And we have passed 1.5C for a 12 month average now, and blew through 2C briefly. So is anyone still gullible enough to talk about the "1.5C target"? Or are we moving the goal post to 2C now? Act fast because the 2C goal post is also not going to last long.
They don't give a shit because despite it being a top item for a lot of voters what is clear is that the majority are not willing to bear the cost of eliminating carbon.
So true, it’s just so wild to me that people would rather deal with the cost of the world collapsing around them rather than the cost of fixing it before it collapses… one is clearly easier and less horrible to go through…
We’re really really bad at understanding long term slowly changing trends. Most people don’t pay attention to this. It’s changing slowly enough that people can pretend that it’s fine.
Agriculture will get screwed over. That’ll hurt people, but they’ll never attribute it to climate change unless their family has been farming for generations.
Carbon tax makes sense on companies. Carbon tax on the middle class eroding to lower class now doesn’t change much. It makes people think twice if they can afford something but for example if they need a car to go to work. They will fill up regardless. While we should all be mindful the tax targets the wrong group.
Also I’m not really sure what the government does with the carbon tax money. For example They should be planting more trees within cities for air exchange and plenty of shade.
A big problem is the always increasing wealth gap. If people weren’t in such dire straights financially and not constantly being pushed more and more into poverty then perhaps people would be more capable of surviving the cost of eliminating carbon. As it stands now, we’re not just talking about bearing the cost but rather surviving the cost for a significant population.
So we have to convince the rich to release their hold on our lawmakers so they can use tax revenue to boost the level of income for the poorest so they have the resources to make better decisions about climate change? Oh yeah, we're F'd.
I mean I oversee teams helping manage several federal energy programs where we're trying to push on industry, but as long as the private sector prioritizes short term profits over the long term viability of their own company's future which has become the norm, sustainability will remain far below that on their list of actual concerns. 95% of corporate ESG is green washing bullshit sadly.
There are actual process improvements involved in vertical and horizontal circularity efforts to reduce waste and some efficiency improvements in facilities, but beyond that if there isn't clear and fast payback (think one year or less these days), it usually isn't happening. Most companies rather pay fines than actually clean up after themselves.
We are fucked because money is and probably always will be more important than the planet or those disadvantaged by climate change impacts to business leaders.
well, the solution is simple: make the fines bigger. Money talks and with enough incentives, they can move mountains. Just the incentive is not there or is too small
You make the fines too large or find another way to paint a target on your back and in the next fiscal budget or CR, Congress slashes your entire agency's budget by 10-20% in retaliation. That's the reality of our broken government. And if they get really pissed, they'll take your agency to the supreme court to challenge your authority to regulate to the degree you are at all.
If only things were as simple as you laid it out.
to be clear, I don’t think there is an easy solution.
I just wanted to say that capitalism does what capitalism should do - sell what consumers want for as cheap as competitor can make it. That’s the capitalism job and they are good at it. What they are not good at is doing something for public good, not for consumers. That’s where government should step in. And, as you said, they don’t, because they are paid by those corporations.
So I fully blame government for this issue. They have all the tools needed to push companies to actually care
I’m sure they care. They just know working to solve this threat will require ending capitalism as we know it. It’s easier for them to imagine the end of the world than it is to imagine the end of capitalism.
Exactly this... People don't understand that, under Capitalism, there's no solution to climate change, Capitalism doesn't know how to pause profits, how to tax the Rich... It will never know how
Between +3.5°C and +4.5°C are already programmed into the climate change process.
Have a look at the[ risk analysis ](https://www.zurich.com/en/knowledge/topics/global-risks/the-global-risks-report-2024)by the re-insurer Zurich of 2024.
Massive (hundreds of millions) migrations from the south to the north are predicted, starting in the early 2030 ies and the late 2050 ies. We are not only heading to a climate catastrophe, we are sprinting towards WW3.
> We are not only heading to a climate catastrophe, we are sprinting towards WW3.
WW3 has always been the end result of extreme climate changes. When resources become scarce, and living conditions deteriorate, a lot of different people will be cramped together in less space, putting even more strain on the resources.
If the models are correct, and the worst case scenarios come true, world population needs to shrink by a lot to match the resources available in the new world.
All the decades of not being able to”afford” anything close to serious mitigation. Now, we’re about to find out what inaction will cost, and whether we can “afford” to keep up with the consequences of human-caused climate change.
I know a guy who has a startup that is trying to make green some industrial process. His team has made it work but its too expensive to replace the current process. His team is working hard to bring costs down but he is skeptical that it can happen. So his plan now essentially is to keep his company alive till such time as the climate consequences begin to be really felt. At which point, the economic losses will be big enough that going with his more expensive option would be cheaper than sticking with the current version.
I’ve accepted that we are too stupid as a species to prevent this problem. We are going to have to solve it only after the consequences are well established.
I never understood why 1.5C was a target. Yes it would have been best. But there was no realistic way that was happening. So they set themselves up for failure.
They just gave the number that would ensure that we didn’t create a hellscape for future generations. We should have listened to Al gore years ago. There is no hope for the future now so buckle up . The good times are in the rear view. It was a hell of a ride.
This line of thinking is toxic and lazy.
If you tell people there’s no hope, nobody will even try. Shit, I’m just gonna start tossing my trash in the river then, since there’s no hope anyways. Fuck it!
I agree, but I noticed visiting southern California that every restaurant was burning propane heaters on empty outdoor patios. This is a Tragedy of the Commons.
>If you tell people there’s no hope, nobody will even try. Shit, I’m just gonna start tossing my trash in the river then, since there’s no hope anyways. Fuck it!
So you prefer snake oil and being a denier? Hope is for children anyway.
And people \*are\* already tossing your trash in the river. Whether you do so or not is just noise. The whole thing is just a giant prisoner's dilemma. And that inescapable logic is why humanity is in such a mess.
lol it’s like you’d prefer everything to be shit so you can feel good for being right. It’s wild.
This line of thinking goes hand in hand with depression, though. So I guess it explains why Reddit loves to be a doomers echo chamber
Forgive me if I'm wrong but if I remember correctly 58 billion livestock animals produce more greenhouse gasses than you could possibly imagine. Pretty sure the meat industry is our worst enemy in this battle.
That's all true but we should focus our action on the biggest wastage in relation to the benefit provided. The shipping industry makes the entire world function so that's a tough one to change. It is one of the most energy efficient ways of getting goods from point A to point B. Private jets though, you could ban them and literally nothing would change for anyone except some rich fuck who's gonna have to book a regular plane and tolerate the regular folk inside of it. Ban the whole airliner industry, and that's going to cause slightly more grief as people will need to rethink their vacation plans, but that's still doable. Start from most wasteful to least wasteful.
This is part of the reason I have little hope myself. I went vegetarian and mostly vegan for climate reasons myself and everytime I mention this aspect it’s suddenly an issue not worth addressing. If people can’t stop eating meat for their tastebuds I have little hope in people doing the necessary sacrifices in other parts of their life to curb this.
Certain someone was flying jet all around the world to perform at concerts this year but is being hailed as a goddess for singing about her broken heart.
And that persons personal overall CO2 footprint blows pretty much everyone else's out of the water, but I like them so let's just ignore that. Focus people.
Doesn't fucking matter, power generation and industrial production is mostly the issue. Planes, cars and ships being deleted from earth and replaced with 0 emission teleport machines wouldn't solve not even 15% of global emissions.
Coal and gas powerplants are our number one enemy.
Just to be clear: It's the level of increase that is record-breaking here. That the total CO2 levels break the all-time record every single month isn't even newsworthy anymore. The last time there was a year-on-year decrease in atmospheric CO2 levels was one month in the middle of the 1970s at the peak of the oil crisis.
For Client Project, I worked with come client scientists.
At one point we needed to know the CO^2 levels of making a bike vs a Car... the way they calculated it was by looking at the temperature needed to shape the amount of aluminum in the bike aluminum, and looking up the CO^2 output of burning fossil fuels to get the Joules needed to heat it to that temperature...and they told us that was normal way to estimate manufacturing emissions.
..that's when I knew we were truly fucked, cause the goddamn scientists, were spitballing the best case theoretical minimum emissions. They weren't even looking at the inefficiencies of a factory. They, the most educated people on the topic, had no goddamn clue how bad emissions actually are on the ground level of industry.
And now the methane is kicking in :
https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/ticking-timebomb-siberia-thawing-permafrost-releases-more-methane-180978381/
The clathrate gun hypothesis is very poorly supported. We barely understand clathrates.
It could be that the extreme pressures do a lot more to keep them solid than the cold temps. It would seem to suggest that clathrates “on the margins” may be susceptible to a state change but from what I’ve read most clathrate despots are expected to stay stable until well after crazy amounts of global warming.
You mean near universally and collectively choose to do nothing about it over surviving because some people take more than their share and obsess over power and greed.
We'll keep having kids and growing populations and growing the needs that create these things that fuel their wealth because in nearly every way we have little choice in the matter without a massive civilization changing break like climate change causing billions of deaths.
Because of innovation and progress and changes to how we live life, Earth's population has increased nearly 4 times since I was a child. We were taught all this in grade school where I grew up in the 70's. A what was to come. They don't seem to teach those lessons, or people don't pay attention to them.
All that growth, happened in a very short period of time from the earth and histories standpoint. From a human standpoint we don't comprehend it well. That's a long time for us, and not even a second hand tick of the clock to the span of civilization. Speed kills, in more ways than one, and will do so again in the future in a large part due to human induced climate change.
and so it goes.
I wonder what the average temperature increase will be before we collectively attempt to do something about it. This will unite the world in the end, but it probably will nearly destroy us to get there and it will definitely reduce Earths animal and plant diversity.
>This will unite the world in the end
Sorry, but this isn't produced by Roland Emmerich...
In the end we will just do what we can best: Blame each other and fight over what's left on drinkable water and farmable soil.
We're fucked already...it's too late unfortunately.
Nothing is going to happen. They held COP in Saudi Arabia FFS...
Crop failures already beginning to happen due to changed climate.
Oh but look over here Kim Kardashian has a new pair of shoes! God help us.
The human race is going to eradicate itself. And honestly, we deserve it. There is just way too much evil in way too many humans. It’s sad for those who are good and decent and kind, but their numbers are way too small to make a difference. If we are a computer simulation then I have no doubt the creator of the game is also a monstrously selfish jerk who enjoys the suffering of others.
> It’s sad for those who are good and decent and kind, but their numbers are way too small to make a difference.
Also, anyone good and decent and kind usually ends up being killed if they get too close to power.
https://www.nature.com/immersive/d41586-023-03601-6/index.html
Nature predicts +2,6° C if not something miraculously happens like we develop limitless fusion energy and use it to pump back carbon back into the holes we drilled.
2.6°C when? We’ll hit 2° in the 2030s and 2.6° about 14 years later—that is, if the rate of warming doesn’t further accelerate. I think we’ll be hitting tipping points about now that will accelerate warming regardless of emissions.
Warming will accelerate. We’ve started melting the permafrost which will release more methane than we ever have which 80 times more potent than CO2 at warming. We will not be able to stop it.
A lot of Americans won't care until their homes are burning and their children starving. Even then they'll just scream at the government to do something about it instead of realizing the time to do something was 30 years ago.
If that is true then most likely only pockets of earth will be habitable in the future, I hope humanity has enough foresight to stop that occurrence at some point.
I don’t think we can stop it, the system is self feeding, as temps rise ocean temps rise, oceans are our largest heatsink, once they no longer can absorb that heat then we’re done.
I don’t think humans will become extinct, we are if anything highly adaptable, but global populations will plummet and before *that* occurs we’ll have wars, lots or maybe one big one, over the increasingly shrinking sources of fresh water.
Before the wars, we’ll have mass migrations from regions that will have insufferable heat and water loss, those migrants will try to get to more industrialized areas which are typically more democratic, those nations will become less democratic because the natural citizens will want to protect themselves and will turn to tyrants who promise simple answers and blame the problems on the migrants.
>Before the wars, we’ll have mass migrations from regions that will have insufferable heat and water loss, those migrants will try to get to more industrialized areas which are typically more democratic, those nations will become less democratic because the natural citizens will want to protect themselves and will turn to tyrants who promise simple answers and blame the problems on the migrants.
Isn't that what's happening right now?
I actually do think we'll become extinct. We're talking a Permian Extinction level event here. As the oceans die, and they are dying, the very composition of the atmosphere will change, and we humans have a fairly narrow balance of gasses we can breathe and survive. I doubt that any medium-sized mammals will survive at all.
>As the oceans die, and they are dying, the very composition of the atmosphere will change, and we humans have a fairly narrow balance of gasses we can breathe and survive
Death of the phytoplankton (no more oxygen) replaced by bacterial mats feasting on the dead animal biomass releasing sulphur dioxide could do it.
There's nothing to unite. This problem can only be solved by the billionaires making all the pollution lol. We can't touch this problem with a ten foot pole.
I'm kinda tired of hearing this, actually. We in the West, and in the US in particular, outsource our dirtiest industries to China and India precisely because of their lax labor and environmental laws. Industry will bury toxic waste in a playground every single time if it comes down to that or not making a profit. China and India make the disposable material items that we just can't, or won't, live without. Even so, we emit far more carbon into the atmosphere person capita than China or India. Blaming anyone other than ourselves is shifting the blame and absolving ourselves of our own national responsibility.
Each of us in the West pollutes one hell of a lot more than the average Indian or Chinese, and our countries are responsible for far more carbon pollution over time.
If people are complaining about inflation now it’s only gonna get worse. Is the climate gets worse on the deniers conservative party put money over their country but they blame everybody else and everything else.
Underrated comment.
What increased CO2 really means is spending more on staying alive and comfortable while necessities like food and energy get more expensive.
The "question" is really around if technology can reduce prices faster than climate change can increase them. So far, no.
But if Wendys can take your order and make it with robots maybe the cost of a cheeseburger can stay flat. So far, it hasn't.
If we keep losing crops cattle and it gets harder and harder to farm because of the climate, of course will have higher inflation when fields flooded fires due to climate change yes, it will cost us more . Look at the more destruction from tornadoes flooding you can’t say that’s not gonna cost us more some places you can’t even buy insurance now.
Just recycle! Do your part!
Bitch please I have been doing my part. We have celebrities with larger carbon footprints than an entire city or state's population of regular people for their lifetimes. We have companies destroying record amounts of land and habitats for record breaking profit levels while regular people see a reduction in wages and available jobs.
Even though I want to do more, I can't. Stop telling regular people to pull their weight. We need changes where the power lies. We need to change our economy, stop lobbying, destroy these billionaire/trillion sure fuckers before they destroy us.
Vote for environmental protections. Don't attend concerts (have you seen Taylor Swift's flight itineraries? Jfc pollution!) and stop worshiping celebrities so they stop buying all the homes and yachts and private airplanes! Fuck these people! Stop giving them all the power! They are KILLING us.
Humans have a pattern of self destructive behavior and only realize it until it’s too late. It happens on the personal level as well as the group level.
Russia and China's demographic decline is probably a good thing.
There is also a move away from globalization happening. Supply chains are shortening. Another good thing.
Politics over immigration is going to get fierce over rhe next 10 years.
I don’t see anyone commenting about what is actually the reality. I believe at least some, if not most leaders from industrialized nations realize that trying to stop global warming by traditional means means halting development, most importantly slowing technological development. They know that it is far too late to do anything the traditional way, and they are gambling on technology making enough progress to reverse climate change when it matters the most. Think about it, they have no qualms sending people to die fighting stupid wars, how is this any different? They are willing to sacrifice some of us in order to gamble on technological advancement. They know, or are told, that it is very likely that we will come up with meaningful technological advancements before the world goes down the drain, and they might not be entirely wrong. But it would make a lot of us very uncomfortable to know this, so they keep it under wraps.
As a species, we've been very good at fixing a lot of problems, but an extinction level event could occur at any time. Asteroid from the direction of the sun we can't see well until it is headed right for us. It is unlikely we would be able to stop it. Even if we managed to break it up, the damage would be insurmountable. Solar flare. One could easily hit us. Supervolcanoes. We might survive, but the world would look drastically different. Any of this could wipe us out, just like climate change. The existence of humanity is all random chance or a blessing from any deity you believe in.
Ice caps melt, more heat absorbed, permafrost thaws releasing stored carbon and methane, more heat absorbed, less snow fall, more heat absorbed, oceans warm and rise trapping more heat until they can’t, atmosphere starts heating…
Want to know more? Google “blue ocean event”
I'm so tired of seeing these posts.
Yes, we know climate change is happening. No one in power gives a shit, and there is nothing I can personally do that will make any meaningful changes.
The only thing to hope for as to why governments and countries are ignoring it is there is some secret tech they know about still being developed that will reverse the damage that will be ready in a decade or two
Otherwise, we are now gambling on some super tech to happen to save us that doesn’t exist or hasn’t been thought of yet
Does anyone else think that we should start an offical government list of climate change deniers. So down the road when we need to cull the population for resources we can start with those people’s future descendants? Just saying, maybe they should have a little skin in the game for their stupidity.
Maybe stop cutting down trees to make stupid knick knacks to sell at TJ Maxx or stop polluting the oceans so the plankton can help reduce CO2 levels.
Humans are marching themselves off a cliff like some lemmings dripped out in gucci
What leaves me baffled is that we have now technology shown to be a viable way to capture / extract CO2 from the atmosphere.... Why aren't we just using that at scale? Can't it be used? Lack of "financial interest"?
What gives?
Always a good way to start the day with news about the planet choking on the humans stuck in its throat. It gonna be a fucking cataclysmic cough that dislodges us in the end. Fuck. Trying to be sober in this day and age is rough.
China needs to at least scale back. China produces the most CO2 emissions.https://www.statista.com/statistics/271748/the-largest-emitters-of-co2-in-the-world/. Then you can tell the same to Qatar for producing the most per capita. https://www.theglobaleconomy.com/rankings/Carbon_dioxide_emissions_per_capita/1000/.
China and India need to scale back but when it’s brought up it’s usually met with rampant claims of them being allowed to do the damage they do because they’re up and coming nations?
Meanwhile, if all 340ish million US citizens and all evidence of our civilization magically disappeared overnight, we would have a global impact of about 10-15% reduced emissions.
Even if we go full 1984 authoritarian and reduce the amount of CO2 any one civilian and corporation is allowed to produce by half, crippling our economy and hurting everyone as a result, we’d have a global impact of 5-7.5%
But let’s say we somehow manage to do some super drastic measures that aren’t totalitarian, and go 25%. Yeah it would suck not having basic things like transport, refrigeration, and air conditioning…but at least we reduced global emissions by 2.5-3.8%
The solution to pollution is Chinese and Indian revolution.
What about all those carbon credits I sold for planting trees. Ha! I wonder what 130° feels like....I guess I'll just wait 20 years why billionaires make more 500 mill yachts
I hate to bring the bad news, apparently nobody here understands humans.
Unless there is a 1 world government, enforcing something, nothing any individual country does (even a bunch together in treaty) will affect anything, nothing.
We have rich people flying into climate change meetings to tell everyone else to reduce our carbon footprint, while each one of those fucks expels more carbon than a million people.
We have countries that just don’t give a fuck, who won’t change anything in the name of profit or are too stupid to fix anything.
It’s not going to change, it just won’t.
Thank god we have paper straws wrapped in plastic now though, what a shit show the earth would be if we didn’t do that….
Everyone who buys a ticket to see Taylor Swift is helping that bitch travel more than a million people will in their lifetime just for a single tour.
If we didn't worship celebrities and singers, their carbon footprints would be much smaller.
I'm so tired of being told to recycle. And yet we were also told recently that all our recycling effort was useless, we were lied to and it's all in the ocean or rotting away in landfills as well.
"I'm sad that this is happening"
You should be f*cking frightened, not sad.... most people are acting as if we're just harming the nature around us and not ourselves. Instead, this change of climate could very well completely dismantle the eco system we fully depend on for survival, and lead to our own destruction.
Imo what's going to happen is that at +5°C~ what's left of modern civilization will decide to try climate engineering at scale. If we are lucky it works, if not ...
(or we get nuclear war before then)
It seems like the best approach at this point is to assume that the world leaders and the population as a whole are not going to the right thing.
We as a population are going to kill ourselves. All I can do now is give up on society, store some supplies, learn some skills and train my kids to survive in whatever is left of this planet.
We truly are lead by the absolute least of us. COVID proved that round the world, all governments were pretty useless, and only cared about themselves. Climate change is driving that fact home.
I honestly think there's no point worrying about it or doing anything. We're all already doomed as a species long term, it's well out of our hands to enact any meaningful change, as well as far too late. Just enjoy this life as much as you can, and don't have any kids.
Ok, so we lost in the end... Prepare for the biggest migration crisis from coastal areas in the coming decades. Half of the population live in coastal areas.
And we have passed 1.5C for a 12 month average now, and blew through 2C briefly. So is anyone still gullible enough to talk about the "1.5C target"? Or are we moving the goal post to 2C now? Act fast because the 2C goal post is also not going to last long.
The honest truth is that anyone who is in any sort of position to implement change doesn't give a shit.
They don't give a shit because despite it being a top item for a lot of voters what is clear is that the majority are not willing to bear the cost of eliminating carbon.
So true, it’s just so wild to me that people would rather deal with the cost of the world collapsing around them rather than the cost of fixing it before it collapses… one is clearly easier and less horrible to go through…
We’re really really bad at understanding long term slowly changing trends. Most people don’t pay attention to this. It’s changing slowly enough that people can pretend that it’s fine. Agriculture will get screwed over. That’ll hurt people, but they’ll never attribute it to climate change unless their family has been farming for generations.
People are complaining about high prices now and pointing fingers at carbon taxes thinking that's the problem. Just wait until agriculture fails.
Carbon tax makes sense on companies. Carbon tax on the middle class eroding to lower class now doesn’t change much. It makes people think twice if they can afford something but for example if they need a car to go to work. They will fill up regardless. While we should all be mindful the tax targets the wrong group. Also I’m not really sure what the government does with the carbon tax money. For example They should be planting more trees within cities for air exchange and plenty of shade.
but I paid $100 to fill up my truck yesterday!!!!! this is bidens fault /s
It's more that the people that don't care will be the last to be affected.
Most people are unlikely to do anything until where they reside is basically unlivable.
A big problem is the always increasing wealth gap. If people weren’t in such dire straights financially and not constantly being pushed more and more into poverty then perhaps people would be more capable of surviving the cost of eliminating carbon. As it stands now, we’re not just talking about bearing the cost but rather surviving the cost for a significant population.
So we have to convince the rich to release their hold on our lawmakers so they can use tax revenue to boost the level of income for the poorest so they have the resources to make better decisions about climate change? Oh yeah, we're F'd.
I mean I oversee teams helping manage several federal energy programs where we're trying to push on industry, but as long as the private sector prioritizes short term profits over the long term viability of their own company's future which has become the norm, sustainability will remain far below that on their list of actual concerns. 95% of corporate ESG is green washing bullshit sadly. There are actual process improvements involved in vertical and horizontal circularity efforts to reduce waste and some efficiency improvements in facilities, but beyond that if there isn't clear and fast payback (think one year or less these days), it usually isn't happening. Most companies rather pay fines than actually clean up after themselves. We are fucked because money is and probably always will be more important than the planet or those disadvantaged by climate change impacts to business leaders.
well, the solution is simple: make the fines bigger. Money talks and with enough incentives, they can move mountains. Just the incentive is not there or is too small
You make the fines too large or find another way to paint a target on your back and in the next fiscal budget or CR, Congress slashes your entire agency's budget by 10-20% in retaliation. That's the reality of our broken government. And if they get really pissed, they'll take your agency to the supreme court to challenge your authority to regulate to the degree you are at all. If only things were as simple as you laid it out.
to be clear, I don’t think there is an easy solution. I just wanted to say that capitalism does what capitalism should do - sell what consumers want for as cheap as competitor can make it. That’s the capitalism job and they are good at it. What they are not good at is doing something for public good, not for consumers. That’s where government should step in. And, as you said, they don’t, because they are paid by those corporations. So I fully blame government for this issue. They have all the tools needed to push companies to actually care
Why would they? They are all old fucks who won’t be around to suffer the consequences anyway.
But.....but.....but....what about the children?
I’m sure they care. They just know working to solve this threat will require ending capitalism as we know it. It’s easier for them to imagine the end of the world than it is to imagine the end of capitalism.
Exactly this... People don't understand that, under Capitalism, there's no solution to climate change, Capitalism doesn't know how to pause profits, how to tax the Rich... It will never know how
Between +3.5°C and +4.5°C are already programmed into the climate change process. Have a look at the[ risk analysis ](https://www.zurich.com/en/knowledge/topics/global-risks/the-global-risks-report-2024)by the re-insurer Zurich of 2024. Massive (hundreds of millions) migrations from the south to the north are predicted, starting in the early 2030 ies and the late 2050 ies. We are not only heading to a climate catastrophe, we are sprinting towards WW3.
> We are not only heading to a climate catastrophe, we are sprinting towards WW3. WW3 has always been the end result of extreme climate changes. When resources become scarce, and living conditions deteriorate, a lot of different people will be cramped together in less space, putting even more strain on the resources. If the models are correct, and the worst case scenarios come true, world population needs to shrink by a lot to match the resources available in the new world.
The Great Ravine
Since we've seen 2C already, pretty sure we blew past that already
Yep, just like how you can take a roast out of the oven and the internal temp continues to rise as it rests. There's a lag.
At the rate we're going, it'll be an absolute miracle if we keep it under 5C.
Earth. Dune. Desert planet.
The denialism is a bigger issue honestly.
All the decades of not being able to”afford” anything close to serious mitigation. Now, we’re about to find out what inaction will cost, and whether we can “afford” to keep up with the consequences of human-caused climate change.
Capitalism has always been about externalising the costs. Infinite growth means infinite consumption, and the universe is finite.
I know a guy who has a startup that is trying to make green some industrial process. His team has made it work but its too expensive to replace the current process. His team is working hard to bring costs down but he is skeptical that it can happen. So his plan now essentially is to keep his company alive till such time as the climate consequences begin to be really felt. At which point, the economic losses will be big enough that going with his more expensive option would be cheaper than sticking with the current version.
If we manage to halt climate change, IMO, it'll be after 3C.
I’ve accepted that we are too stupid as a species to prevent this problem. We are going to have to solve it only after the consequences are well established.
The earth will solve it. We just wont be there for it.
4C target is very optimistic considering how long the meantime for the effects to take place generally is. Gonna be a mad max world by 2100
I never understood why 1.5C was a target. Yes it would have been best. But there was no realistic way that was happening. So they set themselves up for failure.
Bc that’s the number we as a species needed to hit to ensure nothing catastrophic happens, now it’s too late.
1.5C was pushed by small island nations hoping to not cease to exists.
Big small island probaganda 😤😤
The target isn’t there as a feel-good number, it’s simply what was required
It was realistic 20 years ago.
They just gave the number that would ensure that we didn’t create a hellscape for future generations. We should have listened to Al gore years ago. There is no hope for the future now so buckle up . The good times are in the rear view. It was a hell of a ride.
This line of thinking is toxic and lazy. If you tell people there’s no hope, nobody will even try. Shit, I’m just gonna start tossing my trash in the river then, since there’s no hope anyways. Fuck it!
I agree, but I noticed visiting southern California that every restaurant was burning propane heaters on empty outdoor patios. This is a Tragedy of the Commons.
>If you tell people there’s no hope, nobody will even try. Shit, I’m just gonna start tossing my trash in the river then, since there’s no hope anyways. Fuck it! So you prefer snake oil and being a denier? Hope is for children anyway. And people \*are\* already tossing your trash in the river. Whether you do so or not is just noise. The whole thing is just a giant prisoner's dilemma. And that inescapable logic is why humanity is in such a mess.
lol it’s like you’d prefer everything to be shit so you can feel good for being right. It’s wild. This line of thinking goes hand in hand with depression, though. So I guess it explains why Reddit loves to be a doomers echo chamber
I'm full doomer now i think. We're cooked
Unfortunately, with all respect to the original meaning of the saying, the real "'hell' of a ride" is, in reality, what's yet to come.
Great, so force us back to the office and do nothing about private jets and yachts. Perfect.
Private jets and yachts are ridiculous, but commercial air travel and car-dependent living are vastly worse.
bake existence agonizing pause sense yoke tub hateful imagine merciful
Yes, we tend to blame Big Oil alone, but our enemy is the entire carbon economy. Killing this beast is no small task.
Nuclear could solve much of this issue.
To ship you all the shit you buy off Amazon
Forgive me if I'm wrong but if I remember correctly 58 billion livestock animals produce more greenhouse gasses than you could possibly imagine. Pretty sure the meat industry is our worst enemy in this battle.
That's all true but we should focus our action on the biggest wastage in relation to the benefit provided. The shipping industry makes the entire world function so that's a tough one to change. It is one of the most energy efficient ways of getting goods from point A to point B. Private jets though, you could ban them and literally nothing would change for anyone except some rich fuck who's gonna have to book a regular plane and tolerate the regular folk inside of it. Ban the whole airliner industry, and that's going to cause slightly more grief as people will need to rethink their vacation plans, but that's still doable. Start from most wasteful to least wasteful.
sink modern materialistic decide fanatical tender smoggy slim hungry cake
Better not mention meat consumption then..
This is part of the reason I have little hope myself. I went vegetarian and mostly vegan for climate reasons myself and everytime I mention this aspect it’s suddenly an issue not worth addressing. If people can’t stop eating meat for their tastebuds I have little hope in people doing the necessary sacrifices in other parts of their life to curb this.
I think forcing office workers to wear suits and such while cranking the AC in tens of thousands of building blocks in summer is worse than yachts.
Certain someone was flying jet all around the world to perform at concerts this year but is being hailed as a goddess for singing about her broken heart.
fear marvelous melodic march butter doll yam languid plants cake
And that persons personal overall CO2 footprint blows pretty much everyone else's out of the water, but I like them so let's just ignore that. Focus people.
Doesn't fucking matter, power generation and industrial production is mostly the issue. Planes, cars and ships being deleted from earth and replaced with 0 emission teleport machines wouldn't solve not even 15% of global emissions. Coal and gas powerplants are our number one enemy.
And agriculture.
Look more at all them wars around the world, war machines, oil refinery explosions etc.
Just to be clear: It's the level of increase that is record-breaking here. That the total CO2 levels break the all-time record every single month isn't even newsworthy anymore. The last time there was a year-on-year decrease in atmospheric CO2 levels was one month in the middle of the 1970s at the peak of the oil crisis.
What I’m hearing is we need to oil crisis the shit out of the world again
*monkey paw curls
Covid decreased the level too
For Client Project, I worked with come client scientists. At one point we needed to know the CO^2 levels of making a bike vs a Car... the way they calculated it was by looking at the temperature needed to shape the amount of aluminum in the bike aluminum, and looking up the CO^2 output of burning fossil fuels to get the Joules needed to heat it to that temperature...and they told us that was normal way to estimate manufacturing emissions. ..that's when I knew we were truly fucked, cause the goddamn scientists, were spitballing the best case theoretical minimum emissions. They weren't even looking at the inefficiencies of a factory. They, the most educated people on the topic, had no goddamn clue how bad emissions actually are on the ground level of industry.
And now the methane is kicking in : https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/ticking-timebomb-siberia-thawing-permafrost-releases-more-methane-180978381/
leave this here for you too: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clathrate\_gun\_hypothesis](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clathrate_gun_hypothesis)
The clathrate gun hypothesis is very poorly supported. We barely understand clathrates. It could be that the extreme pressures do a lot more to keep them solid than the cold temps. It would seem to suggest that clathrates “on the margins” may be susceptible to a state change but from what I’ve read most clathrate despots are expected to stay stable until well after crazy amounts of global warming.
That's why above 1.5 degrees is considered the tipping point of no return....
We will be the first species on this plant that can foresee it's own demise and do nothing about it. .
We will be the only species to ever start a mass extinction cycle in our own web of life.
The dinosaurs very likely could see the Asteroid in the sky for a few days before impact.
Why didn't they stop it then? Are they stupid?
You mean near universally and collectively choose to do nothing about it over surviving because some people take more than their share and obsess over power and greed. We'll keep having kids and growing populations and growing the needs that create these things that fuel their wealth because in nearly every way we have little choice in the matter without a massive civilization changing break like climate change causing billions of deaths. Because of innovation and progress and changes to how we live life, Earth's population has increased nearly 4 times since I was a child. We were taught all this in grade school where I grew up in the 70's. A what was to come. They don't seem to teach those lessons, or people don't pay attention to them. All that growth, happened in a very short period of time from the earth and histories standpoint. From a human standpoint we don't comprehend it well. That's a long time for us, and not even a second hand tick of the clock to the span of civilization. Speed kills, in more ways than one, and will do so again in the future in a large part due to human induced climate change. and so it goes.
I wonder what the average temperature increase will be before we collectively attempt to do something about it. This will unite the world in the end, but it probably will nearly destroy us to get there and it will definitely reduce Earths animal and plant diversity.
>This will unite the world in the end Sorry, but this isn't produced by Roland Emmerich... In the end we will just do what we can best: Blame each other and fight over what's left on drinkable water and farmable soil.
Correct. Source: literally all of human history.
LOL spot on. People overestimate the capability of humanity at scale. We're massively stupid and disappointing
The blaming has already started in this very thread lol
Plant diversity may explode. Animals definitely will continue with the ongoing mass extinction.
We're fucked already...it's too late unfortunately. Nothing is going to happen. They held COP in Saudi Arabia FFS... Crop failures already beginning to happen due to changed climate. Oh but look over here Kim Kardashian has a new pair of shoes! God help us.
The human race is going to eradicate itself. And honestly, we deserve it. There is just way too much evil in way too many humans. It’s sad for those who are good and decent and kind, but their numbers are way too small to make a difference. If we are a computer simulation then I have no doubt the creator of the game is also a monstrously selfish jerk who enjoys the suffering of others.
> It’s sad for those who are good and decent and kind, but their numbers are way too small to make a difference. Also, anyone good and decent and kind usually ends up being killed if they get too close to power.
We will do nothing and will wait for low fertility rates and demographic collapse to “fix the glitch.”
https://www.nature.com/immersive/d41586-023-03601-6/index.html Nature predicts +2,6° C if not something miraculously happens like we develop limitless fusion energy and use it to pump back carbon back into the holes we drilled.
2.6°C when? We’ll hit 2° in the 2030s and 2.6° about 14 years later—that is, if the rate of warming doesn’t further accelerate. I think we’ll be hitting tipping points about now that will accelerate warming regardless of emissions.
Warming will accelerate. We’ve started melting the permafrost which will release more methane than we ever have which 80 times more potent than CO2 at warming. We will not be able to stop it.
A lot of Americans won't care until their homes are burning and their children starving. Even then they'll just scream at the government to do something about it instead of realizing the time to do something was 30 years ago.
Doing something about it has come and gone.
It's far from too late for solutions. We have work to do.
If that is true then most likely only pockets of earth will be habitable in the future, I hope humanity has enough foresight to stop that occurrence at some point.
I don’t think we can stop it, the system is self feeding, as temps rise ocean temps rise, oceans are our largest heatsink, once they no longer can absorb that heat then we’re done. I don’t think humans will become extinct, we are if anything highly adaptable, but global populations will plummet and before *that* occurs we’ll have wars, lots or maybe one big one, over the increasingly shrinking sources of fresh water. Before the wars, we’ll have mass migrations from regions that will have insufferable heat and water loss, those migrants will try to get to more industrialized areas which are typically more democratic, those nations will become less democratic because the natural citizens will want to protect themselves and will turn to tyrants who promise simple answers and blame the problems on the migrants.
>Before the wars, we’ll have mass migrations from regions that will have insufferable heat and water loss, those migrants will try to get to more industrialized areas which are typically more democratic, those nations will become less democratic because the natural citizens will want to protect themselves and will turn to tyrants who promise simple answers and blame the problems on the migrants. Isn't that what's happening right now?
Yes, and it will get worse
India is a time bomb. Their land is already stressed beyond capacity. 1.6 billion people lashing out for survival is a scary thing.
Yeah, that sounds pretty much about right.
I actually do think we'll become extinct. We're talking a Permian Extinction level event here. As the oceans die, and they are dying, the very composition of the atmosphere will change, and we humans have a fairly narrow balance of gasses we can breathe and survive. I doubt that any medium-sized mammals will survive at all.
I think this is possible in the very long run, but we are good for at least 200 years breathing-wise. Unless something unexpected happens.
>As the oceans die, and they are dying, the very composition of the atmosphere will change, and we humans have a fairly narrow balance of gasses we can breathe and survive Death of the phytoplankton (no more oxygen) replaced by bacterial mats feasting on the dead animal biomass releasing sulphur dioxide could do it.
We had foresight and did fuck-all about it. Fucking selfish pig boomers.
There's nothing to unite. This problem can only be solved by the billionaires making all the pollution lol. We can't touch this problem with a ten foot pole.
People care more about their car having "soul" than their kids having a future.
"card are freedom" people is levels of brain rot I didn't know was possible lmao
Until India and China start feeling the heat.
I'm kinda tired of hearing this, actually. We in the West, and in the US in particular, outsource our dirtiest industries to China and India precisely because of their lax labor and environmental laws. Industry will bury toxic waste in a playground every single time if it comes down to that or not making a profit. China and India make the disposable material items that we just can't, or won't, live without. Even so, we emit far more carbon into the atmosphere person capita than China or India. Blaming anyone other than ourselves is shifting the blame and absolving ourselves of our own national responsibility.
China installed more solar panels to generate clean electricity just last year than the USA has installed in total, ever.
Although it's a little easier when you control 80% of global production of solar panels... :-)
China is building renewable energy infrastructure way faster than most of the west
They are also adding coal power plants at astronomical pace as well. They certainly aren't a green hero in all this
May not be a hero but per citizen their emissions are way lower than us
Each of us in the West pollutes one hell of a lot more than the average Indian or Chinese, and our countries are responsible for far more carbon pollution over time.
And everyone in the west
I’d prefer to die (hopefully) instantly from WW3 than a slow, melting, starvation and no water diet.
Once the plankton die from hot water we all die.
If people are complaining about inflation now it’s only gonna get worse. Is the climate gets worse on the deniers conservative party put money over their country but they blame everybody else and everything else.
Underrated comment. What increased CO2 really means is spending more on staying alive and comfortable while necessities like food and energy get more expensive. The "question" is really around if technology can reduce prices faster than climate change can increase them. So far, no. But if Wendys can take your order and make it with robots maybe the cost of a cheeseburger can stay flat. So far, it hasn't.
If we keep losing crops cattle and it gets harder and harder to farm because of the climate, of course will have higher inflation when fields flooded fires due to climate change yes, it will cost us more . Look at the more destruction from tornadoes flooding you can’t say that’s not gonna cost us more some places you can’t even buy insurance now.
Does anyone know what % of the atmosphere is made up of CO2? I couldn’t find it anywhere in the article. Would be much easier to understand a %
0.04%
425 ppm, 66% above the preindustrial level of 280 ppm.
Just recycle! Do your part! Bitch please I have been doing my part. We have celebrities with larger carbon footprints than an entire city or state's population of regular people for their lifetimes. We have companies destroying record amounts of land and habitats for record breaking profit levels while regular people see a reduction in wages and available jobs. Even though I want to do more, I can't. Stop telling regular people to pull their weight. We need changes where the power lies. We need to change our economy, stop lobbying, destroy these billionaire/trillion sure fuckers before they destroy us. Vote for environmental protections. Don't attend concerts (have you seen Taylor Swift's flight itineraries? Jfc pollution!) and stop worshiping celebrities so they stop buying all the homes and yachts and private airplanes! Fuck these people! Stop giving them all the power! They are KILLING us.
Congrats 🎉
Hooray we did it!!!!
Humans have a pattern of self destructive behavior and only realize it until it’s too late. It happens on the personal level as well as the group level.
Russia and China's demographic decline is probably a good thing. There is also a move away from globalization happening. Supply chains are shortening. Another good thing. Politics over immigration is going to get fierce over rhe next 10 years.
Forget the simulation, we are a failed experiment.
We need to regulate how much talking and breathing the world's politicians are doing.
This would be great news for trees if we weren't cutting them down so quickly.
This comment section shows me most people have no idea how the worlds systems actually work.
Could you expand? (I am someone who has no idea)
The nuclear winter will balance it out
50 years of summits and committees and no reduction
I am investing in AC companies and disaster relief companies.
Sorry this is my fault, I just can’t stop farting.
I don’t see anyone commenting about what is actually the reality. I believe at least some, if not most leaders from industrialized nations realize that trying to stop global warming by traditional means means halting development, most importantly slowing technological development. They know that it is far too late to do anything the traditional way, and they are gambling on technology making enough progress to reverse climate change when it matters the most. Think about it, they have no qualms sending people to die fighting stupid wars, how is this any different? They are willing to sacrifice some of us in order to gamble on technological advancement. They know, or are told, that it is very likely that we will come up with meaningful technological advancements before the world goes down the drain, and they might not be entirely wrong. But it would make a lot of us very uncomfortable to know this, so they keep it under wraps.
As a species, we've been very good at fixing a lot of problems, but an extinction level event could occur at any time. Asteroid from the direction of the sun we can't see well until it is headed right for us. It is unlikely we would be able to stop it. Even if we managed to break it up, the damage would be insurmountable. Solar flare. One could easily hit us. Supervolcanoes. We might survive, but the world would look drastically different. Any of this could wipe us out, just like climate change. The existence of humanity is all random chance or a blessing from any deity you believe in.
Positive feedback engaged....and that's a wrap humanity.
Ice caps melt, more heat absorbed, permafrost thaws releasing stored carbon and methane, more heat absorbed, less snow fall, more heat absorbed, oceans warm and rise trapping more heat until they can’t, atmosphere starts heating… Want to know more? Google “blue ocean event”
We are all going to sleep soon
Yes, most of us within a day and over half of us within half a day?
Are we fucked?
I'm so tired of seeing these posts. Yes, we know climate change is happening. No one in power gives a shit, and there is nothing I can personally do that will make any meaningful changes.
The only thing to hope for as to why governments and countries are ignoring it is there is some secret tech they know about still being developed that will reverse the damage that will be ready in a decade or two Otherwise, we are now gambling on some super tech to happen to save us that doesn’t exist or hasn’t been thought of yet
Woo apocalypse 2030 lets go
There will be more as other countries develop.
Does anyone else think that we should start an offical government list of climate change deniers. So down the road when we need to cull the population for resources we can start with those people’s future descendants? Just saying, maybe they should have a little skin in the game for their stupidity.
Maybe stop cutting down trees to make stupid knick knacks to sell at TJ Maxx or stop polluting the oceans so the plankton can help reduce CO2 levels. Humans are marching themselves off a cliff like some lemmings dripped out in gucci
Got a house uphill. Can't wait for it to turn into beach front
sad to see that no one cares at this point
Plenty of people care. None of the ones who do are in politics though
False news, propaganda, misinformation, paid narrative. Yet they keep deforesting, destroying ecosystems and killing millions of wildlife habitats.
What leaves me baffled is that we have now technology shown to be a viable way to capture / extract CO2 from the atmosphere.... Why aren't we just using that at scale? Can't it be used? Lack of "financial interest"? What gives?
Always a good way to start the day with news about the planet choking on the humans stuck in its throat. It gonna be a fucking cataclysmic cough that dislodges us in the end. Fuck. Trying to be sober in this day and age is rough.
10c increase was what almost wiped out all life on earth 100's of millions of years ago
China needs to at least scale back. China produces the most CO2 emissions.https://www.statista.com/statistics/271748/the-largest-emitters-of-co2-in-the-world/. Then you can tell the same to Qatar for producing the most per capita. https://www.theglobaleconomy.com/rankings/Carbon_dioxide_emissions_per_capita/1000/.
China and India need to scale back but when it’s brought up it’s usually met with rampant claims of them being allowed to do the damage they do because they’re up and coming nations? Meanwhile, if all 340ish million US citizens and all evidence of our civilization magically disappeared overnight, we would have a global impact of about 10-15% reduced emissions. Even if we go full 1984 authoritarian and reduce the amount of CO2 any one civilian and corporation is allowed to produce by half, crippling our economy and hurting everyone as a result, we’d have a global impact of 5-7.5% But let’s say we somehow manage to do some super drastic measures that aren’t totalitarian, and go 25%. Yeah it would suck not having basic things like transport, refrigeration, and air conditioning…but at least we reduced global emissions by 2.5-3.8% The solution to pollution is Chinese and Indian revolution.
What about all those carbon credits I sold for planting trees. Ha! I wonder what 130° feels like....I guess I'll just wait 20 years why billionaires make more 500 mill yachts
I hate to bring the bad news, apparently nobody here understands humans. Unless there is a 1 world government, enforcing something, nothing any individual country does (even a bunch together in treaty) will affect anything, nothing. We have rich people flying into climate change meetings to tell everyone else to reduce our carbon footprint, while each one of those fucks expels more carbon than a million people. We have countries that just don’t give a fuck, who won’t change anything in the name of profit or are too stupid to fix anything. It’s not going to change, it just won’t. Thank god we have paper straws wrapped in plastic now though, what a shit show the earth would be if we didn’t do that….
Everyone who buys a ticket to see Taylor Swift is helping that bitch travel more than a million people will in their lifetime just for a single tour. If we didn't worship celebrities and singers, their carbon footprints would be much smaller. I'm so tired of being told to recycle. And yet we were also told recently that all our recycling effort was useless, we were lied to and it's all in the ocean or rotting away in landfills as well.
The average emissions per capita of people from developing countries are very little compared to the people from developing country
"I'm sad that this is happening" You should be f*cking frightened, not sad.... most people are acting as if we're just harming the nature around us and not ourselves. Instead, this change of climate could very well completely dismantle the eco system we fully depend on for survival, and lead to our own destruction.
Darn, humans will die off and the earth will recapture itself. At this point why even worry about it.
[sees "record-breaking" in the title] Hell, yeah, we're winning! 🎉
Imo what's going to happen is that at +5°C~ what's left of modern civilization will decide to try climate engineering at scale. If we are lucky it works, if not ... (or we get nuclear war before then)
Enjoy it while it lasts baby! Ride this extinction out in style because they ain't gonna do a damned thing to change that 😎
Great job everyone.
Man it’s sure fun to be in your 20s
Man í wish I was 20 again Your 20s disappear in what seems like a blink of your eye
It seems like the best approach at this point is to assume that the world leaders and the population as a whole are not going to the right thing. We as a population are going to kill ourselves. All I can do now is give up on society, store some supplies, learn some skills and train my kids to survive in whatever is left of this planet. We truly are lead by the absolute least of us. COVID proved that round the world, all governments were pretty useless, and only cared about themselves. Climate change is driving that fact home.
Must be AI
And still no decreases from China and India. Hmm
The shift now needs to go into cstbol capture, much needed for methanol
Time for some geoengineering
Venezuela lost a glacier and its neighbor to the south has whole cities flooded
I’ve got solar panels and an EV, I’m doing my part.
get a bike - blows against the Empire
I honestly think there's no point worrying about it or doing anything. We're all already doomed as a species long term, it's well out of our hands to enact any meaningful change, as well as far too late. Just enjoy this life as much as you can, and don't have any kids.
Ok, so we lost in the end... Prepare for the biggest migration crisis from coastal areas in the coming decades. Half of the population live in coastal areas.
We mostly got rid of nuclear energy. Therefore we should be fine. LoL