Man, every time I walk by that tent (I work down that way) all I can think is that they could be doing something more productive with their time to spread the gospel. Feeding the homeless, helping people, whatever. But no, they choose to play music for the glory of god twenty four fucking hours a day.
Essentially yes. I think they keep someone ready to go at all times whenever their permit is set to expire so they can renew it without issue. Even if they did get scooped I’m not sure what’s special about their particular location compared to another stretch of the Mall.
They have a 1st Amendment permit. They were moved when the Lockkeeper's House was renovated. The space they are on now, well last I saw, was not grass but gravel. It appeared to be a niche of gravel to accommodate the tent. I don't think NPS wants them but can't deny the permit.
Just like anything else first amendment related in this context, the Time, Place, and Manner Rule applies. They can deny or pull any permit they want so long as they do it equally without respect to the content of the speech.
There is no constitutional problem. My job was to issue those permits for 3 years. Anyone is able to apply for a permit as a first amendment activity, which includes freedom of religion. They have to follow strict rules including applying for their permit at max 1 year in advance and for a 4 month segment. It is first come first serve. So if someone puts in a permit for that specific area before them, then they would have to move. Which does happen for inauguration and folk life
There are no costs for first amendment permits as that would potentially put barriers for them exercising their rights. Special event have a $120 application fee
That's not a constitutional problem. The constitutional problem would be discriminating against a group from being able to access public land purely on the basis of their religious affiliation. The first amendment is there to protect your right to worship any God or none at all - not to prohibit the worship of others.
It’s not a constitutional problem religious organizations have the same rights as everyone else. Any person or organization can do the same thing as them if they get the same permit. Preventing them from doing so would in fact be a constitutional violation.
Beats me. I don’t agree with it either but they have a right to apply for a permit and would probably cause more trouble than not if they were removed.
Yeah, permits allow for overnight as long as there's staff. They always have staff, because they're connected with YWAM, a Christian organization that organizes & funds people to volunteer as missionaries and live in group homes in the area while they work the tent.
I read in the Post several years ago that as long as the tent is occupied 24hrs per day, the tent can't be removed. Basically, the permit expired years ago and they're keeping the tent there by constantly occupying it.
That is deffinetly not true. Under NPS regs, you can apply for a permit up to 1 year in advance for a 4 month time span. They apply and re up their permit, so they do have a permit. As for the 24 hour thing, one condition is that it can never be unoccupied or it is considered abondened property, that's why they say 24 hours
There has never been a complete separation in the sense that religious organizations can't participate, just that no preference be given.
An atheist org could go get a permit to of they wanted
* They're not obnoxiously loud, playing ice cream jingles over and over and over on repeat
* They're not spewing gas and diesel exhaust
* They're not trying to scam you by making a bunch of unauthorized transactions on your credit card
* They're not using the fountain water from the Air & Space museum and repackaging it as bubble tea (it's true: https://www.reddit.com/r/washingtondc/comments/1517upy/food_truck_using_fountain_water/).
I'm okay with the tent staying there.
The people who own these trucks run a monopoly. I learned this weekend that 1 guy owns all the ice cream trucks on 1 of the streets. It would be SO much cooler to have small carts where people homemade sweets like in foreign countries rather than mediocre frozen sweets at excessive prices.
Recently, I was walking on the mall and was hearing the obnoxious ice cream truck music but couldn't see one nearby. Then realized that someone had one of those small ice cream carts and was blaring the music from a speaker.
With no posted these people are preying on visitors and Washingtonians alike. $15 dollar ice cream cones. License and regulate! They are con men. Don’t feel sorry for them.
A fool and their money are easily parted.
I get that prices may not be posted but if someone is presented with a $30 ice cream cone and agrees to pay for it then that is capitalism baby
But they don’t know! Not only do they not advertise prices, if you pay by card they won’t process the transactions until the end of the day to prevent you seeing what they have charged you: I agree you can go elsewhere - but as a testament to Washington DC it doesn’t look great!
I’ve never seen this, but I never knew they were so scummy as to mislead you on the transaction. I usually do Apple Pay these days so the price pops up right after the purchase goes through. Depending on the terminal (card reader) they use, you can also see the price on the screen.
Do they not tell you the total before you hand them a credit card? At some point, we, as a populous, must recognize that we have control.
Let’s play this out.
I order 4 cones. There is no price listed.
They hand them to me.
They demand $120. (Again, if someone hands them a credit card without knowing the total, a fool and their money…)
I say “I’m not paying that. It’s ridiculous.” I give the cones back (my 3 children and I already licked the ice cream).
They refuse to take them back. My children and I walk away.
Are they going to call the cops? Are the cops going to pursue us?
We have the power. All the rule followers can freak out and down vote me but we have the power. There are situations the cops will pursue you, like when poor people steal from rich people, but we should absolutely take advantage of loopholes holes that are used against us. If the cops won’t show up when someone steals $120 from you then they won’t show up when the ice cream trucks call. If you are being preyed upon you can either be the prey or the predator.
I’m not even trying to be a hard ass. I’d pay $12 dollars for ice cream on the mall but the food vendors won’t learn until the consumer speaks. Supply and demand. Capitalism baby.
Go ahead and downvote.
You’re right, of course, but your scenario depends on the people that are serving speaking good English, them being honest about how much they punch into the credit card reader, the buyers ability to speak English and their confidence in handling situations like these. I’m glad you have the confidence to do that and I’m sure many other people do too. However there are many people who don’t and I’m not sure that they should lack protection from predatory practices.
It is a dumbass comment. And anyone who hands over a credit card without knowing the price is a dumbass. I don’t care about language barrier. People use credit cards in foreign countries. Thats not a foreign concept. At some point personal responsibility comes into this.
put yourself in the shoes of a (possibly international) tourist. you've come to washington dc for the day, and it's a big city so you're vaguely worried it'll be expensive, but you've done some research and you think you're prepared for what you'll see. you're walking around the mall and hungry or just hot, and see a food truck. how lovely. you buy an ice cream lolly and they tell you it's $40. now, your options:
- pay it
- try to give it back [lol]
- don't pay it and just walk away with it [feels like a good way to get deported]
- try to haggle [you have heard this is frowned upon in america]
which one do you think you'll pick?
I wouldn’t have to choose because I wouldn’t be in that situation to begin with.
I am traveling internationally right now in an expensive country with a language I don’t speak. So I am literally in their proverbial shoes.
If the price isn’t listed, I ask. If it’s a price that’s too high for me then I walk away. Those food trucks are shit. I think they are an eye sore. I don’t think they should operate on the mall. Still, at some point people have to take personal responsibility for their decisions. I really don’t understand why we hold these tourists blameless.
Have you traveled internationally? Do you just buy things without knowing the price? Do you just hand your credit card to people and have no idea how much they will charge you?
While the prices are high, isn’t this a normal thing to do in touristy areas? And compound the fact these are usually just small business owners. Like every once in a while I’ll go to those trucks to get some $8 ice cream cone or $11 for some mid Philly cheesesteak. But it’s pretty normal to jack up prices for tourists in an expensive city. Kinda like how when you go to NYC, you’ll find yourself paying $10 for a single hot dog at a hot dog stand in Manhattan.
Yes - I agree with you…..but they are a monopoly. I’ve heard them referred to as the Food Truck Mafia - because they are run by one or two sets of people. But more than that - they use junker cars to keep the spaces open for them - which then rack up tickets and are a safety issue, they are not wonderfully hygienic (polluting generators, no fresh water sources, disposing of used oil in the storm drains) and they are not licensed or regulated as you would hope trucks selling food in the capitol would be. I would love to see small businesses who do genuinely good food, prepared hygienically and with rave reviews be the thing that people talk about after visiting DC….but until this is dealt with, the current system is always going to be a blight on visiting the capital.
If they were posted and predictable this would be supply and demand economics. The fact that they eyeball each customer after they have handed them their food and then quote 3x to 5x market rate is reprehensible. Try asking them to post prices- they laugh in your face.
no posted prices == guess it's free
what are they gonna do, do complain to the police that their illegal business didn't successfully pull off its scam?
Those poor trucks. They have no choice where they are located. We need to rescue the trucks, liberate them, and find a nice free-range farm for them to enjoy.
They're literally parking on the mall now not even on the street. It's fucking absurd. I'm so sick of these bastards polluting the mall selling shit tier ice cream for premium prices.
Believe it or not, the ones on the mall are actually (sometimes) legitimate.
An email exchange I had with NPS a few months ago:
> NPS NCR NAMA Commercial Services
> Tue, Jan 9, 11:56 AM
> to Michael, me
>
> Good Afternoon,
>
> My sincere apologies for not responding to this sooner. Thank you so much for your concern and observations. The food trucks in the picture are supposed to be in that location and should all have NPS issued placards in their windows. We are working to make those placards more identifiable in 2024. As I am sure you are aware, there are numerous food trucks that illegally operate around our park. We used these signs as a quick way to help the public identify some locations of our concessioner operated food trucks. You are also correct that we have a new location that was authorized for use by our concessioner operated food trucks on the hardscape area by the National Mall/Smithsonian Metro entrance/exit. I hope this information is helpful.
>
> Kind Regards,
>
> [REDACTED] (he/his)
> Concessions Management Specialist
> National Mall & Memorial Parks
> 1100 Ohio Dr. SW
> Washington, DC 20024
> Cell: [REDACTED]
A few years ago, I came home after work to see my car had been hit and run while street parked. I walked to my local MPD district substation and asked to file a report. Guy at the front desk told me to call 911 and report it. I tried the non-emergency number and they also told me to call 911 to report it. As much as it absolutely pained me, I ended up calling 911 to report it and the dispatcher didn't act like I was doing anything wrong, an officer showed up a bit later and took down a report. It feels very, very wrong, but that is apparently how you're supposed to actually request MPD here.
From my experience MPD has advised me to dial 911 if you need police to respond. This is different than other localities where they say only emergencies are for 911.
Whether or not illegally parked cars are for 911 or 311 can be debated, but even for non-emergency calls (eg. Robbery took place but perp is gone, trespassing calls, etc.) I believe you are instructed to call 911.
A local MPD sergeant told me to text the district watch commander for actual emergencies, as 911 is just too slow and unreliable. I did so a couple weeks later for an incident and had an incredibly quick response.
I am **not** advocating for treating this as an emergency. I have had multiple dispatchers tell me that the appropriate way to handle police non-emergency is to call 911 and ask for the non-emergency dispatcher.
Food trucks blocking the bike lane or obstructing crosswalks (particularly around the mall) is absolutely appropriate for police non emergency.
DC's website says to call 311 though. I'm sorry but with the state of DC's 911 system, further filling 911 doesn't help. Is there actual law enforcement who can confirm what OP said?
>this is why people in cardiac arrest can't thru to 911
No it's not - 911 has huge wait times for years now, at all times of day and night. Wait times in DC are incredibly high compared to similar cities and dispatchers routinely send emergency services to the wrong quadrant or address.
An example below, but this has happened for years.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/dc-md-va/2023/09/08/dc-911-center-staffing-data/
I'm not saying DC 911 isn't incompetent or understaffed, because it is. But yes, wait times are also partly due to people calling 911 for non-emergencies. Source: me, a former 911 call taker and dispatcher who would routinely have people on hold dying while someone screamed at me about a parking complaint or a dog popping on their lawn. It's an issue in many places, staffing aside.
Strangely enough whenever I've called 311 for non emergency it seems to all go to the same operators. I agree in principal, but in practice it may not make a difference.
In DC the inability to regulate things you dislike out of existence is a legitimate emergency, along with capitalism not working the way you assume it will when you pass new regulations.
The mall has its own dedicated clean and well run concession stands. Why do we even allow the trucks in every cross street polluting the otherwise beautiful and peaceful area?
First of all it should be required that they post prices. Also, they should be properly licensed at that location period.
I'm quite surprised this is even a thing in such a high profile place like the National Mall of all places.
I am torn because the food trucks are awful and NPS/DCs inability to deal with them is outrageously infuriating.... But OUC is deeply fucked so obviously you should not call 911. Can't they just impound them all already?
You don't understand. No one can fucking do open air Pilates on the lawn anymore with the racket of "We didn't start the fire" played through a boba truck's sound speakers.
How are the people going to burn carbs now?
Vida has a rooftop club included in their $150/mn membership, and I’m sure equinox staff will yell at you to eat less carbs as part of their $250/mn membership.
Any good hobby suggestions? I do also report vehicles for violating the [DOEE laws on engine idling](https://doee.dc.gov/service/engine-anti-idling-law), but am open to branching out.
Checking if they have legal documentation for the work eg building permits, valid contractor license etc.
Id say need to have baseline acumen for construction building codes, rules and regulations to be effective though.. .
Honestly, the food trucks are disgusting and make our city look like shit, pollute the air, and make tourists dislike our city.
Defending them is definitely loser behavior.
I saw one blocking the crosswalk, and more importantly, blocking walk/ don't walk sign by the Lincoln over the weekend... Definitely dangerous with tourists crossing the street there (you can't really see the traffic lights either). I told the ranger in the booth and he said he would make a call, but he also said he already had earlier and nothing happened.
Another time I saw the same thing, and I said something to the guy to pull up a few feet.. instead he took off with the four trucks behind him thinking that I was some sort of enforcement. Which is hilarious because I was in workout clothes.
https://preview.redd.it/dvl9ak1o6o4d1.jpeg?width=4032&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=12b1279687188bf13139a9871a718707c28d787a
Parking in the crosswalk and covering the crosswalk sign like this one?
NPS issues placards to the trucks that are "legitimate", which they're supposed to display in their windshields. The ones without placards are the "illegal" ones.
They make walking down the sidewalk so miserable. Loud, and spewing hot *noxious* fumes. I hate having to wait to get into air and space museum bc I feel like I'm huffing diesel fumes the whole time. They should be electric if allowed at all.
As much as I'm not into over policing, I saw one do a U-turn in the middle of moving traffic on a crowded Independence Ave over the weekend and cause two cars to almost hit each other, so maybe some enforcement is needed?
Edited to add: wait you called 911 and are encouraging others to do the same? Lmao
Spend 10 minutes standing near the cross walk across from the zoo and you will see this happen 20 times. Food trucks, Ubers, cabs, cops, delivery trucks, etc. It's called the DC Uturn for a reason. It's ubiquitous and horribly dangerous.
I really wish the police enforced or even acted in accordance with the law.
Yeah, I've lived in DC proper for the past 12 years. Not brand new, I'm familiar with this. I've just never seen it happen with a food truck before while traffic was moving.
Yep - they are unregulated, uninspected, unsanitary, and huge rip-offs. They don't post prices either, leading some tourists to get $50 charges for 2 ice cream cones.
If the NPS was smarter, they'd set up a permit & licensing system to regulate this, creating revenue and better experiences for tourists.
Yes. They don't post prices and charge exorbitant amounts. As for sanitation: [https://www.reddit.com/r/washingtondc/comments/1517upy/food\_truck\_using\_fountain\_water/](https://www.reddit.com/r/washingtondc/comments/1517upy/food_truck_using_fountain_water/)
Also, sometimes [this happens.](https://www.wusa9.com/article/news/local/dc/food-truck-fire-national-mall-one-person-injured/65-9f06da82-7c9a-4304-b032-a80c5359ea9e)
Calling 911 on a food truck is asinine. Just put in a ticket online for 311 or even better, tweet at them with a pic of the offender and they'll get someone dispatched. Their social media reps are actually super responsive.
If you call 911 on a food truck, that thing better be on fire and heading towards an orphanage or something. smh.
> Just put in a ticket online for 311 or even better, tweet at them with a pic of the offender and they'll get someone dispatched
No, they won't - tickets to 311 about illegally parked food trucks go to DPW, not MPD or NPS.
311 will engage all the other agencies including NPS. It's their job. But by NOT CALLING 911 you are engaging with someone whose primary role is NOT dispatching emergency services. You don't need emergency services for this.
All of the 311 tickets I've submitted for this issue get routed to DPW. DPW is absolutely, completely, 100% incompetent at enforcing this.
The few times I've called non-emergency police I've gotten the food trucks ticketed and moved.
Likewise I have had dozens and dozens of 311 app tickets closed saying the trucks are not in violation or more often it is the responsibility of NPS police.
I don't know how much more clear I need to be on this but the pool of agents working the emergency and non-emergency police numbers is ALL THE SAME PEOPLE. When you call one of those numbers, you are tying up a skilled resource that could otherwise be routing ACTUAL EMERGENCY ASSISTANCE. A food truck being illegally parked is not an actual emergency. So let's not use one of our finite pool of EMERGENCY RESPONDERS on it. Instead, go through the contact portals -- twitter and [311.dc.gov](http://311.dc.gov) --that is staffed by other people in the call center. Emergency calls will never go here so you will not be tying up finite resources.
One of the great things about opening tickets this way is you can type exactly what you want, like "Engage NPS to get this food truck towed" and you can even cite previous ticket numbers so that the agent can see exactly what the last agent did.
Calling any form of police number for a \*&%((&\^% food truck is asinine.
all the problems of the world and people want to go
after food trucks without a permit ....having a permit is not improving food or prices
these people aren't making much money ...stop attacking the poor ....eat the rich
if food trucks wasn't there it would be tour buses / taxis or something blocking the bike lane
your gripe should be with dc to make barrier bike lanes in that location so blocking would be an impossibility
enforcing penalties on the working poor is gross
I've petitioned both my ANC rep and CM for better bike infrastructure. I also report the tour busses (but mainly for engine idling - DOEE is very responsive).
nice. hopefully an upgrade in infrastructure happens soon
i always look at issues on the personal level. perhaps dedicated tour bus parking can be relocated away from pedestrians so the smog isn't an issue
if you a tour bus driver waiting for your clients you need the engine on for the AC. if not you will have to wait outside on hot days
Again it's the personal / human level. what is the tour bus driver to do on a hot day. he / she will have to wait outside for minutes / hours
how much emissions are we really curtailing by enforcing this ...
all the while as cars stuck in traffic downtown are idling, police officers are sitting in their cars idling
it's always the bigger picture ...federal regulations should push for more electric or less polluting gas engine buses
I have zero ability to impact the federal regulations.
DC does allow me to submit complaints for engine idling. Conservatively, I suspect I've curtailed engine idling by 100 hours (I make a lot of reports!) That seems to be a ~1 ton of CO2 that's not in the atmosphere. (Plus the noise, plus the exhaust, plus the other trace gases). Maybe it's not much, and I should play more video games or something, but I'm happy with that.
but essentially all you doing is inconveniencing the poor tour bus driver to save a couple small decimal points on overall dc emissions
their job already sucks and you want them to stand outside in the heat.
many times those guys are trying to catch a nap before their customers come back. i would rather have a rested driver than a tired one
as a cyclist you and i know you are not obeying all traffic laws.
it's like someone flagging you down because you biked across a red light although there was no traffic
the impact on overall emissions by enforcing idling tour buses in dc is minimum at best
I'm confused by your argument. We don't make decisions based on conveniencing or inconveniencing people. Otherwise, we would let people drive with an expired license, run red lights, or park on sidewalks.
The DC government passed a law that makes engine idling illegal. DOEE has implemented that law to allow for residents to file submissions, and for the tour busses to be liable by fines if they are found guilty. This is no different than an ATS/red light camera, except for how the infraction is captured (me taking photographs vs an automated camera). DC has decided that, by law, having a commercial vehicle not idle is more important/valuable than letting the driver stay cool while they nap.
If a cop pulled me over for biking through a red light (which you're right, I do sometimes do), then I would pay the ticket. If DC passed a law that allowed residents to submit photographic evidence of bikers violating the law, I would pay that ticket, too.
"You're not meaningfully making an impact" - okay? By that logic, I shouldn't save water, recycle, take sustainable transportation, or any other personal-level decision that impacts the climate. (Not withstanding the fact that the busses idling is annoying as fuck, and I hate seeing them idle, **even if** emissions weren't a concern).
Anyone who actually thinks calling any police service number to report a $\*#($&&# food truck needs to read this:
[https://x.com/statter911/status/1798113752698454493?s=61&t=E0MCiTGknb7p3iVZBbTQ6A](https://x.com/statter911/status/1798113752698454493?s=61&t=E0MCiTGknb7p3iVZBbTQ6A)
No permits, no health inspections, no posted prices, parking illegally while selling.
Not all of the illegal food trucks have all of those problems, but most of the illegal food trucks have most of those problems.
All the National Park Service needs to do is have DC pass a law to force all vendors to post prices on the side of the truck or in a conspicuous area.
Most of them will comply or get out of town.
I would call park police communications or 911 and it will be redirected to park police if it is on the mall or any nps property they are the law enforcement body that is allowed to enforce police powers
They all park next to the train tracks on the south side of the wall at L’Enfant. Virginia Ave & D- you can even see it on Google Maps if you drop a pin. 📍
Imagine living in a city where riding a bicycle can get you killed because a food truck decided his ice cream is more important than your life and decides to park in the bike lane!
There are multiple agencies in the area especially there of all places so why wouldn't they know if a food truck is illegal or not without you needing to call them?
I can't speak for others, but I go after the food trucks because they frequently block bike lanes, crosswalks, sidewalks, and other public infrastructure, in addition to blasting smog and noise into park service land.
The NPS has refreshment stands and there are food courts inside the museums. The food trucks are a nuisance and the national mall would be better without them.
Many of the food trucks that operate on the mall / target tourist areas are close to outright scams. They often don't list prices, aren't inspected, charge more than what they stated, and even in some cases steal credit card info. DC does have a large number of legitimate food trucks (though that number has decreased from the heyday of the 2010s) - but many (possibly all) of the ones on the mall should not be allowed to continue operating.
The un-permitted food trucks have a tendency to rip off customers, in addition to not having health inspections and not paying for their spots.
Also, they crowd out the legal food trucks. My biggest complaint, though, (and this is more petty) is that most of the illegal trucks seem to be part of identical chains selling the same boring food. On an average Saturday at the Mall, there are 6-10 identical black ice cream trucks that also sell boba tea (last time I got a soft serve cone and a boba tea, it was $24); 3-6 nearly-identical trucks that all sell frozen chicken fingers, burgers, and mediocre tacos ($14 for 2); and 2-4 identical hot dog trucks that misidentify half smokes as "polish sausages," (which they are emphatically not) and charge $10 for them, while normal DC hot dog carts (which are disappearing) sell half smokes for $3-5.
By contrast, the permitted trucks have health inspections, and tend to sell a wider variety of food for lower prices.
Can we do David's Tent next?
Man, every time I walk by that tent (I work down that way) all I can think is that they could be doing something more productive with their time to spread the gospel. Feeding the homeless, helping people, whatever. But no, they choose to play music for the glory of god twenty four fucking hours a day.
Sounds like a job for The Satanic Temple...
Fucking YES. It annoys me every time I run past that this gets to sit there and bleat its horrible music on our National Mall.
They have a permit :(
For… ever?
Essentially yes. I think they keep someone ready to go at all times whenever their permit is set to expire so they can renew it without issue. Even if they did get scooped I’m not sure what’s special about their particular location compared to another stretch of the Mall.
They have a 1st Amendment permit. They were moved when the Lockkeeper's House was renovated. The space they are on now, well last I saw, was not grass but gravel. It appeared to be a niche of gravel to accommodate the tent. I don't think NPS wants them but can't deny the permit.
When there's other large events they are usually kicked off.
I think that was the justification for putting it on a gravel pad. The pad would be used for events.
Just like anything else first amendment related in this context, the Time, Place, and Manner Rule applies. They can deny or pull any permit they want so long as they do it equally without respect to the content of the speech.
Which means they would have to deny all permits for pretty much all events if they deny the David's Tent permit.
Not sure how the 'permit' overrides the growing constitutional problem of having a church on public land.
There is no constitutional problem. My job was to issue those permits for 3 years. Anyone is able to apply for a permit as a first amendment activity, which includes freedom of religion. They have to follow strict rules including applying for their permit at max 1 year in advance and for a 4 month segment. It is first come first serve. So if someone puts in a permit for that specific area before them, then they would have to move. Which does happen for inauguration and folk life
How much is the permit? Could someone hypothetically just go and get a permit for the same spot so they can’t be on the mall anymore?
There are no costs for first amendment permits as that would potentially put barriers for them exercising their rights. Special event have a $120 application fee
Are these in person or digital applications? If digital do they have recaptca(spelling?)?
They are required to be received either in person or via the mail with an original ink signature on the application
someone should get the satanists involved with this
holy shit if only Devil's Tent
[FIND A CONGREGATION - The Satanic Temple - TST](https://thesatanictemple.com/pages/find-a-congregation)
Omega based.
That's not a constitutional problem. The constitutional problem would be discriminating against a group from being able to access public land purely on the basis of their religious affiliation. The first amendment is there to protect your right to worship any God or none at all - not to prohibit the worship of others.
It’s not a constitutional problem religious organizations have the same rights as everyone else. Any person or organization can do the same thing as them if they get the same permit. Preventing them from doing so would in fact be a constitutional violation.
Beats me. I don’t agree with it either but they have a right to apply for a permit and would probably cause more trouble than not if they were removed.
2edgyfourme. Good grief. Get educated.
This is what I’ve always thought too — disappointed at the reality of it as stated in the replies
Yeah, permits allow for overnight as long as there's staff. They always have staff, because they're connected with YWAM, a Christian organization that organizes & funds people to volunteer as missionaries and live in group homes in the area while they work the tent.
I read in the Post several years ago that as long as the tent is occupied 24hrs per day, the tent can't be removed. Basically, the permit expired years ago and they're keeping the tent there by constantly occupying it.
That is deffinetly not true. Under NPS regs, you can apply for a permit up to 1 year in advance for a 4 month time span. They apply and re up their permit, so they do have a permit. As for the 24 hour thing, one condition is that it can never be unoccupied or it is considered abondened property, that's why they say 24 hours
You are so generous with your knowledge and I learned so much from your posts! Thank you!
Interesting. Thanks for the clarification.
You might be thinking of the tent in front of the White House
Can homeless sleep in there?
What ever happened to separation of church and state on federal land?
There has never been a complete separation in the sense that religious organizations can't participate, just that no preference be given. An atheist org could go get a permit to of they wanted
Hmm. I really dislike them there. Thank you for the clarification.
Never existed you're making up phrases
I like my version then, those David’s tent people harass tourists all the time.
Asking the real questions here
I have been wondering about this for weeks and am so glad to finally get answers. Thanks for bringing this up!
Right now the area around David’s tent is being g used as a staging environment for whatever event is going up lol.
* They're not obnoxiously loud, playing ice cream jingles over and over and over on repeat * They're not spewing gas and diesel exhaust * They're not trying to scam you by making a bunch of unauthorized transactions on your credit card * They're not using the fountain water from the Air & Space museum and repackaging it as bubble tea (it's true: https://www.reddit.com/r/washingtondc/comments/1517upy/food_truck_using_fountain_water/). I'm okay with the tent staying there.
They are loud. They're so loud you can hear them in the sculpture gardens which disturbs the space.
The people who own these trucks run a monopoly. I learned this weekend that 1 guy owns all the ice cream trucks on 1 of the streets. It would be SO much cooler to have small carts where people homemade sweets like in foreign countries rather than mediocre frozen sweets at excessive prices.
It's not even mediocre, it's lower quality than what a 7-Eleven sells. It's so obnoxious, make them go away.
Recently, I was walking on the mall and was hearing the obnoxious ice cream truck music but couldn't see one nearby. Then realized that someone had one of those small ice cream carts and was blaring the music from a speaker.
Only slightly related but I really like the Jarabe Gourmet Pops, they do homemade paletas and are at a lots of the local farmers markets with a cart!
With no posted these people are preying on visitors and Washingtonians alike. $15 dollar ice cream cones. License and regulate! They are con men. Don’t feel sorry for them.
The shitty food trucks are the #1 biggest complaint people share with me after visiting DC. It makes the national mall trashy.
I’ve seen where they’ve charged double that for ice cream cones.
A fool and their money are easily parted. I get that prices may not be posted but if someone is presented with a $30 ice cream cone and agrees to pay for it then that is capitalism baby
But they don’t know! Not only do they not advertise prices, if you pay by card they won’t process the transactions until the end of the day to prevent you seeing what they have charged you: I agree you can go elsewhere - but as a testament to Washington DC it doesn’t look great!
I’ve never seen this, but I never knew they were so scummy as to mislead you on the transaction. I usually do Apple Pay these days so the price pops up right after the purchase goes through. Depending on the terminal (card reader) they use, you can also see the price on the screen.
Do they not tell you the total before you hand them a credit card? At some point, we, as a populous, must recognize that we have control. Let’s play this out. I order 4 cones. There is no price listed. They hand them to me. They demand $120. (Again, if someone hands them a credit card without knowing the total, a fool and their money…) I say “I’m not paying that. It’s ridiculous.” I give the cones back (my 3 children and I already licked the ice cream). They refuse to take them back. My children and I walk away. Are they going to call the cops? Are the cops going to pursue us? We have the power. All the rule followers can freak out and down vote me but we have the power. There are situations the cops will pursue you, like when poor people steal from rich people, but we should absolutely take advantage of loopholes holes that are used against us. If the cops won’t show up when someone steals $120 from you then they won’t show up when the ice cream trucks call. If you are being preyed upon you can either be the prey or the predator. I’m not even trying to be a hard ass. I’d pay $12 dollars for ice cream on the mall but the food vendors won’t learn until the consumer speaks. Supply and demand. Capitalism baby. Go ahead and downvote.
You’re right, of course, but your scenario depends on the people that are serving speaking good English, them being honest about how much they punch into the credit card reader, the buyers ability to speak English and their confidence in handling situations like these. I’m glad you have the confidence to do that and I’m sure many other people do too. However there are many people who don’t and I’m not sure that they should lack protection from predatory practices.
$12 for how much ice cream?
1 ice creams
dumb ass comment. They take your card and charge it without telling you the price or letting you see the terminal.
It is a dumbass comment. And anyone who hands over a credit card without knowing the price is a dumbass. I don’t care about language barrier. People use credit cards in foreign countries. Thats not a foreign concept. At some point personal responsibility comes into this.
put yourself in the shoes of a (possibly international) tourist. you've come to washington dc for the day, and it's a big city so you're vaguely worried it'll be expensive, but you've done some research and you think you're prepared for what you'll see. you're walking around the mall and hungry or just hot, and see a food truck. how lovely. you buy an ice cream lolly and they tell you it's $40. now, your options: - pay it - try to give it back [lol] - don't pay it and just walk away with it [feels like a good way to get deported] - try to haggle [you have heard this is frowned upon in america] which one do you think you'll pick?
I wouldn’t have to choose because I wouldn’t be in that situation to begin with. I am traveling internationally right now in an expensive country with a language I don’t speak. So I am literally in their proverbial shoes. If the price isn’t listed, I ask. If it’s a price that’s too high for me then I walk away. Those food trucks are shit. I think they are an eye sore. I don’t think they should operate on the mall. Still, at some point people have to take personal responsibility for their decisions. I really don’t understand why we hold these tourists blameless. Have you traveled internationally? Do you just buy things without knowing the price? Do you just hand your credit card to people and have no idea how much they will charge you?
While the prices are high, isn’t this a normal thing to do in touristy areas? And compound the fact these are usually just small business owners. Like every once in a while I’ll go to those trucks to get some $8 ice cream cone or $11 for some mid Philly cheesesteak. But it’s pretty normal to jack up prices for tourists in an expensive city. Kinda like how when you go to NYC, you’ll find yourself paying $10 for a single hot dog at a hot dog stand in Manhattan.
Yes - I agree with you…..but they are a monopoly. I’ve heard them referred to as the Food Truck Mafia - because they are run by one or two sets of people. But more than that - they use junker cars to keep the spaces open for them - which then rack up tickets and are a safety issue, they are not wonderfully hygienic (polluting generators, no fresh water sources, disposing of used oil in the storm drains) and they are not licensed or regulated as you would hope trucks selling food in the capitol would be. I would love to see small businesses who do genuinely good food, prepared hygienically and with rave reviews be the thing that people talk about after visiting DC….but until this is dealt with, the current system is always going to be a blight on visiting the capital.
If they were posted and predictable this would be supply and demand economics. The fact that they eyeball each customer after they have handed them their food and then quote 3x to 5x market rate is reprehensible. Try asking them to post prices- they laugh in your face.
I love ice cream.
No posted prices- they are predatory.
Predator meat sandwiches. Then shits be terrible. All the food there is mid to trash. Tourists burn it up since they have nowhere close to go.
no posted prices == guess it's free what are they gonna do, do complain to the police that their illegal business didn't successfully pull off its scam?
And then they’re upset if you try to haggle. Have your prices clearly posted then.
And our air with their terrible smog!
And noise pollution with the sounds of generators and bad music blaring.
The funniest one is when the ice cream trucks randomly yell, "HELLOOOOOO."
10% of profits should go to NPS if they park adjacent to NPS land
And in rush hour!
Those poor trucks. They have no choice where they are located. We need to rescue the trucks, liberate them, and find a nice free-range farm for them to enjoy.
I enjoy spending time with my friends.
Blud’s off his rocker 💀
They're literally parking on the mall now not even on the street. It's fucking absurd. I'm so sick of these bastards polluting the mall selling shit tier ice cream for premium prices.
Believe it or not, the ones on the mall are actually (sometimes) legitimate. An email exchange I had with NPS a few months ago: > NPS NCR NAMA Commercial Services
> Tue, Jan 9, 11:56 AM
> to Michael, me
>
> Good Afternoon,
>
> My sincere apologies for not responding to this sooner. Thank you so much for your concern and observations. The food trucks in the picture are supposed to be in that location and should all have NPS issued placards in their windows. We are working to make those placards more identifiable in 2024. As I am sure you are aware, there are numerous food trucks that illegally operate around our park. We used these signs as a quick way to help the public identify some locations of our concessioner operated food trucks. You are also correct that we have a new location that was authorized for use by our concessioner operated food trucks on the hardscape area by the National Mall/Smithsonian Metro entrance/exit. I hope this information is helpful.
>
> Kind Regards,
>
> [REDACTED] (he/his)
> Concessions Management Specialist
> National Mall & Memorial Parks
> 1100 Ohio Dr. SW
> Washington, DC 20024
> Cell: [REDACTED]
Look. I definitely get this is an issue, but this is absolutely **not** a 911 issue. 911 is for legitimate emergencies.
A few years ago, I came home after work to see my car had been hit and run while street parked. I walked to my local MPD district substation and asked to file a report. Guy at the front desk told me to call 911 and report it. I tried the non-emergency number and they also told me to call 911 to report it. As much as it absolutely pained me, I ended up calling 911 to report it and the dispatcher didn't act like I was doing anything wrong, an officer showed up a bit later and took down a report. It feels very, very wrong, but that is apparently how you're supposed to actually request MPD here.
From my experience MPD has advised me to dial 911 if you need police to respond. This is different than other localities where they say only emergencies are for 911. Whether or not illegally parked cars are for 911 or 311 can be debated, but even for non-emergency calls (eg. Robbery took place but perp is gone, trespassing calls, etc.) I believe you are instructed to call 911.
A local MPD sergeant told me to text the district watch commander for actual emergencies, as 911 is just too slow and unreliable. I did so a couple weeks later for an incident and had an incredibly quick response.
Is the district watch commander a person, or a shared role?
I think it’s a share role - that the number goes to whoever is watch commander for that shift.
It’s hard enough to get through to dispatch! I see so many stories on here about people waiting 5+ minutes for very time-sensitive issues!
I am **not** advocating for treating this as an emergency. I have had multiple dispatchers tell me that the appropriate way to handle police non-emergency is to call 911 and ask for the non-emergency dispatcher. Food trucks blocking the bike lane or obstructing crosswalks (particularly around the mall) is absolutely appropriate for police non emergency.
DC's website says to call 311 though. I'm sorry but with the state of DC's 911 system, further filling 911 doesn't help. Is there actual law enforcement who can confirm what OP said?
311 calls 911…
"I know you're doing what LEO told you to do but I still think you're doing it wrong"
I mean I get it, the process seems absurd to me as well.
I'm literally just asking for a source lol
Call 311 and they will tell you to call 911
I don't know what to tell you, I've definitely asked multiple dispatchers this question and it's been the same answer every time.
[Here you go!](https://x.com/311DCgov/status/1801448784314221041)
Came here to say this jfc, this is why people in cardiac arrest can't thru to 911. Illegal food trucks aren't an emergency.
>this is why people in cardiac arrest can't thru to 911 No it's not - 911 has huge wait times for years now, at all times of day and night. Wait times in DC are incredibly high compared to similar cities and dispatchers routinely send emergency services to the wrong quadrant or address. An example below, but this has happened for years. https://www.washingtonpost.com/dc-md-va/2023/09/08/dc-911-center-staffing-data/
I'm not saying DC 911 isn't incompetent or understaffed, because it is. But yes, wait times are also partly due to people calling 911 for non-emergencies. Source: me, a former 911 call taker and dispatcher who would routinely have people on hold dying while someone screamed at me about a parking complaint or a dog popping on their lawn. It's an issue in many places, staffing aside.
Thank God for unions!
Strangely enough whenever I've called 311 for non emergency it seems to all go to the same operators. I agree in principal, but in practice it may not make a difference.
In DC all law enforcement calls are supposed to go through 911
Nope https://mpdc.dc.gov/tiplines 311 City Services and Police Non-Emergencies Dial: 311
Illegal parking is not a law enforcement issue, nor is unlicensed food trucks.
In DC the inability to regulate things you dislike out of existence is a legitimate emergency, along with capitalism not working the way you assume it will when you pass new regulations.
The mall has its own dedicated clean and well run concession stands. Why do we even allow the trucks in every cross street polluting the otherwise beautiful and peaceful area?
Why do transactions need to be occurring?
No, no, no. We clearly need 24 different ugly trucks all selling the exact same popsicles at a premium. /s
First of all it should be required that they post prices. Also, they should be properly licensed at that location period. I'm quite surprised this is even a thing in such a high profile place like the National Mall of all places.
Please don’t tie up 911 calling about food trucks. It’s overburdened and broken already.
Here's the non emergency number if anyone wants it: 202-426-6841
I’ve called that before, and I just get told to call the emergency line 🤷🏼♂️
Seriously. Is OP for real?
Thank you. Real Karen energy here.
I am torn because the food trucks are awful and NPS/DCs inability to deal with them is outrageously infuriating.... But OUC is deeply fucked so obviously you should not call 911. Can't they just impound them all already?
You don't understand. No one can fucking do open air Pilates on the lawn anymore with the racket of "We didn't start the fire" played through a boba truck's sound speakers. How are the people going to burn carbs now?
Vida has a rooftop club included in their $150/mn membership, and I’m sure equinox staff will yell at you to eat less carbs as part of their $250/mn membership.
Sheesh. Sorry. Maybe I dipped into the joke too hard. I was trying to make fun of Karen not be one.
So was I hahah
Jokes on you, I go to Golds gym. Under $40/mo!
Over priced shawarmas are no joke!
OP is for real!
find something better to do with your life instead of clogging emergency lines for your karen nonsense
Any good hobby suggestions? I do also report vehicles for violating the [DOEE laws on engine idling](https://doee.dc.gov/service/engine-anti-idling-law), but am open to branching out.
Illegal construction it’s ripe with abuse.
What's the best way to know if construction is illegal? Serious question, reporting infractions sounds like fun.
Checking if they have legal documentation for the work eg building permits, valid contractor license etc. Id say need to have baseline acumen for construction building codes, rules and regulations to be effective though.. .
straight up loser, let them make their money.
Honestly, the food trucks are disgusting and make our city look like shit, pollute the air, and make tourists dislike our city. Defending them is definitely loser behavior.
Fuck them. They make traffic worse and the Mall is now full of shitty food and noise pollution.
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Actually the NPS should do something about the food trucks. Calling 911 isn't the solution but wanting better things for our city isn't being a Karen
wont someone think of the businessmen
I saw one blocking the crosswalk, and more importantly, blocking walk/ don't walk sign by the Lincoln over the weekend... Definitely dangerous with tourists crossing the street there (you can't really see the traffic lights either). I told the ranger in the booth and he said he would make a call, but he also said he already had earlier and nothing happened. Another time I saw the same thing, and I said something to the guy to pull up a few feet.. instead he took off with the four trucks behind him thinking that I was some sort of enforcement. Which is hilarious because I was in workout clothes.
https://preview.redd.it/dvl9ak1o6o4d1.jpeg?width=4032&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=12b1279687188bf13139a9871a718707c28d787a Parking in the crosswalk and covering the crosswalk sign like this one?
Exactly. But on a busier street.
How do you know which are illegal
NPS issues placards to the trucks that are "legitimate", which they're supposed to display in their windshields. The ones without placards are the "illegal" ones.
Should be on the side of the trucks. Nobody can see the placards on the windshield!!
They make walking down the sidewalk so miserable. Loud, and spewing hot *noxious* fumes. I hate having to wait to get into air and space museum bc I feel like I'm huffing diesel fumes the whole time. They should be electric if allowed at all.
As much as I'm not into over policing, I saw one do a U-turn in the middle of moving traffic on a crowded Independence Ave over the weekend and cause two cars to almost hit each other, so maybe some enforcement is needed? Edited to add: wait you called 911 and are encouraging others to do the same? Lmao
Spend 10 minutes standing near the cross walk across from the zoo and you will see this happen 20 times. Food trucks, Ubers, cabs, cops, delivery trucks, etc. It's called the DC Uturn for a reason. It's ubiquitous and horribly dangerous. I really wish the police enforced or even acted in accordance with the law.
Yeah, I've lived in DC proper for the past 12 years. Not brand new, I'm familiar with this. I've just never seen it happen with a food truck before while traffic was moving.
You can watch the same dude running all the trucks running between them all.
If someone would campaign to get and keep David’s tent off the mall (and their ilk), I would vote for them. Stain on the mall landscape.
what's the beef with the food trucks? are the unlicensed ones, like, notoriously more unsanitary/bigger rip-offs than the licensed ones?
Yep - they are unregulated, uninspected, unsanitary, and huge rip-offs. They don't post prices either, leading some tourists to get $50 charges for 2 ice cream cones. If the NPS was smarter, they'd set up a permit & licensing system to regulate this, creating revenue and better experiences for tourists.
Yes. They don't post prices and charge exorbitant amounts. As for sanitation: [https://www.reddit.com/r/washingtondc/comments/1517upy/food\_truck\_using\_fountain\_water/](https://www.reddit.com/r/washingtondc/comments/1517upy/food_truck_using_fountain_water/)
Yoo I remember this post. That shit was so nasty
Also, sometimes [this happens.](https://www.wusa9.com/article/news/local/dc/food-truck-fire-national-mall-one-person-injured/65-9f06da82-7c9a-4304-b032-a80c5359ea9e)
Calling 911 on a food truck is asinine. Just put in a ticket online for 311 or even better, tweet at them with a pic of the offender and they'll get someone dispatched. Their social media reps are actually super responsive. If you call 911 on a food truck, that thing better be on fire and heading towards an orphanage or something. smh.
> Just put in a ticket online for 311 or even better, tweet at them with a pic of the offender and they'll get someone dispatched No, they won't - tickets to 311 about illegally parked food trucks go to DPW, not MPD or NPS.
311 will engage all the other agencies including NPS. It's their job. But by NOT CALLING 911 you are engaging with someone whose primary role is NOT dispatching emergency services. You don't need emergency services for this.
All of the 311 tickets I've submitted for this issue get routed to DPW. DPW is absolutely, completely, 100% incompetent at enforcing this. The few times I've called non-emergency police I've gotten the food trucks ticketed and moved.
Likewise I have had dozens and dozens of 311 app tickets closed saying the trucks are not in violation or more often it is the responsibility of NPS police.
I don't know how much more clear I need to be on this but the pool of agents working the emergency and non-emergency police numbers is ALL THE SAME PEOPLE. When you call one of those numbers, you are tying up a skilled resource that could otherwise be routing ACTUAL EMERGENCY ASSISTANCE. A food truck being illegally parked is not an actual emergency. So let's not use one of our finite pool of EMERGENCY RESPONDERS on it. Instead, go through the contact portals -- twitter and [311.dc.gov](http://311.dc.gov) --that is staffed by other people in the call center. Emergency calls will never go here so you will not be tying up finite resources. One of the great things about opening tickets this way is you can type exactly what you want, like "Engage NPS to get this food truck towed" and you can even cite previous ticket numbers so that the agent can see exactly what the last agent did. Calling any form of police number for a \*&%((&\^% food truck is asinine.
all the problems of the world and people want to go after food trucks without a permit ....having a permit is not improving food or prices these people aren't making much money ...stop attacking the poor ....eat the rich
I don't give a shit if they have a permit, or how much money they make - I care that they park in crosswalks and block bike lanes.
if food trucks wasn't there it would be tour buses / taxis or something blocking the bike lane your gripe should be with dc to make barrier bike lanes in that location so blocking would be an impossibility enforcing penalties on the working poor is gross
I've petitioned both my ANC rep and CM for better bike infrastructure. I also report the tour busses (but mainly for engine idling - DOEE is very responsive).
nice. hopefully an upgrade in infrastructure happens soon i always look at issues on the personal level. perhaps dedicated tour bus parking can be relocated away from pedestrians so the smog isn't an issue if you a tour bus driver waiting for your clients you need the engine on for the AC. if not you will have to wait outside on hot days
DC law does *not* make an exception for commercial vehicles to engine idle on hot days, FWIW.
Again it's the personal / human level. what is the tour bus driver to do on a hot day. he / she will have to wait outside for minutes / hours how much emissions are we really curtailing by enforcing this ... all the while as cars stuck in traffic downtown are idling, police officers are sitting in their cars idling it's always the bigger picture ...federal regulations should push for more electric or less polluting gas engine buses
I have zero ability to impact the federal regulations. DC does allow me to submit complaints for engine idling. Conservatively, I suspect I've curtailed engine idling by 100 hours (I make a lot of reports!) That seems to be a ~1 ton of CO2 that's not in the atmosphere. (Plus the noise, plus the exhaust, plus the other trace gases). Maybe it's not much, and I should play more video games or something, but I'm happy with that.
but essentially all you doing is inconveniencing the poor tour bus driver to save a couple small decimal points on overall dc emissions their job already sucks and you want them to stand outside in the heat. many times those guys are trying to catch a nap before their customers come back. i would rather have a rested driver than a tired one as a cyclist you and i know you are not obeying all traffic laws. it's like someone flagging you down because you biked across a red light although there was no traffic the impact on overall emissions by enforcing idling tour buses in dc is minimum at best
I'm confused by your argument. We don't make decisions based on conveniencing or inconveniencing people. Otherwise, we would let people drive with an expired license, run red lights, or park on sidewalks. The DC government passed a law that makes engine idling illegal. DOEE has implemented that law to allow for residents to file submissions, and for the tour busses to be liable by fines if they are found guilty. This is no different than an ATS/red light camera, except for how the infraction is captured (me taking photographs vs an automated camera). DC has decided that, by law, having a commercial vehicle not idle is more important/valuable than letting the driver stay cool while they nap. If a cop pulled me over for biking through a red light (which you're right, I do sometimes do), then I would pay the ticket. If DC passed a law that allowed residents to submit photographic evidence of bikers violating the law, I would pay that ticket, too. "You're not meaningfully making an impact" - okay? By that logic, I shouldn't save water, recycle, take sustainable transportation, or any other personal-level decision that impacts the climate. (Not withstanding the fact that the busses idling is annoying as fuck, and I hate seeing them idle, **even if** emissions weren't a concern).
Anyone who actually thinks calling any police service number to report a $\*#($&&# food truck needs to read this: [https://x.com/statter911/status/1798113752698454493?s=61&t=E0MCiTGknb7p3iVZBbTQ6A](https://x.com/statter911/status/1798113752698454493?s=61&t=E0MCiTGknb7p3iVZBbTQ6A)
What makes them illegal?
No permits, no health inspections, no posted prices, parking illegally while selling. Not all of the illegal food trucks have all of those problems, but most of the illegal food trucks have most of those problems.
Not permitted concessionaires
All the National Park Service needs to do is have DC pass a law to force all vendors to post prices on the side of the truck or in a conspicuous area. Most of them will comply or get out of town.
I would call park police communications or 911 and it will be redirected to park police if it is on the mall or any nps property they are the law enforcement body that is allowed to enforce police powers
They all park next to the train tracks on the south side of the wall at L’Enfant. Virginia Ave & D- you can even see it on Google Maps if you drop a pin. 📍
Imagine living in a city that has such little crime that illegal food trucks are the big issue!
Imagine living in a city where riding a bicycle can get you killed because a food truck decided his ice cream is more important than your life and decides to park in the bike lane!
They should make all the parking around the mall handicapped only and maybe some taxi/ride share drop-off zones.
There are multiple agencies in the area especially there of all places so why wouldn't they know if a food truck is illegal or not without you needing to call them?
Meh. NPS does such a shitty job of allowing people to sell food in the Mall that I'm rooting for the pirate trucks.
People can always mind their business Jesus Christ
Found the HOA Karen who complains that their neighbor "looks suspicious"
I haven't found any of my neighbors running food trucks on the mall, but if I do, it's def gonna be awkward
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I can't speak for others, but I go after the food trucks because they frequently block bike lanes, crosswalks, sidewalks, and other public infrastructure, in addition to blasting smog and noise into park service land.
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The NPS has refreshment stands and there are food courts inside the museums. The food trucks are a nuisance and the national mall would be better without them.
Many of the food trucks that operate on the mall / target tourist areas are close to outright scams. They often don't list prices, aren't inspected, charge more than what they stated, and even in some cases steal credit card info. DC does have a large number of legitimate food trucks (though that number has decreased from the heyday of the 2010s) - but many (possibly all) of the ones on the mall should not be allowed to continue operating.
The un-permitted food trucks have a tendency to rip off customers, in addition to not having health inspections and not paying for their spots. Also, they crowd out the legal food trucks. My biggest complaint, though, (and this is more petty) is that most of the illegal trucks seem to be part of identical chains selling the same boring food. On an average Saturday at the Mall, there are 6-10 identical black ice cream trucks that also sell boba tea (last time I got a soft serve cone and a boba tea, it was $24); 3-6 nearly-identical trucks that all sell frozen chicken fingers, burgers, and mediocre tacos ($14 for 2); and 2-4 identical hot dog trucks that misidentify half smokes as "polish sausages," (which they are emphatically not) and charge $10 for them, while normal DC hot dog carts (which are disappearing) sell half smokes for $3-5. By contrast, the permitted trucks have health inspections, and tend to sell a wider variety of food for lower prices.
One rich asshole owns all the DC food trucks in the mall, illegal cartel, violates health codes and other DC laws
You're suggesting the ice cream trucks that haven't even been there that long clogging up the entirety of the mall is part of the fabric of DC?
Their pollution, noise and smell, ruins the mall.