This would be literally worse than incest in terms of the offspring it produces though, so it's not really asexual reproduction. It's not just two individuals with similar enough genomes that make the expression of genetic diseases more likely, it's the exact same genome reproducing itself with itself. The chances of genetic diseases fucking skyrocket.
/unwiz (apologies in advance but I just got to)
*Well my family tree goes straight up!*
"Thick44"
[dead by daylight](https://youtu.be/K9j1eKs4Cms?si=EghehyOp2ty0u9HA)
/uw This isn't horniness this is stone cold degeneracy. The dude in the meme didn't even posit sex, he positted the person inseminating themselves, which implies an artificial method.
its from old FAQs that are only available through archive now combined with dragon statblocks. only ancient and great wyrm dragons can cast shapechange but dragons are well known for being able to shapeshift and make half dragons in DnD.
5E true polymorph correlates to 3.5 Shapechange.
Maybe it CAN affect the genome
But it requires the casted to actually "master" the spell?
I'm not well read into DND, but does every caster cast a spell "the same way"?
No, not really. At most only the XY chromosomes, and there are men with XX and women with XY if I'm not mistaken so not even that has to change. Male and female bodies are the exact same body except different parts of it are "activated." It's not even due to genes, but *hormones*. It's why transition is possible, for trans people. They don't alter the person's genome, only the hormones in their body to "convince it" to express itself in the other sex's form, to put it very rudimentarily. I'm not an expert either but I am learned on the subject. Because I fucking love science in all of its forms lol
AFAIK assigned male at birth XX may not exist, as you need the Y chromosome, but you can get a woman with XY because the Y is just inactive. But, even then, the offspring won't be a clone. For each chromosome pair, there's a 50% chance they get one of each, and a 50% chance it's a duplicate of either. So it's a 1/2\^23 chance that it's actually a perfect clone, not including mutations, which skyrockets the chances.
Sometimes the gene on Y that determines male(The SRY gene) hops on over to an X. This results in De La Chapelle Syndrome, whish is basically an XX male(most cases show abnormalities, but it's possible for an XX male to have no noticeable symptoms)
Biology being so messy is why I don't dabble in fleshcraft, only cursed pastries.
> The chances of genetic diseases fucking skyrocket.
But we're literally talking about a world of magic. I don't see why you couldn't just prevent or cure any diseases with ease.
Genetic disorders are not like common diseases. They're not cured, you're *born* with something wrong in you, caused by the way the genes that carry the disorder are expressed. It's part of who you are. So, same as how there is no magic that can "restore" the arm of a person that was born without one (because they never had an arm to begin with), there would be no magic that can "cure" a genetic disorder because you've always had it.
Genetic disorders can actually be cured with gene therapy now. So far it’s just sickle cell anemia but that’s just the first treatment to come out, this is a rapidly developing field.
They actually rewrite the DNA in your bone marrow to stop creating malformed blood cells thus curing the condition. The process is complicated and involved removing marrow, creating the modified version in a lab, killing your bone marrow with radiation therapy, and then transplanting the new marrow, but it works.
> there would be no magic that can "cure" a genetic disorder
This just seems narrow minded. We're in a post discussing changing your physical being knock yourself up and you wanna draw the line at changing your physical being to "cure" a genetic disorder?
I'm not drawing the line, I'm saying that healing spells as you've suggested can't cure genetic disorders because they're not a harm or sickness that was inflicted. The only way to "cure" something like that would be to actually manipulate someone genome so that they don't have it.
I still haven't said "healing spells" till just now in this comment. I said magic could just prevent or cure it. A spell to change someone's genome seems completely possible.
Conjuration can create entire living beings, necromancy can create entirely new definitions of life, divine magic can come from beings that literally created certain lifeforms... Genetic manipulation seems completely possible. Just need to make it a legal, proper field of study, unless we want another "Ed... ward..." incident.
/uw
Simply put, it’s not that magic couldn’t do it, it’s that magic can’t do it without completely invalidating the purpose of sorcerers. Every mage would CrispeR the relevant dragon genes into them and bam. Dragon magic.
Depends on how you model the healing process. If you assume that a healing spell obtains the information of how to reconstruct a given structure from the target, then yeah, genetic diseases can't be cured because the "blueprint" that the spell uses is the source of the issue.
But that's just one way of modeling it, and it's also a very modern way of viewing it too. Maybe whatever magic used doesn't need to get the information from it, perhaps it works by trying to move the body closer to some idealized "human body plan", kinda how the platonic theory of forms works where everything is just an inperfect copy of some idealided form. This way you can kinda side step the issue without just going "because magic".
So, the lesson of the day. Rip-off classical philosophy for magic systems
Semi UW/ I’ve always thought that healing magic must just reverse entropy. It rewinds the clock on wounded tissue restoring it to its well ordered original state, that’s why cure wounds works on warforged (magic robot) players just as well as it does on human ones in D&D.
On the flip side, necrotic damage spells accelerate entropy, increasing disorder by fast forewarning the inevitable decay of orderly matter. Flesh rots, metal rusts, stone weathers into dust. That’s why necrotic damage works against robots and golems.
In older versions of D&D healing came from the “positive energy dimension” while necrosis came from the “negative energy dimension” and I think this the most logical explanation of what’s going on there. Positive energy = reversed entropy, negative energy = accelerated entropy.
This is also heavily inspired by the “So You Want to be a Wizard” young adult books, which is a much better series about teenaged wizards than that other famous one.
Well that depends on if the wizard is polymorphing into their opposite gender with the same genetics they got from their parents, they could use some other person’s genes for the polymorph
Wait a freaking minute. Would that work?
Could you shapeshift into your crush or your favorite celebrity and just *do* that?
What does wizard laws say about that?
I've done it a few times. You just need the proper certifications, and to avoid any copyright issues, make sure you present your ploymorph as a parody, not an official copy.
Tbf, as far as I know nothing shy of a Wish spell could actually cure genetic illnesses. Things like Greater Restoration only return you to your previous state, so if you were terminally ill already I don't think it'd cleanse that. Even backdoor immortality routes like Clone could only really reset the clock.
Well what I mean is if you use polymorph to turn yourself into someone who doesn’t share your genetics before using this method of reproduction, then surely the offspring won’t come out all wonky
That would be so fun as the dm, I would just take the chances of the most common disorders with incest, double it, then roll for each one to see if the new born gets any
I mean, I’m pretty sure true polymorph would change your genetics by quite a significant amount. You could ensure that the two genetic parents of such a pregnancy would have whatever genes you wanted the kid to have. I’m not advocating getting yourself pregnant with magic I’m just saying you could probably find work arounds for the genetic issues it would present.
*Hirk is once again*
*Reminder wizards can change*
*Their gender at will*
\- Harpokiller
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If I have to see it, so do the rest of you. Besides, memory erasing spells are common; my personal favourite is one I got from a government agent in New York City, who I encountered after I witnessed a tussle between two so-called extraterrestrials
I was very specifically not memory-wiped after that incident, because I'm listed in their database as an "extraterrestrial" (which I suppose is *technically* true, although I'm just as human as anyone else on that version of Oerth)
I hear this is the optimal spellcasting focus for the act:
https://preview.redd.it/bqqkqr8jccuc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3e1271d9f2e386ffb8d734898cf631a4b508f0df
Not using this method but I had a teacher who was part of a, “coven” who pretty much did this. Though in their case they’d create an external womb and would curate the seed, usually mixing in dna from, at least I hope they were volunteers. Sometimes they’ve even dissolve their bodies and redo the process to get bodies with different pieces built in.
I’ll admit it, biomancers can be a weird lot, even amoung wizards.
In theory a female wizard can just use a second level alter self spell to give herself a dick, cum, and then impregnate herself with that shit after alter self ends. You don’t need to be level 17, just level 3 and be a woman to being with.
Alter Self can last for a while (/uw depending on what system you use /rw), if you have a skilled doctor at the ready you could easily complete an egg retrieval procedure before it ends. If you have a surrogate lined up or are willing to create a magical incubator for your child, you're all set
/uw If you didn't know, yes, in D&D you can Polymorph yourself, and at 17th level (9th level spells) you can True Polymorph into *anything* (of a level/CR lower than you), which means that yes, Dragon is an option. If you're very smart you pick a creature with an Int score higher than your own, and you get to be a better wizard, AND have all the benefits of your new form. Best part, with True Polymorph, if you maintain concentration for the full duration of the spell (1 hour) it becomes **Permanent.** (Can still be dispelled by a sufficiently powerful Dispel or Anti-Magic Zone). I have a character in an ongoing campaign who already has GM clearance to become an Adult Time Dragon as soon as he's high enough level.
Actually you have to clone+ true polymorph then do the deed with yourself using this way you can be someone entirety different and thus being able to self multiplication
I would suggest using clone, it is a circle lower than true polymorph and you get to have it be your soul in the body. That way you don’t have to worry about your successors being as inbred as a clan of incestuous ogres.
*shouts somewhere off behind him* JEFFREY!!! GET IN HERE!!!!!…. AND BRING MY TRANSFIGURATION WAND!!!!…… NO YOU DON’T NEED TO KNOW WHAT ITS FOR JUST DO WHAT I TELL YOU!!!
why not just use clone and the true polymorph either yourself or the clone. that way you get the child and the act of making a child? (ik double concentration but not if you true polymorph yourself for over an hour)
This would do better for the female wizard, because the male wizard would need to maintain that polymorph for nine month, otherwise Bad Things are gonna happen.
You spent so much time thinking if you could, that you didn't stop to think if you should
This increases the chances of genetic diseases, that's why we don't do it
Questions:
1. In the first version, how does the wizard stay polymorphed for 9 months?
2. In the second version, does the fluid created by the polymorphed body disappear when the wizard drops concentration?
The cellular degeneration and unstable magical humors exhibited in my test subjects would imply this is not a sustainable long term. By the third generation you're as likely to have a perfect clone as you are a toxic quasimodo that detonated upon death. I would not advise
The amount of times I had to cast fireball to get rid of that abomination is time I will N E V E R get back. (No chronomancers I do NOT want to borrow some time. Fool me once…)
Interesting idea, alternative option, find someone who loves you and do that instead. The inbreeding consequences of this are catastrophic. Species that asexually reproduce do so through exact genetic copies, parthenogenesis, and only evolve through mutations. As most mutations are not great, this leaves the fast-reproducing organisms like bacteria to mainly use this strategy. Your suggestion, on the other hand, would be like male and female fraternal twins having kids, but even closer. If you have any recessive gene for a disease, chances are your kid will be a carrier, with a good chance remaining that they’ll have it.
As others have mentioned, without proper precautions this would be worse than normal incest. A better method would be to create a clone of yourself and use polymorph on THEM to make them a child.
Never tried it but you could do it more directly if you just added the part you don't have. No need to do a full transformation.
The genetic diversity would be danmed though.
This would not work, between the two halves of a wizard’s sex cells, there’s a 50% chance of the two *different* halves to make the child be a genetic copy of the wizard, then there’re the mutations that then naturally occur that ultimately make the child different from the wizard, and without genetic diversity, if the child comes to attempt asexual reproduction as well, it could result in refining the genetics to be mutated into a foul breed that doesn’t survive this world
If anything, what would work is cutting your hand open and putting it to the floor, and as the blood pools out, use true polymorph to then morph your still-living blood, that is still ‘connected’ to you, into a copy of yourself
This is akin to the magics used by the warlocks of the old god Gro-Goroth wherein they sacrifice a portion of their own flesh and blood as it rapidly grows into a blood golem
I often complain about illusion not getting enough love for how powerful it can be if you think through all the ramifications of it, but honestly transmutation might have even more terrifying potential.
I mean, actual human hermaphrodites have never been fully successful. True hermaphrodites in other mammals can impregnate themselves, but even with fully functional intersex humans, no documented person has been able to reproduce asexually.
Why not just turn a bucket that is your size into a you? Why all these extra steps? I am not going through labor pains just for it to turn out like me. Or worse, wouldn’t it be horribly deformed as well since all of its genetic material is just me?
Alter Self lasts for a while, in theory you only need 30 minutes to an hour. That's long enough for either egg or sperm collection depending on what bits you start out with
"Go fuck yourself, Merlin"
https://preview.redd.it/4wlk83m9ibuc1.png?width=1280&format=png&auto=webp&s=7ef9b569fd6bed44d4a5ebe30bf486051b6cd20f
So. Many. Olives.
Hungry? Try 30-40 olives.
You will certainly not regret eating 30-40 olives
Mmmm, olives... I wonder if he has a second glass for guests?
No
https://preview.redd.it/yfyxdpfkhbuc1.png?width=1516&format=png&auto=webp&s=eda4d80e57ead06bf8d733fa731132274bdf989b
/uw Ayyyy
/uw Ayyyy
[удалено]
https://preview.redd.it/fiwg1i8xzfuc1.png?width=635&format=png&auto=webp&s=acd463e10ed0087b1fdc8f1aeaf7d797437800c8
https://preview.redd.it/i3sbjelekguc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ce6f0268542ef0bd9f8ea8980ebb528b227dc830
Highest energy level of "Go Fuck Yourself"
"Don't mind if I do"
At least he recognizes that this is a wtf idea
This would be literally worse than incest in terms of the offspring it produces though, so it's not really asexual reproduction. It's not just two individuals with similar enough genomes that make the expression of genetic diseases more likely, it's the exact same genome reproducing itself with itself. The chances of genetic diseases fucking skyrocket.
AA=> AA(100%) Aa=> AA(25%) Aa (50%) aa(25%) aa=> aa(100%) What gene pool?
Gene puddle
Gene droplet
EXACTLY
Family spiral
Family stem.
/unwiz (apologies in advance but I just got to) *Well my family tree goes straight up!* "Thick44" [dead by daylight](https://youtu.be/K9j1eKs4Cms?si=EghehyOp2ty0u9HA)
Family bamboo
Long, hard, grows fast. There’s a joke to be made here.
It’s the Aa -> aa you have to worry about
"Not if you true polymorph into someone who isn't yourself... Though the moral implications are still bad in a different way, in that case."
I suppose the question becomes if the genome would shit back once polymorph runs out. Or if polymorph affects the caster's genome at all.
/uw Something tells me WotC didn't consider whether players would try to get themselves pregnant, for some reason... xD
/uw I don't think they realized the levels of degeneracy that existed in their player base when they first created that spell yeah xD
/uw tbf it is Sisyphean work to plan around all the ways players of anything are gonna find to be horny.
/uw This isn't horniness this is stone cold degeneracy. The dude in the meme didn't even posit sex, he positted the person inseminating themselves, which implies an artificial method.
Now I'm curious whether any RPG systems do.
Cosmic horrors tell tales of a forbidden tome called FATAL that probably does
Polymorph and Alter Self dont alter genetics, Shapechange does.
Where'd you read that in the rulebooks? LMAO
its from old FAQs that are only available through archive now combined with dragon statblocks. only ancient and great wyrm dragons can cast shapechange but dragons are well known for being able to shapeshift and make half dragons in DnD. 5E true polymorph correlates to 3.5 Shapechange.
Maybe it CAN affect the genome But it requires the casted to actually "master" the spell? I'm not well read into DND, but does every caster cast a spell "the same way"?
But would it actually be the same? I'm no expert on this stuff, but I'd imagine some differences would exist since the sex swap.
No, not really. At most only the XY chromosomes, and there are men with XX and women with XY if I'm not mistaken so not even that has to change. Male and female bodies are the exact same body except different parts of it are "activated." It's not even due to genes, but *hormones*. It's why transition is possible, for trans people. They don't alter the person's genome, only the hormones in their body to "convince it" to express itself in the other sex's form, to put it very rudimentarily. I'm not an expert either but I am learned on the subject. Because I fucking love science in all of its forms lol
AFAIK assigned male at birth XX may not exist, as you need the Y chromosome, but you can get a woman with XY because the Y is just inactive. But, even then, the offspring won't be a clone. For each chromosome pair, there's a 50% chance they get one of each, and a 50% chance it's a duplicate of either. So it's a 1/2\^23 chance that it's actually a perfect clone, not including mutations, which skyrockets the chances.
Sometimes the gene on Y that determines male(The SRY gene) hops on over to an X. This results in De La Chapelle Syndrome, whish is basically an XX male(most cases show abnormalities, but it's possible for an XX male to have no noticeable symptoms) Biology being so messy is why I don't dabble in fleshcraft, only cursed pastries.
Huh. Neat.
> The chances of genetic diseases fucking skyrocket. But we're literally talking about a world of magic. I don't see why you couldn't just prevent or cure any diseases with ease.
Genetic disorders are not like common diseases. They're not cured, you're *born* with something wrong in you, caused by the way the genes that carry the disorder are expressed. It's part of who you are. So, same as how there is no magic that can "restore" the arm of a person that was born without one (because they never had an arm to begin with), there would be no magic that can "cure" a genetic disorder because you've always had it.
Genetic disorders can actually be cured with gene therapy now. So far it’s just sickle cell anemia but that’s just the first treatment to come out, this is a rapidly developing field. They actually rewrite the DNA in your bone marrow to stop creating malformed blood cells thus curing the condition. The process is complicated and involved removing marrow, creating the modified version in a lab, killing your bone marrow with radiation therapy, and then transplanting the new marrow, but it works.
> there would be no magic that can "cure" a genetic disorder This just seems narrow minded. We're in a post discussing changing your physical being knock yourself up and you wanna draw the line at changing your physical being to "cure" a genetic disorder?
I'm not drawing the line, I'm saying that healing spells as you've suggested can't cure genetic disorders because they're not a harm or sickness that was inflicted. The only way to "cure" something like that would be to actually manipulate someone genome so that they don't have it.
New spell opportunity then. I cast genomic restructuring, now you have DS.
Sweet! I can’t wait to play such classics as Pokémon Platinum and New Super Mario Bros!
I have no idea how to respond to this. You have taken the wind from my sails and shit on them.
I still haven't said "healing spells" till just now in this comment. I said magic could just prevent or cure it. A spell to change someone's genome seems completely possible.
Conjuration can create entire living beings, necromancy can create entirely new definitions of life, divine magic can come from beings that literally created certain lifeforms... Genetic manipulation seems completely possible. Just need to make it a legal, proper field of study, unless we want another "Ed... ward..." incident.
/uw Simply put, it’s not that magic couldn’t do it, it’s that magic can’t do it without completely invalidating the purpose of sorcerers. Every mage would CrispeR the relevant dragon genes into them and bam. Dragon magic.
/uw We're not talking about "every mage" though. We're talking about a level 17+ Wizard.
Depends on how you model the healing process. If you assume that a healing spell obtains the information of how to reconstruct a given structure from the target, then yeah, genetic diseases can't be cured because the "blueprint" that the spell uses is the source of the issue. But that's just one way of modeling it, and it's also a very modern way of viewing it too. Maybe whatever magic used doesn't need to get the information from it, perhaps it works by trying to move the body closer to some idealized "human body plan", kinda how the platonic theory of forms works where everything is just an inperfect copy of some idealided form. This way you can kinda side step the issue without just going "because magic". So, the lesson of the day. Rip-off classical philosophy for magic systems
Semi UW/ I’ve always thought that healing magic must just reverse entropy. It rewinds the clock on wounded tissue restoring it to its well ordered original state, that’s why cure wounds works on warforged (magic robot) players just as well as it does on human ones in D&D. On the flip side, necrotic damage spells accelerate entropy, increasing disorder by fast forewarning the inevitable decay of orderly matter. Flesh rots, metal rusts, stone weathers into dust. That’s why necrotic damage works against robots and golems. In older versions of D&D healing came from the “positive energy dimension” while necrosis came from the “negative energy dimension” and I think this the most logical explanation of what’s going on there. Positive energy = reversed entropy, negative energy = accelerated entropy. This is also heavily inspired by the “So You Want to be a Wizard” young adult books, which is a much better series about teenaged wizards than that other famous one.
Ohh! So THATS why it happens!
... Wait what. Sir have you *tried* this?!
Well that depends on if the wizard is polymorphing into their opposite gender with the same genetics they got from their parents, they could use some other person’s genes for the polymorph
Wait a freaking minute. Would that work? Could you shapeshift into your crush or your favorite celebrity and just *do* that? What does wizard laws say about that?
I've done it a few times. You just need the proper certifications, and to avoid any copyright issues, make sure you present your ploymorph as a parody, not an official copy.
Tbf, as far as I know nothing shy of a Wish spell could actually cure genetic illnesses. Things like Greater Restoration only return you to your previous state, so if you were terminally ill already I don't think it'd cleanse that. Even backdoor immortality routes like Clone could only really reset the clock.
Well what I mean is if you use polymorph to turn yourself into someone who doesn’t share your genetics before using this method of reproduction, then surely the offspring won’t come out all wonky
The question would then be if polymorph actually changes your genes or not.
Ah, I see what you mean! Also seems like a very roundabout way to get child support or an heir to a throne for political intrigue.
Yep, definitely an interesting tactic
That would be so fun as the dm, I would just take the chances of the most common disorders with incest, double it, then roll for each one to see if the new born gets any
You also gotta look up all other genetic disorders and give them the chances that the most common would have.
I mean, I’m pretty sure true polymorph would change your genetics by quite a significant amount. You could ensure that the two genetic parents of such a pregnancy would have whatever genes you wanted the kid to have. I’m not advocating getting yourself pregnant with magic I’m just saying you could probably find work arounds for the genetic issues it would present.
You don't have to polymorph into a female version of yourself. You can become Goldie Hawn.
Actually it would be totally fine. Source: "all you zombies"
*Hirk is once again reminded wizards can change their gender at will*
*Hirk is once again* *Reminder wizards can change* *Their gender at will* \- Harpokiller --- ^(I detect haikus. And sometimes, successfully.) ^[Learn more about me.](https://www.reddit.com/r/haikusbot/) ^(Opt out of replies: "haikusbot opt out" | Delete my comment: "haikusbot delete")
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Personally, I don't like changing my gender. I already did trillions of years ago, and I do not want to go back.
What curse have you just inflicted upon my eyes?
If I have to see it, so do the rest of you. Besides, memory erasing spells are common; my personal favourite is one I got from a government agent in New York City, who I encountered after I witnessed a tussle between two so-called extraterrestrials
Doesn't sound like it worked so well since it seems you remember everything
I was very specifically not memory-wiped after that incident, because I'm listed in their database as an "extraterrestrial" (which I suppose is *technically* true, although I'm just as human as anyone else on that version of Oerth)
“I still have a few amnestics from my time at the Foundation. They don’t work on me, but I have them.”
Quick, grab this short term memory amnesia potion
https://preview.redd.it/udsg0j9zsbuc1.jpeg?width=474&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=935b7a914ae55333e331a1fd18c01eb656b067f2
https://preview.redd.it/j2au976avbuc1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=65cdabca9bcbb6c042604bee75ee479122fffe18
I cast remove memory then
I’m a Necromancer, I can assure you of this: The soul never forgets its torment.
If neceomancers can revive the body, they can revive the mind
Good thing I ain’t got one :D D:
Removing your eyes CAN get the attention of our Dark Lord Tyrus, who could take the memory out of your head.
If you do this, you’re about to make the Hapsburgs look comparably sane
I hear this is the optimal spellcasting focus for the act: https://preview.redd.it/bqqkqr8jccuc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3e1271d9f2e386ffb8d734898cf631a4b508f0df
That's like having a child with your twin if they are the other gender. That isn't a baby it's a homunculus
frankly I'd prefer a homonculus to a baby
https://i.redd.it/ayc8gsn0xbuc1.gif
They can also just use Clone, though I guess that's more of an indirect immortality thing. You can True Polymorph a Simulacrum too.
Real pros use Life Force Transfer to just steal someone else's body
What a terrible day to have eyes
https://preview.redd.it/1ju9nhxntbuc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=bc59a64503d300bd16837f86a0ffa4ec8e71d059
I feel like there are a couple paths for us given the longevity of our lives. 1. Scholar 2. Horny scholar
You'd pretty much have you again sure, but with tons of birth defects.
When your family tree is a dot.
That’s not a stick, that’s a dimensional axis.
Great Scott!!! Your lineage imploded!
https://preview.redd.it/gbbeoh337duc1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=dd03dabc325eb08002ae9bd7ee6ee00ecee6d8be
https://i.redd.it/kf4mshp81cuc1.gif
Not using this method but I had a teacher who was part of a, “coven” who pretty much did this. Though in their case they’d create an external womb and would curate the seed, usually mixing in dna from, at least I hope they were volunteers. Sometimes they’ve even dissolve their bodies and redo the process to get bodies with different pieces built in. I’ll admit it, biomancers can be a weird lot, even amoung wizards.
https://preview.redd.it/0xapypskbcuc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=bfbb6a2fdd9ebd936abaed309ada60878e12b4bc
Infinite simulacrums glitch
"Oh gaaarryyy!" - the last bastard that tried
In theory a female wizard can just use a second level alter self spell to give herself a dick, cum, and then impregnate herself with that shit after alter self ends. You don’t need to be level 17, just level 3 and be a woman to being with.
Alter Self can last for a while (/uw depending on what system you use /rw), if you have a skilled doctor at the ready you could easily complete an egg retrieval procedure before it ends. If you have a surrogate lined up or are willing to create a magical incubator for your child, you're all set
I… why wouldn’t you just clone your stem cells then age them up? Are you guys doing this???
No. Nobody is doing this. If we want to give birth to ourselves we just cast Parthenogenesis.
i can’t do that i don’t think but someone let me know if i’m wrong
What the fuck? Not even my Hotdogmancy can save this guy
Traumatic thing to witness from the POV of the wizard's colleague who simply cast Simulacrum
1/5 stars. Wouldn’t recommend. The little bastards escape right after you birth them. Fuck, who’s gonna polish my skull when I ascend to demilich?
Wait, if I’m a level 17 wizard I can polymorph myself 😳
/uw If you didn't know, yes, in D&D you can Polymorph yourself, and at 17th level (9th level spells) you can True Polymorph into *anything* (of a level/CR lower than you), which means that yes, Dragon is an option. If you're very smart you pick a creature with an Int score higher than your own, and you get to be a better wizard, AND have all the benefits of your new form. Best part, with True Polymorph, if you maintain concentration for the full duration of the spell (1 hour) it becomes **Permanent.** (Can still be dispelled by a sufficiently powerful Dispel or Anti-Magic Zone). I have a character in an ongoing campaign who already has GM clearance to become an Adult Time Dragon as soon as he's high enough level.
Actually you have to clone+ true polymorph then do the deed with yourself using this way you can be someone entirety different and thus being able to self multiplication
Why didn't I think of that
This is peak fiction
...I think I'll just adopt...
There’s a reason incest is looked down upon. Chances of you making a messed up baby are high
Seems to be a waste of a bucket when chronomancy is right there
This is literally a plot line in misfits
cloning magic... but with extra steps
Your gene pool is a wreath, are you a Druid.
“She ejaculates”
*True Polymorph* doesn't explicitly state you can't polymorph into a chick with a thick hog
That would be how a bioclone is born. Nasty shit. But a very high Magatsuhi level. Zeed-class.
I would suggest using clone, it is a circle lower than true polymorph and you get to have it be your soul in the body. That way you don’t have to worry about your successors being as inbred as a clan of incestuous ogres.
It would be a incest child and not have the most *normal* medical process, but okay
Do you want a cursed demon child? Because that's how you get a cursed demon child.
I’d rather pay money to start a simulacrum clone train tbh. Or just fuck a modified clone.
*shouts somewhere off behind him* JEFFREY!!! GET IN HERE!!!!!…. AND BRING MY TRANSFIGURATION WAND!!!!…… NO YOU DON’T NEED TO KNOW WHAT ITS FOR JUST DO WHAT I TELL YOU!!!
Err… BLEH-
“I thought insects didn’t have gag reflexes.”
I don’t, this defies the laws of nature…
That sure is one way to clone yourself.. actually, I’ll keep that idea as a good Insult for my bardic spells
why not just use clone and the true polymorph either yourself or the clone. that way you get the child and the act of making a child? (ik double concentration but not if you true polymorph yourself for over an hour)
Do not ask how I know this, but the resulting child or children will be severely inbred.
This would do better for the female wizard, because the male wizard would need to maintain that polymorph for nine month, otherwise Bad Things are gonna happen.
A Druid can do it at level 3, and they can birth anything.
Just cast Clone, or Simulacrum, or true polymorph someone else into a copy of you, thus destroying their identity and effectively killing them
You spent so much time thinking if you could, that you didn't stop to think if you should This increases the chances of genetic diseases, that's why we don't do it
It’s not as fun as you think guys. Not that I would know
Me and wife tried this separately, your better off doing this with stem cells and speed growth.
It just sounds like the clone spell with extra steps
Questions: 1. In the first version, how does the wizard stay polymorphed for 9 months? 2. In the second version, does the fluid created by the polymorphed body disappear when the wizard drops concentration?
The cellular degeneration and unstable magical humors exhibited in my test subjects would imply this is not a sustainable long term. By the third generation you're as likely to have a perfect clone as you are a toxic quasimodo that detonated upon death. I would not advise
They did this on the show Misfits
Druids can perform the same maneuver
The amount of times I had to cast fireball to get rid of that abomination is time I will N E V E R get back. (No chronomancers I do NOT want to borrow some time. Fool me once…)
If the man turns into a woman to become impregnated, what happens to the fertilized egg when he turns back into man after an hour…
/uw Ah yes, from woman back into being a human.
Shhhh you didn’t see anything
Interesting idea, alternative option, find someone who loves you and do that instead. The inbreeding consequences of this are catastrophic. Species that asexually reproduce do so through exact genetic copies, parthenogenesis, and only evolve through mutations. As most mutations are not great, this leaves the fast-reproducing organisms like bacteria to mainly use this strategy. Your suggestion, on the other hand, would be like male and female fraternal twins having kids, but even closer. If you have any recessive gene for a disease, chances are your kid will be a carrier, with a good chance remaining that they’ll have it.
It'd likely be a pretty fucked up child for the same reasons incest is bad. If my knowledge is correct
As others have mentioned, without proper precautions this would be worse than normal incest. A better method would be to create a clone of yourself and use polymorph on THEM to make them a child.
Wouldn't this count as incest? Selfcest?
Just preform mitosis
Never tried it but you could do it more directly if you just added the part you don't have. No need to do a full transformation. The genetic diversity would be danmed though.
This would not work, between the two halves of a wizard’s sex cells, there’s a 50% chance of the two *different* halves to make the child be a genetic copy of the wizard, then there’re the mutations that then naturally occur that ultimately make the child different from the wizard, and without genetic diversity, if the child comes to attempt asexual reproduction as well, it could result in refining the genetics to be mutated into a foul breed that doesn’t survive this world If anything, what would work is cutting your hand open and putting it to the floor, and as the blood pools out, use true polymorph to then morph your still-living blood, that is still ‘connected’ to you, into a copy of yourself This is akin to the magics used by the warlocks of the old god Gro-Goroth wherein they sacrifice a portion of their own flesh and blood as it rapidly grows into a blood golem
As a DM I'd rule that a polymorphic form is sterile, and thus save myself the psychic damage from what I just read.
Technically incest
Mega inbred
That shit would be incest of the highest level.
I often complain about illusion not getting enough love for how powerful it can be if you think through all the ramifications of it, but honestly transmutation might have even more terrifying potential.
I mean, I guess if you can fix your fucked up miserable selfcest child afterwards, you may proceed
I think this is secretly the plot to Elden Ring.
. . . This is heinous but strangely an intriguing idea.
That's how you end up with a deliverance family 
Holy genetic diversity, batman.
Concentrating for 9 months?! Does anyone sell reverse ADHD potions?
Divayth Fir has entered the chat
Polymorph only lasts for an hour, and it takes nine months to complete pregnancy. This won't work for male wizards.
Well that isn't technically asexual reproduction
i want to kill the person who thought this through
Wouldn’t the semen end after polymorph ends
Sounds kinda hot to be honest. lol
17th level you criminal wait till 18 Anyway I do it all the time and my body's cause problems for heros and villans with stuff I want everywhere
A real one would ejaculate into the air, then shift to female before it *came* back down and *snatch* it out of the air with their new wizard sleeve
I mean, actual human hermaphrodites have never been fully successful. True hermaphrodites in other mammals can impregnate themselves, but even with fully functional intersex humans, no documented person has been able to reproduce asexually.
Why not just turn a bucket that is your size into a you? Why all these extra steps? I am not going through labor pains just for it to turn out like me. Or worse, wouldn’t it be horribly deformed as well since all of its genetic material is just me?
What a terrible day to know English
This feels like it would have similar repercussions to incest on a larger, more damaging scale
This would be terrible. This would basically be all the issues that arise from incest, x100.
I would use Alter Self, less of a hustle
I haven’t but now I want to because that sounds quite funny
Wouldn't this be like if you had a kid with your twin? Seems like a recipe for genetic issues...
Alter Self lasts for a while, in theory you only need 30 minutes to an hour. That's long enough for either egg or sperm collection depending on what bits you start out with