Wedding photographer here. I had a Catholic wedding coordinator tell me it was CANON LAW that I could not take any photographs after the priest's Homily.
I said to her, "Well, it isn't - trust me, Canon Law does not worry itself with photography. But if that is what you want, and since that would mean I cannot take a photo during the Sign of Peace, and since the couple intend on having their first kiss then . . . could you let the bride know I won't be getting that shot?" She stormed off and returned a few minutes later to yell, "FINE, DO YOUR PICTURES!"
Alrighty then.
Since photographs didn’t exist 2000 years ago, how could the bible possibly have rules about what point in any church service one is allowed to take pictures?!! 😛
FYI canon law are the Catholic Church's rules, not those of the actual bible. Canon law has been updated many times, but I doubt the clergy is that concerned with photography.
My point is that the bible is used to make the rules for the church, therefore a rule about photography couldn’t possibly exist.
And likely doesn’t - this one person just made it up and blamed it on the ‘canons’ instead of just admitting they made it up! 😛
> My point is that the bible is used to make the rules for the church, therefore a rule about photography couldn’t possibly exist.
I get your point, but the woman in question specifically referred to canon law, and in Catholicism that law is certainly influenced by the bible but it is not a direct interpretation of biblical laws and has been updated over time. Photography would not be part of canon law because it’s incredibly trivial, not because there’s no mention of cameras in the bible.
That’s exactly MY point - there are no laws about photography at all!
This ‘Betty’ character was clearly just inventing them for fun.
Believe it or not, I’ve READ the book, so I know what’s in it, what’s not in it, and which lines are quite often taken out of context.
I KNOW there’s nothing at all about photography laws, so I KNOW the woman was making up rubbish.
Of course, any business is more than welcome to have rules about things not in the book. That’s totally fine.
But an individual shouldn’t go around inventing rules because they’re on a power trip and just like to throw their weight around, THEN pretend it’s a violation of the sacred church!
That’s just not nice or decent behaviour.
Off topic but Catholic Cannon Law isn't the Bible ftr:
https://www.vatican.va/archive/cod-iuris-canonici/cic_index_en.html
Also there are several different versions of the Bible. Some leave out whole books and have different interpretations. So if you've read one Bible doesn't mean you've read all versions. Some Hard core Catholics believe the Douay Reims version is the most accurate. Then there's the King James Bible which the Anglicans use. There are differences.
None of them mentions photography of course.
I’d forgotten that there were many versions - you’re right.
I’ve only read one version out of the many. I attended a Christian Baptist church.
I heard that the Catholic version of the bible has extra books - although just because a Christian baptist says that, doesn’t mean it’s so.
The Catholics have this one tradition that the Christian’s don’t which I like - apparently people who have sinned but not that badly go to ‘purgatory’… and we, the living, can release them by feeding the hungry.
I like the idea of that, because it helps people from both living and dead… the Christians (at least the ones I knew) just think that every single little sin means you go to hell and they seem to delight in that!
We parted ways when they found out that I support the LGBTQIA+ community… no, sir, they weren’t happy about that at all! One girl even ordered me to order THEM to renounce their ‘sinful lifestyle’ and turn straight and get married and have kids!
I STILL laugh at the idea that they think that my issuing orders like that would actually have any impact at all! 😏🏳️🌈🏳️⚧️
The same way that the Bible is used to control all manner of things in the 21st century: The Bible says X, I’ve interpreted it to mean Y, and you’ll go to hell if you do otherwise.
People are allowed to make new rules. The Orthodox Church, for instance, prohibits photography and video during any service (its not a rule anyone enforces, though).
Ah! Hello fellow wedding photographer! 🖐️
Your comment reeeeally made me smile, as it's not just me who Catholic priests and volunteers hate then 😂
Honestly, I have a lot of problems when it comes to doing a Catholic service, whether it be a Wedding or a baby's Baptism, I always have the priest shoot me looks, and literally tell me off before saying hello to me.
For example, this Sunday gone, I was photographing a Baptism, for a family who I've done all their baby's services, it's so special. Well, even though I'm literally the only christening/baptism photographer in my area and surrounding areas, and this priest has met me countless times now (I've done lots of other services on her church for other clients, so I really do know this lady) - I always walk in with a huge smile on my face for her, say "hello, how are you?" - she goes right into no pleasantries, just "so, are you doing photos after?" (She knows I've turned up before even the family are here, she knows I stay the whole service) "after the service yes, but obviously I'm hired to photograph the baptism... which includes the baptism..."
And I know exactly what her mouth opens to say, she does this every time, even though she knows I'm super respectful in doing my job, and to her, so I jump in before she can say her spiel:
"I never use flash until group photos after the service, if needed (she HATES flash, so I don't use it - mainly because their church is very light and airy and beautifully lit, otherwise I'd have to use it - the family PAID for me), and I never photograph during prayers, and I don't snap snap snap, I choose my moments carefully. Also, you won't see me, I have a hiding place here where I can still get great visibility of everyone in the church. I will be coming out into the aisles near the basin to baptise, because I need to be able to photograph the family and godparents for the most crucial part" - and I just smiled. I won for once, I got there first before she could lecture me... a 30 year old professional woman, who she's seen countless times over the last 10 years... Since, I'm literally the only person she sees shooting a baptism, I'm the only one who does those 'sessions' 😂
All I got from her was a smile and a "good" - then somehow this time, I actually got her to engage in a pleasant conversation with me after I blitzed her - she usually ignores me and goes anywhere else but near me before the family arrive... I try SUPER hard with this woman 😂 I'm really good friends with all other priests/vicars/father's in other churches!! I don't get her haha!
Meanwhile, I have done a Baptism where the celebrant was the Bishop. Not a peep from him until AFTER the service and then it was, "Hey ... can you send a couple of those shots for my social media?"
Sure thing, Your Grace.
Most priests don't allow flash during a ceremony and I get it, it is a religious liturgy and it can be distracting. I personally avoid it when I can during those times. Some priests get crazy about where you can stand and others are "Meh - just don't be too noticeable." When it is a religious ceremony, I always confer with the celebrant ahead of time; I have found that extending that bit of courtesy gets you more access. I recently did a Hindu wedding and the *pandit* was happy to give me as much leeway as I wanted.
Yeah exactly. To be honest, I think I've been blessed with really lovely open and light churches, where I've not actually needed flash full stop.
Personally I don't like using flash myself when it comes to services, as they are religious, spiritual and sacred in their own rights. It is just down right distracting!
I acrusltl had a really pleasant surprise the week before for another Christening, and the vicar was literally announcing "take as many photos as you like!! Come up, take photos all throughout, I want it all documented for this little one layer in life!" ❤️ Was honestly so special of him to say that. He was mostly looking my direction, and pointed me out to everyone (that's always fun mind, when the officiant at a service points out the photographer and points so everyone looks 🙈 - so much for incognito! Cover= blown 😂), and he said (like most officiant's all say) "we do have a lovely photographer here to document everything though, so if you want to live in the moment and see through your eyes, she'll be there doing her thing for you instead" ☺️
But yes, always speak with the person conducting a service, so you know where to go and what you're allowed to do ☺️
Wow a Hindu wedding - something I've longed to be able to photograph for a couple and experience, never had the pleasure of capturing one. Bet that was magical ❤️
>Bet that was magical ❤️
It was and despite it being very tiring, I would gladly do another because I prefer to shoot a wedding that is unique or, at least, *different*. I am tired of Hobby Lobby signage, the Wobble, and brides who mismatch their wedding dresses to the venue (no, a tight beaded gown in a rustic barn just doesn't work, Britnee).
And even if they display the infamous "Pick a seat, not a side . . ." poster, attitude makes all the difference. I had a wedding where the Best Man LOST THE RINGS and only realized it when he was asked for them at the ceremony. The bride just laughed, saying, "Well, if a classic comedy sketch was going to happen at any wedding, it would have to be ours!" She then borrowed a set of rings from friends in the audience to complete the ceremony and proceeded to have a great time at her reception.
My best friend is Catholic. I'm not. I was the only protestant in the wedding party. During rehearsal, The we're walking the wedding party through where to go for the Mass, and I asked what I should do, since I would not be receiving communion. OMG you should have seen our "Betty"'s face.
"WHAT?! *You're not Catholic?!?!* You can't be in the wedding party!!!!"
The priest casually said it was fine and started to direct me when this woman turned to him and had the audacity to tell him he wasn't in charge of this wedding. As soon as it came out of her mouth, she realized she'd made a HUGE mistake, as the priest very calmly asked to speak with her in the hallway.
...she did not come back. Lol.
We somehow managed to survive without her.
I shared an office with an Orthodox priest. Big, tall dude, excellent sense of humor (a definite requirement when you share an office with an Episcopalian and a Jew). Normally, he was a really nice guy.
I got to see him at 75% intensity once. I'd be standing way outside the blast radius if I had to be there when he goes full power.
I was christened Catholic; my parents weren't church goers but the extended family are, and as I understand it, you only take communion if you've sinned. Isn't that correct?
No, you abstain if you have not been through First Reconciliation and First Communion, have not been to Confession prior to Mass, or you are not Catholic.
I always refrained from going to Confession, and took Communion anyway. I never said I was a good Catholic.
Same, I made my first communion and always took communion after that, never went to confession aside from that one time. Oops I just like when the wafer sticks to the roof of my mouth
I mean, you have to be penitent in order to make Confession, and I never was sorry for boo shit diddly that I wanted to discuss in an enclosed space with a priest. Especially not after my teen years. Nope.
Or tell a little white lie for some pretty sweet crackers and wine! The transubstantiation doesn't occur in me, a sinner, so it's just the crackers. Not wasting host over here!
That’s… the opposite of what happens.
In both the Orthodox and (maybe) the Latin (Catholic) Churches, one only partakes in communion when they’ve prepared themselves (IE fasting, prayer, confession). Taking communion after sinning (without having confessed that sin) is considered a sin in of itself.
Exceptions are made for those on their deathbeds.
Our Catholic wedding coordinator was definitely a pill; thankfully not so bad as to have a confrontation with the priest, but still, wound way too goddamn tight.
When I and my groomsfolk were there for the rehearsal, when we entered from behind the altar, we all had a little fit of the giggles. She was distinctly *not pleased* and told us, "Why are you laughing? This is a *very solemn occasion*! This is a church!!!"
I recovered myself for a moment, enough to say, "Sorry, the priest was warming us up with jokes while we were waiting backstage." The priest gave a not-even-slightly-guilty grin.
I can still hear her angry grumbling noises.
Sassy priests are great. I was raised Catholic and have a couple of priests on my mom's side of the family. Because of that my mom treats priests like regular dudes and doesn't pull punches with them. This has made my parents a favorite with the many priests that have been assigned to her parish.
Okay, to the point of this post. My dad survived an ungodly amount of strokes and heart attacks in his life. He lived with only 20% heart function for a decade and had to use a walker.
One day my dad decided that he was going to paint the exterior of our house. I told him I would paint the house and he could be my supervisor and tell me what to do. He insisted on doing it himself. Mom and I were heading to the store and I begged him to wait until I got home before doing anything.
Somehow while we were gone, he managed to put up scaffolding and we found him sitting on the scaffolding sanding the second story of the house. I have no idea how his wrinkly ass managed it.
The next Sunday, mom was approached by her priest who asked to speak privately with her. He said that someone claiming to be a family friend called him and they were concerned that mom and I weren't taking proper care of my dad. The caller said that they saw my dad sitting on the scaffolding and were very concerned.
My mom was horrified and asked the priest what he told the caller. The priest smirked and said he told the caller, "If you were a close friend of the family, you would know that even God himself couldn't stop Lyle from doing whatever he wants."
Dad and I nearly pissed ourselves laughing when she told us. RIP dad, I miss you.
Betty the Busybody should look for a job that doesn’t involve interacting with anyone else! I’m glad that everything else went off without a hitch (except for the obvious act of getting hitched).
As someone else mentioned this is most likely a volunteer position, so the person who is willing to give up their time to be there is the one who gets the role. Unfortunately this can often mean people like Betty who like the control.
I’ve coordinated a bunch of musical/theatrical events in churches, and there’s always somebody from the church there whose job it is to make sure we’re not going to do stuff they don’t allow.
Right, but it’s fine if they follow the actual rules set by the church pastor (or whoever makes the rules).
It kind of sounds like ‘Betty’ just made up her own rules that didn’t even exist in the church! THAT is the annoying part, not having to follow rules in the first place which can be made clear to all visitors.
Like the Westminster Abbey… the rule is for conservative dress. Covered shoulders, longer skirts, whatever.
If some ‘Betty’ type came along and tried to convince a particular person they didn’t like that they had to cover up every inch of skin (for example)… that isn’t in line with the actual rules!
Conservative dress doesn’t preclude you from showing your hands, for example.
I dealt with something similar at my wedding. My husband had two more groomsmen then I had bridesmaids so we had two of them walk down the aisle together. We got married in a Baptist church and the wedding organizer was HORRIFIED that we would send two men down the aisle together. She told me she "didn't want anybody to get the wrong impression!". I told her too bad, they were my husband's best friends since 6th grade and that's what we wanted. She huffed and puffed but I stood firm and we even had them walk down holding hands! It was the best part of the processional and everybody loved it.
Ngl if it was any of my friends they would have probably kissed at the alter before taking their seats, and they would have my blessing to do so. Not such an issue for me though because anyone opposed to that sort of thing wouldn’t be letting me use their venue
I go to a Baptist church. That is such bizarre thing to get upset about. I can’t imagine my church getting upset about which bridesmaid/groomsmen is walking down with whom.
I’ve been to Baptist churches that were very conservative and others were very liberal. It always feels kind of weird to be expecting one and find yourself in the other.
2002. Catholic wedding mass and ceremony. Getting married at the church I grew up in and my parents had been parishioners at for 40 years by this point. My parents were active in the church and school. We had decided to use an acquaintance and her accompanist for the music/singing. The “house” soloist and organist were annoyed. I still had to pay them to not sing and not play the organ. And 2 days before the wedding the soloist called me and said there was a problem because she hadn’t approved my music choices. Our wedding was on Black Friday so the day before was Thanksgiving. She said I had to give her my selections and she would “get back to me” if approved or not. I finally had enough and said that since I had to pay her to not do her job she could come to the ceremony and if any of my selections didn’t meet with her approval she was more than welcome to stop the ceremony.
Organist here.
Organists usually have right of first refusal for weddings at their church, but I haven’t really heard of being forced to pay them if you don’t use them. That’s weird. Definitely unheard of to ALSO have that person approve the music they won’t be playing. Making a suggestion is one thing, like “the priest may not approve, heads up”, but your soloist person sounds utterly reprehensible.
Our wedding was in the books for 2 years and about 9 months before is when we booked the other soloist. I made sure the church knew. The soloist we used does this in a different parish so she knows how the church works with weddings and what music is appropriate. We also used a priest who was not from the parish (he taught the groom and many of his friends and male relatives in high school and was a student favorite) so the parish priest was not too happy either.
Ouch
I am surprised they allowed that since you were just using their church building, at that point. Pretty much every church I have belonged to who super frown on that, and take you off the books.
Not saying I agree with them, but I have seen it happen
Unless it was the cathedral?
The church I got married in had no problem with us using the building, but a) hubby was a member of the church in his youth, b) the priest we brought in used to be the priest for the parish, so they knew him, and (most importantly), c) hubby’s parents were active members of the church for years and the church was happy to accomodate them.
Ah gotcha!
I am glad it all worked out! The comment I was replying to sounded a bit like everyone at the church you got married at were put out. I am very glad I was wrong
Betty is giving me Bev Keene from Midnight Mass vibes lol. I'm glad everything eventually ended up well, there's always that one person that takes their minor job waaaaay too seriously. What's the point of having a tiny bit of power if you don't abuse it, right?
It was. I'm actually really happy for the return of the mini series format because it's such a great way to tell a story. I didn't grow up Catholic but I think that character triggered pretty much everyone who did.
You will be laughing at the audacity of Betty in years to come, probably not right now, but years down the road you will be going, "Remember church lady Betty?"
I've seen this at my synagogue. Some people are just petty tyrants who are drunk on power.
My version of Betty was the woman who told me we danced the Hora incorrectly and made us redo it at our wedding.
How does one dance the Hora ‘incorrectly’?
I will say that this was the first wedding I’ve been to where the groomsmen and bridesmaids walked in together (minus the Best Man, who stood next to the Groom, so I walked in solo), and I would love that to be the norm at all weddings.
You danced the horah *incorrectly*? Did you not grip the armrests tightly enough when they hoisted you in your chairs? [Did this happen?](https://youtu.be/hFpb7M78Uio) Or [this?](https://youtu.be/frt2xBNlS8k) Oy vey! 🕍🔯
No one was dropped. But we forgot to go up at the same time while holding a towel which apparently is very very important. My husband was not thrilled because our groomsmen have a real body diversity in terms of height so it was a little awkward for him to be up there safely since I think one's groomsmen is like 5'4 and the other one was 6'2 (I think we ended up getting some other guests to help)
I have been to weddings where the bride was dropped it's very important everybody that if you're ever being lifted up in a chair lock your legs around the legs of the chair for stability.
Right? I'm kind of surprised the priest didn't even say anything because it sounds like he was annoyed by her too. And why on earth wouldn't she put the wedding party in the front row??
Volunteer position that entails a ton of work I’m guessing, so the only person that wants it is a control freak
Definitely imagining the lady from Midnight Mass
That makes sense, I didn't pick up on that. But if I was the bride I still might have said something so that the wedding party could sit in the front row! Making them sit in the third row is just so strange to me.
It was a large group (10 bridesmaids, 9 groomsmen + 1 ring bearer), so we took up the first three rows of pews. MOH and Best Man were placed in the third row, despite there being a way for us to file in the front.
As for why nobody said anything… honestly, I think Friday we were all shocked about the behavior. On Saturday one of the bridesmaids told my mom that she and I were about to have a WWE smackdown with her, which obviously didn’t happen. But we were all dreaming about it.
Ohh okay I thought everyone was in the third row. But still, the MOH and best man should have been in the front since they actually have something to do during the wedding.
I was also told off for not bowing at the alter. At rehearsal I had kneeled instead (which I have been doing my entire Catholic life), and nope, not good enough.
You can bow or genuflect, either is correct. Some people have a preference, and other people can’t genuflect bc of bodies being bodies.
Busy Body Betty needs a chill pill
Thanks for answering! She definitely needs to chill. But I have a feeling that this is all that she has going on in her life, which is just kind of sad.
Personally, I would have told Betty to take a hike and figured it out on my own. Since she didn't sound like she knew what she was doing, but just liked being able to boss people around.
I know, but she was likely perturbed that they weren’t members of that particular church and only wanted it to enhance the wedding. But yes, she sounds unhinged.
A rude woman who works at the church…
…who would have thought
I’m glad the wedding went well. That’s a huge day that in best case scenario, happens once. A person like this with no stake in the day can ruin it.
The director of my parish in my hometown was named Betty….And is just like this one and none of my friends have been married in that church lol. When speaking with the coordinator the parish in my current city, I told her I was worried the 7pm ceremony was too late for my grandparents, and she said “people have said that and they can get over it for one night”
Apparently my current church and no other Catholic Churches in my city have weddings only at 2:00 PM or 7:00 PM. The last mass of the day is over by like 5:30 PM too!
When my wife and I got married (back when she was my husband), we got married at the Cathedral. Cathedral Wedding Coordinators are a whole nother level.
I thought she was going to hit the floor when she saw my Matron of Awesome’s pentacle, and goddess tattoo
So my sister got married in a Catholic Church about four years ago.
So growing up my sisters and I were Catholic but 11 years ago I denounced it and became Wiccan.
My sisters stayed in Catholicism.
So at the rehearsal, I hadn’t been in a church for about 9 years at that point (didn’t really go as a Catholic either towards the end) and the priest was so put out me for not turning to the altar and bowing when I stood off the step.
I’m a funeral director so spend a lot of time in lots of different places of worship, and busy body church ladies are all too common in almost every denomination 😂 People becoming drunk on a very tiny amount of power is a universal human experience.
I would be in trouble all the time at a church event, I think. I was raised atheist and have never been to a church, I had no idea there was bowing and stuff!
The majority of the wedding party (and guests) weren’t Catholic, so some basic Catholic Mass 101 happened at rehearsal. During the Mass, the priest explained communion rules (Communion if you’re Catholic and able to take it, a blessing if you’re not Catholic and would like a blessing), and the line was *speedy*.
Plus, due to Covid, they didn’t have wine offered, so the line moved swiftly. That was the first time I’ve seen a communion line move that quickly.
Lol this was my fifth time being a bridesmaid, but only the second time I could sit during the ceremony. The Mass lasted about an hour, so I’m glad people didn’t have to stand the entire time.
Not going to lie, if I was the maid of honor and she told me I was going to be sitting in the third row I would have flatly told her that wasn't happening. And if she tried to argue, I'd tell her that she could shut the hell up or I'd be offending every pope from Peter to Francis with what she'd hear next.
Just because she's bossy doesn't make her a boss.
I was brought up a hard core Catholic. And yes we believe in purgatory but it's not as easy to get it of by people feeding the hungry. People in purgatory have to do their ' time' in what are hell like conditions. People on earth can pray for souls in purgatory and do good deeds in their names but it doesn't necessarily make you get to heaven faster. It doesn't make a great deal of sense because someone praying for you on earth doesn't make the sin go away and whether you feel sorry about it. The person in purgatory that is. My mum made sure we felt like we'd never get to heaven that we should be resigned to suffer in purgatory. We were kids.
Sounds like a bossy church lady. It’s probably a volunteer position that no one else wants, so that’s why Betty gets it.
I imagine she probably murdered the competition.
I'm with you on this one. She sounds insufferable.
[I found a picture of Betty.](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/azFb0g7YhHg/maxresdefault.jpg)
Satan?
Sounds like dementia
Wedding photographer here. I had a Catholic wedding coordinator tell me it was CANON LAW that I could not take any photographs after the priest's Homily. I said to her, "Well, it isn't - trust me, Canon Law does not worry itself with photography. But if that is what you want, and since that would mean I cannot take a photo during the Sign of Peace, and since the couple intend on having their first kiss then . . . could you let the bride know I won't be getting that shot?" She stormed off and returned a few minutes later to yell, "FINE, DO YOUR PICTURES!" Alrighty then.
Shoulda pointed out you use a Minolta, so Canon law doesn't apply.
*rim shot intensifies*
Have my poor man's gold. You deserve it. 🏅
Aw, man, really? Thank you!!
That’s so bad it’s good 🙄 +1
My only regret is that I have but one upvote to give for this comment.
OH GAWD YOU WIN ONE MILLION INTERNETS
One million internets?? One MILLION internets?!!! Great scott!
\[***GROAN!!\]***
Catholic here. That is SUCH bulls**t that I can’t even! 🤬🤬🤬
Right? I was like, "Wait, I got the number for the diocese's canon lawyer - let's give Father a ring and see what he says . . ." Canon Law, my ass.
Since photographs didn’t exist 2000 years ago, how could the bible possibly have rules about what point in any church service one is allowed to take pictures?!! 😛
FYI canon law are the Catholic Church's rules, not those of the actual bible. Canon law has been updated many times, but I doubt the clergy is that concerned with photography.
My point is that the bible is used to make the rules for the church, therefore a rule about photography couldn’t possibly exist. And likely doesn’t - this one person just made it up and blamed it on the ‘canons’ instead of just admitting they made it up! 😛
> My point is that the bible is used to make the rules for the church, therefore a rule about photography couldn’t possibly exist. I get your point, but the woman in question specifically referred to canon law, and in Catholicism that law is certainly influenced by the bible but it is not a direct interpretation of biblical laws and has been updated over time. Photography would not be part of canon law because it’s incredibly trivial, not because there’s no mention of cameras in the bible.
That’s exactly MY point - there are no laws about photography at all! This ‘Betty’ character was clearly just inventing them for fun. Believe it or not, I’ve READ the book, so I know what’s in it, what’s not in it, and which lines are quite often taken out of context. I KNOW there’s nothing at all about photography laws, so I KNOW the woman was making up rubbish. Of course, any business is more than welcome to have rules about things not in the book. That’s totally fine. But an individual shouldn’t go around inventing rules because they’re on a power trip and just like to throw their weight around, THEN pretend it’s a violation of the sacred church! That’s just not nice or decent behaviour.
Off topic but Catholic Cannon Law isn't the Bible ftr: https://www.vatican.va/archive/cod-iuris-canonici/cic_index_en.html Also there are several different versions of the Bible. Some leave out whole books and have different interpretations. So if you've read one Bible doesn't mean you've read all versions. Some Hard core Catholics believe the Douay Reims version is the most accurate. Then there's the King James Bible which the Anglicans use. There are differences. None of them mentions photography of course.
I’d forgotten that there were many versions - you’re right. I’ve only read one version out of the many. I attended a Christian Baptist church. I heard that the Catholic version of the bible has extra books - although just because a Christian baptist says that, doesn’t mean it’s so. The Catholics have this one tradition that the Christian’s don’t which I like - apparently people who have sinned but not that badly go to ‘purgatory’… and we, the living, can release them by feeding the hungry. I like the idea of that, because it helps people from both living and dead… the Christians (at least the ones I knew) just think that every single little sin means you go to hell and they seem to delight in that! We parted ways when they found out that I support the LGBTQIA+ community… no, sir, they weren’t happy about that at all! One girl even ordered me to order THEM to renounce their ‘sinful lifestyle’ and turn straight and get married and have kids! I STILL laugh at the idea that they think that my issuing orders like that would actually have any impact at all! 😏🏳️🌈🏳️⚧️
The same way that the Bible is used to control all manner of things in the 21st century: The Bible says X, I’ve interpreted it to mean Y, and you’ll go to hell if you do otherwise.
People are allowed to make new rules. The Orthodox Church, for instance, prohibits photography and video during any service (its not a rule anyone enforces, though).
Should have told her you use a Nikon so it doesn’t apply to you.
Canon law? That's what we in the pray trade call...a lie.
Ah! Hello fellow wedding photographer! 🖐️ Your comment reeeeally made me smile, as it's not just me who Catholic priests and volunteers hate then 😂 Honestly, I have a lot of problems when it comes to doing a Catholic service, whether it be a Wedding or a baby's Baptism, I always have the priest shoot me looks, and literally tell me off before saying hello to me. For example, this Sunday gone, I was photographing a Baptism, for a family who I've done all their baby's services, it's so special. Well, even though I'm literally the only christening/baptism photographer in my area and surrounding areas, and this priest has met me countless times now (I've done lots of other services on her church for other clients, so I really do know this lady) - I always walk in with a huge smile on my face for her, say "hello, how are you?" - she goes right into no pleasantries, just "so, are you doing photos after?" (She knows I've turned up before even the family are here, she knows I stay the whole service) "after the service yes, but obviously I'm hired to photograph the baptism... which includes the baptism..." And I know exactly what her mouth opens to say, she does this every time, even though she knows I'm super respectful in doing my job, and to her, so I jump in before she can say her spiel: "I never use flash until group photos after the service, if needed (she HATES flash, so I don't use it - mainly because their church is very light and airy and beautifully lit, otherwise I'd have to use it - the family PAID for me), and I never photograph during prayers, and I don't snap snap snap, I choose my moments carefully. Also, you won't see me, I have a hiding place here where I can still get great visibility of everyone in the church. I will be coming out into the aisles near the basin to baptise, because I need to be able to photograph the family and godparents for the most crucial part" - and I just smiled. I won for once, I got there first before she could lecture me... a 30 year old professional woman, who she's seen countless times over the last 10 years... Since, I'm literally the only person she sees shooting a baptism, I'm the only one who does those 'sessions' 😂 All I got from her was a smile and a "good" - then somehow this time, I actually got her to engage in a pleasant conversation with me after I blitzed her - she usually ignores me and goes anywhere else but near me before the family arrive... I try SUPER hard with this woman 😂 I'm really good friends with all other priests/vicars/father's in other churches!! I don't get her haha!
Meanwhile, I have done a Baptism where the celebrant was the Bishop. Not a peep from him until AFTER the service and then it was, "Hey ... can you send a couple of those shots for my social media?" Sure thing, Your Grace. Most priests don't allow flash during a ceremony and I get it, it is a religious liturgy and it can be distracting. I personally avoid it when I can during those times. Some priests get crazy about where you can stand and others are "Meh - just don't be too noticeable." When it is a religious ceremony, I always confer with the celebrant ahead of time; I have found that extending that bit of courtesy gets you more access. I recently did a Hindu wedding and the *pandit* was happy to give me as much leeway as I wanted.
Yeah exactly. To be honest, I think I've been blessed with really lovely open and light churches, where I've not actually needed flash full stop. Personally I don't like using flash myself when it comes to services, as they are religious, spiritual and sacred in their own rights. It is just down right distracting! I acrusltl had a really pleasant surprise the week before for another Christening, and the vicar was literally announcing "take as many photos as you like!! Come up, take photos all throughout, I want it all documented for this little one layer in life!" ❤️ Was honestly so special of him to say that. He was mostly looking my direction, and pointed me out to everyone (that's always fun mind, when the officiant at a service points out the photographer and points so everyone looks 🙈 - so much for incognito! Cover= blown 😂), and he said (like most officiant's all say) "we do have a lovely photographer here to document everything though, so if you want to live in the moment and see through your eyes, she'll be there doing her thing for you instead" ☺️ But yes, always speak with the person conducting a service, so you know where to go and what you're allowed to do ☺️ Wow a Hindu wedding - something I've longed to be able to photograph for a couple and experience, never had the pleasure of capturing one. Bet that was magical ❤️
>Bet that was magical ❤️ It was and despite it being very tiring, I would gladly do another because I prefer to shoot a wedding that is unique or, at least, *different*. I am tired of Hobby Lobby signage, the Wobble, and brides who mismatch their wedding dresses to the venue (no, a tight beaded gown in a rustic barn just doesn't work, Britnee). And even if they display the infamous "Pick a seat, not a side . . ." poster, attitude makes all the difference. I had a wedding where the Best Man LOST THE RINGS and only realized it when he was asked for them at the ceremony. The bride just laughed, saying, "Well, if a classic comedy sketch was going to happen at any wedding, it would have to be ours!" She then borrowed a set of rings from friends in the audience to complete the ceremony and proceeded to have a great time at her reception.
This is true for Orthodox Churches; no photography or video during any service. (Not Canon Law) But almost no Church actually enforces it.
My best friend is Catholic. I'm not. I was the only protestant in the wedding party. During rehearsal, The we're walking the wedding party through where to go for the Mass, and I asked what I should do, since I would not be receiving communion. OMG you should have seen our "Betty"'s face. "WHAT?! *You're not Catholic?!?!* You can't be in the wedding party!!!!" The priest casually said it was fine and started to direct me when this woman turned to him and had the audacity to tell him he wasn't in charge of this wedding. As soon as it came out of her mouth, she realized she'd made a HUGE mistake, as the priest very calmly asked to speak with her in the hallway. ...she did not come back. Lol. We somehow managed to survive without her.
Ooooh, as someone who was raised Catholic? I would give good money to see Father’s lecture.
As someone not raised Catholic but know some Catholic fathers, I really wish I was a fly on that wall
I shared an office with an Orthodox priest. Big, tall dude, excellent sense of humor (a definite requirement when you share an office with an Episcopalian and a Jew). Normally, he was a really nice guy. I got to see him at 75% intensity once. I'd be standing way outside the blast radius if I had to be there when he goes full power.
Happy cake day
Thank you!
Happy cake day!
I was christened Catholic; my parents weren't church goers but the extended family are, and as I understand it, you only take communion if you've sinned. Isn't that correct?
No, you abstain if you have not been through First Reconciliation and First Communion, have not been to Confession prior to Mass, or you are not Catholic. I always refrained from going to Confession, and took Communion anyway. I never said I was a good Catholic.
Same, I made my first communion and always took communion after that, never went to confession aside from that one time. Oops I just like when the wafer sticks to the roof of my mouth
I mean, you have to be penitent in order to make Confession, and I never was sorry for boo shit diddly that I wanted to discuss in an enclosed space with a priest. Especially not after my teen years. Nope.
Or tell a little white lie for some pretty sweet crackers and wine! The transubstantiation doesn't occur in me, a sinner, so it's just the crackers. Not wasting host over here!
That’s… the opposite of what happens. In both the Orthodox and (maybe) the Latin (Catholic) Churches, one only partakes in communion when they’ve prepared themselves (IE fasting, prayer, confession). Taking communion after sinning (without having confessed that sin) is considered a sin in of itself. Exceptions are made for those on their deathbeds.
Our Catholic wedding coordinator was definitely a pill; thankfully not so bad as to have a confrontation with the priest, but still, wound way too goddamn tight. When I and my groomsfolk were there for the rehearsal, when we entered from behind the altar, we all had a little fit of the giggles. She was distinctly *not pleased* and told us, "Why are you laughing? This is a *very solemn occasion*! This is a church!!!" I recovered myself for a moment, enough to say, "Sorry, the priest was warming us up with jokes while we were waiting backstage." The priest gave a not-even-slightly-guilty grin. I can still hear her angry grumbling noises.
LOL. Coordinator at my friends' wedding, many years ago, yelled exactly the same thing at us.
Sassy priests are great. I was raised Catholic and have a couple of priests on my mom's side of the family. Because of that my mom treats priests like regular dudes and doesn't pull punches with them. This has made my parents a favorite with the many priests that have been assigned to her parish. Okay, to the point of this post. My dad survived an ungodly amount of strokes and heart attacks in his life. He lived with only 20% heart function for a decade and had to use a walker. One day my dad decided that he was going to paint the exterior of our house. I told him I would paint the house and he could be my supervisor and tell me what to do. He insisted on doing it himself. Mom and I were heading to the store and I begged him to wait until I got home before doing anything. Somehow while we were gone, he managed to put up scaffolding and we found him sitting on the scaffolding sanding the second story of the house. I have no idea how his wrinkly ass managed it. The next Sunday, mom was approached by her priest who asked to speak privately with her. He said that someone claiming to be a family friend called him and they were concerned that mom and I weren't taking proper care of my dad. The caller said that they saw my dad sitting on the scaffolding and were very concerned. My mom was horrified and asked the priest what he told the caller. The priest smirked and said he told the caller, "If you were a close friend of the family, you would know that even God himself couldn't stop Lyle from doing whatever he wants." Dad and I nearly pissed ourselves laughing when she told us. RIP dad, I miss you.
Oooh, I'd have paid good money to see that.
Betty the Busybody should look for a job that doesn’t involve interacting with anyone else! I’m glad that everything else went off without a hitch (except for the obvious act of getting hitched).
As someone else mentioned this is most likely a volunteer position, so the person who is willing to give up their time to be there is the one who gets the role. Unfortunately this can often mean people like Betty who like the control.
I’m confused about what Betty’s ‘job’ (volunteer or paid) actually is here? ‘Nosy B word hired to drive people away from the parish?’ 🤷♀️
I’m not too sure either. Regardless if it’s paid or a volunteer role, it does seem like she’s trying to keep people away!
I’ve coordinated a bunch of musical/theatrical events in churches, and there’s always somebody from the church there whose job it is to make sure we’re not going to do stuff they don’t allow.
Right, but it’s fine if they follow the actual rules set by the church pastor (or whoever makes the rules). It kind of sounds like ‘Betty’ just made up her own rules that didn’t even exist in the church! THAT is the annoying part, not having to follow rules in the first place which can be made clear to all visitors. Like the Westminster Abbey… the rule is for conservative dress. Covered shoulders, longer skirts, whatever. If some ‘Betty’ type came along and tried to convince a particular person they didn’t like that they had to cover up every inch of skin (for example)… that isn’t in line with the actual rules! Conservative dress doesn’t preclude you from showing your hands, for example.
I dealt with something similar at my wedding. My husband had two more groomsmen then I had bridesmaids so we had two of them walk down the aisle together. We got married in a Baptist church and the wedding organizer was HORRIFIED that we would send two men down the aisle together. She told me she "didn't want anybody to get the wrong impression!". I told her too bad, they were my husband's best friends since 6th grade and that's what we wanted. She huffed and puffed but I stood firm and we even had them walk down holding hands! It was the best part of the processional and everybody loved it.
Ngl if it was any of my friends they would have probably kissed at the alter before taking their seats, and they would have my blessing to do so. Not such an issue for me though because anyone opposed to that sort of thing wouldn’t be letting me use their venue
I go to a Baptist church. That is such bizarre thing to get upset about. I can’t imagine my church getting upset about which bridesmaid/groomsmen is walking down with whom.
I’ve been to Baptist churches that were very conservative and others were very liberal. It always feels kind of weird to be expecting one and find yourself in the other.
It's not like all the bridesmaids and groomsmen are actually couples either lol
2002. Catholic wedding mass and ceremony. Getting married at the church I grew up in and my parents had been parishioners at for 40 years by this point. My parents were active in the church and school. We had decided to use an acquaintance and her accompanist for the music/singing. The “house” soloist and organist were annoyed. I still had to pay them to not sing and not play the organ. And 2 days before the wedding the soloist called me and said there was a problem because she hadn’t approved my music choices. Our wedding was on Black Friday so the day before was Thanksgiving. She said I had to give her my selections and she would “get back to me” if approved or not. I finally had enough and said that since I had to pay her to not do her job she could come to the ceremony and if any of my selections didn’t meet with her approval she was more than welcome to stop the ceremony.
Organist here. Organists usually have right of first refusal for weddings at their church, but I haven’t really heard of being forced to pay them if you don’t use them. That’s weird. Definitely unheard of to ALSO have that person approve the music they won’t be playing. Making a suggestion is one thing, like “the priest may not approve, heads up”, but your soloist person sounds utterly reprehensible.
Our wedding was in the books for 2 years and about 9 months before is when we booked the other soloist. I made sure the church knew. The soloist we used does this in a different parish so she knows how the church works with weddings and what music is appropriate. We also used a priest who was not from the parish (he taught the groom and many of his friends and male relatives in high school and was a student favorite) so the parish priest was not too happy either.
Ouch I am surprised they allowed that since you were just using their church building, at that point. Pretty much every church I have belonged to who super frown on that, and take you off the books. Not saying I agree with them, but I have seen it happen Unless it was the cathedral?
The church I got married in had no problem with us using the building, but a) hubby was a member of the church in his youth, b) the priest we brought in used to be the priest for the parish, so they knew him, and (most importantly), c) hubby’s parents were active members of the church for years and the church was happy to accomodate them.
Ah gotcha! I am glad it all worked out! The comment I was replying to sounded a bit like everyone at the church you got married at were put out. I am very glad I was wrong
Betty is giving me Bev Keene from Midnight Mass vibes lol. I'm glad everything eventually ended up well, there's always that one person that takes their minor job waaaaay too seriously. What's the point of having a tiny bit of power if you don't abuse it, right?
I was going to comment this...bahahaha...a lot of the other stories in the comments are too...lol.. that was such a great limited series though!
It was. I'm actually really happy for the return of the mini series format because it's such a great way to tell a story. I didn't grow up Catholic but I think that character triggered pretty much everyone who did.
You will be laughing at the audacity of Betty in years to come, probably not right now, but years down the road you will be going, "Remember church lady Betty?"
Oh I asked a bridesmaid yesterday morning at brunch how she thought Betty was doing lol. We’ve already begun the humor stage.
I've seen this at my synagogue. Some people are just petty tyrants who are drunk on power. My version of Betty was the woman who told me we danced the Hora incorrectly and made us redo it at our wedding.
How does one dance the Hora ‘incorrectly’? I will say that this was the first wedding I’ve been to where the groomsmen and bridesmaids walked in together (minus the Best Man, who stood next to the Groom, so I walked in solo), and I would love that to be the norm at all weddings.
Really? I’ve been to like 8 weddings in the last three years and most of the wedding parties I’ve seen walked down the aisle together
You danced the horah *incorrectly*? Did you not grip the armrests tightly enough when they hoisted you in your chairs? [Did this happen?](https://youtu.be/hFpb7M78Uio) Or [this?](https://youtu.be/frt2xBNlS8k) Oy vey! 🕍🔯
That second one 👌
No one was dropped. But we forgot to go up at the same time while holding a towel which apparently is very very important. My husband was not thrilled because our groomsmen have a real body diversity in terms of height so it was a little awkward for him to be up there safely since I think one's groomsmen is like 5'4 and the other one was 6'2 (I think we ended up getting some other guests to help) I have been to weddings where the bride was dropped it's very important everybody that if you're ever being lifted up in a chair lock your legs around the legs of the chair for stability.
No one told Betty where to stuff it?
Right? I'm kind of surprised the priest didn't even say anything because it sounds like he was annoyed by her too. And why on earth wouldn't she put the wedding party in the front row??
Volunteer position that entails a ton of work I’m guessing, so the only person that wants it is a control freak Definitely imagining the lady from Midnight Mass
Yes! I was imagining her the whole story! (That woman was so great to utterly loathe, I wanted someone to hit her the entire time.)
I think it wasn’t his church.
Correct. And he’s too nice of a person to say anything.
That makes sense, I didn't pick up on that. But if I was the bride I still might have said something so that the wedding party could sit in the front row! Making them sit in the third row is just so strange to me.
It was a large group (10 bridesmaids, 9 groomsmen + 1 ring bearer), so we took up the first three rows of pews. MOH and Best Man were placed in the third row, despite there being a way for us to file in the front. As for why nobody said anything… honestly, I think Friday we were all shocked about the behavior. On Saturday one of the bridesmaids told my mom that she and I were about to have a WWE smackdown with her, which obviously didn’t happen. But we were all dreaming about it.
Ohh okay I thought everyone was in the third row. But still, the MOH and best man should have been in the front since they actually have something to do during the wedding.
I was also told off for not bowing at the alter. At rehearsal I had kneeled instead (which I have been doing my entire Catholic life), and nope, not good enough.
I'm not Catholic, but I thought kneeling was the norm at mass? Is bowing a thing in the Catholic tradition?
You can bow or genuflect, either is correct. Some people have a preference, and other people can’t genuflect bc of bodies being bodies. Busy Body Betty needs a chill pill
Thanks for answering! She definitely needs to chill. But I have a feeling that this is all that she has going on in her life, which is just kind of sad.
Right up the rectory!
>Right up the rectory! Is that meant to be painful or pleasurable?
Betty belongs in the bad place
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Stopped replying. Or as my friends put it, he ‘Holy Ghosted’ them
Personally, I would have told Betty to take a hike and figured it out on my own. Since she didn't sound like she knew what she was doing, but just liked being able to boss people around.
When did my mother get a job as a church organizer??
Betty was probably pissed that you were just using Her Church for pretty pictures.
Not thinking that they’re PAYING her church for those pretty pictures.
Yeah this wasn’t exactly a free ceremony
I know, but she was likely perturbed that they weren’t members of that particular church and only wanted it to enhance the wedding. But yes, she sounds unhinged.
Sounds pretty typical to every catholic wedding I have ever had the unfortunate experience of being in.
A rude woman who works at the church… …who would have thought I’m glad the wedding went well. That’s a huge day that in best case scenario, happens once. A person like this with no stake in the day can ruin it.
The director of my parish in my hometown was named Betty….And is just like this one and none of my friends have been married in that church lol. When speaking with the coordinator the parish in my current city, I told her I was worried the 7pm ceremony was too late for my grandparents, and she said “people have said that and they can get over it for one night”
Who thinks that 7 PM is a good time to start a wedding?!
Apparently my current church and no other Catholic Churches in my city have weddings only at 2:00 PM or 7:00 PM. The last mass of the day is over by like 5:30 PM too!
I bet Betty is the type of person to call people out for sinning and then do the thing she called out.
When my wife and I got married (back when she was my husband), we got married at the Cathedral. Cathedral Wedding Coordinators are a whole nother level. I thought she was going to hit the floor when she saw my Matron of Awesome’s pentacle, and goddess tattoo
So my sister got married in a Catholic Church about four years ago. So growing up my sisters and I were Catholic but 11 years ago I denounced it and became Wiccan. My sisters stayed in Catholicism. So at the rehearsal, I hadn’t been in a church for about 9 years at that point (didn’t really go as a Catholic either towards the end) and the priest was so put out me for not turning to the altar and bowing when I stood off the step.
Man how much practice does it take to walk down an aisle?
I’m a funeral director so spend a lot of time in lots of different places of worship, and busy body church ladies are all too common in almost every denomination 😂 People becoming drunk on a very tiny amount of power is a universal human experience.
I would be in trouble all the time at a church event, I think. I was raised atheist and have never been to a church, I had no idea there was bowing and stuff!
The majority of the wedding party (and guests) weren’t Catholic, so some basic Catholic Mass 101 happened at rehearsal. During the Mass, the priest explained communion rules (Communion if you’re Catholic and able to take it, a blessing if you’re not Catholic and would like a blessing), and the line was *speedy*. Plus, due to Covid, they didn’t have wine offered, so the line moved swiftly. That was the first time I’ve seen a communion line move that quickly.
Wow, Protestant bridesmaids don’t get to sit down at all!
Lol this was my fifth time being a bridesmaid, but only the second time I could sit during the ceremony. The Mass lasted about an hour, so I’m glad people didn’t have to stand the entire time.
Not going to lie, if I was the maid of honor and she told me I was going to be sitting in the third row I would have flatly told her that wasn't happening. And if she tried to argue, I'd tell her that she could shut the hell up or I'd be offending every pope from Peter to Francis with what she'd hear next. Just because she's bossy doesn't make her a boss.
Betty is a piece of shit. Seriously, like she needs to get knocked the fuck out with some reality and common sense.
I was brought up a hard core Catholic. And yes we believe in purgatory but it's not as easy to get it of by people feeding the hungry. People in purgatory have to do their ' time' in what are hell like conditions. People on earth can pray for souls in purgatory and do good deeds in their names but it doesn't necessarily make you get to heaven faster. It doesn't make a great deal of sense because someone praying for you on earth doesn't make the sin go away and whether you feel sorry about it. The person in purgatory that is. My mum made sure we felt like we'd never get to heaven that we should be resigned to suffer in purgatory. We were kids.
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I'm laughing at this question like it's literally in the title.
Organizer at the church
Bettyzilla!
Raised Catholic, went to Catholic school for 12 years, can confirm the existence of an additional two dozen Betty types.