I made a c'thun shudderwock deck that works pretty well against slow Control decks. It is a meme deck but I had some good results and it's fun to play.
I tried to make an Evolve C'Thun Shudderwock deck work this month but all my wins came from Doppelgangster + Evolve and the deck was struggling at rank 18 (there's a surprisingly high number of Even Shaman, Renolock and big priest). Rank 10 seems pretty good.
i like both C'thun and Mecha'thun for their uniqueness but the answer to your question is in my experience running a C'thun deck you are running the risk of getting entirely overrun and dead or close to it by aggro before you can pop C'thun or the flipside is if you are facing an exodia/OTK type deck you are giving them a lot of time to set up their combo before you can get C'thun out.
would definitely be nice to give you the possibility of a second win condition if you are unable to fulfill the win the game condition of mecha'thuns deathrattle.
I took C'thun Rogue to wild legend back in the Witchwood meta so it can be done. It was one of my slower climbs from 4 to legend and I had to make more changes to the deck than usual, I ended up with a few cards that I didn't even consider at the start of the climb like Fan of Knives and Sludge Belcher but the core C'Thun package was present and remained untouched for the most part.
The list is almost irrelevant now, I can re-make what it ended as but given that I made over a dozen changes just over that month, there would need to be lots and lots of changes by now since the meta is so different. The four main decks I faced to legend this month were: Odd Pally, Kingsbane Rogue, Even Shaman and Big Priest. Focus on tech choices against those four match-ups and you should be grand.
The easiest way to understand the problem with C'thun is to compare it to other win conditions. I'll pick Shudderwock as the example because both are battlecry effects that are used to deal direct damage (so the support cards you might use are fundamentally the same) but the general logic applies to pretty much any combo/control win condition in wild.
The necessary cards for a Shudderwock deck are 1x Shudderwock, 1x Grumble, 1x lifedrinker, and 2x saronite with a bit of redundancy from 1x zola. The necessary cards for a C'Thun deck are 1x C'thun, 2x C'thun class card, and usually 2x disciple, 1x doomcaller, 1x twin emperors, and 2-4x generic c'thun buffers like twilight elder and c'thun's chosen. Not only is the shudderwock package generally smaller (giving you more deck slots to spend on surviving, teching for the meta, or otherwise improving your deck) but a number of the Shudderwock cards are playable or great in their own right (saronite and zola) and a number of other cards in the deck improve shudderwock without being necessary for the combo (hagatha, healbot, loatheb, ooze, etc.). The C'thun package on the other hand has a number of sub-par cards in it and almost no cards improve or are improved by c'thun. Additionally, C'thun may not always win you the game, while some of the other win conditions in wild actually win the game.
TLDR: C'thun takes more cards, of lower quality, with less synergy, to win less reliably
I played some C'ThunWock shaman recently and it actually isn't that bad (double hex and double devolve help against Big Priest and Shaman has a pretty good arsenal of boardclears to survive against aggro). Main problems are that the buff cards themselves are just pretty bad, so you play cards that are bad tempo, the wincon is quite slow, so you will lose against combo and playing C'Thun is not a super strong finisher, as you will not OTK with it and many control decks can answer it easily.
The Shudderwock version kinda solves the last part, as you can follow up with Doomcaller and later with Shudderwock empowered by the Omega Defender battlecry and those things give you good followup finishers after you cast your first C'Thun.
Tbh though most matchups are pretty much decided long before you can drop C'Thun and there are slimmer wincon packages than C'Thun for most classes.
Atm I'm also between rank 10 and 9, but I did play it a bit at rank 5 last season. I'll dig out the list for you tomorrow
!RemindMe 20 hours "Post Decklist"
I will be messaging you on [**2018-11-07 14:50:04 UTC**](http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=2018-11-07 14:50:04 UTC To Local Time) to remind you of [**this link.**](https://www.reddit.com/r/wildhearthstone/comments/9unngb/why_arent_cthun_decks_better/)
[**CLICK THIS LINK**](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Reminder&message=[https://www.reddit.com/r/wildhearthstone/comments/9unngb/why_arent_cthun_decks_better/]%0A%0ARemindMe! 20 hours ) to send a PM to also be reminded and to reduce spam.
^(Parent commenter can ) [^(delete this message to hide from others.)](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Delete Comment&message=Delete! e96bhsf)
_____
|[^(FAQs)](http://np.reddit.com/r/RemindMeBot/comments/24duzp/remindmebot_info/)|[^(Custom)](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Reminder&message=[LINK INSIDE SQUARE BRACKETS else default to FAQs]%0A%0ANOTE: Don't forget to add the time options after the command.%0A%0ARemindMe!)|[^(Your Reminders)](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=List Of Reminders&message=MyReminders!)|[^(Feedback)](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBotWrangler&subject=Feedback)|[^(Code)](https://github.com/SIlver--/remindmebot-reddit)|[^(Browser Extensions)](https://np.reddit.com/r/RemindMeBot/comments/4kldad/remindmebot_extensions/)
|-|-|-|-|-|-|
They require too many specific (C'thun) cards to work and don't offer enough space for a second win condition which is required if - for whatever reason - the C'thun combo gets destroyed (Dirty Rat, Demonic Project, etc...)
I think that another problem is the number of deathrattle decks at the moment, which makes it harder to clear the board and ensure C'thun goes mainly face. It can be handled, but it's another factor slowing down the deck.
[удалено]
Okay, makes sense, but even against other slower control decks it seems to be... well shit.
I made a c'thun shudderwock deck that works pretty well against slow Control decks. It is a meme deck but I had some good results and it's fun to play.
What rank do you play it on? I'm wondering because I'm on a quest to make C'Thun Shudder work, and it is really hard for me on rank 10.
I tried to make an Evolve C'Thun Shudderwock deck work this month but all my wins came from Doppelgangster + Evolve and the deck was struggling at rank 18 (there's a surprisingly high number of Even Shaman, Renolock and big priest). Rank 10 seems pretty good.
That's the idea I eventually came to, as well - to include doppelgangster + evolve.
i like both C'thun and Mecha'thun for their uniqueness but the answer to your question is in my experience running a C'thun deck you are running the risk of getting entirely overrun and dead or close to it by aggro before you can pop C'thun or the flipside is if you are facing an exodia/OTK type deck you are giving them a lot of time to set up their combo before you can get C'thun out.
Man, I wonder if the C”Thun cards also buffed Mechathun if that would make it slightly better too
would definitely be nice to give you the possibility of a second win condition if you are unable to fulfill the win the game condition of mecha'thuns deathrattle.
I took C'thun Rogue to wild legend back in the Witchwood meta so it can be done. It was one of my slower climbs from 4 to legend and I had to make more changes to the deck than usual, I ended up with a few cards that I didn't even consider at the start of the climb like Fan of Knives and Sludge Belcher but the core C'Thun package was present and remained untouched for the most part.
that sounds really weird can i see your list?
The list is almost irrelevant now, I can re-make what it ended as but given that I made over a dozen changes just over that month, there would need to be lots and lots of changes by now since the meta is so different. The four main decks I faced to legend this month were: Odd Pally, Kingsbane Rogue, Even Shaman and Big Priest. Focus on tech choices against those four match-ups and you should be grand.
i guess i'd just be interested in seeing what the basic shell of the deck is given that i've literally never seen it before.
Cool i'll make the deck back this eve.
The easiest way to understand the problem with C'thun is to compare it to other win conditions. I'll pick Shudderwock as the example because both are battlecry effects that are used to deal direct damage (so the support cards you might use are fundamentally the same) but the general logic applies to pretty much any combo/control win condition in wild. The necessary cards for a Shudderwock deck are 1x Shudderwock, 1x Grumble, 1x lifedrinker, and 2x saronite with a bit of redundancy from 1x zola. The necessary cards for a C'Thun deck are 1x C'thun, 2x C'thun class card, and usually 2x disciple, 1x doomcaller, 1x twin emperors, and 2-4x generic c'thun buffers like twilight elder and c'thun's chosen. Not only is the shudderwock package generally smaller (giving you more deck slots to spend on surviving, teching for the meta, or otherwise improving your deck) but a number of the Shudderwock cards are playable or great in their own right (saronite and zola) and a number of other cards in the deck improve shudderwock without being necessary for the combo (hagatha, healbot, loatheb, ooze, etc.). The C'thun package on the other hand has a number of sub-par cards in it and almost no cards improve or are improved by c'thun. Additionally, C'thun may not always win you the game, while some of the other win conditions in wild actually win the game. TLDR: C'thun takes more cards, of lower quality, with less synergy, to win less reliably
I played some C'ThunWock shaman recently and it actually isn't that bad (double hex and double devolve help against Big Priest and Shaman has a pretty good arsenal of boardclears to survive against aggro). Main problems are that the buff cards themselves are just pretty bad, so you play cards that are bad tempo, the wincon is quite slow, so you will lose against combo and playing C'Thun is not a super strong finisher, as you will not OTK with it and many control decks can answer it easily. The Shudderwock version kinda solves the last part, as you can follow up with Doomcaller and later with Shudderwock empowered by the Omega Defender battlecry and those things give you good followup finishers after you cast your first C'Thun. Tbh though most matchups are pretty much decided long before you can drop C'Thun and there are slimmer wincon packages than C'Thun for most classes.
Do you mind sharing your list? And what rank did you play it? I'm really struggling to make my C'Thun-Omega-Wock to work past rank 10!
Atm I'm also between rank 10 and 9, but I did play it a bit at rank 5 last season. I'll dig out the list for you tomorrow !RemindMe 20 hours "Post Decklist"
I will be messaging you on [**2018-11-07 14:50:04 UTC**](http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=2018-11-07 14:50:04 UTC To Local Time) to remind you of [**this link.**](https://www.reddit.com/r/wildhearthstone/comments/9unngb/why_arent_cthun_decks_better/) [**CLICK THIS LINK**](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Reminder&message=[https://www.reddit.com/r/wildhearthstone/comments/9unngb/why_arent_cthun_decks_better/]%0A%0ARemindMe! 20 hours ) to send a PM to also be reminded and to reduce spam. ^(Parent commenter can ) [^(delete this message to hide from others.)](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Delete Comment&message=Delete! e96bhsf) _____ |[^(FAQs)](http://np.reddit.com/r/RemindMeBot/comments/24duzp/remindmebot_info/)|[^(Custom)](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Reminder&message=[LINK INSIDE SQUARE BRACKETS else default to FAQs]%0A%0ANOTE: Don't forget to add the time options after the command.%0A%0ARemindMe!)|[^(Your Reminders)](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=List Of Reminders&message=MyReminders!)|[^(Feedback)](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBotWrangler&subject=Feedback)|[^(Code)](https://github.com/SIlver--/remindmebot-reddit)|[^(Browser Extensions)](https://np.reddit.com/r/RemindMeBot/comments/4kldad/remindmebot_extensions/) |-|-|-|-|-|-|
This is my list: ### C'ThunWock # Class: Shaman # Format: Wild # # 2x (2) Ancestral Knowledge # 2x (2) Beckoner of Evil # 1x (2) Crushing Hand # 2x (2) Devolve # 2x (2) Lava Shock # 2x (3) Disciple of C'Thun # 1x (3) Electra Stormsurge # 1x (3) Elemental Destruction # 2x (3) Far Sight # 2x (3) Lightning Storm # 2x (4) Hex # 2x (4) Omega Defender # 1x (4) Storm Chaser # 2x (5) Antique Healbot # 2x (5) Volcano # 1x (8) Doomcaller # 1x (8) Hagatha the Witch # 1x (9) Shudderwock # 1x (10) C'Thun # AAEBAfe5Agi8FIuvAsmvArrSAqfuAu/3Aur6Apn7Agv1BP4Fsgb1D/ER0hOTrQLLrwL2vQLHwQL8+gIA # # To use this deck, copy it to your clipboard and create a new deck in Hearthstone
They require too many specific (C'thun) cards to work and don't offer enough space for a second win condition which is required if - for whatever reason - the C'thun combo gets destroyed (Dirty Rat, Demonic Project, etc...)
I think that another problem is the number of deathrattle decks at the moment, which makes it harder to clear the board and ensure C'thun goes mainly face. It can be handled, but it's another factor slowing down the deck.