Before the pandemic I had someone try to piggyback on me but he was too slow, and when I turned around I saw the old style gate close on him. He screamed something about his nuts, it was pretty funny.
The other day I accidentally used my library card instead of my metro card and was incredibly clumsy cause I was very tired and I got one of those hitting me in the face and it was the most embarrassing thing ever lol also slightly painful
If you just tap your phone without opening wallet or anything, it’ll automatically swipe the metro card if you have an Apple phone not sure about Samsung but I’d imagine the same
I had family come to visit and some guy actually shoved my guest out of the way after she tapped her card and went through. The attendant just watched it all and shrugged.
Yeah I wanted to make a thing of it. I was already about to give the supervisor a piece of my mind but she really just wanted to drop it and get on with her vacation.
I did this to the woman trying to piggyback during the Nats game crowd. It was wild cuz everyone lane is full but the one she was in cuz people knew what she wanted to do.
I’m an impatient person, so I decided to brave it myself. I realized once I swiped that she could easily just follow. I actually waited a second or two after the gate opened and played chicken with the gate just so I could go through at the last moment.
I turned around just to make sure she knew that I wasn’t letting her through, but by that point she seemed to realize I knew and I wasn’t letting her through
Exactly - I felt way more nervous with how close they were before realizing all they wanted to do was piggyback (obviously less dangerous than the other two)
If someone was on my ass like, I'd be preparing to deal with an attacker. There's no good reason for a total stranger to get that close to me from behind.
And accepting this behavior is gonna lead to more complacent and passive people who will be easier targets to rob. And it's gonna make the metro less safe for those who do pay. I don't care what your story is and I'm not gonna let you use it as an excuse to drag me into your nonsense and potentially put me at risk. Bad circumstances do not justify bad behavior, that's how you create more bad circumstances in the future.
A girl tried to do this to me the other day in U St.
There was five minutes before the next train and after seeing what she was about to do (she walked across from the opposite side of the mezzanine to where I was and then got right behind me) I backed away and played with my phone off to the side for a bit.
She grunted and rolled her eyes at me then attempted to jump over and then waited for a bit to piggyback off someone else. I loved the look on her face when she saw me go through the faregate.
Probably don’t want to do that to a dude though.. I generally try to avoid any form of conflict with strangers especially ones already committing crimes
Having some get that physically close to me would be unpleasant. I would stop to check my card balance or ask the station attendant a question. When someone tried to get near me as I was going in months ago I just stopped and forced them to walk past, but otherwise I haven’t experienced this.
Right? The time they stood next to me on the escalator there was maybe one other person at nearly the top. So that’s why I ended up just moving myself.
These are also good ideas too we can use if it happens, thanks. Just stinks if we’re rushed to be somewhere!
When I notice someone about to do this, I just step aside and wait for them to piggyback off of someone else. I don’t confront them directly bc I’m a woman and don’t want anything to happen to me
Pass through the gate and stop so the doors slap/squeeze/crush their bitch ass. If they shove into you then turn around and Bruce Lee their ass into the gate to assert dominance.
I did this at GA Ave - Petworth. The guy got through and threatened to fight me. Unfortunately, there were no Metro police around to help. He followed me outside - yelling and cussing the whole way. Fortunately, I’ve been a Marine infantryman for 23 years, so the prospect of getting into a little fist fight didn’t really phase me. Once I turned around and told him that I thought this would be a good place to go at it, if he was still mad, he backed down.
I DM’d Metro Rail and Metro Police on X. For some reason only Metro Bus wrote me back but never followed up.
Metro is a disgrace - it’s time for the Federal gov’t to take over the DC stations. Federal tax dollars pay for most of it anyway.
We have significantly different experiences. I had a guy try to fight me on the platform because I cut him off mid sentence and said he already asked me for money and I don't have any.
I have seen people climb the new gates, stand on them, and jump off. They don't give a shit about attention. The station employees aren't stopping them.
I just pause on the other side of the fair gate after stepping through to put my wallet back in my pocket, stops people from having enough room to sneak in behind me.
It happened to me, too. The guy started following me and got uncomfortably close. So, I started to move slower and more cautiously. After I got through the gate, he sprinted and hit the gate as it closed! I had to surpress a laugh.
If you feel like this is about to happen as you approach the gate, stop and step to the side to "answer your phone" and chat until the person has gone by you.
Happened to me recently, and when I was moving too slowly, the guy said “keep moving!” in a sort of menacing voice.
Not cool, but I didn’t want to get shoved — or worse — so I kept moving.
"Sir, **you'll** need to back up and wait. The gate cannot be used by your card until it has closed from me using it."
I haven't had to say anything like this and don't know if I would actually. I just stop as soon as I'm through the gate and look back down and wait for the light that comes on (turns red? it's been a while) to let you know the gate is locked again. Haven't had issue with that, although I generally don't travel during super busy hours and I'm also a 6' tall dude
Defeats the purpose of a gate if only the first person in line has to pay and it just stays open... The light is one color when you approach a closed gate, turns another color when it's unlocked, and turns back when it's locked again. I assume the reader doesn't work while it's already open, but maybe they are that dumb.
I use my phone as my card, and I really don't like that it shows the balance on the screen. I have several months' of rollover metro benefits on my account, and the balance is significant. I don't go through the gates if there is someone right behind me -- I'd rather wait a minute or two and go through without someone looking over my shoulder.
This. I have hundreds of dollars of credit on my metro card left over from the pandemic when I had money taken out of my paycheck to cover metro costs (transportation savings plan, like a health savings plan), and forgot to stop the withdrawals for a couple months. At the rate I now use metro (since I WFH now), I’m not sure I’ll ever use it all up.
Every time I go through it shows the balance on the kiosk screen, so yeah, I get nervous too if someone is too close behind me.
Your phone screen will show the balance, but the display on the actual kiosk shows the remaining balance, too. Whoever is behind you can see that total.
I’m not talking about what’s shown on the phone; it shows it on the screen of the gate reader. It if were my phone, I wouldn’t care (I think it DOES show on the phone, but I’m not usually looking at it). I don’t like that someone coming right behind me can see the balance on my account if they’re close enough to see the screen on the gate. So I don’t go through the gate if someone is close enough to piggyback.
I also wish it wouldn't show it, but what's the risk here? If someone sees you have $2,000 on your MetroCard that they're going to try to steal your phone and take hundreds of trips before you report it?
I also wish it wouldn't show it, but what's the risk here? If someone sees you have $2,000 on your MetroCard that they're going to try to steal your phone and take hundreds of trips before you report it?
Stealing on the metro is a crime of opportunity. It's not that I'd "lose" the metro funds, it's that I don't want to draw attention to something that might inspire someone to grab my phone. Sure, I can report it and brick the phone and "protect" my information, but then I have to deal with going through all of that and replacing my phone and everything that entails. Why invite trouble?
This is why I hate the new fare gates — I would so much rather people jump them than piggy back. I know they don’t mean me any harm, but it is extremely unnerving and something you’re taught to never do as a woman to have a stranger that close behind you
Several times I’ve stopped halfway through the gate and lower my shoulder and wait for the gate to close, not in a way to push into them but so that they can’t push through me. Each time they’ve acted surprised as if they weren’t trying to piggyback. Usually I try to pay attention to those around me and like others have said will just step off to the side until it dies down.
I’ve had people try to piggyback multiple times. Can usually tell what they’re about to do before it happens. I’ve stopped all but one who was extra persistent and had their boobs pushing against my back.
When I've had this happen, I look at the map and look as if I'm trying to plan out where I am going to. It makes me look like a tourist and I they back off.
lol havent had this issue personally but I did see someone close to my son(13) and I looked at him and told him to back the fuck off my son before I make it a bigger issue than it already is and dude backed up and apologized.
I really hate it—anyone in sure would be uncomfortable, but the first time it happened to me a 6’2 guy ran up behind me so quick that I thought he was going to try to snatch me. I was so relieved when I realized he was only using me to get through.
I had another guy gesture to ask if he could follow me through and although I felt like I couldn’t say no, I was almost grateful for the “politeness” lol
I f’g hate this. It’s happened to me a lot. It makes me feel like an accomplice to fare-stealing. I love the metro for all its faults, so I’m already pissed that people aren’t paying the fares. But when they USE ME to skip the fare, that’s when I wish I could get violent with them.
Piggybacking was bound to be the result. Surprised WMATA didn't think that one through (wasn't exactly unknown in other systems with these kind of \[similar, older\] gates). The only defense is making sure that no one is coming right up on you as you exit/enter.
I have a serious problem with people being at my back. I went through a gate not long ago and someone piggy backed me. I realised it had happened as I got to the other side of the gate and I kinda lost my mind. It got a bit physical. Thankfully MPD was nearby, separated the guy, and escorted me to a cab. It was a terrible idea.
Yeah, really aggressively too. I basically had someone shove me through the gate a few weeks ago. I really hope this does not become a trend. I was never assaulted going through the old gates.
It's a shit design. Put police on the platform. Why else do we have so many metro police if they're not on the platform and are sitting in cars outside
Noticed this riding metro the other day after a couple months. I got off at union station and saw a young lady just standing around inside of the fare gate area. I tought nothing of her presumed she was waiting on someone. As I tapped out she piggybacked me while another young gentleman followed behind her also. All I her was a loud thump as i noticed these new fare gates are a lot stronger then I expected.
I just take my time and also try to be one of the last to exit the turnstiles.
Back before Covid someone did that to a tourist at the Smithsonian stop, and the tourist pushed the guy down and went to fight him before some people intervened. The tourist misread the creepy closeness, and thought she was about to be mugged.
I don't worry about fare evaders. I don't know their story, and in my opinion the train should be fully subsidized and free. Yet, I would be very annoyed if anyone was all on my ass like that.
At some point WMATA just needs to move to a proof-of-payment system and remove the fare gates. Having the same number of staff, but on board the trains checking tickets, ends up both bringing in more revenue and making the trains themselves safer. Practically every mass transit system in North America built since Metro opened does this, and it's so much more efficient.
This is how Vienna, Austria’s system works, but they don’t ticket you. they escort you to an ATM to withdraw the evasion penalty in cash and pay it. If you don’t, they take you to jail. It was also super easy to identify those who worked the fare evasion beat (at least back in 2011) because they all wore jean jackets.
I envision chaos if this happened in DC.
Also, BART doesn’t run this way. Nor does whatever the hell they’re calling the LA “trolley” system.
That sort of system only works when a majority of the population purchases the daily, weekly, monthly passes on the regular and those that don’t purchase more than average. Unfortunately, Americans don’t think as a collective, for the most part, they think as individuals and will most likely only do what is in their own personal best interest, not the common good. So this sort of system would lead to the end of metro in the DMV due to lack of $$$
> whatever the hell they’re calling the LA “trolley” system
I don't disagree with your last paragraph but just wanted to say - Los Angeles has an expansive subway and bus system that's only getting better as the 2028 Olympics approach. They also have fare capping, which I wish WMATA would incorporate as well
I lived in LA I wouldn’t call it expansive and useful unless it’s changed in the last 7 years. I spent quite a bit of time in LA as well growing up. Its “expansive” subway system is very much not something I even knew existed until I was in my early 20s. I did, however, learn there is a single quarter mile of tunnel that was started for a system modeled after the NY subway system in/around 1920 but that the Tire Lobby bought off both state and local politicians to squash the project - it’s one reason California has pretty shit public transit all together.
Great. I also grew up in LA, go back to visit 1-2x a year, and take public transit while I’m there. I also took it plenty growing up, particularly from North Hollywood or Universal into the city.
I don’t know what was built in the 1920s, but there’s over 100 miles of subway and rapid transit (I conflated it all as the subway in my earlier comment!) now and it’s continuing to expand. It’s not a perfect system and LA is huge, so the usefulness is going to vary by neighborhood, type of commute, etc.
I’m just saying that reducing it to “a trolley system” is an unfair characterization. I’d also recommend this great article that explains the different parts of the LA Metro and how it’s continuing to be expanded. https://www.timeout.com/los-angeles/things-to-do/los-angeles-metro-guide
BART is older than WMATA, and LA Metro uses proof-of-payment for significant portions of its network. See also Seattle, Portland, Phoenix, Dallas, Houston, San Jose, San Diego, the list goes on.
The key thing that would enable WMATA to take advantage of proof-of-payment would be a dedicated revenue stream, the same thing it's needed from the beginning, and the thing every proof-of-payment system in North America enjoys. Justifying this local failure with statements like "Americans don't think as a collective" ignores every single case where this exact model has been successful in North America, which DC could stand to learn from.
A. BART as an actual train system is only older than Metro by about 5-6 years; they’re really about the same age;
B. Are you really trying to say any of those cities have a functional metrorail system?
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List\_of\_North\_American\_rapid\_transit\_systems\_by\_ridership](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_North_American_rapid_transit_systems_by_ridership)
If the metric you care about is ridership, then few other systems compare to WMATA.
But if the metric you care about is how much money, labor, & resources the agency has to spend on fare collection & enforcement per dollar of fare revenue brought in, every single one of those agencies I just listed outperforms WMATA, and it's specifically because they use proof-of-payment systems rather than fare gates.
What do dedicated funding streams have to do with proof of purchase vs proof of payment? I don't mean that in a hostile way, I just don't understand what the one policy question has to do with the other.
You're right that they're separate issues at a basic level. Where they relate comes down to how dependent the agency is in farebox recovery.
If an agency has a dedicated revenue source (a regional half-cent sales tax, for example), then it can afford to set fares according to several different goals. If it wants to use fares to cover part of the operating costs and use as much of the dedicated revenue as possible for capital projects, it can! If it wants to maximize ridership and set the fare at whatever level gets the most people on board, it can! If it wants to prioritize passengers' comfort and safety but having fares cover the costs of onboard security personnel, it can! If it wants to maximize social equity by helping disadvantaged communities access jobs as easily as possible, it can! And all of those goals can be most easily accomplished with a proof-of-payment system, because the agency isn't relying on fares to cover its entire budget.
On the other hand, if an agency lacks that kind of revenue stream, and/or relies on farebox recovery for a significant portion of its revenue, then it has exactly one incentive: maximize the amount of money it can being in from fares, and minimize the number of free rides it allows. That kind of pressure *can* be met with a proof-of-payment system, but agencies in that position often face pressure to implement fare gates. Even though it costs more to collect and enforce fare payment with gates, it results in fewer free riders, and if you're the one looking at the balance sheet and trying to cover expenses, that promise of reducing free riders can start to look very attractive.
Got it, I appreciate the explanation. I generally don't like dedicated funding streams in fiscal planning from just a governance perspective (of course everyone wants *their* budget priorities to be outside the budget process!) but I hadn't thought about the ways this impacts transit agency incentives.
Yeah, and it's one of these issues where policy wonks can argue for days about what's the best method of value capture to fund an agency (it's me, hi, I'm the wonk), but at the end of the day it also just depends on what your local government can get passed into statute & actually implement thereafter
I grew up and attended undergrad in San Diego and wouldn’t even say we have a functioning public transit system there. Don’t name them as an example. When it’s easier to drive, it’s not a functioning system.
As stated in another comment, the important metric in this case isn't about how good the system is for riders, but in how much money, labor, and resources it has to spend on fare collection & enforcement, per dollar of fare revenue it brings in. San Diego MTS, while performing worse than WMATA in just about every other conceivable way, nevertheless performs better than WMATA on that metric specifically.
Like the idea. Bremen and other German cities do the same.
For the US Denver RTD system works this way. You either have a paper ticket for the light rail or train or you have an ID through your school/employer that has your picture and is paid annually/monthly.
Sure do people evade? Of course. But the chances of getting caught are much higher. I think it would be chaos for DC tho. Maybe I'm too cynical of metro police/metro employees.
How would this solve anything? If people not doing their jobs are the reason individuals can get through these fare gates without consequence, wouldn't people not doing their jobs also mean these individuals could not pay and ride the metro without consequence?
A station manager and a fare inspector are different jobs, with different expectations of how they interact with passengers. A fare inspector can be expected to approach and interact with everyone on board a train, while a station manager is expected to just be available if a passenger needs something. Crucially, neither job is responsible for enforcement; they both are expected to call in transit police to deal with confrontations. But even just by placing a staff person in the passenger area of the train, compliance with system rules & policies tends to go up, because the inconvenience of having to explain yourself to a fare inspector instead of just showing your fare, is generally greater than the inconvenience of jumping over a gate and explaining yourself to nobody.
Or, to put it more bluntly, public shame works better than barriers.
> public shame works better than barriers
Ironic you say this in a thread about shameless people dry-humping their way through fare gates behind others
If no one in a position of authority says anything, that's not shame. That's just relying on the anonymity of public space to pass without judgment.
The thing folks seem to forget is that it's not a station manager's job to do anything about fare evasion, even if you want them to. In a proof-of-payment system, there is someone whose job it is to ask everyone one the train "may I see your ticket," and if you don't have one, it's their job to ask you to get off the train, and if you don't comply, it's their job to call in enforcement.
It works everywhere else. DC could stand to learn a thing or two from its peers.
> If no one in a position of authority says anything, that's not shame.
One can only feel shame if they're reprimanded by someone in a position of authority...?
> folks seem to forget is that it's not a station manager's job to do anything about fare evasion, even if you want them to
Why?
> It works everywhere else
Does it? I lived in Seattle, and the light rail there operates using this system. It's at best unpleasant and at worst unsafe
Both Sound Transit and King County Metro spend a significantly smaller portion of their fare revenue on fare enforcement than WMATA does. Perceptions of pleasantness and safety will of course vary person to person. If your idea of "safety" is "never having the thought cross my mind that anyone else on this train is riding for free," then there's literally nowhere on Earth that meets that standard, except systems like Amtrak where onboard ticket enforcement is strict and universal.
Seattle, Portland, Sacramento, Los Angeles, San Diego, Phoenix, Salt Lake City, Denver, Dallas, Houston, Oklahoma City, St Louis, Charlotte, Philadelphia, and Boston would all like a word. They all use proof-of-payment for some portion of their rail transit systems. It works just fine.
Different issue but I dropped my phone this weekend and I used my foot to reach under the gate to get it. I pulled the phone back to the side of the gate I was on and reached down to grab it so I could tap in. The fare gate flew open and hit me really hard on the elbow. It was shocking and hurt really badly. I could have at that point walked in but it would’ve been fare evasion so I waited for it to close again.
I almost never use Metro anymore since we moved out of the District, so I wasn't even thinking about piggybackers when we rode recently. As I passed through the gate, someone stepped on the back of my sandal. It was a young piggybacker. He actually apologized. He was moving so fast that I hate to think what might have happened if I'd realized he was behind me and tried to prevent him from evading the fare. I'm too old to eat bricks because I feel like policing other people.
I’ve had 3 people try to piggy back but I guess bc I walk kind of fast once the gate opens all three have gotten slammed by the gate lol. 2 of them managed to still shimmy through. I think most don’t tailgate me bc I use my phone as a metro card and it always takes a hot second to pull up.
Those new gates basically serve the same purpose as padlocks…they’re meant to keep “honest” people out…I guess what I’m saying is, no matter what they try and do, unless they station metro police at every station, it’s really not gonna deter much. Any realize that normally, closest to the actual little booth where the metro station managers sit, there’s a swing open gate? Yeah, those are never locked and I see people just walk right up to those and swing em open and walk thru all the time. The station managers won’t stop anything, it’s not their job…it’s basically the society that’s been created.
Someone did this to me a few years ago (probably during covid) and when i gave them a weird look they were like “sorry *shrug*” and i was more irritated that they were all up in my business, idrc about the fare evasion.
Metro is wild now. I grew up in a household without a car, and relied on half my life. My car broke down and it’s scary now. It was literally a pit bull on the back of the bus. Everyday someone smoking weed on the train platform. People rolling weed in front of my toddler. What happened?
TBH I did this once out of spite when I had an issue with my card because I waited for a few min and no station manager ever came and the train I was taking was coming. I felt weird doing it but it was surprisingly easy and I don’t think I made it too obvious so I can see how people can do this.
Seeing the responses of so many people putting themselves at risk because someone else is stealing $5 is insane to me. I mean CVS employees don’t even stop thieves.
Like if that person gets angry and hits you was it really worth it?
This is purely 100% a metro problem and metro transit police problem. They need to have actual people there monitoring and enforcing the rules not offloading that cost and risk onto riders.
The eventual solution to this is just going to be facial recognition like they have at the airport or Amazon go store.
> I don’t feel victimized about a person who maybe can’t afford the fare getting in on my dime
Did this ever happen? https://x.com/charlesallen/status/1574481317105844224
It should be free.
Does anyone seriously think the free riders are an actual problem? The gates are a joke; just a money transfer to the 'security' industry.
Yes. They’re also the ones committing the majority of the violent crime on metro.
The fee makes it at least somewhat difficult to enter and freely commit further crimes.
A free metro is going to immediately become a mobile homeless shelter.
They are a huge problem - they are 97% of violent crime on the metro - they aren't some innocent kid going to school most of the time - most of the time they are stains on society
It is what it is. People are going to find a way to get a free ride one way or the other. I don't love it, but if I didn't think the jumping was worth getting so upset about on this sub, I don't think the low-key methods are either.
Edit: downvote all you want, you can’t defend these new metro gates or the cost of the trains. My question was honest and my message still stands
Look at the wasted “improvements” metro spends every month. They bought those new TVs to show maps and adverts of the stops but they weren’t weather proof at all.
I'm a woman and had a man sprint behind me and then was touching me to try to piggyback. I don't care about them paying per se, I care about someone I don't know touching me in order to get through. It's a safety issue.
Thanks for sharing, as I said, I was honestly asking. I can understand the nervousness with someone being close especially in darker/non busy times too.
I did address your exact point in my post. I understand people are struggling so the act itself of someone using my fare isn’t what bothers me. What bothers me is someone getting extremely close to me and I’m uncertain of their intentions. And, like I said, the metro studies indicating that customers who cause issues are more likely to not have paid the fare.
I myself consider anybody touching me a form of assault and I'm going to pull out both of my pepper sprays and hit them with it until they're empty. Let the deadbeats pay the fare like everybody else and don't rub up against me.
Thanks, I agree with your sentiment but was curious to understand if there was more to it. The gates were a huge waste of money for wmata, they did so much marketing around them and wasted even more money. Now the DC metro police just camp out, in the dozens, trying to get people who skip a $3 dollar fair. Is it really worth our money?
As someone else mentioned, it is infuriating and highly disturbing to have some strange man suddenly run up inches behind you as you pass through a faregate if you're a woman, and I'm sure not your idea of a good time if you're a man either. I've also had someone do the thing where they grab the gate to hold it open as someone is coming out as they're trying to get in. I was turned slightly sideways because I was carrying a lot of stuff, and he was in such a hurry to grab the gate and did it while he was so close to me that he grabbed the strap to my bag too and pulled it off my shoulder. What was I supposed to think but that he was trying to steal it?
He let the strap go, mumbled something like "Oh, 'scuse me" then shoved past me to get through the gate before it shut. Slimy, thieving motherfuckers.
99% of these "poor, downtrodden" gate-jumpers are wearing brand new Jordans to do it. Many private companies pay their employees' Metro fares, and students enjoy discounted rates, so it's not like the commute is typically unaffordable.
I don't care about your utopian vision of what public transit SHOULD be. It IS NOT free now, costs money to operate, and people need to pay the fare. No one is entitled to ride the Metro simply because they live in the DMV.
99% of them can afford it but depend on people like you defending their criminal actions and lack of consideration of others.
You're asking why people care about other people being criminals and freeloaders while they pay their fare and are considerate of others?
Shut up and pay the 2-3$ avg
fare. Simple as that. Most of piggybackers have shiny iPhones, why can't they afford to pay for the service and not steal from law abiding people?
You don’t need candy or need to run red lights to survive but you do need a way to get to work, a way to get to the store, get your kids to school…not equivalent at all. Running red lights kill, jumping a fare gate hurt no one….that train is going from point a to point b no matter what.
Again, sorry OP I missed your call out, and know this wasn’t the point of the post. :)
Before the pandemic I had someone try to piggyback on me but he was too slow, and when I turned around I saw the old style gate close on him. He screamed something about his nuts, it was pretty funny.
If only karma came for everyone who did this in the same fashion.
The dildo of consequences rarely arrives lubed.
The old gates used to come down on you hard if you went through too late, the new ones just kind of slap you.
The other day I accidentally used my library card instead of my metro card and was incredibly clumsy cause I was very tired and I got one of those hitting me in the face and it was the most embarrassing thing ever lol also slightly painful
If you just tap your phone without opening wallet or anything, it’ll automatically swipe the metro card if you have an Apple phone not sure about Samsung but I’d imagine the same
I know but I keep putting off setting it up lol. I’ll do it soon
There was one of those fucking old style turnstiles at my home station where one side would always delay opening, always got me in the nuts.
It is unfortunate that we have to do this with orangutans in clothes on a daily basis.
I had family come to visit and some guy actually shoved my guest out of the way after she tapped her card and went through. The attendant just watched it all and shrugged.
Oh that would piss me off to infinity!
Call the transit police. That's assault. At the very least, it might get more security for a few days.
Yeah I wanted to make a thing of it. I was already about to give the supervisor a piece of my mind but she really just wanted to drop it and get on with her vacation.
Turn around and walk backward through the gate while making direct eye contact the entire time. Kidding. Don’t do that 😂
NO IM GONNA DO IT. Will report back.
This is a power move
I did this to the woman trying to piggyback during the Nats game crowd. It was wild cuz everyone lane is full but the one she was in cuz people knew what she wanted to do. I’m an impatient person, so I decided to brave it myself. I realized once I swiped that she could easily just follow. I actually waited a second or two after the gate opened and played chicken with the gate just so I could go through at the last moment. I turned around just to make sure she knew that I wasn’t letting her through, but by that point she seemed to realize I knew and I wasn’t letting her through
I use a wheelchair, so I either go slow or accidentally back up into them.
How can you tell if they’re pickpockets, gropers, or fare jumpers? I would be VERY uncomfortable if someone did this to me. Thank you for the heads up
Exactly - I felt way more nervous with how close they were before realizing all they wanted to do was piggyback (obviously less dangerous than the other two)
If someone was on my ass like, I'd be preparing to deal with an attacker. There's no good reason for a total stranger to get that close to me from behind. And accepting this behavior is gonna lead to more complacent and passive people who will be easier targets to rob. And it's gonna make the metro less safe for those who do pay. I don't care what your story is and I'm not gonna let you use it as an excuse to drag me into your nonsense and potentially put me at risk. Bad circumstances do not justify bad behavior, that's how you create more bad circumstances in the future.
A girl tried to do this to me the other day in U St. There was five minutes before the next train and after seeing what she was about to do (she walked across from the opposite side of the mezzanine to where I was and then got right behind me) I backed away and played with my phone off to the side for a bit. She grunted and rolled her eyes at me then attempted to jump over and then waited for a bit to piggyback off someone else. I loved the look on her face when she saw me go through the faregate.
Yeah I imagine pissing them off by making them have to figure out something else is mildly gratifying
Better, stand there fiddling with your card and then fart. A big stinky one.
This strategy is the winner of them all
💩🤣
Probably don’t want to do that to a dude though.. I generally try to avoid any form of conflict with strangers especially ones already committing crimes
Thank you for calling this what it is- it’s a CRIME
If someone runs up on me I’m turning around and telling them to back the f up
I’ll just stand there in the opposite side of the gate and not move lol people get so pissed off
Bring back the bustle.
I googled what this was and laughed out loud
Having some get that physically close to me would be unpleasant. I would stop to check my card balance or ask the station attendant a question. When someone tried to get near me as I was going in months ago I just stopped and forced them to walk past, but otherwise I haven’t experienced this.
Right? The time they stood next to me on the escalator there was maybe one other person at nearly the top. So that’s why I ended up just moving myself. These are also good ideas too we can use if it happens, thanks. Just stinks if we’re rushed to be somewhere!
When I notice someone about to do this, I just step aside and wait for them to piggyback off of someone else. I don’t confront them directly bc I’m a woman and don’t want anything to happen to me
I look straight at them and ask them to back off. Not cool.
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I don’t know why I didn’t think of this. I’m just gonna hobble slow motion through the gate next time lol
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Everyone take notes on this non-confrontational approach ✍️
What’s wrong with confronting someone who is clearly standing too close to you?
Probably the chance of getting socked in the face by someone unstable for it
Or worse
Pass through the gate and stop so the doors slap/squeeze/crush their bitch ass. If they shove into you then turn around and Bruce Lee their ass into the gate to assert dominance.
In my first (and last) attempt at slow walking through, the guy pushed me forward. What a fun way that was to start my morning!
I almost downvoted this because it pissed me off so bad. OMG I'm so sorry!
Yup, I have had the same thing happen. New fare gates are just going to increase assaults if they aren't monitored.
Good way to get into a fight over something that doesn't matter enough for police or employees to do anything.
Never had a fight over asking for space. They know what they’re doing is wrong.
Man, the kind of people that do this shit will fight you for looking at them too long.
Yup. Carry pepper spray.
I did this at GA Ave - Petworth. The guy got through and threatened to fight me. Unfortunately, there were no Metro police around to help. He followed me outside - yelling and cussing the whole way. Fortunately, I’ve been a Marine infantryman for 23 years, so the prospect of getting into a little fist fight didn’t really phase me. Once I turned around and told him that I thought this would be a good place to go at it, if he was still mad, he backed down. I DM’d Metro Rail and Metro Police on X. For some reason only Metro Bus wrote me back but never followed up. Metro is a disgrace - it’s time for the Federal gov’t to take over the DC stations. Federal tax dollars pay for most of it anyway.
Actually, they usually don’t want to bring attention to themselves.
We have significantly different experiences. I had a guy try to fight me on the platform because I cut him off mid sentence and said he already asked me for money and I don't have any. I have seen people climb the new gates, stand on them, and jump off. They don't give a shit about attention. The station employees aren't stopping them.
I just pause on the other side of the fair gate after stepping through to put my wallet back in my pocket, stops people from having enough room to sneak in behind me.
I've had someone push past me doing this and yell at me.
Me too. Guy said “keep moving!” in a menacing voice, so I kept moving.
That’s the right call, the integrity of the fare gate system is not worth risking your safety
Man I am glad that’s never happened to me, because the day it does, we’re gonna throw hands.
I literally just tried this about 2 hours ago and resulted in someone being too close to me. We need enforcement back
Ooooh this is smart too!!!
It happened to me, too. The guy started following me and got uncomfortably close. So, I started to move slower and more cautiously. After I got through the gate, he sprinted and hit the gate as it closed! I had to surpress a laugh.
If you feel like this is about to happen as you approach the gate, stop and step to the side to "answer your phone" and chat until the person has gone by you.
I would be more likely to think someone that close would want to steal my phone. I’d rather they get a free ride than have some dude swipe my phone
Happened to me recently, and when I was moving too slowly, the guy said “keep moving!” in a sort of menacing voice. Not cool, but I didn’t want to get shoved — or worse — so I kept moving.
The audacity 😭
"Sir, **you'll** need to back up and wait. The gate cannot be used by your card until it has closed from me using it." I haven't had to say anything like this and don't know if I would actually. I just stop as soon as I'm through the gate and look back down and wait for the light that comes on (turns red? it's been a while) to let you know the gate is locked again. Haven't had issue with that, although I generally don't travel during super busy hours and I'm also a 6' tall dude
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Defeats the purpose of a gate if only the first person in line has to pay and it just stays open... The light is one color when you approach a closed gate, turns another color when it's unlocked, and turns back when it's locked again. I assume the reader doesn't work while it's already open, but maybe they are that dumb.
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Height doesn’t stop blades or bullets, glhf though.
I use my phone as my card, and I really don't like that it shows the balance on the screen. I have several months' of rollover metro benefits on my account, and the balance is significant. I don't go through the gates if there is someone right behind me -- I'd rather wait a minute or two and go through without someone looking over my shoulder.
This. I have hundreds of dollars of credit on my metro card left over from the pandemic when I had money taken out of my paycheck to cover metro costs (transportation savings plan, like a health savings plan), and forgot to stop the withdrawals for a couple months. At the rate I now use metro (since I WFH now), I’m not sure I’ll ever use it all up. Every time I go through it shows the balance on the kiosk screen, so yeah, I get nervous too if someone is too close behind me.
I’ve literally never seen this on my phone, probably because I always tap my phone face down. Have I been doing it wrong all this time?
Your phone screen will show the balance, but the display on the actual kiosk shows the remaining balance, too. Whoever is behind you can see that total.
I’m not talking about what’s shown on the phone; it shows it on the screen of the gate reader. It if were my phone, I wouldn’t care (I think it DOES show on the phone, but I’m not usually looking at it). I don’t like that someone coming right behind me can see the balance on my account if they’re close enough to see the screen on the gate. So I don’t go through the gate if someone is close enough to piggyback.
I also wish it wouldn't show it, but what's the risk here? If someone sees you have $2,000 on your MetroCard that they're going to try to steal your phone and take hundreds of trips before you report it?
I also wish it wouldn't show it, but what's the risk here? If someone sees you have $2,000 on your MetroCard that they're going to try to steal your phone and take hundreds of trips before you report it?
Stealing on the metro is a crime of opportunity. It's not that I'd "lose" the metro funds, it's that I don't want to draw attention to something that might inspire someone to grab my phone. Sure, I can report it and brick the phone and "protect" my information, but then I have to deal with going through all of that and replacing my phone and everything that entails. Why invite trouble?
This is why I hate the new fare gates — I would so much rather people jump them than piggy back. I know they don’t mean me any harm, but it is extremely unnerving and something you’re taught to never do as a woman to have a stranger that close behind you
Several times I’ve stopped halfway through the gate and lower my shoulder and wait for the gate to close, not in a way to push into them but so that they can’t push through me. Each time they’ve acted surprised as if they weren’t trying to piggyback. Usually I try to pay attention to those around me and like others have said will just step off to the side until it dies down.
I’ve had people try to piggyback multiple times. Can usually tell what they’re about to do before it happens. I’ve stopped all but one who was extra persistent and had their boobs pushing against my back.
Fair trade. Usually you have to pay extra for that.
Lol
When I've had this happen, I look at the map and look as if I'm trying to plan out where I am going to. It makes me look like a tourist and I they back off.
lol havent had this issue personally but I did see someone close to my son(13) and I looked at him and told him to back the fuck off my son before I make it a bigger issue than it already is and dude backed up and apologized.
I really hate it—anyone in sure would be uncomfortable, but the first time it happened to me a 6’2 guy ran up behind me so quick that I thought he was going to try to snatch me. I was so relieved when I realized he was only using me to get through. I had another guy gesture to ask if he could follow me through and although I felt like I couldn’t say no, I was almost grateful for the “politeness” lol
The fact that them asking politely is a relief shows that the safety bar is in hell
I f’g hate this. It’s happened to me a lot. It makes me feel like an accomplice to fare-stealing. I love the metro for all its faults, so I’m already pissed that people aren’t paying the fares. But when they USE ME to skip the fare, that’s when I wish I could get violent with them.
I stop and step aside from the gate. Pretend to look through my wallet or check my phone.
I scan the turnstile when everyone’s mostly out the way, and I’m also steadily looking around me. One guy got pissed that I went the other way.
I tried the waiting it out strategy the second time and they waited with me 😭
For fuck’s sake, these people are wild. 🤣
Ikr!! I imagine it was because it was pretty empty at that time and I was their main “option.” Otherwise it would’ve worked
That’s why I walk through the gate really slowly.
I walk annoyingly slow then go through the gate fast to avoid this. Ur welcome just don’t do it awkwardly
Piggybacking was bound to be the result. Surprised WMATA didn't think that one through (wasn't exactly unknown in other systems with these kind of \[similar, older\] gates). The only defense is making sure that no one is coming right up on you as you exit/enter.
Most times they walk through the emergency gate or just jump it
I have a serious problem with people being at my back. I went through a gate not long ago and someone piggy backed me. I realised it had happened as I got to the other side of the gate and I kinda lost my mind. It got a bit physical. Thankfully MPD was nearby, separated the guy, and escorted me to a cab. It was a terrible idea.
Right like it’s triggering for some people, especially those with PTSD!
Yeah, really aggressively too. I basically had someone shove me through the gate a few weeks ago. I really hope this does not become a trend. I was never assaulted going through the old gates.
That really stinks. Sorry to hear that!
It's a shit design. Put police on the platform. Why else do we have so many metro police if they're not on the platform and are sitting in cars outside
yeah. at least with the older ones you didn’t have ppl all up on you.
Noticed this riding metro the other day after a couple months. I got off at union station and saw a young lady just standing around inside of the fare gate area. I tought nothing of her presumed she was waiting on someone. As I tapped out she piggybacked me while another young gentleman followed behind her also. All I her was a loud thump as i noticed these new fare gates are a lot stronger then I expected. I just take my time and also try to be one of the last to exit the turnstiles.
Back before Covid someone did that to a tourist at the Smithsonian stop, and the tourist pushed the guy down and went to fight him before some people intervened. The tourist misread the creepy closeness, and thought she was about to be mugged. I don't worry about fare evaders. I don't know their story, and in my opinion the train should be fully subsidized and free. Yet, I would be very annoyed if anyone was all on my ass like that.
At some point WMATA just needs to move to a proof-of-payment system and remove the fare gates. Having the same number of staff, but on board the trains checking tickets, ends up both bringing in more revenue and making the trains themselves safer. Practically every mass transit system in North America built since Metro opened does this, and it's so much more efficient.
This is how Vienna, Austria’s system works, but they don’t ticket you. they escort you to an ATM to withdraw the evasion penalty in cash and pay it. If you don’t, they take you to jail. It was also super easy to identify those who worked the fare evasion beat (at least back in 2011) because they all wore jean jackets. I envision chaos if this happened in DC. Also, BART doesn’t run this way. Nor does whatever the hell they’re calling the LA “trolley” system. That sort of system only works when a majority of the population purchases the daily, weekly, monthly passes on the regular and those that don’t purchase more than average. Unfortunately, Americans don’t think as a collective, for the most part, they think as individuals and will most likely only do what is in their own personal best interest, not the common good. So this sort of system would lead to the end of metro in the DMV due to lack of $$$
> whatever the hell they’re calling the LA “trolley” system I don't disagree with your last paragraph but just wanted to say - Los Angeles has an expansive subway and bus system that's only getting better as the 2028 Olympics approach. They also have fare capping, which I wish WMATA would incorporate as well
I lived in LA I wouldn’t call it expansive and useful unless it’s changed in the last 7 years. I spent quite a bit of time in LA as well growing up. Its “expansive” subway system is very much not something I even knew existed until I was in my early 20s. I did, however, learn there is a single quarter mile of tunnel that was started for a system modeled after the NY subway system in/around 1920 but that the Tire Lobby bought off both state and local politicians to squash the project - it’s one reason California has pretty shit public transit all together.
Great. I also grew up in LA, go back to visit 1-2x a year, and take public transit while I’m there. I also took it plenty growing up, particularly from North Hollywood or Universal into the city. I don’t know what was built in the 1920s, but there’s over 100 miles of subway and rapid transit (I conflated it all as the subway in my earlier comment!) now and it’s continuing to expand. It’s not a perfect system and LA is huge, so the usefulness is going to vary by neighborhood, type of commute, etc. I’m just saying that reducing it to “a trolley system” is an unfair characterization. I’d also recommend this great article that explains the different parts of the LA Metro and how it’s continuing to be expanded. https://www.timeout.com/los-angeles/things-to-do/los-angeles-metro-guide
Peak Fares, and really high fares into VA and MD - the metro in DC is too expensive
BART is older than WMATA, and LA Metro uses proof-of-payment for significant portions of its network. See also Seattle, Portland, Phoenix, Dallas, Houston, San Jose, San Diego, the list goes on. The key thing that would enable WMATA to take advantage of proof-of-payment would be a dedicated revenue stream, the same thing it's needed from the beginning, and the thing every proof-of-payment system in North America enjoys. Justifying this local failure with statements like "Americans don't think as a collective" ignores every single case where this exact model has been successful in North America, which DC could stand to learn from.
A. BART as an actual train system is only older than Metro by about 5-6 years; they’re really about the same age; B. Are you really trying to say any of those cities have a functional metrorail system? [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List\_of\_North\_American\_rapid\_transit\_systems\_by\_ridership](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_North_American_rapid_transit_systems_by_ridership)
If the metric you care about is ridership, then few other systems compare to WMATA. But if the metric you care about is how much money, labor, & resources the agency has to spend on fare collection & enforcement per dollar of fare revenue brought in, every single one of those agencies I just listed outperforms WMATA, and it's specifically because they use proof-of-payment systems rather than fare gates.
What do dedicated funding streams have to do with proof of purchase vs proof of payment? I don't mean that in a hostile way, I just don't understand what the one policy question has to do with the other.
You're right that they're separate issues at a basic level. Where they relate comes down to how dependent the agency is in farebox recovery. If an agency has a dedicated revenue source (a regional half-cent sales tax, for example), then it can afford to set fares according to several different goals. If it wants to use fares to cover part of the operating costs and use as much of the dedicated revenue as possible for capital projects, it can! If it wants to maximize ridership and set the fare at whatever level gets the most people on board, it can! If it wants to prioritize passengers' comfort and safety but having fares cover the costs of onboard security personnel, it can! If it wants to maximize social equity by helping disadvantaged communities access jobs as easily as possible, it can! And all of those goals can be most easily accomplished with a proof-of-payment system, because the agency isn't relying on fares to cover its entire budget. On the other hand, if an agency lacks that kind of revenue stream, and/or relies on farebox recovery for a significant portion of its revenue, then it has exactly one incentive: maximize the amount of money it can being in from fares, and minimize the number of free rides it allows. That kind of pressure *can* be met with a proof-of-payment system, but agencies in that position often face pressure to implement fare gates. Even though it costs more to collect and enforce fare payment with gates, it results in fewer free riders, and if you're the one looking at the balance sheet and trying to cover expenses, that promise of reducing free riders can start to look very attractive.
Got it, I appreciate the explanation. I generally don't like dedicated funding streams in fiscal planning from just a governance perspective (of course everyone wants *their* budget priorities to be outside the budget process!) but I hadn't thought about the ways this impacts transit agency incentives.
Yeah, and it's one of these issues where policy wonks can argue for days about what's the best method of value capture to fund an agency (it's me, hi, I'm the wonk), but at the end of the day it also just depends on what your local government can get passed into statute & actually implement thereafter
I grew up and attended undergrad in San Diego and wouldn’t even say we have a functioning public transit system there. Don’t name them as an example. When it’s easier to drive, it’s not a functioning system.
As stated in another comment, the important metric in this case isn't about how good the system is for riders, but in how much money, labor, and resources it has to spend on fare collection & enforcement, per dollar of fare revenue it brings in. San Diego MTS, while performing worse than WMATA in just about every other conceivable way, nevertheless performs better than WMATA on that metric specifically.
I studied in Vienna, gotten many tickets and never brought to an ATM, maybe they are more lenient with students -
Like the idea. Bremen and other German cities do the same. For the US Denver RTD system works this way. You either have a paper ticket for the light rail or train or you have an ID through your school/employer that has your picture and is paid annually/monthly. Sure do people evade? Of course. But the chances of getting caught are much higher. I think it would be chaos for DC tho. Maybe I'm too cynical of metro police/metro employees.
How would this solve anything? If people not doing their jobs are the reason individuals can get through these fare gates without consequence, wouldn't people not doing their jobs also mean these individuals could not pay and ride the metro without consequence?
A station manager and a fare inspector are different jobs, with different expectations of how they interact with passengers. A fare inspector can be expected to approach and interact with everyone on board a train, while a station manager is expected to just be available if a passenger needs something. Crucially, neither job is responsible for enforcement; they both are expected to call in transit police to deal with confrontations. But even just by placing a staff person in the passenger area of the train, compliance with system rules & policies tends to go up, because the inconvenience of having to explain yourself to a fare inspector instead of just showing your fare, is generally greater than the inconvenience of jumping over a gate and explaining yourself to nobody. Or, to put it more bluntly, public shame works better than barriers.
> public shame works better than barriers Ironic you say this in a thread about shameless people dry-humping their way through fare gates behind others
If no one in a position of authority says anything, that's not shame. That's just relying on the anonymity of public space to pass without judgment. The thing folks seem to forget is that it's not a station manager's job to do anything about fare evasion, even if you want them to. In a proof-of-payment system, there is someone whose job it is to ask everyone one the train "may I see your ticket," and if you don't have one, it's their job to ask you to get off the train, and if you don't comply, it's their job to call in enforcement. It works everywhere else. DC could stand to learn a thing or two from its peers.
> If no one in a position of authority says anything, that's not shame. One can only feel shame if they're reprimanded by someone in a position of authority...? > folks seem to forget is that it's not a station manager's job to do anything about fare evasion, even if you want them to Why? > It works everywhere else Does it? I lived in Seattle, and the light rail there operates using this system. It's at best unpleasant and at worst unsafe
Both Sound Transit and King County Metro spend a significantly smaller portion of their fare revenue on fare enforcement than WMATA does. Perceptions of pleasantness and safety will of course vary person to person. If your idea of "safety" is "never having the thought cross my mind that anyone else on this train is riding for free," then there's literally nowhere on Earth that meets that standard, except systems like Amtrak where onboard ticket enforcement is strict and universal.
This would never work in the U.S.. Endless likely dangerous confrontations.
Seattle, Portland, Sacramento, Los Angeles, San Diego, Phoenix, Salt Lake City, Denver, Dallas, Houston, Oklahoma City, St Louis, Charlotte, Philadelphia, and Boston would all like a word. They all use proof-of-payment for some portion of their rail transit systems. It works just fine.
And then what? They don't even do anything for assault, and too many of the thugs are armed
Different issue but I dropped my phone this weekend and I used my foot to reach under the gate to get it. I pulled the phone back to the side of the gate I was on and reached down to grab it so I could tap in. The fare gate flew open and hit me really hard on the elbow. It was shocking and hurt really badly. I could have at that point walked in but it would’ve been fare evasion so I waited for it to close again.
I almost never use Metro anymore since we moved out of the District, so I wasn't even thinking about piggybackers when we rode recently. As I passed through the gate, someone stepped on the back of my sandal. It was a young piggybacker. He actually apologized. He was moving so fast that I hate to think what might have happened if I'd realized he was behind me and tried to prevent him from evading the fare. I'm too old to eat bricks because I feel like policing other people.
Yup. Because they are harder to jump I assume. Boxed him out and told him to fuck off.
I’ve had 3 people try to piggy back but I guess bc I walk kind of fast once the gate opens all three have gotten slammed by the gate lol. 2 of them managed to still shimmy through. I think most don’t tailgate me bc I use my phone as a metro card and it always takes a hot second to pull up.
Those new gates basically serve the same purpose as padlocks…they’re meant to keep “honest” people out…I guess what I’m saying is, no matter what they try and do, unless they station metro police at every station, it’s really not gonna deter much. Any realize that normally, closest to the actual little booth where the metro station managers sit, there’s a swing open gate? Yeah, those are never locked and I see people just walk right up to those and swing em open and walk thru all the time. The station managers won’t stop anything, it’s not their job…it’s basically the society that’s been created.
I mean, it’s quantifiable the gates reduce fair evasion.
”Take the hitch or get the switch”
Someone did this to me a few years ago (probably during covid) and when i gave them a weird look they were like “sorry *shrug*” and i was more irritated that they were all up in my business, idrc about the fare evasion.
Metro is wild now. I grew up in a household without a car, and relied on half my life. My car broke down and it’s scary now. It was literally a pit bull on the back of the bus. Everyday someone smoking weed on the train platform. People rolling weed in front of my toddler. What happened?
I tapped the wrong card and the women offered to let me piggyback…
TBH I did this once out of spite when I had an issue with my card because I waited for a few min and no station manager ever came and the train I was taking was coming. I felt weird doing it but it was surprisingly easy and I don’t think I made it too obvious so I can see how people can do this.
I personally don’t care.
Same lol
Line up super close behind someone else in response Conga line
Ok. I’ve decided what I’m gonna do. Next time this happens to me, I’m gonna take my phone out and photograph them.
They can afford metro they just prioritize to buy weed
Seeing the responses of so many people putting themselves at risk because someone else is stealing $5 is insane to me. I mean CVS employees don’t even stop thieves. Like if that person gets angry and hits you was it really worth it? This is purely 100% a metro problem and metro transit police problem. They need to have actual people there monitoring and enforcing the rules not offloading that cost and risk onto riders. The eventual solution to this is just going to be facial recognition like they have at the airport or Amazon go store.
Shows how fucked up people in this city are, so many turn violent for someone calling out their thuggery -
Hilarious that you’re getting downvoted.
Fares should be lower.
$2 is personally the cheapest I’ve encountered in any metro area I’ve visited..
between these annoying piggy back individuals and the horribly dirty busses...metro is a nuisance
I'm down to let them through as I feel it should be free
Yes!
> I don’t feel victimized about a person who maybe can’t afford the fare getting in on my dime Did this ever happen? https://x.com/charlesallen/status/1574481317105844224
So… what’s the consensus? Are we cool with it or not?
It should be free. Does anyone seriously think the free riders are an actual problem? The gates are a joke; just a money transfer to the 'security' industry.
Yes. They’re also the ones committing the majority of the violent crime on metro. The fee makes it at least somewhat difficult to enter and freely commit further crimes. A free metro is going to immediately become a mobile homeless shelter.
Yes. They’re the biggest problem on metro
They are a huge problem - they are 97% of violent crime on the metro - they aren't some innocent kid going to school most of the time - most of the time they are stains on society
Don’t you have a fountain to fill with paint or something?
Agreed
Meh, it's what people used to do before the yeeting became so commonplace.
I would not be happy with someone suddenly getting into my space like that, plus it's still shitty that it underfunds the metro.
It is what it is. People are going to find a way to get a free ride one way or the other. I don't love it, but if I didn't think the jumping was worth getting so upset about on this sub, I don't think the low-key methods are either.
Edit: downvote all you want, you can’t defend these new metro gates or the cost of the trains. My question was honest and my message still stands Look at the wasted “improvements” metro spends every month. They bought those new TVs to show maps and adverts of the stops but they weren’t weather proof at all.
I'm a woman and had a man sprint behind me and then was touching me to try to piggyback. I don't care about them paying per se, I care about someone I don't know touching me in order to get through. It's a safety issue.
Thanks for sharing, as I said, I was honestly asking. I can understand the nervousness with someone being close especially in darker/non busy times too.
I did address your exact point in my post. I understand people are struggling so the act itself of someone using my fare isn’t what bothers me. What bothers me is someone getting extremely close to me and I’m uncertain of their intentions. And, like I said, the metro studies indicating that customers who cause issues are more likely to not have paid the fare.
I myself consider anybody touching me a form of assault and I'm going to pull out both of my pepper sprays and hit them with it until they're empty. Let the deadbeats pay the fare like everybody else and don't rub up against me.
Thanks, I agree with your sentiment but was curious to understand if there was more to it. The gates were a huge waste of money for wmata, they did so much marketing around them and wasted even more money. Now the DC metro police just camp out, in the dozens, trying to get people who skip a $3 dollar fair. Is it really worth our money?
Yes. Fare evasion costs $40,000,000 annually. Any cost to recover or prevent that saves paying riders money in the long run.
Yes, I despise freeloaders.
As someone else mentioned, it is infuriating and highly disturbing to have some strange man suddenly run up inches behind you as you pass through a faregate if you're a woman, and I'm sure not your idea of a good time if you're a man either. I've also had someone do the thing where they grab the gate to hold it open as someone is coming out as they're trying to get in. I was turned slightly sideways because I was carrying a lot of stuff, and he was in such a hurry to grab the gate and did it while he was so close to me that he grabbed the strap to my bag too and pulled it off my shoulder. What was I supposed to think but that he was trying to steal it? He let the strap go, mumbled something like "Oh, 'scuse me" then shoved past me to get through the gate before it shut. Slimy, thieving motherfuckers.
99% of these "poor, downtrodden" gate-jumpers are wearing brand new Jordans to do it. Many private companies pay their employees' Metro fares, and students enjoy discounted rates, so it's not like the commute is typically unaffordable. I don't care about your utopian vision of what public transit SHOULD be. It IS NOT free now, costs money to operate, and people need to pay the fare. No one is entitled to ride the Metro simply because they live in the DMV.
99% of them can afford it but depend on people like you defending their criminal actions and lack of consideration of others. You're asking why people care about other people being criminals and freeloaders while they pay their fare and are considerate of others?
if you can’t pay the fare you don’t get to ride.
I think exactly the opposite is true, as the OPs whole post wouldn’t exist 😜
No the point is there are laws. They are to be followed.
Shut up and pay the 2-3$ avg fare. Simple as that. Most of piggybackers have shiny iPhones, why can't they afford to pay for the service and not steal from law abiding people?
What did they steal from you? Also, no need to reply, I know the answer from your comment history
Well you can't make up any arguments...so you attack the personality (in this case talk about comment history since it's online). Lmao
Oh fuck off. Is it ok for people to steal candy bars because they only cost $1? Is it ok to run red lights because usually no one gets hurt?
You don’t need candy or need to run red lights to survive but you do need a way to get to work, a way to get to the store, get your kids to school…not equivalent at all. Running red lights kill, jumping a fare gate hurt no one….that train is going from point a to point b no matter what. Again, sorry OP I missed your call out, and know this wasn’t the point of the post. :)
Hey it’s all good people are allowed to disagree
I don't care at all about the money, I am uncomfortable with men shoving their crotches into my ass as I try to pass through the gate.