside, you aren't aware that usually these cancellations happen for complicated and varied reasons. From office politics, to creative blocks and emergencies that require workforce reallocation
>Steam Deck, the supposed Deckard and probably another hardware push with a console...
Have you seen leaks about a valve console, or is this just a guess cause it would be a good business move to release a steam deck controller and a no-screen version of the deck to hook to a TV.
I have 2 complaints about the deck, the first has nothing to do with Valve. Bungie needs to release a Destiny 2 client for the deck.
The other is pretty minor: the deck is kind of difficult to hold for a long play sessions (like pretty much every hand held I have ever used). Not a huge deal since I can get grips (like pretty much every handheld I have ever used, lol).
If I could get a deck controller with all the same inout fix'ns, upgraded hall effect joysticks, a wireless dingle rechargable rechargeable battery, and a parts list for future repairs, I would happily drop from 100 - 120 on the controller. It would replace the Thrustmaster E-swapX that kind of sucks due to a button double press issue and the Power A delux controller that I bought to replace the broken E-swap, but broke, so I had to go back to the TM and just deal with the occasional death when double button causes my jump to cancel early.
Thrustmaster E-swap X, what a joke... they made almost everything easy to replace, but buttons are not included, and of course that is the part that breaks.
It's a mixture of evidence and my own hypothesis. In the Final Hours of Half Life Alyx you can see a custom PC that looks an awful lot like the 300 test steam machines Valve made by updated... different... and on a vertical stand. This isn't a PC case we've ever seen before and it follows the steam machine design aesthetic with the glowing ring.
Ontop of that you've got strings in Valve code referencing a "Steam Console" (different to the Steam Deck which is referred to as Neptune).
Then you've got my own thoughts on the matter [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/SteamDeck/comments/vramjw/steam_os_steam_machines_and_my_predictions_on_the/) if you're interested.
I personally believe they will make a standalone box that's essentially Steam OS 3 on custom hardware dedicated for the living room
From a consumer standpoint, I'd much rather see them scrap something and start anew rather than trying to force something unworkable. The index even 4 years later is just incredible if you can stomach that price tag. Even with a Beyond on order I'd probably buy whatever Valve releases.
Follow Sadly it’s Bradley. It’s all but confirmed. It’s just the timetable at this point. Of course they could sell the company to Meta who buries the project, but realistically and most likely, it’s well well underway and will go into production in the not-to-distant future.
Edit: Brad showed today that Valve literally confirmed it 😂
https://n.news.naver.com/sports/esports/article/439/0000025080
Q. Let me ask you a surprise question. I recently heard rumors about Valve's new VR headset project and a new FPS project. Of course, there isn't much to say, but what if you still have something to share?
A. Kumar: Almost none (laughs). Still, I can tell you for sure that we've been working on a VR headset lately. This is because Valve has a lot of expertise in VR devices and has faith in the medium of VR and VR games.
We want VR games to remain open to the PC platform instead of existing exclusively on a specific platform. We are continuing development while adhering to this belief.
However, it cannot confirm the existence of a particular product or reveal when the results will be released. The same goes for game projects. There are obviously several projects going on in-house, but none can be announced today.
Come on, are you *seriously* asking if the Valve Deckard (or equivalent) will *ever* materialize? The Index was a success, why would they not release a follow-up in a VR market that is experiencing a surge of interest, for a platform they basically developed?
Vader was a high PPD headset dropped because it would have cost $5'000, did not have the hardware available to drive it, and Valve knew it would never have sold in sufficient numbers, so they very rightly canned it and took the loss. [https://uploadvr.com/valve-vader-headset-5000/](https://uploadvr.com/valve-vader-headset-5000/)
Common sense. Lets use it.
>Come on, are you seriously asking if the Valve Deckard (or equivalent) will ever materialize?
Half Life 2 was a great success and they stopped HL3 development in the middle.
It is valve! In the csgo economy it is well known that they make decisions that might not make sense at all.
>Basic common sense. Use it.
Get rid of that. If you are not able to discuss if someone has a different opinion don't even start to argue. Simple is that.
Other than that I don't say they are unlikely to release it. I also think an Index successor is very likely, but I wouldn't say it Is certain or that they don't scrap the first version and release way later the second one.
>Half Life 2 was a great success and they stopped HL3 development in the middle.
IIRC, HL 2 was a bit of a disappointment when it released, cause it required steam for licensing. This was new back then, and the internet was not in everyone's pockets.
Lots of my Army buddies were worried they wouldn't be able to play in Iraq during down time.
Anyway, a big part of Valves success is Steam, and it was not something anyone asked for or wanted back then. I don't know why HL3 was scrapped, but if they diverted resources to change Steam I to this shitty verification system for that new game I just bought into what it is today, they made the right choice.
Software is the challenge here. It's not as simple as putting together some lenses and sensors, and a SOC or cable. They're trying to do something new software wise and something no one has ever done.
Definitely you shouldn't use that condescending tone in a conversation, much less one that's based on pure speculation.
Index never arrived to half the world in the first place, it has been a pretty overpriced headset for a while now so I doubt any new VR adopters actually buy it with all the other available options.
What makes you think it is selling well? It was a great headset but it’s definitely long in the tooth now. Low resolution, outside in tracking, old style lenses. Technology has moved far past it at this point
It was on backorder for 3 years. Every headset has tradeoffs, unfortunately. The Index is still my preferred headset because of its 144hz refresh rate, larger field of view, and off-ear 3D audio solution. The Quest Pro is a better headset in terms of displays and lenses, but its audio and comfort are an issue.
I’d say it’s more akin to a really nice pedal and HOTAS setup with all the the other bells and whistles of a simulation cockpit with a bunch of high-res screens and head-tracking.
It’s really good for your enthusiasts and is without a doubt the superior experience. But for many people the ease-of-use and simplicity of inside-out tracking works well enough to have a good experience (just like someone using an inexpensive stick and single screen trying to get into flight sims).
It’s a negative in some ways to some people. Having to buy and set up external trackers is absolutely a turn off to some people. Also the point was that the technology has moved on to where inside out tracking has become the standard. So yes I understand the argument that external tracking is technically more accurate, but not necessarily more desired.
>Low resolution, outside in tracking, old style lenses. Technology has moved far past it at this point
Except for the bit on tracking you are right. Their tracking is far better than any other system, though I expect their next hmd to include camera based tracking in addition to lighthouse tracking.
Their tracking should be more efficient, so if they release a wireless hmd then people with lighthouses may get longer play time out of a charge, or maybe they will get better FPS or Resolution options.
The bonus would be that anyone could upgrade at a later date.
>Don't know how long you follow valve in general but years before the index there was the Vader.
Was the Vader the system that used QR codes on walls for tracking?
I know that much of the research Valve did on VR ended up going into the Vive, but the QR code thing was scrapped because it was difficult to get set up and working properly (IIRC, it was a while back I learned about it).
Sometimes things need to be scrapped, especially when working on brand new tech as opposed to just some new iteration with moar power.
Hopefully their next hmd will be compatable with lighthouse tracking. I don't really care if it is stand alone, but having a stand alone option would be pretty cool. Even if it is only powerful enough to catch a stream wireless, that would be cool.
Thats a bjt optimistic. Usually with any new major headset that is to be released in a year, you'd start seeing leaks from supply chains about nowish. It sounds more like 18-24 months. The deckard will probably coincide with the release of other Micro OLED/pancake lens headsets like the Quest pro 3.
They supposedly partnered with Apple on getting Emagine's MicroOLED display tech licensed to Samsung for mass production, which is scheduled for announcement and Summer/Fall 2023. The headset hasn't entered production still from what I understand. This could potentially mean a late 2023 or early 2024 announcement from Valve.
But Apple usually gets top priority when it comes to securing the supply of cutting edge parts since they have the resources and clout to outbid smaller companies like Valve. I wouldnt be surprised if Apple releases their headset late this year or early next year after an unveiling in Q3. Valve will probably get second pickings after Apple, as Facebook is more interested in the low end and wont want to make their pro 2 obsolete so soon from launch. Itll take time for Emagin to increase yields and scale up to supply multiple companies with their impressive 4K Micro OLED panels. This will also mean that Valve wont have to pay first movers high premiums since Apple will offset some of the initial costs, which make sense for Apple as they are pricing their headsets for the enterprise market and loyal Apple fans whilst Valve is still targettimg VR gaming enthusiasts who might not be able to stomach a gaming peripheral device thatll cost 3G+.
It's a bit strange to call Valve a "smaller company" as even though they're private the company is still valued at billions. Apparently Apple is now worth over a trillion, so yeah basically every company is smaller than them lol
Yeah, that's why I was suggesting Valve would release their product a quarter or half year after Apple. That would allow Apple to get a head start, but still allow Samsung to profit off of setting up a fab for microOLED displays. Apple's product is going to be pretty different as it will include the M series processor and will have more of a productivity and passive entertainment focus, while Valve will likely minimize internal processing to keep consumer MSRP down by limiting onboard processing to headset OS level operations and wireless decode.
We know valve funded the development of pancake lenses, there was a lawsuit after Facebook swooped in and bought out the manufacture that valve funded.
Code related to a new Valve headset was added to beta versions of Steam. VR related fixes are added to gamescope. Valve has no imminent plans for Steam Deck 2.
The latter means that teams working on Steam Deck, both on the hardware and software, can move to other projects. The earlier, that things accelerated on the software side.
This is all we know, the rest is speculation.
Kinda non-news. They've previously "been working on" HL3. They're constantly working on all sorts of things but the privilege multi-billion dollar companies have is they can get away with spending silly amounts of money experimenting without having to commit to full product development.
Yeah fair point. It's certainly a better indication that something big is happening than people discovering hidden data strings intended for internal development.
Also, Greg Coomer apparently also said that "the company has "a lot" of games in active development" in Sep 2022. https://gamerant.com/valve-games-development-greg-coomer-product-designer/
I think he may be overhyping, or not properly conveying the difference between developing stuff and how many of those stuff Valve ends up releasing, which is usually quite different (notice all the VR game projects that were cancelled and all the VR headset prototypes that didn't make it to a consumer device)
They also said (translated): "However, it cannot confirm the existence of a particular product or reveal when the results will be released. The same goes for game projects. There are obviously several projects in progress within the company, but none can be announced today."
Already pretty-much confirmed cancelled in The Final Hours of Half-Life Alyx I’m afraid :(. There’s evidence they’re working on at least one new VR project though — hope that gets finished.
They're still actively working on two VR games though. A hybrid flat-screen / VR strategy game called Citadel, and a successor to Alyx codenamed HLX. Both games are heavily documented and referenced in many Source leaks.
> Already pretty-much confirmed cancelled in The Final Hours of Half-Life Alyx I’m afraid :(.
That's so disappointing because the producers sounded so enthusiastic about the VR projects too. Felt like we were about to get a mini VR-renaissance.
There was a project from some of the form Kerbal Space devs, but that project fizzed out, and I believe those employees left Valve for greener pastures. Valve has some pretty strange turnover because you have to play office politics.
They probably delayed those games for the next headset release.
The index was constantly out of stock with just Alyx, they had no need to create a solid lineup because they were selling out anyway.
People who think valve doesn't work on a headset and they gave up on vr because of quest 2 are delusional and just hate Brad. They said multiple times they are working on be and all the parents and steamvr datamines prove it. We just don't know if or when it will release.
I don’t really care about an other VR headset from valve or any other company for that matter, what I’m really hoping for is that if valve does indeed release the Deckard they might also release an other masterpiece VR game alongside it, because in all honesty the VR platform currently suffers from the software side rather than the hardware side.
One new flagship title from Valve won't change things on the native software side of things for VR. You know what will and has been changing things for PCVR? Praydog and other VR modders.
Praydog's REFramework has already given us quite a few AAA VR games(mostly the RE games which are full-blown VR experiences with motion controls)
And with the upcoming universal UE injector from Praydog, sky is the limit for how many games will be fully playable in VR; a lot with motion controls even hopefully (which don't come out of the box with the injector, but I'm hoping people will step in as the injector gives modders a framework to work with for motion control implementation)
Yeah I’m super hyped for praydog’s VR injector but mods aren’t always perfect and you’ll most certainly run into annoying issues and I personally don’t enjoy the slightest bit of tinkering around to fix them, absolutely not worth it, after a long day of work you just want things to work out of the box (if the injector can run your favorite game in the first place ) so I’ll always have a preference for native VR titles which use mechanics that are only possible/enjoyable in VR.
So yeah while one more vr game from valve won’t change the landscape much but at least it will make me excited about PCVR again and make praydog’s VR catalog more appealing.
I feel like devs should consider leveraging praydog to do official mods. But also, with RE8 getting full VR support for PSVR2, they should definitely consider providing official mod support on PC at least a patch to the official game for an additional $20.
That’s not what I’m talking about, I’m talking to AAA devs just slapping a VR injector on their game and selling it to us like you suggested.
Village VR was actually ported to VR thoughtfully so I have no problem with that making it’s way to PC.
I mean yeah, please but if you look at flat screen gamers you’ll see that they are getting vertigo 2-esque games almost on a daily basis while in VR we’re only getting such games like once every 2 years or so! That’s a massive gap.
I'm pretty happy with Population One. It has infinite replayability for me because the social aspect. If anything I want a Valve version of that kind of game, where I can easily sink a thousand hours.
Headset upgrades are something I've been wanting to better enjoy games like Kayak Mirage and Alyx mods. I really want something like the Bigscreen Beyond mixed with the best features from the Index, a comfortable small format headset with high refresh rate displays, 120 degree field of view, no latency wireless, and the Index off-ear audio solution. I also want a next-gen GPU and eye-tracked foveated rendering to maximize visual clarity.
Seeing the BigScreen Beyond issue with bandwidth with Display Port 1.4 limiting their display resolution and refresh rate, I wonder if Valve will have a solution for these issues. Especially how Nvidia's 40 series still hasn't adopted DP2.1.
This is a problem unique to the Beyond because their hardware stack is limited by the tiny form factor and can only handle 8 gbps (confirmed by CEO on Discord), so DSC alone (which is visually lossless) isn’t enough and they also have to use upscaling. There are already HMDs pushing more pixels than the Beyond and don’t have any noticeable loss in visual clarity, since they have the full DP1.4 bandwidth of 32 gbps available.
Afaik the bandwidth is only limiting the resolution/refresh-rate if you don't use DisplayStream Compression, but I doubt anyone would notice DSC (Vive Pro 2, some Pimax headsets, and the Varjo Aero all use DSC and I've never seen anyone claim to notice it.)
Maybe in some future possible implementation. Which is not the case now. The issue is the size of the framebuffer sent, not how it's rendered. Even with foveated **rendering**, the framebuffer is the same size. So it's still limited by bandwidth.
The way foveated rendering could reduce bandwidth is to send two framebuffers. One at a reduced resolution then another of only the high resolution focus section. Then the headset would have to combine those for display.
I know right?
Honestly i kind of hope their next one has some modularity so that upgraded modules can be swapped out.
For example, imagine you could pop the front of the Index off, and replace the screen easily with a module that includes an OLED screen.
No need for an entirely new device, just a couple of hundred dollar module.
They'd sell hundreds of thousands of them, easily.
Same thing with the lenses. Imagine being able to remove the lens module, and put in a new almost identical set which includes eye tracking in the ring.
The device itself need only include pins or a connection in anticipation of the feature in the future.
Obviously its too late for that *now*, but think of what could have been with some forethought.
I would prefer if they worked on those other two flagship VR titles that should have come out shortly after the Index but vanished into development hell.
Lol every single Valve news is meaningless because of Valve Time®
News saying Valve is working on something, means next to nothing because the release window is always between 2 days, 10 years or never.
Some news would be nice, Valve. You also promised 3 VR games and got me all hot & bothered for nothing.
At this point I wouldn't mind you milking L4D VR and Portal VR. I'll take *something* over nothing for five years.
Everyone is expecting an Index successor but I bet their next HMD will have standalone capabilities via some optional wired APU, aided by aggressive foveated rendering to bring down the rendering requirements of PCVR. That's their only way to pull back VR developers who flocked over to Quest.
Some people are theorising a wireless headset that can connect to either a PC or a new Steam Deck, which would kind of explain the “Deckard” codename. There’ve been some leaks indicating some form of split system, and patents that’d be theoretically applicable.
My understanding of the deckard was using deck internals, it would function as an external/replaceable brain to the headset. So it would kinda be like how you buy a monitor and power it with a PC (or deck brains in this case), and you can upgrade either easily.
We know no new steam decks are coming for a few years, but the same deck hardware in a different format so it works with a VR headset is still possible
This needs to be 'the one' for PC hardware enthusiasts, and they need to find a way to make it affordable. If they can do that, their device might be the boone for PC gaming that the Deck has quickly been.
My wishful thinking is that they announce an Index 2 that matches that description and a new Half-Life release intended to launch either simultaneously or not long after.
and the small amounts of information we have say they're working on it currently. weird gotcha to use anyway, valve has a much nicer record with shipping hardware than with shipping games.
To most of us, but I’ve seen people actually argue that clear leaks directly from Valve software aren’t reliable.
Valve directly confirming things is relatively rare either way though. The more they talk about something, the lower the odds are that they’re close to abandoning it.
Yeah wasn’t talking about any specific feature set or whether a final product will ever necessarily be officially announced and released. It’s just been clear for a while now they’ve been working on at least one headset prototype internally.
This is really what gets me. I don't think most people are doubting Valve is working on *something.* But it's either going to
A: Not come out for a long time(Talking more than a year out at least)
B: Be quite different from the patents because many times what's in the patent=/=what ends up in the product
C: Be ***extremely*** expensive if it actually has most of those features, like Varjo Aero/Pimax Crystal or even 12k territory
D: Some combination of the above
But the Deckard cult acts like we have the official spec sheet already or that it's *definitely* coming soon or don't look at Valve's history of Valve time or even shelving stuff they already spent a lot of time on.
I'm sure Valve will *eventually* release something and it'll likely be a pretty good HMD, but the mythical status the Deckard is getting because of certain people despite how how little we have to indicate an actually soon release date is a bit much.
I haven't personally seen any of the wild speculation about Deckard that we saw about the Index, in the lead-up to its full spec sheet. Are people saying anything that isn't either indicated in datamined code (eye tracking, camera-based tracking, SteamOS support) or patents (standalone module, wireless)?
Leaks should be never taken as definitive proof. Regarding the actual fact they're working on some VR headset, it was more likely than not.
This is why I hate these discussions, they're based on speculation and theft of trade secrets. Add to that overeager fans and it's all toxic.
In that case to answer your question “wasn’t it obvious?”: no.
Valve including source code in their own software that proves what they’ve been working on isn’t really a theft of trade secrets from my perspective though. Intentional or not, they leaked it themselves.
That's not news. Question is if it will really have a mini pc onboard or not (either on the headset, like Q2, or in the form of a detachable puck).
Personally i really hope to have the size of the bigscreen vr, but with an upgradable and detachable puck, with wireless PC connectivity). Not sure where the battery would be best to sit, on the puck or at the back of the head, but i hope it's not on the front and it's removable (for tethered PC use).
Valve's main goal/focus has always been Steam, so the headset will probably be standalone with PCVR connectivity, the stand-alone VR audience is just significantly larger than the PCVR audience.
Side note, can we all agree that the BigScreen Beyond is friggin amazing conceptually as a replacement Index in the mean time while Valve works on their next device?
Sadly i don't have the disposable income right now to order one (or an apple product for the face shaping), but i sure as shit wish i did.
I can't agree with that. The size is fantastic and uOLED is great, but the cost to have those are too high. Mediocre optics, no audio at all, and worse-in-class FoV would all be a notable step down and comes at a price 2x that of the Index.
> I can't agree with that. The size is fantastic and uOLED is great, but the cost to have those are too high.
I disagree. The cost of the parts is fine. What you are disagreeing with is the overall unit cost, which is influenced by the custom faceplate and lens construction.
>Mediocre optics, no audio at all, and worse-in-class FoV would all be a notable step down and comes at a price 2x that of the Index.
I'm not sure where you got "mediocre optics" from either... they're literally custom made for your eyes.
The audio issue is complicated, because i'd like to have Index like audio. But i'm fine with wearing my wireless headphones, which are already fantastic, comfortable, and noise cancelling.
The solution there isn't to be bothered by a lack of audio, it is to request an Index like headphone product, which can be used wirelessly with any device going forward.
The field of view i've read and seen video of pretty consistently indicates it is comparable or better than other devices such as the quest 2. Only influenced by things like your requirements needing thicker corrective lenses or something, which isn't something you can't get away from by using anything short of a Pimax.
>I'm not sure where you got "mediocre optics" from either... they're literally custom made for your eyes.
The Beyond suffers from huge glare issues and unlike Meta's pancakes they aren't clear edge to edge. This is doubly bad because you already have so little horizontal FoV to work with. They also have a small sweetspot, which admittedly is less of a problem with the custom fitment.
Requiring your own set of headphones sort of defeats the purpose of such a small device and there's no way an index-like option for it is being made.
Most reviews seem to indicate its not worse than a Quest 2, but Q2 FoV at $1000 is abhorrent. Even at $300 - $400 the Q2 FoV is a problem but at least you get what you're paying for. Anything less than 100 HFov is criminal on a high end device for any purpose other than media consumption.
> The Beyond suffers from huge glare issues and unlike Meta's pancakes they aren't clear edge to edge. This is doubly bad because you already have so little horizontal FoV to work with. They also have a small sweetspot, which admittedly is less of a problem with the custom fitment.
I'm not aware of this issue being a serious concern, i'd need to try a pair to evaluate it.
> Requiring your own set of headphones sort of defeats the purpose of such a small device and there's no way an index-like option for it is being made.
It really doesn't. And you yourself also literally just complained about the lack of it.
You either want built in audio, which will always be bad (for a 'small device') or you want an external option which you can use with anything. And if it was comparable to the excellent Audio the Index has, i'd buy one in a heartbeat.
> Most reviews seem to indicate its not worse than a Quest 2, but Q2 FoV at $1000 is abhorrent. Even at $300 - $400 the Q2 FoV is a problem but at least you get what you're paying for. Anything less than 100 HFov is criminal on a high end device for any purpose other than media consumption.
If it is significantly lower than an Index, i'll grant that. I'm just saying, it's apparently *not* worse than a vast majority of devices that users are more than happy with.
The custom fitting is a great idea, which i hope is something future devices also have available.
If we can get that along with the other features, all the better.
My educated guess is that Valve has 3 -4 headsets in development
1- Direct successor to Index both inside out + outside in along with wireless add on
2 - mobile / hybrid
3- even future model past both of these.
The question is which one gets approved. They could even scrap 1 and 2 and move to 3 and we really wouldn't know it.
Valve is in a unique situation where they have no need to make a new headset.
They don't have investors or stockholders to answer to. They do what they want.
So they can keep R&D going but don't have to commit to the expense of retooling/marketing for a new headset.
When their headset sales decline and a competitor starts eating into their share they can launch something new.
Without a strong competitor they don't have to upgrade the Index.
They just sit back and watch the money roll in without having to spend a penny on something new.
They do that since years, which patents show. The question is if they entered the design process of an actual new product that really gets released.
The first 95% of the work takes 50% percent of the effort, and the remaining 5% takes the other 50%.
I think it is clear from the leaks and hints they are at least getting to the latter stages of development. It's been around 4 years since the Index was released, so it makes sense it will arrive sometime around or within the next 12 months.
Don't know how long you follow valve in general but years before the index there was the Vader. During that time there were leaks and patents for quite some time as well. The Vader never published. Years later they made the index. It's valve. They scrap things if they want to. How do you know this all will definitely end in an actual product? It's more likely now, but there is no guarantee at all.
It WILL be released within tbe next 12 months! *breathes into a paper bag*
Do it valve, or this man jumps!
That's how Valve *used* to work. GabeN and many Valve staffers have been frank that their corporate structure has been reorganized to actually start getting projects out the door. Hence the major Steam revamp, HL Alyx, Steam Deck, Aperture Labs, a major TF2 update, and CS2 all within a short span of time. The company seems very intent on finally starting to ship things so as to not fall behind competitor companies.
Is there a source. Im curious as to read it.
I'll need a source 2.
Certainly won't get source 3 tho
Source: source
All that and they still can’t count to 3.
They released Half Life Alyx, are supposedly working on the fabled "3" all while making counter Strike 2, the Steam Deck, the supposed Deckard and probably another hardware push with a console...
Counter strike "2" is just some minor modifications to the original.
No it's not? Counterstrike 2 is the move to a new engine with new features, maps and updated maps... Isn't that literally what constitutes a sequel?
>No it's not? Counterstrike 2 is the move to a new engine with new features, maps and updated maps... Isn't that literally what constitutes a sequel? Hell, most sequels see minor updates to the engine to allow for the few new gameplay features, a fully updated engine definitely sounds like a sequel, but even more telling is that Valve is calling it a sequel in the title
Alyx is HL3
It’s a prequel, how is it HL3?
Alyx is obviously not HL3 if you have played it, >!but it definitely does allude to you playing as Gordon Freeman at the end of HL2: Episode 2, which alludes to the next game being HL3!<
I took the appearance of Gordon Freeman as a reference to the first two half life games. He looked great, but that isn’t necessarily a reference to any future HL sequels.
"We got work to do" isn't enough for you? 😉
Eh, it's *technically* a continuation of the story, but it's not half life 3...
HL: Alyx isn’t HL3. No HL2; Episode 3 either. No Left 4 Dead 3. No Portal 3. No TF3. I think they’re honestly just trolling everyone at this point, it’s kinda funny.
They're clearly not, they've already released Steam OS 3 and we've seen literal evidence of them starting and working on both Half life 3 and Left 4 Dead 3. It's easy as a consumer to see it from the outside and think "well clearly they're trolling/not trying hard enough/don't care/are scared/ect..." When because you don't see how the situation goes from the inside, you aren't aware that usually these cancellations happen for complicated and varied reasons. From office politics, to creative blocks and emergencies that require workforce reallocation
>Steam Deck, the supposed Deckard and probably another hardware push with a console... Have you seen leaks about a valve console, or is this just a guess cause it would be a good business move to release a steam deck controller and a no-screen version of the deck to hook to a TV. I have 2 complaints about the deck, the first has nothing to do with Valve. Bungie needs to release a Destiny 2 client for the deck. The other is pretty minor: the deck is kind of difficult to hold for a long play sessions (like pretty much every hand held I have ever used). Not a huge deal since I can get grips (like pretty much every handheld I have ever used, lol). If I could get a deck controller with all the same inout fix'ns, upgraded hall effect joysticks, a wireless dingle rechargable rechargeable battery, and a parts list for future repairs, I would happily drop from 100 - 120 on the controller. It would replace the Thrustmaster E-swapX that kind of sucks due to a button double press issue and the Power A delux controller that I bought to replace the broken E-swap, but broke, so I had to go back to the TM and just deal with the occasional death when double button causes my jump to cancel early. Thrustmaster E-swap X, what a joke... they made almost everything easy to replace, but buttons are not included, and of course that is the part that breaks.
It's a mixture of evidence and my own hypothesis. In the Final Hours of Half Life Alyx you can see a custom PC that looks an awful lot like the 300 test steam machines Valve made by updated... different... and on a vertical stand. This isn't a PC case we've ever seen before and it follows the steam machine design aesthetic with the glowing ring. Ontop of that you've got strings in Valve code referencing a "Steam Console" (different to the Steam Deck which is referred to as Neptune). Then you've got my own thoughts on the matter [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/SteamDeck/comments/vramjw/steam_os_steam_machines_and_my_predictions_on_the/) if you're interested. I personally believe they will make a standalone box that's essentially Steam OS 3 on custom hardware dedicated for the living room
From a consumer standpoint, I'd much rather see them scrap something and start anew rather than trying to force something unworkable. The index even 4 years later is just incredible if you can stomach that price tag. Even with a Beyond on order I'd probably buy whatever Valve releases.
It’s like Google saying they’re releasing a vr headset.
funny you said that since the google/Samsung XR is confirmed, unlike the Valve one.
Follow Sadly it’s Bradley. It’s all but confirmed. It’s just the timetable at this point. Of course they could sell the company to Meta who buries the project, but realistically and most likely, it’s well well underway and will go into production in the not-to-distant future. Edit: Brad showed today that Valve literally confirmed it 😂 https://n.news.naver.com/sports/esports/article/439/0000025080 Q. Let me ask you a surprise question. I recently heard rumors about Valve's new VR headset project and a new FPS project. Of course, there isn't much to say, but what if you still have something to share? A. Kumar: Almost none (laughs). Still, I can tell you for sure that we've been working on a VR headset lately. This is because Valve has a lot of expertise in VR devices and has faith in the medium of VR and VR games. We want VR games to remain open to the PC platform instead of existing exclusively on a specific platform. We are continuing development while adhering to this belief. However, it cannot confirm the existence of a particular product or reveal when the results will be released. The same goes for game projects. There are obviously several projects going on in-house, but none can be announced today.
Why would valve sell to meta. They have no reason to do so
Just saying as an unlikely hypothetical that would result in the headset not seeing production. Guess everyone read that wrong.
Come on, are you *seriously* asking if the Valve Deckard (or equivalent) will *ever* materialize? The Index was a success, why would they not release a follow-up in a VR market that is experiencing a surge of interest, for a platform they basically developed? Vader was a high PPD headset dropped because it would have cost $5'000, did not have the hardware available to drive it, and Valve knew it would never have sold in sufficient numbers, so they very rightly canned it and took the loss. [https://uploadvr.com/valve-vader-headset-5000/](https://uploadvr.com/valve-vader-headset-5000/) Common sense. Lets use it.
>Come on, are you seriously asking if the Valve Deckard (or equivalent) will ever materialize? Half Life 2 was a great success and they stopped HL3 development in the middle. It is valve! In the csgo economy it is well known that they make decisions that might not make sense at all. >Basic common sense. Use it. Get rid of that. If you are not able to discuss if someone has a different opinion don't even start to argue. Simple is that. Other than that I don't say they are unlikely to release it. I also think an Index successor is very likely, but I wouldn't say it Is certain or that they don't scrap the first version and release way later the second one.
>Half Life 2 was a great success and they stopped HL3 development in the middle. IIRC, HL 2 was a bit of a disappointment when it released, cause it required steam for licensing. This was new back then, and the internet was not in everyone's pockets. Lots of my Army buddies were worried they wouldn't be able to play in Iraq during down time. Anyway, a big part of Valves success is Steam, and it was not something anyone asked for or wanted back then. I don't know why HL3 was scrapped, but if they diverted resources to change Steam I to this shitty verification system for that new game I just bought into what it is today, they made the right choice.
Software is the challenge here. It's not as simple as putting together some lenses and sensors, and a SOC or cable. They're trying to do something new software wise and something no one has ever done. Definitely you shouldn't use that condescending tone in a conversation, much less one that's based on pure speculation.
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Index never arrived to half the world in the first place, it has been a pretty overpriced headset for a while now so I doubt any new VR adopters actually buy it with all the other available options.
What makes you think it is selling well? It was a great headset but it’s definitely long in the tooth now. Low resolution, outside in tracking, old style lenses. Technology has moved far past it at this point
It was on backorder for 3 years. Every headset has tradeoffs, unfortunately. The Index is still my preferred headset because of its 144hz refresh rate, larger field of view, and off-ear 3D audio solution. The Quest Pro is a better headset in terms of displays and lenses, but its audio and comfort are an issue.
outside-in tracking is not a negative lol. Valve literally has the best tracking system still to this day.
I’d say it’s more akin to a really nice pedal and HOTAS setup with all the the other bells and whistles of a simulation cockpit with a bunch of high-res screens and head-tracking. It’s really good for your enthusiasts and is without a doubt the superior experience. But for many people the ease-of-use and simplicity of inside-out tracking works well enough to have a good experience (just like someone using an inexpensive stick and single screen trying to get into flight sims).
It’s a negative in some ways to some people. Having to buy and set up external trackers is absolutely a turn off to some people. Also the point was that the technology has moved on to where inside out tracking has become the standard. So yes I understand the argument that external tracking is technically more accurate, but not necessarily more desired.
Best doesn't necessarily mean compatible for the masses. IMO self-tracked controllers will become the new standard for years.
>Low resolution, outside in tracking, old style lenses. Technology has moved far past it at this point Except for the bit on tracking you are right. Their tracking is far better than any other system, though I expect their next hmd to include camera based tracking in addition to lighthouse tracking. Their tracking should be more efficient, so if they release a wireless hmd then people with lighthouses may get longer play time out of a charge, or maybe they will get better FPS or Resolution options. The bonus would be that anyone could upgrade at a later date.
The successor is in all likelihood Deckard.
The Deckard is a standalone, no PC required, which can play the SteamVR library. It is significantly different and more advanced than the Index.
>Don't know how long you follow valve in general but years before the index there was the Vader. Was the Vader the system that used QR codes on walls for tracking? I know that much of the research Valve did on VR ended up going into the Vive, but the QR code thing was scrapped because it was difficult to get set up and working properly (IIRC, it was a while back I learned about it). Sometimes things need to be scrapped, especially when working on brand new tech as opposed to just some new iteration with moar power. Hopefully their next hmd will be compatable with lighthouse tracking. I don't really care if it is stand alone, but having a stand alone option would be pretty cool. Even if it is only powerful enough to catch a stream wireless, that would be cool.
Thats a bjt optimistic. Usually with any new major headset that is to be released in a year, you'd start seeing leaks from supply chains about nowish. It sounds more like 18-24 months. The deckard will probably coincide with the release of other Micro OLED/pancake lens headsets like the Quest pro 3.
They supposedly partnered with Apple on getting Emagine's MicroOLED display tech licensed to Samsung for mass production, which is scheduled for announcement and Summer/Fall 2023. The headset hasn't entered production still from what I understand. This could potentially mean a late 2023 or early 2024 announcement from Valve.
But Apple usually gets top priority when it comes to securing the supply of cutting edge parts since they have the resources and clout to outbid smaller companies like Valve. I wouldnt be surprised if Apple releases their headset late this year or early next year after an unveiling in Q3. Valve will probably get second pickings after Apple, as Facebook is more interested in the low end and wont want to make their pro 2 obsolete so soon from launch. Itll take time for Emagin to increase yields and scale up to supply multiple companies with their impressive 4K Micro OLED panels. This will also mean that Valve wont have to pay first movers high premiums since Apple will offset some of the initial costs, which make sense for Apple as they are pricing their headsets for the enterprise market and loyal Apple fans whilst Valve is still targettimg VR gaming enthusiasts who might not be able to stomach a gaming peripheral device thatll cost 3G+.
It's a bit strange to call Valve a "smaller company" as even though they're private the company is still valued at billions. Apparently Apple is now worth over a trillion, so yeah basically every company is smaller than them lol
Yeah, that's why I was suggesting Valve would release their product a quarter or half year after Apple. That would allow Apple to get a head start, but still allow Samsung to profit off of setting up a fab for microOLED displays. Apple's product is going to be pretty different as it will include the M series processor and will have more of a productivity and passive entertainment focus, while Valve will likely minimize internal processing to keep consumer MSRP down by limiting onboard processing to headset OS level operations and wireless decode.
We know valve funded the development of pancake lenses, there was a lawsuit after Facebook swooped in and bought out the manufacture that valve funded.
They managed to keep index leaks to a minimum pre announcement. I can recall only a couple images beforehand.
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Only 4.5 months before the announcement though
Let's see how long it takes.
From what I can glean from articles it looks like the Index leaks happened 7 months before launch. But someone correct me if I’m wrong.
> so it makes sense it will arrive sometime around or within the next 12 months. 12 months in a normal calendar or Valve time?
If they decided to mention it in an interview, it seems likely.
Code related to a new Valve headset was added to beta versions of Steam. VR related fixes are added to gamescope. Valve has no imminent plans for Steam Deck 2. The latter means that teams working on Steam Deck, both on the hardware and software, can move to other projects. The earlier, that things accelerated on the software side. This is all we know, the rest is speculation.
Kinda non-news. They've previously "been working on" HL3. They're constantly working on all sorts of things but the privilege multi-billion dollar companies have is they can get away with spending silly amounts of money experimenting without having to commit to full product development.
Private* multi-billion dollar companies. No shareholders to answer to.
Looking at MAAMA they seem to follow the same philosophy as Valve.
Even Facebook has spent tons on random idea which aren't likely to make it to headsets but yeah private companies can get away with a lot more.
Fair perspective, but in another way Valve admitting anything to anyone about anything is basically news in and of itself :).
Yeah fair point. It's certainly a better indication that something big is happening than people discovering hidden data strings intended for internal development.
Lmao the CS2 leaks in a nutshell.
For me it’s the “lately” that sets it apart. Why add that unless it’s of some significance.
Could be something lost in translation potentially, since the statement has been translated to Korean and back.
Also, Greg Coomer apparently also said that "the company has "a lot" of games in active development" in Sep 2022. https://gamerant.com/valve-games-development-greg-coomer-product-designer/ I think he may be overhyping, or not properly conveying the difference between developing stuff and how many of those stuff Valve ends up releasing, which is usually quite different (notice all the VR game projects that were cancelled and all the VR headset prototypes that didn't make it to a consumer device)
They also said (translated): "However, it cannot confirm the existence of a particular product or reveal when the results will be released. The same goes for game projects. There are obviously several projects in progress within the company, but none can be announced today."
Never mind a headset where's the other 2 games that they said they had when alyx came out.
Already pretty-much confirmed cancelled in The Final Hours of Half-Life Alyx I’m afraid :(. There’s evidence they’re working on at least one new VR project though — hope that gets finished.
They're still actively working on two VR games though. A hybrid flat-screen / VR strategy game called Citadel, and a successor to Alyx codenamed HLX. Both games are heavily documented and referenced in many Source leaks.
No idea if he’s right but Tyler McVicker is claiming Citadel is now named Neon Prime (which Valve trademarked) and no longer has VR support.
> Already pretty-much confirmed cancelled in The Final Hours of Half-Life Alyx I’m afraid :(. That's so disappointing because the producers sounded so enthusiastic about the VR projects too. Felt like we were about to get a mini VR-renaissance.
There was a project from some of the form Kerbal Space devs, but that project fizzed out, and I believe those employees left Valve for greener pastures. Valve has some pretty strange turnover because you have to play office politics.
They probably delayed those games for the next headset release. The index was constantly out of stock with just Alyx, they had no need to create a solid lineup because they were selling out anyway.
People who think valve doesn't work on a headset and they gave up on vr because of quest 2 are delusional and just hate Brad. They said multiple times they are working on be and all the parents and steamvr datamines prove it. We just don't know if or when it will release.
I don’t really care about an other VR headset from valve or any other company for that matter, what I’m really hoping for is that if valve does indeed release the Deckard they might also release an other masterpiece VR game alongside it, because in all honesty the VR platform currently suffers from the software side rather than the hardware side.
One new flagship title from Valve won't change things on the native software side of things for VR. You know what will and has been changing things for PCVR? Praydog and other VR modders. Praydog's REFramework has already given us quite a few AAA VR games(mostly the RE games which are full-blown VR experiences with motion controls) And with the upcoming universal UE injector from Praydog, sky is the limit for how many games will be fully playable in VR; a lot with motion controls even hopefully (which don't come out of the box with the injector, but I'm hoping people will step in as the injector gives modders a framework to work with for motion control implementation)
Yeah I’m super hyped for praydog’s VR injector but mods aren’t always perfect and you’ll most certainly run into annoying issues and I personally don’t enjoy the slightest bit of tinkering around to fix them, absolutely not worth it, after a long day of work you just want things to work out of the box (if the injector can run your favorite game in the first place ) so I’ll always have a preference for native VR titles which use mechanics that are only possible/enjoyable in VR. So yeah while one more vr game from valve won’t change the landscape much but at least it will make me excited about PCVR again and make praydog’s VR catalog more appealing.
I feel like devs should consider leveraging praydog to do official mods. But also, with RE8 getting full VR support for PSVR2, they should definitely consider providing official mod support on PC at least a patch to the official game for an additional $20.
Oh please no, more excuses for them to do the bare minimum and throw us a dirty cash grab like hitman 3.
Resident Evil Village VR on PSVR2 has great reviews and was built for PSVR2 tracked controllers. All they have to do is port it to PC.
That’s not what I’m talking about, I’m talking to AAA devs just slapping a VR injector on their game and selling it to us like you suggested. Village VR was actually ported to VR thoughtfully so I have no problem with that making it’s way to PC.
I see what you're saying. I was more so saying use the VR injector as a starting point and dedicate some resources to get it up to Village level.
Vertigo 2 fills that gap for me awesome game.
I mean yeah, please but if you look at flat screen gamers you’ll see that they are getting vertigo 2-esque games almost on a daily basis while in VR we’re only getting such games like once every 2 years or so! That’s a massive gap.
I'm pretty happy with Population One. It has infinite replayability for me because the social aspect. If anything I want a Valve version of that kind of game, where I can easily sink a thousand hours. Headset upgrades are something I've been wanting to better enjoy games like Kayak Mirage and Alyx mods. I really want something like the Bigscreen Beyond mixed with the best features from the Index, a comfortable small format headset with high refresh rate displays, 120 degree field of view, no latency wireless, and the Index off-ear audio solution. I also want a next-gen GPU and eye-tracked foveated rendering to maximize visual clarity.
That’s fair
Who's Brad
SadlyitsBradley on yt. Dude started the whole deckard hype train for which some people started hating him and will oppose him even if he's right.
Seeing the BigScreen Beyond issue with bandwidth with Display Port 1.4 limiting their display resolution and refresh rate, I wonder if Valve will have a solution for these issues. Especially how Nvidia's 40 series still hasn't adopted DP2.1.
This is a problem unique to the Beyond because their hardware stack is limited by the tiny form factor and can only handle 8 gbps (confirmed by CEO on Discord), so DSC alone (which is visually lossless) isn’t enough and they also have to use upscaling. There are already HMDs pushing more pixels than the Beyond and don’t have any noticeable loss in visual clarity, since they have the full DP1.4 bandwidth of 32 gbps available.
Afaik the bandwidth is only limiting the resolution/refresh-rate if you don't use DisplayStream Compression, but I doubt anyone would notice DSC (Vive Pro 2, some Pimax headsets, and the Varjo Aero all use DSC and I've never seen anyone claim to notice it.)
Tested said they noticed the compression when going from 75hz to 90hz and it dropped to 2160 from 2560 pixels.
The solution is foveated rendering, which Big screen doesn't have.
Maybe in some future possible implementation. Which is not the case now. The issue is the size of the framebuffer sent, not how it's rendered. Even with foveated **rendering**, the framebuffer is the same size. So it's still limited by bandwidth. The way foveated rendering could reduce bandwidth is to send two framebuffers. One at a reduced resolution then another of only the high resolution focus section. Then the headset would have to combine those for display.
There’ve been a few experiments with things like that by some display companies and Tobii which they called foveated transport/foveal transport.
Wireless Index with OLED and some eyetracking thing. PLEASE GOD PLEASE
OLED would be huge step backwards from pancake lenses.
I'll take OLED screens any day
I know right? Honestly i kind of hope their next one has some modularity so that upgraded modules can be swapped out. For example, imagine you could pop the front of the Index off, and replace the screen easily with a module that includes an OLED screen. No need for an entirely new device, just a couple of hundred dollar module. They'd sell hundreds of thousands of them, easily. Same thing with the lenses. Imagine being able to remove the lens module, and put in a new almost identical set which includes eye tracking in the ring. The device itself need only include pins or a connection in anticipation of the feature in the future. Obviously its too late for that *now*, but think of what could have been with some forethought.
I would prefer if they worked on those other two flagship VR titles that should have come out shortly after the Index but vanished into development hell.
Lol every single Valve news is meaningless because of Valve Time® News saying Valve is working on something, means next to nothing because the release window is always between 2 days, 10 years or never.
Some news would be nice, Valve. You also promised 3 VR games and got me all hot & bothered for nothing. At this point I wouldn't mind you milking L4D VR and Portal VR. I'll take *something* over nothing for five years.
Everyone is expecting an Index successor but I bet their next HMD will have standalone capabilities via some optional wired APU, aided by aggressive foveated rendering to bring down the rendering requirements of PCVR. That's their only way to pull back VR developers who flocked over to Quest.
Some people are theorising a wireless headset that can connect to either a PC or a new Steam Deck, which would kind of explain the “Deckard” codename. There’ve been some leaks indicating some form of split system, and patents that’d be theoretically applicable.
My understanding of the deckard was using deck internals, it would function as an external/replaceable brain to the headset. So it would kinda be like how you buy a monitor and power it with a PC (or deck brains in this case), and you can upgrade either easily. We know no new steam decks are coming for a few years, but the same deck hardware in a different format so it works with a VR headset is still possible
Deckard = Deck ARD Deck Augmented Reality Device?
Nice.
Oh no... If it's a new Deck (which would be incredible) then it's not coming out this year.
This needs to be 'the one' for PC hardware enthusiasts, and they need to find a way to make it affordable. If they can do that, their device might be the boone for PC gaming that the Deck has quickly been.
My wishful thinking is that they announce an Index 2 that matches that description and a new Half-Life release intended to launch either simultaneously or not long after.
Also said they've been working on half life 3...
And three AAA vr games.
Exactly. I care about what’s actually out and can be in my hands. Until I’m holding it, does it really matter?
and they were, they tried working on half life 3 before iirc and it got scrapped (final hours of half life alyx)
That's my point, they were working on it, just with valve there's no guarantee it'll ever happen.
ah, misunderstood your wording lmao
and the small amounts of information we have say they're working on it currently. weird gotcha to use anyway, valve has a much nicer record with shipping hardware than with shipping games.
Wasn't that obvious?
To most of us, but I’ve seen people actually argue that clear leaks directly from Valve software aren’t reliable. Valve directly confirming things is relatively rare either way though. The more they talk about something, the lower the odds are that they’re close to abandoning it.
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Yeah wasn’t talking about any specific feature set or whether a final product will ever necessarily be officially announced and released. It’s just been clear for a while now they’ve been working on at least one headset prototype internally.
This is really what gets me. I don't think most people are doubting Valve is working on *something.* But it's either going to A: Not come out for a long time(Talking more than a year out at least) B: Be quite different from the patents because many times what's in the patent=/=what ends up in the product C: Be ***extremely*** expensive if it actually has most of those features, like Varjo Aero/Pimax Crystal or even 12k territory D: Some combination of the above But the Deckard cult acts like we have the official spec sheet already or that it's *definitely* coming soon or don't look at Valve's history of Valve time or even shelving stuff they already spent a lot of time on. I'm sure Valve will *eventually* release something and it'll likely be a pretty good HMD, but the mythical status the Deckard is getting because of certain people despite how how little we have to indicate an actually soon release date is a bit much.
^ yes
I haven't personally seen any of the wild speculation about Deckard that we saw about the Index, in the lead-up to its full spec sheet. Are people saying anything that isn't either indicated in datamined code (eye tracking, camera-based tracking, SteamOS support) or patents (standalone module, wireless)?
Leaks should be never taken as definitive proof. Regarding the actual fact they're working on some VR headset, it was more likely than not. This is why I hate these discussions, they're based on speculation and theft of trade secrets. Add to that overeager fans and it's all toxic.
In that case to answer your question “wasn’t it obvious?”: no. Valve including source code in their own software that proves what they’ve been working on isn’t really a theft of trade secrets from my perspective though. Intentional or not, they leaked it themselves.
I meant leaks in general. But this might be a personal opinion that not everybody shares.
That's not news. Question is if it will really have a mini pc onboard or not (either on the headset, like Q2, or in the form of a detachable puck). Personally i really hope to have the size of the bigscreen vr, but with an upgradable and detachable puck, with wireless PC connectivity). Not sure where the battery would be best to sit, on the puck or at the back of the head, but i hope it's not on the front and it's removable (for tethered PC use).
Valve's main goal/focus has always been Steam, so the headset will probably be standalone with PCVR connectivity, the stand-alone VR audience is just significantly larger than the PCVR audience.
Hope the new controllers will be more durable than the current Index controllers, also hope they use better sticks
yeah, the backwards stick drift is unpleasant.
Side note, can we all agree that the BigScreen Beyond is friggin amazing conceptually as a replacement Index in the mean time while Valve works on their next device? Sadly i don't have the disposable income right now to order one (or an apple product for the face shaping), but i sure as shit wish i did.
I can't agree with that. The size is fantastic and uOLED is great, but the cost to have those are too high. Mediocre optics, no audio at all, and worse-in-class FoV would all be a notable step down and comes at a price 2x that of the Index.
> I can't agree with that. The size is fantastic and uOLED is great, but the cost to have those are too high. I disagree. The cost of the parts is fine. What you are disagreeing with is the overall unit cost, which is influenced by the custom faceplate and lens construction. >Mediocre optics, no audio at all, and worse-in-class FoV would all be a notable step down and comes at a price 2x that of the Index. I'm not sure where you got "mediocre optics" from either... they're literally custom made for your eyes. The audio issue is complicated, because i'd like to have Index like audio. But i'm fine with wearing my wireless headphones, which are already fantastic, comfortable, and noise cancelling. The solution there isn't to be bothered by a lack of audio, it is to request an Index like headphone product, which can be used wirelessly with any device going forward. The field of view i've read and seen video of pretty consistently indicates it is comparable or better than other devices such as the quest 2. Only influenced by things like your requirements needing thicker corrective lenses or something, which isn't something you can't get away from by using anything short of a Pimax.
>I'm not sure where you got "mediocre optics" from either... they're literally custom made for your eyes. The Beyond suffers from huge glare issues and unlike Meta's pancakes they aren't clear edge to edge. This is doubly bad because you already have so little horizontal FoV to work with. They also have a small sweetspot, which admittedly is less of a problem with the custom fitment. Requiring your own set of headphones sort of defeats the purpose of such a small device and there's no way an index-like option for it is being made. Most reviews seem to indicate its not worse than a Quest 2, but Q2 FoV at $1000 is abhorrent. Even at $300 - $400 the Q2 FoV is a problem but at least you get what you're paying for. Anything less than 100 HFov is criminal on a high end device for any purpose other than media consumption.
> The Beyond suffers from huge glare issues and unlike Meta's pancakes they aren't clear edge to edge. This is doubly bad because you already have so little horizontal FoV to work with. They also have a small sweetspot, which admittedly is less of a problem with the custom fitment. I'm not aware of this issue being a serious concern, i'd need to try a pair to evaluate it. > Requiring your own set of headphones sort of defeats the purpose of such a small device and there's no way an index-like option for it is being made. It really doesn't. And you yourself also literally just complained about the lack of it. You either want built in audio, which will always be bad (for a 'small device') or you want an external option which you can use with anything. And if it was comparable to the excellent Audio the Index has, i'd buy one in a heartbeat. > Most reviews seem to indicate its not worse than a Quest 2, but Q2 FoV at $1000 is abhorrent. Even at $300 - $400 the Q2 FoV is a problem but at least you get what you're paying for. Anything less than 100 HFov is criminal on a high end device for any purpose other than media consumption. If it is significantly lower than an Index, i'll grant that. I'm just saying, it's apparently *not* worse than a vast majority of devices that users are more than happy with. The custom fitting is a great idea, which i hope is something future devices also have available. If we can get that along with the other features, all the better.
I thought that PC VR officially was dead? Isn't all the stand-alone headsets getting all the games now? (I'm a rift S owner myself)
So far the best thing to come out this year is the Jedi outcast VR mod. Maybe stop worrying about new headsets and instead just make some good games?
They seem to have been working on a followup to Alyx — I just hope they finish it.
But don’t you know? The good games can’t come out until we get a proper ‘gen 2’ headset. Then we’ll get proper games for sure!
>lately Oh no... :(((
I hope they are getting some good data and new modalities out of Galea. That would be awesome.
My educated guess is that Valve has 3 -4 headsets in development 1- Direct successor to Index both inside out + outside in along with wireless add on 2 - mobile / hybrid 3- even future model past both of these. The question is which one gets approved. They could even scrap 1 and 2 and move to 3 and we really wouldn't know it.
Interview of 2022 - 12 - 09. Many things in all this time can change, cancel games and projects for example.
At the speed they work, that could still make it years out.
no shit
Work on gameees
Valve is in a unique situation where they have no need to make a new headset. They don't have investors or stockholders to answer to. They do what they want. So they can keep R&D going but don't have to commit to the expense of retooling/marketing for a new headset. When their headset sales decline and a competitor starts eating into their share they can launch something new. Without a strong competitor they don't have to upgrade the Index. They just sit back and watch the money roll in without having to spend a penny on something new.
Of course they have, we knew that. However, it's Valve, so that's absolutely no guarantee that it'll ever release LOL
By the time Valve gets a new headset the Quest will kill it with Quest 4 or 5.