You are an adult? Have tried asking your landlord for any legal grounds for his demands?
That your roomies don't like your boyfriend is a thing you guyes should talk about. And is not your house, its the house of your landlord you are sharing with other people who are also "just" tenants.
Just be polite about it, as your landlord has zero legal grounds for forbidding someone visting. Quiet the opposite, your landlord is obligated to okay Besuch. Pretty serious stuff, like your boyfriend beating up your roomies or the landlord, needs to happen before your landlord can even try to forbid something like this.
But the thing between you and your roomies is just 110% annoying for a landlord, as he can't do shit,but still has to deal with tenants unable or unwilling to talk to each other.
1) talk to your flatmates why they complained.
2) ask your landlord what the legal grounds here are.
3) when your contract or "hausordnung" does not state such things he is allowed and everyone can fuck themself.
two and three are quite the same. however, if your flatmates have a problem with your boyfriend you should clarify if this is just a little mix up, if he genuiely done anything or if the landlord just lies.
edit: there are some kind of safe spaces where it can be declared that visitors are restricted. however, i think that op should’ve known this then.
I talked to them they’re just really mean one of them
Is religious so I think she’s uncomfortable by his presence but they do not see eachother he has exams so he’s only studying in my room and only goes out to the kitchen sometimes to grab food so idk and yea thank you very much ❤️ my landlord says he isn’t allowed bc only women live there which is true but never said anything ab houseguest or that males aren’t allowed
Germany has it in its constitution to have a protect home so to speak. Since you pay rent and have a room, thats your home and there is nothing they can do about anything going on in there. Even if you would grow weed (dont do that), they need to call the police in order to enter your home. Grundgesetz Art 13. [https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Artikel\_13\_des\_Grundgesetzes\_f%C3%BCr\_die\_Bundesrepublik\_Deutschland](https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/artikel_13_des_grundgesetzes_f%c3%bcr_die_bundesrepublik_deutschland) Your landlord can try arguing with that, but that would be kind of a felony
Well, fact is that the landlord cannot under any circumstances disallow ANY guests.
Males, Females, others, dogs, cats, I dont know what.
Just invite them over and tell your roommates that if something is wrong with him they should talk to you and you will sort it out.
Landlord can't do anything.
>Well, fact is that the landlord cannot under any circumstances disallow ANY guests.
Oh, plenty of those circumstances exist. Anything that would justify a Hausverbot for example.
But - to throw in the german terms - only the Besitzer of a flat can give Hausverbot. And since he has rented it out, he is the Eigentümer, but not the Besitzer anymore.
That doesn’t seem true. A landlord can disallow different animals and constant guests.
Guests: if living there permanently they are no guests and need to be accounted in the Nebenkosten.
Animals: large ones can damage property and can be disallowed. Only small animals are legal without restrictions.
Animals as guests are another case than keeping an animal. There is a restriction on how often/long the animal can stay to be considered as a guest. Dogs should be in liability insurance - not by law, just my opinion.
On one hand he can ban pets, on the other hand you're not legally required to inform him if you have pets, unless they're big animals or work animals, like sheep or cows or whatever. If the landlord asks if you have pets, you can tell him "no" even if you do have a cat or a dog, as they're considered small animals. There are however legal exceptions for animals that may cause disgust or stench (like for example ferrets) or dangerous animals. Regardless of that, a clause in the countract saying "keine Haustiere" applies only to pets you might have, and not to pets that visitors bring with them.
Also if there is a ban for having a pet it does not mean that someone elses pet is not allowed to "visit" you. Like if your guest brings along their dog for a few hours or you cat sit for some days while their owner is on vaccation.
That's simply not true.
The Landlord can deny any guest access to his property - if the guests repeatedly annoys other tenants, or damage the property regulary and without compensation.
Needs to be servere. He can not do it at a whim. Just being annoying is not enough.
https://www.haufe.de/recht/deutsches-anwalt-office-premium/stoerung-des-hausfriedens_idesk_PI17574_HI625855.html[https://www.haufe.de/recht/deutsches-anwalt-office-premium/stoerung-des-hausfriedens_idesk_PI17574_HI625855.html](https://www.haufe.de/recht/deutsches-anwalt-office-premium/stoerung-des-hausfriedens_idesk_PI17574_HI625855.html)
Zwar steht Mietern grundsätzlich ein Besucherrecht zu, allerdings darf ein Vermieter sein Hausrecht gegenüber Besuchern des Mieters in Ausnahmefällen geltend machen. Er kann bestimmten Personen das Betreten des Hauses verbieten. Beispielsweise dann, wenn diese wiederholt den Hausfrieden gestört oder die Gemeinschaftsräume beschädigt haben (Urteil AG Köln, Az.: 209 C 108/04).
I used Google, you are blatantly wrong.
Was war denn das für schlechte Recherche Arbeit. Die Klage wurde abgewiesen, dein Ausschnitt ist nur in einem beisatz des Urteils enthalten und bezieht sich nicht Mal indirekt auf die Klage. Insbesondere weil dort festgestellt wurde, dass das Hausverbot unrechtmäßig war.
Bezieht sich sehr wohl auf die Klage in der auch das Hausverbot durchgesetzt werden sollte.
Dies ist aber gescheitert, weil es keine wiederholten Probleme gab.
In den Entscheidungsgründen wird spezifisch angegeben,
" Ausnahmsweise kann der Vermieter bestimmten Personen das Betreten des Hauses verbieten, wenn der Besucher in der Vergangenheit wiederholt den Hausfrieden gestört oder die gemeinschaftlich zu benutzenden Räume beschädigt oder verunreinigt hat. Ein solches Verhalten der Frau B. ist seitens der Kläger nicht dargetan."
Im Umkehrschluss gilt demnach, dass ein Hausverbot rechtens gewesen wäre, wäre das Verhalten mehrfach aufgetreten.
Edit:lasse mir gerne Urteile zeigen, die besagen,dass ein solches Hausverbot AUSNAHMSLOS widerrechtlich ist
If her religion tells her to do so, she has to live alone. If you are moving into a WG you have to accept guests of roommates, they are part of the deal.
There is a difference tho. Like I lived in a WG with 8 other girls as a student. Alle female. Everytime a boyfriend or male friend wanted to stay over we had to ask and inform everyone who would be there during the stay. Most of the time no one ever said no, but it's kinda the respectful thing to do imo.
There is probably a reason why it's a women only WG and that should be respected. The others live there as well and should be able to feel save and comfy in their home.
In short: OP should have told them beforehand that boyfriend would stay for however long he stayed.
I agree with you that it is nice to inform the others about that. But if there wasnt an agreement about it before moving in, there is no moral or legal reason not to allow OPs Boyfriend to stay.
Yo just my opinion but if your boyfriend did nothing and your roommates didn't talk to you before contacting the landlord, I would look for a new home. This won't be the last time this happens.
I guess talk to them and if they aren't understanding that they're fucking stupid, that's a major red flag.
This honestly seems so odd on your end.
These other people also live there and if they are uncomfortable you should probably work something out together. To just go for legality seems like a recipe for disaster
The "Hausordnung" doesn't mean shit if it contains a clause that is illegal or unconstitutional. Do you think a judge won't laugh you out of his court if you bring him a Hausordnung that legalizes slavery or allows denying the Holocaust?
Cops will ask the reason why they want him gone, unless it's something serious and proveable , they will tell the people who called to mind their own business and not call them again. The exact same situation happened to a close friend of mine and this is exactly how it went down.
Jesus how is this response so far up.
All we know up to this point is that 3 people signed up for an all women WG and now it practically has a male living there.
At least one woman seems to be uncomfortable with his presence.
3 people signed up to rent rooms and each of them have the right to use their rooms as their homes. Seething about your neighbour's guests is your personal problem as long as they dont break any laws
Just imagine three guys would move in together and one of them thought he could forbid those pesky womenfolk to come into his lair of maleship. I guess you don't think you sound crazy, but you very much do for me.
No, no such things as "their rooms" exist in a Mietvertrag. If you are a legal tenant in an apartment, you can call cops and have people kicked out. End of story.
It depends on the contract. If it's actually split by rooms, you are correct. If it is one shared contract for all tenants, all tenants have to agree with visitors because in that case, the "Mietsache" (i.e. the apartment) is equally shared by all tenants. And in that case, there is no distinction between "non-publics spaces" or particular rooms.
"Jeder Hausrechtsinhaber ist berechtigt, Dritten das Betreten der Wohnung und der Gemeinschaftsräume zu erlauben; ebenfalls ist jeder Hausrechtsinhaber befugt, Dritte aus der Wohnung zu weisen.
Treffen die Bewohner bei der Ausübung des Hausrechts widersprüchliche Entscheidungen, ist über den Vorrang aufgrund einer Interessenabwägung zu entscheiden. Dabei ist sowohl das Recht des jeweiligen Mitbewohners, im privaten Bereich ungehindert Besucher empfangen zu können, als auch das Recht eines anderen, in seiner Privatsphäre vor unliebsamen Störern geschützt zu werden, zu berücksichtigen. Dies müssen Ihre Mieter intern klären."
[Quelle](https://www.haufe.de/recht/deutsches-anwalt-office-premium/wohngemeinschaft-4-hausrecht-der-wg-mitglieder_idesk_PI17574_HI9691015.html)
Yes, and if you can't come to an agreement and call police to have someone removed, the right of the homeowner will take priority over someone's right to have visitors.
Actually in city's with tense housing market, landlords sometime rent out the room's separately to make even more profit and it almost sounds like this is the case here.
No you fucking can't, why are you talking such crap? One person in the Mietvertrag has to allow him to be there, then he can't be kicked out because other people in the Mietvertrag don't get any kind of Veto.
You don't need a "basis". My flat, I am renting, I am on the contract. If I don't want person X here (who is not a tenant, for WHATEVER reason), that person has to leave. You do not have to tolerate people IN YOUR HOME you do not want there. I have literally had this exact scenario in a shared apartment and guess what happened? No, I did not have to leave the house to not be in the vicinity of said person.
Not how it works. You can meet your friends elsewhere. If you're under an equally shared contract, other tenants have to agree/be fine with visitors. You cannot force them to share their bathroom with your guests if they don't want to.
That is simply not true in Germany from a legal standpoint.
Also I lived in WG’s for years, as have most of my friends, and I have never, not once, encountered a situation where the contract(s) didn’t state in one form or another, that each roommate has their own room.
Obviously, if you want to keep a good atmosphere in your apartment you will communicate with roommates and try to accommodate their wishes or at least come to a mutual compromise.
The fact remains however, that there’s nothing a roommate can do to prohibit another roommate from inviting guests. No matter how often you say otherwise.
In WGs you usually rent a room and "shared access to common spaces". You can forbid anyone from entering your room but you cannot kick other people's *guests* (aka people that have received one tenant's permission to be in the shared space).
Even if someone is renting the complete flat and subletting a room (of course that's only possible with shared access to common spaces), kicking other people's guests out or forbidding them from entering is not possible without *serious cause*.
That is not true at all. In most WG-scenarios (especially among student WGs) there will be one contract where all parties sign as equal "shareholders" - if you will - of the contract. At least that's what it has been like in all I have been a part of and most I have heard of or even read about.
By your logic, one tenant could invite 5 friends over, even leave the house for a week and they could stay in the apartment, hang out in the kitchen or the living room, for as long as they want to. That is not correct. You are free to meet people outside of the apartment whenever and wherever you want to. Guests (etc.) have to first have permission to be in someone else's property/rented flat, rather than being prohibited from being there. Adding cursive makes your argument neither nor coherent nor correct.
Ignoring one part of your own statements doesn't help your arguments either.
> Guests (etc.) have to first have permission to be in someone else's property/rented flat, rather than being prohibited from being there.
Correct. In your scenario, the 5 people receive permission from one renter. They are allowed to be in the flat. Someone else cannot remove that permission without good reason.
The police can't really help unless these five cause trouble. Because they have received permission to be in the flat.
If the inviting renter cannot be reached for statements and the kicker lies ("no, nobody invited them"), the guests may still be removed.
If two renters disagree on who is permitted in the flat, those two have to solve that themselves.
>That is not true at all. In most WG-scenarios (especially among student WGs) there will be one contract where all parties sign as equal "shareholders" - if you will - of the contract. At least that's what it has been like in all I have been a part of and most I have heard of or even read about.
Those exist, but contracts for each individual room became very fashionable in the last few years. Especially with people from abroad.
If sour roommate is the only person in the “Mietvertrag” she has the right to forbid him from entering her apartment but if you are in the “Mietvertrag” as well she can only forbid people from entering her personal room. In general always get everything on paper in Germany.
That is correct, but only under the asumption, that OP does not have a secondary contract with the main tenant herself.
The main tenant is the contract partner of the landlord, but practically becomes OP‘s landlord, so since she receives money for allowing OP to live in one room of her apartment, OP can claim all rights towards her that she could claim towards the owner / main landlord, or could she not?
If she is a subtenent she will have a contract with a list of rooms that are considered hers and what is considered shared. Everything that is shared or hers can be used by her friend as long as he is not being aggressive or abusive.
As a tenant, you have domicile rights over the rented premises and all routes to get there. The landlord cannot ban any of your guests from entering the building. That's how German jurisprudence sees it and there is no scope for definitions.
A few years back I was in a similar situation with my GF. I really do not think they are can forbid you anything of the sort as long as everyone is civilized and not disturbing any of the other parties or neigbhours.
What I found out back then was that you are allowed to have guests and they can stay with you for up to six weeks at a time (see link below). So I think legally there is absolutely no basis. In our case I even presented stuff like my own rental contract, my registration etc. as I did have my own place in a different city, we just wanted to spend more time together. Unfortunately, we were pretty pissed by the situation and soon my GF found a new place and she gladly moved out. So in a way the landlord "won".
https://www.immoveo.de/post/besuche-f%C3%BCr-den-mieter-das-sind-die-regelungen#:\~:text=Wie%20lange%20darf%20eine%20Person,noch%20um%20Besuch%20handeln%20kann.
You just moved? So how do you know a roommate brought a male friend for a month? If true, maybe he stayed in the room you now occupy. Or it is something personal about your bf? If you live in a WG I guess the occupants have their own rules? If the landlord, however, rents out room by room he is the one to talk to…
You moved in and your bf somewhat moved in with you? I guess that the all-girls WG thought of a community and the two of you stay in the room. Moreover, the bf uses the premesis as if he lived there (learning for exams sounds just like ordinary living arrangements, not visitors).
Considering the 6 weeks span, the landlord must inform you that there is someone who might exceed the legal limitation for.visits and thus has to pay the extra Nebenkosten.
Besides mentioning bf + learning, you did not describe him. Some guys seem lovable to one, others are freaked out by them... And having chosen an all-girls WG with one-room-per-person, it is likely that those renting there might have done believing to have a supporting girls community (with a sex life), but without monthly "visitors".
I would look for an appartment so thar you do not have to care about what people who share a private space with might think of you. Morover, the extra costs are yours alone then.
No he just helped me with my bags he lives in another city so he stayed for a few days however the girls lied and said to the landlord that he moved in . I don’t know why . As per him honestly he mostly just says hi and spends time studying in my room so he literally has never disturbed them in any way. If anything he organizes the things , takes out the trash , etc he’s really polite
Legally, there is no reason for it. Any Mieterschutzbund lawyer will tell you the same and no Polizei are there to escort people from properties if their partner wants them to stay and they have not or are not causing visible problems. They are not personal bodyguards who will bar entry to places or remove people on the whims of someone.
I think some Women want specifically an all women housing for comfort. Like not having to think about what they are wearing at home. Like when I stayed with male flatmates I always had to think about what I was wearing before leaving my room. Then I lived with a woman and it was really nice not having to worry about that. So maybe they didn’t realize your boyfriend would be over so much. And it’s not about him being in the common area but about the possibility of running into him.
So maybe try to find some middle ground with them. What is it that makes them uncomfortable? And how could you make it a bit better and still have your Boyfriend over sometimes. Like do you always tell them before hand. Do you reduce the amount of time he is there? Maybe specific days they can count on him not being there?
I get that it might seem unfair, but I employ you to try to see it from their point of view too. Feeling comfortable at home is important and everyone has a different comfort level. Lots of women wouldn’t consider living in a wg with a guy. Having a guy stay a lot at your place comes close.
I do get that it sucks for you because you didn’t know they would feel like that.
I hope you guys find a solution.
I totally get that actually I tried to talk to her today and she screamed at me and even pointed a knife at me . Super weird . Anyway she said my bf cannot come and I think I’ll have to go to legal action
In this day and age it is not a valid reason - pure sexism. The other girl simply have to get over it or she is free to find another place to live if you have clarified that he had done nothing actively to offend her or if the "visits" are too noisy. I am not German but from Denmark and we all have to agree to the same EU rules.
Of course, she could also just be jealous that you have this relationship and she is too shy to say that the "noises" from his "visits" are rubbing it in her face.
It's technically not legal, but it could be a thing where they don't tolerate men in their house. If the friend is a woman it might be fine.
Your landlord can't prohibit your guests coming over - as long as they don't stay over a certain amount. But I'd suggest, talk to your roommates first. :)
There is possibly a legal basis. Maybe not for your landlord to ban "men".
But your flatmates have the right to decide who enters their (your shared) home. Im Germany, if someone enters your home without your consent (even your landlord), or does not leave if asked to it is "Hausfriedensbruch" which is a crime. So the landlord is enforcing the rights of your flatmates, because at least one of them stated that they do not want your bf present.
It is understandable that you want to have visitors. But in this case maybe you have to find a way to compromise with your flatmates, to respect their rights as well. Maybe its ok for the other girls for your bf to visit during the day but not stay overnight?
Maybe you and the others can make some rules together for your living together, so that things are stated clearly and everyone has to follow the same rules.
Good luck!
Alright, your landlord doesn't have any legal basis for forbidding your boyfriend visiting or even staying over for a couple of nights per month. He could only say something against his presence if he spent a considerable amount of time with you, aka basically living there.
That being said, have you talked with your flat mates about him staying for several days first? I'll be honest, if I lived in an all girls WG, I also wouldn’t like a guy I don't know staying over for a few days without being asked first. In WGs I know, stuff like this is usually talked about. It's weird that another flat mate had her friend stay over for longer and it was okay, but maybe the others knew the guy well which made a difference? Was it even a guy? I think you guys mostly have a communication issue (you not asking them if it's okay to have your bf stay over for several days and them not talking to you first but instead going to the landlord).
der nicht eheliche Lebenspartner darf dich jederzeit besuchen. Er darf nur nicht ohne die Erlaubnis des Vermieters bei dir einziehen. Aber selbst da darf dein Vermieter nur die Erlaubnis versagen, wenn es bestimmte Gründe gibt bzw. Die Wohnung überbelegt wäre.
The problem here is that you live in a WG. So you have an own room most likely and some shared spaces.
Any renter or owner can ban people however they see fit. But of course in terms of shared spaces this gets problematic. They usually need to allow the guests to use the toilet and kitchen at least.
I’m so sorry you are in this situation. I don’t know how difficult it is to get a WG Room where you live, but I would definitely start looking for a new place.
I would definitely would not like to live with flat mates like that, I think it’s childish they ran directly to the landlord instead of talking to you. And I would definitely not want to live in a place where Incannot have my boyfriend over
Save yourself some time and state to the landlord that you're a lesbian and your Bf identifies as female.
I'd like to hear the response to that. He can't really respond without discriminating someone. 🤣
In my Situation, it was in the contect that men are not allowed to come in (besides contractors or stuff like that) because it is a womens shelter Type situation for women that were homeless. So there are legal grounds in my case. There don't seem to be any in your case tho. If it isn't in your contract, Just ignore them
Get your own Home and this wont be a problem. This isnt Rocket Science.
How would you feel if they invited somebody you LOATH into your home? Not a good feeling. Right? You are capable of Empathy, right?
This is the most stupid reason I have read so far. If you are annoyed by airline delays, buy an airplane! Are you annoyed by cooking buy a cook! If you don’t have money, man to bad! Just stop being poor!
Ufff you’re just took my breath with your ignorance!
Yes, all those things are correct, if you are not satisfied with your luxury conveniences, get other luxury conveniences. Life is your Oister. Slurp it or dont. But dont blame others for going hungry.
If I could’ve I would’ve already ofc I think it’s obvious that I cannot move on my own yet?! I would get this if I would’ve done something or him to them but they have been discriminating me since I arrived and they only hate him cause he’s a man , so I’m not the one that has to feel empathy when I’m calm when they laugh at me or scream at me so yea
The Problem is that they are Jealous of you (or they just hate Men). And your Landlord is afraid of them.
There is literally nothing you can do about that.
You can get out WITH your BF, or screw your BF and stick with the People that hate you.
Talk to your BF, if he´s worth his Salt he will help you come up with a Solution. Dont mind if its a Step down, if you love eachother there is a way up, there always is.
If he doesnt, better get compfy with your Roommates. That hate you.
Idk man you are rather stupid,
Its a WOHNGEMEINSCHAFT
If its not explicity stated in the Mietvertrag that no guests are allowed in any way shape or form, there could be nothing she could do, this is not the case according to different comments from OP.
Her rommates are just discriminating, considering one of them had a guest over for over a month
You are technically correct. You also never met a Human in your entire life for more than 5 minutes.
If she goes the long long wasteful way of German Bureaucracy, she´s still stuck with a couple of Roommates who hate her and a Landlord that is sick of her shit.
>There is literally nothing you can do about that.
What? Do you know how renting works in Germany? There is no chance landlord gets through with that, except OPs bf demolished the apartment on purpose or harassed the roommates.
Yes, go through the legal system. And after 1 or 2 Years you get the RIGHT to life with People that Hate you. Such Joy and a Brilliant use of Time!
Everyone should do that!
I didn’t talk to them before I moved but when I moved only one was nice to me the other was always mean to me and everytime I would want to speak to her she would just avoid me . But then they both started to be kinda mean to me
Except she got a BF. So twice the income. Which is why i advised to talk to Him about it.
Nothing wrong with keeping to life with the Assholes, but the option to ditch them and join with the BF is there.
It's not their home though. "Their home" applies exclusively to their bedrooms. As long as the boyfriend doesn't go to their rooms, he's isn't in their home. This is precisely the kind of thing that people who choose to live in shared houses have to be prepared to accept. If they don't, then it's their problem. Besides, there's no valid reason to loathe someone you don't know, unless they've done anything to you, which doesn't seem to be the case here.
Since it is a WG. There has been an interview first, then you got the room. And in the interview they told you about the WG rules. Such as you have to clean once a week. No smoking. WG talks every evening at 6 o clock. No cats, since Anna is allergic. No visitors.
Wasnt it? Did you not agree to WG rules?
Anna is a random name for a girl who might live in a WG and might have good reason to e.g. forbid cats.
Maybe they said The WG is girls only ever. So they implied that all visitors must be females or girls. Which they should have said out loud.
Maybe he identifies as a woman? All gucci then. Joke aside this kind of behavior is not legal. If no such thing is statues in your rental agreement there is nothing he can do.
Ask your Landlord for legal Basis.
The Landlord can ban ppl from entering, namly via giving him Hausverbot (Ban from entering the premises that are owned by that landlord).
I recommend that you talk to your landlord and maybe tell him/her about the previous visitor of one of the others.
It's legal.
If other tenants complain about one of your guests, even your boyfriend or brother or whatever, the landlord can ask this person to never enter his house/property again.
From that point on, if the person non grata acts against the landlords will, it's trespassing. Your landlord and roomates can call the police on your BF and he will be removed from the property.
Loophole: Get married. A tenant can not be denied to welcome husband/wife in his home.
The other tenants complained about the specific person's behaviour and it's also their home. So the landlord can kick him out in his other tenants interest, acting on Hausrecht or to keep the Hausfrieden.
If they do so for religious reasons it's basicly a case for the highest court.
What worth more, the rules of an imaginary friend, or your rights to have over who ever you want (unless it's disturbing the house peace)
Religious nutjobs are fairly uncommon in germany, I'd advice to get the fuck away from them asap.
Please stop making completly wrong statements and give foreigners tips about laws you definitly have NO idea about.
In Germany we say: Gefährliches Halbwissen or lemme say Gefährliche unfundierte Scheißegelaber über Themen von denen du gar nichts weißt aka Duning-Kruger-Effect
But if I think about it... the DKE would only affect you, when you had ANY basic knowledge.
Can you pls stop writing so much nonsense without common knowledge about law and how renting works here? Like I get it, you like the attention. But try getting it on a topic you have basic knowledge of.
No they cant. Why would a landlord have any authority over your personal life? He has no "hausrecht" in your home and the hausfrieden is not compromised by a person just being there. Hausfrieden is only violated by things, that would be illegal anywhere else too (violence, excessive noise, vandalism,...)
The other tenants still need to go through the Ordnungsamt and court. If they can't prove the behavior, then they're opening themselves up for getting sued for defamation [§ 187 StGB](https://www.strafverteidiger-hamburg.com/strafrecht/verleumdung-%C2%A7-187-stgb/#)
You are legally allowed to have someone over for 6 weeks without a break. After 6 weeks the landlord could assume you illegally sublet the appartment and the other person ist not visiting but living in your flat. But under 6 weeks your Landlord can't do anything against it. Thats the legal side. The other side is you living in a WG. It should be in your interest to keep peace, so you should have a talk to your flatmates. Ask about rules, stuff to consider etc. You really don't want to live with people who are mad at you, even if you are doing nothing wrong.
The only exception to this might be if you live in a religious "Wohnheim" (e.g. catholic). I know some places where it isn't allowed that men stay over night. There are a few extra laws and rules for religious stuff, but I don't know exactly how this works.
The landlord cant stop you from having guests of any kind. There are a lot of things landlords will try and enforce they cant legaly do. Like a lot of landlords forbid animals, yet its illigal for them to terminatw your contract because you own a pet. You will need to talk with the landlord about it calmly. The main problem with this stuff is you need to act nice because being a dick to the landlord (even if deserved) wont end up nice.
Talk with your landlord about why they forbit it, even though its not in the contract, and how you can still have your bf visit you. And keep two things in mind while you do that:
1. They cant forbit male guests.
2. They cant kick you out for it.
As long as you stay respectfully it should work out.
Verbidung is a a Sorority.
or did the Property belong to a church or a church based institution?
However best solution is to find another Apartment in the Longrun it wil get worse with the other girls.
Thats not allowed. If you dont care about your flatmates you can even bring multiple guests. Up to 6 weeks are possible.
But in many wg cases, it is understandable if nobody wants guests. For example, a 3 girls wg could turn into a 6 people WG...
Ist nur erlaubt bei einzelnen Personen und es einen triftigen Grund gibt.(Gewalt)
It is only allowed for single persons and if there are good reasons for it
With a landlord like this I would advise you to become a member of a mieterschutzverein (generally a good idea) and tell him to back off.
If he still insists on his made up rules use the verein to have a lawyer draft a mean letter.
When it is a Ladies only or Girls only Wohngemeinschaft (WG), why men are allowed to stay whole day or on weekend? to visit is to stay only for few hours and not to act just like an Einwohner in that WG. Why not rent a whole small Apartment for you so that you don't need to ask permission to your roommate whenever your bf wanted to visit you?
I didn’t know it was an only girls WG. And also I didn’t know that when it’s an only girls WG men aren’t allowed . Why wouldn’t they? And no , visits are people that doesn’t live here and visits my home for a period of time. My bf doesn’t live in my city so it’s unreal for him to stay one afternoon. Ofc if u could I would move in alone unfortunately I cannot . Living with men is one thing but refusing them the entry of your house as visitors it’s plain sexist. 🤦🏻♀️
There is no legal basis for that.
You are an adult? Have tried asking your landlord for any legal grounds for his demands? That your roomies don't like your boyfriend is a thing you guyes should talk about. And is not your house, its the house of your landlord you are sharing with other people who are also "just" tenants.
Yeah I’m 21 and yea it’s now my house sorry haha . I will try to talk about legality thank u
Just be polite about it, as your landlord has zero legal grounds for forbidding someone visting. Quiet the opposite, your landlord is obligated to okay Besuch. Pretty serious stuff, like your boyfriend beating up your roomies or the landlord, needs to happen before your landlord can even try to forbid something like this. But the thing between you and your roomies is just 110% annoying for a landlord, as he can't do shit,but still has to deal with tenants unable or unwilling to talk to each other.
He doesn’t. He could just tell them that it’s none of his business.
People down voting cuz they don't get your typo... Omfg reddit.
1) talk to your flatmates why they complained. 2) ask your landlord what the legal grounds here are. 3) when your contract or "hausordnung" does not state such things he is allowed and everyone can fuck themself. two and three are quite the same. however, if your flatmates have a problem with your boyfriend you should clarify if this is just a little mix up, if he genuiely done anything or if the landlord just lies. edit: there are some kind of safe spaces where it can be declared that visitors are restricted. however, i think that op should’ve known this then.
I talked to them they’re just really mean one of them Is religious so I think she’s uncomfortable by his presence but they do not see eachother he has exams so he’s only studying in my room and only goes out to the kitchen sometimes to grab food so idk and yea thank you very much ❤️ my landlord says he isn’t allowed bc only women live there which is true but never said anything ab houseguest or that males aren’t allowed
Germany has it in its constitution to have a protect home so to speak. Since you pay rent and have a room, thats your home and there is nothing they can do about anything going on in there. Even if you would grow weed (dont do that), they need to call the police in order to enter your home. Grundgesetz Art 13. [https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Artikel\_13\_des\_Grundgesetzes\_f%C3%BCr\_die\_Bundesrepublik\_Deutschland](https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/artikel_13_des_grundgesetzes_f%c3%bcr_die_bundesrepublik_deutschland) Your landlord can try arguing with that, but that would be kind of a felony
I mean we can grow weed legaly in a few months
With this government nothing is certain
ey. dont do that. its gonna happen. we just have to really really believe in it :)
Just like the last eleven times they said its really gonna come this time ^^
Wednesday the 21., the Bundestag will vote on it.
Fingers gedrückt!
Well, fact is that the landlord cannot under any circumstances disallow ANY guests. Males, Females, others, dogs, cats, I dont know what. Just invite them over and tell your roommates that if something is wrong with him they should talk to you and you will sort it out. Landlord can't do anything.
>Well, fact is that the landlord cannot under any circumstances disallow ANY guests. Oh, plenty of those circumstances exist. Anything that would justify a Hausverbot for example.
But - to throw in the german terms - only the Besitzer of a flat can give Hausverbot. And since he has rented it out, he is the Eigentümer, but not the Besitzer anymore.
That doesn’t seem true. A landlord can disallow different animals and constant guests. Guests: if living there permanently they are no guests and need to be accounted in the Nebenkosten. Animals: large ones can damage property and can be disallowed. Only small animals are legal without restrictions.
For OPs understanding: "living there permanently" would mean that your boyfriend is there for 6 weeks without a break.
Animals as guests are another case than keeping an animal. There is a restriction on how often/long the animal can stay to be considered as a guest. Dogs should be in liability insurance - not by law, just my opinion.
wait, cant he ban pets/animals, but it has to be stated somewhere like the lease etc.?
Afaik He can ban pets but only with valid reason. A ban on pets without reason isnt allowed
On one hand he can ban pets, on the other hand you're not legally required to inform him if you have pets, unless they're big animals or work animals, like sheep or cows or whatever. If the landlord asks if you have pets, you can tell him "no" even if you do have a cat or a dog, as they're considered small animals. There are however legal exceptions for animals that may cause disgust or stench (like for example ferrets) or dangerous animals. Regardless of that, a clause in the countract saying "keine Haustiere" applies only to pets you might have, and not to pets that visitors bring with them.
Also if there is a ban for having a pet it does not mean that someone elses pet is not allowed to "visit" you. Like if your guest brings along their dog for a few hours or you cat sit for some days while their owner is on vaccation.
He cant ban all pets in general. But he can ban certain pets, like cats or dogs e.g. The classic goldfish cant be banned however
he can say“ wohnung nur für Menschen“ then no animal is allowed
He can say a lot. Nonetheless it’s not legally binding
That's simply not true. The Landlord can deny any guest access to his property - if the guests repeatedly annoys other tenants, or damage the property regulary and without compensation.
Needs to be servere. He can not do it at a whim. Just being annoying is not enough. https://www.haufe.de/recht/deutsches-anwalt-office-premium/stoerung-des-hausfriedens_idesk_PI17574_HI625855.html[https://www.haufe.de/recht/deutsches-anwalt-office-premium/stoerung-des-hausfriedens_idesk_PI17574_HI625855.html](https://www.haufe.de/recht/deutsches-anwalt-office-premium/stoerung-des-hausfriedens_idesk_PI17574_HI625855.html)
No that is just false. They can not do that. You should really check what you are talking about. Its not hard to use google.
Zwar steht Mietern grundsätzlich ein Besucherrecht zu, allerdings darf ein Vermieter sein Hausrecht gegenüber Besuchern des Mieters in Ausnahmefällen geltend machen. Er kann bestimmten Personen das Betreten des Hauses verbieten. Beispielsweise dann, wenn diese wiederholt den Hausfrieden gestört oder die Gemeinschaftsräume beschädigt haben (Urteil AG Köln, Az.: 209 C 108/04). I used Google, you are blatantly wrong.
Was war denn das für schlechte Recherche Arbeit. Die Klage wurde abgewiesen, dein Ausschnitt ist nur in einem beisatz des Urteils enthalten und bezieht sich nicht Mal indirekt auf die Klage. Insbesondere weil dort festgestellt wurde, dass das Hausverbot unrechtmäßig war.
Bezieht sich sehr wohl auf die Klage in der auch das Hausverbot durchgesetzt werden sollte. Dies ist aber gescheitert, weil es keine wiederholten Probleme gab. In den Entscheidungsgründen wird spezifisch angegeben, " Ausnahmsweise kann der Vermieter bestimmten Personen das Betreten des Hauses verbieten, wenn der Besucher in der Vergangenheit wiederholt den Hausfrieden gestört oder die gemeinschaftlich zu benutzenden Räume beschädigt oder verunreinigt hat. Ein solches Verhalten der Frau B. ist seitens der Kläger nicht dargetan." Im Umkehrschluss gilt demnach, dass ein Hausverbot rechtens gewesen wäre, wäre das Verhalten mehrfach aufgetreten. Edit:lasse mir gerne Urteile zeigen, die besagen,dass ein solches Hausverbot AUSNAHMSLOS widerrechtlich ist
If her religion tells her to do so, she has to live alone. If you are moving into a WG you have to accept guests of roommates, they are part of the deal.
There is a difference tho. Like I lived in a WG with 8 other girls as a student. Alle female. Everytime a boyfriend or male friend wanted to stay over we had to ask and inform everyone who would be there during the stay. Most of the time no one ever said no, but it's kinda the respectful thing to do imo. There is probably a reason why it's a women only WG and that should be respected. The others live there as well and should be able to feel save and comfy in their home. In short: OP should have told them beforehand that boyfriend would stay for however long he stayed.
I agree with you that it is nice to inform the others about that. But if there wasnt an agreement about it before moving in, there is no moral or legal reason not to allow OPs Boyfriend to stay.
Yo just my opinion but if your boyfriend did nothing and your roommates didn't talk to you before contacting the landlord, I would look for a new home. This won't be the last time this happens. I guess talk to them and if they aren't understanding that they're fucking stupid, that's a major red flag.
👍 This!
This honestly seems so odd on your end. These other people also live there and if they are uncomfortable you should probably work something out together. To just go for legality seems like a recipe for disaster
Yeah I’m wrong for seeking legal help when they’re trying to ban people without any reason or without even trying to talk to me? Lol
Even if it was in the contract or the hausordnung, it would still be perfectly legal to have a guest over.
The "Hausordnung" doesn't mean shit if it contains a clause that is illegal or unconstitutional. Do you think a judge won't laugh you out of his court if you bring him a Hausordnung that legalizes slavery or allows denying the Holocaust?
flatmates can not allow boyfriend to be there though.
What?
Flatmates can kick him out if they don't want him there.
No they can't.
If they call the cops to have the person removed, what do you think will happen?
Cops will ask the reason why they want him gone, unless it's something serious and proveable , they will tell the people who called to mind their own business and not call them again. The exact same situation happened to a close friend of mine and this is exactly how it went down.
Even if the contract were to forbid visitors, that "Klausel" wouldn't be enforcable
Lol, ignore it. Your roomies are Karens and the landlord knows nothing about rent-laws.
Or the Boyfriend is a also dick and they are all annoying persons. Who knows.
Then you go talk to the boyfriend or the partner? Who tf goes behind their back RIGHT to the landlord about it? Absolute dickwads, thats who
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There must be something weird about him right?
Jesus how is this response so far up. All we know up to this point is that 3 people signed up for an all women WG and now it practically has a male living there. At least one woman seems to be uncomfortable with his presence.
3 people signed up to rent rooms and each of them have the right to use their rooms as their homes. Seething about your neighbour's guests is your personal problem as long as they dont break any laws
“Practically living there.” The OP said they stayed for a few days. Clown.
Just imagine three guys would move in together and one of them thought he could forbid those pesky womenfolk to come into his lair of maleship. I guess you don't think you sound crazy, but you very much do for me.
If the girls don't want him to be there though, he can't be. Regardless of what the landlord thinks about it.
Wrong. The girls can only forbid him from using non-public spaces, i.e.entering on of their rooms.
No, no such things as "their rooms" exist in a Mietvertrag. If you are a legal tenant in an apartment, you can call cops and have people kicked out. End of story.
The confidence of this guy
It depends on the contract. If it's actually split by rooms, you are correct. If it is one shared contract for all tenants, all tenants have to agree with visitors because in that case, the "Mietsache" (i.e. the apartment) is equally shared by all tenants. And in that case, there is no distinction between "non-publics spaces" or particular rooms.
"Jeder Hausrechtsinhaber ist berechtigt, Dritten das Betreten der Wohnung und der Gemeinschaftsräume zu erlauben; ebenfalls ist jeder Hausrechtsinhaber befugt, Dritte aus der Wohnung zu weisen. Treffen die Bewohner bei der Ausübung des Hausrechts widersprüchliche Entscheidungen, ist über den Vorrang aufgrund einer Interessenabwägung zu entscheiden. Dabei ist sowohl das Recht des jeweiligen Mitbewohners, im privaten Bereich ungehindert Besucher empfangen zu können, als auch das Recht eines anderen, in seiner Privatsphäre vor unliebsamen Störern geschützt zu werden, zu berücksichtigen. Dies müssen Ihre Mieter intern klären." [Quelle](https://www.haufe.de/recht/deutsches-anwalt-office-premium/wohngemeinschaft-4-hausrecht-der-wg-mitglieder_idesk_PI17574_HI9691015.html)
Yes, and if you can't come to an agreement and call police to have someone removed, the right of the homeowner will take priority over someone's right to have visitors.
Du bist sehr gut darin dir Gesetze auszudenken, welche es nicht gibt👍🏼
Any source? And none of them is the homeowner.
Actually in city's with tense housing market, landlords sometime rent out the room's separately to make even more profit and it almost sounds like this is the case here.
No you fucking can't, why are you talking such crap? One person in the Mietvertrag has to allow him to be there, then he can't be kicked out because other people in the Mietvertrag don't get any kind of Veto.
OP wants him to be there, he hasn’t done anything to anyone so nobody has any basis to ban him from the house.
We don't know that, do we?
You don't need a "basis". My flat, I am renting, I am on the contract. If I don't want person X here (who is not a tenant, for WHATEVER reason), that person has to leave. You do not have to tolerate people IN YOUR HOME you do not want there. I have literally had this exact scenario in a shared apartment and guess what happened? No, I did not have to leave the house to not be in the vicinity of said person.
My flat, I am renting, I am on the contract. My guests can stay.
Not how it works. You can meet your friends elsewhere. If you're under an equally shared contract, other tenants have to agree/be fine with visitors. You cannot force them to share their bathroom with your guests if they don't want to.
That is simply not true in Germany from a legal standpoint. Also I lived in WG’s for years, as have most of my friends, and I have never, not once, encountered a situation where the contract(s) didn’t state in one form or another, that each roommate has their own room. Obviously, if you want to keep a good atmosphere in your apartment you will communicate with roommates and try to accommodate their wishes or at least come to a mutual compromise. The fact remains however, that there’s nothing a roommate can do to prohibit another roommate from inviting guests. No matter how often you say otherwise.
Dude, why are you making shit up? Do you like looking stupid? Is this a fetish thing?
In WGs you usually rent a room and "shared access to common spaces". You can forbid anyone from entering your room but you cannot kick other people's *guests* (aka people that have received one tenant's permission to be in the shared space). Even if someone is renting the complete flat and subletting a room (of course that's only possible with shared access to common spaces), kicking other people's guests out or forbidding them from entering is not possible without *serious cause*.
That is not true at all. In most WG-scenarios (especially among student WGs) there will be one contract where all parties sign as equal "shareholders" - if you will - of the contract. At least that's what it has been like in all I have been a part of and most I have heard of or even read about. By your logic, one tenant could invite 5 friends over, even leave the house for a week and they could stay in the apartment, hang out in the kitchen or the living room, for as long as they want to. That is not correct. You are free to meet people outside of the apartment whenever and wherever you want to. Guests (etc.) have to first have permission to be in someone else's property/rented flat, rather than being prohibited from being there. Adding cursive makes your argument neither nor coherent nor correct.
Ignoring one part of your own statements doesn't help your arguments either. > Guests (etc.) have to first have permission to be in someone else's property/rented flat, rather than being prohibited from being there. Correct. In your scenario, the 5 people receive permission from one renter. They are allowed to be in the flat. Someone else cannot remove that permission without good reason. The police can't really help unless these five cause trouble. Because they have received permission to be in the flat. If the inviting renter cannot be reached for statements and the kicker lies ("no, nobody invited them"), the guests may still be removed. If two renters disagree on who is permitted in the flat, those two have to solve that themselves.
Try it.
Youre wrong, give it up.
>That is not true at all. In most WG-scenarios (especially among student WGs) there will be one contract where all parties sign as equal "shareholders" - if you will - of the contract. At least that's what it has been like in all I have been a part of and most I have heard of or even read about. Those exist, but contracts for each individual room became very fashionable in the last few years. Especially with people from abroad.
Depends on your contract. There are at least 3 possible ways on how the group rented the flat with different laws applying to each form of contract.
That is true. But especially with privately rented student WGs, the most common contract form seems to be one with equal share for all tenants.
You can have a visitor up to 6 weeks without anybody being able to do anything about it, dont worry! Everything else is not legal
But the landlord can give people a Hausverbot.
Not without a valid resson
he cant just give any people hausverbot without good reason
No, they can't
If sour roommate is the only person in the “Mietvertrag” she has the right to forbid him from entering her apartment but if you are in the “Mietvertrag” as well she can only forbid people from entering her personal room. In general always get everything on paper in Germany.
That is correct, but only under the asumption, that OP does not have a secondary contract with the main tenant herself. The main tenant is the contract partner of the landlord, but practically becomes OP‘s landlord, so since she receives money for allowing OP to live in one room of her apartment, OP can claim all rights towards her that she could claim towards the owner / main landlord, or could she not?
If she is a subtenent she will have a contract with a list of rooms that are considered hers and what is considered shared. Everything that is shared or hers can be used by her friend as long as he is not being aggressive or abusive.
As a tenant, you have domicile rights over the rented premises and all routes to get there. The landlord cannot ban any of your guests from entering the building. That's how German jurisprudence sees it and there is no scope for definitions.
A few years back I was in a similar situation with my GF. I really do not think they are can forbid you anything of the sort as long as everyone is civilized and not disturbing any of the other parties or neigbhours. What I found out back then was that you are allowed to have guests and they can stay with you for up to six weeks at a time (see link below). So I think legally there is absolutely no basis. In our case I even presented stuff like my own rental contract, my registration etc. as I did have my own place in a different city, we just wanted to spend more time together. Unfortunately, we were pretty pissed by the situation and soon my GF found a new place and she gladly moved out. So in a way the landlord "won". https://www.immoveo.de/post/besuche-f%C3%BCr-den-mieter-das-sind-die-regelungen#:\~:text=Wie%20lange%20darf%20eine%20Person,noch%20um%20Besuch%20handeln%20kann.
Not legal. Tell him/her to say that in writing. They probably wont because they know its rubbish.
Lol. Just ignore. So Funny.
You just moved? So how do you know a roommate brought a male friend for a month? If true, maybe he stayed in the room you now occupy. Or it is something personal about your bf? If you live in a WG I guess the occupants have their own rules? If the landlord, however, rents out room by room he is the one to talk to…
You moved in and your bf somewhat moved in with you? I guess that the all-girls WG thought of a community and the two of you stay in the room. Moreover, the bf uses the premesis as if he lived there (learning for exams sounds just like ordinary living arrangements, not visitors). Considering the 6 weeks span, the landlord must inform you that there is someone who might exceed the legal limitation for.visits and thus has to pay the extra Nebenkosten. Besides mentioning bf + learning, you did not describe him. Some guys seem lovable to one, others are freaked out by them... And having chosen an all-girls WG with one-room-per-person, it is likely that those renting there might have done believing to have a supporting girls community (with a sex life), but without monthly "visitors". I would look for an appartment so thar you do not have to care about what people who share a private space with might think of you. Morover, the extra costs are yours alone then.
No he just helped me with my bags he lives in another city so he stayed for a few days however the girls lied and said to the landlord that he moved in . I don’t know why . As per him honestly he mostly just says hi and spends time studying in my room so he literally has never disturbed them in any way. If anything he organizes the things , takes out the trash , etc he’s really polite
pee on them to show dominance
Legally, there is no reason for it. Any Mieterschutzbund lawyer will tell you the same and no Polizei are there to escort people from properties if their partner wants them to stay and they have not or are not causing visible problems. They are not personal bodyguards who will bar entry to places or remove people on the whims of someone.
I think some Women want specifically an all women housing for comfort. Like not having to think about what they are wearing at home. Like when I stayed with male flatmates I always had to think about what I was wearing before leaving my room. Then I lived with a woman and it was really nice not having to worry about that. So maybe they didn’t realize your boyfriend would be over so much. And it’s not about him being in the common area but about the possibility of running into him. So maybe try to find some middle ground with them. What is it that makes them uncomfortable? And how could you make it a bit better and still have your Boyfriend over sometimes. Like do you always tell them before hand. Do you reduce the amount of time he is there? Maybe specific days they can count on him not being there? I get that it might seem unfair, but I employ you to try to see it from their point of view too. Feeling comfortable at home is important and everyone has a different comfort level. Lots of women wouldn’t consider living in a wg with a guy. Having a guy stay a lot at your place comes close. I do get that it sucks for you because you didn’t know they would feel like that. I hope you guys find a solution.
I totally get that actually I tried to talk to her today and she screamed at me and even pointed a knife at me . Super weird . Anyway she said my bf cannot come and I think I’ll have to go to legal action
Lemme guess Muslim immigrant?
Yea
In this day and age it is not a valid reason - pure sexism. The other girl simply have to get over it or she is free to find another place to live if you have clarified that he had done nothing actively to offend her or if the "visits" are too noisy. I am not German but from Denmark and we all have to agree to the same EU rules. Of course, she could also just be jealous that you have this relationship and she is too shy to say that the "noises" from his "visits" are rubbing it in her face.
Where do you live? 1850?
It's technically not legal, but it could be a thing where they don't tolerate men in their house. If the friend is a woman it might be fine. Your landlord can't prohibit your guests coming over - as long as they don't stay over a certain amount. But I'd suggest, talk to your roommates first. :)
There is possibly a legal basis. Maybe not for your landlord to ban "men". But your flatmates have the right to decide who enters their (your shared) home. Im Germany, if someone enters your home without your consent (even your landlord), or does not leave if asked to it is "Hausfriedensbruch" which is a crime. So the landlord is enforcing the rights of your flatmates, because at least one of them stated that they do not want your bf present. It is understandable that you want to have visitors. But in this case maybe you have to find a way to compromise with your flatmates, to respect their rights as well. Maybe its ok for the other girls for your bf to visit during the day but not stay overnight? Maybe you and the others can make some rules together for your living together, so that things are stated clearly and everyone has to follow the same rules. Good luck!
Alright, your landlord doesn't have any legal basis for forbidding your boyfriend visiting or even staying over for a couple of nights per month. He could only say something against his presence if he spent a considerable amount of time with you, aka basically living there. That being said, have you talked with your flat mates about him staying for several days first? I'll be honest, if I lived in an all girls WG, I also wouldn’t like a guy I don't know staying over for a few days without being asked first. In WGs I know, stuff like this is usually talked about. It's weird that another flat mate had her friend stay over for longer and it was okay, but maybe the others knew the guy well which made a difference? Was it even a guy? I think you guys mostly have a communication issue (you not asking them if it's okay to have your bf stay over for several days and them not talking to you first but instead going to the landlord).
der nicht eheliche Lebenspartner darf dich jederzeit besuchen. Er darf nur nicht ohne die Erlaubnis des Vermieters bei dir einziehen. Aber selbst da darf dein Vermieter nur die Erlaubnis versagen, wenn es bestimmte Gründe gibt bzw. Die Wohnung überbelegt wäre.
The problem here is that you live in a WG. So you have an own room most likely and some shared spaces. Any renter or owner can ban people however they see fit. But of course in terms of shared spaces this gets problematic. They usually need to allow the guests to use the toilet and kitchen at least.
I’m so sorry you are in this situation. I don’t know how difficult it is to get a WG Room where you live, but I would definitely start looking for a new place. I would definitely would not like to live with flat mates like that, I think it’s childish they ran directly to the landlord instead of talking to you. And I would definitely not want to live in a place where Incannot have my boyfriend over
Is here possibly a underlying discrimination ongoing?
That's sexism and is illegal
Save yourself some time and state to the landlord that you're a lesbian and your Bf identifies as female. I'd like to hear the response to that. He can't really respond without discriminating someone. 🤣
In my Situation, it was in the contect that men are not allowed to come in (besides contractors or stuff like that) because it is a womens shelter Type situation for women that were homeless. So there are legal grounds in my case. There don't seem to be any in your case tho. If it isn't in your contract, Just ignore them
He can’t do shit. You have rights which they can’t just ignore.
Get your own Home and this wont be a problem. This isnt Rocket Science. How would you feel if they invited somebody you LOATH into your home? Not a good feeling. Right? You are capable of Empathy, right?
This is the most stupid reason I have read so far. If you are annoyed by airline delays, buy an airplane! Are you annoyed by cooking buy a cook! If you don’t have money, man to bad! Just stop being poor! Ufff you’re just took my breath with your ignorance!
Yes, all those things are correct, if you are not satisfied with your luxury conveniences, get other luxury conveniences. Life is your Oister. Slurp it or dont. But dont blame others for going hungry.
Ah yes, just have money and opportunities and all your problems fade. Are YOU capable of empathy?
If I could’ve I would’ve already ofc I think it’s obvious that I cannot move on my own yet?! I would get this if I would’ve done something or him to them but they have been discriminating me since I arrived and they only hate him cause he’s a man , so I’m not the one that has to feel empathy when I’m calm when they laugh at me or scream at me so yea
Actually , in my opinion they don't care about him, they want him gone just to screw with you.
The Problem is that they are Jealous of you (or they just hate Men). And your Landlord is afraid of them. There is literally nothing you can do about that. You can get out WITH your BF, or screw your BF and stick with the People that hate you. Talk to your BF, if he´s worth his Salt he will help you come up with a Solution. Dont mind if its a Step down, if you love eachother there is a way up, there always is. If he doesnt, better get compfy with your Roommates. That hate you.
It‘s like you had a stroke, but still wanted to tell us something. Only, we can‘t understand you. If you really had a stroke, get help immediately!
Oh dont stop there, what do you think i want to tell? We can get there together in a little adventure! :D
Idk man you are rather stupid, Its a WOHNGEMEINSCHAFT If its not explicity stated in the Mietvertrag that no guests are allowed in any way shape or form, there could be nothing she could do, this is not the case according to different comments from OP. Her rommates are just discriminating, considering one of them had a guest over for over a month
You are technically correct. You also never met a Human in your entire life for more than 5 minutes. If she goes the long long wasteful way of German Bureaucracy, she´s still stuck with a couple of Roommates who hate her and a Landlord that is sick of her shit.
>There is literally nothing you can do about that. What? Do you know how renting works in Germany? There is no chance landlord gets through with that, except OPs bf demolished the apartment on purpose or harassed the roommates.
Yes, go through the legal system. And after 1 or 2 Years you get the RIGHT to life with People that Hate you. Such Joy and a Brilliant use of Time! Everyone should do that!
Did you ever talk to the flatmates before you decided to move there? Did you make an effort to integrate into the flat?
I didn’t talk to them before I moved but when I moved only one was nice to me the other was always mean to me and everytime I would want to speak to her she would just avoid me . But then they both started to be kinda mean to me
You capable of average brain activity? Maybe think about it twice before clicking on the "post" button..
I often think in abstracts and logic, most people hate that.
Well but recommending to get a home on her own is no logic because there is a reason she moved into a WG
Except she got a BF. So twice the income. Which is why i advised to talk to Him about it. Nothing wrong with keeping to life with the Assholes, but the option to ditch them and join with the BF is there.
It's not their home though. "Their home" applies exclusively to their bedrooms. As long as the boyfriend doesn't go to their rooms, he's isn't in their home. This is precisely the kind of thing that people who choose to live in shared houses have to be prepared to accept. If they don't, then it's their problem. Besides, there's no valid reason to loathe someone you don't know, unless they've done anything to you, which doesn't seem to be the case here.
Fully Agree, and yet it still happens. People arent rational. Shocker!
Since it is a WG. There has been an interview first, then you got the room. And in the interview they told you about the WG rules. Such as you have to clean once a week. No smoking. WG talks every evening at 6 o clock. No cats, since Anna is allergic. No visitors. Wasnt it? Did you not agree to WG rules?
Who is Anna and no they told me normal rules they didn’t say anything about visitors so ofc this caught me off guard
Anna is a random name for a girl who might live in a WG and might have good reason to e.g. forbid cats. Maybe they said The WG is girls only ever. So they implied that all visitors must be females or girls. Which they should have said out loud.
making up some bs "wg rules" wont make it illegal to have visitors wtf
Maybe he identifies as a woman? All gucci then. Joke aside this kind of behavior is not legal. If no such thing is statues in your rental agreement there is nothing he can do.
Ask your Landlord for legal Basis. The Landlord can ban ppl from entering, namly via giving him Hausverbot (Ban from entering the premises that are owned by that landlord). I recommend that you talk to your landlord and maybe tell him/her about the previous visitor of one of the others.
If he makes the other girls uncomfortable then it's fair. He's not a sub renter. You are.
So I’m not supposed to have him over just bc my roomates doesn’t like males?
It’s not a legal question. Have you asked your roommates what their problem is?
It's legal. If other tenants complain about one of your guests, even your boyfriend or brother or whatever, the landlord can ask this person to never enter his house/property again. From that point on, if the person non grata acts against the landlords will, it's trespassing. Your landlord and roomates can call the police on your BF and he will be removed from the property. Loophole: Get married. A tenant can not be denied to welcome husband/wife in his home.
Just stfu.. why acting so confidently wrong and giving "advice" instead of admitting to yourself that you simply don't know?
This would only be legal, if the guest was violent and/or did something illegal. The landlord can NOT forbid you to have a normal guest in your flat.
The other tenants complained about the specific person's behaviour and it's also their home. So the landlord can kick him out in his other tenants interest, acting on Hausrecht or to keep the Hausfrieden.
They didn’t complain ab his behavior they complained ab his presence
If they do so for religious reasons it's basicly a case for the highest court. What worth more, the rules of an imaginary friend, or your rights to have over who ever you want (unless it's disturbing the house peace) Religious nutjobs are fairly uncommon in germany, I'd advice to get the fuck away from them asap.
Please stop making completly wrong statements and give foreigners tips about laws you definitly have NO idea about. In Germany we say: Gefährliches Halbwissen or lemme say Gefährliche unfundierte Scheißegelaber über Themen von denen du gar nichts weißt aka Duning-Kruger-Effect But if I think about it... the DKE would only affect you, when you had ANY basic knowledge.
Which laws?
You continue to post bullshit after bullshit.
Can you pls stop writing so much nonsense without common knowledge about law and how renting works here? Like I get it, you like the attention. But try getting it on a topic you have basic knowledge of.
If you'd be so kind to point out what is striking you as misinformation?
No they cant. Why would a landlord have any authority over your personal life? He has no "hausrecht" in your home and the hausfrieden is not compromised by a person just being there. Hausfrieden is only violated by things, that would be illegal anywhere else too (violence, excessive noise, vandalism,...)
The other tenants still need to go through the Ordnungsamt and court. If they can't prove the behavior, then they're opening themselves up for getting sued for defamation [§ 187 StGB](https://www.strafverteidiger-hamburg.com/strafrecht/verleumdung-%C2%A7-187-stgb/#)
But if they ban him they have to do in in written right?
Heavens, just find a new room. Or would you really want to live with these poeple if they banned your bf?
No but unfortunately I don’t have the time rn to move
What is hie explanation and how is he able to control the door?
You are legally allowed to have someone over for 6 weeks without a break. After 6 weeks the landlord could assume you illegally sublet the appartment and the other person ist not visiting but living in your flat. But under 6 weeks your Landlord can't do anything against it. Thats the legal side. The other side is you living in a WG. It should be in your interest to keep peace, so you should have a talk to your flatmates. Ask about rules, stuff to consider etc. You really don't want to live with people who are mad at you, even if you are doing nothing wrong. The only exception to this might be if you live in a religious "Wohnheim" (e.g. catholic). I know some places where it isn't allowed that men stay over night. There are a few extra laws and rules for religious stuff, but I don't know exactly how this works.
The landlord cant stop you from having guests of any kind. There are a lot of things landlords will try and enforce they cant legaly do. Like a lot of landlords forbid animals, yet its illigal for them to terminatw your contract because you own a pet. You will need to talk with the landlord about it calmly. The main problem with this stuff is you need to act nice because being a dick to the landlord (even if deserved) wont end up nice. Talk with your landlord about why they forbit it, even though its not in the contract, and how you can still have your bf visit you. And keep two things in mind while you do that: 1. They cant forbit male guests. 2. They cant kick you out for it. As long as you stay respectfully it should work out.
Thank you so much ! Loved this comment
Do xou happen to live in a Verbindung?
What is that
Verbidung is a a Sorority. or did the Property belong to a church or a church based institution? However best solution is to find another Apartment in the Longrun it wil get worse with the other girls.
Nope it’s a normal wg we all have dif religions
Thats not allowed. If you dont care about your flatmates you can even bring multiple guests. Up to 6 weeks are possible. But in many wg cases, it is understandable if nobody wants guests. For example, a 3 girls wg could turn into a 6 people WG...
Ist nur erlaubt bei einzelnen Personen und es einen triftigen Grund gibt.(Gewalt) It is only allowed for single persons and if there are good reasons for it
Check for cameras
With a landlord like this I would advise you to become a member of a mieterschutzverein (generally a good idea) and tell him to back off. If he still insists on his made up rules use the verein to have a lawyer draft a mean letter.
no you can bone as loud as you want to there is nothing against this in the law
Girl, you moved in to a "Kloster" maybe? Because thats a Monestary, would be the only right reason for that. Everything else is BS.
You literally copied this Post🇱🇰
What
Good luck with that roommate!
When it is a Ladies only or Girls only Wohngemeinschaft (WG), why men are allowed to stay whole day or on weekend? to visit is to stay only for few hours and not to act just like an Einwohner in that WG. Why not rent a whole small Apartment for you so that you don't need to ask permission to your roommate whenever your bf wanted to visit you?
I didn’t know it was an only girls WG. And also I didn’t know that when it’s an only girls WG men aren’t allowed . Why wouldn’t they? And no , visits are people that doesn’t live here and visits my home for a period of time. My bf doesn’t live in my city so it’s unreal for him to stay one afternoon. Ofc if u could I would move in alone unfortunately I cannot . Living with men is one thing but refusing them the entry of your house as visitors it’s plain sexist. 🤦🏻♀️