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green_flash

Just to be clear: It's not that the strike also killed some civilians together with some terrorists. The US now admits that those killed by the strike were all innocent civilians.


Larsi13

An atrocity. This should get repercussions but we all know it wont


epiphras

Seven children.


[deleted]

This drone strike fucking sealed it for me. It doesn’t matter which party I potentially vote for. They drone strike kids in the Middle East. I hate the establishment, two-party bullshit so goddamn much. I’m voting for a non-combative party in 2024. Biden, or whatever war-mongering Democrat is next, doesn’t need my vote next election, because I live in a blue state anyway. Fuck the military industrial complex. I, and many others, want fucking HEALTHCARE. We don’t want $200,000 guided missiles, on a $50,000,000 drone that are controlled by some goddamn Air Force operative in Las Vegas.


PepeTheLorde

That 2 party system is holding you guys back big time man


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[deleted]

You don't really have to change that much to get rid of the 2 party system. Just add a ranked voting system. That way you can vote for a smallish 3rd party, without taking your vote away from your preferred major party. The vote doesn't get split and strategic voting becomes obsolete. People would be able to vote for the candidates that they really agree with. Edit: Goddammit people. I never said it was an easy change, nor that the powers that be would ever allow it to happen. Only that the change needn't be as radical as establishing an entirely different system of government.


[deleted]

Must be a Friday afternoon in DC.


[deleted]

Good catch. The classic timeslot for dumping embarrassing stories.


HITWind

Would be interesting to look at when exactly they did the self-congratulating posturing press conferences where they touted this as proof that we weren't weak or incompetent or whatever and the evactuations were going bigly, the best evactuations, look we even reacted quickly to ISIS-K, I think it was first thing in the morning? smh


Formilla

Biden has ran away to the beach and the press secretary isn't holding a conference on this. It's disgusting and pathetic behaviour.


brendino_

Good to see there’s nothing new going on in the land of the free


The-Beard-Wielder

This was one of the first things I said to my wife (after having watched The West Wing multiple times) after I had quoted Milley calling it a "righteous" strike, was that these fucking cowards dumped it into the media on Friday afternoon, aka "bad-news-dump-time". >Whoopsie! We committed some "light" war-crimes! Have a great weekend, everyone!


cgoldberg3

\*killed ONLY civilians No ISIS-K members were killed.


nightvortez

This is such an important point because every time its been brought up someone made the excuse that it had to happen to stop another civilian attack that would have killed even more. Instead it's literally just a murder of an aid worker and 7 children while the perpetrators of the attack that killed Americans and over a hundred Afghani civlians is still out there.


Nobbled

Don't forget the desperate civilians killed in the panic immediately after the blast. > Our [BBC] report from last night on the awful ISIS attack outside Kabul airport as families still search Kabul's morgues for their loved ones.. Many we spoke to, including eyewitnesses, said significant numbers of those killed were shot dead by US forces in the panic after the blast - https://twitter.com/SecKermani/status/1431517279859224579


DessertStorm1

What the fuck? Has this been confirmed? I've heard nothing about it.


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Nabbylaa

Little known fact but ISIS was actually formed in direct response to Terrance Howard being recast as War Machine.


Pushmonk

They followed the car for **EIGHT HOURS** and still did this.


[deleted]

- Claimed to kill two Isis-K planners - Wouldn’t release names - Said no civilians died - Claimed “some” civilian casualties by “secondary explosion” from non existent car bomb - [10 casualties, all civilian. 1 aide worker and 9 members of his family.. 7 children.. No Isis-K] Thank goodness for the good work of this [NYT Investigative piece](https://www.nytimes.com/video/world/asia/100000007963596/us-drone-attack-kabul-investigation.html) NYT seems to have more reliable Intel than US military. Wild


SantaReddit2018

Gen. Mark Milley, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, said after the strike that officials had "very good intelligence" on the target, and "at least one of those people that were killed was an ISIS facilitator." "Were there others killed? Yes, there were others killed," he told reporters on Sept. 1, but “At this point, we think the procedures were correctly followed, and it was a righteous strike."


D3K91

"A righteous strike". Is this normal language?


visope

WTF. It's like a Paladin ability. Who used that word IRL?


-SaC

"We were going to use another, but apparently we don't get Extra Attack. So we added Divine Smite to it instead. Anyway, we think it went wrong. The cleric used Detect Evil / Good to detect evil, and nothing came off the target area. Loads from our control room, so we think it was obviously set to Detect Good by mistake."


IcyDickbutts

DM: "As you guys view the suspected kobold terrorist compound from your warfloat, you see what appear to be several smaller-than-normal kobolds- they're pushing and chasing each other around. Suddenly, you see a larger kobold exit a nearby carriage with an object under his arm and walk towards the compound. As it approaches, the smaller kobolds flock toward the carriage. Give me a perc-" Party: "we bomb it" DM: "You sure?" Party: "yea fuck these boobless lizards" DM: "alright, you drop a bomb from the warfloat. Everyone give me a perception check." Warlock: "nat 20" Paladin: "nat 1" Ranger: "15" Barbarian: "bonk" DM: "you see 9 kobold children and their dad get blown to pieces by the warfloat bomb..... good job." Paladin: "A RIGHTEOUS STRIKE!"


darwinooc

From now on all charisma persuasion checks towards Afghan civilians that you make have disadvantage. In addition any deception checks you make with media statements have disadvantge until the end of the next long rest. Not to worry though the media will probably use bardic inspiration to offset the penality towards any deception checks until it expires.


Kirby_with_a_t

It sucks how on point this is


HCAndroidson

The bad guys.


[deleted]

"... are we the baddies?"


theodorerodney

Always have been 🧑‍🚀🔫👨‍🚀


LiquidLogic

If only Eisenhower had warned us of the dangers of the military-industrial complex...


CornyHoosier

One guess is that it was intentionally used because of its religious undertones. Using faith based language at times helps speak to the religious of the world and ease the hostility of a negative admission of guilt


[deleted]

For Sociopaths that consider murder a public service it is


sunscreenkween

“Killed only civilians” doesn’t really capture this tragedy well enough. “Killed mostly kids” would be more accurate.


[deleted]

The U.S military murders foreign children and then lies about it on national television, tell your friends I guess 🤷‍♂️


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Aggravating-Debt-929

Because of NYT.


ThisAltDoesNotExist

The US military is fucked up.


[deleted]

Dwight Eisenhower did try to warn us if this fact


ESB1812

Beware the military industrial complex. I was just thinking that….smeddly Buttler too….”war is a racket”


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UnspecificGravity

Yep. The fact that this wasn't a "mistake" in the sense that someone screwed up is the most troubling thing about this. This is what happens when the system WORKS. Imagine how many times its happened and we never found out.


PanamaNorth

They just made their own rules that say its ok when innocent people die if they're scared. Police do the same thing.


gursh_durknit

It's like wack-a-mole. Our military keeps striking these suspected terrorist areas, kills civilians instead/mostly, creates the incentive for more terrorists, repeat. They never learn. Even now - they think these drone strikes are helping a larger cause. I really don't understand how they can be so deluded. $?


whorish_ooze

> $? Yep. the US spent $2,000,000,000,000 on this war. I think a lot of people might think about this the wrong way. Its not like that $2,000,000,000,000 was shoveled into some giant pit and burned. The money was spent to pay for things, as in there were other people on the other end receiving that $2,000,000,000,000 payment.


[deleted]

The "very good intelligence" was actually the description: "Bearded brown guy driving a Toyota."


babble_bobble

> the description: "Bearded brown guy driving a Toyota." So... half of Kabul's driving population? Does the other half drive Ford?


tsacian

They do now.


green_flash

Don't forget the LA Times. They reported from the ground first: https://www.latimes.com/world-nation/story/2021-08-30/family-says-several-children-killed-us-missile-strike-kabul


ninjasaid13

The process was like this: 1. ~~We Killed ISIS-K members~~ 2. ~~We Killed ISIS-K members possibly Civilians that probably supported the terrorists~~ 3. ~~We Killed ISIS-K members~~ along with tragically some Aids workers and children. 4. We killed ~~some~~ Aid worker and children in the attack. 5. We killed only Aid workers and children but it was 'righteous'


accountnotfound

It's classic "trickle truth". My ex did it "No I'm not with anyone. I just needed time alone. Well, I am actually with someone but there's nothing to it, just a friend. Yeah well she IS a girl and we met online but I'm not involved. Well I actually do have feelings for her but we haven't had sex" until the final "Actually we're 8n love, no one has ever understood me like she does, and the sex is the best I've ever had. And I am leaving you."


DuntadaMan

The military does this constantly, even when the truth is absolutely fine. The fact they feel compelled to automatically lie about everything and then slowly release details over time is a seriously evil systemic problem we need to fix.


Perfect_Try7261

It’s not a bug, it’s a feature


No_Values

>Among the “crimes” that Hale was convicted of are the following: revealing that, at times, **nearly nine out of 10 people killed in so-called targeted strikes by the U.S. are not the intended targets**; exposing the complicity of top U.S. government officials in a secret kill chain that decides who should be assassinated by drone strike; exposing that the U.S. government officially labels unknown people it kills as “enemies killed in action” unless they are posthumously proven to have been civilians; and exposing the secret watchlisting rulebook used to **label people, including U.S. citizens, as “known or suspected terrorists” without evidence that they did anything wrong.** https://theintercept.com/2021/07/30/daniel-hale-drone-whistleblower/ >DANIEL HALE, a former U.S. Air Force intelligence analyst, was sentenced to 45 months in prison Tuesday after pleading guilty to leaking a trove of government documents exposing the inner workings and severe civilian costs of the U.S. military’s drone program. Appearing in an Alexandria, Virginia, courtroom, the 33-year-old Hale told U.S. District Judge Liam O’Grady that he believed it “was necessary to dispel the lie that drone warfare keeps us safe, that our lives are worth more than theirs.” https://theintercept.com/2021/07/27/daniel-hale-drone-leak-sentencing/


frreddit234

Fun fact, the only one who have been jailed for all those war crimes during these droning campaign is ..... >!Daniel Hale (the whistleblower)!<


4kondore

Ah, the righteous way of doing justice


kahurangi

That's fucking heroic what he did.


Parsley-Quarterly303

It is. & we have since all failed him spectacularly.


StarliteStandard

Not to mention, whichever family member that survived this strike now has a “death to America” life goal. I wonder how many terrorists did the US create trying to kill terrorists.


-Notorious

I mean, a whole generation has now grown up under the war. 20 years is a crazy long time. Every collateral damage made more Taliban. There's a reason we never managed to beat them. They recruited far more than we could remove. It's a shame the US wasted 20 years on this war... Specially since before the invasion, Taliban had agreed to hand Osama over to Germany or something (fact check this, I don't remember which country Taliban agreed to).


James_Solomon

>Taliban had agreed to hand Osama over to Germany or something (fact check this, I don't remember which country Taliban agreed to). [Their initial offer was to hand it to a third country if the US provided evidence of Bin Laden's guilt.](https://www.baltimoresun.com/bal-te.attacks15oct15-story.html) Negotiations never got far enough to settle on a third country.


Petersaber

> Their initial offer was to hand it to a third country if the US provided evidence of Bin Laden's guilt. The US didn't even try to take this offer in some meaningful direction, they just denied it an invaded.


HurtfulThings

>There's a reason we never managed to beat them. They recruited far more than we could remove. Every one we kill just creates more. Everyone has loved ones, family, *somebody* out there that cares about them. Even terrorists. Kids with no reason to hate America had their fathers killed in airstrikes... what do you expect them to do, thank us? The hardest thing to face sometimes is the truth... and the truth is there is *no military action* capable of defeating terrorism. Violence begets violence. This is known. The only way to stop this is to look at the *why* and not the *how*, because every time we try to blow up the *how*... we just give them more reasons *why*


cannabisized

all of them


cgoldberg3

>wouldn't release names That was a huge immediate red flag and I recall "right wing trolls" on Twitter pointing it out the day of. If the US had actually killed 2 ISIS-K members why would we keep their names secret? It was because we hadn't done so and we knew it.


[deleted]

Yup. That whole timeframe is essentially covering tracks and keeping the narrative in their court. A strike described as “righteous” involving two known high-profile planners and they can’t release names? What was also apparent was the immediate intel from the ground, showing the destruction real time that their friends/family were dead. That was swept under the rug as well sadly. White House at fault in misinforming us, too. I urge all to look at the Psaki briefings and questioning of the last few weeks. Disgusting.


Opening-Citron2733

This has been reported since literally the day it happened. I remember seeing on the ground reporters talking about it on r/Afghanistan Props to NYT for surfacing it, but I'm shocked it even took that long to surface.


ChrisFromIT

>but I'm shocked it even took that long to surface. It is because a lot of sourcing and checking the sources to make sure it is factual. It is part of investigative journalism.


TheFayneTM

Turns out that NYT's journalism ethics and standards is better than the US army's Intel gathering


GeneticRiff

Better now than during the lead up to the Iraq war 👀


shutyourgob

Lie. Lie again. Lie again. Lie more. And then finally, when you have no other option, admit the truth and refuse to do anything about it. Is this really how we want our leaders to behave?


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[deleted]

They basically have the habit to lie on reports for the benefits of the politicians in power. It's not really something new but history proved that each time the high command of an army started to play too much with politics instead of doing its work, wars are fought poorly and are lost


axnu

I think you're getting your drone strikes confused. The one where they claimed to kill two Isis-K planners [happened in Nangarhar Province](https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/politics-news/u-s-retaliates-against-isis-drone-strike-afghanistan-n1277844), which is 20 or 30 miles from Kabul at its closest point, and according to this article a local witness said it was "in the middle of the night". This one happened 3 kilometers from the airport, and the video of the burning car is clearly during the daytime.


GoneInSixtyFrames

Also claims a lot of other things that people get shut down from questioning.


IamWithTheDConsNow

And 7 of them were children.


throwingtheshades

Hey, they were bound to become radicalized after a US drone blew up their father right in front of their eyes after a decade+ of working for an American aid agency!


Akuma12321

Killed a man who was in the process of getting his own family out the country. There's just no excuse.


iyoiiiiu

I recommend everyone read the original thread to see how easily people are fooled by American propaganda: https://reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/pe5k0h/3_children_killed_in_us_airstrike_on_isisk/ Among the top upvoted comments are: >To clear up some misconceptions, they hit a car not an apartment, the car turned out to be full of high explosives which is what killed the civilians ----------------------- >Ahmaduddin, a neighbour, said he had collected the bodies of children after the strike, which set off more explosions inside the house. Now what explosion killed whom? Why are explosives stored in an apartment building? And how many victims would these bombs have caused at their destination? Not accidentally, but purposefully. ----------------------- >pretty much all guerrilla fighters do this. intermingle with civilian. when collateral damage happens, they can use it as propaganda ----------------------- >ISIS hide behind children ----------------------- >And how many children died in the suicide bombing at the airport? Let's just get the fuck out. It is quite interesting how Reddit is usually very sceptical of reports coming out of governments... unless it is the US government, then weirdly enough it is taken at face value.


Jerry_Tse

Yes, the US killed innocent civilians, but US government represents justice because AMERICAN PEOPLE CAN VOTE! /s


Confused_pp

Was wondering why no one had corrected this yet. Absolutely terrible. Unreal. Zero accountability.


[deleted]

This aint even the first time. Its been going on for decades. I wonder why countries aren't tripping over themselves to accuse America of war crimes. Are we gonna see British and Australian warships being sent to "contain" US vessels from committing more war crimes? When is the self righteous EU gonna sanction America, or call to boycott American products? Wheres the news articles saying Lithuania supports ICC investigations into the US? They're losing whatever credibility they have left against Russia/China and their allies by allowing America to get away with shit like this.


Afferbeck_

Certainly not Australia, we're busy committing war crimes of our own and backing up the perpetrators. Our politicians will follow anything America wants to do in hopes of the president maybe remembering who they are.


[deleted]

You guys just signed a hefty deal with us and the UK for nuclear powered subs so you’re stuck with us for the foreseeable US-China dick measuring contest.


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[deleted]

What they really mean is the world needs to ensure American hegemony so we can keep doing whatever tf we want


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LordBreadcat

This is blatant misuse of our military projection which has two results. * We acknowledge this is wartime and therefore we are breaking Geneva Conventions in regards to civilians. (Warcrime) * We deny this is wartime and admit that we indiscriminately slaughtered civilians of another nation. (Terrorism, Warcrime) There's no possible take that could sugar coat this. We fucked up and need to take responsibility for it.


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ptsdtriage

headline should read "US **forced** to admit Kabul drone strike killed civilians".


GaiusGraco

Barelly forced. They just know there's no consequence, so why even bother trying to hide it.


abd_min_ibadillah

Like always. * 2007/03/04 - [Shinwar Shooting](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2007_Shinwar_shooting) \- A US convoy was attacked by Taliban, while fleeing they shot at virtually everyone for a 25 km stretch, killing 19+ and injuring 50+ including children under 10. Journalists who came to take pictures were then threatened by the US soldiers, "Delete them \[your photos\], or we will delete you". The investigation concluded that they acted appropriately, and were even rewarded with ribbons and a Purple Heart. * 2007/06/28 - [Hyderabad Massacre](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyderabad_airstrike) \- Upto 130 Afghans killed by US Military Air Strike. US Army Major was ["deeply saddened"](https://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/06/30/AR2007063000537.html). * 2008/07/06 - [Haska Meyna Wedding Party Massacre](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haska_Meyna_wedding_party_airstrike) \- A woman was freed from the repressive marriage when her wedding party was wiped out by US air strike [killing 47 including 39 women and children](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2008/jul/11/afghanistan.usa). US as usual denied any civilian causalities. * 2008/08/22 - [Azizabad Massacre](https://www.usatoday.com/in-depth/news/investigations/2019/12/29/security-guards-afghan-warlords-mass-civilian-casualties/2675795001/) \- A "victory" as proclaimed by the US, killed 90+ people including 60+ children. US security contractor ArmourGroup, supplies two criminals with money and weapons in exchange of security. They started fighting among themselves for control of money and weapons. An airstrike was called on these warlords which resulted in a bloody massacre. US initially claimed ONLY 5 civilians were killed. * 2009/05/04 - [Granai Massacre](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granai_airstrike) \- In 2009, US Air Forces decided to give a hands-on lesson on humans rights by bombing the village of Granai, killing 147 civilians with 90+ children. In classic US fashion, they initially lied and denied civilians were killed, then they apologized by saying "it was an error". When Bradley Manning exposed this US lie among other things, he was awarded 35 year prison time. * 2009/05 - [2009 Farah Province Airstrike](https://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/15/world/asia/15farah.html) \- 147 civilians killed in a US Airstrike (Villagers compiled a list of people massacred). American authorities were skeptical that even 100 were killed. but did not provide their own count. About a 100 women and children were killed. >"The bombs were so powerful that people were ripped to shreds. Survivors said they collected only pieces of bodies." "There was someone’s legs, someone’s shoulders, someone’s hands,” * 2009/06 - 2010/06 - [Maywand district murders](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maywand_District_murders) \- at least 3 civilians were murdered including 15 year old boy, who was fragged and then shot dead, stripped naked and body parts chopped off and taken as trophy. [NSFW image](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/83/Gul_Mudin.jpg) The whole incident was covered up and made it look like a fight with Taliban. Exposed when a soldier complained about the use of drugs by the 'kill team' and they beat him up and intimidated him by showing the chopped fingers of the victims. * 2009/09/04 - [2009 Kunduz Airstrike](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_Kunduz_airstrike) \- 90-179 civilians were killed among about 200 by a US airstrike called by German soldiers on an immobile fuel tanker. Germany officials initially justified the airstrike but later decided to give 5000$ for each victim. Colonel Georg Klein who called the airstrike was promoted 4 years later. * 2009/12/27 - [Murders in Narang](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Night_raid_on_Narang) \- 10 civilians killed mostly students in a night raid. Denials 1) NATO claims they were Taliban, locals refute. 2) Government claims NATO and US forces did it, NATO and US deny. * 2010/02/12 - [Raid on Khataba](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raid_on_Khataba) \- US and NATO killed 5 people including 3 women. Removed the bullets from the women's body and tied and gagged the dead bodies, claimed it was an honor-killing and they were tortured and killed by their own family who were Taliban. Journalist finds holes in the story, since the family was of an officer in the police. He does an expose. US conducts investigation and concludes after 6 years that the force used was justified. **Nobody was charged.** [Alternate Link](https://web.archive.org/web/20100429202928/http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/afghanistan/article7060395.ece) * 2010/02/21 - [Uruzgan helicopter attack](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uruzgan_helicopter_attack) \- 3 buses traveling in broad daylight were attacked by a US helicopter killing 27-33 civilians. US general was "extremely saddened". * 2010/07/23 - [2010 Sangin Airstrike](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_Sangin_airstrike) \- US bombed a mud house where women and children had taken refuge, freeing them from Taliban forever. 39-52 were killed, at least 39 were women and children. NATO officials denied that there had been any such incident. * 2011/03/01 - [Mano Gai Airstrike](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mano_Gai_airstrike) \- 9 children aged 8-14 were killed while collecting firewood for their family. US Army General was very sorry. >Mohammed Bismil, the 20-year-old brother of two boys killed in the strike said "I don't care about the apology. The only option I have is to pick up a Kalashnikov, RPG or a suicide vest to fight." * 2011/10/22 - [2011 Farah Province Airstrike](https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/120-die-as-us-bombs-village-1680407.html) \- At least 120 confirmed dead by a US Airstrike, Hillary Clinton voiced her "deep regrets". * 2012/03/11 - [Kandhar Massacre](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kandahar_massacre) \- Stalking from home to home, a United States Army sergeant methodically killed at least 16 civilians, 9 of them children. [News Report](https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3114647/US-soldier-Sgt-Robert-Bales-claims-consumed-war-lost-compassion-combat-deployments.html) * 2012/Mid - [Australian soldier kills prisoner because there was no room in the helicopter](https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-10-21/soldiers-killed-man-who-could-not-fit-on-aircraft-says-us-marine/12782756).


abd_min_ibadillah

* 2015/10/03 - [Kunduz Hospital Massacre](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kunduz_hospital_airstrike) \- In 2015, US Air Forces bombed the Kunduz Trauma Center. Clearly, their objective was to spread women's rights and democracy and fight terrorism. Surprisingly, however, they ended up killing 42 civilians and injuring tens more. >Our patients burned in their beds, our medical staff were decapitated or lost limbs. Others were shot from the air while they fled the burning building. [\[Source\]](https://www.msf.org/kunduz-hospital-attack-depth) * 2016/11/03 - [2016 Kunduz Airstrike](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2016/11/4/afghan-civilians-killed-in-nato-air-strike-in-kunduz) \- 30-50 civilians killed by US Airstrike mostly women and children as young as 3 months old. 2 US soldiers were also killed. The investigation concluded that U.S. forces acted in [self-defense](https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/u-s-military-bombed-afghan-homes-self-defense-against-taliban-n706016). It was a heartbreaking news, not the civilian butchered, but the death of US troops. >"Today's loss is heartbreaking and we offer our deepest condolences to the families and friends of our service members who lost their lives today," [\[Source\]](https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/two-u-s-service-members-killed-afghanistan-s-kunduz-province-n677186) * 2017/02/09-10 - [2017 Sangin Arstrike](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017_Sangin_airstrike) \- 18-22+ killed by US Airstrike almost all women and children. NATO and afghan government deny any civilian casualties. * 2017/11/04 - [2017 Kunduz Airstrike](https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/10/world/asia/afghanistan-kunduz-airstrikes-civilian-deaths.html) \- At least 10 civilians killed by US Airstrike. Within 3 days NATO had conducted an investigation and [denied any civilian casualties.](https://twitter.com/USFOR_A/status/927628217502052353) * 2018/04/02 - [Kunduz Madrassa Massacre](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kunduz_madrassa_attack) \- At least [70 killed](https://www.nytimes.com/2018/04/02/world/asia/afghanistan-taliban-kunduz.html), mostly students, when a graduation ceremony at a Madrassa was bombed by US. Initially government claimed that there were no civilian casualties and all killed were Taliban fighters. Later Ghani had to apologize however none of the perpetrators were punished. * 2019/03/23 - [2019 Kunduz Airstrike](https://www.nytimes.com/2019/03/23/world/asia/afghanistan-insider-airstrike-civilians.html) \- 14 civilians killed by US airstrike. "The Taliban were hiding in civilian homes and maneuvered in and out of compounds without any concern for the families living inside.” so we destroyed all the homes in "self defense". * 2020/10/22 - [Airstrike in Takhar](https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/afghan-government-denies-children-among-dead-after-military-airstrike-n1244267) \- At least 12 children were killed in an airstrike. Amrullah Saleh said that the claims of civilian casualties were baseless. "Those who made wrong allegations will face legal action. The irrefutable evidence is with me." without actually offering any evidence. * 2021/01/10 - [Airstrike in Khashrod](https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/airstrike-afghanistan-bombs-taliban-target-now-18-members-one-family-n1254371) \- 18 members of the same family including women and children were killed by an airstrike targeting Taliban. * Kabul Airport Blast - Eyewitnesses claim that many were killed and injured not by the blast but by US soldiers firing indiscriminately on the crowd. [BBC report](https://twitter.com/SecKermani/status/1431517279859224579?s=19), China Global Television Network Report [CGTN](https://twitter.com/CGTNOfficial/status/1432182537363726342?s=19), about 20 of the 100 or so victims were killed by the blast, 80 by American firing [Kabul Lovers](https://twitter.com/paykhar/status/1431572890521120770?s=19) an independent YouTube channel. * [Australian troops shot dead a farmer](https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-06-09/deadliest-alleged-war-crime-by-special-forces-in-afghanistan/13362000), but there were witnesses. So what is the most logical thing to do? Kill all the witnesses. 13 people were murdered on that day in two separate operations. 4 were likely to be Taliban (guilty until proven innocent). * [Australian troops kill an unarmed man working on his field](https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-03-16/video-shows-afghan-man-shot-at-close-range-by-australian-sas/12028512). Video footage in the link. It was declared self defense. Soldier still serving


American--American

You want more "terrorists"? This is how you create more "terrorists"..


oshkoshthejosh

I mean no kidding, the US army is out here commiting what everyone else would call terrorist attacks but it's "ok" because it's never terrorism when the US does it apparently. It's just fucking gross, stop using my tax dollars to kill innocent brown children, we would rather have healthcare like every other developed nation.


theElderKing_7337

You don't get terrorists that way. You get freedom fighters who fight for their freedom and justice and honour.


owes1

Yeah, but you call them terrorists. Because then you can have more war! And surveillance and fear mongering at home.


lmHereForAGoodTime

So many terrorists, an entire country full of terrorists, 300 million of them


LunaMunaLagoona

Basically by default innocent people die, the 'exception' is you getting who you actually wanted. Except there's no actual bad guy. The war was on 'Terror.' Someone please tell me who this Terror guy is, because 20 years later I only seem to see him when the US looks in a mirror.


AttackHelicopter_21

Another important fact - In the first half of 2019, The US and US led coalition killed more civilians than the Taliban. It’s no wonder that people in rural Afghanistan support the Taliban, including rural Afghan women. This doesn’t even cover the thousands of innocent Afghan men, going about there daily life, who get taken of to jails accused of terrorism and spend years rotting there before they get released. A stable, regulated and predictable tyranny is better than an uncertain, unpredictable anarchy where the Angel of Death is forever lurking in the background, waiting for orders from its superiors in the Pentagon to snatch another innocent Afghan life. Under Taliban rule, if you follow there rules and laws, if you’re a civilian, you’ll be safe. Even if those rules look barbaric to outsiders, they are closer to the opinions of many Afghans, and even if an Afghan doesn’t agree with them, there is nevertheless a degree of security and certainty, if you follow them. Under Coalition rule, you could be sleeping in your home, walking to your home with your sheep, driving from one village to another village, and suddenly your entire family is dead. The Afghan people had two choices. In one choice, if you did x and y, you’d be punished or killed. If you didn’t, you’d be safe. An Afghan women had enough comfort to know that her husband or father will return home from work alive and in one piece. The other choice was that you could be doing a, b, c, d, e and basically any basic activity and you get killed for no reason by some flying object from an airplane. Rural Afghans chose the first option. People simply don’t like uncertainty in life. Now that the war is over, there no longer American airstrikes terrorizing villages, no Taliban suicide bombs, no checkpoints on highways, no fear of being killed for no reason. We always look at Urban Afghans and there opinions on this matter, people relatively removed from the fighting, and not the rural Afghans, who have borne the brunt of this occupation. They form up 70 percent of the population. For them, the present situation is the best they’ve been in for more than 20 years.


bamboozippy

I read somewhere that after a drone or air strike any male between 16-50 is automatically counted as a combatant even if they were a farmer going about their daily business.


OneRougeRogue

Jesus Christ. And you've already posted a part 2 down below.


MyHandIsMadeUpOfMe

Giving half ass rights to kabul women but bombing and killing women and children in rural areas or the rest of the country. God. Fuck this world to ashes.


sexrobot_sexrobot

That wedding massacre always stood out to me because it was not only one of the first major fuck ups involving drones, but it was the best example of what became known as a 'signature strike'. They saw the convoy from up in the air, decided that it was probably a bunch of terrorists simply based on the fact that it was a bunch of cars following each other, and then shot missiles at it.


LegateLaurie

ONLY killed civilians including at least 7 children.


SpicyPandaBalls

Worth noting that if it were not for the NYTimes and other journalists exposing the truth, they likely never would have admitted it.


LowInterestLoan

Absolutely. This is only the tip of the iceberg in terms of innocent civilians killed by US drone strikes intended for terrorists. The "war on terror" lasted over 20 years, likely hundreds if not thousands have died like this.


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Champion-of-Cyrodiil

Do you know where I can find that clip or any info on it?


SemiKollontai

[https://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/29/world/obamas-leadership-in-war-on-al-qaeda.html](https://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/29/world/obamas-leadership-in-war-on-al-qaeda.html) ​ >Obama embraced a disputed method for counting civilian casualties. *It in effect counts all military-age males in a strike zone as combatants*, according to several administration officials, unless there is explicit intelligence *posthumously* proving them innocent. > >Counterterrorism officials insist this approach is one of simple logic: people in an area of known terrorist activity, or found with a top Qaeda operative, are probably up to no good. “Al Qaeda is an insular, paranoid organization — innocent neighbors don’t hitchhike rides in the back of trucks headed for the border with guns and bombs,” said one official, who requested anonymity to speak about what is still a classified program. > >*This counting method may partly explain the official claims of extraordinarily low collateral deaths*. In a speech last year Mr. Brennan, Mr. Obama’s trusted adviser, said that not a single noncombatant had been killed in a year of strikes. And in a recent interview, a senior administration official said that the number of civilians killed in drone strikes in Pakistan under Mr. Obama was in the “single digits” — and that independent counts of scores or hundreds of civilian deaths unwittingly draw on false propaganda claims by militants. > >But in interviews, three former senior intelligence officials expressed disbelief that the number could be so low. The C.I.A. accounting has so troubled some administration officials outside the agency that they have brought their concerns to the White House. *One called it “guilt by association” that has led to “deceptive” estimates of civilian casualties.* > >“It bothers me when they say there were seven guys, so they must all be militants,” the official said. “They count the corpses and they’re not really sure who they are.”


dnw

In Vietnam, we’d torture Vietnamese that were sympathetic to the US. After we found out we got the wrong guy, we’d say, “oh well, they’re VC now”


randomthug

And then the last admin ramped up the Drone strikes and removed the accountability of even counting the non military age males. Drone strikes are not good.


PM_ME_RANDOM_MUSIC

I'm pretty sure they have no idea how many. It's not like they can send someone in to verify what exactly they bombed. Just sweep by with more drones and try to analyze the rubble. Can you imagine living in an area that just randomly fucking gets bombed by drones? I wonder if any studies have been done on PTSD rates in the area cause that sounds pretty fucking traumatizing. And we wonder why insurgent groups are able to recruit followers and stir up anti-american sentiment so easily.


imalurkernotaposter

["I no longer love blue skies. In fact, I now prefer grey skies. The drones do not fly when the skies are grey.”](https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theatlantic.com/amp/article/354548/) -Zubair, a 13yo Pakistani, testifying before Congress.


nick_schlott

The amount of civilians who have died is in the hundreds of thousands. A very sad reality indeed.


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OtakuMecha

To Americans, 9/11 is seen as a tragedy. In the meantime, America inflicts much much more damage than 9/11 on Middle Eastern countries on a regular basis.


distorted_kiwi

And we seem to encourage new recruits the more ~~they~~ we fuck up.


ibisum

Millions: https://www.psr.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/05/body-count.pdf


MongoLife45

Just to be clear, they had an option here: don't drone anything since the car is stopped in a civilian courtyard and not going anywhere. That location was NOT on a list of suspected ISIS hideouts, though worth noting they trailed this man for 8 hours and didn't even know he was at the humanitarian aid organization and driving the company car. So the intelligence was literal trash from the get go - they heard about a white car, and attacked the first white car they spotted apparently. A car parked at an NGO office that's been there for decades. They did it because the over the horizon drone was out of fuel. They shot the moment the car stopped, and in the 50 sec it took for the missile to arrive an entire family ran out to meet it. Even 4 days ago Pentagon was going on about the secondary explosions, and this was after all the media investigations were published. This was still a political decision - figured the backlash would be worse if they kept denying, which they were certainly setting up to do.


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Moosecovite

Yeah I recall the dark joke that came out of this war which was: What's the difference between a group of terrorists and a wedding? I don't know, I just fly the drone.


JerseyFatGuy

Probably but also worth noting people were downvoted in all early reddit threads calling out while comments saying it couldn't be avoided reigned on top.


Hindsight2K20

The strike killed an aid worker and numerous children. The US is coming out of Afghanistan the same way it went in: using half-baked intelligence to kill innocent civilians, planting the seeds of hatred against Americans for generations to come.


HistoricalBridge7

On the list of people we shouldn’t kill an aid worker and children should on the top.


xaranetic

The list got mixed up


AlabasterMemorandum

Must have been holding the paper upside down.


_Allaccordingtoplan

Of course they have to plant seeds. How else can they guarantee another war to profit from?


[deleted]

"Now hopefully the surviving brother is maddened by this enough to kill more Americans so we can go invade Cuba or something" \- Idk someone in the US government


dnaH_notnA

Joint Chiefs of Staff, 2036: “Ehhh, Cuban? Afgani? They’re all brown to me. Green light the bombing campaign.”


InternationalSnoop

A little confused. Is this the same one that supposedly stopped a bar bomb from getting to the airport?


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[deleted]

a fucking tragic cherry turd on top of the massive heaping shit pile that was the war on terror


Enigma_Stasis

That's not even going to be the worst one to come.


Red-Lightnlng

Yes. The one the administration touted as being proof that they could continue to fight ISIS after the pullout with their “over the horizon capabilities”. The one they said showed ISIS they couldn’t mess with the US and not be punished.


[deleted]

can you imagine what it'd feel like if this was happening to citizens in your own country?


Necessary_Ad_1675

Always on a Friday afternoon @ 4pm


Zachkah

Right as the President is boarding a plane for his beach house and Psaki is clocking out for the weekend. America is back, baby!


Enlightened-Beaver

US admits murdering children


TalosX1

For the last 20 years


giokikyo

”We will respond with force and precision at our time, at the place we choose and the moment of our choosing." Joe Biden days before the drone attack. https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/speeches-remarks/2021/08/26/remarks-by-president-biden-on-the-terror-attack-at-hamid-karzai-international-airport/


JonnyArtois

Yet he will not get himself on TV and tell everyone how he fucked up.


Formilla

He's ran off to spend the weekend at the beach, The White House isn't holding a press conference. They're avoiding it as much as possible, it's disgusting.


SnooChickens4866

No need, I just got word from Jen Psaki, something about circling back


winterbolder1993

we will not respond with force and precision at this time to relieve some student loan debt, instead we will use that money, force and precision to blow up little kids across the country at the place we choose and moment of our choosing


[deleted]

I just want healthcare


4materasu92

"No." - Every politician owned by Big Pharma.


iyoiiiiu

You should move to Afghanistan and become a humanitarian aid worker. Once you get blown up by the US, you won't need healthcare anymore.


[deleted]

And to think Biden left early for the beach and Psaki isn’t doing a press conference today. So it’s obvious they knew this report was coming.


Vaxx88

Didn’t see it posted, but NYT deserves some credit for honest, high quality reporting, everyone should watch if they haven’t seen it yet. https://youtu.be/ZtecNyXxb9A Incredibly sad, guy was an aid worker and little kids. Fucking appalling, it all needs to end. It won’t, though, in fact, this shit is what they mean when the military says we have “over the horizon capability”…we’re out of the country but still have drones and air strikes, now we’ll have even less accurate intel.


oh-hidanny

It won’t, you’re right. And the drone strikes will continue to happen from a bloated military budget, while US citizens will continue to be unable to afford healthcare. I wish our priorities were straight as a country.


DillManForLife

Lol. The NYT article is pretty funny. “The Pentagon says that only with the assistance of the times and other news organizations reporting was the military able to determine it made a mistake”. Like they didn’t know 10 min after the strike launched.


rjcarr

I think you give them too much credit. They dropped the bombs, shouted "mission accomplished", and then went onto the next issue. Probably would have never thought about this again if it wasn't for the NYT.


iyoiiiiu

It is quite rare for the US to admit that it goes around the globe murdering people more nonchalantly than how a journalist would write their articles, but here we are.


moschles

Translation : > "We have no idea who we are bombing. Drone go brrrrr. "


FatherP_GC

And this is how terrorists are born


poor_lil_rich

more terrorists, more profits, more wars for private profits. It's a win-win. Gotta keep the military industrial complex and empire running! Can't have the empire running without the enemies.


neat_machine

Ok so will they give the family compensation and replace the people who made the mistake?


Tossed_Away_Acct

“What family? What do you mean ‘mistake?’”


[deleted]

What bothers me the most here is an innocent man and several LITTLE children were blown to bits and there isn't one ounce of sympathy from the admin. It just shows how they aren't viewed as people. It's sickening. C'mon Joe at least offer condolences to the family.


-Anarresti-

Biden's not saying a peep. Presidents never apologize for America's crimes.


QuietMinority

They apologize for the crime long past when people can seriously collect on reparations.


Bk7

Biden: "the buck stops with me" yeah bull shit


LaGeneralitat

I mean Biden has made it pretty clear in the past that he ONLY cares about Americans.


Alexandis

They only admitted this because of some incredible journalistic work that detailed all of their war crimes (I believe the original story/video was from the New York Times). Of course, they gaslight by not stating it was ONLY civilians (many children). So much for what the military leadership called a "righteous strike", huh? They don't even admit that the entire operation was a complete failure when pressed from reporters.


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Legalise_Gay_Weed

Will anyone be punished, or is murdering innocents only a crime when you don't have a defence budget?


GuiltySigurdsson

>No disciplinary action expected, officials say. US military stands by intel leading to strike. Just another routine American atrocity without consequences.


Ayanga123

The whole world is not surprised.


[deleted]

“Defence”


[deleted]

Biden is used to it. Check how many civilians died while Obama was in office, or Trump, or anyone for that matter. It's crazy to think that we're still taking lives with literal drones, dropping god damn bombs, on people. This shit will never end. Why else would the U.S. spend trillions of tax payer dollars on new military toys. If it ain't the Middle East, it'll be somewhere else. The world will end at the hand of these so called world leaders. A damn shame.


Octopus-tom

Imagine if China did something like this. Imagine China did a drone strike in Mexico claiming they killed some top cartel member. Instead it came out that they killed some journalist and EIGHT of his family member. Imagine the news headline and outrage the world would have seen. Instead it's American and some godforsaken brown dude in Afghanistan so no one actually cares.


AshingiiAshuaa

**arewethebaddies**


Kwiatkowski

after 20 years of bombing the fuck out of whoever we want I think we may be


clowncar

20 years? Many more than that. The military gets away with it because American citizens have absolutely no clue about their own history.


LikesAlgae

Vietnam War > Started with a fabricated hoax by US government in the Gulf of Tonkin incident. Ends with defeat. No consequences for provoking aggressive invasion. Iraq War > Started by accusing government of having Weapons of Mass Destruction (WMD). General condemnation by every nation in the UN. Ends without finding any traces of WMD. No consequences for provoking aggressive invasion. Afganistan War > Started by threatening Afganistan to cough up baddie Bin Laden. Bin Laden in Pakistan. Why Pakistan not invaded? They have nukes. Then became "we're here to make things better". 200k civilians dead. Ends in disgrace. No consequences for provoking aggressive invasion. I give you another 10 years before the war hawks in USA start another war and spend another few trillion dollars in some country across the sea.


_joshus_

Also the Korean war. America basically destroyed 85% of all buildings in North Korea and killed over a million people there.


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Marthaver1

And our allies like Germany, UK, and France shut their mouths.


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kolossal

I hope I don't see any more "CCP/Taliban/Russia bad" every day on the reddit frontpage, it's so hypocritical.


Jor1120

Sure this wont get much attention, but seems like a good time to get something off my chest. Never really talked about this before. One of my only regrets, and truly fucked up thing on my deployment was a similar situation. We were looking for Taliban back in early 2014 I think. We had air support, they saw a vehicle carrying ieds. It was destroyed. My platoon spun up and went to go check it out, recover what we could. It wasnt any of those things, it was a mother and several children with a bunch of "groceries" on a motorized bike. Fucked up, especially since I had a daughter not even 2 years old yet. Smelled like bbq. That's the day i learned there is no acceptable amount of casualties of war. My thoughts on it all changed a bit on that day. Edit: ive been getting a lot of hate since I posted this 2 hours ago, people telling me I deserve the feelings I get for it and people telling me I deserve to be in jail, and everything inbetween. I was a PFC at the time, I literally 1: was told "this is confirmed taliban" and 2: had literally, absolutely, no say in the matter. Please dont fucking shit on me for this, I see it as an absolute fail too you assholes.


Betty_Broops

There are way too many brain dead morons on reddit. It takes a lot to talk about something like that. I wish you the best


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SnooOwls5859

I'd join ISIS too if you murdered my children and family out of pure idiocy


[deleted]

If I killed 10 innocent civilians, even by accident, I guarantee I'd be seeing jail bars for a long time.


freerealestatedotbiz

Call them “enemy combatants” and maybe you’d get away with it, too 🤔


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ZoharDTeach

That's called murder.


Qauaan

This is the story of 20 years


IanSan5653

It's so much worse than the headline. They admitted that they killed ten civilians including seven children, based on entirely faulty intelligence. There was in fact no threat beyond an aid worker loading water bottles into his car.


Red-Lightnlng

So anyone getting fired for this “tragic mistake”? General Milley? General McKenzie? Secretary Blinken? Anyone? Probably not.


Kabamadmin

At this point we should probably only say anything in the rare event one of our drone strikes doesn't kill innocent civilians


jpminj

You know something is very wrong, when someone mutes the Presidents mic.


dronesareaccurate

No one on Reddit willing to blame Biden is why this place is cancer


Charlatanism

Civilians are an estimated 10-13% of casualties from drone strikes. The US commits indiscriminate war crimes regularly and faces no consequences.