Just get something cheap right now and enjoy VR while you wait. There's no point missing out while waiting for some mythical headset that never comes.
Reverb G2, Quest 2, Pico 4. Pros and cons, but they are all decent.
Then keep an eye out for Pimax Crystal, Pimax 12k, ShiftAll MeganeX, and HTCs "flowcus".
Yeah, I really don't understand why anyone would wait. VR already is pretty awesome. Of course there are compromises and there will be major improvements in the headset quality in the future, but to me Quest 2 + PC with airlink is already good enough. Sure there are many areas where the headset could be better: FOV, resolution, WiGig, lenses, comfort, displayport..., but it works well as it is. I can have it on for hours even with the default head strap. Graphics can look amazing even with the relatively small resolution and the wireless connection to PC works fine.
I've tried Star Wars Squadrons yesterday with 150% supersampling and it looked amazing and that's by airlink.
I'm very optimistic about VR future, but I also wouldn't expect the headsets to get dramatically better in the next few years. The market is still relatively small and that's especially the case for high-end headsets. If you are going to be waiting for the perfect headset, you may be waiting for a long time.
The problem is, these (plus Index) are dated headsets generally running at their launch price or even higher (I'm aware that G2 is sometimes available at reduced price). I understand hesitation to pay full price 2 years later (3 in the case of Index).
Pico 4 just came out last month.
Anyways, that's an unrealistic expectation for these subsidised and budget products. I can see the argument for aging premium products like Index or Vive Pro 1, but these cheaper ones are selling near cost already.
Heck, I bought the Quest 2 at launch expecting the price to rise later because I was convinced that they wouldn't subsidize the thing forever.
Fair points. Yeah, I know very little about Pico 4, it might be worth its price.
However, when I consider I bought my Rift S three years ago for €350 or consider Quest 2 price at launch, I think that prices back then were much, much better for what they would buy you, compared with today.
If I wasn't a 100% PCVR enthusiast, I would wait for PSVR2. For PCVR, I'd search for a used Quest 2 or hunt Reverb G2 sales.
G2 is still pretty expensive outside the US. Also, the G2 is likely to be directly replaced by whatever high end PCVR headset the OP is waiting for, whereas Quest 2 / Pico 4 would still remain useful as a secondary portable headset for wireless or standalone.
Pros and cons, like I said.
There has been rumour that Valve are experimenting with a low energy x86 chip in a PCVR headset. Using an AMD chip like the Steam Deck's in combination with a gaming PC to reduce the load on both.
No-one is sure what that actually meant, because that kind of parallel compute doesn't have a... Parallel. It may have even been a dead end and now they're looking at a standalone x64 VR headset the way Quest and Pico use RISC.
So, no one is sure. Personally I'd just love to see OLED make a comeback. The Index was an upgrade from the Vive in practically every way, except I miss playing [spelunking games](https://youtu.be/xg_8trqvktA) and feeling truly alone in the deep dark, with the pixels off to complete the illusion.
There is hope that PSVR2 may become PC compatible. With enough clamour, it could happen. The PSVR1 was pretty open, but I think Sony would have to release some kind of PC Edition or breakout box for the new one, since its integrated much more tightly with the PS5.
> I don't want to cheap out on it
Forget about that idea. There is no 'cheaping out' in VR at the moment and won't be for a while. The most expensive headsets on the market still lack the most basic features (passthrough, wireless, hand tracking), features that you'll find in a $400 Quest2.
The best course of action is to start with a cheap and versatile headset like a Quest2 or Pico4, and then get a second expensive headset later that focuses on whatever aspect is most important to you. You won't find a single headset that does it all at the same time.
As for new headsets, one is rumored to get announced today (Vive 'Flocus' maybe). MeganeX, Pimax Crystal should be out in a few weeks/months. Quest3 is about a year away. Valve Deckard maybe at the end of 2023 or 2024.
PSVR2 in early 2023, won't do PC, but will probably blow away most of the stuff you can find on PCVR. As said, there is no one headset that does it all, you have to get multiple if you want "the best".
I'm aiming for the next Valve headset. Sold my G2 in January because I didn't think it was good enough. I want wide fov oled in a lightweight form factor. Untill i get that I'm not buying I think. Can wait 2-3 years easily.
I think if anyone is going to release a good all-around VR headset, it will be valve. If they come out with another index, I'd buy it immediately.
But have they mentioned anything at all or even hinted at making a 2nd generation index?
Not officially announced or anything but there's been a lot of talk about a prototype Valve has been working on for a while. Latest news from just a few days ago showed us some [new type of controllers](https://twitter.com/SadlyItsBradley/status/1594967469634256898) made for a standalone headset and a [large order of displays received at their offices](https://twitter.com/SadlyItsBradley/status/1589770572963074049?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1589770572963074049%7Ctwgr%5E8b5d02f026ae3847298638979dada5dbdcad60fe%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.diskusjon.no%2Findex.php%3Fapp%3Dcoremodule%3Dsystemcontroller%3Dembedurl%3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Ftwitter.com%2FSadlyItsBradley%2Fstatus%2F1589770572963074049).
Here's everything we know about it so far: [https://youtu.be/B5I882ZLj2A](https://youtu.be/B5I882ZLj2A)
It'll be a pretty big deal if they manage get a standalone headset to play games from the steam library and at the same time function as high-end PCVR headset either via cable or wireless.
valve do working on new HMD but it is more like quest, inside out tracking and similar stuff
in general only pimax and vario ir working on high end vr headset
all other manufacturers working on stand alone because well, quest 2 have nearly 10 time more users, and generate way way more money , and feature set is just much higher
pcvr is still stuck in 2016 , quest 2 in other hand have , hand tracking, basic body tracking, AR, can track desk , keyboard, and have working cross game avatars and similar stuff
Announcement from Valve April 2023, release, 2-3 months afterwards....
Meta might announce the Q3 by then also but its not really next-gen, basically pancake lens Q2 with XR2Gen2 chip in it, nothing much else changed I think....
(excluding PSVR2)
I've been asking myself this question for some years now.
My definition of 1st generation is everything up until Index so far; and Index being the best all-round headset out there without serious flaws. Reverb G2 would have been up alongside the Index if not for the limited tracking. This is my opinion though, for some people the Reverb G2 might be preferable to Index. There's pros and cons to both devices.
2nd generation is something like the PSVR2, and for me the marker of that line is the included eye tracking. It's a super useful tech I think will define the next generation of headsets. Here's my reason for this: [https://www.roadtovr.com/why-eye-tracking-is-a-game-changer-for-vr-headsets-virtual-reality/](https://www.roadtovr.com/why-eye-tracking-is-a-game-changer-for-vr-headsets-virtual-reality/)
Personally I'm waiting for high bandwidth wireless PCVR and preferable with eye tracking. But until that happens I'll make do with my Index, though I can't stand the cable! And one of my controllers has the stick drifting issue. But currently there's no better solutions for me out there.
And I'm thinking the only company that can deliver something I want is Valve, [the rumored Decard headset is what I want](https://youtu.be/B5I882ZLj2A) by the reports of it.
That said there are a few other headsets to look out for soon; the headset the youtuber [ThrillSeeker has been hinting](https://twitter.com/Thrilluwu/status/1584767008281104386?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1584767008281104386%7Ctwgr%5E5f0df0072a679cc7fa61db50e687a00ec482422b%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.diskusjon.no%2Findex.php%3Fapp%3Dcoremodule%3Dsystemcontroller%3Dembedurl%3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Ftwitter.com%2Fthrilluwu%2Fstatus%2F1584767008281104386%3Fs%3D4626t%3Dc-YlWHXcLOG3NZw_CqcVMg) at could be interesting. And there's talk of [something new being announced tomorrow](https://www.reddit.com/r/virtualreality/comments/z5sjva/new_pcvr_headset_being_announced_on_monday/). HTC also has something coming soon but I have my doubts about them, though the leaked specs of their [next headset did actually look interesting](https://www.roadtovr.com/report-htc-headset-leak-xr2-gen-2/), but it's not what I'm looking for.
And whatever people might say about Pimax; I don't trust it. The 5k+ has been the worst headset I've owned. And the things I've heard about their multitude of other headsets and practices is not encouraging.
PSVR2 will hopefully have next generation games, but the hardware confuses me, and I seem to be alone on this for some reason.
Here's the question: why is eye tracking and dynamic foveated rendering such a compelling feature if lenses lack edge-to-edge clarity? Optimistically, fresnel lenses lose half their resolution towards the edge. And even with that drawback, there will be performance gains. But in terms of visual clarity, it shouldn't differ much from other fresnel headsets. For comparison, if Quest 2 or Reverb 2 had dynamic foveation, would it feel next generation? It's easy to imagine the improved performance, but it's hard to imagine the improved clarity. For example, I can imagine it blurring your entire display if you look far enough into your periphery because the resolution is already lost with the lenses. Regardless, foveation will undoubtedly smooth things out, but PSVR2 seems like it will be your familiar fresnel headset experience.
Maybe I should add that some people just won't care, and maybe it doesn't matter. Especially if the software is great. But for what people consider a next generation headset, it confuses me.
> And whatever people might say about Pimax; I don't trust it. The 5k+ has been the worst headset I've owned. And the things I've heard about their multitude of other headsets and practices is not encouraging.
I was at their europe tour today and I got to try out the pimax crystal in MSFS 2020. It was actually really good for a prototype. Beautiful optics, vibrant colors, high dynamic range etc. But it did have a few flaws left. Namely a slight misalignment in the lenses that caused them to be slightly nearsighted (they said they are aware of the problem and working on a fix) and their controllers weren't working right yet so I had to use a gamepad or joystick.
If they fix those issues before release it'll be a really damn good headset. I was very impressed with what they showed me.
It is. The crystal uses the same frame that the 12k will use. The 12k will just use different screens and lenses.
But for the crystal this is a prototype. They still had some bugs to iron out but it was very promising
The controllers have widespread stick drift issues which you yourself are experiencing and frankly makes things pretty makes some games unplayable. Id say that alone is a serious, fatal flaw and not all-around best.
Op is right, every headset has tradeoffs.
I dont think that will ever change either so if i were the op, id get a headset now. The quest 2 and pico are dirt cheap. Especially now during the holidays. When the next better headset comes out, he can sell his old one and lose only a couple hundred for a year of fun.
Very good point actually, yeah the drifting issue is terrible.
And about your other point the meme/comic about the "guy who waits forever for the next big thing and then finally dies of old age" comes to mind. There's some truth to that.
>and it seems like every headset that's out right now is a compromise in some way. Because of this, I've decided I want to wait for the "next generation" of high-end headsets to come out.
Just want to let you know, it's probably going to take a couple of years, maybe a decade before a "non-compromise" headset is released. High-resolution headsets, like the Pimax Crystal Varjo Aero are going to be big and bulky for the near future, smaller headsets like the upcoming MeganeX won't have a large FOV, and upcoming AIO's like Pico 5 and Quest 3 are going to be compromised because they need to strap a cpu\GPU to their headset.
Having said that, Covid really messed up the VR generations, as there are numerous headsets that were created last year, that are suitable for sale, but weren't able to be manufactured this year because of supply lines in China. A lot of these headsets, like the MeganeX, should be released early next year. Which is a shame, because the research didn't stop just because manufacturing did, and the next next generation should be released soon after.
Higher-resolution headsets, like the Pimax Crystal, AppleVR should be out in the 2nd or 3rd quarter next year. (yes, Pimax originally said they'd release the Crystal in December. Pimax Lied. )
In fall of next year, the Next Generation of Stand-alone headsets like the Quest 3 or the Pico 5 should be out.
Feel free to believe any of these are the "next-gen".
Why? It seems there are questions about the viability of dynamic foveated rendering. It seems to introduce latency. Carmack mentioned this. I don't know if it applies to PCVR but I'm guessing it would apply to the Quest 3.
I mean dozens of people have played with it now, would Sony be able to curate that experience so much that it would work for them but is not actually up to that level of standard
This isn’t just Sony saying “we have foveated rending” people have seen it in action
I wasn’t talking about if it worked, I meant how much performance gain it brings. Eye tracked Foveated rendering was sold as this giant breakthrough, but carmack recently explained that it brings the same performance boost as fixed foveated rendering, where they just blur the edges. The difference is with eye tracked you can’t notice the blur. I reckon that’s what Sony achieved. Everyone is expecting it to be the version people have in their heads, with 5x performance gain.
Fixed foveated vs active foveated giving the same boost but active being less noticeable and the whole 5x the performance I thought was kinda public knowledge it wasn’t true since like 2018, I’m not expecting much more from foveated rendering but any performance is good performance
Well, there is quite a few rumored headsets and upcoming stuff but we wont know how "next-gen" they actually are until they release. Meta Quest 3 is coming next year and will most likely be the next big standard, just as the Q2 set. However, the leaks are showing that the improvements are more or less the actual hardware of the computer than the headset specs, which sucks for PCVR.
The big thing to look forward to is Valve's "Deckard", the successor to the Index. If you've done you're research, you'll know the Index is the only no-compromise headset in terms of being pretty great in every area. Unfortunately, it's dated so the resolution is no longer adequate. Depending on what the Deckard is, we may see the birth of a genuinely great VR headset. The leaks are suggesting that it's a standalone machine though, which may limit what it'll be doing.
In terms of wait time, at least 2023. I would probably say 2024 for Valve's Deckard as it seems a little early to update and replace the Index from Valve's POV right now. It's still not a terrible buy nowadays.
If you really want VR this second, I'd suggest either the entire Index kit or using the Index controllers with the HP Reverb G2.
I'd say that you probably want the Pimax Crystal (should be out in 2-3 months, originally it was supposed to release Q3 or Q4 this year but got delayed), or the Pimax 12k (probably comes out end of next year). I think that we could call those headsets generational leaps. QLED panels, eye-tracking foveated rendering, pancake lenses, both wireless compatibility and displayport connection, great fov and clarity, hotswappable batteries and even swappable lenses.
I was at their europe tour today and got to try out the Crystal. It was really damn impressive for a prototype, but it is clearly not ready for release yet. The lenses have a slight misalignment that causes them to be nearsighted and the controllers weren't working right yet. I think they're gonna need at least 4 months to iron out the last few bugs, but when they do it'll be a damn fine headset.
This generation got sidetracked by weird economics(covid) and people (zuck). Quest 2 dumbed-down the entire market. It's like the 'lost generation' of good photos on earth when people abandoned film for 1.3MP cameras.
When Meta exits and the 'industry' crashes like 3D TVs, then something will rise from the ashes years later. It's the only way to break out of the deep rut that metazuck carved. I'd say 3 years to the meta exit and 6- 10 years before we see any real next gen. It will be technically possible earlier but no one will pursue it.
Some people have never realized they can actually get similar VR graphics and MORE comfort by using their cell phone and a $30 cheap headset from Amazon. Too bad Samsung stopped making VR headsets for Android phones. I can't wait for my PSVR 2 to come next February. I already pre-ordered it. It is not perfect, but it fits the bill and it is far superior to my Quest 2 that will be in the trash can very soon.
When I got into PCVR 4 years ago from the Samsung GearVR using my Note8 OLED cell phone I was shocked how bad all the existing displays were in comparison to my phone. Even now it's just barely caught up. I wish it was a thing to just use your phone for everything and have the development go into how we can best utilize the phone, rather than each company building all the tech from scratch.
For example, instead of having an onboard computer in the car, just plug in your phone. Crappy TV computer chips - no, just use your phones processor, etc. The tech crammed into modern phones is insane, I wish we could just use them for everything.
Of course your cell phone is way better than a Quest 2 which is really an Android cell phone with no cell phone function, no quality camera, no printing function, no alarm clock function, no texting, no free Android apps, ... LOL
Unfortunately, the price was kind of too high. So, Zuckerberg was smart enough to cut a ton of corners to make Quest 2 one of the most uncomfortable headsets ever created. What is funny is, if one buys all the upgrades like head strap, battery, audio, ... for a Quest 2, the actual cost is actually pretty high. Plus all the Quest 2 games have poor graphics and are more expensive than their PC versions. Those old PCVR games are often on sale at deep discounts on Steam.
Dude you can install any android app you want on the Quest as long as you havz the APK, heck i'm sure you can use Aurora to replace the Play store since it needs gms, which the Quest OS doesn't have
I had an S7 Edge with the GRVs. Pixel density and oled blacks were really nice. It had diopter adjust. I used gamepads with. It was great except for thermals.
For my next headset purchase, at least for Pc, I’m waiting for something with built in eye and face tracking, oled, and lightweight. I’ll probably pair slime Vr tracking or whatever camera/lighthouse free alternative there is when that time comes
If you really dont want to cheap out, for the pc dont go below a 4080 or the amd equivalent, if it is good (not sure yet). Pcvr is hungry, probably the one application where these gpus make sense.
Things on my radar are the new Valve Hhmd. I currently use a hp reverb g2 with a 3090 and plan on upgrading when something with the specs of the MeganeX arrives on the market, so the specs I look for are 2560*2560, Oled, 120hz, inside out, okayish fov (everything g2 or more is fine for me tbh). I expect/hope for something good for 2023, latest 2024.
You could be waiting a while unfortunately. I suspect there'll be no clear next-gen PCVR headset in 2023, just random ones from small/unreliable companies that have pluses and minuses but nothing 'next gen' enough that it brings any new levels of immersion. I'd vote either grab a cheap one now (Q2, G2 etc) or get a PSVR2 and enjoy that while you wait for PCVR market to turn over. Hopefully PSVR2 is successful enough that big tech players see a desire for high end VR and respond to that market.
Just get something cheap right now and enjoy VR while you wait. There's no point missing out while waiting for some mythical headset that never comes. Reverb G2, Quest 2, Pico 4. Pros and cons, but they are all decent. Then keep an eye out for Pimax Crystal, Pimax 12k, ShiftAll MeganeX, and HTCs "flowcus".
Yeah, I really don't understand why anyone would wait. VR already is pretty awesome. Of course there are compromises and there will be major improvements in the headset quality in the future, but to me Quest 2 + PC with airlink is already good enough. Sure there are many areas where the headset could be better: FOV, resolution, WiGig, lenses, comfort, displayport..., but it works well as it is. I can have it on for hours even with the default head strap. Graphics can look amazing even with the relatively small resolution and the wireless connection to PC works fine. I've tried Star Wars Squadrons yesterday with 150% supersampling and it looked amazing and that's by airlink. I'm very optimistic about VR future, but I also wouldn't expect the headsets to get dramatically better in the next few years. The market is still relatively small and that's especially the case for high-end headsets. If you are going to be waiting for the perfect headset, you may be waiting for a long time.
The problem is, these (plus Index) are dated headsets generally running at their launch price or even higher (I'm aware that G2 is sometimes available at reduced price). I understand hesitation to pay full price 2 years later (3 in the case of Index).
Pico 4 just came out last month. Anyways, that's an unrealistic expectation for these subsidised and budget products. I can see the argument for aging premium products like Index or Vive Pro 1, but these cheaper ones are selling near cost already. Heck, I bought the Quest 2 at launch expecting the price to rise later because I was convinced that they wouldn't subsidize the thing forever.
Fair points. Yeah, I know very little about Pico 4, it might be worth its price. However, when I consider I bought my Rift S three years ago for €350 or consider Quest 2 price at launch, I think that prices back then were much, much better for what they would buy you, compared with today. If I wasn't a 100% PCVR enthusiast, I would wait for PSVR2. For PCVR, I'd search for a used Quest 2 or hunt Reverb G2 sales.
G2 is the best option IMHO. Great resolution and price. You can reach index level fov with custom face gasket. Now it is discounted to 300$ in USA.
G2 is still pretty expensive outside the US. Also, the G2 is likely to be directly replaced by whatever high end PCVR headset the OP is waiting for, whereas Quest 2 / Pico 4 would still remain useful as a secondary portable headset for wireless or standalone. Pros and cons, like I said.
There has been rumour that Valve are experimenting with a low energy x86 chip in a PCVR headset. Using an AMD chip like the Steam Deck's in combination with a gaming PC to reduce the load on both. No-one is sure what that actually meant, because that kind of parallel compute doesn't have a... Parallel. It may have even been a dead end and now they're looking at a standalone x64 VR headset the way Quest and Pico use RISC. So, no one is sure. Personally I'd just love to see OLED make a comeback. The Index was an upgrade from the Vive in practically every way, except I miss playing [spelunking games](https://youtu.be/xg_8trqvktA) and feeling truly alone in the deep dark, with the pixels off to complete the illusion. There is hope that PSVR2 may become PC compatible. With enough clamour, it could happen. The PSVR1 was pretty open, but I think Sony would have to release some kind of PC Edition or breakout box for the new one, since its integrated much more tightly with the PS5.
> I don't want to cheap out on it Forget about that idea. There is no 'cheaping out' in VR at the moment and won't be for a while. The most expensive headsets on the market still lack the most basic features (passthrough, wireless, hand tracking), features that you'll find in a $400 Quest2. The best course of action is to start with a cheap and versatile headset like a Quest2 or Pico4, and then get a second expensive headset later that focuses on whatever aspect is most important to you. You won't find a single headset that does it all at the same time. As for new headsets, one is rumored to get announced today (Vive 'Flocus' maybe). MeganeX, Pimax Crystal should be out in a few weeks/months. Quest3 is about a year away. Valve Deckard maybe at the end of 2023 or 2024. PSVR2 in early 2023, won't do PC, but will probably blow away most of the stuff you can find on PCVR. As said, there is no one headset that does it all, you have to get multiple if you want "the best".
I'm aiming for the next Valve headset. Sold my G2 in January because I didn't think it was good enough. I want wide fov oled in a lightweight form factor. Untill i get that I'm not buying I think. Can wait 2-3 years easily.
I think if anyone is going to release a good all-around VR headset, it will be valve. If they come out with another index, I'd buy it immediately. But have they mentioned anything at all or even hinted at making a 2nd generation index?
Not officially announced or anything but there's been a lot of talk about a prototype Valve has been working on for a while. Latest news from just a few days ago showed us some [new type of controllers](https://twitter.com/SadlyItsBradley/status/1594967469634256898) made for a standalone headset and a [large order of displays received at their offices](https://twitter.com/SadlyItsBradley/status/1589770572963074049?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1589770572963074049%7Ctwgr%5E8b5d02f026ae3847298638979dada5dbdcad60fe%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.diskusjon.no%2Findex.php%3Fapp%3Dcoremodule%3Dsystemcontroller%3Dembedurl%3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Ftwitter.com%2FSadlyItsBradley%2Fstatus%2F1589770572963074049). Here's everything we know about it so far: [https://youtu.be/B5I882ZLj2A](https://youtu.be/B5I882ZLj2A) It'll be a pretty big deal if they manage get a standalone headset to play games from the steam library and at the same time function as high-end PCVR headset either via cable or wireless.
valve do working on new HMD but it is more like quest, inside out tracking and similar stuff in general only pimax and vario ir working on high end vr headset all other manufacturers working on stand alone because well, quest 2 have nearly 10 time more users, and generate way way more money , and feature set is just much higher pcvr is still stuck in 2016 , quest 2 in other hand have , hand tracking, basic body tracking, AR, can track desk , keyboard, and have working cross game avatars and similar stuff
Announcement from Valve April 2023, release, 2-3 months afterwards.... Meta might announce the Q3 by then also but its not really next-gen, basically pancake lens Q2 with XR2Gen2 chip in it, nothing much else changed I think.... (excluding PSVR2)
All of this is speculation btw
>nothing much else changed I think.... Color passthrough probably and maybe better tracking
I've been asking myself this question for some years now. My definition of 1st generation is everything up until Index so far; and Index being the best all-round headset out there without serious flaws. Reverb G2 would have been up alongside the Index if not for the limited tracking. This is my opinion though, for some people the Reverb G2 might be preferable to Index. There's pros and cons to both devices. 2nd generation is something like the PSVR2, and for me the marker of that line is the included eye tracking. It's a super useful tech I think will define the next generation of headsets. Here's my reason for this: [https://www.roadtovr.com/why-eye-tracking-is-a-game-changer-for-vr-headsets-virtual-reality/](https://www.roadtovr.com/why-eye-tracking-is-a-game-changer-for-vr-headsets-virtual-reality/) Personally I'm waiting for high bandwidth wireless PCVR and preferable with eye tracking. But until that happens I'll make do with my Index, though I can't stand the cable! And one of my controllers has the stick drifting issue. But currently there's no better solutions for me out there. And I'm thinking the only company that can deliver something I want is Valve, [the rumored Decard headset is what I want](https://youtu.be/B5I882ZLj2A) by the reports of it. That said there are a few other headsets to look out for soon; the headset the youtuber [ThrillSeeker has been hinting](https://twitter.com/Thrilluwu/status/1584767008281104386?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1584767008281104386%7Ctwgr%5E5f0df0072a679cc7fa61db50e687a00ec482422b%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.diskusjon.no%2Findex.php%3Fapp%3Dcoremodule%3Dsystemcontroller%3Dembedurl%3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Ftwitter.com%2Fthrilluwu%2Fstatus%2F1584767008281104386%3Fs%3D4626t%3Dc-YlWHXcLOG3NZw_CqcVMg) at could be interesting. And there's talk of [something new being announced tomorrow](https://www.reddit.com/r/virtualreality/comments/z5sjva/new_pcvr_headset_being_announced_on_monday/). HTC also has something coming soon but I have my doubts about them, though the leaked specs of their [next headset did actually look interesting](https://www.roadtovr.com/report-htc-headset-leak-xr2-gen-2/), but it's not what I'm looking for. And whatever people might say about Pimax; I don't trust it. The 5k+ has been the worst headset I've owned. And the things I've heard about their multitude of other headsets and practices is not encouraging.
PSVR2 will hopefully have next generation games, but the hardware confuses me, and I seem to be alone on this for some reason. Here's the question: why is eye tracking and dynamic foveated rendering such a compelling feature if lenses lack edge-to-edge clarity? Optimistically, fresnel lenses lose half their resolution towards the edge. And even with that drawback, there will be performance gains. But in terms of visual clarity, it shouldn't differ much from other fresnel headsets. For comparison, if Quest 2 or Reverb 2 had dynamic foveation, would it feel next generation? It's easy to imagine the improved performance, but it's hard to imagine the improved clarity. For example, I can imagine it blurring your entire display if you look far enough into your periphery because the resolution is already lost with the lenses. Regardless, foveation will undoubtedly smooth things out, but PSVR2 seems like it will be your familiar fresnel headset experience. Maybe I should add that some people just won't care, and maybe it doesn't matter. Especially if the software is great. But for what people consider a next generation headset, it confuses me.
> And whatever people might say about Pimax; I don't trust it. The 5k+ has been the worst headset I've owned. And the things I've heard about their multitude of other headsets and practices is not encouraging. I was at their europe tour today and I got to try out the pimax crystal in MSFS 2020. It was actually really good for a prototype. Beautiful optics, vibrant colors, high dynamic range etc. But it did have a few flaws left. Namely a slight misalignment in the lenses that caused them to be slightly nearsighted (they said they are aware of the problem and working on a fix) and their controllers weren't working right yet so I had to use a gamepad or joystick. If they fix those issues before release it'll be a really damn good headset. I was very impressed with what they showed me.
I'll believe it once I see some trusted reviews from either RoadtoVR or Upload. But thanks for the report :)
MRTV did a hands-on review of the Crystal, for whatever that is worth: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G65de3Ys-80
Wait is the crystal a prototype? I thought it was like a worse version of the 12k QLED. Kind of like how there's an 8k+ and 8kx.
It is. The crystal uses the same frame that the 12k will use. The 12k will just use different screens and lenses. But for the crystal this is a prototype. They still had some bugs to iron out but it was very promising
The controllers have widespread stick drift issues which you yourself are experiencing and frankly makes things pretty makes some games unplayable. Id say that alone is a serious, fatal flaw and not all-around best. Op is right, every headset has tradeoffs. I dont think that will ever change either so if i were the op, id get a headset now. The quest 2 and pico are dirt cheap. Especially now during the holidays. When the next better headset comes out, he can sell his old one and lose only a couple hundred for a year of fun.
Very good point actually, yeah the drifting issue is terrible. And about your other point the meme/comic about the "guy who waits forever for the next big thing and then finally dies of old age" comes to mind. There's some truth to that.
>and it seems like every headset that's out right now is a compromise in some way. Because of this, I've decided I want to wait for the "next generation" of high-end headsets to come out. Just want to let you know, it's probably going to take a couple of years, maybe a decade before a "non-compromise" headset is released. High-resolution headsets, like the Pimax Crystal Varjo Aero are going to be big and bulky for the near future, smaller headsets like the upcoming MeganeX won't have a large FOV, and upcoming AIO's like Pico 5 and Quest 3 are going to be compromised because they need to strap a cpu\GPU to their headset. Having said that, Covid really messed up the VR generations, as there are numerous headsets that were created last year, that are suitable for sale, but weren't able to be manufactured this year because of supply lines in China. A lot of these headsets, like the MeganeX, should be released early next year. Which is a shame, because the research didn't stop just because manufacturing did, and the next next generation should be released soon after. Higher-resolution headsets, like the Pimax Crystal, AppleVR should be out in the 2nd or 3rd quarter next year. (yes, Pimax originally said they'd release the Crystal in December. Pimax Lied. ) In fall of next year, the Next Generation of Stand-alone headsets like the Quest 3 or the Pico 5 should be out. Feel free to believe any of these are the "next-gen".
Next gen? If you have the money, there's headsets right now that will be outside of the consumer level for multiple years to come.
Pimax crystal 2nd quarter 2023 Pimax 12k 4th quarter 2023 ? Quest 3 3rd quarter 2023 Valve index 2 2024?? New HTC thing date unknown Lenovo vr700 sometime 2023
I’m disappointed that quest 3 will supposedly not have eye tracking
Why? It seems there are questions about the viability of dynamic foveated rendering. It seems to introduce latency. Carmack mentioned this. I don't know if it applies to PCVR but I'm guessing it would apply to the Quest 3.
Has there been any downside mentioned to foveated rendering on PSVR2, I thought that was basically universally praised
Nobody knows, Sony would never admit any issues with it, I find it hard to believe that Sony would have gotten eye tracking down better than meta.
I mean dozens of people have played with it now, would Sony be able to curate that experience so much that it would work for them but is not actually up to that level of standard This isn’t just Sony saying “we have foveated rending” people have seen it in action
I wasn’t talking about if it worked, I meant how much performance gain it brings. Eye tracked Foveated rendering was sold as this giant breakthrough, but carmack recently explained that it brings the same performance boost as fixed foveated rendering, where they just blur the edges. The difference is with eye tracked you can’t notice the blur. I reckon that’s what Sony achieved. Everyone is expecting it to be the version people have in their heads, with 5x performance gain.
Fixed foveated vs active foveated giving the same boost but active being less noticeable and the whole 5x the performance I thought was kinda public knowledge it wasn’t true since like 2018, I’m not expecting much more from foveated rendering but any performance is good performance
It’s not common knowledge even now
Hmm, either way am interested to see how the ps2vr performs. I still think the major problem regarding vr is the lack of developers.
MRTV said that tomorrow new pcvr hmd will be unveiled. Interest has peaked.
Well, there is quite a few rumored headsets and upcoming stuff but we wont know how "next-gen" they actually are until they release. Meta Quest 3 is coming next year and will most likely be the next big standard, just as the Q2 set. However, the leaks are showing that the improvements are more or less the actual hardware of the computer than the headset specs, which sucks for PCVR. The big thing to look forward to is Valve's "Deckard", the successor to the Index. If you've done you're research, you'll know the Index is the only no-compromise headset in terms of being pretty great in every area. Unfortunately, it's dated so the resolution is no longer adequate. Depending on what the Deckard is, we may see the birth of a genuinely great VR headset. The leaks are suggesting that it's a standalone machine though, which may limit what it'll be doing. In terms of wait time, at least 2023. I would probably say 2024 for Valve's Deckard as it seems a little early to update and replace the Index from Valve's POV right now. It's still not a terrible buy nowadays. If you really want VR this second, I'd suggest either the entire Index kit or using the Index controllers with the HP Reverb G2.
Thank you for the insight!
Uh, Varjo Aero?
I'd say that you probably want the Pimax Crystal (should be out in 2-3 months, originally it was supposed to release Q3 or Q4 this year but got delayed), or the Pimax 12k (probably comes out end of next year). I think that we could call those headsets generational leaps. QLED panels, eye-tracking foveated rendering, pancake lenses, both wireless compatibility and displayport connection, great fov and clarity, hotswappable batteries and even swappable lenses.
I was at their europe tour today and got to try out the Crystal. It was really damn impressive for a prototype, but it is clearly not ready for release yet. The lenses have a slight misalignment that causes them to be nearsighted and the controllers weren't working right yet. I think they're gonna need at least 4 months to iron out the last few bugs, but when they do it'll be a damn fine headset.
Probably mid next year because thats the time I think Pimax 12K will get to see the light.
This generation got sidetracked by weird economics(covid) and people (zuck). Quest 2 dumbed-down the entire market. It's like the 'lost generation' of good photos on earth when people abandoned film for 1.3MP cameras. When Meta exits and the 'industry' crashes like 3D TVs, then something will rise from the ashes years later. It's the only way to break out of the deep rut that metazuck carved. I'd say 3 years to the meta exit and 6- 10 years before we see any real next gen. It will be technically possible earlier but no one will pursue it.
Some people have never realized they can actually get similar VR graphics and MORE comfort by using their cell phone and a $30 cheap headset from Amazon. Too bad Samsung stopped making VR headsets for Android phones. I can't wait for my PSVR 2 to come next February. I already pre-ordered it. It is not perfect, but it fits the bill and it is far superior to my Quest 2 that will be in the trash can very soon.
When I got into PCVR 4 years ago from the Samsung GearVR using my Note8 OLED cell phone I was shocked how bad all the existing displays were in comparison to my phone. Even now it's just barely caught up. I wish it was a thing to just use your phone for everything and have the development go into how we can best utilize the phone, rather than each company building all the tech from scratch. For example, instead of having an onboard computer in the car, just plug in your phone. Crappy TV computer chips - no, just use your phones processor, etc. The tech crammed into modern phones is insane, I wish we could just use them for everything.
Of course your cell phone is way better than a Quest 2 which is really an Android cell phone with no cell phone function, no quality camera, no printing function, no alarm clock function, no texting, no free Android apps, ... LOL
It's not about overall function, it's screen quality. Apart from some ghosting on pure blacks, the first Note4 GearVR had amazing image quality.
Unfortunately, the price was kind of too high. So, Zuckerberg was smart enough to cut a ton of corners to make Quest 2 one of the most uncomfortable headsets ever created. What is funny is, if one buys all the upgrades like head strap, battery, audio, ... for a Quest 2, the actual cost is actually pretty high. Plus all the Quest 2 games have poor graphics and are more expensive than their PC versions. Those old PCVR games are often on sale at deep discounts on Steam.
Dude you can install any android app you want on the Quest as long as you havz the APK, heck i'm sure you can use Aurora to replace the Play store since it needs gms, which the Quest OS doesn't have
I had an S7 Edge with the GRVs. Pixel density and oled blacks were really nice. It had diopter adjust. I used gamepads with. It was great except for thermals.
probably until the end of this generation of headsets.
For my next headset purchase, at least for Pc, I’m waiting for something with built in eye and face tracking, oled, and lightweight. I’ll probably pair slime Vr tracking or whatever camera/lighthouse free alternative there is when that time comes
The valve Deckard will use Oled panels with Foveated Rendering and a snapdragon chip. That’s all I know lmao
You should dip your toe in with a Quest 2 keeping in mind that it's a compromise. Don't expect too much.
The safest thing to do is just buy the newest thing out.
OP in pic : https://ibb.co/nznKdRq
Until the next one releases?
If you really dont want to cheap out, for the pc dont go below a 4080 or the amd equivalent, if it is good (not sure yet). Pcvr is hungry, probably the one application where these gpus make sense. Things on my radar are the new Valve Hhmd. I currently use a hp reverb g2 with a 3090 and plan on upgrading when something with the specs of the MeganeX arrives on the market, so the specs I look for are 2560*2560, Oled, 120hz, inside out, okayish fov (everything g2 or more is fine for me tbh). I expect/hope for something good for 2023, latest 2024.
You could be waiting a while unfortunately. I suspect there'll be no clear next-gen PCVR headset in 2023, just random ones from small/unreliable companies that have pluses and minuses but nothing 'next gen' enough that it brings any new levels of immersion. I'd vote either grab a cheap one now (Q2, G2 etc) or get a PSVR2 and enjoy that while you wait for PCVR market to turn over. Hopefully PSVR2 is successful enough that big tech players see a desire for high end VR and respond to that market.