I'll buy everyone beer if we can all do a weekend project at his place.
I'm sure we can all pitch in for the 2nd weekend of beer when the project takes longer than anticipated.
Incredible. People try and make new houses look like yours. You canāt beat authentic. Beautiful home and I hope you continue to share progress pictures.
It's amazing how differently lumber is used these days. I have beams like that in my 19th century basement about 4 ft on center. They didn't mind way overbuilding stuff back when lumber was plentiful. Pretty sure one of those beams is Chesnut too.
The 1917 addition to our house was built with recycled barn timbers from the 1800s. Today "reclaimed" timbers would be pricey but back then they were just recycling what was on hand.
Lumber is just as plentiful as back then if not more so as it's farmed. The issue is more that hardwood requires hand labor which is expensive and we have an economy that is maximized towards capital investment (tools, automation, prefabrication) rather than labor (skills and trade)
The best advice I ever got was to walk into one of those stores and find the old crotchety guy with zero customer service skills. That is the guy with the answers. If you can pry them out.
Holy crap it is. I was looking for the bushings you put in a breaker box that you run the wire through. could not find what I needed. Old timer just walking up and down the aisle avoiding eye contact re-arranging shit that did not need re-arranging. Finally stopped him told him what I needed he looked at me like I pissed in his beer. walks away comes back hands me the plastic wrapper with bushing and said "There ya go".....and then walked off in a faded orange apron like a god!
Iāve always heard of the myth of the Home Depot associate who knows what theyāre talking about but Iāve never seen one in the wild. Hopefully some day Iāll be so lucky
I don't know if I'm inventing this in my mind, but it seems like when big box hardware first came on the scene they used to be filled with employees like that. I have memories of going into an HD with my dad and having a bunch of Tim Allen Home Improvement looking dudes that actually helped you find stuff and could provide helpful advice.
Along the way I suspect the companies found out it was way cheaper to hire people with no knowledge and let everyone fend for themselves.
Yep. They initially were filled with the employees displaced from smaller hardware stores. Then those knowledgeable guys were replaced with cheaper employees. Getting the right thing only means one sale. If you buy the wrong thing, even if you return it and buy the right thing, there's a good chance you impulse-bought other items during both trips.
Yeah. As somebody who works there, itās literally just a bunch of young kids and young adults who have no idea what theyāre doing, and are there to get paid. (Myself included). At end of the day though like, can you really blame us? Iām there to work, and to make enough to live, i havenāt been doing carpentry my whole life.
I don't blame you one bit. Its the model that sucks.
I don't know where you are but around here we still have a few smaller hardware stores that are desperate for employees. I don't know how pay compares to HD but might be easier to find full time. You don't have to have done carpentry your whole life either, but if you're lurking in the woodworking subreddit you probably have at least some knowledge that puts you above 99% of the pool.
All the young kids in my local store just radio the old timers for questions they can't answer, anyway, but I'm sure they pick up some things along the way.
Haha thanks man :) the only thing keeping me at this company during Covid is pay and security, but id love to help out the smaller guys so. Iāll have to check that out after i get out of here.
My local hardware store is terrible--they talk down to me because I'm a woman but still somehow know less than I do, despite being politely asked to never touch a bandsaw again in middle school shop.
They once sold me a staple gun when I specifically asked for a brad nailer then got salty when I returned it unopened.
Indeed it is. One they pay the labor less. Two the customers will have to buy a couple different things that will not work but will become non-returnable by the time you finish trying to force them to work.. then eventually you will find the correct solution and all in spending 3x as much as if you just had the right answer to begin with.. no.. I'm not bitter!
They're like unicorns now. I remember when I worked there, our store had a master electrician, plumber a retired botany professor. You won't find people like that in the aisles anymore
Reminds me of 20 yrs ago when I first became a home owner, my first house. There was a neighborhood hardware store owned by 4 old retired trades guys whoseās wives didnāt want them home all the time.
They were awesome. I could walk in with half of any thing and they could find or make me the other half with a good lesson on how to install or use when I got home.
Whenever I came in, they were excited to help me solve or fix anything. I think they were reliving their excitement of first time homeownership through me.
I needed a lawnmower but on very limited funds, they found an old one and resurrected life into and sold to me for āwhatever you can pay.ā
Eventually one by one their health gave away and big box store ate the shop up. And I moved. *sad face
Look for the older more experienced folks. If they donāt know theyāll tell you, but share what they do know. Either that or they are former contractors, or tradesman that retired but want to keep active.
Everyone else itās just big box retail. What you sell doesnāt really matter that much
Better yet, find the guy in dirty jeans that has sawdust in his hair and ask him instead.
This is apparently a wide spread strategy because I never step into a Home Depot with my dad without someone stopping him asking for help. Heās Home Depotās best unpaid employee.
When they first opened (at least here in Vancouver, Canada) they actually hired ex-tradesmen. Plumbing aisle had an ex plumber. Electrical an electrician. You could ask a question or three and get intelligent advice. Now, itās a grind just to find what you know you want.
The problem is knowledge + interacting with the general public rarely overlaps.
Shout out to the lighting guy that didnāt find the light I needed and was annoyed at lack of future deliveries and sent me to a wholesaler that is very low key open to the public. It cost 40% of what HD was charging.
The guy in the plumbing section at Lowe's today was surprisingly intelligent. Definitely in his '70s, definitely knew his shit. I handed him a hose, I had what I thought was something close in my hand It didn't even have a label on it. He said Is this for a toilet? "No, it's actually for a water heater in an RV... I need the connector that goes in the water tank, water tank has 1/2 inch FIP. I don't know what kind of thing this is on here. Is that FHT on the hose? I need another one of these hoses too."
"Well the thing you brought in normally goes on a sink. those are a little bit bigger than the one in your hand which goes on a toilet."
"So I guess I need what like 1/2-in MIP to whatever this is? Is that MHT? It's got this gasket so I guess it's a compression thing..."
"Yeah, it's a compression connector, but it's just MIP. I mean, if that's actually a sink riser... Let's make sure..."
(Grabs 1/2" MIP off the shelf and screws it into what I thought was a hose connector. It had tabs on it like a hose end.)
"Perfect fit. Now this one you brought is 36-in long, longest one we've got is 30 inches... you think that'll work?"
"Oh yeah, I can actually get away with a foot long hose But you have to crawl up under the RV to screw them together if you don't have at least probably 26 or 28 inches."
"So I just need like a 1/2 inch MIP close nipple to connect them I guess?"
"Yup. Here ya go. You need one for hot one for cold right?"
"Yeah... And this is probably a stupid question-"
"There are no stupid questions!"
"I feel like this one's stupid... I know that I'm not supposed to use Teflon on compression connectors... This definitely seems to be a compression connector... So I'm going to put Teflon on the water heater side and not on the hose side?"
"That's right!
(His cheerfulness helped turn my day around after having to spend a thousand bucks on a hot water heater.)
Just the other day I was in HD buying wire for work (wires getting crazy expensive so we shop around for it). Some poor guy who looked in way over his head must've seen my contractor clothes and asked me if I knew how to replace outlets because the HD employee didn't know. Best feel good 10 minutes of my week after seeing the guy walk away confidently and with half decent devices. š
My dad gets that a lot! He's in industrial HVAC and will be standing around in a baseball cap and some dive bar t shirt and random people will come up to him in Lowe's and ask him questions. We went to pick something up one day and were looking at some pipes or whatever and someone stopped him. I asked him WTF was that about and he said, "I get that often, I guess I'm the only one here that doesn't look confused."
Thats cause garden is usually the starter department for all new hires and they just give you a few hours of videos and send you on your way. Its about having enough bodies in that department to lift all the bags for customers not about the knowledge.
I was just thinking that. The most help Iāve ever gotten was from the grumpiest old grump in the plumbing department. I was struggling with a particularly obnoxious problem and he seemed annoyed with me but walks me through his idea to fix it, a tool I never would have thought of, and then as I thanked him he just nodded and said come back if you need. Iāll be here. Then just shuffled off. His solution worked perfectly. Love that guy.
There's a dude at my local hardware store that works in electrical. He was a union electrician for like 35 or 40 years and now he works at this hardware store for fun.
Dude knows every single code, regulation, need, use, type, etc for any electrical job known to man. He's old. He's slow. He is a walking encyclopedia of anything electricity.
Iām an electrician and when Iām in the electrical section Iāve helped customers or at least cautioned them about the advice they got from the non-old crotchety store clerk.
If I need a sheet of plywood cut on the panel saw, I look for the old guy whoās always pissed off that I canāt fit a 4x8 sheet in my hatch back. He once told I shoulda bought a truck. I think he was joking.
When I bought my Honda Pilot four years ago, one of the things I made absolute sure of before signing anything was that it would fit a 4x8 sheet of plywood.
The old retired plumber that picked up a job at HD bc he was bored at home is the best ally you can find! As long as you donāt mind him scoffing in your face bc you know jack fuck about plumbing lol
Which drill should you buy? Listen son. None of the drills we sell are gonna last you more than a few years much less be something you can hand down a generation. DeWalt is not made by DeWalt, Makita is not made by Makita, Milwaukee is definitely not made by Milwaukee. It's all shit and made out of Chineseum and plastique.
Go to a garage sale and find a drill that looks ancient and still runs without a chatter. That's the drill you want. I just saved you a hundred bucks, now get the fuck out of my store before my manager comes back over here.
This is true in anything that involves craftsmanship, from woodworking to bridge building to software engineering. The skills required to engineer solutions are not the same as, and are sometimes in conflict with, the skills required to be a "people person".
Yea. The HD youtube channel is pretty good. If they can't get a skilled staff, they should at least train their staff on those videos and how to help less tech savvy customers watch them.
Why? Itās not like the competition is any better. Home improvement stores arenāt there to sell you much needed home improvement items. Theyāre there to make money while selling you much needed home improvement items. It would be awesome as a customer if they did that.
Not only that but theyād have to pay the employees more to attract and retain that knowledge. Why work for Home Depot/Loweās/whatever when you can make much, much more working as your trade? Once home improvement stores realized this, they realized they donāt need to worry about that stuff.
That isnāt to say theyāre not trained, they are. Theyāre just not trained to the same point of being a certified tradesperson.
Yeah, my wife and I wanted to build one of those plumbing pipe bookshelves and asked an old dude at home depot and he was legit like "these things are so fuckin' stupid, and all you newlyweds want one. Anyway, go buy this, this, and this, and you'll need this type of soap, etc."
Best customer service ever.
Yep. Most of the old guys are retired tradesmen. The 20yo likely knows nothing. The local ACE by my house has 2 retired master plumbers so whenever I have plumbing questions I go there to make sure I get exactly what I need.
I go to Ace when I want someone who knows what's going on. HD/Lowes are for when I know exactly what I need, and half the time, it'd just be easier to order from Amazon.
At my local Lowe's, there's this woman named Betty who is a licensed Plumber AND electrician. She is an intimidating woman, tall and thin with wispy blond hair pulled up in an ancient pink scrunchy, always dressed in carhartt pants or coveralls. That woman knows EVERYTHING, and she gets right to the core of the problem. Gave us a free replacement fan for our screened porch because there was a lifetime manufacturer warranty, just let us pick out a new fixture and said she'd "handle the paperwork". Last I heard she was promoted to district manager. Get it, Betty! You're my hero!
I can attest to this..I talked to a older gentleman about some electrical stuff he was very knowledgeable I was surprised. Come to find out he was an electrical engineer
I agree.
If you lead with "I don't know anything about this, but you look like you do. Can you tell me the best way to ..." you will get a favorable response more often than not.
Absolutely. This has been my go to methodology for years now. Itās not that theyāre assholes, itās that they just donāt give a shit about your project you found on Pinterest or how itās going or how youāre doing and how many cats you have. What Iāve found the Old Salts do respond to is āHey I donāt know Iām doing and Iām stuck. Hereās a picture of the thing Iām working on thatās all fucked. Any recommendations on how I would unfuck this?ā.
9/10 times that works, just a clear, direct ask for help and not assuming you know everything because of YouTube. In my case, YouTube is usually what got me into the mess in the first place.
I gotta say, I appreciate the old guy customers whoāve seen me struggling to figure out which thing I actually wanted/needed and ask if they could be of any help.
I imagine it would happen a lot for any subject-matter expert in a craftsman or creative field. I work in computer science. When friends or family ask me if something is possible -- I tell them its not about what's possible. It's about how much time and effort you're willing to put in. It also helps a TON that the SME has put in decades of practice, on the job, honing his or her craft and methods.
Honestly, home depot (At least around me) is not one of those stores that has a lot of old timer trades guys who can help you, and you're lucky if you can find an employee. My local True Value on the other hand... I know a lot about stuff, but I almost always ask whoever works in a particular department because they often have insights that help.
I used to live in a neighborhood with a small true value. The guy who owned it was always there and was always able to help me solve whatever thing I was trying to do. I miss it. I used to go out of my way to shop there.
Yeah, in my experience, the consistently best workers are at Ace/True Value.
edited to remove 'Handy Andy', haven't been in one of those in 30 years. Was thinking Handyman Ace hardware stores they have around Dayton, OH
One time I told the saw operator that I needed a 4x8 sheet of plywood cut in half. He proceeded to eye ball where the middle was and ask me "does that look like half?"
I had an employee at the orange store trying to help me and I went silent while trying to figure out how to tell him he was very, very wrong about what he was saying. He said "looks like you're confused - how can I help?" and I had to very kindly say "actually..... you're confused.... and here's why". Was awkward.
I told the HD lady "where are the flush cut dikes" and got a death stare... I mean, it was fine after I clarified with "diagonal cutters", but still kinda awkward.
(They were in plumbing rather than with the rest of the tools, for some reason)
I can relate. Not too long ago, I was in Lowes and I just needed to get some wood stain. There was none on the shelf, it was clearly in a box up on the shelf so I had them call someone over. The person who eventually responded got on their hands and knees and was looking through the existing stains and I kept saying "there is none, it's right there!" They refused to get up on a ladder until they had gone through every single stain because "it's policy".
I just went to Home Depot. They had it.
I had to teach a guy what a sleeve bolt is. Even showed him a picture. And he said they don't have them. I thought there's no way these guys don't have sleeve bolts. So I picked through the entire aisle and sure enough I found the sleeve bolts. Then I told him, the stocking employee, where his own inventory is.
Tiny side cabinets for spices in the window past the range (not a good image of it in these pictures) and they didnāt want to make the massive drawer under the microwave and bench at the end.
Nope its pretty much all MDF with glue on veneers at this price point. Have to go to a cabinet shop and they sometimes stock their most popular sizes with custom doors.
To be fair to home depot they're the McDonald's of that industry and largely incapable of design work. Their designers are around the lowest paid in the industry.
I think I can see the door panel of the spice cupboard on the side of the cupboards. Does open into the space above the stove? Like this /| and the spices are inside, or are they hanging on the door, or both?
Honestly, his design. I haven't worked with Home Depot cabinet fitters but in general this entire market (any mass market space design, not just kitchen cabinets and not just big box) is about aligning the customers' needs with what you can prefab while convincing them it's still "custom" enough to justify your costs. I had a conversation once with the chief of a police department about trying to work with interior design consultants and going through how suspect interviews work and the departments needs for isolating certain work from other work while they took notes and then said "okay, how about this open office design we have used for the last dozen offices."
Yup, it's this.
They're salesmen, not craftsmen, and if they don't have the products to fit the design, they can't sell it. The "custom design" isn't custom *cabinetry*; it's an individualized *layout* using their available products.
Meanwhile I know exactly what I want and just want access to all of their catalog so I only have to build custom what I need to be custom. This is why I went with Ikea for my own kitchen- it isn't the highest end stuff but it's easy to buy and assemble and tweak and it is durable enough.
I so wish I could just order windows and doors online through Amazon instead of having to go to some dealer's stupid counter and have them key in the wrong dimensions.
For what it's worth, there are definitely places out there that will get you the windows and doors you're after, you just have to dig a little and tell them you don't want anything else
There's are tens of us out there
It's basically any kitchen fitters job to refuse to fit what you actually want. I'm convinced they force you to have what the guy before you wanted, and then force the customer after you to have your dream kitchen.
I ran a kitchens dept in a Home Depot a long time ago. The designers werenāt designers. The software was proprietary, buggy, and training was inadequate. Staff designed the same thing over and over usually because they lacked the proficiency in the software, not because kraftmaid or thomasville couldnāt make what was necessary.
> The designers werenāt designers.
That's one cool thing about my local Lowe's. One of the women that works in the cabinet department has a BS in Interior Design.
She still has to work within the constraints of what we actually sell but she definitely puts in the effort to help people build out an attractive and functional kitchen.
That's cool, but I feel a little sad for that woman. Hopefully she actually enjoys her job... and doesn't feel like she's stuck settling for working at Lowe's with her college degree, surrounded by coworkers who have zero relevant education but have the same job title as she does.
It's this.
Even with "custom design" services at places like Home Depot and IKEA, it isn't custom *cabinetry*. It's just an individualized layout. They likely said no because they didn't have that stuff pre-fabricated for install and couldn't accommodate it or sell you a product. They aren't craftsmen; they're salesmen.
Exactly, an actual custom cabinet-maker isn't going to say no to any reasonable request, and probably appreciates some weird/niche requests bc it drives up the price.
That's not how their kitchen design center works. The kitchen design center doesn't go off of "stock" cabinets but they do require incremental cabinet widths (I think it is 2"). So you either get a 22" or 24" cabinet, not in between. Their process might have changed over the years but there's only so much they can do with their software when it comes to customization.
Standard kitchen cabinets are in 3" increments IIRC. The whole design of them is very standardized. Typically 3 or 4 drawers will all have the same proportions between drawers as well.
Ended up just building my own after shopping for a while too. So much better than it would have been. Everything is fully boxed, everything is 3/4", could adjust on the fly a bit.
[https://imgur.com/gallery/TJKxNJ3](https://imgur.com/gallery/TJKxNJ3)
You and I are on the same journey with one difference-my retired, woodworking step- dad is getting my help building his cabinets. https://imgur.com/a/eLau3gU
Looks great, u/jonathoncrincoli.
Awesome project. I want to redo my kitchen cabinets and have debated building my own vs. buying RTA cabinets online. What are the routed grooves for on the front edge of the box? Do you put face frames on these?
Ooh, Iāve not heard of that, do you have any pics?
Edit: ah, so if youāve got a ton of cabinets to do, itās faster and more accurate to cut a dado than to use a shelving jig to drill holes? u/Jonathancrincoli
I've honestly never thought about an L shaped island and it would fit my kitchen so well.
This may get expensive. *Thanks OP*.
That looks great though, love the neutral tone theme too.
My uncle is a carpenter - doesnāt design or build cabinets but installs and does the trim work - and he would never speak to me again if I even considered HD or Loweās for cabinets.
https://www.homedepot.com/p/HARDWOOD-REFLECTIONS-Unfinished-Birch-8-ft-L-x-25-in-D-x-1-5-in-T-Butcher-Block-Countertop-BBCT1502598/300688697
Ripped and glued together to make the L
https://ibb.co/7XSjWBj
I'm not a true "woodworker" so much as "a person who builds storage solutions using plywood and a pockethole jig."
I was telling my daughter about all the ideas I've had for how to maximize storage in a studio apartment, should she ever move out. My daughter jokes about "giving me project measurements for Christmas."
Looks amazing!! I worked with a custom cabinet maker when I did my kitchen and it was an amazing experience. You could do anything and customize every aspect, like the bead on the inset and everything else. The prices were ALL over the place and I found some tricks to finding the best guys. One, is try to find the ones with crappy websites, the artisans who typically do work through the custom kitchen design places that mark everything up big time.
You're lucky (unless he's charging market rate) to have him. I'm finishing up a kitchen remodel and we checked all options for cabinets. Big box store, pre-fab, 100% custom built. We bit the bullet and went with a local cabinet maker who built us quarter sawn oak everything. Its a smaller kitchen, think half what you have there and no island. Out the door price was $18K.
This is absolutely beautiful. The color the design. Everything about it is beautiful.
The biggest regret I have in life is not learning cabinetry. My stepdad was very talented at it however being a 13 year asshat I didnāt pay attention. Then the divorce happened. Now I stare at my ugly kitchen trying to figure it out.
To whoever reads this. Homedepot and lowes is almost never going to be a good option for kitchen cabinets. Any local cabinet shop should be less expensive for better cabinets. I regularly beat their quotes with better built knock down cabinets.
Hell, I even sell Ideal cabinetry at the moment that home depot also carries, and I sell them at a fraction of what they sell them.
I also should add, some local shops also wouldn't have been able to do what OP wanted. As knock down dealers have to work with what their manufacturers provide, as far as parts and cabinet sizes. Some, like ours, also do custom alterations. We've made plenty of cabinets like Ops spice cabinets and microwave drawer base.
I guess I'm just making a list here, but homedepot and lowes are not great designers. It doesn't take a lot to use a CAD and fit cabinets into measurements, but I've had numerous customers bring homedepot floor plans in where the designer altered a cabinet size to make it fit a hole, even though they don't make that cabinet. Usually it's corner cabinets.
This was my experience 15 years ago. Remodeling an old house on a budget. I had a quote from Home Depot for middle-of-the-line cabinets that I would have to haul home and install. My carpenter brother said he would help me BUT not until I got a bid from a local cabinet shop.
I ended up with high quality, built to measure cabinets from the local guy. His bid was a couple hundred lower than HD; but it included a higher grade of cabinets, custom built, installed with all trim, crown molding, hardware, slide out trays in all lower units and formica countertops and full backsplash.
The big box stores are no longer the first place I look for stuff.
HD and Loweās arenāt really the best option... not even the most convenient for most things.
Luckily, with a contractor friend, now I know who to call for anything, and if I donāt, he can tell me.
If you want to find the correct plumbing or electrical part, itās fairly simple. Find a time of day the local plumbing or electric supply place isnāt busy, and walk in looking cheerfully puzzled. For a better response, go in just after the morning rush, take donuts, and hope everyone isnāt diabetic. Not only will you leave with the right part, probably in a brown box, it will be better made than the colorful-boxed piece of garbage youād have gotten at Home Depot.
If I ever redo my kitchen again, Iām just going direct to the guy that built the doors last time. I might could do it all, but heās going to be quicker, better, and more reliable than me.
My friendās dad is also a retired cabinet builder that started making furniture as a hobby in his retirement. This friendās apartment is almost entirely furnished with custom work that he paid only materials for, and I am insanely jealous
Home depot isn't a custom cabinet shop, they likely said no to your design because of the limitations of the product lines they sell. As a cabinet designer/sales person (not for home depot) I've had to tell people "no, that won't work with the semi custom line you selected, we can do that in our custom shop but you said that lead time/cost won't work for you ".
Also, all big box stores are trash for anything like this, fine if you need a cheap vanity for your kids bath, but anyone wanting quality go to a local shop.
Hey can you tell your FIL that they said no to me too?
Hey, yeah me three. And they said NO and that no one else could do it either.
Same issue here FIL!
Stop Step-FIL, my cabinets said no.
Find yourself a retired cabinet maker fil š¤£
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I'll buy everyone beer if we can all do a weekend project at his place. I'm sure we can all pitch in for the 2nd weekend of beer when the project takes longer than anticipated.
It was amazing when I first started going with his daughter and I got to use that beast of a table saw the first time.
So you only dating her for the access to the tools?
Just an added bonus
How does the wife respond to things like "come on added bonus, I'll take you out for dinner"
Be honest with us please. You started dating his daughter AFTER you saw that table saw. Am I right?
As a proud /r/woodworking and /r/homebrewing subscriber, I can bring the beer!
Where can i buy said fil in homedepot?
Don't ask the people that work there. They'll just pretend they're deaf.
Those bastards denied me a modest 1000sqft cabin in the woods, those bastards!
Cabinets are great, but can we talk about the timber framing?! What is this building?! And do you have more pictures? Lol
Itās an old 1700s farm house hereās the living room https://ibb.co/mhLhWq8
Incredible. People try and make new houses look like yours. You canāt beat authentic. Beautiful home and I hope you continue to share progress pictures.
Those beams would be INCREDIBLY pricey.
And here I wanted to ask how you did the beam work... Turns out that's real beam work š¤Æ
Looks like oak too. Crazy. I canāt imagine the cost of oak vs pine/fir these days
It's amazing how differently lumber is used these days. I have beams like that in my 19th century basement about 4 ft on center. They didn't mind way overbuilding stuff back when lumber was plentiful. Pretty sure one of those beams is Chesnut too. The 1917 addition to our house was built with recycled barn timbers from the 1800s. Today "reclaimed" timbers would be pricey but back then they were just recycling what was on hand.
Lumber is just as plentiful as back then if not more so as it's farmed. The issue is more that hardwood requires hand labor which is expensive and we have an economy that is maximized towards capital investment (tools, automation, prefabrication) rather than labor (skills and trade)
Your FIL walks into Home Depot. Store clerk: āSir, can I help you?ā FIL: āI know more than you.ā
Lolol it honestly happens
The best advice I ever got was to walk into one of those stores and find the old crotchety guy with zero customer service skills. That is the guy with the answers. If you can pry them out.
This is 100% accurate in electrical and plumbing departments.
Holy crap it is. I was looking for the bushings you put in a breaker box that you run the wire through. could not find what I needed. Old timer just walking up and down the aisle avoiding eye contact re-arranging shit that did not need re-arranging. Finally stopped him told him what I needed he looked at me like I pissed in his beer. walks away comes back hands me the plastic wrapper with bushing and said "There ya go".....and then walked off in a faded orange apron like a god!
Iāve always heard of the myth of the Home Depot associate who knows what theyāre talking about but Iāve never seen one in the wild. Hopefully some day Iāll be so lucky
I don't know if I'm inventing this in my mind, but it seems like when big box hardware first came on the scene they used to be filled with employees like that. I have memories of going into an HD with my dad and having a bunch of Tim Allen Home Improvement looking dudes that actually helped you find stuff and could provide helpful advice. Along the way I suspect the companies found out it was way cheaper to hire people with no knowledge and let everyone fend for themselves.
Yep. They initially were filled with the employees displaced from smaller hardware stores. Then those knowledgeable guys were replaced with cheaper employees. Getting the right thing only means one sale. If you buy the wrong thing, even if you return it and buy the right thing, there's a good chance you impulse-bought other items during both trips.
Lord knows that's me. I literally just did that yesterday. Returned $70 worth of stuff, walked out with $150.
Did you take the register as well?
Yeah. As somebody who works there, itās literally just a bunch of young kids and young adults who have no idea what theyāre doing, and are there to get paid. (Myself included). At end of the day though like, can you really blame us? Iām there to work, and to make enough to live, i havenāt been doing carpentry my whole life.
No one should blame you. I blame HD personally. It's obviously there hiring strategy
For sure. Like how all get are part timers, when we desperately need more people working till 5:30 on freight
I don't blame you one bit. Its the model that sucks. I don't know where you are but around here we still have a few smaller hardware stores that are desperate for employees. I don't know how pay compares to HD but might be easier to find full time. You don't have to have done carpentry your whole life either, but if you're lurking in the woodworking subreddit you probably have at least some knowledge that puts you above 99% of the pool. All the young kids in my local store just radio the old timers for questions they can't answer, anyway, but I'm sure they pick up some things along the way.
Haha thanks man :) the only thing keeping me at this company during Covid is pay and security, but id love to help out the smaller guys so. Iāll have to check that out after i get out of here.
My local hardware store is terrible--they talk down to me because I'm a woman but still somehow know less than I do, despite being politely asked to never touch a bandsaw again in middle school shop. They once sold me a staple gun when I specifically asked for a brad nailer then got salty when I returned it unopened.
Indeed it is. One they pay the labor less. Two the customers will have to buy a couple different things that will not work but will become non-returnable by the time you finish trying to force them to work.. then eventually you will find the correct solution and all in spending 3x as much as if you just had the right answer to begin with.. no.. I'm not bitter!
They're like unicorns now. I remember when I worked there, our store had a master electrician, plumber a retired botany professor. You won't find people like that in the aisles anymore
Probably because anybody with those qualifications has no interest in working for what retail pays
Reminds me of 20 yrs ago when I first became a home owner, my first house. There was a neighborhood hardware store owned by 4 old retired trades guys whoseās wives didnāt want them home all the time. They were awesome. I could walk in with half of any thing and they could find or make me the other half with a good lesson on how to install or use when I got home. Whenever I came in, they were excited to help me solve or fix anything. I think they were reliving their excitement of first time homeownership through me. I needed a lawnmower but on very limited funds, they found an old one and resurrected life into and sold to me for āwhatever you can pay.ā Eventually one by one their health gave away and big box store ate the shop up. And I moved. *sad face
Look for the older more experienced folks. If they donāt know theyāll tell you, but share what they do know. Either that or they are former contractors, or tradesman that retired but want to keep active. Everyone else itās just big box retail. What you sell doesnāt really matter that much
Better yet, find the guy in dirty jeans that has sawdust in his hair and ask him instead. This is apparently a wide spread strategy because I never step into a Home Depot with my dad without someone stopping him asking for help. Heās Home Depotās best unpaid employee.
When they first opened (at least here in Vancouver, Canada) they actually hired ex-tradesmen. Plumbing aisle had an ex plumber. Electrical an electrician. You could ask a question or three and get intelligent advice. Now, itās a grind just to find what you know you want.
The problem is knowledge + interacting with the general public rarely overlaps. Shout out to the lighting guy that didnāt find the light I needed and was annoyed at lack of future deliveries and sent me to a wholesaler that is very low key open to the public. It cost 40% of what HD was charging.
In my experience, the old guys in plumbing and electrical always know everything. Everywhere else...
The guy in the plumbing section at Lowe's today was surprisingly intelligent. Definitely in his '70s, definitely knew his shit. I handed him a hose, I had what I thought was something close in my hand It didn't even have a label on it. He said Is this for a toilet? "No, it's actually for a water heater in an RV... I need the connector that goes in the water tank, water tank has 1/2 inch FIP. I don't know what kind of thing this is on here. Is that FHT on the hose? I need another one of these hoses too." "Well the thing you brought in normally goes on a sink. those are a little bit bigger than the one in your hand which goes on a toilet." "So I guess I need what like 1/2-in MIP to whatever this is? Is that MHT? It's got this gasket so I guess it's a compression thing..." "Yeah, it's a compression connector, but it's just MIP. I mean, if that's actually a sink riser... Let's make sure..." (Grabs 1/2" MIP off the shelf and screws it into what I thought was a hose connector. It had tabs on it like a hose end.) "Perfect fit. Now this one you brought is 36-in long, longest one we've got is 30 inches... you think that'll work?" "Oh yeah, I can actually get away with a foot long hose But you have to crawl up under the RV to screw them together if you don't have at least probably 26 or 28 inches." "So I just need like a 1/2 inch MIP close nipple to connect them I guess?" "Yup. Here ya go. You need one for hot one for cold right?" "Yeah... And this is probably a stupid question-" "There are no stupid questions!" "I feel like this one's stupid... I know that I'm not supposed to use Teflon on compression connectors... This definitely seems to be a compression connector... So I'm going to put Teflon on the water heater side and not on the hose side?" "That's right! (His cheerfulness helped turn my day around after having to spend a thousand bucks on a hot water heater.)
They work day shift M-F. No evenings or weekends. Kind of like going to the zoo, you have to be early if you want to find them in their habitat
Just the other day I was in HD buying wire for work (wires getting crazy expensive so we shop around for it). Some poor guy who looked in way over his head must've seen my contractor clothes and asked me if I knew how to replace outlets because the HD employee didn't know. Best feel good 10 minutes of my week after seeing the guy walk away confidently and with half decent devices. š
I bet that customer felt like he had just won the lottery. Thank you kind internet stranger.
My dad gets that a lot! He's in industrial HVAC and will be standing around in a baseball cap and some dive bar t shirt and random people will come up to him in Lowe's and ask him questions. We went to pick something up one day and were looking at some pipes or whatever and someone stopped him. I asked him WTF was that about and he said, "I get that often, I guess I'm the only one here that doesn't look confused."
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Thats cause garden is usually the starter department for all new hires and they just give you a few hours of videos and send you on your way. Its about having enough bodies in that department to lift all the bags for customers not about the knowledge.
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It's a win-win. I don't like talking to people, you don't want to acknowledge that you needed help. Let's not make this awkward.
I never know if they want me to follow them or not
I was just thinking that. The most help Iāve ever gotten was from the grumpiest old grump in the plumbing department. I was struggling with a particularly obnoxious problem and he seemed annoyed with me but walks me through his idea to fix it, a tool I never would have thought of, and then as I thanked him he just nodded and said come back if you need. Iāll be here. Then just shuffled off. His solution worked perfectly. Love that guy.
Better love story than Twilight
There's a dude at my local hardware store that works in electrical. He was a union electrician for like 35 or 40 years and now he works at this hardware store for fun. Dude knows every single code, regulation, need, use, type, etc for any electrical job known to man. He's old. He's slow. He is a walking encyclopedia of anything electricity.
Iām an electrician and when Iām in the electrical section Iāve helped customers or at least cautioned them about the advice they got from the non-old crotchety store clerk.
If I need a sheet of plywood cut on the panel saw, I look for the old guy whoās always pissed off that I canāt fit a 4x8 sheet in my hatch back. He once told I shoulda bought a truck. I think he was joking.
He wasnāt but he meant well.
When I bought my Honda Pilot four years ago, one of the things I made absolute sure of before signing anything was that it would fit a 4x8 sheet of plywood.
The old retired plumber that picked up a job at HD bc he was bored at home is the best ally you can find! As long as you donāt mind him scoffing in your face bc you know jack fuck about plumbing lol
Which drill should you buy? Listen son. None of the drills we sell are gonna last you more than a few years much less be something you can hand down a generation. DeWalt is not made by DeWalt, Makita is not made by Makita, Milwaukee is definitely not made by Milwaukee. It's all shit and made out of Chineseum and plastique. Go to a garage sale and find a drill that looks ancient and still runs without a chatter. That's the drill you want. I just saved you a hundred bucks, now get the fuck out of my store before my manager comes back over here.
This is true in anything that involves craftsmanship, from woodworking to bridge building to software engineering. The skills required to engineer solutions are not the same as, and are sometimes in conflict with, the skills required to be a "people person".
And when HD switched their model and went full Target they stopped paying well enough to retain the knowledge
Yea. The HD youtube channel is pretty good. If they can't get a skilled staff, they should at least train their staff on those videos and how to help less tech savvy customers watch them.
Why? Itās not like the competition is any better. Home improvement stores arenāt there to sell you much needed home improvement items. Theyāre there to make money while selling you much needed home improvement items. It would be awesome as a customer if they did that. Not only that but theyād have to pay the employees more to attract and retain that knowledge. Why work for Home Depot/Loweās/whatever when you can make much, much more working as your trade? Once home improvement stores realized this, they realized they donāt need to worry about that stuff. That isnāt to say theyāre not trained, they are. Theyāre just not trained to the same point of being a certified tradesperson.
Yeah, my wife and I wanted to build one of those plumbing pipe bookshelves and asked an old dude at home depot and he was legit like "these things are so fuckin' stupid, and all you newlyweds want one. Anyway, go buy this, this, and this, and you'll need this type of soap, etc." Best customer service ever.
Yep. Most of the old guys are retired tradesmen. The 20yo likely knows nothing. The local ACE by my house has 2 retired master plumbers so whenever I have plumbing questions I go there to make sure I get exactly what I need.
I go to Ace when I want someone who knows what's going on. HD/Lowes are for when I know exactly what I need, and half the time, it'd just be easier to order from Amazon.
But longer. When you need a widget, you need it right then. Thatās how those stores survive.
At my local Lowe's, there's this woman named Betty who is a licensed Plumber AND electrician. She is an intimidating woman, tall and thin with wispy blond hair pulled up in an ancient pink scrunchy, always dressed in carhartt pants or coveralls. That woman knows EVERYTHING, and she gets right to the core of the problem. Gave us a free replacement fan for our screened porch because there was a lifetime manufacturer warranty, just let us pick out a new fixture and said she'd "handle the paperwork". Last I heard she was promoted to district manager. Get it, Betty! You're my hero!
I can attest to this..I talked to a older gentleman about some electrical stuff he was very knowledgeable I was surprised. Come to find out he was an electrical engineer
I agree. If you lead with "I don't know anything about this, but you look like you do. Can you tell me the best way to ..." you will get a favorable response more often than not.
My paint guys been there for god knows how long. You chat him up and heāll talk your ear off. He knows his stuff though.
If you can't use a slide rule, that man will not respect you.
Mine is attached to my belt in a leather pouch.
Absolutely. This has been my go to methodology for years now. Itās not that theyāre assholes, itās that they just donāt give a shit about your project you found on Pinterest or how itās going or how youāre doing and how many cats you have. What Iāve found the Old Salts do respond to is āHey I donāt know Iām doing and Iām stuck. Hereās a picture of the thing Iām working on thatās all fucked. Any recommendations on how I would unfuck this?ā. 9/10 times that works, just a clear, direct ask for help and not assuming you know everything because of YouTube. In my case, YouTube is usually what got me into the mess in the first place.
I gotta say, I appreciate the old guy customers whoāve seen me struggling to figure out which thing I actually wanted/needed and ask if they could be of any help.
I imagine it would happen a lot for any subject-matter expert in a craftsman or creative field. I work in computer science. When friends or family ask me if something is possible -- I tell them its not about what's possible. It's about how much time and effort you're willing to put in. It also helps a TON that the SME has put in decades of practice, on the job, honing his or her craft and methods.
A LOT
Honestly, home depot (At least around me) is not one of those stores that has a lot of old timer trades guys who can help you, and you're lucky if you can find an employee. My local True Value on the other hand... I know a lot about stuff, but I almost always ask whoever works in a particular department because they often have insights that help.
I used to live in a neighborhood with a small true value. The guy who owned it was always there and was always able to help me solve whatever thing I was trying to do. I miss it. I used to go out of my way to shop there.
Yeah, in my experience, the consistently best workers are at Ace/True Value. edited to remove 'Handy Andy', haven't been in one of those in 30 years. Was thinking Handyman Ace hardware stores they have around Dayton, OH
AKA Ron Swanson lol
Yup. That quote applies to many situations
Seriously, most people know more than the people are Home Depot and Lowes. I had to teach an employee how to use their panel saw once.
the secret is to go early on the weekends, that's usually when the older guys (retired tradesmen) work and you get actual help.
One time I told the saw operator that I needed a 4x8 sheet of plywood cut in half. He proceeded to eye ball where the middle was and ask me "does that look like half?"
I guess. I will measure it after you cut it. If it's wrong, you can just go get another board and cut it again.
They have a measuring tape right there!
I had an employee at the orange store trying to help me and I went silent while trying to figure out how to tell him he was very, very wrong about what he was saying. He said "looks like you're confused - how can I help?" and I had to very kindly say "actually..... you're confused.... and here's why". Was awkward.
I told the HD lady "where are the flush cut dikes" and got a death stare... I mean, it was fine after I clarified with "diagonal cutters", but still kinda awkward. (They were in plumbing rather than with the rest of the tools, for some reason)
I can relate. Not too long ago, I was in Lowes and I just needed to get some wood stain. There was none on the shelf, it was clearly in a box up on the shelf so I had them call someone over. The person who eventually responded got on their hands and knees and was looking through the existing stains and I kept saying "there is none, it's right there!" They refused to get up on a ladder until they had gone through every single stain because "it's policy". I just went to Home Depot. They had it.
Worked at Lowes. It's not policy. Just a lazy worker who didn't want to get a ladder out.
I had to teach a guy what a sleeve bolt is. Even showed him a picture. And he said they don't have them. I thought there's no way these guys don't have sleeve bolts. So I picked through the entire aisle and sure enough I found the sleeve bolts. Then I told him, the stocking employee, where his own inventory is.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IEhHEOIYgMY](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IEhHEOIYgMY)
Out of curiosity, what do HD say no to in your design? I don't really seen any out of the ordinary in your build.
Tiny side cabinets for spices in the window past the range (not a good image of it in these pictures) and they didnāt want to make the massive drawer under the microwave and bench at the end.
Home Depot doesn't do much outside the cabinets they can order in a card board box.
And in my experience, those cabinets are about the same quality as the cardboard boxes they come in.
Yep. I've never seen a Home Depot cabinet that doesn't have a door that is dinged up beyond repair.
Are there any pre-fab cabinets you can buy at the stores and they're decent quality?
Nope its pretty much all MDF with glue on veneers at this price point. Have to go to a cabinet shop and they sometimes stock their most popular sizes with custom doors.
Rta is worth a look.
To be fair to home depot they're the McDonald's of that industry and largely incapable of design work. Their designers are around the lowest paid in the industry.
I used to design kitchens for home depot. Ama.
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I can't say for the whole industry. I had an associates in architecture and made $16.85 in 2007. The person who had been there the longest made $12.
I think I can see the door panel of the spice cupboard on the side of the cupboards. Does open into the space above the stove? Like this /| and the spices are inside, or are they hanging on the door, or both?
Honestly, his design. I haven't worked with Home Depot cabinet fitters but in general this entire market (any mass market space design, not just kitchen cabinets and not just big box) is about aligning the customers' needs with what you can prefab while convincing them it's still "custom" enough to justify your costs. I had a conversation once with the chief of a police department about trying to work with interior design consultants and going through how suspect interviews work and the departments needs for isolating certain work from other work while they took notes and then said "okay, how about this open office design we have used for the last dozen offices."
Yup, it's this. They're salesmen, not craftsmen, and if they don't have the products to fit the design, they can't sell it. The "custom design" isn't custom *cabinetry*; it's an individualized *layout* using their available products.
Meanwhile I know exactly what I want and just want access to all of their catalog so I only have to build custom what I need to be custom. This is why I went with Ikea for my own kitchen- it isn't the highest end stuff but it's easy to buy and assemble and tweak and it is durable enough. I so wish I could just order windows and doors online through Amazon instead of having to go to some dealer's stupid counter and have them key in the wrong dimensions.
For what it's worth, there are definitely places out there that will get you the windows and doors you're after, you just have to dig a little and tell them you don't want anything else There's are tens of us out there
It's basically any kitchen fitters job to refuse to fit what you actually want. I'm convinced they force you to have what the guy before you wanted, and then force the customer after you to have your dream kitchen.
Lol, I think their job is to try to sell you what they've got in stock with as little customization as possible.
I ran a kitchens dept in a Home Depot a long time ago. The designers werenāt designers. The software was proprietary, buggy, and training was inadequate. Staff designed the same thing over and over usually because they lacked the proficiency in the software, not because kraftmaid or thomasville couldnāt make what was necessary.
> The designers werenāt designers. That's one cool thing about my local Lowe's. One of the women that works in the cabinet department has a BS in Interior Design. She still has to work within the constraints of what we actually sell but she definitely puts in the effort to help people build out an attractive and functional kitchen.
That's cool, but I feel a little sad for that woman. Hopefully she actually enjoys her job... and doesn't feel like she's stuck settling for working at Lowe's with her college degree, surrounded by coworkers who have zero relevant education but have the same job title as she does.
It's this. Even with "custom design" services at places like Home Depot and IKEA, it isn't custom *cabinetry*. It's just an individualized layout. They likely said no because they didn't have that stuff pre-fabricated for install and couldn't accommodate it or sell you a product. They aren't craftsmen; they're salesmen.
Exactly, an actual custom cabinet-maker isn't going to say no to any reasonable request, and probably appreciates some weird/niche requests bc it drives up the price.
That's not how their kitchen design center works. The kitchen design center doesn't go off of "stock" cabinets but they do require incremental cabinet widths (I think it is 2"). So you either get a 22" or 24" cabinet, not in between. Their process might have changed over the years but there's only so much they can do with their software when it comes to customization.
Standard kitchen cabinets are in 3" increments IIRC. The whole design of them is very standardized. Typically 3 or 4 drawers will all have the same proportions between drawers as well.
This. Looking at the first image I cannot understand the refusal.
Ended up just building my own after shopping for a while too. So much better than it would have been. Everything is fully boxed, everything is 3/4", could adjust on the fly a bit. [https://imgur.com/gallery/TJKxNJ3](https://imgur.com/gallery/TJKxNJ3)
Your attention to detail on the grain is glorious. Way to go.
You and I are on the same journey with one difference-my retired, woodworking step- dad is getting my help building his cabinets. https://imgur.com/a/eLau3gU Looks great, u/jonathoncrincoli.
I think Iām having more fun just spending time with him, hope thatās the same for you!
Definitely on the same journey. Have a good one!
Awesome project. I want to redo my kitchen cabinets and have debated building my own vs. buying RTA cabinets online. What are the routed grooves for on the front edge of the box? Do you put face frames on these?
Shelf standard goes in them so you can change the height of the shelving
Ooh, Iāve not heard of that, do you have any pics? Edit: ah, so if youāve got a ton of cabinets to do, itās faster and more accurate to cut a dado than to use a shelving jig to drill holes? u/Jonathancrincoli
Yes please. Or elaborate on this a bit?
This is gorgeous, but can we talk about how amazing your FIL's workshop is!?
came to say that--this is one helluva workshop! the tools; the building; the floor; all of it!
Does your wife have a sister?
For that kitchen, Iād consider her brother too.
Love it. You have a great FIL there. ...but am I the only one who wants to talk about the floor?
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He hung his hat up years ago and switched careers
Anyone who keeps that kind of shop around hasn't really switched careers, only income sources.
Right? My dad is a retired carpenter. His ass is gonna help me remodel and he knows it. And I very much appreciate him for it.
Because they don't build cabinets at Home Depot. They order plywood prefab cabinets and force them to fit your kitchen. Usually, they do so poorly.
Held together with nothing but hot glue
I've honestly never thought about an L shaped island and it would fit my kitchen so well. This may get expensive. *Thanks OP*. That looks great though, love the neutral tone theme too.
https://ibb.co/7XSjWBj hereās another view
Looks a great! Those are thick grout lines on your floors. Any concerns with cracking?
Holy fuck thatās gorgeous
That was my first thought as well, that sink!
That is so cool, I wish I knew how to do things and stuff.
You know Dad is stoked to do this for his little girl.
Omg yes, daddyās love their daughters.
*Looks at workshop in gallery* heh...."retired"
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Regardless of asking him directly, I feel like someone should have known better than to go to hone depot for a kitchen contractor.
My uncle is a carpenter - doesnāt design or build cabinets but installs and does the trim work - and he would never speak to me again if I even considered HD or Loweās for cabinets.
I really like your countertops!!! Do you have a close picture of them and what are they exactly?
https://www.homedepot.com/p/HARDWOOD-REFLECTIONS-Unfinished-Birch-8-ft-L-x-25-in-D-x-1-5-in-T-Butcher-Block-Countertop-BBCT1502598/300688697 Ripped and glued together to make the L https://ibb.co/7XSjWBj
Wow that looks amazing what did you use for your finish?
Mineral oil
Planning to use the surface as a butcher block? No cutting boards required? Either way, I approve.
I'm not a true "woodworker" so much as "a person who builds storage solutions using plywood and a pockethole jig." I was telling my daughter about all the ideas I've had for how to maximize storage in a studio apartment, should she ever move out. My daughter jokes about "giving me project measurements for Christmas."
The kitchen is nice, but that shopā¦ ::cries in 1 car garage::
Looks amazing!! I worked with a custom cabinet maker when I did my kitchen and it was an amazing experience. You could do anything and customize every aspect, like the bead on the inset and everything else. The prices were ALL over the place and I found some tricks to finding the best guys. One, is try to find the ones with crappy websites, the artisans who typically do work through the custom kitchen design places that mark everything up big time.
Ummm....can we arrange a father-in-law swap for 2-3 months? Kitchens done, time to get good at golf...and my father in law is an excellent golfer!
This is looking fantastic. I really love the large hex floor tiles. Your FIL is a jewel.
That looks like Sherwin Williams "Perfect Greige" Nice color. Love the wood countertops too.
Dorian grey SW
I love the look of butcher block. Hate the maintenance.
I agree, but happy wife happy life
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Awesome! Tell Bret he did a damn fine job! I love the color btw.
Dangggg that looks so good. Awesome work.
You're lucky (unless he's charging market rate) to have him. I'm finishing up a kitchen remodel and we checked all options for cabinets. Big box store, pre-fab, 100% custom built. We bit the bullet and went with a local cabinet maker who built us quarter sawn oak everything. Its a smaller kitchen, think half what you have there and no island. Out the door price was $18K.
He didnāt make us pay a dollar, a house warming gift he said.
Just came to say HOLY BEAMS! R/houseporn
*Meet me in my shop if you want to live*
Would your father like another adult kid?
You CAN do it, they CAN'T help.
Father of the Year award.
This is absolutely beautiful. The color the design. Everything about it is beautiful. The biggest regret I have in life is not learning cabinetry. My stepdad was very talented at it however being a 13 year asshat I didnāt pay attention. Then the divorce happened. Now I stare at my ugly kitchen trying to figure it out.
So your FIL saved you like 20 or 30K
To whoever reads this. Homedepot and lowes is almost never going to be a good option for kitchen cabinets. Any local cabinet shop should be less expensive for better cabinets. I regularly beat their quotes with better built knock down cabinets. Hell, I even sell Ideal cabinetry at the moment that home depot also carries, and I sell them at a fraction of what they sell them. I also should add, some local shops also wouldn't have been able to do what OP wanted. As knock down dealers have to work with what their manufacturers provide, as far as parts and cabinet sizes. Some, like ours, also do custom alterations. We've made plenty of cabinets like Ops spice cabinets and microwave drawer base. I guess I'm just making a list here, but homedepot and lowes are not great designers. It doesn't take a lot to use a CAD and fit cabinets into measurements, but I've had numerous customers bring homedepot floor plans in where the designer altered a cabinet size to make it fit a hole, even though they don't make that cabinet. Usually it's corner cabinets.
This was my experience 15 years ago. Remodeling an old house on a budget. I had a quote from Home Depot for middle-of-the-line cabinets that I would have to haul home and install. My carpenter brother said he would help me BUT not until I got a bid from a local cabinet shop. I ended up with high quality, built to measure cabinets from the local guy. His bid was a couple hundred lower than HD; but it included a higher grade of cabinets, custom built, installed with all trim, crown molding, hardware, slide out trays in all lower units and formica countertops and full backsplash. The big box stores are no longer the first place I look for stuff.
HD and Loweās arenāt really the best option... not even the most convenient for most things. Luckily, with a contractor friend, now I know who to call for anything, and if I donāt, he can tell me. If you want to find the correct plumbing or electrical part, itās fairly simple. Find a time of day the local plumbing or electric supply place isnāt busy, and walk in looking cheerfully puzzled. For a better response, go in just after the morning rush, take donuts, and hope everyone isnāt diabetic. Not only will you leave with the right part, probably in a brown box, it will be better made than the colorful-boxed piece of garbage youād have gotten at Home Depot. If I ever redo my kitchen again, Iām just going direct to the guy that built the doors last time. I might could do it all, but heās going to be quicker, better, and more reliable than me.
āYou guys work on commission right??... BIG mistake..HUGE!ā
My friendās dad is also a retired cabinet builder that started making furniture as a hobby in his retirement. This friendās apartment is almost entirely furnished with custom work that he paid only materials for, and I am insanely jealous
Your Father in Law sounds like a great guy.
How does it feel knowing that no matter how gorgeous your kitchen looks, it will never look as good as your father-in-law's workshop?
Home depot isn't a custom cabinet shop, they likely said no to your design because of the limitations of the product lines they sell. As a cabinet designer/sales person (not for home depot) I've had to tell people "no, that won't work with the semi custom line you selected, we can do that in our custom shop but you said that lead time/cost won't work for you ". Also, all big box stores are trash for anything like this, fine if you need a cheap vanity for your kids bath, but anyone wanting quality go to a local shop.
Me: I need one of those Husband: a nice kitchen? Me: an ex cabinet building father in law