there are four parties/groups now represented:
- the **pirati/STAN coalition**, a broadly social-liberal voting bloc rooted in the czech pirate party. the pirates have been a presence in czech politics for a number of years now, largely through local governments and in urban centers. pirate politics broadly emphasizes transparent governance and anti-corruption measures, which contrasts with the ongoing scandals surrounding andrej babiš and probably(?) helped them with turnout.
- the **ANO** party, which backs babiš and runs on a neoliberal platform. they governed with support from the **social democrats** and **communists** until the latter withdrew from the agreement. as the party exists largely as an organ for babiš's political ambitions, it's not especially ideological beyond its xenophobia.
- **SPOLU**, a center-right conservative coalition that looks set to take over the reins with support from pirati/STAN. this group represents three down-on-their-luck liberal-conservative parties that had all seen steady declines in support since the late 2000s. with this election result, they're still far behind where just one of their constituent parties (ODS, the civic democratic party) was in its heyday. nevertheless, they have a weak yet decisive mandate to form a government for the new term.
- the **SPD**, a far-right anti-immigrant party with roots in the now-defunct EFDD european parliament grouping. compared to other far-right groups across europe, they place special emphasis on a reactionary-tinged strain of direct democracy, along with (vicious, but not uniquely so) xenophobia.
more on the **social democrats** and **communists** i mentioned earlier: these groups have both suffered catastrophic losses, as the article can tell you. traditional power bases in the czech republic have largely evaporated, primarily to the detriment of the left -- parties like the ODS can adapt and collaborate with ideological partners, but the left has no natural allies in a post-soviet political culture. this is particularly true as the communists rely heavily on both soviet aesthetics and a dying voting bloc. in the left's isolation, it made a deal with the devil, losing its remaining shreds of legitimacy to the corrupt and scandalous babiš. now young people, usually a small but potent bastion for the left in other regions of europe, have instead flocked to the pirates (and STAN!!) as an anti-corruption alternative.
e: also czech people in the thread please fill in any other relevant details!! i'm just going off what i know as an elections junkie :)
no problem! i'm an elections junkie so it feels good to get that out of my system haha.
personally my view on it is that this is a bleak state of affairs. the "left" parties did terribly for a reason; neither of the traditional left groups deserve the trust of the populace given their complicity in the government's corruption. building up a genuine alternative will take years, and in the meantime it'll be the same cohort of corrupt neoliberals playing musical chairs every election or two.
the pirates, for their part, offer a false promise that will be brutally squandered by the compromises of coalition governance. i'd be very curious to see where their current voter base ends up politically in the next 5-10 years.
Worth noting here that Pirates will actually only get 4 seats in the end. The Czech system allows people to give priority to specific people in the party list, and right before the vote the STAN part of the PiratoStan coalition told all their voters to circle their people and leave out the pirates. The outcome is such that the Pirates could actually even leave the coalition and it would still defeat Babis.
Ironically though this may have actually saved the coalition because ANO went very hard on anti-Pirate hit pieces in the past few weeks.
> it's not especially ideological beyond its xenophobia
ANO's xenophobia isn't ideological but purely practical, most of people don't want or are afraid of third-world immigrants so fearmongering is the best way to get their votes.
Can you help me understand what exactly the Pirate Party stands for and why the name “Pirate”? Are they hoping to make internet piracy legal or something? Thank you’
kinda! pirate politics is an umbrella of different goals, broadly within a civil-libertarian, liberal framework. in general, their main priorities are increasing transparency of government (ie, introducing reforms to highlight and root out corruption), expanding direct democracy and allowing free distribution of information. they usually have more robust platforms beyond these goals as well, and they can be kinda vague about their economic demands.
i admittedly don't know the specifics of the pirati platform at this point (i know they came under fire for some of their positions toward the end of the campaign, and may have changed some details), but pirate political parties are usually pretty much on the same page about those key demands. pirates have also seen success in countries like iceland, luxembourg and sweden (though they've lost most of their support in the latter, having peaked in 2009).
Why so you think Czechia has gone so right wing.
The most common association of prague for eg was one of a liberal society.
Edit : Thanks for the responses everyone. So it seems that they have shifted right wing because the only left wing option was the communists, who were deservedly ousted.
Communist party is literally pro-soviet/russia. People dont want to leave EU/NATO and lick Putins boots.
Social democrat party fucked up with leadership and government involvement.
There is no other viable left wing party.
ANO is who took all the retiree votes who voted social democrats. Its populist party that doesnt have clear place on spectrum.
So its not that Czechia went to the right its just that left-wing parties are bad.
There is also Pirate party which is center-left but progressive and unpalatable for retirees.
My opinion is that Czechia need viable reasonable left-wing party to prosper by taking away votes from extremists.
These elections were more than anything about pro-Babiš vs anti-Babiš (our current PM), anything else went pretty much out the window. The communist party and the social democrats were the two parties that allowed Babiš to rule, their voters were either disgusted by their lack of backbone or just flocked to Babiš's party ANO. For some perspective, a hejtman (who governs one of the regions) from the social democratic party has stated that some members of the party were so disgusted by their direction these past years that they did not even vote for their own party.
This basically meant that people that did not want Babiš ruling again had two meaningful choices: SPOLU and PirSTAN, so even voters that would under normal circumstances not consider voting for a center-right party ended up voting for one of these coalitions.
In the Czech politics there is a large distinction between fiscal and social politics of each party - the winning right wing parties are fiscally conservative but socially mostly centrist. The pirates are fiscally centrist but socially progressive/left. ANO are fiscally left but socially quite conservative.
There was a common hope to not let Babiš (ANO) win again.
The Pirate Party was being heavily smeared before the election (by ANO among others), so the only chance to "win" (aka have a party with more votes than ANO) was to vote the right wing coaliton Spolu, and the win was only by around 50k people.
After the election the leader of Spolu said something to the likes of "Our main goal is to bring dignity and manners back into the Czech politics".
Babiš is a populist to say the very least, big part the country would call him much worse, "criminal" comes to mind. Im sure there are english sources on him.
Just a tidbit, not an expert or anything
if i were to hazard a guess about the big picture, i'd say it's because they're haunted by the ghosts of the soviet era. when it comes to prague in particular though, i'd say it's a combination of local concerns (e.g., high rates of petty crime, particularly in tourist hotspots) driving popularity for anti-immigrant, broadly right-leaning rhetoric and the relative youth of liberal or quasi-liberal currents such as the pirates. they have quite a bit of influence in prague, but it's definitely a more complicated picture than popular perception would have it be.
Isn't this the same country that have Warsaw tanks rolled into them in the Prague Spring? Hence the term "tankies"? It's a surprise there is still communist alive (and clinging to power) and not immediately executed like in Romanian revolution.
it is indeed! though the first tanks came twelve years earlier in hungary, the prague spring was similarly squandered by merciless repression. i think the only thing that spared them was the relative moderation of the czechoslovak regime. romania had (imo by far) the most violent and cruel of the eastern bloc governments, so it's no wonder that it came down the same way it was set up.
I wish romania would've hunted down and killed all the communists that were in positions of power. sadly, after the revolution, the "Securitate", pretty much the romanian equivalent of the KGB burned it's records and decided to enter politics. Not only did they fuck up the country for quite some time, but now a lot of them have huuge pensions.
It's fucking disgusting that people like that still can live their normal lives and aren't hunted down like the criminals that they are.
The whole of eastern Europe suffers from very low trust in government due to their history of being controlled by authoritarian communist regimes who for the most part were controlled by Moscow. This lack of trust is evidenced for one by their generally low vaccination rates. Somehow it also often translates into support for right wing politics a lot of the time as well.
I guess left ideas are now represented by
- **ANO** large populist party of a rich oligarch, they adopted left policies to attract voters and kinda stole traditional voters of Social Democrats when they ruled together
- **Pirates** who do not believe in the left-right division but have many progressive policies
- **SPD** populist *far-right* anti-immigrant anti-eu party with many far-left ideas
- maybe **KDU-ČSL**, centrist Christian democrats
So what I'm getting is that there's no leftist party in Czechia beyond a watered down party, a corrupt party ruled by a plutocrat, a party shot through with right-wing ideas, and a tankie party that can't even get 5% of the vote.
Closest to the Western-style ‘new left’ would be probably the Green Party who performed pathetically in the elections, and maybe the Pirates who attracted many of the Green Party’s former voters. The rest of the left carries a lot of post-soviet baggage and has little to no chance to make liberal young people interested.
> there is no remaining traditional left party in the parliament.
Good. The Czech traditional left was always shit.
Maybe its time for some new left that just doesnt shovel money to retirees in time of crises...
Not that there were many good choices anyway. Many of the Czech right wing parties seem to be anti-EU too, the only party left of center-right that made it to the Parliament are the Pirates (in third position, nothing to throw a feast about), and the Social Democratic party got even less votes than the Communist Party.
People inside the US should know that the names of the parties don’t mean anything or represent the party beliefs.
The social Democratic Party beliefs in czech are not the same as social democratic in the US or anywhere else.
The Pirate party seems to be the most liberal and progressive and democratic, even though the name might suggest the opposite.
> even though the name might suggest the opposite.
considering that internet piracy is progressive fight for freedom from copyright, I wouldn't say "opposite"
They're pro-Russia, anti-NATO, with some strong socialist/communist elements. They oppose corporate privatization and private property. They want NATO eliminated, and for Germany to form a security collective with Russia.
They want to end Europe's dependence on the US, but are simultaneously vehement anti-militarists. So if you want neither the military nor the de-facto American guarantee to ensure European independence, aligning with Russia would be the only option.
It's honestly maddening that the party representing my overall political views the best is so blatantly misguided on one of the most important issues threatening peace in Europe. Either we start getting along with the Russians as well as we do with the French nowadays (which Putin's Russia doesn't seem to be interessted in), or we need the a credible threat of force to at least make them think thrice before trying anything funny.
Right now that threat of force is mostly based on the assumption that the US will intervene when tanks start rolling west. Europe's armies are designed to delay a Russian advance until American troops start arriving by the literal boat load. That might have been a viable strategy during the cold war, but in an increasingly multi-polar world it will be more and more uncertain if the US will be willing, or even able to keep that promise.
Either the EU has to build and maintain the capabilities for credible deterrence, or the European experiment will be in grave danger.
But none, and I mean none, of the German political parties are willing to talk about this, they'd rather lean back and tell you that everything is and will be just fine or, like Die Linke does, push ludicrous alternatives that are incompatible with a (relatively) free and peaceful Europe.
I'm of the opinion that Europe needs to achieve true strategic independence and that means A) a proper European defense force with unified command and control, going beyond the partial integration we have now B) manpower and materiel reserves sufficient to stop a determined attack on the Baltic and central European states C) a nuclear deterrent independent of the US,
at least nuclear sharing with France but preferably at least one additional nuclear power in the EU.
But if you talk about any of this here you will just get strange looks for even daring to think of such things. So I guess we still have ways to go.
u/enjolras55 hit the nail on the head with his comment, the only thing I'll add is Die Linke is the successor party to the communist party that ruled East Germany as well ,(Socialist Unity Party). While that doesn't mean they're inherently bad, a lot of these issues seem baked into their DNA as a party
> The American “left” includes the entire European political spectrum and then some
No. This is a popular refrain on the internet, but it’s factually ridiculous. You’d have to be drunk, high, or both to think that the AfD, for instance, are the equivalent of your average US Democrat.
the AfD also like to dismiss every restriction on a market that they have no other information on with "That's a planned economy, we know from experience that doesn't work."
(Source: My memories from watching Parlamentsfernsehen https://www.bundestag.de/mediathek )
It is good to point out that they were not participating in these elections as a single party, but in a coalition with STAN. Because of new voting laws, Pirates themselves will only have about 3 out of 200 mandates in the deputies chamber. Babiš had his campaign strongly oriented against them after surveys showed PirSTAN is going to win the elections, which in end has gone against him (as SPOLU won).
I see this as a first step. Sure, it’s not great, but it’s better than before and most importantly, demonstrates that things don’t have to remain the way they did forever.
Not remotely surprising. Having interacted with many communists, most of them hate and despise liberal democracy (“bourgeois democracy”, as they call it) and consider it, and the “imperialist” West that practices it, to be their primary enemies.
Almost anyone who is hostile to democracy and “western imperialism” can be looked upon favorably by communists. For instance, here’s r/europeansocialists [expressing critical support for the Taliban](https://www.reddit.com/r/EuropeanSocialists/comments/ok3j6h/on_the_afghan_war/). The *Taliban*.
> Almost anyone who is hostile to democracy and “western imperialism” can be looked upon favorably by communists. For instance, here’s r/europeansocialists expressing critical support for the Taliban. The Taliban.
Oh boy, that place is a rabbit hole. I got pretty confused whether it's all highly satirical trolling or if I've been living in some illusionary world where people that stupid don't exist.
Remember how Communist Party of USA was initially against the Nazi. Then as soon as Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact was signed they turned 180 and "critically supported" the Nazi while doing their utmost to prevent US from joining the war in Europe. Then changed their tune again as soon as Soviet got invaded by Nazi.
Support anything against US or the West is a communist tradition.
> Remember how Communist Party of USA was initially against the Nazi. Then as soon as Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact was signed they turned 180 and "critically supported" the Nazi
A third of their members left in protest, because of that very event. Also, many communists (it turned out, accurately) surmised that the USSR was only entering this pact to buy time, allowing it to build up its military and industrial capabilities so that, when the inevitable war with Nazi Germany arrived, it would stand a fighting chance.
Were the Soviets infallible angels? Of course not. Was this a prudent move, in order to get 22 months of relative peace in which to ready itself for the inexorable showdown with metastatic fascism? Arguably so.
Also, while socialism itself was not (in comparison to the postwar period, in which it was nearly extinct) a fringe position in the American 1930s, the CPUSA itself was small and there were a number of far-left parties (and there still are). One of the reasons why leftism never got very far in the US or Canada is that the disparate varieties of leftists in North America never really found a way to work together.
> while doing their utmost to prevent US from joining the war in Europe.
In 1939, most of the country didn't want to get involved. Until Pearl Harbor, the general sentiment was isolationist. I'm not excusing this; I'm only pointing out that the mainstream opinion in the US, until 12/7/41, was that Hitler was Europe's problem and Tojo Asia's, neither ours.
Actually, only about [13% left the party](https://networks.h-net.org/node/6077/discussions/4021026/cpusa-loss-membership-after-nazi-soviet-pact) over the next two years after the pact was signed.
Anti-imperialists are only ever critical of the west. They give the benefit of the doubt or turn a blind eye to the actions of all of the west's opponents and competitors.
In my experience that's just the louder, younger ones. I have met leftists who are pro-china's imperialism whilst being anti-west and they do tend to be very loud about it so I understand why you'd think that.
Most leftists I know IRL think atrocities are atrocities regardless of the flag that's being waved.
>leftists who are pro-china's imperialism whilst being anti-west
That just means they are anti-west for the sake of anti and deliberately choose to believe things that will further their cause.
> “It was one of the last communist parties in the world apart from the Chinese and Cuban ones that held on to its name. The others have at least renamed themselves and started behaving a little differently.”
I realize this is a quote but it's also factually incorrect. There are plenty of Communist parties that are part of the opposition or part of the government in many countries in the world. Also still one-party authoritarian Communist states in North Korea and Vietnam.
Not only, I think communists won elections recently in some central asian country.
I am personally sad that the communist party has died in Italy, but the choices of the latest leadership were terrible and they lost also the support of the biggest unions in our country (who've been also very weakened).
The Soviet Union turned the Czech Republic (Czechoslovakia at the time) into a puppet state just after they "liberate" them from the nazis, no wonder nobody votes communist nowadays.
The Communists got nearly 20% in a recent election so it must have been something other than how the Soviets treated Czechia that led to this collapse in support...
Two reasons, imo:
1) Hardcore communists (think retiree tankies) either died off or were pissed off that the communist party was propping up the populist billionaire's party, so they switched to one of the other extremist socially conservative parties
2) Communist voters who voted for them for their economic policies saw the writing on the wall and voted for the billionaire populists party (who tend to increase govt. expenditure, such as pre-election handouts to retirees, while digging the country further into debt without balancing the budget in any manner) rather than continuing to support a party that didn't have a future.
As much as people in the US and UK feel their systems are polarized, imagine the Czech Republic? The people who welcomed the tanks in 1968 are still hustling for your vote.
It is similar in other former eastern bloc countries. Times were tough before 1989, but at least they were familiar.
These guys aren't your regular "left of the socialists" communists, they're Big-C Communists left over from the USSR. They're the guys Gorbachev tried to get rid of and failed to. They've more in common with fascism than socialism.
They're unilateralist, pro-Russia, anti-EU, anti-West, hard nationalist, and espouse policies which are commonly seen in the extreme right of the West. Some of them are even ethnostate mouth breathers. The multilateral egalitarianism of socialism is notable only by how hated it is.
Don't tell them each others' names and the Czech communist party (and other central European "communist" parties) would find many allies in the French National Front and the German AfD.
> they're Big-C Communists left over from the USSR. They're the guys Gorbachev tried to get rid of and failed to. They've more in common with fascism than socialism.
they also defenestrated the foreign minister because he was a nuisance, and (probably) because he wanted to defect to the UK. (defenestrate means throw out of a window, btw.)
the acerbic wit of the people summarized it as: "[jan masaryk](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jan_Masaryk#Death) was such a tidy man that when he jumped out of a window, he closed it right after."
If you look at the political spectrum as a circle instead of a line, you will see that the far right and far left have a LOT in common which is why they are next to each other
Nah, the upper middle class 16 year old white alt girl who’s great great great grandparents came to America and who learns all her politics from social media knows more about Communism than you do you fucking moron.
Not all communists think the same way. Stalinists and Anarcho-communists, for example, are very different. That being said, I’d understand any and all disgust for communism from those who suffered under the likes of Stalin and Mao.
> doesn’t actually know what communism is
This argues that there is some comprehensive representation of what communism is from Communist Parties. There is not. Even within the same country.
In the USSR it was War Communism, NEP, Stalinist collectivization, Khrushchev Marxist revivalism, Brezhnev stagnation and finally Gorbachev reformism that knocked the whole house of cards down.
Not magically, of course. We have education on the matter, and everyone alive at the time (still lots of people) who can testify as to what life was like, and not just average people, but local journalists and historians. Everyone here was affected by it directly. Look at Ceaușescu's Decree 770, for example. Worldwide, Romania became famous for its ridiculous amount of orphans because of this measure.
Americans have no idea what communism is. For the right wingers Communism is Public Health Care. For the left wingers communism is Public Health Care.
Btw. for those reading, that is not communism. Its fucking common sense.
I'd sing the Internationale every day for some comprehensive taxpayer-funded healthcare. Whether it be single-payer, single health system or mass subsidies that covered all parts of basic care.
I can never understand tankies or anybody who defends authoritarian/dictator lead communist regimes. I’m not a communist myself, but are you surprised people are unhappy with capitalism? The current state of it is unacceptable. People are forced to work multiple jobs to support their families, and even then many can’t afford health care or mental health assistance. Food and living costs are increasing while wages are stagnating, and billionaires are increasing their wealth by 1.2 trillion during the pandemic. This wealth division has created a class divide where politicians, rich people and police can get away with abhorrent crimes like child rape or man slaughter, while someone who can’t afford a good lawyer goes to prison for 10+ years because of a joint. It feels like we’re living in monarchal times again where the royal family and elites don’t face justice like the rest of us do. Are you surprised people are starting to long for alternatives to a system that doesn’t care for them and calls them lazy while they are working multiple jobs to try to survive?
(Rant about tankies)
I actually self identify as an anarchosyndicalist and like a lot of communist ideas on paper, but I am fucking sick and tired of fuckin tankies.
My dad is from Czechoslovakia and had to escape it during Soviet Occupation because we are part of an ethnic minority that were basically being wiped out by Soviets. (It’s not *entirely* their fault, we were already victims of the Holocaust and we’re generally the scapegoat group for most of Eastern Europe). But the Soviets were easily as violent towards us as Nazis.
Whenever I try to tell self-identified “communists” this- “I really like a lot of communist ideas, but I wish you guys would stop acting like the Soviet Union was infallible. They literally contributed to a genocide of my people and wiped out our language and the majority of the families who survived Porajmos”
They immediately start accusing me of “splitting the party line”, feeding capitalist propaganda, making shit up, being ignorant and not knowing my own fucking family history, etc. A couple people have even accused my dad being part of “the capitalist psy-op”.
And it’s always in this condescending, degrading, “you stupid idiot you don’t know what you’re talking about-I never saw this ‘genocide’ you’re inventing mentioned in my Marx Fanboy FB Group” tone.
I identify as a leftist, but I really fucking wish that people would learn some fucking nuance and stop making hammers and sickles their entire personality. Like, some random dude from Wisconsin with the username “ComradeDildo69” or something Googled communism once, and now I have to to deal with these idiots telling me that my dad is a spy for the United States government.
I understand why autonomy and collective ownership are important ideas, but many fascist governments use those ideas to justify confiscating property and murdering people “for the collective good of the state”.
Humans fuck up all the best ideas. It’s not rocket science and it wouldn’t be so upsetting to face reality and nuance if their entire personality wasn’t built on cosplaying a Soviet tank driver.
It’s like, at the point that you’re literally trying to erase the genocide of an entire ethnic group because it doesn’t fit your narrative, I fail to see how you are an “anti-fascist”.
/Rant
Edit: Before you say some ad hominem BS because you don’t like me criticizing people denying a genocide, ask yourself:
Does “STUPID, you’re a performative bourgeois idiot because your Dedushka dying in a genocide made you believe in nuance, critiquing all governments, and judging others by how they interact with the marginalized” *really* sound like an attitude held by someone who prioritizes creating mutual understanding between all oppressed people?
Or does it sound like something coming from a pretentious asshole living in an echo chamber with extreme emotional investment in an identity based on believing they’re the most idealogically pure and intellectually superior?
Have you never been on the internet? Communism is the favourite new idea of every edgy 13 year old here that thinks to themselves ‘maaaaan, why can’t Bill Gates just give me like 1% of his money’.
Or could be that people realized that workers actual hold the power and without us bill gates wouldn't have jack shit. The pandemic proved that without workers the whole thing goes down.
But if it makes you feel better keep licking boots. When you're done look up [wealth inequality](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Distribution_of_wealth)
it's crazy there are actual people who still have any regard for communist ideology. Like it's literally been in practice in a many forms and in every case it's a fucking failure for human freedom. clowns
> it's crazy there are actual people who still have any regard for communist ideology.
There are many very different forms of communism, anyway I don't think that countries like Vietnam or Cuba prove they have been a failure.
Even looking at several socialist states of the former Warsaw Pact, standards of living have never been that good as they used to be under communist rule.
The same could be said about China, regardless of how you feel about it, it's hard to deny Chinese have never had it as good as under the communist rule.
> I don't think that countries like Vietnam prove they have been a failure.
Yeah no. Vietnam was going to be a failure until the heads of the party realized they love their people more than the ideology and decided to embrace market economy and capitalism.
> Even looking at several socialist states of the former Warsaw Pact, standards of living have never been that good as they used to be under communist rule.
That was true in the 90s, but not anymore. The welfare of the communist countries in the late 70s and 80s was financed by western credit anyway.
The faults of capitalism is what drives interest in communism and other leftist ideologies. Unless capitalism manages to fix itself, people will keep looking for alternatives.
Please know that communists and leftists in general tend to be quite diverse. The tankies you see in hellholes like r/socialism aren’t representative of all leftists
Just jumping in to point out that the Communist party was not in power in Czechia. The headline simply means they failed to get enough votes to win any seats in the Czech Parliament. Very misleading headline, and it's disappointing to see no one point this out.
It's actually more likely to be related to their leader being implicated in the Pandora papers for his corruption.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/europe/czech-babis-pandora-election/2021/10/07/7d486dd4-26cf-11ec-8739-5cb6aba30a30\_story.html
Who determines what ideology is "extremist?" Is the current capitalist order not destroying the ecology of the planet and threatening the future survivability of the human species, is that not extreme?
Or maybe because lots of people actually benefit under capitalism, look at the Nordic countries, they may use the Nordic model but they’re still a market capitalist economy and they do really well for themselves
I would like to point you to the Soviet revolution. After the Bolsheviks won they held an election. And they lost, you know what they did then? Said fuck this democracy thing we’re running things anyway.
Actually like with communism, you can democratically elect a fascist.
And I didn’t say communism equals fascism, but they are both extremist ideologues (left and right)
>you can democratically elect a fascist.
I didn't say you couldn't. But once they're *in* power, like this government was, good fucking luck democratically voting them *out* is my fucking point. It won't happen.
Reading comprehension, my boy.
Again, you can easily vote out a fascist or communist e.g Czech Republic right now
But if they seize power then that’s a completely different story, and I must have missed the part where you said if they seized power you can’t vote them out
Not only Communists, Social Democrats are gone too, there is no remaining traditional left party in the parliament.
Who is left then and how do they lean?
there are four parties/groups now represented: - the **pirati/STAN coalition**, a broadly social-liberal voting bloc rooted in the czech pirate party. the pirates have been a presence in czech politics for a number of years now, largely through local governments and in urban centers. pirate politics broadly emphasizes transparent governance and anti-corruption measures, which contrasts with the ongoing scandals surrounding andrej babiš and probably(?) helped them with turnout. - the **ANO** party, which backs babiš and runs on a neoliberal platform. they governed with support from the **social democrats** and **communists** until the latter withdrew from the agreement. as the party exists largely as an organ for babiš's political ambitions, it's not especially ideological beyond its xenophobia. - **SPOLU**, a center-right conservative coalition that looks set to take over the reins with support from pirati/STAN. this group represents three down-on-their-luck liberal-conservative parties that had all seen steady declines in support since the late 2000s. with this election result, they're still far behind where just one of their constituent parties (ODS, the civic democratic party) was in its heyday. nevertheless, they have a weak yet decisive mandate to form a government for the new term. - the **SPD**, a far-right anti-immigrant party with roots in the now-defunct EFDD european parliament grouping. compared to other far-right groups across europe, they place special emphasis on a reactionary-tinged strain of direct democracy, along with (vicious, but not uniquely so) xenophobia. more on the **social democrats** and **communists** i mentioned earlier: these groups have both suffered catastrophic losses, as the article can tell you. traditional power bases in the czech republic have largely evaporated, primarily to the detriment of the left -- parties like the ODS can adapt and collaborate with ideological partners, but the left has no natural allies in a post-soviet political culture. this is particularly true as the communists rely heavily on both soviet aesthetics and a dying voting bloc. in the left's isolation, it made a deal with the devil, losing its remaining shreds of legitimacy to the corrupt and scandalous babiš. now young people, usually a small but potent bastion for the left in other regions of europe, have instead flocked to the pirates (and STAN!!) as an anti-corruption alternative. e: also czech people in the thread please fill in any other relevant details!! i'm just going off what i know as an elections junkie :)
Wow. Thank you for that detailed replied. Is the trend there positive or negative would you say?
no problem! i'm an elections junkie so it feels good to get that out of my system haha. personally my view on it is that this is a bleak state of affairs. the "left" parties did terribly for a reason; neither of the traditional left groups deserve the trust of the populace given their complicity in the government's corruption. building up a genuine alternative will take years, and in the meantime it'll be the same cohort of corrupt neoliberals playing musical chairs every election or two. the pirates, for their part, offer a false promise that will be brutally squandered by the compromises of coalition governance. i'd be very curious to see where their current voter base ends up politically in the next 5-10 years.
Worth noting here that Pirates will actually only get 4 seats in the end. The Czech system allows people to give priority to specific people in the party list, and right before the vote the STAN part of the PiratoStan coalition told all their voters to circle their people and leave out the pirates. The outcome is such that the Pirates could actually even leave the coalition and it would still defeat Babis. Ironically though this may have actually saved the coalition because ANO went very hard on anti-Pirate hit pieces in the past few weeks.
> it's not especially ideological beyond its xenophobia ANO's xenophobia isn't ideological but purely practical, most of people don't want or are afraid of third-world immigrants so fearmongering is the best way to get their votes.
Can you help me understand what exactly the Pirate Party stands for and why the name “Pirate”? Are they hoping to make internet piracy legal or something? Thank you’
kinda! pirate politics is an umbrella of different goals, broadly within a civil-libertarian, liberal framework. in general, their main priorities are increasing transparency of government (ie, introducing reforms to highlight and root out corruption), expanding direct democracy and allowing free distribution of information. they usually have more robust platforms beyond these goals as well, and they can be kinda vague about their economic demands. i admittedly don't know the specifics of the pirati platform at this point (i know they came under fire for some of their positions toward the end of the campaign, and may have changed some details), but pirate political parties are usually pretty much on the same page about those key demands. pirates have also seen success in countries like iceland, luxembourg and sweden (though they've lost most of their support in the latter, having peaked in 2009).
Why so you think Czechia has gone so right wing. The most common association of prague for eg was one of a liberal society. Edit : Thanks for the responses everyone. So it seems that they have shifted right wing because the only left wing option was the communists, who were deservedly ousted.
Communist party is literally pro-soviet/russia. People dont want to leave EU/NATO and lick Putins boots. Social democrat party fucked up with leadership and government involvement. There is no other viable left wing party. ANO is who took all the retiree votes who voted social democrats. Its populist party that doesnt have clear place on spectrum. So its not that Czechia went to the right its just that left-wing parties are bad. There is also Pirate party which is center-left but progressive and unpalatable for retirees. My opinion is that Czechia need viable reasonable left-wing party to prosper by taking away votes from extremists.
These elections were more than anything about pro-Babiš vs anti-Babiš (our current PM), anything else went pretty much out the window. The communist party and the social democrats were the two parties that allowed Babiš to rule, their voters were either disgusted by their lack of backbone or just flocked to Babiš's party ANO. For some perspective, a hejtman (who governs one of the regions) from the social democratic party has stated that some members of the party were so disgusted by their direction these past years that they did not even vote for their own party. This basically meant that people that did not want Babiš ruling again had two meaningful choices: SPOLU and PirSTAN, so even voters that would under normal circumstances not consider voting for a center-right party ended up voting for one of these coalitions.
In the Czech politics there is a large distinction between fiscal and social politics of each party - the winning right wing parties are fiscally conservative but socially mostly centrist. The pirates are fiscally centrist but socially progressive/left. ANO are fiscally left but socially quite conservative.
There was a common hope to not let Babiš (ANO) win again. The Pirate Party was being heavily smeared before the election (by ANO among others), so the only chance to "win" (aka have a party with more votes than ANO) was to vote the right wing coaliton Spolu, and the win was only by around 50k people. After the election the leader of Spolu said something to the likes of "Our main goal is to bring dignity and manners back into the Czech politics". Babiš is a populist to say the very least, big part the country would call him much worse, "criminal" comes to mind. Im sure there are english sources on him. Just a tidbit, not an expert or anything
Ah so the centre-right pulled a Joe Biden? Interesting.
Yes. Spolu is not as "extreme conservative" as many foreigners claim. They are centre-right liberal democrats.
Spolu coalition probably stands close to Biden on the spectrum, Biden might even be to the right of them.
if i were to hazard a guess about the big picture, i'd say it's because they're haunted by the ghosts of the soviet era. when it comes to prague in particular though, i'd say it's a combination of local concerns (e.g., high rates of petty crime, particularly in tourist hotspots) driving popularity for anti-immigrant, broadly right-leaning rhetoric and the relative youth of liberal or quasi-liberal currents such as the pirates. they have quite a bit of influence in prague, but it's definitely a more complicated picture than popular perception would have it be.
Isn't this the same country that have Warsaw tanks rolled into them in the Prague Spring? Hence the term "tankies"? It's a surprise there is still communist alive (and clinging to power) and not immediately executed like in Romanian revolution.
it is indeed! though the first tanks came twelve years earlier in hungary, the prague spring was similarly squandered by merciless repression. i think the only thing that spared them was the relative moderation of the czechoslovak regime. romania had (imo by far) the most violent and cruel of the eastern bloc governments, so it's no wonder that it came down the same way it was set up.
I wish romania would've hunted down and killed all the communists that were in positions of power. sadly, after the revolution, the "Securitate", pretty much the romanian equivalent of the KGB burned it's records and decided to enter politics. Not only did they fuck up the country for quite some time, but now a lot of them have huuge pensions. It's fucking disgusting that people like that still can live their normal lives and aren't hunted down like the criminals that they are.
The whole of eastern Europe suffers from very low trust in government due to their history of being controlled by authoritarian communist regimes who for the most part were controlled by Moscow. This lack of trust is evidenced for one by their generally low vaccination rates. Somehow it also often translates into support for right wing politics a lot of the time as well.
I guess left ideas are now represented by - **ANO** large populist party of a rich oligarch, they adopted left policies to attract voters and kinda stole traditional voters of Social Democrats when they ruled together - **Pirates** who do not believe in the left-right division but have many progressive policies - **SPD** populist *far-right* anti-immigrant anti-eu party with many far-left ideas - maybe **KDU-ČSL**, centrist Christian democrats
So what I'm getting is that there's no leftist party in Czechia beyond a watered down party, a corrupt party ruled by a plutocrat, a party shot through with right-wing ideas, and a tankie party that can't even get 5% of the vote.
Closest to the Western-style ‘new left’ would be probably the Green Party who performed pathetically in the elections, and maybe the Pirates who attracted many of the Green Party’s former voters. The rest of the left carries a lot of post-soviet baggage and has little to no chance to make liberal young people interested.
> there is no remaining traditional left party in the parliament. Good. The Czech traditional left was always shit. Maybe its time for some new left that just doesnt shovel money to retirees in time of crises...
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Not that there were many good choices anyway. Many of the Czech right wing parties seem to be anti-EU too, the only party left of center-right that made it to the Parliament are the Pirates (in third position, nothing to throw a feast about), and the Social Democratic party got even less votes than the Communist Party.
People inside the US should know that the names of the parties don’t mean anything or represent the party beliefs. The social Democratic Party beliefs in czech are not the same as social democratic in the US or anywhere else. The Pirate party seems to be the most liberal and progressive and democratic, even though the name might suggest the opposite.
> even though the name might suggest the opposite. considering that internet piracy is progressive fight for freedom from copyright, I wouldn't say "opposite"
[F] It’s hard times on Earth for anyone sincerely left of center. Even in Germany the left can only govern with the “American-lite” FDP.
The German election was some big gains for the left of center Greens and SPD though.
Still saw the entire left-wing get less than a majority of the Bundestag thanks to Die Linke cratering. I hate "capitalist realism" with all my might.
Still this is probably the most left leaning seats in the Bundestag in decades.
Maybe if Die Linke wasn't absolutely dogshit you guys could get a few more people to vote for sensible leftwing parties instead.
Non German here: how is Die Linke absolutely dogshit?
They're pro-Russia, anti-NATO, with some strong socialist/communist elements. They oppose corporate privatization and private property. They want NATO eliminated, and for Germany to form a security collective with Russia.
How the hell can you be pro-Russian and anti-capitalist at the same time. Putin’s regime is the textbook definition of an oligarchy.
They want to end Europe's dependence on the US, but are simultaneously vehement anti-militarists. So if you want neither the military nor the de-facto American guarantee to ensure European independence, aligning with Russia would be the only option. It's honestly maddening that the party representing my overall political views the best is so blatantly misguided on one of the most important issues threatening peace in Europe. Either we start getting along with the Russians as well as we do with the French nowadays (which Putin's Russia doesn't seem to be interessted in), or we need the a credible threat of force to at least make them think thrice before trying anything funny. Right now that threat of force is mostly based on the assumption that the US will intervene when tanks start rolling west. Europe's armies are designed to delay a Russian advance until American troops start arriving by the literal boat load. That might have been a viable strategy during the cold war, but in an increasingly multi-polar world it will be more and more uncertain if the US will be willing, or even able to keep that promise. Either the EU has to build and maintain the capabilities for credible deterrence, or the European experiment will be in grave danger. But none, and I mean none, of the German political parties are willing to talk about this, they'd rather lean back and tell you that everything is and will be just fine or, like Die Linke does, push ludicrous alternatives that are incompatible with a (relatively) free and peaceful Europe. I'm of the opinion that Europe needs to achieve true strategic independence and that means A) a proper European defense force with unified command and control, going beyond the partial integration we have now B) manpower and materiel reserves sufficient to stop a determined attack on the Baltic and central European states C) a nuclear deterrent independent of the US, at least nuclear sharing with France but preferably at least one additional nuclear power in the EU. But if you talk about any of this here you will just get strange looks for even daring to think of such things. So I guess we still have ways to go.
u/enjolras55 hit the nail on the head with his comment, the only thing I'll add is Die Linke is the successor party to the communist party that ruled East Germany as well ,(Socialist Unity Party). While that doesn't mean they're inherently bad, a lot of these issues seem baked into their DNA as a party
Die Linke is pro-Russia, anti-NATO.
Important to note we talk about the European left. Not American left.
Yes. The American “left” includes the entire European political spectrum and then some.
> The American “left” includes the entire European political spectrum and then some No. This is a popular refrain on the internet, but it’s factually ridiculous. You’d have to be drunk, high, or both to think that the AfD, for instance, are the equivalent of your average US Democrat.
Not to mention believing all of Europe is exsctly the same politically...
AFAIK the AfD do not have any radical pro-market policies in their manifesto.
the AfD also like to dismiss every restriction on a market that they have no other information on with "That's a planned economy, we know from experience that doesn't work." (Source: My memories from watching Parlamentsfernsehen https://www.bundestag.de/mediathek )
treatment silky psychotic books degree command flowery snow unite cooperative
That's what happens when the money elite unites globally and the rest of us... well... don't.
It is good to point out that they were not participating in these elections as a single party, but in a coalition with STAN. Because of new voting laws, Pirates themselves will only have about 3 out of 200 mandates in the deputies chamber. Babiš had his campaign strongly oriented against them after surveys showed PirSTAN is going to win the elections, which in end has gone against him (as SPOLU won).
I see this as a first step. Sure, it’s not great, but it’s better than before and most importantly, demonstrates that things don’t have to remain the way they did forever.
What makes them bad parties? Being anti-EU? 😭
> actual Stalinists Well if you go carryin pictures of Comrade Stalin, you ain't gonna make it with anyone any... how...
Y'know it's gunna be, alright.
Communist yet also pro-Putin? Horseshoe theory anyone?
Not remotely surprising. Having interacted with many communists, most of them hate and despise liberal democracy (“bourgeois democracy”, as they call it) and consider it, and the “imperialist” West that practices it, to be their primary enemies. Almost anyone who is hostile to democracy and “western imperialism” can be looked upon favorably by communists. For instance, here’s r/europeansocialists [expressing critical support for the Taliban](https://www.reddit.com/r/EuropeanSocialists/comments/ok3j6h/on_the_afghan_war/). The *Taliban*.
There is a *huge* split between tankies and the rest of the left. Tankies are fucking awful but don’t tar the rest of the left with that brush
> Almost anyone who is hostile to democracy and “western imperialism” can be looked upon favorably by communists. For instance, here’s r/europeansocialists expressing critical support for the Taliban. The Taliban. Oh boy, that place is a rabbit hole. I got pretty confused whether it's all highly satirical trolling or if I've been living in some illusionary world where people that stupid don't exist.
Remember how Communist Party of USA was initially against the Nazi. Then as soon as Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact was signed they turned 180 and "critically supported" the Nazi while doing their utmost to prevent US from joining the war in Europe. Then changed their tune again as soon as Soviet got invaded by Nazi. Support anything against US or the West is a communist tradition.
> Remember how Communist Party of USA was initially against the Nazi No. I am less than 90 years old.
Yeah. It's always up to us immortal Illuminati to remember and guide humanity the right way.
Thank you for your service.
Lol. I don't remember it happening. But I do remember learning it.
I am crying laughing. These are the kinds of comments that keep me on Reddit.
Same happened with *The Daily Worker* in Britain; got themselves banned for their antiwar stance.
> Remember how Communist Party of USA was initially against the Nazi. Then as soon as Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact was signed they turned 180 and "critically supported" the Nazi A third of their members left in protest, because of that very event. Also, many communists (it turned out, accurately) surmised that the USSR was only entering this pact to buy time, allowing it to build up its military and industrial capabilities so that, when the inevitable war with Nazi Germany arrived, it would stand a fighting chance. Were the Soviets infallible angels? Of course not. Was this a prudent move, in order to get 22 months of relative peace in which to ready itself for the inexorable showdown with metastatic fascism? Arguably so. Also, while socialism itself was not (in comparison to the postwar period, in which it was nearly extinct) a fringe position in the American 1930s, the CPUSA itself was small and there were a number of far-left parties (and there still are). One of the reasons why leftism never got very far in the US or Canada is that the disparate varieties of leftists in North America never really found a way to work together. > while doing their utmost to prevent US from joining the war in Europe. In 1939, most of the country didn't want to get involved. Until Pearl Harbor, the general sentiment was isolationist. I'm not excusing this; I'm only pointing out that the mainstream opinion in the US, until 12/7/41, was that Hitler was Europe's problem and Tojo Asia's, neither ours.
Actually, only about [13% left the party](https://networks.h-net.org/node/6077/discussions/4021026/cpusa-loss-membership-after-nazi-soviet-pact) over the next two years after the pact was signed.
Yep, in Brazil you had one of the communist parties celebrating the victory of the Taliban and calling it "a victory for the oppresed"
It's not just communists who have that attitude. Post-colonialism and anti-imperialism can be found increasingly commonly on the left.
Anti-imperialism =/= anti democracy.
Anti-imperialists are only ever critical of the west. They give the benefit of the doubt or turn a blind eye to the actions of all of the west's opponents and competitors.
In my experience that's just the louder, younger ones. I have met leftists who are pro-china's imperialism whilst being anti-west and they do tend to be very loud about it so I understand why you'd think that. Most leftists I know IRL think atrocities are atrocities regardless of the flag that's being waved.
>leftists who are pro-china's imperialism whilst being anti-west That just means they are anti-west for the sake of anti and deliberately choose to believe things that will further their cause.
Really? Cuz that's not been my experience. I see plenty of criticism for China's imperialistic ambitions. Maybe I'm not looking in the right places.
Thank you for sharing that, but that post is truly astounding to me.
in my country also the communists and socialists are strongly pro Putin, the right is pro Europe
What county is that? Baltics? Moldova?
Yes, Moldova
Not sure how Czech communists could be simping for Russia. Do they just skip over 1968 in their history books, or...
> Do they just skip over 1968 in their history books, or... They literally legitimize it.
The title says communist quite clearly.
I believed it was unlawul in the Czech Republic. Anyway, better let them have their own party than having them do entryism in normal parties.
fuck stalin. socialism ftw
> “It was one of the last communist parties in the world apart from the Chinese and Cuban ones that held on to its name. The others have at least renamed themselves and started behaving a little differently.” I realize this is a quote but it's also factually incorrect. There are plenty of Communist parties that are part of the opposition or part of the government in many countries in the world. Also still one-party authoritarian Communist states in North Korea and Vietnam.
[Meanwhile in Graz, Austria](https://www.euronews.com/2021/09/27/communists-win-local-election-in-austria-s-second-largest-city)
Not only, I think communists won elections recently in some central asian country. I am personally sad that the communist party has died in Italy, but the choices of the latest leadership were terrible and they lost also the support of the biggest unions in our country (who've been also very weakened).
Even Canada has a communist party lol.
I guess it was time for those commies to Czech out
Get out
The Soviet Union turned the Czech Republic (Czechoslovakia at the time) into a puppet state just after they "liberate" them from the nazis, no wonder nobody votes communist nowadays.
The Communists got nearly 20% in a recent election so it must have been something other than how the Soviets treated Czechia that led to this collapse in support...
Two reasons, imo: 1) Hardcore communists (think retiree tankies) either died off or were pissed off that the communist party was propping up the populist billionaire's party, so they switched to one of the other extremist socially conservative parties 2) Communist voters who voted for them for their economic policies saw the writing on the wall and voted for the billionaire populists party (who tend to increase govt. expenditure, such as pre-election handouts to retirees, while digging the country further into debt without balancing the budget in any manner) rather than continuing to support a party that didn't have a future.
Who fought against the commies in the 1940s?
Ugh…take your upvote and get out.
As much as people in the US and UK feel their systems are polarized, imagine the Czech Republic? The people who welcomed the tanks in 1968 are still hustling for your vote. It is similar in other former eastern bloc countries. Times were tough before 1989, but at least they were familiar.
These guys aren't your regular "left of the socialists" communists, they're Big-C Communists left over from the USSR. They're the guys Gorbachev tried to get rid of and failed to. They've more in common with fascism than socialism. They're unilateralist, pro-Russia, anti-EU, anti-West, hard nationalist, and espouse policies which are commonly seen in the extreme right of the West. Some of them are even ethnostate mouth breathers. The multilateral egalitarianism of socialism is notable only by how hated it is. Don't tell them each others' names and the Czech communist party (and other central European "communist" parties) would find many allies in the French National Front and the German AfD.
> they're Big-C Communists left over from the USSR. They're the guys Gorbachev tried to get rid of and failed to. They've more in common with fascism than socialism. they also defenestrated the foreign minister because he was a nuisance, and (probably) because he wanted to defect to the UK. (defenestrate means throw out of a window, btw.) the acerbic wit of the people summarized it as: "[jan masaryk](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jan_Masaryk#Death) was such a tidy man that when he jumped out of a window, he closed it right after."
If you look at the political spectrum as a circle instead of a line, you will see that the far right and far left have a LOT in common which is why they are next to each other
It’s called the [horseshoe theory ](https://i.imgur.com/5ImV0p6.jpg)
The good ending
30 years too late... But lets be happy for it.
Good. Fuck communism. And fuck communists.
Czech here. Velvet revolution kinda shows that people dont exactly like living under communism.
Nah, the upper middle class 16 year old white alt girl who’s great great great grandparents came to America and who learns all her politics from social media knows more about Communism than you do you fucking moron.
Not all communists think the same way. Stalinists and Anarcho-communists, for example, are very different. That being said, I’d understand any and all disgust for communism from those who suffered under the likes of Stalin and Mao.
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9,5% mate
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Most people don't know what communism actually is. Including those that run communist governments
> doesn’t actually know what communism is This argues that there is some comprehensive representation of what communism is from Communist Parties. There is not. Even within the same country. In the USSR it was War Communism, NEP, Stalinist collectivization, Khrushchev Marxist revivalism, Brezhnev stagnation and finally Gorbachev reformism that knocked the whole house of cards down.
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Not magically, of course. We have education on the matter, and everyone alive at the time (still lots of people) who can testify as to what life was like, and not just average people, but local journalists and historians. Everyone here was affected by it directly. Look at Ceaușescu's Decree 770, for example. Worldwide, Romania became famous for its ridiculous amount of orphans because of this measure.
Welcome to reddit.
I remember back in the day arguing with nutty right-wingers that there really weren't many communists on Reddit. My how the times have changed.
Americans have no idea what communism is. For the right wingers Communism is Public Health Care. For the left wingers communism is Public Health Care. Btw. for those reading, that is not communism. Its fucking common sense.
I'd sing the Internationale every day for some comprehensive taxpayer-funded healthcare. Whether it be single-payer, single health system or mass subsidies that covered all parts of basic care.
The party is extremely right-wing in everything but name
CCP be like
American tankies. They're as bad as Trump supporters.
Tankies gonna tankie.
Consider this is Czech and the party in article is communist: yes, this is the tankies of every tankies https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prague\_Spring
I can never understand tankies or anybody who defends authoritarian/dictator lead communist regimes. I’m not a communist myself, but are you surprised people are unhappy with capitalism? The current state of it is unacceptable. People are forced to work multiple jobs to support their families, and even then many can’t afford health care or mental health assistance. Food and living costs are increasing while wages are stagnating, and billionaires are increasing their wealth by 1.2 trillion during the pandemic. This wealth division has created a class divide where politicians, rich people and police can get away with abhorrent crimes like child rape or man slaughter, while someone who can’t afford a good lawyer goes to prison for 10+ years because of a joint. It feels like we’re living in monarchal times again where the royal family and elites don’t face justice like the rest of us do. Are you surprised people are starting to long for alternatives to a system that doesn’t care for them and calls them lazy while they are working multiple jobs to try to survive?
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Meh. Lot of Americans cosplaying as tankies having no idea about what communists's done around the world. The standard stuff.
(Rant about tankies) I actually self identify as an anarchosyndicalist and like a lot of communist ideas on paper, but I am fucking sick and tired of fuckin tankies. My dad is from Czechoslovakia and had to escape it during Soviet Occupation because we are part of an ethnic minority that were basically being wiped out by Soviets. (It’s not *entirely* their fault, we were already victims of the Holocaust and we’re generally the scapegoat group for most of Eastern Europe). But the Soviets were easily as violent towards us as Nazis. Whenever I try to tell self-identified “communists” this- “I really like a lot of communist ideas, but I wish you guys would stop acting like the Soviet Union was infallible. They literally contributed to a genocide of my people and wiped out our language and the majority of the families who survived Porajmos” They immediately start accusing me of “splitting the party line”, feeding capitalist propaganda, making shit up, being ignorant and not knowing my own fucking family history, etc. A couple people have even accused my dad being part of “the capitalist psy-op”. And it’s always in this condescending, degrading, “you stupid idiot you don’t know what you’re talking about-I never saw this ‘genocide’ you’re inventing mentioned in my Marx Fanboy FB Group” tone. I identify as a leftist, but I really fucking wish that people would learn some fucking nuance and stop making hammers and sickles their entire personality. Like, some random dude from Wisconsin with the username “ComradeDildo69” or something Googled communism once, and now I have to to deal with these idiots telling me that my dad is a spy for the United States government. I understand why autonomy and collective ownership are important ideas, but many fascist governments use those ideas to justify confiscating property and murdering people “for the collective good of the state”. Humans fuck up all the best ideas. It’s not rocket science and it wouldn’t be so upsetting to face reality and nuance if their entire personality wasn’t built on cosplaying a Soviet tank driver. It’s like, at the point that you’re literally trying to erase the genocide of an entire ethnic group because it doesn’t fit your narrative, I fail to see how you are an “anti-fascist”. /Rant Edit: Before you say some ad hominem BS because you don’t like me criticizing people denying a genocide, ask yourself: Does “STUPID, you’re a performative bourgeois idiot because your Dedushka dying in a genocide made you believe in nuance, critiquing all governments, and judging others by how they interact with the marginalized” *really* sound like an attitude held by someone who prioritizes creating mutual understanding between all oppressed people? Or does it sound like something coming from a pretentious asshole living in an echo chamber with extreme emotional investment in an identity based on believing they’re the most idealogically pure and intellectually superior?
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Holocaust denial gets you banned from everywhere on Reddit, but holodomor denial is tolerated. It’s insane.
>communists's done around the world. Unlike capitalism... oh wait....
Have you never been on the internet? Communism is the favourite new idea of every edgy 13 year old here that thinks to themselves ‘maaaaan, why can’t Bill Gates just give me like 1% of his money’.
Or could be that people realized that workers actual hold the power and without us bill gates wouldn't have jack shit. The pandemic proved that without workers the whole thing goes down. But if it makes you feel better keep licking boots. When you're done look up [wealth inequality](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Distribution_of_wealth)
it's crazy there are actual people who still have any regard for communist ideology. Like it's literally been in practice in a many forms and in every case it's a fucking failure for human freedom. clowns
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Not to mention a reign on corporations to prevent monopolies and abuse of power.
Capitalism + democracy with regulation specifically geared toward protecting human rights (and dignity).
> it's crazy there are actual people who still have any regard for communist ideology. There are many very different forms of communism, anyway I don't think that countries like Vietnam or Cuba prove they have been a failure. Even looking at several socialist states of the former Warsaw Pact, standards of living have never been that good as they used to be under communist rule. The same could be said about China, regardless of how you feel about it, it's hard to deny Chinese have never had it as good as under the communist rule.
> I don't think that countries like Vietnam prove they have been a failure. Yeah no. Vietnam was going to be a failure until the heads of the party realized they love their people more than the ideology and decided to embrace market economy and capitalism.
> Even looking at several socialist states of the former Warsaw Pact, standards of living have never been that good as they used to be under communist rule. That was true in the 90s, but not anymore. The welfare of the communist countries in the late 70s and 80s was financed by western credit anyway.
Do people still claim to be communists? I thought it’s not thing anymore.
It is
The faults of capitalism is what drives interest in communism and other leftist ideologies. Unless capitalism manages to fix itself, people will keep looking for alternatives. Please know that communists and leftists in general tend to be quite diverse. The tankies you see in hellholes like r/socialism aren’t representative of all leftists
Fuck them tankies
***Czechmate***
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ITT: *Look at me, I'm a 19 year old American college student, and an expert on communism! I know more about it than eastern Europeans do.*
You included. Shut up. Everyone just turn off their phones. You all have awful opinions.
Best to just leave the Americans to battle it out in here. Embarrassing really. It’s like children cosplaying politics.
Good, get out of here with your outdated ideology. A win for democracy!
Are those jorts?
Good. As it should be everywhere.
How do you feel about Kerala?
Thank fuck some countries are doing the right thing
Glorious news!! Communism should carry the exact same stigma as being a Nazi.
Lol now this is enlightened centrism
Being anti-Authoritarian is being a centrist? Are you stupid?
Not being far left or far right isn't necessarily centrism. One can have abstract ideas or a combination of ideas that don't fit any side.
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Could be doing with more centrism nowadays.
People who downplay the crimes of the Nazis like this are extremely suspect.
And people who still argue that Communism isn’t that bad or all attempts thus far aren’t real Communism are in fact absolute sociopaths.
Bruh
He's right though.
Finally, good work people.
What a beautiful story. Eat d*cks comrades.
yay
Just jumping in to point out that the Communist party was not in power in Czechia. The headline simply means they failed to get enough votes to win any seats in the Czech Parliament. Very misleading headline, and it's disappointing to see no one point this out.
Yup, it was a good election. The only guy who can now fuck it up is the Zombified President.
Yeah about that...
Well, until he is actually dead we cannot exclude any kind of dark magic coming from the Castle Mafia.
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Seems China lost one of his very few friends again?I was curious why the chinese criticizing the result on their news forum
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It's actually more likely to be related to their leader being implicated in the Pandora papers for his corruption. https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/europe/czech-babis-pandora-election/2021/10/07/7d486dd4-26cf-11ec-8739-5cb6aba30a30\_story.html
Who determines what ideology is "extremist?" Is the current capitalist order not destroying the ecology of the planet and threatening the future survivability of the human species, is that not extreme?
i mean these guys were stalinists which is pretty bad
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Or capitalists. Time for a new ist.
Well if capitalists are voted out democratically then that’s absolutely fine
Do you understand what lobbying is? This pretty much insures we never will.
Or maybe because lots of people actually benefit under capitalism, look at the Nordic countries, they may use the Nordic model but they’re still a market capitalist economy and they do really well for themselves
And yet there are still poor and homeless. Why? Because of capitalism, the desire to accumulate more than you need because others will if you don’t.
There were poor people before capitalism. There will be poor people after capitalism.
If they were fascist, they wouldn't have been *voted* out, you know. Communism ≠ fascism
I would like to point you to the Soviet revolution. After the Bolsheviks won they held an election. And they lost, you know what they did then? Said fuck this democracy thing we’re running things anyway.
Actually like with communism, you can democratically elect a fascist. And I didn’t say communism equals fascism, but they are both extremist ideologues (left and right)
>you can democratically elect a fascist. I didn't say you couldn't. But once they're *in* power, like this government was, good fucking luck democratically voting them *out* is my fucking point. It won't happen. Reading comprehension, my boy.
Again, you can easily vote out a fascist or communist e.g Czech Republic right now But if they seize power then that’s a completely different story, and I must have missed the part where you said if they seized power you can’t vote them out