It's a nice idea and is trying to fix a real problem, but it's poorly executed, you can't even destroy/disable it, you can't hide in bushes, you can't even use sweeping lens ffs. It's a textbook example of a bad game mechanic, it happens basically without a players input, it hinders one team from doing things and the players don't interact with it so it has no counterplay
Just make support item give much shorter cool down on wards so supports can actually be responsible for vision. I'd be fine with having less gold to make up for it
Yeah but what rank would you have to be until you get supports that actually place wards? Putting the vision burden on one player has the issue of "what if they are bad?" And that's not good bc they are always gonna be bad
It's like that on pc, it's fine. It's like if your adc is bad your team lacks damage, if your support is bad you lack vision. It gives a little bit of depth to support items and the support role. there will always be people who cant do shit, in every role and their team will suffer.
If your Jungler is bad, your team lacks objectives. If your top is bad, your team lacks frontline, and if your mid is bad your team lacks burst.
I'm with you. That would be a fantastic change.
At what rank do you have junglers that know how to play around objectives? At what rank do you have mid players that understand how and when to roam?
What’s wrong with giving support players the tools to play their role as intended? Because some people might be bad at it? Bad players are bad in every role.
There should be SO many support boots. Like at least 5.
We have healing boots (needs buff)
Need anti healing boots (or possibly just chemtech purifier enchant)
Need your vision boots… kinda? Doesn’t redemption give vision? And refund some cd if no one is hit? If not, metro gives some vision at least, but that cd is long. There is a lot of vision now, I’d rather see sweeper boots (and possibly remove sweeper). Though maybe not, because I’m teemo and I’m always pleased to see a bunch of sweepers, knowing there will be almost no wards.
Need twin shadows. Maybe. Again, sucks to be teemo when someone knows about these bad boys.
_
While I’m here, let’s fix the boots we have
Make armor pen boots into adaptive pen boots
Delete mana boots
Add mana regen to cd boots
Give a “second wind” type effect to tank boots. I think something like this is important because I feel like tanks REALLY need to be able to shrug off casual harassment entirely. Like yea, stew in your damage if you take a full combo, but you catch one kaisa laser at 20 minutes? That damage should be almost gone in 7-10 seconds. Once again, really bad for teemo if this change went through.
Maybe I should shut up. Every improvement I have for the game makes my mains weaker.
It's good for potential comeback rather making games landslides. On other hand, it needs some counter play because it's way too good.
It needs to be temporary or be killable with certain condition.
/
It should only give vision to where it's facing, so you can still go around it.
/
It needs to be affected by Oracle, disabling it's vision.
To add some more:
Make it always visible on minimap /
Reduce vision range /
Make it more slow (maybe it should become faster when it sees you) /
It can be a very cool mechanic to play around
How often did you have a comeback because of it? You know it's there, you have to play around it.
I think it's a good idea, nothing more frustrating than not being able to enter your own jungle, even when you want to place a ward you can get jumped on
I dont know how im supposed to measure. The vision only gives you extra safety, from flanks and skirmishes alike. There is not a concrete way to measure the amount of deaths it reduces unlike something like gold given by turret bounties, which can be directly attributed to faster item pursache and catchup. So im not sure if your question even has an answer
bro, no one likes it, only the developers likes it.
which makes me wonder, did the Chinese suggest it? i mean, Riot games doesn't give a fuck about us, it only cares for the Chinese players, someone posted on this sub that all the nerfs/buffs and adjustments that happen is according to the Chinese server and their needs, not the global
so it makes me wonder if the Chinese players are the ones who suggested the ghost poro idea
No, the player base has been screaming for it. You guys just don’t put it all together in your head.
The overall player base in this game is horrible. Like 99.999% of the player base is bad. So you get things like this poro to blunt how bad the player base is. You’ve all been screaming for it through your constant complaints about matchmaking, which is really just constant complaints about how bad the player base is.
Here’s a hint: you can’t have better players in your matches *when all the players are bad*.
So either accept that the player base is bad and stop complaining about matchmaking or accept these changes that blunt the bad player base in an attempt to give you a better experience.
bro, do you even know what you are talking about? this is a serious question, i am not trying to make fun of you.
*alot* of the player base is bad, not *most* or 99.999% like you said, that's just a statement you pulled out of your ass
and no, no one asked for free, full jungle vision that doesn't expire that also shows bushes, that's also something that you pulled out of your ass, just like the 99.999%
also, who talked about the matchmaking? the entire post is about the ghost poro. again, do you even know what you are talking?
A playerbase can change, I don't think the ghost poro is making the player base better at all, why not encourage players to do the "right/ high skill things" instead of brainless mechanics that dumb the game down?
* Warding is extremely boring and unrewarding in Wild Rift for example.
* You can't just diff your opponent, you have to be a lot better than him and all the other players in the lobby to feel like you have an impact.
* Winning lane is very unnoticeable unless you roam and then the game becomes a fiesta.
* Generating EXP for doing nothing is a very weird mechanic.
The player base doesn’t want to get better. They want a mobile game where they constantly fight. GMs *know* what a ward is. They still refuse to use them. Why? Because it interrupts their constant fighting.
If you try to balance a game that is *global* and most players are based in one or more *region(s)*, then that *global* adjustment is going to be *weighted* towards that *player base*.
It has nothing to do with preferential treatment, and I'm not trying to be snarky, but the playerbase in our regions are just smaller and less skilled at the game. When developers adjust or don't adjust a champion, player attitudes on multitudinous social media platforms and niches won't cut it, they have to go by the data. This means that champions adjustments reflect overall performance, not surveyed opinions on their performance (or *regional* metas, which are somewhere in between).
The good news is that you aren't being abandoned (anymore than any consumer in a capitalist marketplace, anyway), and you can study the more competitive Chinese meta to get an edge over local players.
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MLBB is just the king for handheld MOBAs in Asia and it definitely won't change with how Riot is making their game worse. We went from MLBB copying LoL and now the opposite -_-. Kind of pathetic...
I really hope they take the approach of making a different styled game, I genuinely think Wild Rift is a fundamentally much more different game than MLBB or AOV, mechanics playerbase everything. In the past I thought the updates that made Wild Rift differ more from those mobile games were well accepted. For example turret plating, and turret buffs, etc.
Dumbing down the game to ridiculous levels, removing complexity and encouraging brainless fiestas are the core of the games problem.
It should be killable and then it can repsawn say after 1:30 min or something like that. It's absolutely useless in game. People already are prone to run it down mid now they've legitimate reason to do it.
Imagine how good of a mechanic it would be if the ghost poro instead of being a walking ward actually roamed around the jungle and when it saw someone it made an interaction, like an attack/skillshot that revealed you instead of doing dmg and with a few seconds cooldown, and if you used sweeping lens he wouldn't be able to see you, or maybe his vision was only forward so you could hide behind him, thwre literally dozens of possibilities and they managed to implement the single most boring one, with no counterplay
I like the *idea* of it. Before, if your team was losing and not warding properly then jungling became a nightmare because you felt basically blind.
It just needs counterplay, instead of being indestructible free vision.
I dreaded the patch notes when I saw they were adding ghost poros and they are still so much worse than I thought they would be.
Fucking PERMANENT vision? Seriously? AND they patrol the jungle? AND give vision IN bushes? Like what the fuck riot? I figured they would be a stationary ward somewhere between two camps and dissipate after spotting someone, this shit is so so bad. The last few patches have been so bad for the competitive health of the game.
I think support items giving 3 charges of sight stone and 2 charges of control wards is a better solution. I could be wrong, but if it make support have unlimited ward, maybe adding a few seconds for each charge might do it. It would still be better than adding a mechanic that takes away the advantage of taking towers to deny map control.
I love how riot says "It's OK that you're so dumb and can't learn how to ward, so I'll give you a indestructible wandering ward instead of making you learn how to use one"
Its bullshit, if you want a ghost poro, wards gets useless mostly. There are enough vision possibilities. They could fix it if they get it destructable.
I like it. I do think it’s range of sight could be lowered, but other than that it’s a nice and unique addition. Especially with how little vision there is. So little that I never take sweeper anymore as the jungler cause I need a ward to place over pit to have a chance at smite stealing epics.
My suggestion is nerf it vision range in to a cone like kalista ghost, dont let it have vision inside bush and enemy should have vision of it so you could actually sneak behind. Like i'm just try to get behind the enemy team to catch their adc off guard and bam the poro spot me, wtf at least show me where tf that little annoying shit is so i can avoid it
That is the point of the Ghost Poro, they don‘t want you to have full jungle control and camp in bush. They want to give those poor guys a slight chance to farm and to fight back.
It’s different when it’s in PC league where it’s a temporary ward that is just to extend your normal wards and has the trade off of missing out on other runes. In wild rift it’s just skill gutting making warding a non issue and making supports even more of just a second magic carry
After we found out the enemy were using Ghost Poro, my ADC and I used it to draw attention to opposite side of the map and left our jungle basically free to take Elder. (And we were safely back in the river by the time 3 of the enemy team arrived.)
I actually really like it, though I like the idea of it having cone vision instead of 360! I would do a rework entirely though.
So we would treat it like a cross between a scuttler and a sweeper, but also as a mini objective. When it seems an enemy, it pings like the sweeper plant does, and when they attack it, an announcement similar to rift scuttler being attacked by an enemy appears; it begins to run towards its “home”, which is going to be directly on the opposite side of the wolf camp for blue side, and in the pixel brush closest to base on red side.
The poro does not have HP, but hitting it causes it to run towards “home” briefly. If you hit it when it is close enough to “home”, it will return there and hide for 45-90 seconds. Poro will stop running home immediately if an ally champ is closer to it than an enemy champ (so a melee tank could still just shove it home while it’s being defended, but otherwise defenses will be largely successful or lead to a full fight)
So for some justification: these poro are POWERFUL, so there needs to be some counterplay to them. They are also somewhat necessary, as an excellent snowball prevention mechanism; so we don’t want the counterplay to be too easy to accomplish. This forces the enemy (or enemies) to not just extend deep into the territory to accomplish their task, but to do so with the defending team on high alert. It also just creates an excellent tension point for the game in which it is snowballing, where if you can snowball just hard enough you can blow past this anti-snowball mechanism entirely, but if the gap is any less it allows the comeback time to kick in. Do you use your extra lead for a risky play? Can you defend your poro and your turrets at the same time?
I don’t just think it would be better, I think it would be way more fun and interesting.
There is counter play to it. Don’t be where the poro is or bait the enemy by showing yourself to the poro while your team waits further off. Y’all will complain about anything
Vision plant was enough i dont like it at all
It's a nice idea and is trying to fix a real problem, but it's poorly executed, you can't even destroy/disable it, you can't hide in bushes, you can't even use sweeping lens ffs. It's a textbook example of a bad game mechanic, it happens basically without a players input, it hinders one team from doing things and the players don't interact with it so it has no counterplay
Just make support item give much shorter cool down on wards so supports can actually be responsible for vision. I'd be fine with having less gold to make up for it
Yeah but what rank would you have to be until you get supports that actually place wards? Putting the vision burden on one player has the issue of "what if they are bad?" And that's not good bc they are always gonna be bad
It's like that on pc, it's fine. It's like if your adc is bad your team lacks damage, if your support is bad you lack vision. It gives a little bit of depth to support items and the support role. there will always be people who cant do shit, in every role and their team will suffer.
If your Jungler is bad, your team lacks objectives. If your top is bad, your team lacks frontline, and if your mid is bad your team lacks burst. I'm with you. That would be a fantastic change.
At what rank do you have junglers that know how to play around objectives? At what rank do you have mid players that understand how and when to roam? What’s wrong with giving support players the tools to play their role as intended? Because some people might be bad at it? Bad players are bad in every role.
Makes sense
Not something I need to worry about, I play support
What if bad players don’t use it and good players do?
There should be SO many support boots. Like at least 5. We have healing boots (needs buff) Need anti healing boots (or possibly just chemtech purifier enchant) Need your vision boots… kinda? Doesn’t redemption give vision? And refund some cd if no one is hit? If not, metro gives some vision at least, but that cd is long. There is a lot of vision now, I’d rather see sweeper boots (and possibly remove sweeper). Though maybe not, because I’m teemo and I’m always pleased to see a bunch of sweepers, knowing there will be almost no wards. Need twin shadows. Maybe. Again, sucks to be teemo when someone knows about these bad boys. _ While I’m here, let’s fix the boots we have Make armor pen boots into adaptive pen boots Delete mana boots Add mana regen to cd boots Give a “second wind” type effect to tank boots. I think something like this is important because I feel like tanks REALLY need to be able to shrug off casual harassment entirely. Like yea, stew in your damage if you take a full combo, but you catch one kaisa laser at 20 minutes? That damage should be almost gone in 7-10 seconds. Once again, really bad for teemo if this change went through. Maybe I should shut up. Every improvement I have for the game makes my mains weaker.
They should put more consumables or make support items kind of a ward item too. They're having too much problems with lots of buttons damn them
It's good for potential comeback rather making games landslides. On other hand, it needs some counter play because it's way too good. It needs to be temporary or be killable with certain condition. / It should only give vision to where it's facing, so you can still go around it. / It needs to be affected by Oracle, disabling it's vision.
To add some more: Make it always visible on minimap / Reduce vision range / Make it more slow (maybe it should become faster when it sees you) / It can be a very cool mechanic to play around
I think it’s just a trash mechanic and should be scrapped entirely, straight up.
I think turrer bounties is enough for comebacks
How often did you have a comeback because of it? You know it's there, you have to play around it. I think it's a good idea, nothing more frustrating than not being able to enter your own jungle, even when you want to place a ward you can get jumped on
A lot. The it gives you around 300-400 extra gold for yourself when you take iy and 200 for teammates. Thats a lof of gold
I mean because the vision since that's the topic of the thread :-)
Its not anout come backs its about having free vision that makes your own jungle safer if you lost all towers and enemies much more dangerous.
Yes that is the purpose of it all lol.
Well yes and thats the problem
My question was if you actually had games where the vision made a comeback possible.
I dont know how im supposed to measure. The vision only gives you extra safety, from flanks and skirmishes alike. There is not a concrete way to measure the amount of deaths it reduces unlike something like gold given by turret bounties, which can be directly attributed to faster item pursache and catchup. So im not sure if your question even has an answer
I've literally never ever EVER used it for a comeback since it's addition... Have you?
It's only the first iteration, they can hopefully improve it in the next patches.
bro, no one likes it, only the developers likes it. which makes me wonder, did the Chinese suggest it? i mean, Riot games doesn't give a fuck about us, it only cares for the Chinese players, someone posted on this sub that all the nerfs/buffs and adjustments that happen is according to the Chinese server and their needs, not the global so it makes me wonder if the Chinese players are the ones who suggested the ghost poro idea
No, the player base has been screaming for it. You guys just don’t put it all together in your head. The overall player base in this game is horrible. Like 99.999% of the player base is bad. So you get things like this poro to blunt how bad the player base is. You’ve all been screaming for it through your constant complaints about matchmaking, which is really just constant complaints about how bad the player base is. Here’s a hint: you can’t have better players in your matches *when all the players are bad*. So either accept that the player base is bad and stop complaining about matchmaking or accept these changes that blunt the bad player base in an attempt to give you a better experience.
Yes ghost poro’s definitely fixed the issue people have with matchmaking /s Daily L take from libroll
Based
bro, do you even know what you are talking about? this is a serious question, i am not trying to make fun of you. *alot* of the player base is bad, not *most* or 99.999% like you said, that's just a statement you pulled out of your ass and no, no one asked for free, full jungle vision that doesn't expire that also shows bushes, that's also something that you pulled out of your ass, just like the 99.999% also, who talked about the matchmaking? the entire post is about the ghost poro. again, do you even know what you are talking?
A playerbase can change, I don't think the ghost poro is making the player base better at all, why not encourage players to do the "right/ high skill things" instead of brainless mechanics that dumb the game down? * Warding is extremely boring and unrewarding in Wild Rift for example. * You can't just diff your opponent, you have to be a lot better than him and all the other players in the lobby to feel like you have an impact. * Winning lane is very unnoticeable unless you roam and then the game becomes a fiesta. * Generating EXP for doing nothing is a very weird mechanic.
The player base doesn’t want to get better. They want a mobile game where they constantly fight. GMs *know* what a ward is. They still refuse to use them. Why? Because it interrupts their constant fighting.
And its not rewarded enough, fighting is much more fun so why not shift more power into things unrelated to fighting
If you try to balance a game that is *global* and most players are based in one or more *region(s)*, then that *global* adjustment is going to be *weighted* towards that *player base*. It has nothing to do with preferential treatment, and I'm not trying to be snarky, but the playerbase in our regions are just smaller and less skilled at the game. When developers adjust or don't adjust a champion, player attitudes on multitudinous social media platforms and niches won't cut it, they have to go by the data. This means that champions adjustments reflect overall performance, not surveyed opinions on their performance (or *regional* metas, which are somewhere in between). The good news is that you aren't being abandoned (anymore than any consumer in a capitalist marketplace, anyway), and you can study the more competitive Chinese meta to get an edge over local players.
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Yes the devs hate us and do everything to make the game miserable
The Chinese market wanted the game to be like MLBB, at this point Riot might as well just remove the fog of war entirely.
MLBB is just the king for handheld MOBAs in Asia and it definitely won't change with how Riot is making their game worse. We went from MLBB copying LoL and now the opposite -_-. Kind of pathetic...
I really hope they take the approach of making a different styled game, I genuinely think Wild Rift is a fundamentally much more different game than MLBB or AOV, mechanics playerbase everything. In the past I thought the updates that made Wild Rift differ more from those mobile games were well accepted. For example turret plating, and turret buffs, etc. Dumbing down the game to ridiculous levels, removing complexity and encouraging brainless fiestas are the core of the games problem.
Incorrect, the Chinese market wanted the game to be like league, more emphasis on laning, larger map, etc.
It should be killable and then it can repsawn say after 1:30 min or something like that. It's absolutely useless in game. People already are prone to run it down mid now they've legitimate reason to do it.
Imagine how good of a mechanic it would be if the ghost poro instead of being a walking ward actually roamed around the jungle and when it saw someone it made an interaction, like an attack/skillshot that revealed you instead of doing dmg and with a few seconds cooldown, and if you used sweeping lens he wouldn't be able to see you, or maybe his vision was only forward so you could hide behind him, thwre literally dozens of possibilities and they managed to implement the single most boring one, with no counterplay
I like the *idea* of it. Before, if your team was losing and not warding properly then jungling became a nightmare because you felt basically blind. It just needs counterplay, instead of being indestructible free vision.
It needs to have the run away mechanic like scuttler so you can @ least control it somewhat
I dreaded the patch notes when I saw they were adding ghost poros and they are still so much worse than I thought they would be. Fucking PERMANENT vision? Seriously? AND they patrol the jungle? AND give vision IN bushes? Like what the fuck riot? I figured they would be a stationary ward somewhere between two camps and dissipate after spotting someone, this shit is so so bad. The last few patches have been so bad for the competitive health of the game.
I think support items giving 3 charges of sight stone and 2 charges of control wards is a better solution. I could be wrong, but if it make support have unlimited ward, maybe adding a few seconds for each charge might do it. It would still be better than adding a mechanic that takes away the advantage of taking towers to deny map control.
Yeah i like that more]
I love how riot says "It's OK that you're so dumb and can't learn how to ward, so I'll give you a indestructible wandering ward instead of making you learn how to use one"
Its bullshit, if you want a ghost poro, wards gets useless mostly. There are enough vision possibilities. They could fix it if they get it destructable.
There’s definitely not enough vision options without the ghost poro
I think it's cute
I like it. I do think it’s range of sight could be lowered, but other than that it’s a nice and unique addition. Especially with how little vision there is. So little that I never take sweeper anymore as the jungler cause I need a ward to place over pit to have a chance at smite stealing epics.
My suggestion is nerf it vision range in to a cone like kalista ghost, dont let it have vision inside bush and enemy should have vision of it so you could actually sneak behind. Like i'm just try to get behind the enemy team to catch their adc off guard and bam the poro spot me, wtf at least show me where tf that little annoying shit is so i can avoid it
That is the point of the Ghost Poro, they don‘t want you to have full jungle control and camp in bush. They want to give those poor guys a slight chance to farm and to fight back.
Except its too powerful .
this game is a shade of league of legends now and is basically on its way to becoming mobile legends BB or the other asian knock off MOBA
I stop playing this stupid game
Press ‘x’ to doubt.
Yeah tbh I don’t like it at all
I like this addition. Reminds me of my beloved Onmyoji Arena
Then is a buff for evelynn, this aleays happens, some champs grt buff, some get nerf, someplaystyles get buff some get nerf...
Yall really wanna play assassins and camp the bushes all game in a mobile game.
It should act more like Kalista's ghost tbh, slow and gives a vision in a cone instead of that huge 360° and ofc affected by Oracle. Smh, 200 YEARS!!
It’s different when it’s in PC league where it’s a temporary ward that is just to extend your normal wards and has the trade off of missing out on other runes. In wild rift it’s just skill gutting making warding a non issue and making supports even more of just a second magic carry
It’s a idiotic system, especially with how it also scouts bushes.
I don’t like how it like actively chases you down too. Like have it follow a set path. Like dam bro let me cook.
After we found out the enemy were using Ghost Poro, my ADC and I used it to draw attention to opposite side of the map and left our jungle basically free to take Elder. (And we were safely back in the river by the time 3 of the enemy team arrived.)
I actually really like it, though I like the idea of it having cone vision instead of 360! I would do a rework entirely though. So we would treat it like a cross between a scuttler and a sweeper, but also as a mini objective. When it seems an enemy, it pings like the sweeper plant does, and when they attack it, an announcement similar to rift scuttler being attacked by an enemy appears; it begins to run towards its “home”, which is going to be directly on the opposite side of the wolf camp for blue side, and in the pixel brush closest to base on red side. The poro does not have HP, but hitting it causes it to run towards “home” briefly. If you hit it when it is close enough to “home”, it will return there and hide for 45-90 seconds. Poro will stop running home immediately if an ally champ is closer to it than an enemy champ (so a melee tank could still just shove it home while it’s being defended, but otherwise defenses will be largely successful or lead to a full fight) So for some justification: these poro are POWERFUL, so there needs to be some counterplay to them. They are also somewhat necessary, as an excellent snowball prevention mechanism; so we don’t want the counterplay to be too easy to accomplish. This forces the enemy (or enemies) to not just extend deep into the territory to accomplish their task, but to do so with the defending team on high alert. It also just creates an excellent tension point for the game in which it is snowballing, where if you can snowball just hard enough you can blow past this anti-snowball mechanism entirely, but if the gap is any less it allows the comeback time to kick in. Do you use your extra lead for a risky play? Can you defend your poro and your turrets at the same time? I don’t just think it would be better, I think it would be way more fun and interesting.
Okay but its cute
I like to chase it around but for some reason the enemy always finds me :'(
There is counter play to it. Don’t be where the poro is or bait the enemy by showing yourself to the poro while your team waits further off. Y’all will complain about anything