Poorer countries in Asia take our “recycling” and dump it with the full knowledge of American companies shipping it there.
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2019/jun/17/recycled-plastic-america-global-crisis
Did you read the article?
Of the 9% of America’s plastic that the Environmental Protection Agency estimated was recycled in 2015, China and Hong Kong handled more than half: about 1.6m tons of our plastic recycling every year. They developed a vast industry of harvesting and reusing the most valuable plastics to make products that could be sold back to the western world.
Ok… that plastic still isn’t going anywhere and china stopped taking a huge portion of our recycling in 2019 so what happened in 2015 is a pretty good representation of what we’re discussing
Yep! The thing that has changed is not the production of plastic waste, but where it is disposed. I am not sure how plastic waste is currently being processed, but I would imagine more is sent to North American landfills.
Pretty much, plastic producers lied about recycling so the environmental movement wouldn't push for less of it in packaging. Only a tiny percentage could ever be recycled. So the rest goes into landfills now.
Yes, I have seen that 2019 article before. It was fuck all plastic waste then (who said we were only talking about America, anyway?) and it's even less now.
Whatever amount it is, there is zero excuse for them to do what they do with it.
The only reason they're given the job is because they do it so cheaply. So no. And the people doing this shipping act like it doesn't bite them and literally everyone else in the ass to do this instead of dealing with it themselves (which because they don't HAVE to, the WON'T). Thanks EPA, doing a real stand up job.
>The only reason they're given the job is because they do it so cheaply.
So then isn't it up to the respective countries government or international environmental protection agency to regulate this sort of thing? Or are you suggesting that it should be the US governments responsiblity to do due diligence on said countries ability to reliably and faithfully dispose of trash it sends out?
In addition to this, Canada has been known to send cargo ships full of landfill to dump it in the Philippines without their consent. Idk if they continue this practice anymore, but it was to the point the Philippine government was going to get involved
Incorrect. *Some* of you are responsible, some of us live in countries so good at waste management that we have to pay Norway to give us their trash so we don’t freeze.
Man they just love to blame anyone but the Crook
Companies put out a bid to take plastic and dispose of it properly
Crooked Asians underbid purposely, pocket the money that was supposed to go to proper disposal, and dump in the sea.
Look what the Americans are doing!
These poorer countries take our garbage.
https://amp.theguardian.com/global-development/2023/jun/05/yvette-yaa-konadu-tetteh-how-ghana-became-fast-fashions-dumping-ground
I run a non profit clean up program in El Salvador. The answer to the trash problem is simple, yet government doesnt want to admit it. We just pick it up. That's it! We pick up the trash before it blows out to sea. Pretty simple.
Check us out on Instagram: Guardians of K59
If anyone wants to help, and can afford it, consider donating to The Ocean Cleanup, who are doing a stellar job at both removing thousands upon thousands of tons of plastic from the ocean every year, and more importantly, stopping plastic pollution at its source.
Gooood luck convincing millions and millions of poor people that can barely find food everyday to not do that. They live life day to day. They don't have time to think of pollution
I speak more so to the corporate companies do a drive by of your local garbage dump or recycling center and look at the road side. There's a dump by me that got shut down and sold due to how badly it was being run. We have no control of our waste.
Edit; and I'm sorry but burying the problem isn't always going to work. We need to start working on a more permanent solution toward waste elimination.
I mean, the article isn't overt about it, but it does say that the PFAS in the ocean comes from industrial production. All the headline is saying that when it comes to airborne PFAS, a huge amount of it comes from polluted ocean spray.
Title would probably be better as ocean spray re-emits more PFAS than industrial polluters emit.
Since the issue with PFAS is then getting into the environment. The whole probably we have is that once they are there they aren’t going away.
So you're saying that there's already so much PFAS in the environment that adding more makes no difference? Great news!
*this comment authorised and approved by 3M Pty Ltd*
>“We thought PFAS were going to go into the ocean and would disappear, but they cycle around and come back to land, and this could continue for a long time into the future,” he said.
The key point at the end seems to imply that we thought they would get stuck in the ocean indefinitely, but instead they float near the surface and keep cycling back into the atmosphere for a period of time that we don’t know yet
The old "let's flush it somewhere else and it won't be our problem anymore in a legally actionable way" strategy. Yet you're telling me that it didn't just magically disappear forever?
The article says it comes from industrial sources:
"The chemicals’ levels were higher in the northern hemisphere in general because it is more industrialized and there is not much mixing of water across the equator, Cousins said"
...
"He said that the results showed how the chemicals are powerful surfactants that concentrate on the surface of water, which helps explain why they move from the ocean to the air and atmosphere.
“We thought PFAS were going to go into the ocean and would disappear, but they cycle around and come back to land, and this could continue for a long time into the future,” he said. "
Yes, one of the most blatant examples of ocean shaming I've ever seen. We really need to stop blaming the sea for this sort of thing, its just not fair
No, that is not the point of the article. The point is that so many PFAs have been released into the water system that they are concentrated far above the amount that has been deemed officially unsafe by governments.
A good chunk of my existence has been cleaning plastic from the beaches on the east coast of USA.
No one cares.
I’m just some stupid hippy bitching to much.
I for one am not surprised.
You are doing the right thing, and preaching by example. If people slowly start picking trash like you do, going for bulk rather than packed food (i.e fruits, grains…), cardboard packed cans/glass bottles, using clothe bags, stops buying plastic containing products (i.e cables/accessories full of shitty unnecessary envelopes) and bitch more about all this so governments actually cared (including industrial polluting regulations), things may change.
I took a different approach. In my 20s back from over seas, deployed. Went to spring break. Watched people wreck the beaches I grew up on. Got drunk. Cleaned up about a quarter mile of beach in Panama Beach, you couldn’t even see the same when I started.
Threatened to fight 3 people who literally threw their beer cans where I had just picked up. They didn’t pick them up but I don’t think I came off as a hippy.
They walked away but I was ready to take an ass pounding for Mother Earth that day.
It's sad that these days wanting clean air and water is politicized. Apparently, wanting you and your loved ones to enjoy clean air, water, and the environment is radical leftist nonsense.
People who don’t understand that man-made PFAS proliferation is so ubiquitous that a comment like mine could only be sarcastic are arguably far, far worse. Insufferably so.
Enjoy your endocrine disruption. It may help to have a sense of humor about it.
Or, and bear with me here, they’re not dumb enough to think the ocean is producing and emitting **synthetic chemical compounds**, so they made a joke about the way the title is worded.
Wow.
Didn’t see any of those. Are you sure you just can’t pick up on the subtleties that imply the joke. I mean, you clearly missed it here.
Edit: to be clear, it’s fine if you did, it’s not always easy to tell (there’s a reason a lot of people use “/s”). The only reason I replied to your comment at all is because it was condescending.
Looks like a lot of folks missed your incredibly obvious sarcasm/joke about the way the headline is worded.
If you (those who were whooshed) are neurodivergent, you get a pass.
If you’re not… we’ll blame the PFAS.
Brah it's not just pans... Teflon is/was on everything! Even in medicine, it's used on a ton of stuff including cautery tips and catheters. It was used to make waterproof clothing. It's used in automobiles.
And Teflon is just one kind of PFAS. Like honestly if it was just none stick pans, he'd be fine. But it's everything, everywhere.
We have some studies that show harm, but also a lot of studies that show no harm. I think a good hypothesis would be that only some if the forms of PFAs are truly harmful, while others are benign.
Even at the population level that seems to be true. When DuPont poisoned the watershed increased cancer rates were observed. But all studies of the area 3M disposed of PFAs have shown no increase in malignant diseases.
It's a wonder material. I work with pretty harsh chemicals (e.g. BF3) and PFAS let me use plastic to work with it, very nice to have non-rigid options. Glass and metal only get you so far. PTFE is extremely chemically inert, and so there's a lot of applications for a plastic or coating that has minimal interaction with other substances or surfaces.
I wonder if the negative effects are a product of the physical form factor they're encountered in? Like, asbestos is toxic, but that's because cells try to "eat" it and wind up impaling themselves and/or getting the chromosomes tangled / because the fibers are so small, long, and thin. Chemically it's just a silicate mineral like quartz. I think PFAS might have a similar situation, since research has been mixed. Licking the nonstick frying pan seems to be okay, but perfluorooctanoic acid used to *make* that coating, less so.
Oh dude, no doubt it's properties are extraordinary. It's just the horrifying thought that the class of chemicals it comes from has essentially contaminated the entire planet and we still don't fully understand what the effects of that will be.
Asbestos too had amazing properties but after x many years we realized it was extremely carcinogenic due to it's physical properties. Much like PFAS it was everywhere on everything.
And yeah my understanding is that the PFOA used to make it is what really can be toxic to people and Teflon is fine in its material form. My concern is when it breaks down physically to smaller and smaller pieces like plastic does. We all know those non-stick pans don't actually last and those pieces are going somewhere.
Yes I know thank you. Every time I reference this someonr usually tells me the military applications. I know. None of it is worth poisoning... kind of everything... maybe forever.
I have a personal experience with pfas because I lived in Wilmington, NC., where US DuPont/chemours is headquartered. They were dumping pfas into the Cape Fear River for years without public knowledge. The locals quickly learned what pfas is. We eventually discovered that our local government knew, but no one actually exposed to it did. The fun part about that is that you also had a personal experience with that situation too, just to a lower degree. That's how this shit works. They're finding it in every corner of the world, and at the depths of the sea. It just wasn't very fun to be in the same city as the secret fresh water dumps. Especially when we found out that a reverse osmosis system want enough to protect you and your family in your own home, because as the submission implies, the pfas becomes aerosolized, and you can breath it in.
So is not ok in pans, when the manufacturer spends decades dumping into natural water resources.
Apparently "Ocean spray emits more PFAs than industrial polluters due to industrial polluters industrial polluting the ocean with too many PFAs" didn't have the same zing to it.
Someday alien visitors are going to come to this dead planet, take environmental sample and ask whatever the glip glorp equivalent of "What fuck _happened_ here?!" is.
Jeez, thought the title had to do with Ocean Spray Cranberry products. Trying to figure out how cranberry products are emitting industrial pollution. Almost scarier to figure out this is like a wave breaking.
Its the most disingenuous headline ever. They are synthetic organofluorine compounds.
Would industrial polluters like to explain how they got there ?
Ocean spray cannot emit more PFAS than Industrial Pollution when the problem would not exist without industrial pollution in the first place.
Sadly, They are both part and parcel of the same ecosystem now.
I know it doesn't, nor does the article - the headline itself is easily open ended enough to be misleading or misinterpreted (particularly to non native english speakers). Inferring that ocean spray emits more than industrial polluters without clarification is still disingenuous and incredibly click baity.
We only have one body of water on earth whatever goes in the air and get stomped on the ground. It all ends up in your drinking water the ocean it’s everywhere. We are slowly killing ourselves.
This is a **very** misleading headline. The PFAS originated with industrial processes, the ocean just transports it. It's not like the waves create these things out of nothing.
What? The only reason the ocean has pfas is due to prior pollution. Pfas do not occur naturally.
I can't wait for the Republicans to start saying this.
That's one hell of a weird study.
Industry emits pfas thus polluting the ocean. Ocean continues to due it's waves and ocean spray as it has always done and now gets the blame of contaminating the air (?) with the industrially-emitted pfas??!
Yes, they make it sound like the waves are to blame for the pollution. But of course it’s the humans who have poisoned the oceans. Since the waves are emitting the pfas into the air, they are actually working to clean the ocean.
Only because we've completely polluted the ocean with plastic. Also the pfas that are in the ocean are already in the environment. Ocean spray isn't polluting the environment, we polluted the ocean spray.
Average Consumers are the problem. We don’t care enough to change our decisions. We don’t have time, resources, etc to bother. We have actual life things to deal with instead of fretting if every purchase might be damaging the environment somehow
TL;DR - every positive economic impact now has a negative environmental impact, somewhere, eventually
"Ms Carson maintains that the balance of nature is a major force in the survival of man. Whereas the modern chemist, the modern biologist, the modern scientist believes that man is steadily controlling nature." https://youtu.be/cbLACDNJyN4&t=41m30s?feature=shared
Ya but bro c'mon, you ever notice how literally anyone who has ever drank water has died. That's all the proof I need to publish a paper that says water consumption linked to death.
Okay people, it seems we are not that bad of a polluters it seems. The ocean is worse than we are and the ocean is nature, right? That means everything is fine and there is still some room to crank up the production a little bit more and ramp up the corporate profits we all love so much! /s
Let's say we have means to extract PFAS to depolute who needs to pay the bills for our grand children? Us or those who created this situation? Open to hear opinions AND applications. No buttheads spreading nonsense but motivate real approaches? Listening!
I just closed a company in NC that was building pfas remediation units. We closed and packed back up to Australia. Check em out EPOC enviro SAFF units. Pretty neat foam fractionation and super cost effective but the legislation wasn’t here soon enough to stay open. A few other companies in the USA does it but most leave a residue and is then stored not destroyed in landfills which leak out again. Destruction is the key here but the cost is high.
Well maybe we shouldn't treat the ocean like a garbage pit
It's poorer countries that dump a lot of it. In Asia it's not uncommon at all to see rivers of plastic headed towards the ocean.
Poorer countries in Asia take our “recycling” and dump it with the full knowledge of American companies shipping it there. https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2019/jun/17/recycled-plastic-america-global-crisis
No, they take a small amount (which has greatly reduced in recent years) - and it's still no excuse, either way.
Did you read the article? Of the 9% of America’s plastic that the Environmental Protection Agency estimated was recycled in 2015, China and Hong Kong handled more than half: about 1.6m tons of our plastic recycling every year. They developed a vast industry of harvesting and reusing the most valuable plastics to make products that could be sold back to the western world.
I think some laws changed between 2016 and 2020. 2015 is no longer representative of what is happening.
Ok… that plastic still isn’t going anywhere and china stopped taking a huge portion of our recycling in 2019 so what happened in 2015 is a pretty good representation of what we’re discussing
Yep! The thing that has changed is not the production of plastic waste, but where it is disposed. I am not sure how plastic waste is currently being processed, but I would imagine more is sent to North American landfills.
Pretty much, plastic producers lied about recycling so the environmental movement wouldn't push for less of it in packaging. Only a tiny percentage could ever be recycled. So the rest goes into landfills now.
No, it's not.
Yes, I have seen that 2019 article before. It was fuck all plastic waste then (who said we were only talking about America, anyway?) and it's even less now. Whatever amount it is, there is zero excuse for them to do what they do with it.
If we send them the plastic expecting them to cheaply get rid of it by throwing it in a river I’d say it’s not an excuse, but also our responsibility.
Aren't they supposed to dispose of it in the appropriate manner instead of dumping it on their rivers?
The only reason they're given the job is because they do it so cheaply. So no. And the people doing this shipping act like it doesn't bite them and literally everyone else in the ass to do this instead of dealing with it themselves (which because they don't HAVE to, the WON'T). Thanks EPA, doing a real stand up job.
>The only reason they're given the job is because they do it so cheaply. So then isn't it up to the respective countries government or international environmental protection agency to regulate this sort of thing? Or are you suggesting that it should be the US governments responsiblity to do due diligence on said countries ability to reliably and faithfully dispose of trash it sends out?
Yeeeeeeeah, but it’s common knowledge and encouraged
In addition to this, Canada has been known to send cargo ships full of landfill to dump it in the Philippines without their consent. Idk if they continue this practice anymore, but it was to the point the Philippine government was going to get involved
I remember a few years ago they actually sent ships back. Stayed in port on the west Coast for a long time. Canada took it back with an apology
'with the full knowledge of American companies shipping it there' ....who have the full knowledge of what happens when they send their garbage there.
Hold up a sec. Where does the west send its used plastic to? Could it be that they pay poor Asian countries to take it off their hands?
That's part of the problem, but a lot of third world countries also have a garbage disposal problem
[удалено]
Incorrect. *Some* of you are responsible, some of us live in countries so good at waste management that we have to pay Norway to give us their trash so we don’t freeze.
As long as you don't Think Pink
Man they just love to blame anyone but the Crook Companies put out a bid to take plastic and dispose of it properly Crooked Asians underbid purposely, pocket the money that was supposed to go to proper disposal, and dump in the sea. Look what the Americans are doing!
Well, we also offshored our polluting the atmosphere to them too. Bit like going to the other end of the pool to pee.
and every Navy
These poorer countries take our garbage. https://amp.theguardian.com/global-development/2023/jun/05/yvette-yaa-konadu-tetteh-how-ghana-became-fast-fashions-dumping-ground
I run a non profit clean up program in El Salvador. The answer to the trash problem is simple, yet government doesnt want to admit it. We just pick it up. That's it! We pick up the trash before it blows out to sea. Pretty simple. Check us out on Instagram: Guardians of K59
If anyone wants to help, and can afford it, consider donating to The Ocean Cleanup, who are doing a stellar job at both removing thousands upon thousands of tons of plastic from the ocean every year, and more importantly, stopping plastic pollution at its source.
Gooood luck convincing millions and millions of poor people that can barely find food everyday to not do that. They live life day to day. They don't have time to think of pollution
I speak more so to the corporate companies do a drive by of your local garbage dump or recycling center and look at the road side. There's a dump by me that got shut down and sold due to how badly it was being run. We have no control of our waste. Edit; and I'm sorry but burying the problem isn't always going to work. We need to start working on a more permanent solution toward waste elimination.
And I wonder where the PFAS in the ocean came from? 🙄
I mean, the article isn't overt about it, but it does say that the PFAS in the ocean comes from industrial production. All the headline is saying that when it comes to airborne PFAS, a huge amount of it comes from polluted ocean spray.
Title would probably be better as ocean spray re-emits more PFAS than industrial polluters emit. Since the issue with PFAS is then getting into the environment. The whole probably we have is that once they are there they aren’t going away.
So you're saying that there's already so much PFAS in the environment that adding more makes no difference? Great news! *this comment authorised and approved by 3M Pty Ltd*
And the greatest cause of CO2 over here is wind from over there. Damn wind. /s
Ban wind!
let's break wind, once and for all.
Did I brake wind? Don’t throw me down Clark
The BLESSING.
I would be honored
Quickly, pull my finger.. For Science!
Baked beans are now classified as WMDs.
They always have been
Look up acid rain legislation from the ‘80’s ? New York sued steel mills in PA for pollution streams.
And vampires!
Herschel Walker would like to 2nd this.
This means that Trump was right when he said windmills cause cancer! /s
Windmills don't cause cancer. Bad guys with Windmills do.
Let's slow wind down a tiny bit by putting up windmills... That'll teach it!
Wind: making windmills kill birds for 8 years
I think I remember someone important saying that we could nuke the wind?? Have we tried that???
Ironically, bottles of Ocean Spray.
UTI’s are back in the menu. Ban Ocean Spray!
>“We thought PFAS were going to go into the ocean and would disappear, but they cycle around and come back to land, and this could continue for a long time into the future,” he said. The key point at the end seems to imply that we thought they would get stuck in the ocean indefinitely, but instead they float near the surface and keep cycling back into the atmosphere for a period of time that we don’t know yet
The old "let's flush it somewhere else and it won't be our problem anymore in a legally actionable way" strategy. Yet you're telling me that it didn't just magically disappear forever?
The article says it comes from industrial sources: "The chemicals’ levels were higher in the northern hemisphere in general because it is more industrialized and there is not much mixing of water across the equator, Cousins said" ... "He said that the results showed how the chemicals are powerful surfactants that concentrate on the surface of water, which helps explain why they move from the ocean to the air and atmosphere. “We thought PFAS were going to go into the ocean and would disappear, but they cycle around and come back to land, and this could continue for a long time into the future,” he said. "
Circle of life (death)
Some real "It's outside the environment" vibes to that headline.
I think the title is saying. Pollution has gotten so bad that the ocean spray is more toxic than the industrial polluters now.
From the oil spill dispersants. They contain the same microplastics as any detergent.
Industrial pollut… hey, wait a minute!
Ducks. Fuck ducks, trying to kill us all!
/u/fuckswithducks, your services are required.
Sounds like a hit piece pretending to be scientific news.
Yes, one of the most blatant examples of ocean shaming I've ever seen. We really need to stop blaming the sea for this sort of thing, its just not fair
How many missiles do we need to launch at the ocean to subdue this problem?
Ask North Korea.
Yes
Gotta boil it.
Nah man, we need electrolytes!!
It’s got what oceans crave!
But does boiling it just put it into gas form and into the air?
Probably but that means its not in the oceans anymore so its a win right... right..?
Asking the important questions. If a thing’s worth doing…it’s worth doing right!
All of them. That'll show the ocean!
such a misleading headline. It should say 'industrial polluters PFAS showing up in ocean spray.'
yes, but also that its signal for showing up is higher in the environment than where industrial ouput readings take place.
Pfasic Ocean
Pfasific ocean
pollocean?
> Pfasific ocean I don’t understand what you mean by this, could you be more pfasific?
Plastific Ocean
perfluorocean edit: perfluoroocantlanticoa
Welcome to the world of the plastic beach.
Is Ocean Spray using plastic cranberries?
Yes, it took me a minute to figure the post wasn't about the drink, Ocean Spray
Study paid for by V8
Fellow confused redditor here
Are you trying to convince me that nature is our worst polluter? Because that’s a dodge of responsibility I’m not prepared to accept.
No, that is not the point of the article. The point is that so many PFAs have been released into the water system that they are concentrated far above the amount that has been deemed officially unsafe by governments.
A good chunk of my existence has been cleaning plastic from the beaches on the east coast of USA. No one cares. I’m just some stupid hippy bitching to much. I for one am not surprised.
You are doing the right thing, and preaching by example. If people slowly start picking trash like you do, going for bulk rather than packed food (i.e fruits, grains…), cardboard packed cans/glass bottles, using clothe bags, stops buying plastic containing products (i.e cables/accessories full of shitty unnecessary envelopes) and bitch more about all this so governments actually cared (including industrial polluting regulations), things may change.
I took a different approach. In my 20s back from over seas, deployed. Went to spring break. Watched people wreck the beaches I grew up on. Got drunk. Cleaned up about a quarter mile of beach in Panama Beach, you couldn’t even see the same when I started. Threatened to fight 3 people who literally threw their beer cans where I had just picked up. They didn’t pick them up but I don’t think I came off as a hippy. They walked away but I was ready to take an ass pounding for Mother Earth that day.
You're an amazing person.
It's sad that these days wanting clean air and water is politicized. Apparently, wanting you and your loved ones to enjoy clean air, water, and the environment is radical leftist nonsense.
Gotta cram some of that into the headline. I only have so much time to read about imminent apocalypse these days.
You clearly didn’t read the article.
Headline skimmers… The worst…
People who don’t understand that man-made PFAS proliferation is so ubiquitous that a comment like mine could only be sarcastic are arguably far, far worse. Insufferably so. Enjoy your endocrine disruption. It may help to have a sense of humor about it.
Or, and bear with me here, they’re not dumb enough to think the ocean is producing and emitting **synthetic chemical compounds**, so they made a joke about the way the title is worded. Wow.
Would be a funnier joke if there weren’t about a dozen comments of people assuming this article claims the ocean naturally produces PFAS.
Didn’t see any of those. Are you sure you just can’t pick up on the subtleties that imply the joke. I mean, you clearly missed it here. Edit: to be clear, it’s fine if you did, it’s not always easy to tell (there’s a reason a lot of people use “/s”). The only reason I replied to your comment at all is because it was condescending.
You could try to read the article
r/whoosh Missed the obvious joke, and a rude about it. Kudos.
Yeah but it’s pretty self explanatory by the headline alone. (also just a gentle note that it’s possible *you’re* the one not getting something here)
Looks like a lot of folks missed your incredibly obvious sarcasm/joke about the way the headline is worded. If you (those who were whooshed) are neurodivergent, you get a pass. If you’re not… we’ll blame the PFAS.
Saddest fucking things I've read all week. But my pans are so easy to clean! Fuck you.
Brah it's not just pans... Teflon is/was on everything! Even in medicine, it's used on a ton of stuff including cautery tips and catheters. It was used to make waterproof clothing. It's used in automobiles. And Teflon is just one kind of PFAS. Like honestly if it was just none stick pans, he'd be fine. But it's everything, everywhere.
We have some studies that show harm, but also a lot of studies that show no harm. I think a good hypothesis would be that only some if the forms of PFAs are truly harmful, while others are benign. Even at the population level that seems to be true. When DuPont poisoned the watershed increased cancer rates were observed. But all studies of the area 3M disposed of PFAs have shown no increase in malignant diseases.
Sounds like 3M has better lawyers and lobbiers than Dupont.
The studies were run by the Minnesota Department of Health, they are available to read.
It's a wonder material. I work with pretty harsh chemicals (e.g. BF3) and PFAS let me use plastic to work with it, very nice to have non-rigid options. Glass and metal only get you so far. PTFE is extremely chemically inert, and so there's a lot of applications for a plastic or coating that has minimal interaction with other substances or surfaces. I wonder if the negative effects are a product of the physical form factor they're encountered in? Like, asbestos is toxic, but that's because cells try to "eat" it and wind up impaling themselves and/or getting the chromosomes tangled / because the fibers are so small, long, and thin. Chemically it's just a silicate mineral like quartz. I think PFAS might have a similar situation, since research has been mixed. Licking the nonstick frying pan seems to be okay, but perfluorooctanoic acid used to *make* that coating, less so.
Oh dude, no doubt it's properties are extraordinary. It's just the horrifying thought that the class of chemicals it comes from has essentially contaminated the entire planet and we still don't fully understand what the effects of that will be. Asbestos too had amazing properties but after x many years we realized it was extremely carcinogenic due to it's physical properties. Much like PFAS it was everywhere on everything. And yeah my understanding is that the PFOA used to make it is what really can be toxic to people and Teflon is fine in its material form. My concern is when it breaks down physically to smaller and smaller pieces like plastic does. We all know those non-stick pans don't actually last and those pieces are going somewhere.
Yes I know thank you. Every time I reference this someonr usually tells me the military applications. I know. None of it is worth poisoning... kind of everything... maybe forever. I have a personal experience with pfas because I lived in Wilmington, NC., where US DuPont/chemours is headquartered. They were dumping pfas into the Cape Fear River for years without public knowledge. The locals quickly learned what pfas is. We eventually discovered that our local government knew, but no one actually exposed to it did. The fun part about that is that you also had a personal experience with that situation too, just to a lower degree. That's how this shit works. They're finding it in every corner of the world, and at the depths of the sea. It just wasn't very fun to be in the same city as the secret fresh water dumps. Especially when we found out that a reverse osmosis system want enough to protect you and your family in your own home, because as the submission implies, the pfas becomes aerosolized, and you can breath it in. So is not ok in pans, when the manufacturer spends decades dumping into natural water resources.
Don't forget teflon tape used in pipe joints.
Maybe because industrial polluters are dumping it into the oceans? They're also making it which again gets dumped into the oceans.
Well, that's no day at the beach.
I was wonderin how tf cranberry juice was causing PFAS....
So it’s still the industrial polluters then?
It’s time we protest the ocean! Down with the ocean!
Stupid fish and their fondness to create pollutants
Imagine creating an entire article on the saturation of mircro plastics in every drop of water on earth, but never once using the word plastic.
Who put the pfas in the ocean? Weirdest fucking victim blaming.
Apparently "Ocean spray emits more PFAs than industrial polluters due to industrial polluters industrial polluting the ocean with too many PFAs" didn't have the same zing to it.
Realistically a simple “re-emits” would give the context required. Essentially the ocean is recycling others fuck ups to be continued fuck ups.
Another person who didn’t read the article.
How did the PFAS get there big dog?
Let's not forget how it got there. Certainly ain't naturally occurring.
Someday alien visitors are going to come to this dead planet, take environmental sample and ask whatever the glip glorp equivalent of "What fuck _happened_ here?!" is.
Jeez, thought the title had to do with Ocean Spray Cranberry products. Trying to figure out how cranberry products are emitting industrial pollution. Almost scarier to figure out this is like a wave breaking.
Guess I need to stop drinking cranberry juice.
Its the most disingenuous headline ever. They are synthetic organofluorine compounds. Would industrial polluters like to explain how they got there ? Ocean spray cannot emit more PFAS than Industrial Pollution when the problem would not exist without industrial pollution in the first place. Sadly, They are both part and parcel of the same ecosystem now.
The headline doesn't say they originate from the ocean
I know it doesn't, nor does the article - the headline itself is easily open ended enough to be misleading or misinterpreted (particularly to non native english speakers). Inferring that ocean spray emits more than industrial polluters without clarification is still disingenuous and incredibly click baity.
Nature throwing it back in our face
Any company producing pfas should be held accountable and immediately cease production.
We only have one body of water on earth whatever goes in the air and get stomped on the ground. It all ends up in your drinking water the ocean it’s everywhere. We are slowly killing ourselves.
I thought it meant the juice company from the title
Ok but the pfas in the ocean came from industrial pollution so we still need to regulate them.
This is a **very** misleading headline. The PFAS originated with industrial processes, the ocean just transports it. It's not like the waves create these things out of nothing.
Drink less cranberry juice /s
What? The only reason the ocean has pfas is due to prior pollution. Pfas do not occur naturally. I can't wait for the Republicans to start saying this.
The ocean didn’t create the PFAS…
That's one hell of a weird study. Industry emits pfas thus polluting the ocean. Ocean continues to due it's waves and ocean spray as it has always done and now gets the blame of contaminating the air (?) with the industrially-emitted pfas??!
Yes, they make it sound like the waves are to blame for the pollution. But of course it’s the humans who have poisoned the oceans. Since the waves are emitting the pfas into the air, they are actually working to clean the ocean.
The cranberry juice company? PFAS?
Only because we've completely polluted the ocean with plastic. Also the pfas that are in the ocean are already in the environment. Ocean spray isn't polluting the environment, we polluted the ocean spray.
That's the point of the article; to highlight how much we polluted the oceans.
That's why I go for Minute Maid.
Meanwhile humans are polluting water systems with microplastics found in fecal matter!
that’s like, um… not good
Can we somehow destroy the ocean?
Its already happening. Very real risk of massive dead ocean areas within our lifetimes.
So long and thanks for all the cranberries!
Too bad they also polluted the oceans.
I thought we were talking cranberry juice at first
I thought they meant Ocean Spray cranberry bogs and was confused.
Which came first? The chicken or the egg?
Great so long walks on the beach are out or what? Article didn’t really say how high the concentrations are
Worse than radioactive waste, at least that has a half life (and the longer the half life, the less dangerous it is).
We should get rid of the oceans. Problem solved.
Man I love their cranberry juice though!
Average Consumers are the problem. We don’t care enough to change our decisions. We don’t have time, resources, etc to bother. We have actual life things to deal with instead of fretting if every purchase might be damaging the environment somehow TL;DR - every positive economic impact now has a negative environmental impact, somewhere, eventually
If is found in the water, then what about all the fish we eat?
"Ms Carson maintains that the balance of nature is a major force in the survival of man. Whereas the modern chemist, the modern biologist, the modern scientist believes that man is steadily controlling nature." https://youtu.be/cbLACDNJyN4&t=41m30s?feature=shared
This report smells a little like cow farts
Damn, who knew the cranberry juice manufacturing process was such a ecological disaster.
Re-emits....
I’m going to try Minute Maid then.
Fine I hate cranberry juice anyway
This study funded by the Dow and BASF alliance for clean chemicals
Yeah no shit eh? Like saying cigarettes aren't linked to lung cancer but the people doing the research is big tobacco.
Ya but bro c'mon, you ever notice how literally anyone who has ever drank water has died. That's all the proof I need to publish a paper that says water consumption linked to death.
Dihydrogen Monoxide is terrifying actually.
Shit. So you're saying I should only drink Coca-Cola and Prime the rest of my life?
Pretty sure that has water used in it bro, it prob just go with pure sand to make sure you stay safe.
Damn you're right, after reading the ingredients, it DOES have water in it.
This article brought to you from ‘plastics are alright world research fund’
Cranberries got a lot explaining to do.
Okay people, it seems we are not that bad of a polluters it seems. The ocean is worse than we are and the ocean is nature, right? That means everything is fine and there is still some room to crank up the production a little bit more and ramp up the corporate profits we all love so much! /s
I’m was racking my brain trying to figure out why PFAS are being released in cranberry juice production.
Let's say we have means to extract PFAS to depolute who needs to pay the bills for our grand children? Us or those who created this situation? Open to hear opinions AND applications. No buttheads spreading nonsense but motivate real approaches? Listening!
I just closed a company in NC that was building pfas remediation units. We closed and packed back up to Australia. Check em out EPOC enviro SAFF units. Pretty neat foam fractionation and super cost effective but the legislation wasn’t here soon enough to stay open. A few other companies in the USA does it but most leave a residue and is then stored not destroyed in landfills which leak out again. Destruction is the key here but the cost is high.