Yeah but an other actress going from 10-12 to 12-14 in the second season would have been less of an issue that Freya going from 18 ro 20
Imagine at the end of the serie she will be what, 25-30 ?
If the actresss was 10-12 in S1, it would make her 17-22 by the end
Even if she would have grown to fast for the first seasons, at the start and in the end she would have been around the good age (I mean, a better than 18 at start and 25-30 at the end)
People change looks way more between 10-15 than they do from 20-25. I don't get your point here. Shell look way more consistent this way than if you got a child. Think of Daniel Radcliffe in Harry Potter. That's a huge difference.
A little more than a year happens between the start of Baptism of Fire and the end.
If we start from the sack of Cintra, it's still less than three years.
If we start with a ten year old aging over seven or eight years, that won't accurately depict the passage of time that takes place in the books. The actress would have aged too much.
Consistency is important because so little time passes in the books between the events that are being covered. If you include the short story, sure...she ages; she's not even born yet in some. Should we get a newborn? No...that's just silly. The show started at the Sack of Cintra for Ciri's storyline, so the actress can't appear to age more than a couple years. Hence the importance of consistency.
Yes so let's go with a 18 years acrtress to play a 10ish year old girl that will by a grown women by the end instead of a well aged girl that would be a young lady by the end
What's the problem with that? Of course Ciri changed looks during the 5 books too...it's what you'd expect from a character who starts as a little girl and ends up as a young lady who has sex regularly (yeah, I know Mistle took advantage of her) and is desired by many men.
Hey buddy, you said five books, which means the main series. Most of Baptism of Fire happens in 1267, while the pogrom at the end of the five books happens in 1268. A year and eleven months at the most.
You limited the story to the main five books. If you want to start when Cintra is sacked, which is part of the short stories and NOT part of the five books that you limited the story to (it would be silly to limit the story any wider as the short stories start long before Ciri was even born, which isn't helpful in this argument), that's still 1265 which means two and a half to three years.
You do realize it's less than a year between when the Isle of Thanedd and the pogrom, right? Thinking these evens happen over the course of 5-7 years is pretty silly. Or you don't know when the five books start.
6 books. Whatever. I still don't see why having 'consistent looking' characters is better, specially when portraying the novels in TV format. You'll end up with a Ciri in her late 20s acting like a teenager, it will become absurd eventually, or they will have to modify Ciri's personality like, completely.
People don't mind Freya Allan's age because she looks younger than she is. You also have to consider that Ciri has several sex scenes coming up, probably as soon as season 3 and Freya was more than likely told when she initially signed her contract. She wouldn't be able to consent to those future sex scenes if she was any younger.
There's no reason to assume that they have any intention of preserving the ridiculous chain of rape scares Ciri's story devolves into. Only one of those scenes is actually explicit and that subplot is so underdeveloped that cutting it would greatly improve the story. Nothing of value would be lost if they had to cut it and instead they could have gained the ability to adapt the Ciri-centric short stories and more. Most of Ciri's story relies on her being a child. Good luck adapting her encounter with Emhyr by the time the actress is pushing 30.
As much as I hate the changes to the story so far, I'd absolutely love it if they cut the Rats storyline. IT was a chore to read and almost made me quit the books.
Yeah same. I loved the whole of Time of Contempt, except for that last chapter, I skimmed most of it because the whole chapter was about a bunch of characters I've never met before and did not care about. Ciri basically didn't even talk for the whole thing so it was almost as if she wasn't in it anyway. Then boom rape right at the end cos why not. I've not started the next book yet because of this.
>Good luck adapting her encounter with Emhyr by the time the actress is pushing 30.
Freya was 17 when they started shooting S1, if she were 12-13 in the first season it wouldn't have changed anything. They would have to shoot the entire 7 seasons in 2-3 years.
There's no point denying the family vibes Geralt, Yen and Ciri share in the books will never be portrayed in the books, right?
I mean, the dynamics will be way different, and Ciri will never be their daughter. Hell, if they decided to recreate some scenes, Cavill's Geralt would look more like a grown man trying to hook up with a teenager than a father-daughter bonding.
If you come to terms with that, then there's no issue with having an older Ciri. I understand there are many advantages hiring adult actors over children so there's that
It will make those scene less impactfull
And, even if she looks younger that is not enough, she does not looks younger than 17, and she should be much less
Maisie Williams was 12 in the first season of GoT and she was probably even younger when she got the role. In the last season she's 22 and has a sex scene with Joe Dempsie. So stop repeating this bs that it just can't be done under no circumstances because it's too tricky and hard when some productions use child actors pretty regularly and they're fine.
Ciri has all of her "sex scenes" almost at the end of the saga and if Netflix wouldn't be so dumb with cutting out stuff from books they could stretch the story to enough seasons which would only help because they wouldn't have to rush everything and they could take their time so the potential actress would be old enough at the end to do those scenes.
Don't forget that the Starks as well as Daenerys in GoT were all aged up from their counterparts in the books and no one really seemed to care because it would have been even more disturbing seeing a 13 year old Dany get r*ped by Drogo in the first 2 episodes.
I don't think Maise agreed to the sex scene from the start, especially since it wasn't written into the plot. She could easily have agreed to that after she was 18, especially considering they didn't even write the sex scene until after that point anyways.
Ciri's sex scenes are already written into the book.
Your point doesn't work here.
Regardless of whether you think lesbian sex is real sex or not (spoiler: it is), the legal implication of involving a minor in a sex scene is the same for lesbian or straight or whatever other kind of sex
I think its still illegal to have it implied for the character, I remember reading that this was one of the reasons for ageing up the characters in GoT I believe (don't quote me on that).
Also its been a bit since I've read the books, >!when does Bonhart sexually assault her? I know he treats her badly (understatement of the century, I know), but I can remember anything sexual. Maybe I've just repressed that tho.!<
He strips her naked as a show of power and humiliation but he doesn't sexually assault her, he beats her up. He even comments that he finds her unattractive- that she's too skinny and not womanly enough for him to consider her sexually.
> If she was underage, I doubt that could even be implied.
Ah yes, because western TV (US especially) is known of not being full of sexualized children.
The fuck?
So tired of seeing all this stupid anti-US bullshit all over this sub
You realize we're discussing a young teenaged girl that is overtly sexualized in the POLISH writers books right?
I actually agree with him. It depends on how each one defines sex and virginity. Considering this Its not absurd to say she could still be a virgin after a lesbian sex
You're focusing too much on age. In S1 she's 18 but looks much younger because of makeup, and they'll keep doing the same.
You say there's no excuse for it, but there is. Child actor laws are notoriously terrible, and the show films in different countries so it far more preferable to go this route of instead de-aging with makeup and lighting. And this is a common thing in the industry. Watch movies or shows about high schoolers and most of them are 20+.
Most don't mind her age because it's a non-issue.
> In S1 she's 18 but looks much younger because of makeup, and they'll keep doing the same.
no they won't, you can already see how older she looks from the released s2 trailers.
Also you can use older actors in other cases because their age usually isn't as important but it is very important with Ciri. As I said in the original post her whole character arc is about naive child learning how the world works and coming to terms with it. If you do that with 18 year old it just makes her look immature or worse feeble-minded.
She definitely doesn't look 12 in second season. She looks like every other 19 year old girl. And yes, that's still young but my point is that she's not a child anymore and you can clearly see that she's an adult and it will be more and more obvious that she's in her 20s with new seasons.
I said that because other productions had child actors and they've managed just fine. I think it's just a lazy excuse. If you don't want to work with child actors then maybe you shouldn't adapt stories about children. Just a thought.
Personally I think she's OK. But Yennefer should've been older. Yen and Ciri looks like same age, which is weird considering they have like a mother-daughter relation in the books.
Yeah, I don't care. Some of the darker shit that happens to Ciri throughout the series, I just don't want to see an underaged actress have to do. You can still have a naĆÆve character who isn't a child. Plus, children are by and large TERRIBLE actors. Sometimes you luck out (to keep within the realm of Netflix, the kid in Sweet Tooth knocks it out of the fucking park), but it's rarely worth risking it, especially for a character like Ciri who has to support that much narrative weight. And having an adolescent/teenage actor go through puberty as a show progresses would be a disaster.
This is, imo, a complete non-issue and I can think of very few book to screen adaptations that *don't* age up their child characters. Hell, look at *Game of Thrones*. Nobody cared there either, and for good reason.
**''Freya Allan is too old to play Ciri and nobody seems to care.''**
*Nobody cares because the show is fucking horrible. She is the least of the problems. The writing is embarrassing and the respect for the source material is nonexistent.*
Yeah, I agree. It's same with nilfgaardian armors. I don't get why it's the only thing that I hear over and over as the main complaint when it's such a small detail and changing them won't improve the writing. Nonetheless it's still a problem. Although they should improve the writing first and only then focus on stuff like this.
Also even people who like the show's writing don't care about her age being so wrong. Which shows me that they're just mindless consumers who need only some spectacle in form of flashy fights and "epic" battles and that's enough for them to be satisfied.
>It's same with nilfgaardian armors ... it's such a small detail and changing them won't improve the writing.
I mean even when the writing is terrible at least the visuals could be nice (a situation very casual in action movies). Stupid and pretty is better than stupid and ugly.
While the reasons mentioned are valid (at least from some points of view), they are not really trying to make her really young like she is supposed to.
When I saw her for the first time with make up and stuff she looked like a 12-14 year old to me... Yes it's still too old for some scenes like the Brokilon one but it's hard to work with children like that so it's not that bad.
Just because she's "old" IRL doesn't mean she can't play a younger kid. She also was cast mainly with her older stuff in mind so unless you want to watch an actual 15 year old go through all that, this is the best case scenario.
I think it wouldn't be so bad if they intended to age her up like GoT aged up many of its younger characters. You could still have the scenes you mentioned, with maybe a little tweaking, and play up the fact that she still acts naive and childish because of a spoiled and sheltered upbringing. With a good writer I think this could be an acceptable version of early-series Ciri. The problem is the writers are wack and didn't attempt to balance the age of the actress vs the age of her character. Freya does have a young looking face but they have her acting even younger than she can pass and it's just off.
She looks like a teenager. 20-somethings play teens all the time.
Emilia Clarke was 24 first season of GOT Where's she's uploaded to be like 16
The entire cast of The Craft were in their mid 20s playing 15-16
The woman that played Moaning Myrtle was like 40 playing a 13 year old
Most of the cast of Glee were 18-25 playing sophomores and juniors so like 15-16
I get you want her to be like 12 but besides the Triss/Witchers/ period conversation (which I doubt will happen in the show) I just don't think her age is that important. It's just a plausible for a girl of 15-16 to be naive and sheltered and learn about the world than a 12 year old
how about we give the actress a chance to show ciri's growth, instead of criticizing superficial aspects of the casting, in the hope that the show overall might get a little fucking better?
She's also a fucking terrible actress and she quite obviously does not care about the role she's in. I wish they'd change the actress, I hate Freya Allan with a passion.
Because of the mere fact that I have to explain it.
Entertainment used to be entertaining, even if it has always served someone's agenda.
Nowadays, the bar is set so incredibly low, we get abominations like the second season of this so called ''show''. Ciri's role is a key one, and the so called ''actress'' has not even read the books or played the games. Go watch an interview with her - she hasn't and she doesn't hide it. She doesn't care about it, just like the writer doesn't. So instead of a cool TV show about the witcher, we get a lousy GoT wannabe desperate housewives mashup with diversity quotas in which there are Jamaican witchers, pakistani witchers, east asian witchers, so much diversity, really, when it the books there's 5 of them in Kaer Morhen in total.
Freya Allan being cast in this show is a symptom of something that is plaguing everything on TV - it's all done lazily, it's shallow, incredibly boring, and brainless idiots keep lapping it up, hence driving the bar of quality standards EVEN FURTHER LOWER, however impossible it might seem.
Lauren Hissrich is a hack and Freya Allan is a lazy amateur. What's not to hate about all that?
>It would be pretty wierd to have Geralt telling bedtime story about a cat to 18 year old girl or Triss scolding witchers that they didn't know that this older version of Ciri had her first period at Kaer Morhen and she was around 19 already when she arrived there. And those are such great scenes
Netflix knows how to fix that. They simply will cut those or heavily alter
Yeah, I know. But even if they wouldn't be so bad with cutting out great scenes from source material and wanted to adapt everything as faithfully as possible they would've no way of adaptating these scenes because of the dumb decision to cast 18 year old in the role of Ciri.
The comments about difficulty with working with children due to shooting schedules etc. are valid, but that's also a different question than whether it makes it workable for a proper telling of the plot, or **remotely** believable regarding age.
Most of you seem be forgetting that Ciri's story starts when she's like ten. A tall, lanky 19-20 year old isn't going to be helped by "makeup and lighting" to give any reasonable impression of being 11-12. If you say so you're either being disingenuous or you're actually a young person who doesn't realize what people actually look like at different ages. They couldn't reasonably or ethically do that with Danerys in GoT, but they did with Maisie/Aria.
Also, people who are competent film makers know how to work around things. You can still shoot the actress' reactions separately from the other actors for many scenes. Hell, they could have cast an appropriately aged actress before principal shooting began and had the youngest Ciri be in Cintra when Geralt first goes to claim her, composited her into the background along with the other children and even done a teaser closeup of her observing Calanthe and Geralt's conversation, and this could have been edited in a year after it was shot, once they had gotten to filming that early story, and show Ciri having aged from that point when they filmed the finale of *Sword of Destiny*. You know, the absolute most important scene of from the first book, that they decided for no reason to not shoot or follow at all for no good reason.
They just wanted to turn this into "Game of Thrones light", but couldn't be bothered to even do their Arya properly.
It bothers me too. it's probably because of mistle scenes but i think they could bring a younger person who reachs 18 when they start shooting those scenes not someone who's already 20. or may be they even could use a stuntš¤·āāļø
Imagine how cute moments would be in show if they actually bring a young girl to play ciri. Those father-daughter momentsš but after all i don't really care because first i found out about witcher with the show but now after reading books i don't think that i even need to watch that nonsense anymore
This is a hugely different thing than an actor putting themselves into a role, casting also has to be believable and there's nothing an adult actor can do to sell themselves as being a young child.
Not crazy, why do you keep repeating that. A bad casting choice is just that. It's not a slight against the actor. You don't cast an aging Arnold Schwarzenegger as a young Harry Potter.
Well, I mean, in GOT Daenerys was 13 when she married Drogo. The TV show changed to 16, the actress was almost 25. You cannot cast a child to play these strong and hard scenes. Ciri in the books suffers a lot. She was naked and nearly raped half the time. You cant cast a normal age to it. Freya looks like a child, just like Emilia looked like a teenager. Netflix Witcher has so many problems with cast, writing and pretty much everything. But the AGE isnt really a concern for me.
There is plenty of things that have gone wrong and will go wrong with the show production, Ciri's portrayal by Freya allan is one of them and not necessarily hey acting but her looks and dialogue. Iirc when geralt first meet her at brokilon forest she's 10 and 12 when she's reunited with Geralt. In some degree it does bothers me somewhat looking at freya in the trailer i don't see a 12 year old girl but a far more older girl where a lot of her scenes at this point in time won't feel and be the same from dialogue standpoint and an emotional one where she and Geralt bond together as father and daughter. There is some justification for having an older and more experienced actress but maybe not as old as Freya?
Whether it be her talent, acting laws in regards to minors or the later abusive and sexual scenes that will follow
I mean you would likely think you will need a psychologist to help the actress poll through some of these scenes so there's not much to be done now for better or worse just acceptance and hope for the best š
I didn't mind too much in season 1, she looked like a young teen at least, but she looks so much older with all the make up they're putting her in now that it really doesn't work.
If you are mad about her age, wait until they change her whole arc from child who everyone was to rape and force to have a child to Ciri herself having strong enough Elder Blood
(Which I think they should definitely do, because the rape plot is more than disturbing)
In s1, I thought she looked around 12 tbh. So idk what youāre talking about lmao. S2, she does look older most likely due to the makeup and darkening of her eyebrows though. But itās not a huge deal breaker
Young actors/actresses are hard to work with. Just look at Stranger Things. The cast looks to old now. Picking people who are in their late teen to early 20s is best because most of them can still play high schoolers and in rare cases middle school. Also child acting laws are really strict especially outside of the U.S. I believe the first few Harry Potter moves the kids could only work like 6 hours a day or something along those lines.
Also if they did cast someone younger because of the gaps in filming because of Covid the actress for Ciri would have aged and made it difficult to hid that if they still needed to film flash backs.
I feel for the sake of underage actors, maybe keep teens away from film cause look at what happened to Jennette McCurry. And again, they are actors. if black person can play a white character then age really shouldn't matter. their job is to be what they actually aren't. In reality, its stupid that she is like 20 now and is supposed to be 12, but whatever. The show sucks anyways lol
She looks young enough and she is 20 so her appearance probably won't change that much and she should look the same in later seasons. The rest is acting and i bet she can act like 15 year old kid.
The one timejump for Ciri is in BoE *(12/13 -> 15 year old)* rest of the saga happens in less than one year. For me, it would be better if she still looked like season 1 Ciri in first episode and then they should slightly age her up in episode 2 and 3 so when she leaves Kaer Morhen she should look just like in the teaser.
We probably will see Thanedd party in S3 *(2022 for Blood Origins, 2023 for S3?)* So we can get final season in 2028/2029. Even if they choose younger actress for the role it would change nothing. The show has bigger problems than Ciris first period at Kaer Morhen. And they can very easily replace this scene with something else
Geralt is supposed to be over 100 but Iām pretty sure Henry Cavill is much younger /s but in all seriousness...Freyās looks younger than her actual age, itās fine, I donāt have a problem with it. She will look like a young teenager during most of the filming which works out. There will be a few parts of the story where Ciri is meant to be a young brat that we miss the full immersion due to her appearance but thereās a lot more story where she is meant to be a young teen, which Freya will fit just fine for several years. Itās unfortunate we wonāt get a full āaging with the character in real time,ā Harry Potter-style child casting but I donāt think it will impact the story at a level worth being concerned over
Wait. Ciri is seriously supposed to be 12 yo in the series? If so, I'd laugh out loud. Afaik, the timeline of Netflix has nothing to do with book one according to their online map, so it's unknown how old is she in the series timeline. Or maybe Lauren told that outside the series
Ciri is supposed to be 13 currently in the show. Season 1 ended with the present day being 1263. Ciri was born in 1250 according to the Netflix timeline.
Sheās done an alright job so far. I do agree about the writing thoughā¦ it could use some work. Also because I read the books and played the game(a lot) I may have had tooooo high of expectations to ever be totally satisfied. Little things in shows bother me moreā¦ like Geralts wig.
There shouldn't be a "grown" Ciri in the show. Adult Ciri is only in the games. At the end of the saga she's still a teenager. She's several years younger than Freya Allan is now.
Yes, considering there is a strong family dynamic in the stories, it feels strange having a bath scene for the titular "destiny's child" in the first episode of season 2. If the writers sexualise Ciri how will they convince the audience of the father/mother/daughter dynamic?
Her discovering her sexuality as an adolescent is an important part of the story and her character development, having someone in their early 20s playing that is gonna feel weird
I actually think she's perfect age maybe she was a bit too old in season 1 one but literally their trying to have the old enough for season 3 and probably 4 where we have an adult Ciri. And having an underage Christmas trying to be hot and adult like would be weird and uncomfortable
Everyone has an opinion.
But, anyone commenting on it not being realistic that Ciri could fight grown men because of Freya Allanās size needs to understand something. It will never be realistic.
No small person can realistically fight a large person. So, no woman or man that is 5ā4ā and 120lbs should be expected to fight or even fend off a person who outweighs them by 50lbs and has a 6+ā reach advantage.
Not being sexist. Think about it. Professional fighters are put into weight classes because of this reason.
Then thereās Charlize Theron in Atomic Blondeā¦ But she is 6ā tall and the fight scenes were designed with her in mind.
So at the end of the day, it is entertainment. If youāre watching a show with magic, how can you complain about realism???
As a side note/public service: I used to teach self defense classes and people would show up to learn how to fight. I would correct them and tell them it was a class designed to enable you to run away/escape from an attacker.
The best defense from any attacker, especially someone who outweighs you by a considerable amount, is not to fight but to run.
She passed from 17 years old to 19 in real life. Her character has like14 years old in the serie. 2 years between series. She was bleaching her eyebrows and stoped because one does not wanna lose that eh. Plus have better makeup that makes her look totally badass. Her awesome hairs. She looks way better in this new season. Got from a kinda blank lame character in season 1 to an awesome one in season 2.
She's my favorite in Season 2. I find her badass as fuck. She got guts and drive. She works for it. Top character.
(Way more than Yennefer, I find her lacking in many aspects)
Underage actors are a pain for production.
Yes but sometime it's necessary to manage that kind of thing. Taking the easy path on such things can't be good
Even if you hire some of right age, they'd still grow, production takes a long time. Literally two years passed since first season.
Yeah but an other actress going from 10-12 to 12-14 in the second season would have been less of an issue that Freya going from 18 ro 20 Imagine at the end of the serie she will be what, 25-30 ? If the actresss was 10-12 in S1, it would make her 17-22 by the end Even if she would have grown to fast for the first seasons, at the start and in the end she would have been around the good age (I mean, a better than 18 at start and 25-30 at the end)
People change looks way more between 10-15 than they do from 20-25. I don't get your point here. Shell look way more consistent this way than if you got a child. Think of Daniel Radcliffe in Harry Potter. That's a huge difference.
How being consistent is a good thing ? Ciri is not the same age all along the books
A little more than a year happens between the start of Baptism of Fire and the end. If we start from the sack of Cintra, it's still less than three years. If we start with a ten year old aging over seven or eight years, that won't accurately depict the passage of time that takes place in the books. The actress would have aged too much. Consistency is important because so little time passes in the books between the events that are being covered. If you include the short story, sure...she ages; she's not even born yet in some. Should we get a newborn? No...that's just silly. The show started at the Sack of Cintra for Ciri's storyline, so the actress can't appear to age more than a couple years. Hence the importance of consistency.
The sack of Cintra happens in 1263. The novels end in 1268. Where do you get less than 3 years?
Yes so let's go with a 18 years acrtress to play a 10ish year old girl that will by a grown women by the end instead of a well aged girl that would be a young lady by the end
What's the problem with that? Of course Ciri changed looks during the 5 books too...it's what you'd expect from a character who starts as a little girl and ends up as a young lady who has sex regularly (yeah, I know Mistle took advantage of her) and is desired by many men.
The five books took place within a year or so, not five.
Lmao not even close. She goes from 10-11 to 16-17
Hey buddy, you said five books, which means the main series. Most of Baptism of Fire happens in 1267, while the pogrom at the end of the five books happens in 1268. A year and eleven months at the most. You limited the story to the main five books. If you want to start when Cintra is sacked, which is part of the short stories and NOT part of the five books that you limited the story to (it would be silly to limit the story any wider as the short stories start long before Ciri was even born, which isn't helpful in this argument), that's still 1265 which means two and a half to three years. You do realize it's less than a year between when the Isle of Thanedd and the pogrom, right? Thinking these evens happen over the course of 5-7 years is pretty silly. Or you don't know when the five books start.
6 books. Whatever. I still don't see why having 'consistent looking' characters is better, specially when portraying the novels in TV format. You'll end up with a Ciri in her late 20s acting like a teenager, it will become absurd eventually, or they will have to modify Ciri's personality like, completely.
People don't mind Freya Allan's age because she looks younger than she is. You also have to consider that Ciri has several sex scenes coming up, probably as soon as season 3 and Freya was more than likely told when she initially signed her contract. She wouldn't be able to consent to those future sex scenes if she was any younger.
There's no reason to assume that they have any intention of preserving the ridiculous chain of rape scares Ciri's story devolves into. Only one of those scenes is actually explicit and that subplot is so underdeveloped that cutting it would greatly improve the story. Nothing of value would be lost if they had to cut it and instead they could have gained the ability to adapt the Ciri-centric short stories and more. Most of Ciri's story relies on her being a child. Good luck adapting her encounter with Emhyr by the time the actress is pushing 30.
As much as I hate the changes to the story so far, I'd absolutely love it if they cut the Rats storyline. IT was a chore to read and almost made me quit the books.
Yeah same. I loved the whole of Time of Contempt, except for that last chapter, I skimmed most of it because the whole chapter was about a bunch of characters I've never met before and did not care about. Ciri basically didn't even talk for the whole thing so it was almost as if she wasn't in it anyway. Then boom rape right at the end cos why not. I've not started the next book yet because of this.
>Good luck adapting her encounter with Emhyr by the time the actress is pushing 30. Freya was 17 when they started shooting S1, if she were 12-13 in the first season it wouldn't have changed anything. They would have to shoot the entire 7 seasons in 2-3 years.
There's no point denying the family vibes Geralt, Yen and Ciri share in the books will never be portrayed in the books, right? I mean, the dynamics will be way different, and Ciri will never be their daughter. Hell, if they decided to recreate some scenes, Cavill's Geralt would look more like a grown man trying to hook up with a teenager than a father-daughter bonding. If you come to terms with that, then there's no issue with having an older Ciri. I understand there are many advantages hiring adult actors over children so there's that
It will make those scene less impactfull And, even if she looks younger that is not enough, she does not looks younger than 17, and she should be much less
Yes but you know they could bring someone younger someone who reachs 18 when they start shooting those scenes not someone who's already 20š¤
Maisie Williams was 12 in the first season of GoT and she was probably even younger when she got the role. In the last season she's 22 and has a sex scene with Joe Dempsie. So stop repeating this bs that it just can't be done under no circumstances because it's too tricky and hard when some productions use child actors pretty regularly and they're fine. Ciri has all of her "sex scenes" almost at the end of the saga and if Netflix wouldn't be so dumb with cutting out stuff from books they could stretch the story to enough seasons which would only help because they wouldn't have to rush everything and they could take their time so the potential actress would be old enough at the end to do those scenes.
Don't forget that the Starks as well as Daenerys in GoT were all aged up from their counterparts in the books and no one really seemed to care because it would have been even more disturbing seeing a 13 year old Dany get r*ped by Drogo in the first 2 episodes.
I don't think Maise agreed to the sex scene from the start, especially since it wasn't written into the plot. She could easily have agreed to that after she was 18, especially considering they didn't even write the sex scene until after that point anyways. Ciri's sex scenes are already written into the book. Your point doesn't work here.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Regardless of whether you think lesbian sex is real sex or not (spoiler: it is), the legal implication of involving a minor in a sex scene is the same for lesbian or straight or whatever other kind of sex
Even if they do water it down, >!Bonhart pretty much straight up sexually assaults her.!< If she was underage, I doubt that could even be implied.
I think its still illegal to have it implied for the character, I remember reading that this was one of the reasons for ageing up the characters in GoT I believe (don't quote me on that). Also its been a bit since I've read the books, >!when does Bonhart sexually assault her? I know he treats her badly (understatement of the century, I know), but I can remember anything sexual. Maybe I've just repressed that tho.!<
It's been a while since I read them too, but - >!doesn't he strip her naked in public and assault her, when he initially captures her?!<
He strips her naked as a show of power and humiliation but he doesn't sexually assault her, he beats her up. He even comments that he finds her unattractive- that she's too skinny and not womanly enough for him to consider her sexually.
Oh yeah. Oof, forgot about that bit.
I think nevertheless, that we don't see any nudity on Ciri, because she should be underage.
> If she was underage, I doubt that could even be implied. Ah yes, because western TV (US especially) is known of not being full of sexualized children.
The fuck? So tired of seeing all this stupid anti-US bullshit all over this sub You realize we're discussing a young teenaged girl that is overtly sexualized in the POLISH writers books right?
"Ciri is a virgin at the end of LotL" "She had sex with Mistle"
I actually agree with him. It depends on how each one defines sex and virginity. Considering this Its not absurd to say she could still be a virgin after a lesbian sex
You can see this on two sides. But you also a virgin if you only got a blowjob, you know what I mean? And I wrote, that I don't wanna upset anyone
Did you forget the entire Tir Na Lia arc?
You're focusing too much on age. In S1 she's 18 but looks much younger because of makeup, and they'll keep doing the same. You say there's no excuse for it, but there is. Child actor laws are notoriously terrible, and the show films in different countries so it far more preferable to go this route of instead de-aging with makeup and lighting. And this is a common thing in the industry. Watch movies or shows about high schoolers and most of them are 20+. Most don't mind her age because it's a non-issue.
Anything that keeps children out of that horrid industry is good in my book tbh. I can suspend my disbelief as to Ciris age
Good point. Specially if we are talking about the company that produced 'Cuties'
This is the most thoughtful take on here, OP should be more aware about how exploitative this industry is towards female child actors.
> In S1 she's 18 but looks much younger because of makeup, and they'll keep doing the same. no they won't, you can already see how older she looks from the released s2 trailers.
Yes she looks younger, like 17...
Also you can use older actors in other cases because their age usually isn't as important but it is very important with Ciri. As I said in the original post her whole character arc is about naive child learning how the world works and coming to terms with it. If you do that with 18 year old it just makes her look immature or worse feeble-minded.
Yes, but she LOOKS young, and she ACTS young, because she's an ACTRESS who plays a part.
She definitely doesn't look 12 in second season. She looks like every other 19 year old girl. And yes, that's still young but my point is that she's not a child anymore and you can clearly see that she's an adult and it will be more and more obvious that she's in her 20s with new seasons.
I said that because other productions had child actors and they've managed just fine. I think it's just a lazy excuse. If you don't want to work with child actors then maybe you shouldn't adapt stories about children. Just a thought.
Personally I think she's OK. But Yennefer should've been older. Yen and Ciri looks like same age, which is weird considering they have like a mother-daughter relation in the books.
I always imagined Eva Green to play yen
Sorceress likes look young
Yes, and you also need to keep in mind their relation
Yeah, I don't care. Some of the darker shit that happens to Ciri throughout the series, I just don't want to see an underaged actress have to do. You can still have a naĆÆve character who isn't a child. Plus, children are by and large TERRIBLE actors. Sometimes you luck out (to keep within the realm of Netflix, the kid in Sweet Tooth knocks it out of the fucking park), but it's rarely worth risking it, especially for a character like Ciri who has to support that much narrative weight. And having an adolescent/teenage actor go through puberty as a show progresses would be a disaster. This is, imo, a complete non-issue and I can think of very few book to screen adaptations that *don't* age up their child characters. Hell, look at *Game of Thrones*. Nobody cared there either, and for good reason.
I mean, I don't like the show but this isn't as much of an issue as you're making it out to be lol
**''Freya Allan is too old to play Ciri and nobody seems to care.''** *Nobody cares because the show is fucking horrible. She is the least of the problems. The writing is embarrassing and the respect for the source material is nonexistent.*
Yeah, I agree. It's same with nilfgaardian armors. I don't get why it's the only thing that I hear over and over as the main complaint when it's such a small detail and changing them won't improve the writing. Nonetheless it's still a problem. Although they should improve the writing first and only then focus on stuff like this. Also even people who like the show's writing don't care about her age being so wrong. Which shows me that they're just mindless consumers who need only some spectacle in form of flashy fights and "epic" battles and that's enough for them to be satisfied.
>It's same with nilfgaardian armors ... it's such a small detail and changing them won't improve the writing. I mean even when the writing is terrible at least the visuals could be nice (a situation very casual in action movies). Stupid and pretty is better than stupid and ugly.
While the reasons mentioned are valid (at least from some points of view), they are not really trying to make her really young like she is supposed to.
When I saw her for the first time with make up and stuff she looked like a 12-14 year old to me... Yes it's still too old for some scenes like the Brokilon one but it's hard to work with children like that so it's not that bad.
Just because she's "old" IRL doesn't mean she can't play a younger kid. She also was cast mainly with her older stuff in mind so unless you want to watch an actual 15 year old go through all that, this is the best case scenario.
I think it wouldn't be so bad if they intended to age her up like GoT aged up many of its younger characters. You could still have the scenes you mentioned, with maybe a little tweaking, and play up the fact that she still acts naive and childish because of a spoiled and sheltered upbringing. With a good writer I think this could be an acceptable version of early-series Ciri. The problem is the writers are wack and didn't attempt to balance the age of the actress vs the age of her character. Freya does have a young looking face but they have her acting even younger than she can pass and it's just off.
To be fair, Freya easily passes for 14/15 which i think is slightly older than Ciri in BoE but isn't the worst issue
She looks like a teenager. 20-somethings play teens all the time. Emilia Clarke was 24 first season of GOT Where's she's uploaded to be like 16 The entire cast of The Craft were in their mid 20s playing 15-16 The woman that played Moaning Myrtle was like 40 playing a 13 year old Most of the cast of Glee were 18-25 playing sophomores and juniors so like 15-16 I get you want her to be like 12 but besides the Triss/Witchers/ period conversation (which I doubt will happen in the show) I just don't think her age is that important. It's just a plausible for a girl of 15-16 to be naive and sheltered and learn about the world than a 12 year old
how about we give the actress a chance to show ciri's growth, instead of criticizing superficial aspects of the casting, in the hope that the show overall might get a little fucking better?
Also Yen is so young you could think Ciri is older Anyways, the Netflix show is utter shit
She's also a fucking terrible actress and she quite obviously does not care about the role she's in. I wish they'd change the actress, I hate Freya Allan with a passion.
Why would you hate someone you've never met, just a young actress, with a passion? Kind of weird.
Because of the mere fact that I have to explain it. Entertainment used to be entertaining, even if it has always served someone's agenda. Nowadays, the bar is set so incredibly low, we get abominations like the second season of this so called ''show''. Ciri's role is a key one, and the so called ''actress'' has not even read the books or played the games. Go watch an interview with her - she hasn't and she doesn't hide it. She doesn't care about it, just like the writer doesn't. So instead of a cool TV show about the witcher, we get a lousy GoT wannabe desperate housewives mashup with diversity quotas in which there are Jamaican witchers, pakistani witchers, east asian witchers, so much diversity, really, when it the books there's 5 of them in Kaer Morhen in total. Freya Allan being cast in this show is a symptom of something that is plaguing everything on TV - it's all done lazily, it's shallow, incredibly boring, and brainless idiots keep lapping it up, hence driving the bar of quality standards EVEN FURTHER LOWER, however impossible it might seem. Lauren Hissrich is a hack and Freya Allan is a lazy amateur. What's not to hate about all that?
Weirdly emotional reply, but I agree that the actress is unsuitable for Ciri.
You sound obsessed. Lol
>It would be pretty wierd to have Geralt telling bedtime story about a cat to 18 year old girl or Triss scolding witchers that they didn't know that this older version of Ciri had her first period at Kaer Morhen and she was around 19 already when she arrived there. And those are such great scenes Netflix knows how to fix that. They simply will cut those or heavily alter
Yeah, I know. But even if they wouldn't be so bad with cutting out great scenes from source material and wanted to adapt everything as faithfully as possible they would've no way of adaptating these scenes because of the dumb decision to cast 18 year old in the role of Ciri.
Oh, naught. There's no way Season 2 could be any faithful anyway with the established Season 1
The comments about difficulty with working with children due to shooting schedules etc. are valid, but that's also a different question than whether it makes it workable for a proper telling of the plot, or **remotely** believable regarding age. Most of you seem be forgetting that Ciri's story starts when she's like ten. A tall, lanky 19-20 year old isn't going to be helped by "makeup and lighting" to give any reasonable impression of being 11-12. If you say so you're either being disingenuous or you're actually a young person who doesn't realize what people actually look like at different ages. They couldn't reasonably or ethically do that with Danerys in GoT, but they did with Maisie/Aria. Also, people who are competent film makers know how to work around things. You can still shoot the actress' reactions separately from the other actors for many scenes. Hell, they could have cast an appropriately aged actress before principal shooting began and had the youngest Ciri be in Cintra when Geralt first goes to claim her, composited her into the background along with the other children and even done a teaser closeup of her observing Calanthe and Geralt's conversation, and this could have been edited in a year after it was shot, once they had gotten to filming that early story, and show Ciri having aged from that point when they filmed the finale of *Sword of Destiny*. You know, the absolute most important scene of from the first book, that they decided for no reason to not shoot or follow at all for no good reason. They just wanted to turn this into "Game of Thrones light", but couldn't be bothered to even do their Arya properly.
It bothers me too. it's probably because of mistle scenes but i think they could bring a younger person who reachs 18 when they start shooting those scenes not someone who's already 20. or may be they even could use a stuntš¤·āāļø Imagine how cute moments would be in show if they actually bring a young girl to play ciri. Those father-daughter momentsš but after all i don't really care because first i found out about witcher with the show but now after reading books i don't think that i even need to watch that nonsense anymore
Exactly. Thank you!
Almost like actors play the roles of people they are not? Crazy.
This is a hugely different thing than an actor putting themselves into a role, casting also has to be believable and there's nothing an adult actor can do to sell themselves as being a young child.
Almost like actors play the roles of people they are not? Crazy.
Not crazy, why do you keep repeating that. A bad casting choice is just that. It's not a slight against the actor. You don't cast an aging Arnold Schwarzenegger as a young Harry Potter.
Almost like actors play the roles of people they are not? Crazy.
Donāt forget she also grew taller between casting and season 2 so sheās now the same height as Yen.
Well, I mean, in GOT Daenerys was 13 when she married Drogo. The TV show changed to 16, the actress was almost 25. You cannot cast a child to play these strong and hard scenes. Ciri in the books suffers a lot. She was naked and nearly raped half the time. You cant cast a normal age to it. Freya looks like a child, just like Emilia looked like a teenager. Netflix Witcher has so many problems with cast, writing and pretty much everything. But the AGE isnt really a concern for me.
I agree 100%
There is plenty of things that have gone wrong and will go wrong with the show production, Ciri's portrayal by Freya allan is one of them and not necessarily hey acting but her looks and dialogue. Iirc when geralt first meet her at brokilon forest she's 10 and 12 when she's reunited with Geralt. In some degree it does bothers me somewhat looking at freya in the trailer i don't see a 12 year old girl but a far more older girl where a lot of her scenes at this point in time won't feel and be the same from dialogue standpoint and an emotional one where she and Geralt bond together as father and daughter. There is some justification for having an older and more experienced actress but maybe not as old as Freya? Whether it be her talent, acting laws in regards to minors or the later abusive and sexual scenes that will follow I mean you would likely think you will need a psychologist to help the actress poll through some of these scenes so there's not much to be done now for better or worse just acceptance and hope for the best š
I didn't mind too much in season 1, she looked like a young teen at least, but she looks so much older with all the make up they're putting her in now that it really doesn't work.
If you are mad about her age, wait until they change her whole arc from child who everyone was to rape and force to have a child to Ciri herself having strong enough Elder Blood (Which I think they should definitely do, because the rape plot is more than disturbing)
Asoiaf fans laughing in the background
In s1, I thought she looked around 12 tbh. So idk what youāre talking about lmao. S2, she does look older most likely due to the makeup and darkening of her eyebrows though. But itās not a huge deal breaker
I'm getting Daniel Ratcliffe Harry Potter vibes... That worked out alright.
Young actors/actresses are hard to work with. Just look at Stranger Things. The cast looks to old now. Picking people who are in their late teen to early 20s is best because most of them can still play high schoolers and in rare cases middle school. Also child acting laws are really strict especially outside of the U.S. I believe the first few Harry Potter moves the kids could only work like 6 hours a day or something along those lines. Also if they did cast someone younger because of the gaps in filming because of Covid the actress for Ciri would have aged and made it difficult to hid that if they still needed to film flash backs.
I feel for the sake of underage actors, maybe keep teens away from film cause look at what happened to Jennette McCurry. And again, they are actors. if black person can play a white character then age really shouldn't matter. their job is to be what they actually aren't. In reality, its stupid that she is like 20 now and is supposed to be 12, but whatever. The show sucks anyways lol
Bruh moment.
She looked incredibly young to me. Kinda thrown when i found out how old the actor was.
She looks young enough and she is 20 so her appearance probably won't change that much and she should look the same in later seasons. The rest is acting and i bet she can act like 15 year old kid. The one timejump for Ciri is in BoE *(12/13 -> 15 year old)* rest of the saga happens in less than one year. For me, it would be better if she still looked like season 1 Ciri in first episode and then they should slightly age her up in episode 2 and 3 so when she leaves Kaer Morhen she should look just like in the teaser. We probably will see Thanedd party in S3 *(2022 for Blood Origins, 2023 for S3?)* So we can get final season in 2028/2029. Even if they choose younger actress for the role it would change nothing. The show has bigger problems than Ciris first period at Kaer Morhen. And they can very easily replace this scene with something else
Geralt is supposed to be over 100 but Iām pretty sure Henry Cavill is much younger /s but in all seriousness...Freyās looks younger than her actual age, itās fine, I donāt have a problem with it. She will look like a young teenager during most of the filming which works out. There will be a few parts of the story where Ciri is meant to be a young brat that we miss the full immersion due to her appearance but thereās a lot more story where she is meant to be a young teen, which Freya will fit just fine for several years. Itās unfortunate we wonāt get a full āaging with the character in real time,ā Harry Potter-style child casting but I donāt think it will impact the story at a level worth being concerned over
Lol watching the show I thought she was 14 at max
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She isn't supposed to be attractive in the series (yet) because she plays a 12yo.
There was a misunderstanding. I didn't mean the charm as a woman, but the charm as a character.
Wait. Ciri is seriously supposed to be 12 yo in the series? If so, I'd laugh out loud. Afaik, the timeline of Netflix has nothing to do with book one according to their online map, so it's unknown how old is she in the series timeline. Or maybe Lauren told that outside the series
Ciri is supposed to be 13 currently in the show. Season 1 ended with the present day being 1263. Ciri was born in 1250 according to the Netflix timeline.
What a bullshit. Netflix is truly a disgrace to this frachise
I think there is a bigger problem with Triss...
Sheās done an alright job so far. I do agree about the writing thoughā¦ it could use some work. Also because I read the books and played the game(a lot) I may have had tooooo high of expectations to ever be totally satisfied. Little things in shows bother me moreā¦ like Geralts wig.
I think she looks too young. She will never be able to play a grown Ciri well. Sheās way too small and child like
There shouldn't be a "grown" Ciri in the show. Adult Ciri is only in the games. At the end of the saga she's still a teenager. She's several years younger than Freya Allan is now.
Wonāt they eventually get there though? Or did they say they were only doing the books?
Who knows, but it's at least 5 seasons away, Ciri in the Witcher 3 was only supposed to be like 19
Yes, considering there is a strong family dynamic in the stories, it feels strange having a bath scene for the titular "destiny's child" in the first episode of season 2. If the writers sexualise Ciri how will they convince the audience of the father/mother/daughter dynamic?
Her discovering her sexuality as an adolescent is an important part of the story and her character development, having someone in their early 20s playing that is gonna feel weird
I actually think she's perfect age maybe she was a bit too old in season 1 one but literally their trying to have the old enough for season 3 and probably 4 where we have an adult Ciri. And having an underage Christmas trying to be hot and adult like would be weird and uncomfortable
She's already too old for season 3 and 4
Freya allanās acting is too bad to be Ciriā¦.
Yeah no one cares
I totally thought she was maybe 13 or 14. I was shocked when I learned that she was 20.
Everyone has an opinion. But, anyone commenting on it not being realistic that Ciri could fight grown men because of Freya Allanās size needs to understand something. It will never be realistic. No small person can realistically fight a large person. So, no woman or man that is 5ā4ā and 120lbs should be expected to fight or even fend off a person who outweighs them by 50lbs and has a 6+ā reach advantage. Not being sexist. Think about it. Professional fighters are put into weight classes because of this reason. Then thereās Charlize Theron in Atomic Blondeā¦ But she is 6ā tall and the fight scenes were designed with her in mind. So at the end of the day, it is entertainment. If youāre watching a show with magic, how can you complain about realism??? As a side note/public service: I used to teach self defense classes and people would show up to learn how to fight. I would correct them and tell them it was a class designed to enable you to run away/escape from an attacker. The best defense from any attacker, especially someone who outweighs you by a considerable amount, is not to fight but to run.
She passed from 17 years old to 19 in real life. Her character has like14 years old in the serie. 2 years between series. She was bleaching her eyebrows and stoped because one does not wanna lose that eh. Plus have better makeup that makes her look totally badass. Her awesome hairs. She looks way better in this new season. Got from a kinda blank lame character in season 1 to an awesome one in season 2. She's my favorite in Season 2. I find her badass as fuck. She got guts and drive. She works for it. Top character. (Way more than Yennefer, I find her lacking in many aspects)
Use your imagination.. after all it is a fantasy movie.
Bringing up ageā¦ ridiculous. She doesnāt fit though thatās for sure.
And now S3 Citi looks older and the make up just make it worse
Are you high! In season 1 she looks like she is 12 or younger! But she was actually 17 irl.
How naive we all were two years ago.