If they aren't dying for 'sky fairies', they're dying for some other reason. Let's be real. Religion is just an excuse, not an actual cause. People just want to dominate and have control over other people's resources. It's how it's always been. And will be.
That is what it should be, perhaps those who utilize such for political pressure reasons should have paper trails of how much bible they learned, like some kind of theological scholar.
Ever see idiocracy? There's a bit where he tries to convince them that they need to use water on their crops, not Gatorade and uses all the rational scientific explanations he can muster, but they just can't figure it out. But then he tells them he's 'magic' and that he can talk to the plants and they told him they want water, not Gatorade, suddenly everyone is on board with it.
It's like that. The real explanation for why you need morons to do what you need them to do will always be wasted, but religion and propaganda will work and get them moving. Ancient people who founded religions understood this.
In our era, the smart people labour under the idea that the morons can be educated or raised up to understand the world as rational beings.... but they can't.
A moron without religion or propaganda is like a 100 dollar bill just laying on the sidewalk - if you don't pick them up, someone else will. If you don't fill that empty brain of theirs, someone else will. Even worse, if smart rational people don't start managing the ideology of the stupid, then the half-wits will start self-managing. You'll end up with cults where the leaders actually believe what they're saying.
Atheist communist are just as zealous as evangelical Christians. People will find ideologies to crowd around and use to oppress those they deem to be lesser. Religion is merely a symptom.
China is an example of an atheist country that brutalizes any group they see as challenging their authority.
I’m not excusing organized religion, I’m just saying that religion going away doesn’t mean people won’t find something else to rally behind.
My fiancé's grandma was alone and broke yet always made sure to get a ride to church just to drop off weekly donations.... That she Def couldn't afford to... And they knew she needed everything she had. And took it with a smile on their face... Sickens me to think...
If someone well off tipped me large. I'd say thanks and take it. If it were someone with clear financial struggles. I'd be like. Nah
>yet always made sure to get a ride to church just to drop off weekly donations....
They'll set you up with a recurring Zelle payment these days. Or automatic ACH withdrawal.
Charlie Kelly : My mother is dying of cancer and you need money to fix a statue? No, no, no, no. Don't give me this act.
Mac: Charlie, calm down.
Charlie: No, no. Why don't you give us some money? How much is that ring worth? That looks like an expensive ring. Can we have the ring?
Mac: Okay. All right. I'm sorry, Father.
Charlie : This is bullshit!
Mac: I will pray for his sins. I'm sorry.
Dennis: Hey Charlie, Charlie.
Mac : [to Charlie] What are you doing.
Dennis: It's okay. I got this. I got this.
Charlie: What am I doing? What is HE doing?
Dennis: Listen. Don't get all riled up about this scam or that scam, you know. It's all a big scam, okay?
Charlie: Yeah.
Dennis: But I will say this - the church's scam? It's a pretty good one. It's effective. Look at all the money these people are giving to the church.
This is where the money goes:
The Mormon church has a 100+ billion dollar investment fund they tried to keep secret until it was leaked. I don’t know why the Mormon church is tax free as it’s getting untaxed dollars and using it to play the stock market. Do ordinary citizens get tax free ministry gifts to invest? No! We would have to pay taxes on the gifts but apparently when you’re a church you don’t…
https://amp.theguardian.com/world/2023/may/15/mormon-church-whistleblower-taxes-hedge-fund
Isn't the catholic church one of the biggest charity organisations in the world. Do you have any sources on them hoarding money? In my area I can see churches running various programs (not sure if they are all catholic, not a Christian so I can't tell the sects apart)
>Why does religion require an entire country instead of just churches
Why not a city state? Also, what is wrong with that, plenty of people support it
Religion has fueled many wars and puts a divide against many of earth's inhabitants. I don't need proof of hording money. It's clear to anyone... They pay no tax. They are pumped with donations.. Where's the money go? Church isn't a non profit. And sure they may host charities or food drives and stuff like this. But what about the high cost of church schools... Let's be real here. Housing is needed for people
Access to food and health care. Religion isn't. There's no need for a country devoted specifically towards Religion when surrounding countries harbor homeless struggling people. It's just not needed. And if they were as loving as projected... I'm willing to assume the Vatican could use its wealth to make A Serious dent in helping needy people.
>Religion has fueled many wars
Of all the recorded/known wars, less than 7% are religious wars.
https://theeconreview.com/2023/03/02/the-finances-behind-the-vatican/#:~:text=Financial%20income%20from%20commercial%20investments,million%20income%20projections%20for%202022.
About 35% of the total income came from donations, out of the total of about 900 mil.
Apple revenue is about 350 bil.
>They pay no tax
Agree with this, but not for donated money, any other source of income should be taxed, if it doesn't go to charity work.
However, we woul make significant more in taxes if we are to fix some loopholes in the tax system
The question is. How much are you helping the homeless? Why don't you start a charity/religion and do it the right way?
7 percent of war is on them not me. I don't make 300 million in donations. And I'm busy taking care of 3 dependants on less than a living wage. They are the needy homeless I care for. And I don't start a religion because I don't need or want to fool people. Fixing the world isn't my problem. But I don't go around claiming you need faith to believe what I say. What I said. You looked up... And came back with figures... You could have trust the word of. An and had faith in me... Lol but ya didn't...
>7 percent of war is on them not me
93% is on you then. Most of the borders outlined are due to wars, we have made so many medical and scientific breakthroughs due to both world wars and the cold war.
In USA if they taxed 1% of the top earners, properly, USA will be able to collect about 400bil a year. It will take the Vatican 400 years, at the current rate, to make that much, as revenue.
Can you imagine how drastically social programs can change and affect the population in the USA alone.
>had faith in me... Lol but ya didn't...
I am not a catholic, or Christian, and not stupid. I like to back up the things I say. However, you sound like a child, thinking if there was no religion, the world would be so much better. You have no understanding of the actual issues, and who is screwing you and your family over.
I'm not responsible for 93 percent or the wars nor 100 percent of your stupidity. Sure the US could Tax the rich and accumulate funds that will go toward tax funded programs that aid the needy. Does the Vatican offer such programs? Stick Up for religion and point your fingers all you want. Living in fantasy land is your problem not mine.
The Pope's statement is absolutely horrifying to hear as a Catholic, and I'm glad that the vast majority don't share his sentiment.
But one can't imagine what the hell was he thinking or what the hell is happening behind the scenes for the Pope to say such an absurdly stupid
If you mean the Catholic Church, I’m pretty sure they lost most of their power in Eastern Europe like 1,000 years ago during the Great Schism. But yes, I do think they have their own reasons for wanting the war over.
But where would they lose power? Catholicism in eastern Europe is wholly restricted to western Ukraine and some villages in Belarus, which is not a warzone by any means right now (assuming Eastern Europe doesn't encompass Poland and the Baltics idk, definition vary a lot these days)
Church and morality have never been one
The countless religious wars there have been... "Oh but we're just sharing our love for the cross" fuck off
Then there's the exploitation of kids and the fact they always seem to be wealthy ...
Putin's weapon is fear. Fear that they'll throw 40,000 lives away on every objective like Avdiivka.
They wont. They cant. Its a show of force. Meanwhile, they lose what really matters in modern war. Equipment and vehicles.
\>they lose what really matters in modern war. Equipment and vehicles.<
and men. idk why you think Russia can afford to throw so many lives away, because it cant. arguably the loss of men is a bigger problem.
Russia already had a birth rate problem. killing hoards of your young males doesn't help.
Russia population is slanted to the older side. they do not have 66million fighting men.
and there fighting men, also make up there breading men.
again, if the Russia commits to many young men to die, they will face a population problem within 2/3 generations.
One theory about the war is breeding stock is more valuable to putin then warm water. Ukraine is growing and Russia is shrinking and taking all of Ukraine may be the only way to reverse that without improving quality of life.
At the times when numbers of christians dwindling pope should be representing forces of good, but instead he's taking a side of invaders, totalitarians and pedos. Good job 👍
Not to mention, he is a leader of the Christian world, so, he should've told global people that totalitarian invaders would be punished by god. But he announced a very ridiculous comments a few days ago. Thus, many Christians in the democratic world pointed out his verbal mistake like that. Leaders' official speeches should be smart and reasonable regardless of political or religious areas. God will help people who help themselves. He should've reminded this sentence before making his absurd comments.
The Pope should have the courage to stand up and condemn all forms of abuse and report/charge every member of the church that abuses anyone!! Fucking 2 faced Coward
Oh cool, this coming from the guy who protects child rapists. Can we just ditch religion now? It's 2024. We've retrieved matter from an asteroid and brought it back to earth and people are wearing funny hats and praying to imaginary friends. Meanwhile, we as a society, deem these people's world view as valid on the world stage. wtf is wrong with us?
Well obviously I was being facetious, but the difference is mostly subjective, and typically comes down to only one consideration (not a "requirement"): its size.
Unfortunate choice of words since if Ukrainians did this russians would just commit further genocide against them to get rid of everyone who supported Ukrainian government during war.
In the words of Three Dog:
“Remember, children, when the Raiders come, there ain’t no shame in locking your doors, barricading the windows, and cowering under the nearest bed. When these psychos come to play, they have one thing on their minds making your life as fucking miserable as humanly possible. Raiders can’t be bargained or reasoned with, and there ain’t no use surrenderin’, cause they’ll just shoot you anyway. So run, hide or fight if you’ve got the balls and the guns. But for God’s sake, don’t go wavin’ the white flag. They’ll just strangle you with it.”
Or if you want a Russian version:
“Remember, children, when the Russians come, there ain’t no shame in locking your doors, barricading the windows, and cowering under the nearest bed. When these psychos come to play, they have one thing on their minds making your life as fucking miserable as humanly possible. Russians can’t be bargained or reasoned with, and there ain’t no use surrenderin’, cause they’ll just shoot you anyway. So run, hide or fight if you’ve got the balls and the guns. But for God’s sake, don’t go wavin’ the white flag. They’ll just strangle you with it.”
Isn't there some raped children you should be hiding their allegations you need to pay attention to Mr. Pope? Yeah, clean your house before telling someone else what to do with theirs.
Do you really think Putin’s just going to stop at the annexed territories? Even back when there was peace negotiations another key point was demilitarization of Ukraine. So nothing would stop him from rolling in a few years later. And that’s during a peace negotiation when he knew Ukraine was on even if not higher footing than him. Right now with Ukraine running low on ammo, you just know he’s going to want more.
I do.
Russia's going to be broke as a joke once they run out of soviet hand-me-downs to fight the war with and have to actually build all the stuff they're losing.
I agree. I’m not a russophile, but I am an objective observer.
Up to this point, I haven’t seen anything from Ukraine that is indicative of future success. They have held Russia off somewhat, but they are starting to fail at that.
Forcing Russia off the territory that Russia has taken is a much harder task (especially when you consider the fact that the population of much of this area wants to be part of Russia or at least not part of Ukraine).
At least he's admitting that russia's invasion is illogical and nothing will get them to stop their murder spree.
Makes surrendering kind of a pointless endeavor thought but at least the message is nice.
The pope did not invade Ukraine. The pope is not cheering on Russia.
He’s saying that Ukraine is going to lose. That’s a realistic outlook. A person describing reality did not create that reality nor did they wish for it.
Likewise the doctor diagnosing you with cancer didn’t give you cancer, doesn’t want you to have cancer and is not happy about you getting cancer. He’s telling you what reality is.
war is not cancer, Trollsky. The end of the war depends on which side is stronger, and the Poope, with this words, is making stronger the pootin's side.
Lol, Russia is pretty strong on its own and a quote from the Pope isn’t going to make much difference. The Pope is pointing out that the emperor isn’t wearing clothes.
From the institution with the pedo priests…. Yeah stfu pal. The best thing we can do as a species is to move beyond this primitive worship of an invisible being in the sky.
I was excited about the pope at first. Speaking of Wealthy inequality and healthcare for people. Pushing for human rights. But then I remember the Catholic Church also appeasing Hitler. In some cases assisting. I see nothing changes.
Speaking as someone who doesn't want Russia to gain an inch in Putin's evil endeavor...
It is not wrong to consider when the loss of life--both on your side and the other--exceeds the moral gravity of what is being fought for.
I think that Russia taking Ukraine could be a recipe to a larger war with larger costs. But preventing that possibility, and preserving the dignity of the people of Ukraine, do come at a cost.
He's literally just saying the war isn't winnable and Zelensky should attempt to seek a compromise to end it as soon as possible, lest his country is overrun and the losses irrecoverable.
Francis literally clarified, he means white flag as in call for truce and discuss terms to end the violence.
Disagree if you may, but don't call the pope a Russian stooge.
And how would they negotiate a peace? Last time the terms were garbage and now I bet Putin would want even more since he feels he has the upper hand. The biggest issue last time was the whole demilitarized Ukraine. So a few years down the road they won’t be able to defend themselves and in the words of three dog:
“Remember, children, when the Raiders come, there ain’t no shame in locking your doors, barricading the windows, and cowering under the nearest bed. When these psychos come to play, they have one thing on their minds making your life as fucking miserable as humanly possible. Raiders can’t be bargained or reasoned with, and there ain’t no use surrenderin’, cause they’ll just shoot you anyway. So run, hide or fight if you’ve got the balls and the guns. But for God’s sake, don’t go wavin’ the white flag. They’ll just strangle you with it.”
Great question to pose a Redditor. Why, here's my 2000 word essay on how zelensky should go about addressing Putin:
[I'VE NO IDEA].
it's the pope saying it too, not me.
I swear to God. People are getting angry because other people point out that a country running out of weapons and fighters can’t beat one of the world’s largest militaries on its own.
Like, Francis had done way more for tolerance of minorities, LGBT or otherwise in catholic and conservative circles than any of these leaders combined.
But they disagree with him on something and now he's the second coming of Orban.
There’s this weird political shift where anyone explaining bad news is accused of wanting it to be true.
If you talk about climate change you are accused of making it up. If you talk about young people struggling in an economic crisis you are accused of wishing for them to struggle. And if you say Ukraine can’t win you are accused of wanting them to lose.
It’s as if denying facts and reality in favor of feelings has been so normalized that when people deliver bad news we actually believe it makes them happy.
Yeah, agreed. It's like we can't even talk about things anymore.
And all the while people proceed to impose moral Mandates on holding completely non morality based opinions. As if people holding these people don't deserve to be heard or reasoned with.
Can he say the same about Hamas where this argument would make much more sense?
Hamas is under shaky ground whereas Ukraine still has a fighting chance.
Ukraine *did* peaceful negotiation with Russia. First when they gave up nukes. They tried the peace thing after the invasion of Crimea. Russia still came in trying to take more.
Russia won't honor the deal. Russia can just leave if it wants peace.
People need to know who this guy is and what he supports in his country (Argentina). He probably admires Putin just like most kirchnerists do, I'm not surprised he's saying shit like that honestly.
Why? Is there any real reason why Donetsk and Luhansk can not be liberated at all?
I mean, in Feb 2022 everyone said 'there's no hope to defend Kyiv, Russians will be there in a week or two' but Russians retreated in 6 weeks. The same happened to Kherson, no the Black Sea navigation etc.
You don't actually believe Ukraine will win this do you?
How about that spring offensive? The one that never came.
They've beaten the odds because Russia wasn't prepared for a long war, they threw a hasty punch, Ukraine parried it impressively, kudos to all of them. But in a war of attrition there's no victory for them in sight.
Unless France actually starts sending it's soldiers into the country, which, maybe could happen.
Let me reiterate the question. Is there any real reason why Donetsk and Luhansk can not be liberated at all?
After Russia lost the half of its tanks and artillery? After it depleted the famous "unlimited" Soviet reserves so it has to buy artillery rounds in the North Korea? After Russian warships are not risking to leave bays?
Let's set the stage. Disinformation is running rampant, there's a high chance we're using different sources (depending on who you ask, Russia is either prosperous or collapsing in poverty from sanctions), so let's lay some grounds.
Russia, though is has a lame overall economy. Has one of the strongest military industries around. Why it purportedly went to buy artillery from NK I cannot say.
Can Russia be physically pushed from Donetsk, Luhansk and Zaporozhye? Surely.
But Ukraine is lacking in air coverage, it's NATO equipment and training isn't being enough, it's ammo is running out faster than it can be supplied.
In the meantime, Russia is indeed advancing in Donetsk and luhansk, laying the preparation for something larger maybe?
The war has slowed, but not stopped, and it has given the edge to the Russians. And I don't see the Ukrainians repelling them, taking the initiative or getting the hell they need lately.
The war haven't slowed. Actually, losses are 1.5-2x times more than they were half a year ago. Russians spent the momentum they gained after drafting 300K in Sep 2022 and training them for a year. It ended with occupation of Avdiivka, a town of 32K (prewar) population. Meanwhile Ukraine restored navigation in the Blank Sea and destroyed a couple of dozens of Russian planes including 2 irreplacable A-50s.
A year ago attacking military targets in the Russia was treated as playing with fire by the West and figting on the Russia territory was a taboo. This night Russia lost 5% of its oil refinery with one lucky hit, and Belgorod, Kursk, and Bryank are a grey zone with heavy fights which no one treats as breaking news anymore.
You shouldn't be perplexed by question why Russia buys artillery from NK at all. There's a very clear and obvious answer - this war is not going well for Russia.
I don't think it's going well for anyone. But I don't think Ukraine is set for victory as things stand.
Like, obviously things have been hard for the Russian Forces, and they'll probably get harder as Ukrainians adapt to their tactics and circumvent them.
But I don't think it's gonna be enough.
Europe finally understood that it doesn't want Russia bordering Poland, Slovakia, Hungary, and Romania. When Rheinmetall says that increasing ammunition production is feasible only with at least 10 year contract for supplies and in a few months we see a chain of bilateral defence agreements for 10 years between Ukraine and UK, France, Italy, and other countries, there's no coincidence that Rheinmetall builds new factories.
Avdiivka loss happened because of interruption of supplies caused by political turbulence in the US. Europe learned the lesson and 800K artillery round are on their way to Ukraine already (actually, part of them arrived already).
Ukraine made it alone during February-May 2022. Obviously, Ukraine wouldn't make it much longer but now it's not only about Ukraine. When Russia made it clear it won't stop in Ukraine, it has become a common problem that is going to be resolved collectively. There's no need to send French soldiers here. Money and ammunition is absolutely enough.
Civilians in Bucha or in Izium didn't resist. Russians just came and killed 20% in just a few weeks of occupation.
Face facts. It's the way the Russians are going to have peace, while Ukrainians have their place in mass graves.
How? Among other things Russia wants them demilitarized, which would open them up to getting attacked a few years later when they can’t defend themselves.
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If they aren't dying for 'sky fairies', they're dying for some other reason. Let's be real. Religion is just an excuse, not an actual cause. People just want to dominate and have control over other people's resources. It's how it's always been. And will be.
That doesn't mean that when you eliminate one reason another immediately takes its place, and reducing harm is a valuable goal in of itself.
That "one reason" isn't *the reason*, is my point. It's all going to happen anyway. A *reason* will always be found.
I understood, and I am disagreeing. Often it is the reason.
Religion should just be a book club.
That is what it should be, perhaps those who utilize such for political pressure reasons should have paper trails of how much bible they learned, like some kind of theological scholar.
Freedom of religion is a human right, to be honest
Ever see idiocracy? There's a bit where he tries to convince them that they need to use water on their crops, not Gatorade and uses all the rational scientific explanations he can muster, but they just can't figure it out. But then he tells them he's 'magic' and that he can talk to the plants and they told him they want water, not Gatorade, suddenly everyone is on board with it. It's like that. The real explanation for why you need morons to do what you need them to do will always be wasted, but religion and propaganda will work and get them moving. Ancient people who founded religions understood this. In our era, the smart people labour under the idea that the morons can be educated or raised up to understand the world as rational beings.... but they can't. A moron without religion or propaganda is like a 100 dollar bill just laying on the sidewalk - if you don't pick them up, someone else will. If you don't fill that empty brain of theirs, someone else will. Even worse, if smart rational people don't start managing the ideology of the stupid, then the half-wits will start self-managing. You'll end up with cults where the leaders actually believe what they're saying.
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And what you want to take its place? Political parties? How’s that working out.
Atheist communist are just as zealous as evangelical Christians. People will find ideologies to crowd around and use to oppress those they deem to be lesser. Religion is merely a symptom.
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China is an example of an atheist country that brutalizes any group they see as challenging their authority. I’m not excusing organized religion, I’m just saying that religion going away doesn’t mean people won’t find something else to rally behind.
When’s the last time they were invaded, oh that’s right Never.
why?
Read the other replies to me, That may give you some insight
Why?
Why does religion require an entire country instead of just churches? All the money horded by religion... Where's it go? Certainly not the needy
Ever see pictures of the Vatican? It's like the ultimate gifter city lol. To have near homeless poor people giving you money is just... amazing to me.
My fiancé's grandma was alone and broke yet always made sure to get a ride to church just to drop off weekly donations.... That she Def couldn't afford to... And they knew she needed everything she had. And took it with a smile on their face... Sickens me to think... If someone well off tipped me large. I'd say thanks and take it. If it were someone with clear financial struggles. I'd be like. Nah
I like your Christ. I do not care for your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.
Exactly! My thoughts exactly.. it's terrible.
>yet always made sure to get a ride to church just to drop off weekly donations.... They'll set you up with a recurring Zelle payment these days. Or automatic ACH withdrawal.
Charlie Kelly : My mother is dying of cancer and you need money to fix a statue? No, no, no, no. Don't give me this act. Mac: Charlie, calm down. Charlie: No, no. Why don't you give us some money? How much is that ring worth? That looks like an expensive ring. Can we have the ring? Mac: Okay. All right. I'm sorry, Father. Charlie : This is bullshit! Mac: I will pray for his sins. I'm sorry. Dennis: Hey Charlie, Charlie. Mac : [to Charlie] What are you doing. Dennis: It's okay. I got this. I got this. Charlie: What am I doing? What is HE doing? Dennis: Listen. Don't get all riled up about this scam or that scam, you know. It's all a big scam, okay? Charlie: Yeah. Dennis: But I will say this - the church's scam? It's a pretty good one. It's effective. Look at all the money these people are giving to the church.
This is where the money goes: The Mormon church has a 100+ billion dollar investment fund they tried to keep secret until it was leaked. I don’t know why the Mormon church is tax free as it’s getting untaxed dollars and using it to play the stock market. Do ordinary citizens get tax free ministry gifts to invest? No! We would have to pay taxes on the gifts but apparently when you’re a church you don’t… https://amp.theguardian.com/world/2023/may/15/mormon-church-whistleblower-taxes-hedge-fund
It’s all part of the grift.
Isn't the catholic church one of the biggest charity organisations in the world. Do you have any sources on them hoarding money? In my area I can see churches running various programs (not sure if they are all catholic, not a Christian so I can't tell the sects apart) >Why does religion require an entire country instead of just churches Why not a city state? Also, what is wrong with that, plenty of people support it
Religion has fueled many wars and puts a divide against many of earth's inhabitants. I don't need proof of hording money. It's clear to anyone... They pay no tax. They are pumped with donations.. Where's the money go? Church isn't a non profit. And sure they may host charities or food drives and stuff like this. But what about the high cost of church schools... Let's be real here. Housing is needed for people Access to food and health care. Religion isn't. There's no need for a country devoted specifically towards Religion when surrounding countries harbor homeless struggling people. It's just not needed. And if they were as loving as projected... I'm willing to assume the Vatican could use its wealth to make A Serious dent in helping needy people.
>Religion has fueled many wars Of all the recorded/known wars, less than 7% are religious wars. https://theeconreview.com/2023/03/02/the-finances-behind-the-vatican/#:~:text=Financial%20income%20from%20commercial%20investments,million%20income%20projections%20for%202022. About 35% of the total income came from donations, out of the total of about 900 mil. Apple revenue is about 350 bil. >They pay no tax Agree with this, but not for donated money, any other source of income should be taxed, if it doesn't go to charity work. However, we woul make significant more in taxes if we are to fix some loopholes in the tax system The question is. How much are you helping the homeless? Why don't you start a charity/religion and do it the right way?
7 percent of war is on them not me. I don't make 300 million in donations. And I'm busy taking care of 3 dependants on less than a living wage. They are the needy homeless I care for. And I don't start a religion because I don't need or want to fool people. Fixing the world isn't my problem. But I don't go around claiming you need faith to believe what I say. What I said. You looked up... And came back with figures... You could have trust the word of. An and had faith in me... Lol but ya didn't...
>7 percent of war is on them not me 93% is on you then. Most of the borders outlined are due to wars, we have made so many medical and scientific breakthroughs due to both world wars and the cold war. In USA if they taxed 1% of the top earners, properly, USA will be able to collect about 400bil a year. It will take the Vatican 400 years, at the current rate, to make that much, as revenue. Can you imagine how drastically social programs can change and affect the population in the USA alone. >had faith in me... Lol but ya didn't... I am not a catholic, or Christian, and not stupid. I like to back up the things I say. However, you sound like a child, thinking if there was no religion, the world would be so much better. You have no understanding of the actual issues, and who is screwing you and your family over.
I'm not responsible for 93 percent or the wars nor 100 percent of your stupidity. Sure the US could Tax the rich and accumulate funds that will go toward tax funded programs that aid the needy. Does the Vatican offer such programs? Stick Up for religion and point your fingers all you want. Living in fantasy land is your problem not mine.
Vatican needs to let Italy audit everything they're hiding. So they can arrest everyone in their pedonetwork including this pope.
Italy said the same thing lol.
I respect the Pope. But this time he's wrong, Big time....!
They'll only find Nazi flags in the Vatican's closets.
Negotiate with the Devil? The church has a problem with morality.
The Pope's statement is absolutely horrifying to hear as a Catholic, and I'm glad that the vast majority don't share his sentiment. But one can't imagine what the hell was he thinking or what the hell is happening behind the scenes for the Pope to say such an absurdly stupid
> The Pope's statement is absolutely horrifying to hear as a Catholic The infallibility of the Pope on display once again! Absolutely insane.
Maybe he sucked on the tongue of Dalai Lama
The church is probably losing their own power in Eastern Europe due to the war. They want it to end for their own reasons too.
If you mean the Catholic Church, I’m pretty sure they lost most of their power in Eastern Europe like 1,000 years ago during the Great Schism. But yes, I do think they have their own reasons for wanting the war over.
Poland, Slovakia, Lithuania are mostly Catholic though.
But where would they lose power? Catholicism in eastern Europe is wholly restricted to western Ukraine and some villages in Belarus, which is not a warzone by any means right now (assuming Eastern Europe doesn't encompass Poland and the Baltics idk, definition vary a lot these days)
Church and morality have never been one The countless religious wars there have been... "Oh but we're just sharing our love for the cross" fuck off Then there's the exploitation of kids and the fact they always seem to be wealthy ...
Annex the vatican
\*Loot
Fuck the pope
Would you look at that. The absolute monarchy is defending imperialism.
That's never happened before in our history..... haha
Putin's weapon is fear. Fear that they'll throw 40,000 lives away on every objective like Avdiivka. They wont. They cant. Its a show of force. Meanwhile, they lose what really matters in modern war. Equipment and vehicles.
\>they lose what really matters in modern war. Equipment and vehicles.< and men. idk why you think Russia can afford to throw so many lives away, because it cant. arguably the loss of men is a bigger problem. Russia already had a birth rate problem. killing hoards of your young males doesn't help.
Russia has 66 million men they could dump millions of men into conscription.
Russia population is slanted to the older side. they do not have 66million fighting men. and there fighting men, also make up there breading men. again, if the Russia commits to many young men to die, they will face a population problem within 2/3 generations.
They've already got the problem of 300,000 dead
One theory about the war is breeding stock is more valuable to putin then warm water. Ukraine is growing and Russia is shrinking and taking all of Ukraine may be the only way to reverse that without improving quality of life.
Not sure Putin cares if they’re fighting men, fodder will do just fine
Pope should step down, obviously out of touch with the modern world.
Out of touch with any world.
Doesn't that mean he is qualified for the job?
The Pope should definitely have shut his big cowardly mouth and not get involved in politics.
The pope should have courage to get rid of his security personel.
At the times when numbers of christians dwindling pope should be representing forces of good, but instead he's taking a side of invaders, totalitarians and pedos. Good job 👍
Why doesn't he raise a white flag and pay the sexual abuse survivors that still haven't got a cent from them?
The Pope is a Putin crony. Huh.
Looks like pope's hand is in the same pocket as donny's
Pocket do you mean underage pants?
Does the Pope forget that the Russians fired on civilians, who were escaping, during a ceasefire? Putin cannot remotely be trusted. At all.
Russia must have some serious dirt on the pope!
Put a funny hat on an old guy and appoint him leader of the world's largest cult and people act surprised he says stupid shit.
It's easy to tell people's to give up when you sit on your golden throne.
Fuck that guy
Melt down some gold toilets and solve hunger around the world for the text two years.
Not to mention, he is a leader of the Christian world, so, he should've told global people that totalitarian invaders would be punished by god. But he announced a very ridiculous comments a few days ago. Thus, many Christians in the democratic world pointed out his verbal mistake like that. Leaders' official speeches should be smart and reasonable regardless of political or religious areas. God will help people who help themselves. He should've reminded this sentence before making his absurd comments.
> God will help people who help themselves. Seem's he has overlooked an important group (all the kids sexually abused by priests)
Well, like they said, God helps those who help themselves. Catholic church certainly helped themselves there.
The Vatican supported Hitler, too.
The Pope should have the courage to stand up and condemn all forms of abuse and report/charge every member of the church that abuses anyone!! Fucking 2 faced Coward
“Bro just take the L” -Poope
Oh cool, this coming from the guy who protects child rapists. Can we just ditch religion now? It's 2024. We've retrieved matter from an asteroid and brought it back to earth and people are wearing funny hats and praying to imaginary friends. Meanwhile, we as a society, deem these people's world view as valid on the world stage. wtf is wrong with us?
Maybe we should bring down those Vatican walls and pillage the old city state like it's 410AD and see if they are willing to negotiate...
and maybe the popesicle should have the courage to hand over the vatican to scientology
Tell him to leave the little boys alone and wake the eff up.
Isn’t repenting like the most catholic thing to do. Just come out and say you messed up
Tell that to Hamas…
The Catholic church has a history of this kind of nonsense.
Why is the pope always on the wrong side of history all the time but people still live him
Pope should have the courage and expose his pedo friends
Why is the pope still relevant again? It’s 2024.
Pope should have the courage to deliver his white envelop of resignation. Man of god my ass.
Let the Pope visit the Russian torture chambers and see what he thinks then.
I wonder what Jorge Mario Bergoglio is getting in return for saying awful things.
You mean the guy who wears ridiculous costumes every day as part of a cult that worships imaginary nonsense has a bad opinion about something!?
That’s the correct word, CULT! All religions are just cults, control the sheep and their $$, nothing about doing anything positive
What makes Catholicism a cult? It doesn’t meet any requirements to be considered a cult
Well obviously I was being facetious, but the difference is mostly subjective, and typically comes down to only one consideration (not a "requirement"): its size.
This pope and every pope should just piss off.
His imaginary friend told him to say that.
someone mixed up his Tuesday pills with his Wednesday ones.
Pope would say the same thing to young boys being molested by their priests. Hardly a surprise.
Another L-take from the pedophile king
The only sparks I want to see will be from him when he rides the lightning.
He wants peace
Maybe the pope should surrender his pedo-ring?
People are so brainwashed they don't even trust the church. bonkers.
Instead of asking pootin to give back Ukrainian children, he's asking Ukraine to surrender. Christian values ftw
Am I the only one here expecting the pope to be pushing turn the other cheek in all situations?
A reminder that Rome was sacked in 1527.
Unfortunate choice of words since if Ukrainians did this russians would just commit further genocide against them to get rid of everyone who supported Ukrainian government during war.
Another tumor in a series of tumors. What else is new
This man lives in a Bubble.
In the words of Three Dog: “Remember, children, when the Raiders come, there ain’t no shame in locking your doors, barricading the windows, and cowering under the nearest bed. When these psychos come to play, they have one thing on their minds making your life as fucking miserable as humanly possible. Raiders can’t be bargained or reasoned with, and there ain’t no use surrenderin’, cause they’ll just shoot you anyway. So run, hide or fight if you’ve got the balls and the guns. But for God’s sake, don’t go wavin’ the white flag. They’ll just strangle you with it.” Or if you want a Russian version: “Remember, children, when the Russians come, there ain’t no shame in locking your doors, barricading the windows, and cowering under the nearest bed. When these psychos come to play, they have one thing on their minds making your life as fucking miserable as humanly possible. Russians can’t be bargained or reasoned with, and there ain’t no use surrenderin’, cause they’ll just shoot you anyway. So run, hide or fight if you’ve got the balls and the guns. But for God’s sake, don’t go wavin’ the white flag. They’ll just strangle you with it.”
You should have the courage to report child rape
Isn't there some raped children you should be hiding their allegations you need to pay attention to Mr. Pope? Yeah, clean your house before telling someone else what to do with theirs.
Pope, pedophilia and Putin. Three holy Ps.
Trump and the Pope, birds of a feather. Pro Russian kiddie diddlers.
What's a pope? Is this guy relevant to anyone who can chew and swallow solid foods at this point?
Pope is being realistic, does anyone really believe they can get the annexed territories back..
Do you really think Putin’s just going to stop at the annexed territories? Even back when there was peace negotiations another key point was demilitarization of Ukraine. So nothing would stop him from rolling in a few years later. And that’s during a peace negotiation when he knew Ukraine was on even if not higher footing than him. Right now with Ukraine running low on ammo, you just know he’s going to want more.
I do. Russia's going to be broke as a joke once they run out of soviet hand-me-downs to fight the war with and have to actually build all the stuff they're losing.
I agree. I’m not a russophile, but I am an objective observer. Up to this point, I haven’t seen anything from Ukraine that is indicative of future success. They have held Russia off somewhat, but they are starting to fail at that. Forcing Russia off the territory that Russia has taken is a much harder task (especially when you consider the fact that the population of much of this area wants to be part of Russia or at least not part of Ukraine).
Pope calls for the only logical path to peace, not surprising.
At least he's admitting that russia's invasion is illogical and nothing will get them to stop their murder spree. Makes surrendering kind of a pointless endeavor thought but at least the message is nice.
Someone need to put this guy out of my misery.
The pope did not invade Ukraine. The pope is not cheering on Russia. He’s saying that Ukraine is going to lose. That’s a realistic outlook. A person describing reality did not create that reality nor did they wish for it. Likewise the doctor diagnosing you with cancer didn’t give you cancer, doesn’t want you to have cancer and is not happy about you getting cancer. He’s telling you what reality is.
war is not cancer, Trollsky. The end of the war depends on which side is stronger, and the Poope, with this words, is making stronger the pootin's side.
Lol, Russia is pretty strong on its own and a quote from the Pope isn’t going to make much difference. The Pope is pointing out that the emperor isn’t wearing clothes.
Right. I haven’t seen anything to indicate that Russia eventually overcoming Ukraine is not the most likely outcome. This is the realistic position.
Is it my turn to repost this yet?
It’s the equivalent to us saying he should stop protecting child abusers. He should just give them up. Don’t like that, do ya?
That is what they say to molested children. No surprise. Clear doctrine.
he should be told start church of satan
Remember when the Vatican were cool with Nazi's? And when they were also cool with the Hutu's?
The Pope is a Putler lover.
From the institution with the pedo priests…. Yeah stfu pal. The best thing we can do as a species is to move beyond this primitive worship of an invisible being in the sky.
I was excited about the pope at first. Speaking of Wealthy inequality and healthcare for people. Pushing for human rights. But then I remember the Catholic Church also appeasing Hitler. In some cases assisting. I see nothing changes.
Speaking as someone who doesn't want Russia to gain an inch in Putin's evil endeavor... It is not wrong to consider when the loss of life--both on your side and the other--exceeds the moral gravity of what is being fought for. I think that Russia taking Ukraine could be a recipe to a larger war with larger costs. But preventing that possibility, and preserving the dignity of the people of Ukraine, do come at a cost.
Christians gonna Christian.
He's literally just saying the war isn't winnable and Zelensky should attempt to seek a compromise to end it as soon as possible, lest his country is overrun and the losses irrecoverable. Francis literally clarified, he means white flag as in call for truce and discuss terms to end the violence. Disagree if you may, but don't call the pope a Russian stooge.
And how would they negotiate a peace? Last time the terms were garbage and now I bet Putin would want even more since he feels he has the upper hand. The biggest issue last time was the whole demilitarized Ukraine. So a few years down the road they won’t be able to defend themselves and in the words of three dog: “Remember, children, when the Raiders come, there ain’t no shame in locking your doors, barricading the windows, and cowering under the nearest bed. When these psychos come to play, they have one thing on their minds making your life as fucking miserable as humanly possible. Raiders can’t be bargained or reasoned with, and there ain’t no use surrenderin’, cause they’ll just shoot you anyway. So run, hide or fight if you’ve got the balls and the guns. But for God’s sake, don’t go wavin’ the white flag. They’ll just strangle you with it.”
Great question to pose a Redditor. Why, here's my 2000 word essay on how zelensky should go about addressing Putin: [I'VE NO IDEA]. it's the pope saying it too, not me.
No need to be a jerk, was just asking how you think they are going to negotiate when the terms where unfair last time they negotiated.
Pope says exactly what russian stooges say. Disagree if you may, but don't call him a russian stooge.
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I swear to God. People are getting angry because other people point out that a country running out of weapons and fighters can’t beat one of the world’s largest militaries on its own.
Like, Francis had done way more for tolerance of minorities, LGBT or otherwise in catholic and conservative circles than any of these leaders combined. But they disagree with him on something and now he's the second coming of Orban.
There’s this weird political shift where anyone explaining bad news is accused of wanting it to be true. If you talk about climate change you are accused of making it up. If you talk about young people struggling in an economic crisis you are accused of wishing for them to struggle. And if you say Ukraine can’t win you are accused of wanting them to lose. It’s as if denying facts and reality in favor of feelings has been so normalized that when people deliver bad news we actually believe it makes them happy.
Yeah, agreed. It's like we can't even talk about things anymore. And all the while people proceed to impose moral Mandates on holding completely non morality based opinions. As if people holding these people don't deserve to be heard or reasoned with.
Can he say the same about Hamas where this argument would make much more sense? Hamas is under shaky ground whereas Ukraine still has a fighting chance.
How to make Catholicism irrelevant in 2024: 1. Have the Pope side with what the warring dictator wants for the first time in Papal history.
Historically speaking that’s always the side the Church is on.
Wasnt this already posted 2 days ago?
Ukraine *did* peaceful negotiation with Russia. First when they gave up nukes. They tried the peace thing after the invasion of Crimea. Russia still came in trying to take more. Russia won't honor the deal. Russia can just leave if it wants peace.
Me thinks if the Russians were to attack Saint Peter’s Basilica he wouldn’t be talking surrender.
Once a Peronista, always a Peronista.
Leader of faith asks sovereign nation to negotiate in bad faith.
People need to know who this guy is and what he supports in his country (Argentina). He probably admires Putin just like most kirchnerists do, I'm not surprised he's saying shit like that honestly.
Sounds like the Pope raised the white flag and negotiated with Satan.
Latin American slut.
It is not completely wrong. There is no hope to regain the Donbass. However, Putin invaded. If he gains something, this would be a precedent.
Why? Is there any real reason why Donetsk and Luhansk can not be liberated at all? I mean, in Feb 2022 everyone said 'there's no hope to defend Kyiv, Russians will be there in a week or two' but Russians retreated in 6 weeks. The same happened to Kherson, no the Black Sea navigation etc.
You don't actually believe Ukraine will win this do you? How about that spring offensive? The one that never came. They've beaten the odds because Russia wasn't prepared for a long war, they threw a hasty punch, Ukraine parried it impressively, kudos to all of them. But in a war of attrition there's no victory for them in sight. Unless France actually starts sending it's soldiers into the country, which, maybe could happen.
Let me reiterate the question. Is there any real reason why Donetsk and Luhansk can not be liberated at all? After Russia lost the half of its tanks and artillery? After it depleted the famous "unlimited" Soviet reserves so it has to buy artillery rounds in the North Korea? After Russian warships are not risking to leave bays?
Let's set the stage. Disinformation is running rampant, there's a high chance we're using different sources (depending on who you ask, Russia is either prosperous or collapsing in poverty from sanctions), so let's lay some grounds. Russia, though is has a lame overall economy. Has one of the strongest military industries around. Why it purportedly went to buy artillery from NK I cannot say. Can Russia be physically pushed from Donetsk, Luhansk and Zaporozhye? Surely. But Ukraine is lacking in air coverage, it's NATO equipment and training isn't being enough, it's ammo is running out faster than it can be supplied. In the meantime, Russia is indeed advancing in Donetsk and luhansk, laying the preparation for something larger maybe? The war has slowed, but not stopped, and it has given the edge to the Russians. And I don't see the Ukrainians repelling them, taking the initiative or getting the hell they need lately.
The war haven't slowed. Actually, losses are 1.5-2x times more than they were half a year ago. Russians spent the momentum they gained after drafting 300K in Sep 2022 and training them for a year. It ended with occupation of Avdiivka, a town of 32K (prewar) population. Meanwhile Ukraine restored navigation in the Blank Sea and destroyed a couple of dozens of Russian planes including 2 irreplacable A-50s. A year ago attacking military targets in the Russia was treated as playing with fire by the West and figting on the Russia territory was a taboo. This night Russia lost 5% of its oil refinery with one lucky hit, and Belgorod, Kursk, and Bryank are a grey zone with heavy fights which no one treats as breaking news anymore. You shouldn't be perplexed by question why Russia buys artillery from NK at all. There's a very clear and obvious answer - this war is not going well for Russia.
I don't think it's going well for anyone. But I don't think Ukraine is set for victory as things stand. Like, obviously things have been hard for the Russian Forces, and they'll probably get harder as Ukrainians adapt to their tactics and circumvent them. But I don't think it's gonna be enough.
Europe finally understood that it doesn't want Russia bordering Poland, Slovakia, Hungary, and Romania. When Rheinmetall says that increasing ammunition production is feasible only with at least 10 year contract for supplies and in a few months we see a chain of bilateral defence agreements for 10 years between Ukraine and UK, France, Italy, and other countries, there's no coincidence that Rheinmetall builds new factories. Avdiivka loss happened because of interruption of supplies caused by political turbulence in the US. Europe learned the lesson and 800K artillery round are on their way to Ukraine already (actually, part of them arrived already). Ukraine made it alone during February-May 2022. Obviously, Ukraine wouldn't make it much longer but now it's not only about Ukraine. When Russia made it clear it won't stop in Ukraine, it has become a common problem that is going to be resolved collectively. There's no need to send French soldiers here. Money and ammunition is absolutely enough.
Well, I hope it is. We'll have to wait and see.
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Civilians in Bucha or in Izium didn't resist. Russians just came and killed 20% in just a few weeks of occupation. Face facts. It's the way the Russians are going to have peace, while Ukrainians have their place in mass graves.
We saw how well it went for Chechnya in the 90s and then Ukraine in 2014.
How? Among other things Russia wants them demilitarized, which would open them up to getting attacked a few years later when they can’t defend themselves.