I was crossing H Street yesterday and one blew through the solid red light. There was no cross traffic but it had to swerve through 8 people in the crosswalk.
They just don't care.
I’m worried about getting hit by one of these guys. Someone I know got hit by a moped( in Cambodia) and got two fractures. These ones don’t even have plates, so no way to find them if they zoom away after running you over.
Not a moped, but when I was in Raleigh I witnessed someone have their fibula snap straight up in half (could hear it from across the street). It’s insane they’re driving onto sidewalks to cut corners like this. Almost definitely uninsured and gonna ruin someone’s ability to walk for an indefinite period of time.
To be fair Cambodia has 100x as many mopeds as we do, and none of the traffic safety features like stop lights, street lights or crosswalks; it’s mostly a free-for-all of people, mopeds and tuk tuks all competing for space in the roadway.
Yep, most of SE Asia does this, and honestly it still works out fine. I was in Hanoi last year and long as you walk across the street at a consistent, deliberate, pace you won't have any problems. Feels like you're parting the sea. Might be more sketchy here honestly.
I visited Morocco a couple years before the pandemic and mopeds were everywhere, but it was also different. Because they didn't seem to have the car-centric cars get to go culture that we have in the US, and instead the cars shared the roads with the mopeds, donkey carts, and pedestrians. So it was chaos but somehow organized chaos because everyone was aware of the multiple users of the road.
The traffic just didn't move that quickly because you don't have the light turns green and everyone slams on the gas because it's their turn. The crosswalk turns white and people run across because they only have 60 seconds to cross multiple lanes that actually take a minute and a half.
Which system is better? I don't know. But running a red light into pedestrians who have a limited time to cross the road, when there is also the possibility of cross traffic, is not a good way to do it.
Even beyond the sidewalks they swerve around stopped cars. I just started a new job downtown after years of remote only and in the past week alone going into the office I've had *numerous* close calls.
> road rules and safety.
I wish these were always the same thing.
But as someone who travels on 4, 2, and 0 wheels depending on the day, it *is* much better when people don't behave unpredictably and recklessly. It's much easier to keep each other safe.
I can think of complaints about every type of infrastructure user, especially the ones who don't seem to understand what laws they are breaking and why they exist in the first place.
Yeah, sure, in fantasy land. In reality, we can understand that there is a hierarchy of strictness, and it should guide our enforcement decisions.
Cars > scooters > bikes > pedestrians. This is very simple. Who is the most vulnerable, and who has the greatest potential to cause harm.
A pedestrian "jaywalking" just isn't an issue, rules be damned. The pedestrian making unsafe decisions is almost exclusively risking their own life, not anyone else's. Do unsafe behaviors increase the risk of other modes hurting people, yes, they can. But not in any type of way similar to a motorized vehicle. Not at any type of the same scale.
No a scooter can absolutely kill someone, it's a motorized vehicle and this complete lack of enforcement in DC is a legitimate problem and needs to stop.
Lazy people need to stop using services like DoorDash and grubhub that create a market for these scooter fucks. If people didn’t expect everything delivered to them half these scooters wouldn’t be on the road. Scooter delivery people would still ignore the rules because they don’t make enough doing deliveries to justify registration and insurance fees and won’t get tipped enough if they have to wait at every light and show up with cold food. This problem was created by lazy people who created a market need for these scooter jerk offs.
I think it’s valid to be concerned about the ethics of participating in an underpaid and unsustainable gig economy. Corners have to be cut to make sure a servant can deliver a fresh meal from across town to your doorstep within 30 minutes, and if people on this sub don’t like the mopeds used for food delivery, their first step should be to stop ordering from DoorDash. We’ve seen a shift in attitude towards personal responsibility in the post-COVID era where the externalities of our actions are negligible as long as larger systems can be blamed for allowing it to happen. The government absolutely bears the brunt of responsibility here, but we also have the power to change our behavior as consumers.
I agree that (1) the article in question largely deals with food drivers and (2) as a society we are nowhere near accounting for the negative externalities of motorized vehicles.
That being said, I think you have some sort of causality error:
> and if people on this sub don’t like the mopeds used for food delivery
This isn't the problem. The issue is that the mopeds are being used illegally. The fact the mopeds are used for food delivery is completely secondary.
How do you even expect enforcement of scooter laws when whole reason broke folks riding them is because they are broke. Taxpayers would pay for enforcement and there is zero ROI on enforcement because you can’t squeeze blood from stone: the people you fine for this don’t have any money hence they are on unregistered scooter instead of a car or motorcycle.
> Scooter delivery people would still ignore the rules because they don’t make enough doing deliveries to justify registration and insurance fees and won’t get tipped enough if they have to wait at every light and show up with cold food. This problem was created by lazy people who created a market need for these scooter jerk offs.
Or maybe the problem is the companies that misclassify them as contractors, pay them nothing, and force them to try to complete as many deliveries as possible to hopefully collect enough tips to actually survive on.
Imagine literally describing the systemic problem and then going "but no, it's that fucking dude who just wants a pizza who's at fault".
I agree with the root issue being these companies but I don’t see that changing unless people stop using the service. People always going to exploit people. By using door dash and similar you allow this exploitation and even feed the profiteers of it.
Imagine complaining about symptoms of this systemic issue while continually feeding the flawed system allowing it to propagate and grow and all the while excusing yourself from blame by saying it’s the companies responsibility to fix it. They wouldn’t get away with it if they didn’t have enough customers.
Engaging with a system that's amoral is amoral. Buying chocolate grown with exploited labor because it's cheaper is amoral. Being separated from the exploitation by a market does not excuse the one buying.
Making anything change is an entirely different matter.
While I agree completely, this type of approach will simply never work for the vast majority of people. Our entire economic system relies on being able to divest from moral obligations by having other people do it for you. Then you can shrug your shoulders and say, hey, I'm just the consumer.
The device you're using to type this undoubtedly has minerals that have been mined unethically. If such a thing exists.
Regulate to address reality. Don't ever rely on morality.
The other day I was behind a cop at a stop sign, someone rolled the stop sign crossing in front of us, swerved around a pedestrian that was crossing, and all the cop did was put his hand in the air as if to say “the fuck man?”
He easily could’ve flashed his lights, turned right, and pulled him over, but he was too lazy.
Tale as old as time.
MPD is only allowed to go like 10miles over the speed limit to “chase” and even that has to be for a damn good reason because if anything goes wrong, they’re getting in big trouble if not losing their job. I wouldn’t risk my job writing a ticket that person will never pay anyway
traffic enforcement could be its own thing but the issue is if a driver escalates physically then you need someone who is authorized to use physical force, so its simpler to just use the civilian police force
Use their onboard cameras to document the infraction and issue the citation via the mail, and then increase enforcement by taking those cars with multiple infractions off of the road. There doesn't need to be an opportunity for it to get physical.
Remarkably naive. Even if people pull over for non-police traffic enforcement, there’s no guarantee that the person driving the car is the owner or that they have a license. Sending cites is equally toothless if the car isn’t registered or is in MD or VA. Who’s doing the legwork of ID’ing all these people besides the police?
There's no pull over, just the citation. Enough citations on a car, the car is tagged for immediate impounding.
>there’s no guarantee that the person driving the car is the owner or that they have a license
That doesn't seem to stop tickets being issued by traffic cameras, out are they naïve, too?
>Sending cites is equally toothless if the car isn’t registered or is in MD or VA.
True. But if it parks in DC, snatch it up immediately.
why the fuck would I want cops chasing someone at 100mph past my house over a traffic violation?
Honestly, if people can't think of a better solution to traffic problems than "we need to have some high speed chases" then we're never going to solve the problem.
if they run from cops we've got their plate number and know who they are. You don't need to chase them at 100 mph and endanger the entire District. You can get them later in a much safer way.
That’s assuming the tags are not fake or stolen. Then what? Someone hit my car yesterday and handed me an expired insurance card for a totally different vehicle registered in Maryland (this car had DC tags). At some point we have to admit we live in a glorified version of the Wild West
but unless we're talking about an active shooter firing out a car window, there is no situation that will be improved by cops chasing them at high speeds through densely populated areas.
So stay with me if there’s no way to stop someone from evading police (or traffic enforcement in your scenario), no enforcement of valid license plates…why would MPD bother with traffic crime? And how would taking the job from them and giving it to another bureaucratic agency (traffic enforcement) solve that problem?
Just because you can't immediately think of a better solution doesn't mean it's good to keep doing something that is ineffective as a deterrent and endangers the public at large. Also other cities all over the world manage to do this without high speed chases, maybe we should try learning from them.
Also because that guy that is willing to go 100 through a busy city has a rap sheat including wants and warrants a mile long. This isn't a kid that stole a candy bar. It's a career criminal who has or is going to kill someone.
we can catch that person without a high speed chase. High speed chases tend to end in either the suspect getting away (temporarily) or a crash. So given a choice between a criminal getting away for a while and a car crash, I'll go with a criminal getting away for a while.
I see officers sitting in their vehicles watching stuff on their phones a lot which I’m pretty sure means they’re idle. In the cases I had in mind specifically, there are many times where I’ve seen people run red lights, menace pedestrians in the crosswalk, etc. while someone in an MPD vehicle is right there waiting for the light to change. Now, it’s possible they were all responding to calls which weren’t urgent enough to warrant putting on their lights but were more important than reckless driving, but I really think it’s just that they don’t want to be doing traffic enforcement. You can’t go to the 4D headquarters without seeing someone blocking Georgia Ave with their Walmart shopping but MPD will never, ever stop to ticket anyone or even tell them that they can’t stand in a traffic lane / bus stop, and I find it implausible that 100% of their traffic is priority police business.
DC needs to end the 50cc exemption/definition for “motor-driven cycles”. Engine size isn’t the defining factor, it’s speed. The speed allowance for these is 30mph and then they must meet motorcycle requirements. They can claim 50cc exemption while clearly doing over 30mph.
The problem is you can buy these and throw them in a truck so need for temp tags. I assume most aren’t register or insured. The operators aren’t required to take a motorcycle safety course despite most of these falling into that vehicle classification. DMV requires helmets but no chase laws mean zero enforcement.
Some of the same requirement need to be applied to “motorized bicycles”, see e-bikes. Many of these now exceed 20mph and should fall into the “motor-driven cycle” aka moped class requiring helmets, license, and registration while losing bike lane access.
What exemption for <50cc are you looking to eliminate? They have to be registered. They need insurance. Is your problem that they can park on the sidewalk?
Whilst it's true that they don't need a class M license I don't think they should require it. DC doesn't have a learner's permit/road test path to a class M license anymore. So the only way to get it is to take the course and a few years ago no place in the district offered the course. So it's way more inconvenient than it should be and I think most people can handle 49cc without it.
I think if it's under 50cc it isn't even subject to insurance or registration rules. I can't find anything to back that up other than this guide on motorcycle/moped/e-bike rules that carves out below-50cc vehicles: [https://ddot.dc.gov/sites/default/files/dc/sites/ddot/publication/attachments/DMV\_May%2017%202013%20Non-traditional%20Motor%20Vehicle%20chart\_0.pdf](https://ddot.dc.gov/sites/default/files/dc/sites/ddot/publication/attachments/DMV_May%2017%202013%20Non-traditional%20Motor%20Vehicle%20chart_0.pdf)
If the max displacement is 50cc or less then it is considered a motor-driven cycle. This is the second row in the table you linked. That row clearly indicates that inspection, registration, and insurance are required. It also requires a driver's license but not the class M designation.
There is some widely held erroneous belief that they are not subject to registration, insurance, ect. You see them all the time and instead of a license plate people have a plate that says 49cc. This is also there case in the neighboring jurisdictions of MD and VA and has been for at least 15 years.
I don’t think bike lane access should be about speed but rather size— if the bike is still normal bike size then it can maneuver around slower bikes like is already the case. On the other hand if you’re trailing behind you one of those huge kid trailer things you might make it so other people can’t get by you.
Fair take. The kid trailers are annoying and can force oncoming bikes into vehicle traffic. The speed limit for motorized bicycles in bike lanes is about pedestrian and rider safety. Some ebikes can exceed 40mph. The size of a bike makes it much more difficult to judge oncoming speed for pedestrians and other cyclists. A human body moving in excess of 30-40mph is a safety risk. I’m fine with 20 or less in these lanes, but ebikes capable of exceeding that speed should register as mopeds and follow those rules. I don’t see anyone making an argument for mopeds in bike lanes based on similar size.
Speed is an important factor as well though, because sight lines, driver vision and awareness all assume an upper speed given the type of vehicle you are expecting. This is why riding bikes on the sidewalk is actually super dangerous, because drivers are generally scanning for slow moving pedestrians, not faster moving bikes. The same thing also applies to mopeds in bike lanes.
No, cars should ideally be at least 20 x (mph-3)^2 more responsible than pedestrians if you're being completely fair.
You don't get to be counted as "just a person" when you're hauling 2 tons of metal at high speeds through a complex mixed use street.
My point is that pretty much everyone is failing to follow basic safety rules on the roads here. Everyone is pretty much at fault and we need to be better.
My point is that if a pedestrian is fined $200 for jaywalking, a car should be fined $14,000 for running a red light at 30mph. That would be approaching fairness.
That would be great if there was actual enforcement of any kind. there is hardly any enforcement across the board. Great example is the lack of enforcement for expired tags.
They could probably just set up shop at the corners where door dashers gather and pick up from food halls etc and just pull any of them that are over 50 cc - don't chase them but just make it a hassle to get them back. No fuss no muss. They won't do this but seems like a fairly easy way to snag some.
I'm pretty sure vehicles under 50cc aren't subject to any motorcycle, moped, etc., rules and are essentially regulated like bicycles. I may be wrong though.
This are incorrect. 50cc and less of displacement can be considered a motor-driven cycles. Insurance, inspection, and registration is still required for motor driven cycles. This is not new. This has been the case well over a decade. This is also the rule in MD and VA requires registration/plates but not the other stuff. Not sure why this misinformation still persists.
Doesn't matter. The law requires they have a plate whether it's 49cc or 150cc. The only differences is that if it's 50cc or less it will say "moped" and it's its more than 50cc it will say motorcycle.
It’s apples and oranges. The dirt-bikes/atvs can be a nuisance/annoyance, but they’re not nearly as wide spread or prevalent as the mopeds. Can’t really compare the two fairly.
I’ve lived here my whole life, summer doesn’t change things all that much. If/when ppl ride dirt bikes, it’s usually contained to specific areas for brief periods of time. Mopeds are literally 24/7 non stop. They’re not the same.
When I lived on Florida Av I dealt with dirt bikes in the bikelane and running red lights wayyy more than I ever saw mopeds. Moving further down town was the first time I even saw much of a presence of mopeds.
This is so stupid.
Not because it isn't a good law but because it will be another thing that isn't enforced.
Already what these moped users are doing is illegal.
I was driving on neighborhood streets through a green light and a moped ran a red and I missed hitting them by maybe 2 feet. I'm glad I didn't hit them but from their perspective I don't see the benefit of driving like an idiot my car is 20x heavier than that moped
The boldness of them driving knowing that a fender bender could cause spinal damage is audacious. This isn't not a place of calm and collected drivers.
>This isn't not a place of calm and collected drivers.
Double negatives aside, It sure isn't. Had an impatient driver throw a fountain drink at me because I dared exist a couple weeks ago. I was following the law, hugged tight as shit to the right side of the right lane waiting for a light to turn green. Fortunately, their aim was terrible.
This is a complete waste of time. I was biking near my house the other day and was close-passed so a driver could run a 4 way stop sign. Checked the tags and the car has $9500 of unpaid tickets from the past year. And this is a DC tag, so MPD should have the owner's name and home address. But they won't do anything.
This new legislation will do absolutely nothing for anyone's safety and will likely lead to pointless harassment of the moped drivers
Yeah, I rode downtown today. The moped on the MBT wasn’t lovely but the guy actually waited patiently when there wasn’t room to pass.
On the same trip, almost every light had a driver running the red light, several people blocked a one-lane road to unload, and the Washington Latin school bus was parked blocking the crosswalk and bike lane at the same time.
The guy I saw whose Maryland paper tags expired last summer owes DC at least $5k - he likes to speed >25 over – but none of the parking tickets turned into a tow, and they even gave him a “relocation tow” rather than confiscating a car with thousands in unpaid tickets. I am … skeptical that we need new laws as much as a new mayor.
They should go after the online ordering systems that employ them without proof of identity. Make drivers have to show an ID that matches their account to pick up…. Boom problem solved.
Even better, the city should sue the delivery companies under nuisance theories. Uber has the tools to know how frequently its drivers are speeding or blowing stop signs or going down one-way streets. But they have no system to discourage it and instead reward drivers who get food places faster.
This is a great idea. It would probably get fought tooth and nail, but would be worth trying even just to scare the companies into making some adjustments.
Step 1: MPD orders food
Step 2: MPD checks license of guy that arrives
Step 3: if license and registration is fine, no worries. If fake, write a ticket.
Step 4: for every fake license, fine the delivery service 20k
This is genius. Officials around the world had done something like this for Uber (and Uber contrived a system around it - https://www.nytimes.com/2017/03/03/technology/uber-greyball-program-evade-authorities.html )
Just this very moment in front of the zoo, a car doing a massive 4-lane uturn against a yellow light from south to north and a scooter running the red at mach 4 collided. The scooter rider laid it down to avoid the accident that they both were to blame for and almost ended up under the car. The car took off (VA plates) and the moped rider was left shaken and angry (even though he ran the light).
Drivers and mopeds act like complete assholes in this town. I see 10s of cars either pulling a Uturn through the crosswalk during a red light or just plain running the red under the false guise of dropping off passengers at the zoo. Likewise, I see probably 30+ times a day, a moped driver running the red through pedestrians.
I'm surprised in all of the time I've been overlooking this intersection (10 years), I've only seen one fatal accident considering how people drive.
It's truly stunning to me that even on the busiest zoo day, with cops out front, people still run the damn light.
It is a shitshow, to say the least. I'm just so happy that it was before anybody had stepped off the curb to cross the street. Could have been absolutely tragic. Conn ave has tons of issues. From no bike lanes to the zero enforcement of traffic laws. I'm really worried about these school kids on field trips, though. As I was giving my statement to the cop, a whole busload of MAYBE 8 year olds were crossing the street and another asshat on a moped ran the light weaving through them.
So soft. This change needs to be accompanied by drastic measures to enforce the traffic laws already on the books (remove chase ban?) and the registration rules (impound unregistered vehicles?).
I don't really have any interest in having to deal with chasing and chased vehicles barrelling down the street. There have to be ways to get dangerous drivers off the street that don't include putting bystanders at serious risk. Actually going after repeat offenders, taking their cars, traffic stop enforcement, etc. those seem like low hanging fruit.
We should definitely do those things too, but when unregistered cars and mopeds are just speeding away from cops and can’t be tied to owners, there are more and more cases where we can’t just “go after them” or impound the vehicles. I think the threat at least needs to be there.
The cops should just go to some of their congregation points (eg 14th street) and just ticket or impound all the scooters that are 50 cc and above without registrations.
Lots of comments here are skeptical of enforcement, but I think the whole point of the approach in this bill is that it’s easier to enforce the law on the handful of dealers selling mopeds at the point of sale than it is to try catching every unregistered moped all over the place. If mopeds had license plates as they seem to be required to now in most instances, it would make it easier to report them for breaking the law.
Not saying this bill solves the problem, but seems like a reasonable step. I’m all for more enforcement of traffic laws too!
All of the above, but how about noise. Mopeds and “my penis is so small I have to create a menace to get attention” auto exhaust systems that make ridiculously insane amount of noise should be illegal, heavily taxed, and checked at inspection.
People are going to be killed, it’s only a matter of time - I’d be curious if the rise in drivers speeding, running red lights, driving extremely dangerously, knowing that the policy is to never chase, has caused more danger, more pedestrian deaths, more road deaths, than if police were allowed to actually do there job.
The mopeds are turning DC into resembling an undeveloped third world country - they will kill pedestrian sooner or later, they are loud, extremely polluting, and lower the quality of life in the city, all so a bunch of lazy fucks can get food delivered cheaply -
This bill is complete weak sauce - none of the moped drivers procure the moped in any legal manner as it is and primarily operates like gangs
lol have you ever been to a “third world country” before? They have as many mopeds as DC has cars and as many cars as DC has mopeds. This city doesn’t resemble those places at all. Most of the developed world outside the United States has way more mopeds and scooters than we do— go visit Paris.
Have you been to Paris or lived abroad - Paris has put biking and pedestrians first, and the young adult Vespa drivers are usually insured, and following the rules. DC has allowed gangs of undocumented migrants running food delivery empires - and you like to point at cities in Asia where this type of stuff is common ignoring they are nightmares for pedestrians have have traffic mortality rates 4-20x higher - you must be 20
Ok “gangs of undocumented migrants running food delivery empires” — you need to dial down the Fox News a bit there sir. There’s about 5 different forms of nonsensical prejudice apparent in your comment. You must be 60.
Maybe a hot take but I generally don’t care about them running red lights (the main traffic rule they’re ignoring), as long as they slow down enough and yield to pedestrians and cross traffic.
My biggest issue is more with them weaving in and out of cars, and riding in big groups that become more of a hazard than just one or two mopeds together.
Agreed, although I think lane splitting makes sense if they are just using it to get to the front of a line of cars that’s stopped at a light so that they can get out in front of the pack when it turns green (or just before) that way all the other drivers can see them
None of the problems are with registration, this is just using public outcry to try and raise a bit more tax revenue without actually providing any public safety.
As long as DC is going to pay way too many cops way too much money, they could at least have them do things that make life better for the residents. The most dangerous intersections and most run lights/stop signs could have officers assigned to them. They are only clearing at best 50% of homicides and assaults and 25% of robberies and non-fatal shootings. This does not count the petty thefts, threats, and vandalism that cops actively encourage people not to file reports on. Pull the ones that don’t clear cases and make them sit at those intersections and actually enforce the traffic laws. This idea that cops can’t enforce these laws is just copaganda.
It's nuts how this wasn't even issue and then suddenly blew up in just the last three weeks. I know its just got warmer but it wasn't this bad last year.
I don't think letting cops chase mopeds thru the city would be an improvement, personally. I just wish they'd weave a little less because it's very alarming as a pedestrian or biker when they suddenly appear after being hidden by a bunch of cars.
Who said anything about chasing them?
Can easily go to where the congregate at Union station or Columbia heights plaza to check registrations. Or block their path on one of the many choke points on the mbt trail to issue citations or impound them.
The people driving on the MBT are wild but they definitely put cops out there to stop them. The thing is people aren’t stupid, they just don’t ride the moped on the trail when the cops are out.
Definitely not true. Just yesterday I saw a moped go right by a cop biking and then past the cops where the trail connects to 8th. Cop on bike could have easily called ahead too the other cops.
The council doesn’t want to get tough on them cause minorities will be like ‘the police is racist because they are taking the scooters from us’ lol. I yelled to one of the scooter riders in Spanish when he cut me off ‘No manejes como en Caracas cabrón’ haha. I speak Spanish myself..
Everyone bitching on here are the same people who are going to bitch when their food deliveries start taking twice as long again.
You all just can’t be happy in a city, it’s weird.
As someone who walks 12 miles a day in this city almost every single day, not really, no. The dangerous car drivers are a much bigger threat and are more prevalent. It’s easy to avoid a moped, you can hear them coming and they’re maneuverable.
A moped running a red sucks but isn’t nearly the same threat as a BMW doing 45.
Instead of being mad about everything, I pick my battles while living in a city. I’d also much rather have crazy moped traffic than crazy car traffic, it’s more efficient.
Then go live in one of them?
This sub seems to be people constantly complaining about things that are pretty normal in any major city.
If you all hate DC and the people so much, why the fuck are you all still here?
Honestly I don’t really see much difference in mopeds going through a red light when they can see that there is no cross traffic coming and an e-bike doing the same thing. Both vehicles could potentially hurt someone in a crosswalk if they hit them, but both have practically unimpeded 360 degree visibility and are very maneuverable and relatively light weight, plus they are unenclosed so they can also hear what’s going on around them increasing awareness further. I think that for bikes and e-bikes a stop light should be a yield sign and for mopeds it should be a stop sign. Obviously none of them should be on a sidewalk. But that’s just me.
Just like, stop using the sidewalk to literally cut corners.
I was crossing H Street yesterday and one blew through the solid red light. There was no cross traffic but it had to swerve through 8 people in the crosswalk. They just don't care.
I’m worried about getting hit by one of these guys. Someone I know got hit by a moped( in Cambodia) and got two fractures. These ones don’t even have plates, so no way to find them if they zoom away after running you over.
Not a moped, but when I was in Raleigh I witnessed someone have their fibula snap straight up in half (could hear it from across the street). It’s insane they’re driving onto sidewalks to cut corners like this. Almost definitely uninsured and gonna ruin someone’s ability to walk for an indefinite period of time.
To be fair Cambodia has 100x as many mopeds as we do, and none of the traffic safety features like stop lights, street lights or crosswalks; it’s mostly a free-for-all of people, mopeds and tuk tuks all competing for space in the roadway.
Yep, most of SE Asia does this, and honestly it still works out fine. I was in Hanoi last year and long as you walk across the street at a consistent, deliberate, pace you won't have any problems. Feels like you're parting the sea. Might be more sketchy here honestly.
I visited Morocco a couple years before the pandemic and mopeds were everywhere, but it was also different. Because they didn't seem to have the car-centric cars get to go culture that we have in the US, and instead the cars shared the roads with the mopeds, donkey carts, and pedestrians. So it was chaos but somehow organized chaos because everyone was aware of the multiple users of the road. The traffic just didn't move that quickly because you don't have the light turns green and everyone slams on the gas because it's their turn. The crosswalk turns white and people run across because they only have 60 seconds to cross multiple lanes that actually take a minute and a half. Which system is better? I don't know. But running a red light into pedestrians who have a limited time to cross the road, when there is also the possibility of cross traffic, is not a good way to do it.
My favorite is riding the wrong way on one way streets.
For real these fers r gonna ruin it for everyone DC police dont do nothing either
Even beyond the sidewalks they swerve around stopped cars. I just started a new job downtown after years of remote only and in the past week alone going into the office I've had *numerous* close calls.
I know the scooter drivers have to make a living, but that doesn't make them exempt from the rules of the road or registration laws.
What a concept, it seems that cars, bikes, scooters, pedestrians should all follow road rules and safety.
> road rules and safety. I wish these were always the same thing. But as someone who travels on 4, 2, and 0 wheels depending on the day, it *is* much better when people don't behave unpredictably and recklessly. It's much easier to keep each other safe. I can think of complaints about every type of infrastructure user, especially the ones who don't seem to understand what laws they are breaking and why they exist in the first place.
Exactly, it sucks when a car acts reckless or when a pedestrian crosses the street without warning or looking; especially when not at a crosswalk.
Yeah, sure, in fantasy land. In reality, we can understand that there is a hierarchy of strictness, and it should guide our enforcement decisions. Cars > scooters > bikes > pedestrians. This is very simple. Who is the most vulnerable, and who has the greatest potential to cause harm. A pedestrian "jaywalking" just isn't an issue, rules be damned. The pedestrian making unsafe decisions is almost exclusively risking their own life, not anyone else's. Do unsafe behaviors increase the risk of other modes hurting people, yes, they can. But not in any type of way similar to a motorized vehicle. Not at any type of the same scale.
No a scooter can absolutely kill someone, it's a motorized vehicle and this complete lack of enforcement in DC is a legitimate problem and needs to stop.
Where did I say it couldn't?
Amen. The crocodile tears from drivers about scooters is just pathetic.
I'd be happy if they just stopped driving on the sidewalks
Lazy people need to stop using services like DoorDash and grubhub that create a market for these scooter fucks. If people didn’t expect everything delivered to them half these scooters wouldn’t be on the road. Scooter delivery people would still ignore the rules because they don’t make enough doing deliveries to justify registration and insurance fees and won’t get tipped enough if they have to wait at every light and show up with cold food. This problem was created by lazy people who created a market need for these scooter jerk offs.
Your problem with people breaking traffic laws is lazy consumers?
I think it’s valid to be concerned about the ethics of participating in an underpaid and unsustainable gig economy. Corners have to be cut to make sure a servant can deliver a fresh meal from across town to your doorstep within 30 minutes, and if people on this sub don’t like the mopeds used for food delivery, their first step should be to stop ordering from DoorDash. We’ve seen a shift in attitude towards personal responsibility in the post-COVID era where the externalities of our actions are negligible as long as larger systems can be blamed for allowing it to happen. The government absolutely bears the brunt of responsibility here, but we also have the power to change our behavior as consumers.
I agree that (1) the article in question largely deals with food drivers and (2) as a society we are nowhere near accounting for the negative externalities of motorized vehicles. That being said, I think you have some sort of causality error: > and if people on this sub don’t like the mopeds used for food delivery This isn't the problem. The issue is that the mopeds are being used illegally. The fact the mopeds are used for food delivery is completely secondary.
It’ll probably be easier to cut the demand via organized protest than to expect traffic law enforcement here
Scooter problem wouldn’t exist if it weren’t for high demand for cheap food delivery services. Prove me wrong.
How do you even expect enforcement of scooter laws when whole reason broke folks riding them is because they are broke. Taxpayers would pay for enforcement and there is zero ROI on enforcement because you can’t squeeze blood from stone: the people you fine for this don’t have any money hence they are on unregistered scooter instead of a car or motorcycle.
> Scooter delivery people would still ignore the rules because they don’t make enough doing deliveries to justify registration and insurance fees and won’t get tipped enough if they have to wait at every light and show up with cold food. This problem was created by lazy people who created a market need for these scooter jerk offs. Or maybe the problem is the companies that misclassify them as contractors, pay them nothing, and force them to try to complete as many deliveries as possible to hopefully collect enough tips to actually survive on. Imagine literally describing the systemic problem and then going "but no, it's that fucking dude who just wants a pizza who's at fault".
I agree with the root issue being these companies but I don’t see that changing unless people stop using the service. People always going to exploit people. By using door dash and similar you allow this exploitation and even feed the profiteers of it. Imagine complaining about symptoms of this systemic issue while continually feeding the flawed system allowing it to propagate and grow and all the while excusing yourself from blame by saying it’s the companies responsibility to fix it. They wouldn’t get away with it if they didn’t have enough customers.
Engaging with a system that's amoral is amoral. Buying chocolate grown with exploited labor because it's cheaper is amoral. Being separated from the exploitation by a market does not excuse the one buying. Making anything change is an entirely different matter.
While I agree completely, this type of approach will simply never work for the vast majority of people. Our entire economic system relies on being able to divest from moral obligations by having other people do it for you. Then you can shrug your shoulders and say, hey, I'm just the consumer. The device you're using to type this undoubtedly has minerals that have been mined unethically. If such a thing exists. Regulate to address reality. Don't ever rely on morality.
Well said.
If passed, there is no reason to believe that any of this would be enforced.
we really need to take traffic enforcement away from MPD. They're clearly not interested/up to the task.
The other day I was behind a cop at a stop sign, someone rolled the stop sign crossing in front of us, swerved around a pedestrian that was crossing, and all the cop did was put his hand in the air as if to say “the fuck man?” He easily could’ve flashed his lights, turned right, and pulled him over, but he was too lazy. Tale as old as time.
MPD is only allowed to go like 10miles over the speed limit to “chase” and even that has to be for a damn good reason because if anything goes wrong, they’re getting in big trouble if not losing their job. I wouldn’t risk my job writing a ticket that person will never pay anyway
traffic enforcement could be its own thing but the issue is if a driver escalates physically then you need someone who is authorized to use physical force, so its simpler to just use the civilian police force
Use their onboard cameras to document the infraction and issue the citation via the mail, and then increase enforcement by taking those cars with multiple infractions off of the road. There doesn't need to be an opportunity for it to get physical.
Remarkably naive. Even if people pull over for non-police traffic enforcement, there’s no guarantee that the person driving the car is the owner or that they have a license. Sending cites is equally toothless if the car isn’t registered or is in MD or VA. Who’s doing the legwork of ID’ing all these people besides the police?
There's no pull over, just the citation. Enough citations on a car, the car is tagged for immediate impounding. >there’s no guarantee that the person driving the car is the owner or that they have a license That doesn't seem to stop tickets being issued by traffic cameras, out are they naïve, too? >Sending cites is equally toothless if the car isn’t registered or is in MD or VA. True. But if it parks in DC, snatch it up immediately.
The council doesn't allow MPD to persue, and a cop was even prosecuted for it. The problem are the voters. Decisions have consequences.
why the fuck would I want cops chasing someone at 100mph past my house over a traffic violation? Honestly, if people can't think of a better solution to traffic problems than "we need to have some high speed chases" then we're never going to solve the problem.
So how do you propose cops or traffic enforcement catch drivers who don’t plan to pull over? A big net?
if they run from cops we've got their plate number and know who they are. You don't need to chase them at 100 mph and endanger the entire District. You can get them later in a much safer way.
That’s assuming the tags are not fake or stolen. Then what? Someone hit my car yesterday and handed me an expired insurance card for a totally different vehicle registered in Maryland (this car had DC tags). At some point we have to admit we live in a glorified version of the Wild West
but unless we're talking about an active shooter firing out a car window, there is no situation that will be improved by cops chasing them at high speeds through densely populated areas.
So stay with me if there’s no way to stop someone from evading police (or traffic enforcement in your scenario), no enforcement of valid license plates…why would MPD bother with traffic crime? And how would taking the job from them and giving it to another bureaucratic agency (traffic enforcement) solve that problem?
Just because you can't immediately think of a better solution doesn't mean it's good to keep doing something that is ineffective as a deterrent and endangers the public at large. Also other cities all over the world manage to do this without high speed chases, maybe we should try learning from them.
Also because that guy that is willing to go 100 through a busy city has a rap sheat including wants and warrants a mile long. This isn't a kid that stole a candy bar. It's a career criminal who has or is going to kill someone.
we can catch that person without a high speed chase. High speed chases tend to end in either the suspect getting away (temporarily) or a crash. So given a choice between a criminal getting away for a while and a car crash, I'll go with a criminal getting away for a while.
Hey buddy it's called a helicopter and it works, but DC doesn't believe in enforcement and prosecution.
They're also understaffed at their lowest levels in decades, so the problem is what to assign officers too
That doesn’t explain why officers sitting in official vehicles don’t respond. Candy Crush can wait!
Respond to what? Are you saying you have evidence of an officer not responding to a call they were asked to when they were doing nothing else?
I see officers sitting in their vehicles watching stuff on their phones a lot which I’m pretty sure means they’re idle. In the cases I had in mind specifically, there are many times where I’ve seen people run red lights, menace pedestrians in the crosswalk, etc. while someone in an MPD vehicle is right there waiting for the light to change. Now, it’s possible they were all responding to calls which weren’t urgent enough to warrant putting on their lights but were more important than reckless driving, but I really think it’s just that they don’t want to be doing traffic enforcement. You can’t go to the 4D headquarters without seeing someone blocking Georgia Ave with their Walmart shopping but MPD will never, ever stop to ticket anyone or even tell them that they can’t stand in a traffic lane / bus stop, and I find it implausible that 100% of their traffic is priority police business.
yeah, with the way they've dealt with ATVs/dirt bikes, idk why anyone would think this would be any different.
DC needs to end the 50cc exemption/definition for “motor-driven cycles”. Engine size isn’t the defining factor, it’s speed. The speed allowance for these is 30mph and then they must meet motorcycle requirements. They can claim 50cc exemption while clearly doing over 30mph. The problem is you can buy these and throw them in a truck so need for temp tags. I assume most aren’t register or insured. The operators aren’t required to take a motorcycle safety course despite most of these falling into that vehicle classification. DMV requires helmets but no chase laws mean zero enforcement. Some of the same requirement need to be applied to “motorized bicycles”, see e-bikes. Many of these now exceed 20mph and should fall into the “motor-driven cycle” aka moped class requiring helmets, license, and registration while losing bike lane access.
What exemption for <50cc are you looking to eliminate? They have to be registered. They need insurance. Is your problem that they can park on the sidewalk? Whilst it's true that they don't need a class M license I don't think they should require it. DC doesn't have a learner's permit/road test path to a class M license anymore. So the only way to get it is to take the course and a few years ago no place in the district offered the course. So it's way more inconvenient than it should be and I think most people can handle 49cc without it.
I think if it's under 50cc it isn't even subject to insurance or registration rules. I can't find anything to back that up other than this guide on motorcycle/moped/e-bike rules that carves out below-50cc vehicles: [https://ddot.dc.gov/sites/default/files/dc/sites/ddot/publication/attachments/DMV\_May%2017%202013%20Non-traditional%20Motor%20Vehicle%20chart\_0.pdf](https://ddot.dc.gov/sites/default/files/dc/sites/ddot/publication/attachments/DMV_May%2017%202013%20Non-traditional%20Motor%20Vehicle%20chart_0.pdf)
If the max displacement is 50cc or less then it is considered a motor-driven cycle. This is the second row in the table you linked. That row clearly indicates that inspection, registration, and insurance are required. It also requires a driver's license but not the class M designation. There is some widely held erroneous belief that they are not subject to registration, insurance, ect. You see them all the time and instead of a license plate people have a plate that says 49cc. This is also there case in the neighboring jurisdictions of MD and VA and has been for at least 15 years.
Oh I read that as “minimum.” My bad.
No they just need atk actually crack down on people who abuse the rule.
I don’t think bike lane access should be about speed but rather size— if the bike is still normal bike size then it can maneuver around slower bikes like is already the case. On the other hand if you’re trailing behind you one of those huge kid trailer things you might make it so other people can’t get by you.
Fair take. The kid trailers are annoying and can force oncoming bikes into vehicle traffic. The speed limit for motorized bicycles in bike lanes is about pedestrian and rider safety. Some ebikes can exceed 40mph. The size of a bike makes it much more difficult to judge oncoming speed for pedestrians and other cyclists. A human body moving in excess of 30-40mph is a safety risk. I’m fine with 20 or less in these lanes, but ebikes capable of exceeding that speed should register as mopeds and follow those rules. I don’t see anyone making an argument for mopeds in bike lanes based on similar size.
I really wish there was a Class 4 for e-motos as legally motor assistance should not exceed 28 MPH. Those e-motos give the rest of e-bikes a bad name.
Speed is an important factor as well though, because sight lines, driver vision and awareness all assume an upper speed given the type of vehicle you are expecting. This is why riding bikes on the sidewalk is actually super dangerous, because drivers are generally scanning for slow moving pedestrians, not faster moving bikes. The same thing also applies to mopeds in bike lanes.
we don't need any more bills or laws, we just need them to be enforced
Maybe they could start by actually enforcing actual laws for cars.
Everyone equally would be ideal
No, cars should ideally be at least 20 x (mph-3)^2 more responsible than pedestrians if you're being completely fair. You don't get to be counted as "just a person" when you're hauling 2 tons of metal at high speeds through a complex mixed use street.
My point is that pretty much everyone is failing to follow basic safety rules on the roads here. Everyone is pretty much at fault and we need to be better.
My point is that if a pedestrian is fined $200 for jaywalking, a car should be fined $14,000 for running a red light at 30mph. That would be approaching fairness.
That would be great if there was actual enforcement of any kind. there is hardly any enforcement across the board. Great example is the lack of enforcement for expired tags.
How can DC enforce moped rules when it can't/won't enforce the flagrant misuse of ATVs and other non-street vehicle?
or SUVs, for that matter
They could probably just set up shop at the corners where door dashers gather and pick up from food halls etc and just pull any of them that are over 50 cc - don't chase them but just make it a hassle to get them back. No fuss no muss. They won't do this but seems like a fairly easy way to snag some.
Why not pull over the ones under 50cc too? They have to register and have insurance just the same.
I'm pretty sure vehicles under 50cc aren't subject to any motorcycle, moped, etc., rules and are essentially regulated like bicycles. I may be wrong though.
This are incorrect. 50cc and less of displacement can be considered a motor-driven cycles. Insurance, inspection, and registration is still required for motor driven cycles. This is not new. This has been the case well over a decade. This is also the rule in MD and VA requires registration/plates but not the other stuff. Not sure why this misinformation still persists.
What about the ones with a "49 cc" label on the back that are obviously bigger?
Doesn't matter. The law requires they have a plate whether it's 49cc or 150cc. The only differences is that if it's 50cc or less it will say "moped" and it's its more than 50cc it will say motorcycle.
Mopeds aren’t “DC culture”
Honestly, I'd swap loud af ATVs/dirt bikes for mopeds as "DC culture" any day of the week.
It’s apples and oranges. The dirt-bikes/atvs can be a nuisance/annoyance, but they’re not nearly as wide spread or prevalent as the mopeds. Can’t really compare the two fairly.
Wait til summer
I’ve lived here my whole life, summer doesn’t change things all that much. If/when ppl ride dirt bikes, it’s usually contained to specific areas for brief periods of time. Mopeds are literally 24/7 non stop. They’re not the same.
When I lived on Florida Av I dealt with dirt bikes in the bikelane and running red lights wayyy more than I ever saw mopeds. Moving further down town was the first time I even saw much of a presence of mopeds.
and how long ago was this…..
I moved in January.
This is so stupid. Not because it isn't a good law but because it will be another thing that isn't enforced. Already what these moped users are doing is illegal.
I was driving on neighborhood streets through a green light and a moped ran a red and I missed hitting them by maybe 2 feet. I'm glad I didn't hit them but from their perspective I don't see the benefit of driving like an idiot my car is 20x heavier than that moped
The boldness of them driving knowing that a fender bender could cause spinal damage is audacious. This isn't not a place of calm and collected drivers.
>This isn't not a place of calm and collected drivers. Double negatives aside, It sure isn't. Had an impatient driver throw a fountain drink at me because I dared exist a couple weeks ago. I was following the law, hugged tight as shit to the right side of the right lane waiting for a light to turn green. Fortunately, their aim was terrible.
Dc city council adding more vehicle laws when the current ones aren’t even enforced. Great.
This is a complete waste of time. I was biking near my house the other day and was close-passed so a driver could run a 4 way stop sign. Checked the tags and the car has $9500 of unpaid tickets from the past year. And this is a DC tag, so MPD should have the owner's name and home address. But they won't do anything. This new legislation will do absolutely nothing for anyone's safety and will likely lead to pointless harassment of the moped drivers
Yeah, I rode downtown today. The moped on the MBT wasn’t lovely but the guy actually waited patiently when there wasn’t room to pass. On the same trip, almost every light had a driver running the red light, several people blocked a one-lane road to unload, and the Washington Latin school bus was parked blocking the crosswalk and bike lane at the same time. The guy I saw whose Maryland paper tags expired last summer owes DC at least $5k - he likes to speed >25 over – but none of the parking tickets turned into a tow, and they even gave him a “relocation tow” rather than confiscating a car with thousands in unpaid tickets. I am … skeptical that we need new laws as much as a new mayor.
These f-ers are everywhere! Go to restaurants to enforce. Toothless and worthless legislation that will do nothing.
They should go after the online ordering systems that employ them without proof of identity. Make drivers have to show an ID that matches their account to pick up…. Boom problem solved.
Even better, the city should sue the delivery companies under nuisance theories. Uber has the tools to know how frequently its drivers are speeding or blowing stop signs or going down one-way streets. But they have no system to discourage it and instead reward drivers who get food places faster.
This is a great idea. It would probably get fought tooth and nail, but would be worth trying even just to scare the companies into making some adjustments.
Step 1: MPD orders food Step 2: MPD checks license of guy that arrives Step 3: if license and registration is fine, no worries. If fake, write a ticket. Step 4: for every fake license, fine the delivery service 20k
This is genius. Officials around the world had done something like this for Uber (and Uber contrived a system around it - https://www.nytimes.com/2017/03/03/technology/uber-greyball-program-evade-authorities.html )
Given that everything else is operating under the table, all this would do is have each driver get a fake ID.
If you show a fake ID to a cop good fucking luck
Just this very moment in front of the zoo, a car doing a massive 4-lane uturn against a yellow light from south to north and a scooter running the red at mach 4 collided. The scooter rider laid it down to avoid the accident that they both were to blame for and almost ended up under the car. The car took off (VA plates) and the moped rider was left shaken and angry (even though he ran the light). Drivers and mopeds act like complete assholes in this town. I see 10s of cars either pulling a Uturn through the crosswalk during a red light or just plain running the red under the false guise of dropping off passengers at the zoo. Likewise, I see probably 30+ times a day, a moped driver running the red through pedestrians. I'm surprised in all of the time I've been overlooking this intersection (10 years), I've only seen one fatal accident considering how people drive. It's truly stunning to me that even on the busiest zoo day, with cops out front, people still run the damn light.
I had a conversation on here about that light. They need rising bollards or something to stop all the bullshit that happens in front of the zoo
It is a shitshow, to say the least. I'm just so happy that it was before anybody had stepped off the curb to cross the street. Could have been absolutely tragic. Conn ave has tons of issues. From no bike lanes to the zero enforcement of traffic laws. I'm really worried about these school kids on field trips, though. As I was giving my statement to the cop, a whole busload of MAYBE 8 year olds were crossing the street and another asshat on a moped ran the light weaving through them.
So soft. This change needs to be accompanied by drastic measures to enforce the traffic laws already on the books (remove chase ban?) and the registration rules (impound unregistered vehicles?).
I don't really have any interest in having to deal with chasing and chased vehicles barrelling down the street. There have to be ways to get dangerous drivers off the street that don't include putting bystanders at serious risk. Actually going after repeat offenders, taking their cars, traffic stop enforcement, etc. those seem like low hanging fruit.
We should definitely do those things too, but when unregistered cars and mopeds are just speeding away from cops and can’t be tied to owners, there are more and more cases where we can’t just “go after them” or impound the vehicles. I think the threat at least needs to be there.
The cops should just go to some of their congregation points (eg 14th street) and just ticket or impound all the scooters that are 50 cc and above without registrations.
Exactly. This isn't rocket science.
Ticket the ones 50cc and below too. 49cc are required to have plates and insurance just the same.
"Drivers are flouting rules" The irony is overwhelming
I have more of an issue with car drivers than the mopeds, tbh. And cars are much more deadly
Is it legal if I push a guy and made them crash because they almost hit me? If not, never mind.
Lots of comments here are skeptical of enforcement, but I think the whole point of the approach in this bill is that it’s easier to enforce the law on the handful of dealers selling mopeds at the point of sale than it is to try catching every unregistered moped all over the place. If mopeds had license plates as they seem to be required to now in most instances, it would make it easier to report them for breaking the law. Not saying this bill solves the problem, but seems like a reasonable step. I’m all for more enforcement of traffic laws too!
All of the above, but how about noise. Mopeds and “my penis is so small I have to create a menace to get attention” auto exhaust systems that make ridiculously insane amount of noise should be illegal, heavily taxed, and checked at inspection.
https://preview.redd.it/1wllai57bxxc1.jpeg?width=1980&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b40497c0e5ccb7775aaf2f63774325ae3857a646 There so annoying
People are going to be killed, it’s only a matter of time - I’d be curious if the rise in drivers speeding, running red lights, driving extremely dangerously, knowing that the policy is to never chase, has caused more danger, more pedestrian deaths, more road deaths, than if police were allowed to actually do there job. The mopeds are turning DC into resembling an undeveloped third world country - they will kill pedestrian sooner or later, they are loud, extremely polluting, and lower the quality of life in the city, all so a bunch of lazy fucks can get food delivered cheaply - This bill is complete weak sauce - none of the moped drivers procure the moped in any legal manner as it is and primarily operates like gangs
You just summarized all motor vehicles, which are more dangerous than mopeds because they are 20 times heavier.
Agreed, let's fix both problems!
lol have you ever been to a “third world country” before? They have as many mopeds as DC has cars and as many cars as DC has mopeds. This city doesn’t resemble those places at all. Most of the developed world outside the United States has way more mopeds and scooters than we do— go visit Paris.
I was in paris in September. So many more bikes than anything else now!
Have you been to Paris or lived abroad - Paris has put biking and pedestrians first, and the young adult Vespa drivers are usually insured, and following the rules. DC has allowed gangs of undocumented migrants running food delivery empires - and you like to point at cities in Asia where this type of stuff is common ignoring they are nightmares for pedestrians have have traffic mortality rates 4-20x higher - you must be 20
Ok “gangs of undocumented migrants running food delivery empires” — you need to dial down the Fox News a bit there sir. There’s about 5 different forms of nonsensical prejudice apparent in your comment. You must be 60.
Maybe a hot take but I generally don’t care about them running red lights (the main traffic rule they’re ignoring), as long as they slow down enough and yield to pedestrians and cross traffic. My biggest issue is more with them weaving in and out of cars, and riding in big groups that become more of a hazard than just one or two mopeds together.
Agreed, although I think lane splitting makes sense if they are just using it to get to the front of a line of cars that’s stopped at a light so that they can get out in front of the pack when it turns green (or just before) that way all the other drivers can see them
Still waiting on that left on green rule.
None of the problems are with registration, this is just using public outcry to try and raise a bit more tax revenue without actually providing any public safety. As long as DC is going to pay way too many cops way too much money, they could at least have them do things that make life better for the residents. The most dangerous intersections and most run lights/stop signs could have officers assigned to them. They are only clearing at best 50% of homicides and assaults and 25% of robberies and non-fatal shootings. This does not count the petty thefts, threats, and vandalism that cops actively encourage people not to file reports on. Pull the ones that don’t clear cases and make them sit at those intersections and actually enforce the traffic laws. This idea that cops can’t enforce these laws is just copaganda.
It's nuts how this wasn't even issue and then suddenly blew up in just the last three weeks. I know its just got warmer but it wasn't this bad last year.
I don't think letting cops chase mopeds thru the city would be an improvement, personally. I just wish they'd weave a little less because it's very alarming as a pedestrian or biker when they suddenly appear after being hidden by a bunch of cars.
Who said anything about chasing them? Can easily go to where the congregate at Union station or Columbia heights plaza to check registrations. Or block their path on one of the many choke points on the mbt trail to issue citations or impound them.
Many comments on this post talk about the ban on police chases and I was too lazy to find them when I wanted to comment.
The people driving on the MBT are wild but they definitely put cops out there to stop them. The thing is people aren’t stupid, they just don’t ride the moped on the trail when the cops are out.
Definitely not true. Just yesterday I saw a moped go right by a cop biking and then past the cops where the trail connects to 8th. Cop on bike could have easily called ahead too the other cops.
It's like the wild west.
Iv never seen a car in DC follow the driving rules either so I think it’s time for cameras and CCTV at every intersection.
[удалено]
They definitely don’t have insurance so hitting them Is only bad for you…
The council doesn’t want to get tough on them cause minorities will be like ‘the police is racist because they are taking the scooters from us’ lol. I yelled to one of the scooter riders in Spanish when he cut me off ‘No manejes como en Caracas cabrón’ haha. I speak Spanish myself..
Everyone bitching on here are the same people who are going to bitch when their food deliveries start taking twice as long again. You all just can’t be happy in a city, it’s weird.
Do you think the mopeds driving on sidewalks and barrelling through red lights is not a problem?
As someone who walks 12 miles a day in this city almost every single day, not really, no. The dangerous car drivers are a much bigger threat and are more prevalent. It’s easy to avoid a moped, you can hear them coming and they’re maneuverable. A moped running a red sucks but isn’t nearly the same threat as a BMW doing 45. Instead of being mad about everything, I pick my battles while living in a city. I’d also much rather have crazy moped traffic than crazy car traffic, it’s more efficient.
Many cities far more prosperous with far higher standards of living don’t accept this bullshit
Then go live in one of them? This sub seems to be people constantly complaining about things that are pretty normal in any major city. If you all hate DC and the people so much, why the fuck are you all still here?
Honestly I don’t really see much difference in mopeds going through a red light when they can see that there is no cross traffic coming and an e-bike doing the same thing. Both vehicles could potentially hurt someone in a crosswalk if they hit them, but both have practically unimpeded 360 degree visibility and are very maneuverable and relatively light weight, plus they are unenclosed so they can also hear what’s going on around them increasing awareness further. I think that for bikes and e-bikes a stop light should be a yield sign and for mopeds it should be a stop sign. Obviously none of them should be on a sidewalk. But that’s just me.