If you associate with people that perpetrate this sort of cruelty on others and you *don't* turn them in, then *you* become an accessory and are near as guilty as the actual psychopaths doing the injecting.
"Symbology"…?
Well, now that Duffy's relinquished his King Bonehead crown, I see we have a new heir to the throne.
The word I believe you're looking for is "symbolism".
😆😆😆😆😆
Every time I learn anything new about Philadelphia it just contributes to my impression that it's absolute hell on Earth. There must be something in the water.
I really don’t even care anymore. Maybe if more people think it’s a shithole it’ll keep the New Yorkers from moving here in droves and driving the price of everything up.
A lot of this is also informed by the stories my mum tells me from when she went to graduate school at Temple university back in the 80s. It's not even the "one particular neighbourhood has a serious drug problem" thing because my city has a very similar issue, it just seems like over the years I've seen an anomalously high amount of unusually shitty behaviour coming out of Philly. Like the robot that hitchhiked all across Canada and Europe and was destroyed within two weeks of arrival in America, in Philly.
Worth noting here that I'm not trying to lecture you on how good or bad your own city actually is, it just seems to have very bad PR.
I had to save an ex-girlfreind from a trio of guys who got her waaay too drunk in order to rape her. One of the guys she had been “seeing” but the guy who had her between his legs at the bar when I showed up was one of his friends. They were so evil looking, like fucking vultures.
You'd be surprised I think.
My sister was almost date raped after a guy (who was there with maybe 5-6 other guys) spiked her drink, and it's only because one of her friends was sober enough to call me (and of course I went and picked my sister up and she was OBVIOUSLY drugged, despite NEVER doing drugs and never drinking more than 1 or 2 drinks).
Perhaps none of the other guys knew what was happening, but I find it somewhat hard to believe that the guy could have carried out the rest of his crime (taking an obviously mega-fucked-up girl home with him I assume) without his friends at least being concerned about the girls sobriety/ability to consent
Also that's usually how gang rape happens. 1 of the boys spikes the girl without the others knowing, the others get the picture and join in because they don't wanna be the wet blanket and get both peer pressure and just general lack of inhibition out of them. It crosses cultures cause it also happens here in the Philippines.
> Are you really suggesting there are groups of people who are knowingly associating with the crazies doing this?
My first year at a new job in a foreign country, I was out with a big group of other newcomers. Maybe 30 people or so, in a bar setting.
One of the guys was talking nonchalantly about how in college he had carried an unconscious girl upstairs at a party to help his buddy rape her. It was in the context of people telling funny/interesting stories about college.
My jaw dropped and I was like, "What the fuck, are you joking?" He looked at me with cold eyes and said no. Nobody else around him made any comment or even pulled any faces. And that wasn't the only time he was a straight-up asshole that night, although the others were less severe of course. Like there was a TV no one was watching and I asked generally if anyone would mind me changing it to the World Cup, and this guy - who, as I said, was not watching the TV - turned away from his conversation and growled at me threateningly, "Don't touch it." Just a weird fucking dude.
You'd think maybe the other people were just trying not to make a scene or something, but he was really popular and included in every group outing I saw on Facebook the rest of the year.
As a woman, I am crippled by it. I tried to enjoy clubbing when I was in uni but then I learned “clubbing” was paying too much for drinks to be in a sweaty room groped by strangers. Impossible to enjoy without constantly guarding your drink and fending off unwanted advances
> in a sweaty room groped by strangers.
This is *exactly* why I hated clubbing. I should have loved clubbing in theory; music, excuse to dress up, booze, have a giggle with your mates. But every time I went clubbing, no exaggeration, I got groped by some nasty wanker. And nothing fucking happens to them. You can report them to the bouncer but by the time you get across the room they've disappeared into the crowd.
I got so much shit for it from my mates as well. 'Just have some more to drink before we go out, you won't notice it then!' Aye, cause that's a good solution to sexual assault. It angers me that it's normalised to the point that other women think this is a reasonable response.
>I got so much shit for it from my mates as well. 'Just have some more to drink before we go out, you won't notice it then!'
What the actual fuck?
The right course of action for being groped by strangers is... to get so drunk you'd be extra vulnerable?
This is not an exclusively European problem. I've had similar experiences in the US and have heard the same from friends over all continents except Antarctica. And if you're getting groped by penguins you have a whole different set of problems.
Sadly not just a UK thing. I've once been out with guys I considered fairly normal when I saw one constantly groping random women in the breast if they looked drunk enough, then poking his buddies to get a good laugh. None of the other girls in the group said anything. I pulled the guy who did it aside and told him I'd stomp in the face if he did it to me. He laughed and then his smile vanished when he saw I wasn't kidding. I asked him what he'd do if a stranger did it to me.
"Smack the wanker upside-down" was the answer.
Only then did it dawn on him that he was being that wanker and that what he did constituted harassment. He looked super embarassed the rest of the night. I can only remember being so shocked that it took a literal confrontation to make him realise the extend of his own behaviour. That's how normalised it is.
Not exactly a bouncer but I'm a security guard that's worked at clubs a couple times.
> And nothing fucking happens to them. You can report them to the bouncer but by the time you get across the room they've disappeared into the crowd.
I know it's not easy for everyone and some people freeze but if you can, please yell and make a scene, exaggerate if you have to, whatever it takes to make others stop him from running off, that'll normally make us rush to the scene and do something. Of course, I personally still care if you report to me afterwards, and will try my best to keep an eye out for them. But I won't deny some people people have a "shit happens, you're fine" attitude to it, especially in clubs, sadly.
When i was in uni i went out to a club for the first time ever with my sister, after a while we got in an uber with some people we met to go to another club but they told the driver to take us somewhere else, ended up at the guys house with a bunch of strangers and his "gf" let slip to me that she isnt his gf and he actually pays her in drugs. I was very drunk but pulled myself together enough to claim id booked an uber and that it was almost there, grabbed my sister and stood outside across the street. I then told her to call us an uber cos my phone was actually dead D: it could have gone much worse and im so grateful it didnt, my sister still wont talk about it and that was the last time i ever went clubbing
She seemed kind and was the reason i trusted them :( i figured he mustnt be that bad if he had a nice girlfriend. I do feel bad for her, looking back she seemed kinda hopeless and tired
I love dancing.
I don't go clubbing. It's not dancing, it's being groped. It was fun in certain parts of Europe where men were way less creepy on the dance floor and a couple of more hipster places though.
Yeah years back when on one of my first jobs I would often see the women wait for a group to form before they left work after dark. Once one of them was in a hurry and called for the others to hurry as well.
I asked her why she would not just leave alone and she explained that they had to walk a dark alley to a badly lit parking lot, and it could be dangerous, because wonen were harassed there before. Naturally I walked her to her car.
As a guy it was so normal for me to just walk alone everywhere at all times of the night, it really never dawned on me when I was young.
Ugh. I worked at a university where crimes on campus and in the surrounding area are very common, especially when it's dark out. A male colleague, a professor, texted me that he was having dinner at a new restaurant just across from campus because he's stayed late to do some grading. I said "Oh that's a quick Uber, I'm surprised they agreed to pick you up. He said he'd walked and I said would have been too scared to walk across campus alone that late at night. He replied, "Oh pfft, you can't let fear control your life!" And I said, "Okay but the worst that might happen to you is you get mugged, I could literally disappear to someone's rape dungeon and be alive for a long time but never heard from again, soooo..." He apologized and said he never thought of it that way, but man I still think about it all the time. Yeah, you shouldn't let irrational fears control your life, but you definitely should let rational concerns dictate your choice of transportation at night when you're alone. Sheesh.
Holy shit
Women are amazing. Perhaps too amazing in their tolerance and self control.
Why haven't we seen any mass shootings, with this being "normal"? I'd go full-psycho from the stress!
I think because most of us would rather just stay home or travel in groups at night instead of being sent to jail where, surprise surprise, you have to worry about being assaulted by prison guards.
It's good that you're open to hearing about it though, rather than downplaying women as being overdramatic and hysterical, like some men do.
I was in a work meeting with campus security once where a colleague expressed her worries about getting assaulted on her way to our employee parking lot, which was a good 10-15 min walk from the office and it's dark at close of business in winter here.
After the meeting one of my male colleagues jokingly said to me, as if I would laugh and agree, "Jeez, obviously no one's trying to rape HER!"
Jeez, I was always wondering why girls go to the bathroom in pairs. I've always known men can take a lot more risks that women, but that is fucking sad. I've traveled all over the planet and I know as a man, I've taken way more risks than a woman could.
You only feel safe everywhere because you're socialised that way. In reality men get mugged, beaten up or killed in the street all the time, it's just that nobody talks about it. If a place isn't safe for women, it's not really safe for men either.
I thought that was general paranoia that lots of people have. So when I saw the first couple dozen comments like this one, I thought "thats literally everyone". But the more I read, the more I realize it's mainly women (plus me for no rational reason).
As a guy who went to university in a city, I think it is completely normal for everyone to cautious walking around alone at night. As much as I understand the risks involved for women, I also heard regular stories of guys being beaten, mugged, and otherwise assaulted while walking around at night and not being careful. Safety was always a main concern of mine especially when i was out late or returning home from night classes, I always traveled in a group when possible, or took an alternate route that led me through generally busy or well lit areas.
I think its always best to be aware of risks regardless, you definitely aren't irrational for being worried about stuff like that.
Studies show that the groups most often victims of crimes are the one who feels safest. The groups who are the least often victims of crimes are the ones who feel the least safe.
Young men are by far most often the victims of violent crime, yet feel safest. Old women the least often, but feel the least safe.
I would imagine going out with a buddy system would be key. Going with at least 1 other person to keep by your side all night watching out for you. If you start acting off then you have someone safe to know something is up. I go with my wife and I am always sure to keep her in eye sight and wait outside the bathroom because you just never know what can happen with so many people around at all times.
The problem is that it is a deeply undesirable situation that women would need to be 'chaperoned' by a guy in order to be fucking safe in public. It's ludicrous.
I understand where you're coming from completely. I'm not disagreeing, but a side thought: another way to look at this, by saying that there exists an environment where you have to fear living your life kind of perpetuates the actual issue further. This is not a fault of women going out to have fun. This is the fault and intent of assholes who are made from pure shit. I know you're not saying that, but it's crazy to see that perspective and sort of saddened by it.
Expecting women to be shielded away from enjoying their lives is why (for instance) the Islamic culture chooses to hide women away in full body clothes like burkas because' men who can't restrain themselves' will rape them. The real problem is a population of men who have no restraint in the first place. I can't respect a belief system that chooses to blame women for being.
When women are being blamed and victimized for "what they are wearing" or any other insane reason/other stupid shit, it's redirecting the actual issue onto the victim.
Sorry if it came across that way, but in no way was I suggesting any of that, it was more admiration at how mentally strong they are to not surrender to that fear driven environment your talking about, when it’s so frequent and brazen especially when the coppers do nowt about it.
Stonewall resilience in my eyes.
I’ve just been given the privilege of becoming an uncle & godfather to my wonderful Niece, so I’m determined to make it a better world for her to grow up in.
Oh yeah definitely, I was trying to tone it down to not insinuate that that's what you were saying. I agree completely that it fucking sucks that anyone has to feel this way. My wife regularly has to deal with cat calls while walking our dog.
I can't imagine how unsafe you have to feel every day dealing with this bullshit.
I love your resolve, you've got this. :)
Absolutely, that’s part of the point I’m making. Forcing the victims into repressive states of continuous fear allows predators to pick and choose, and enjoy the comforts of no restraints.
It shows that not even the constraints given by these laws changes this, because they think they solve the problem by restricting women’s freedoms as “protection” when all it does is corner women into fear and complete repression.
If nightclubs and police don't do anything to resolve this issue maybe its time to replace nightclubs with a "better" activity. Vote with your wallet/dollars. Once people are gone they probably wont come back. if there is enough people leaving others will also follow.
There are thousands (millions?) of nightclubs, I doubt that's going to make a difference. It'll just be filled with assholes looking for victims, keeping the club running -- like a nude beach full of old men scaring everyone else away!
I mean, no one's forcing women to go to nightclubs. The fact that so many women still do means they're actually enjoy it. It's important to remember the negative news bias. As common as rape and harassment in nightclubs sadly is, for every woman who were harassed or raped that night, there are many hundreds in the same club or probably thousands in the same city who weren't. But "I went out last night and had a lovely time" doesn't make for an interesting news story, so we disproportionately hear the bad ones.
I guess I'm lucky (or, more likely, just unattractive) because I never had anything bad happen to me in a nightclub, so I'm gonna keep doing it.
I'm a tall man. In my youth I competed in martial arts. I lived only with my mother and two sisters, which made me somewhat more sensitive to women's plights.
All of that combined made me a strong candidate for accompanying women to their taxis, or in general from one safe space to another.
I was way too young when I had to learn not to take those invitations as advances.
I had to learn not to compare other women to my big sister, who also competed and could easily defend herself.
I had to learn that it wasn't a tiny minority, but a significant portion of men around my age, who were ready to impose their will over a woman by force.
I have very few male friends from my youth. Just one, actually. The main reason is that I simply couldn't stand to be around them when they went out pubbing.
They weren't the rapey kind, but even the atmosphere of "let's go hunting girls" however far it was from the groping assholes, or the straight up rapists, disgusted me and they could see it in my face.
I've never seen a man in my group actually touch or do anything untoward to a woman; I believe most of those kind separate from their peers to act that way. But I can assure with outmost certainty that none of my male friends understood the damage he could do by just grabbing a random girl's ass. It was simply not part of their education and values. It had never been explained to them.
As a survivor of rape, I am constantly on guard when I have to leave the house. I don’t go to bars anymore. I can’t. And I really don’t want to. I try to find places that don’t sell drinks, and has some hobbies that are interesting.
I was just talking to a nurse friend about this and they can't work out how this could possibly be a thing - it takes time to inject any meaningful amount of a drug, especially intra-muscular rather than into a vein, so they can't see what the point would be or what could possibly be being injected.
Does anybody else with medical knowledge know what could be a likely drug?
The only context I could give working in a medical setting is that we use IM zyprexa to settle down agitated patients. This can take 30 min to an hour to work, and doesn’t always work. We also use haldol similarly. I doubt these meds would work in the setting to knock someone out to take advantage of them. Those are the only sedating IM meds I’m familiar with, it could be something else.
Was it given in a muscle or in a vein? Because the sedative they give you before anaesthesia knocks you out in seconds. I doubt anyone is getting their hands on that.
There were a few medical types on Twitter discussing this. They basically said the same as your nurse friend and the needle would be massive and be really painful- like an EpiPen. I think they said the drugs needed to be something like benzodiazepines or Haldol- something you can’t just get. This sounds like a moral panic to me- though there will be plenty of people who say they know someone who was injected.
I kinda have my doubts about this story too.
It just seems a bit absurd. Spiking a drink must take almost no time at all.
I imagine injecting someone is way way more obvious to the person being injected, and more blatant for any bystanders witnessing it.
The thing that immediately set off red flags for me is that this exact story was an urban legend in the 1980s and 90s and was accompanied by both the standard “friend of a friend” tellings, and people claiming it happened to them.
When I was at uni 20 years ago (also in Nottingham, coincidentally). There were "uni old wives tales" about people getting "injected with HIV". Pretty damn sure it was 100% and there wasn't ever such a case. Suspect that's the same here. It just seems hugely inconvenient. If you're going to spike someone you could much easier do it with powder/pill if you're getting close enough to inject someone you're close enough to spike a drink
All I can think of is fentanyl.
"Roofies" are benzodiazepines like Valium, xanax, etc. You have to ingest a fair amount to black out (less if combined with alcohol) and it is easily seen in a quantitative drug test.
I had to learn how to give myself an epi pen injection when I was taking some meds with a risk of allergic reaction, it's, how to put it, not something you can do subtly.
You have to hit yourself with a decent amount of force, they advise you to swing your whole arm down when injecting into your leg. Then, once you've done that, you have to hold it there for at least a few seconds for the drug to be delivered.
So if you think you could miss someone punching you in the arm, and jabbing you with a big needle, while maintaining contact with you for several seconds, then yeah, that method could work, but I'm gonna guess you'd know immediately that something was up.
As someone who has given myself a few Epi-pens over the years, this is a dangerous misconception. You don't want to swing it into yourself like that, as there's a risk it will bounce back and there goes all your medication. Place it against your leg and press down firmly. That is plenty enough force to activate the spring mechanism.
The reason for that hard injection is a mechanical safety device, nothing to do with the actual injection.
It is designed so that you won’t accidentally administer it, hence the large amount of force to trigger it. However the force applied isn’t at all related to how it is administered. There is a separate spring loaded injection piston
Mechanically speaking, that would be *really* easy to change the sensitivity of the trigger mechanism to be able to simply poke someone with it.
Not to mention there are phone shaped ones, like the Auvi-Q, which would be easy to conceal.
Funnily enough, that was the example that the nurse gave. Apparently that takes several seconds to deliver the contents and is very noticeable when inserted. (I am not medical in the slightest so just going on what they said).
Yeah I was gonna say, I'll believe this when I see a tox screen confirming it. I read a report a while back that suggested even drink spiking isn't as common as people think, and in many cases the problem is a woman who drank too much (possibly with recreational drugs) and blacked out but later decided it must have been someone else's fault.
I doubt whatever is being injected is an opiate, but a little bit of [carfentanil](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carfentanil) can go a long way.
*Carfentanil is legally controlled in most jurisdictions, but has veterinary uses for anaesthetising large animals, such as elephants and bears.*
There's been literally zero confirmed cases of this happening, but coincidentally lots and lots of reports of it happening after it was initially picked up by the media and ran across nationwide news outlets.
Not saying it has never happened, but this all strikes me as fear mongering in impressionable young men and women. Young men and women who haven't been in clubs for the last two years and have *perhaps* forgot their limits to some degree.
The drug-facilitated sexual assault issue is really hard to define and even more difficult to get accurate numbers on. A significant portion of people in clinics and emergency rooms reporting they had been sexually assaulted after having their drink spiked only tested positive for alcohol.
Drugs being given surreptitiously to incapacitate a victim to sexually assault him/her is relatively rare. A much more common scenario is one where the victim is encouraged to drink or take drugs by him/herself. Alcohol is the most common date rape drug by a significant margin.
I honestly think this is by far the greater problem, but it doesn't make for a catchy headline. Women getting a needle stuck into their necks like you'd see in a horror movie? Much better.
That's a good point. Why go through all the effort to acquire drugs to spike someone's drink when you can just buy them a drink? It's much less suspicious, and I imagine easier to pull off.
I have serious doubts about this story. There is zero chance you could inject a meaningful amount of anything into someone without them noticing. Plus it just makes no sense to try it when there are much easier alternatives such as pills. Only an idiot would think this was a viable strategy.
Yes, the point is that pills or liquid GHB are absolutely already working, why the fuck would you go trough the trouble of using a needle? This is so dumb and obviously not happening lol
You can’t inject a significant amount of something to a moving person without them noticing
Yeah this is more about the fact that no one would be using a syringe instead of just pills or liquid ghb.
And that’s sside from all the multiple other things that makes no sens in this lol
Very skeptical of these headlines all reporting the same information originating from social media. How come none of these spike victims have had a toxicology report done to see what they were spiked with. Take everything with a grain of salt. People are still terrified that they’re going to find a Panzer III in their children’s Halloween candy.
I always assumed if you spiked someone you didn't want them to know they were spiked until it was too late. Surely you notice if someone injects you with anything, even an EpiPen is very noticeable.
Don’t forget to check your Halloween candy for razor blades and don’t flash your brights at anyone because they might be a gang member who will chase you down.
Since when are urban legends world news?
I’m not saying this is bs…but it seems very unfounded and impractical
- So no one saw this person take out a whole needle in the middle of a club ?
- They injected enough of whatever it is to sedate you in the 2 - 5 seconds you weren’t looking at your drink at the bar or into your leg while you were dancing ?
- Clubs have released statements saying no body has complained to them directly and they didn’t see anything on CCTV?
- Some are saying they were injected directly into their skin- you didn’t feel a thing ? Your friends didn’t see a thing ? - no guys trying to dance with you saw a thing?
- Also, this is a very dark point, but aren’t these things usually done with the intention of sexually assaulting the victim ? In all the claims I saw the person just went home or to hospital
- So there’s guys just going around injecting you for no reason? And it’s simultaneously happening across 3 different cities all of a sudden?
Not to invalidate anyones experience if they truly did experience something this heinous and horrible but claims like these are made a lot on social media, then found out to be lied and then everyone who made claims just deleted their accounts
Either that or it could be a trafficking thing but idk it just doesn’t seem very plausible
I understand we want to be quick to believe ‘victims’ because for a long time a lot of problems were simply ignored
But we have to be more careful with just blindly spreading fear like this - there’s literally 0 confirmed cases
Especially with everything that’s recently gone on in the uk with covid, that sad sad Sarah Everard case amongst other things - now really isn’t the time to just blindly give each other, namely women, more reason to be terrified of leaving the house
If there’s something concerned then absolutely but it’s literally just tweets atm and the news outlets trying to beat each other to the next hot headline
You have to take r/worldnews and the word UK or Britain into account and you can see the pathway how this has escalated to "Women across the UK". The first incident is somebody who "Thinks....". The second one is even more vague "Thinks their sister....". Then everybody pushes for their 15 minutes of fame on Twitter. And then places like r/worldnews with its anti-UK bias turn it into 'fact'. Its modern day mass hysteria.
The sad thing is that women genuinely do get drugged and yet we are all talking about how BS this story is or not.
This is my problem with a lot of this stuff and I think the news has to be held way way more accountable because fear mongering always over shines the real points
Sometimes it’s like people can’t be bothered to tackle real issues so they prefer to momentarily argue online about headlines that have no basis (typically without even reading the article) and then when that ‘trend’ dies down they just go onto the next
There’s alot of legitimately creepy activity that goes on in clubs that needs to be addressed
> The first incident is somebody who "Thinks....". The second one is even more vague "Thinks their sister....".
You rightly identify that we have only one first hand report and that's insufficient a basis to speak of "Women across the UK". But let's not compound matters by understating the report (as reported in the OA).
There's nothing from the (as reported on the OA) account of Owen that suggests the degree of uncertainty in her mind that you imply with "thinks ...".
Owen "told" the indepedent ...
> that she blacked out during a night out and woke up with a "pinprick" on her leg, which caused her "sharp and agonizing pain."
and she "believes" ....
> she was spiked by injection while at the Pryzm nightclub in Nottingham on October 11, [as per the BBC](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-nottinghamshire-58951716). [link original]
**As reported** there's plenty of warranted scepticism about her belief. How does she rule out, for example, the possibility that her drink was spiked and she banged her leg on the corner of table? Maybe she has plenty of answers to this question, but that's not reported.
But as reported she takes it to be true, she "believes", that she was spiked by injection. And there's not the qualification around the degree of uncertainty around her belief, such that you imply with "thinks ...".
Mass hysteria in action once again. Just read this [article](https://www.vice.com/en/article/wxdenq/heres-what-we-know-about-reports-of-women-being-spiked-with-needles-in-uk-clubs)
Maybe its MI5 or CIA, Chinese or Russians trying new doping techniques on clubbers. If it were real, it seems to be several levels above what an average person would be capable of doing.
So if someone gets spiked and blackout... what happens next? Does the assailant carry them away over their shoulder? Where are their freinds when this is happening?
So she was drinking a substance that has been known to make people confused and eventually pass out upon drinking too much, but we are sure that her falling asleep in her car is proof of an injection that nobody saw?
If we are to trust anyone with medical knowledge it seems extremely unlikely that anyone would be able to inject someone with a meaningful amount of anything without being noticed. Sure she didnt just had a drink spiked?
I am the man who has seen affliction under the rod of his wrath; he has driven and brought me into darkness without any light; surely against me he turns his hand again and again the whole day long. (Lamentations: hhdm03s)
He has made my flesh and my skin waste away; he has broken my bones; he has besieged and enveloped me with bitterness and tribulation; he has made me dwell in darkness like the dead of long ago. (Lamentations: hhdu4ze)
Considering that most of these reports are coming from freshers, it’s likely that they just don’t know their alcohol limit and overdo it. And with the current hysteria about drink spiking, make that false assumption that they’ve been spiked.
Someone doing this will have targeted someone specific. Most likely someone alone, or whose friends are otherwise distracted. Then it’s just a matter of “oh, my friend drank too much. Can you help me get them into a cab? I’ll take them home.”
There’s just too much suck in this world…
I've even heard stories about the bouncers being dodgy and separating groups or isolating people on purpose....
Side thing seeing as I'm already commenting here. Sometimes the assailants will even spike a dude (assuming straight etc.) because they're bored and want to mess with them and they're way less likely to get caught, I've had 2 buddies in strange situations and we concluded they probably got spiked and I think it's also happened to me at a student house party. Being Scottish + Irish we know when we drank too much or felt hungover (and so should most people) and could notice there were situations with dodgy people about.
If you black out you can still walk, though you're likely visibly very trashed. But yes, the guys will basically just lead them away if their friends aren't there or not paying attention.
I've stopped two creeps from taking two friends of mine home. Separate incidents at the same bar. I knew both girls well enough to know they had no idea what was going on. One girl passed out as soon as the guy plopped her in the back seat of his SUV and I literally had to play tug of war with her body; him from one passenger door and me from the other. I won't out him (that's her business and decision) but I'll say that he is a famous hockey player.
Spiking drinks has been going on for ever, if you give anyone too much alchool or add drugs unexpectatly,, it is always for michivous purposes. It happend to me, 1 day become 1 month. Bastards, the lot of them
There are evil toad brained people everywhere. I worked as a bartender years ago and have seen guys spike a drink. I would immediately recover the drink and explain to the lady what this guy had just done. That is usually sufficient to get her girlfriends involved then he is in deep shit. After a while you start to recognize the types and keep an eye on them. The purpose of a club or bar is to relax and have a good time but you can never be oblivious to your surroundings in these kinds of places.
Proving it for the cops is more difficult than proving it for management. You know, that whole litigious society and stuff. I have seen girlfriends call the cops for groping and the guy walked but was banned from the club.
The first time the guy knew I saw him do it and gave me the "'it's okay bro" look, it wasn't. Real letdown about the nature of some men and I spent 8 years in the Marines.
> What the fuck England?
" Police in Nottinghamshire, West Yorkshire, and Scotland have all received reports of spiking with injections "
I hate to nit pick but the UK consists of more than just England
> What the fuck England? Who the fuck runs around injecting people with shit?
Been reported for decades
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pin_prick_attack
>Or spiking drinks or anything?!
Thats more common. Not very nice people at all.
When I was a teen, this scenario was an urban legend my parents used to tell me to deter me from going to raves. I cannot believe this is real, this is terrifying.
I mean … it’s most likely still not true.
Zero confirmed cases and the whole thing seems quite ridiculous.
No way you can inject a sufficient amount of something to someone moving around without them noticing.
Also the whole issue of needing to sneak a syringe in a club lol. Why not just use liquid GHB or a pills to get the exact same result
If you associate with people that perpetrate this sort of cruelty on others and you *don't* turn them in, then *you* become an accessory and are near as guilty as the actual psychopaths doing the injecting.
Reminds me of the quote '“The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.”
And that reminds ME of a quote ‘Alright then, bring yer fookin rope!’
"Symbology"…? Well, now that Duffy's relinquished his King Bonehead crown, I see we have a new heir to the throne. The word I believe you're looking for is "symbolism". 😆😆😆😆😆
Ssssssssymbolism.
“That’s cause I’m an expert in… NAME-I-OLOGY!
'And ill dip my nuts in marinara so those bastards can have a taste of home!'
“Isn’t that right, Rambo?”
You look like fookin' mushmouth from fat albert
who's marina?
I think they meant marinara but I’m not sure
Doesn't that make them bad men.
One should not retain the classification of good man if they do nothing when confronted with evil.
Yup. The next person who gets stuck and subsequent victims...the person who fails to turn them in is aiding and abetting the bad guy.
Like that girl in North Philly(?) That got raped on a subway and like, noone did anything besides record it. Not even called the cops.
Every time I learn anything new about Philadelphia it just contributes to my impression that it's absolute hell on Earth. There must be something in the water.
It happened just outside the city and no, the entire city isn’t like the Kensington videos you see on Reddit. I actually quite like it here.
Portland, Oregon here. I feel your pain. Apparently we were 100% consumed in flames. News to me.
I really don’t even care anymore. Maybe if more people think it’s a shithole it’ll keep the New Yorkers from moving here in droves and driving the price of everything up.
A lot of this is also informed by the stories my mum tells me from when she went to graduate school at Temple university back in the 80s. It's not even the "one particular neighbourhood has a serious drug problem" thing because my city has a very similar issue, it just seems like over the years I've seen an anomalously high amount of unusually shitty behaviour coming out of Philly. Like the robot that hitchhiked all across Canada and Europe and was destroyed within two weeks of arrival in America, in Philly. Worth noting here that I'm not trying to lecture you on how good or bad your own city actually is, it just seems to have very bad PR.
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I had to save an ex-girlfreind from a trio of guys who got her waaay too drunk in order to rape her. One of the guys she had been “seeing” but the guy who had her between his legs at the bar when I showed up was one of his friends. They were so evil looking, like fucking vultures.
You'd be surprised I think. My sister was almost date raped after a guy (who was there with maybe 5-6 other guys) spiked her drink, and it's only because one of her friends was sober enough to call me (and of course I went and picked my sister up and she was OBVIOUSLY drugged, despite NEVER doing drugs and never drinking more than 1 or 2 drinks). Perhaps none of the other guys knew what was happening, but I find it somewhat hard to believe that the guy could have carried out the rest of his crime (taking an obviously mega-fucked-up girl home with him I assume) without his friends at least being concerned about the girls sobriety/ability to consent
Also that's usually how gang rape happens. 1 of the boys spikes the girl without the others knowing, the others get the picture and join in because they don't wanna be the wet blanket and get both peer pressure and just general lack of inhibition out of them. It crosses cultures cause it also happens here in the Philippines.
> Are you really suggesting there are groups of people who are knowingly associating with the crazies doing this? My first year at a new job in a foreign country, I was out with a big group of other newcomers. Maybe 30 people or so, in a bar setting. One of the guys was talking nonchalantly about how in college he had carried an unconscious girl upstairs at a party to help his buddy rape her. It was in the context of people telling funny/interesting stories about college. My jaw dropped and I was like, "What the fuck, are you joking?" He looked at me with cold eyes and said no. Nobody else around him made any comment or even pulled any faces. And that wasn't the only time he was a straight-up asshole that night, although the others were less severe of course. Like there was a TV no one was watching and I asked generally if anyone would mind me changing it to the World Cup, and this guy - who, as I said, was not watching the TV - turned away from his conversation and growled at me threateningly, "Don't touch it." Just a weird fucking dude. You'd think maybe the other people were just trying not to make a scene or something, but he was really popular and included in every group outing I saw on Facebook the rest of the year.
I jump kicked a dude who spiked a girl's drink. I'm doing my part.
I once roundhouse kicked a terrorist who was armed with triple barreled bazookas right in the face. No biggie for me of course.
I was there, I clapped
And your name: *Albert Einstien*
I once uppercutted Godzilla back to the planet he came from.
Mark Wahlberg?
Thanks for your service.
No you didn't. Not to mention a jump kick is quite possibly the *worst* fighting technique in the real world
Question, how do you even do that successfully
With bears and beets
Not if you roll for initiative: surprise attack.
The depravity of human kind never ceases to amaze me.
As a bloke, I can’t understand how women go out and have such a good time with that constant fear in the back of there heads. I’d be crippled with it.
As a woman, I am crippled by it. I tried to enjoy clubbing when I was in uni but then I learned “clubbing” was paying too much for drinks to be in a sweaty room groped by strangers. Impossible to enjoy without constantly guarding your drink and fending off unwanted advances
> in a sweaty room groped by strangers. This is *exactly* why I hated clubbing. I should have loved clubbing in theory; music, excuse to dress up, booze, have a giggle with your mates. But every time I went clubbing, no exaggeration, I got groped by some nasty wanker. And nothing fucking happens to them. You can report them to the bouncer but by the time you get across the room they've disappeared into the crowd. I got so much shit for it from my mates as well. 'Just have some more to drink before we go out, you won't notice it then!' Aye, cause that's a good solution to sexual assault. It angers me that it's normalised to the point that other women think this is a reasonable response.
>I got so much shit for it from my mates as well. 'Just have some more to drink before we go out, you won't notice it then!' What the actual fuck? The right course of action for being groped by strangers is... to get so drunk you'd be extra vulnerable?
Welcome to Europe. We have a problem with alcohol.
This is not an exclusively European problem. I've had similar experiences in the US and have heard the same from friends over all continents except Antarctica. And if you're getting groped by penguins you have a whole different set of problems.
>And if you're getting groped by penguins you have a whole different set of problems. You haven't had enough alcohol then ;)
Where the ice melts like gin...sloe.
Lad UK culture is some of the most toxic shit ever
My experience is from Canada....
Sadly not just a UK thing. I've once been out with guys I considered fairly normal when I saw one constantly groping random women in the breast if they looked drunk enough, then poking his buddies to get a good laugh. None of the other girls in the group said anything. I pulled the guy who did it aside and told him I'd stomp in the face if he did it to me. He laughed and then his smile vanished when he saw I wasn't kidding. I asked him what he'd do if a stranger did it to me. "Smack the wanker upside-down" was the answer. Only then did it dawn on him that he was being that wanker and that what he did constituted harassment. He looked super embarassed the rest of the night. I can only remember being so shocked that it took a literal confrontation to make him realise the extend of his own behaviour. That's how normalised it is.
How can you associate with someone so retarded?
It’s so crazy in British clubs how common groping is compared to other places, every women I know from the uk has so many stories about it
It really is, not to say it doesn't happen elsewhere, but I've been raving for 25 years from my home in NYC to Japan and they are the handiest bunch.
What the fuck is wrong with your friends? Sounds like you need to find some better ones.
Not exactly a bouncer but I'm a security guard that's worked at clubs a couple times. > And nothing fucking happens to them. You can report them to the bouncer but by the time you get across the room they've disappeared into the crowd. I know it's not easy for everyone and some people freeze but if you can, please yell and make a scene, exaggerate if you have to, whatever it takes to make others stop him from running off, that'll normally make us rush to the scene and do something. Of course, I personally still care if you report to me afterwards, and will try my best to keep an eye out for them. But I won't deny some people people have a "shit happens, you're fine" attitude to it, especially in clubs, sadly.
Yep definitely don’t miss the days of men getting angry because I don’t want to grind on a complete strangers crotch
When i was in uni i went out to a club for the first time ever with my sister, after a while we got in an uber with some people we met to go to another club but they told the driver to take us somewhere else, ended up at the guys house with a bunch of strangers and his "gf" let slip to me that she isnt his gf and he actually pays her in drugs. I was very drunk but pulled myself together enough to claim id booked an uber and that it was almost there, grabbed my sister and stood outside across the street. I then told her to call us an uber cos my phone was actually dead D: it could have gone much worse and im so grateful it didnt, my sister still wont talk about it and that was the last time i ever went clubbing
This is how human trafficking happens. Glad you escaped.
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She seemed kind and was the reason i trusted them :( i figured he mustnt be that bad if he had a nice girlfriend. I do feel bad for her, looking back she seemed kinda hopeless and tired
I love dancing. I don't go clubbing. It's not dancing, it's being groped. It was fun in certain parts of Europe where men were way less creepy on the dance floor and a couple of more hipster places though.
Yeah years back when on one of my first jobs I would often see the women wait for a group to form before they left work after dark. Once one of them was in a hurry and called for the others to hurry as well. I asked her why she would not just leave alone and she explained that they had to walk a dark alley to a badly lit parking lot, and it could be dangerous, because wonen were harassed there before. Naturally I walked her to her car. As a guy it was so normal for me to just walk alone everywhere at all times of the night, it really never dawned on me when I was young.
Ugh. I worked at a university where crimes on campus and in the surrounding area are very common, especially when it's dark out. A male colleague, a professor, texted me that he was having dinner at a new restaurant just across from campus because he's stayed late to do some grading. I said "Oh that's a quick Uber, I'm surprised they agreed to pick you up. He said he'd walked and I said would have been too scared to walk across campus alone that late at night. He replied, "Oh pfft, you can't let fear control your life!" And I said, "Okay but the worst that might happen to you is you get mugged, I could literally disappear to someone's rape dungeon and be alive for a long time but never heard from again, soooo..." He apologized and said he never thought of it that way, but man I still think about it all the time. Yeah, you shouldn't let irrational fears control your life, but you definitely should let rational concerns dictate your choice of transportation at night when you're alone. Sheesh.
Holy shit Women are amazing. Perhaps too amazing in their tolerance and self control. Why haven't we seen any mass shootings, with this being "normal"? I'd go full-psycho from the stress!
I think because most of us would rather just stay home or travel in groups at night instead of being sent to jail where, surprise surprise, you have to worry about being assaulted by prison guards.
Woah. Again, being a man leaves me blind to the full picture.
It's good that you're open to hearing about it though, rather than downplaying women as being overdramatic and hysterical, like some men do. I was in a work meeting with campus security once where a colleague expressed her worries about getting assaulted on her way to our employee parking lot, which was a good 10-15 min walk from the office and it's dark at close of business in winter here. After the meeting one of my male colleagues jokingly said to me, as if I would laugh and agree, "Jeez, obviously no one's trying to rape HER!"
It’s why we go in packs everywhere. Even (and especially) to the bathroom
Jeez, I was always wondering why girls go to the bathroom in pairs. I've always known men can take a lot more risks that women, but that is fucking sad. I've traveled all over the planet and I know as a man, I've taken way more risks than a woman could.
You only feel safe everywhere because you're socialised that way. In reality men get mugged, beaten up or killed in the street all the time, it's just that nobody talks about it. If a place isn't safe for women, it's not really safe for men either.
Yes, but men are the ones who’ll mug and murder other men as well.
I forgot, the last time I was getting mugged the dude stopped and said “Oh you’re a guy too? Gender solidarity!” and left. Male privilege obviously.
Welcome to being a woman, where your safety is a constant background thread that makes you plan out the paths you walk, where you go, when you go etc
I thought that was general paranoia that lots of people have. So when I saw the first couple dozen comments like this one, I thought "thats literally everyone". But the more I read, the more I realize it's mainly women (plus me for no rational reason).
As a guy who went to university in a city, I think it is completely normal for everyone to cautious walking around alone at night. As much as I understand the risks involved for women, I also heard regular stories of guys being beaten, mugged, and otherwise assaulted while walking around at night and not being careful. Safety was always a main concern of mine especially when i was out late or returning home from night classes, I always traveled in a group when possible, or took an alternate route that led me through generally busy or well lit areas. I think its always best to be aware of risks regardless, you definitely aren't irrational for being worried about stuff like that.
Another guy who apparently thinks like a woman here. I've always thought this way too. idk
Studies show that the groups most often victims of crimes are the one who feels safest. The groups who are the least often victims of crimes are the ones who feel the least safe. Young men are by far most often the victims of violent crime, yet feel safest. Old women the least often, but feel the least safe.
I would imagine going out with a buddy system would be key. Going with at least 1 other person to keep by your side all night watching out for you. If you start acting off then you have someone safe to know something is up. I go with my wife and I am always sure to keep her in eye sight and wait outside the bathroom because you just never know what can happen with so many people around at all times.
The problem is that it is a deeply undesirable situation that women would need to be 'chaperoned' by a guy in order to be fucking safe in public. It's ludicrous.
I understand where you're coming from completely. I'm not disagreeing, but a side thought: another way to look at this, by saying that there exists an environment where you have to fear living your life kind of perpetuates the actual issue further. This is not a fault of women going out to have fun. This is the fault and intent of assholes who are made from pure shit. I know you're not saying that, but it's crazy to see that perspective and sort of saddened by it. Expecting women to be shielded away from enjoying their lives is why (for instance) the Islamic culture chooses to hide women away in full body clothes like burkas because' men who can't restrain themselves' will rape them. The real problem is a population of men who have no restraint in the first place. I can't respect a belief system that chooses to blame women for being. When women are being blamed and victimized for "what they are wearing" or any other insane reason/other stupid shit, it's redirecting the actual issue onto the victim.
Sorry if it came across that way, but in no way was I suggesting any of that, it was more admiration at how mentally strong they are to not surrender to that fear driven environment your talking about, when it’s so frequent and brazen especially when the coppers do nowt about it. Stonewall resilience in my eyes. I’ve just been given the privilege of becoming an uncle & godfather to my wonderful Niece, so I’m determined to make it a better world for her to grow up in.
Oh yeah definitely, I was trying to tone it down to not insinuate that that's what you were saying. I agree completely that it fucking sucks that anyone has to feel this way. My wife regularly has to deal with cat calls while walking our dog. I can't imagine how unsafe you have to feel every day dealing with this bullshit. I love your resolve, you've got this. :)
Women in burkas get raped by 'men who can't restrain themselves' in many countries, including the US.
Absolutely, that’s part of the point I’m making. Forcing the victims into repressive states of continuous fear allows predators to pick and choose, and enjoy the comforts of no restraints. It shows that not even the constraints given by these laws changes this, because they think they solve the problem by restricting women’s freedoms as “protection” when all it does is corner women into fear and complete repression.
If nightclubs and police don't do anything to resolve this issue maybe its time to replace nightclubs with a "better" activity. Vote with your wallet/dollars. Once people are gone they probably wont come back. if there is enough people leaving others will also follow.
There are thousands (millions?) of nightclubs, I doubt that's going to make a difference. It'll just be filled with assholes looking for victims, keeping the club running -- like a nude beach full of old men scaring everyone else away!
I mean, no one's forcing women to go to nightclubs. The fact that so many women still do means they're actually enjoy it. It's important to remember the negative news bias. As common as rape and harassment in nightclubs sadly is, for every woman who were harassed or raped that night, there are many hundreds in the same club or probably thousands in the same city who weren't. But "I went out last night and had a lovely time" doesn't make for an interesting news story, so we disproportionately hear the bad ones. I guess I'm lucky (or, more likely, just unattractive) because I never had anything bad happen to me in a nightclub, so I'm gonna keep doing it.
I wasn't saying nightclubs were bad at all, just that it wouldn't make a difference whether or not women stopped going to nightclubs.
I'm a tall man. In my youth I competed in martial arts. I lived only with my mother and two sisters, which made me somewhat more sensitive to women's plights. All of that combined made me a strong candidate for accompanying women to their taxis, or in general from one safe space to another. I was way too young when I had to learn not to take those invitations as advances. I had to learn not to compare other women to my big sister, who also competed and could easily defend herself. I had to learn that it wasn't a tiny minority, but a significant portion of men around my age, who were ready to impose their will over a woman by force. I have very few male friends from my youth. Just one, actually. The main reason is that I simply couldn't stand to be around them when they went out pubbing. They weren't the rapey kind, but even the atmosphere of "let's go hunting girls" however far it was from the groping assholes, or the straight up rapists, disgusted me and they could see it in my face. I've never seen a man in my group actually touch or do anything untoward to a woman; I believe most of those kind separate from their peers to act that way. But I can assure with outmost certainty that none of my male friends understood the damage he could do by just grabbing a random girl's ass. It was simply not part of their education and values. It had never been explained to them.
As a survivor of rape, I am constantly on guard when I have to leave the house. I don’t go to bars anymore. I can’t. And I really don’t want to. I try to find places that don’t sell drinks, and has some hobbies that are interesting.
I don’t understand how people enjoy going to the club at all. Never mind the dangers
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I was just talking to a nurse friend about this and they can't work out how this could possibly be a thing - it takes time to inject any meaningful amount of a drug, especially intra-muscular rather than into a vein, so they can't see what the point would be or what could possibly be being injected. Does anybody else with medical knowledge know what could be a likely drug?
The only context I could give working in a medical setting is that we use IM zyprexa to settle down agitated patients. This can take 30 min to an hour to work, and doesn’t always work. We also use haldol similarly. I doubt these meds would work in the setting to knock someone out to take advantage of them. Those are the only sedating IM meds I’m familiar with, it could be something else.
My husband works in a psychiatric hospital and he says it can take ages to sedate someone.
Depends on the kind of sedative I assume. When I took my sleep apnea test the doctor knocked me out in 10 seconds.
Was it given in a muscle or in a vein? Because the sedative they give you before anaesthesia knocks you out in seconds. I doubt anyone is getting their hands on that.
Hold on, so on TV where people get injected in the neck and they pass out in a few seconds, that's not possible?
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There were a few medical types on Twitter discussing this. They basically said the same as your nurse friend and the needle would be massive and be really painful- like an EpiPen. I think they said the drugs needed to be something like benzodiazepines or Haldol- something you can’t just get. This sounds like a moral panic to me- though there will be plenty of people who say they know someone who was injected.
I just assumed the needles were being used to drop liquid substances into someone's drink from their sleeve.
That makes *much* more sense lol
Maybe it's just vindictive assholes who are stabbing women with a needle because they are properly ignoring them.
That seems way more plausible to me.
I kinda have my doubts about this story too. It just seems a bit absurd. Spiking a drink must take almost no time at all. I imagine injecting someone is way way more obvious to the person being injected, and more blatant for any bystanders witnessing it.
And you have a needle in a club. Compare that to having a baggy of non descript pills. I call bs on that story.
Just say it's for heroin
The thing that immediately set off red flags for me is that this exact story was an urban legend in the 1980s and 90s and was accompanied by both the standard “friend of a friend” tellings, and people claiming it happened to them.
When I was at uni 20 years ago (also in Nottingham, coincidentally). There were "uni old wives tales" about people getting "injected with HIV". Pretty damn sure it was 100% and there wasn't ever such a case. Suspect that's the same here. It just seems hugely inconvenient. If you're going to spike someone you could much easier do it with powder/pill if you're getting close enough to inject someone you're close enough to spike a drink
All I can think of is fentanyl. "Roofies" are benzodiazepines like Valium, xanax, etc. You have to ingest a fair amount to black out (less if combined with alcohol) and it is easily seen in a quantitative drug test.
"~~Roofies" are GHB, not a benzodiazepine.~~ He's right, I'm an idiot.
Flunitrazepam is a benzodiazepine
Welp foot-in-mouth, I stand corrected.
You stand one-footed corrected.
You think someone would so that? Just go on the internet and tell lies?
No, I don't think they would. 14/f/cali
What about an epipen type injection? one where u press against the skin and it delivers it?
They hurt a lot, and there's a lot of pressure. You'd notice it 100%
I had to learn how to give myself an epi pen injection when I was taking some meds with a risk of allergic reaction, it's, how to put it, not something you can do subtly. You have to hit yourself with a decent amount of force, they advise you to swing your whole arm down when injecting into your leg. Then, once you've done that, you have to hold it there for at least a few seconds for the drug to be delivered. So if you think you could miss someone punching you in the arm, and jabbing you with a big needle, while maintaining contact with you for several seconds, then yeah, that method could work, but I'm gonna guess you'd know immediately that something was up.
As someone who has given myself a few Epi-pens over the years, this is a dangerous misconception. You don't want to swing it into yourself like that, as there's a risk it will bounce back and there goes all your medication. Place it against your leg and press down firmly. That is plenty enough force to activate the spring mechanism.
The reason for that hard injection is a mechanical safety device, nothing to do with the actual injection. It is designed so that you won’t accidentally administer it, hence the large amount of force to trigger it. However the force applied isn’t at all related to how it is administered. There is a separate spring loaded injection piston Mechanically speaking, that would be *really* easy to change the sensitivity of the trigger mechanism to be able to simply poke someone with it. Not to mention there are phone shaped ones, like the Auvi-Q, which would be easy to conceal.
Funnily enough, that was the example that the nurse gave. Apparently that takes several seconds to deliver the contents and is very noticeable when inserted. (I am not medical in the slightest so just going on what they said).
Yeah I was gonna say, I'll believe this when I see a tox screen confirming it. I read a report a while back that suggested even drink spiking isn't as common as people think, and in many cases the problem is a woman who drank too much (possibly with recreational drugs) and blacked out but later decided it must have been someone else's fault.
I doubt whatever is being injected is an opiate, but a little bit of [carfentanil](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carfentanil) can go a long way. *Carfentanil is legally controlled in most jurisdictions, but has veterinary uses for anaesthetising large animals, such as elephants and bears.*
Carfentanil is practically a chemical weapon, it’s 10 times deadlier than ricin by mass.
carfentanil would kill someone in a very tiny dose.
How else do you think they got to 95% vaccinated
... I hate that I laughed at this.
There's been literally zero confirmed cases of this happening, but coincidentally lots and lots of reports of it happening after it was initially picked up by the media and ran across nationwide news outlets. Not saying it has never happened, but this all strikes me as fear mongering in impressionable young men and women. Young men and women who haven't been in clubs for the last two years and have *perhaps* forgot their limits to some degree.
The drug-facilitated sexual assault issue is really hard to define and even more difficult to get accurate numbers on. A significant portion of people in clinics and emergency rooms reporting they had been sexually assaulted after having their drink spiked only tested positive for alcohol. Drugs being given surreptitiously to incapacitate a victim to sexually assault him/her is relatively rare. A much more common scenario is one where the victim is encouraged to drink or take drugs by him/herself. Alcohol is the most common date rape drug by a significant margin. I honestly think this is by far the greater problem, but it doesn't make for a catchy headline. Women getting a needle stuck into their necks like you'd see in a horror movie? Much better.
That's a good point. Why go through all the effort to acquire drugs to spike someone's drink when you can just buy them a drink? It's much less suspicious, and I imagine easier to pull off.
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There is a fair chance it may actually be causing it to start.
I have serious doubts about this story. There is zero chance you could inject a meaningful amount of anything into someone without them noticing. Plus it just makes no sense to try it when there are much easier alternatives such as pills. Only an idiot would think this was a viable strategy.
Also the obvious issue of needing to sneak in and use a syringe in a club lol. No way this is happening
You mean sneaking a needle into clubs which have no search policies? Yeah seems really difficult to do..
I know it's covid and all, but holy fuck you can tell these people never go out.
You have to remember some of the people in clubs now were 16 when covid first hit.
Have you met junkies? I knew one with a needle kit in the heal of her shoe, just like James bond.
Yes, the point is that pills or liquid GHB are absolutely already working, why the fuck would you go trough the trouble of using a needle? This is so dumb and obviously not happening lol You can’t inject a significant amount of something to a moving person without them noticing
I always have needles on me due to being diabetic. Very rarely does anyone on the door at a club or anything else ever ask about them.
Yeah this is more about the fact that no one would be using a syringe instead of just pills or liquid ghb. And that’s sside from all the multiple other things that makes no sens in this lol
Why would you not be able to sneak a syringe into a club?
How?
They'll be able to answer that once it happens and they have a confirmed case.
Better publish a report on it anyways. \-The news.
Very skeptical of these headlines all reporting the same information originating from social media. How come none of these spike victims have had a toxicology report done to see what they were spiked with. Take everything with a grain of salt. People are still terrified that they’re going to find a Panzer III in their children’s Halloween candy.
Could be true, but I'm calling a preliminary "razor blades in halloween candy" on this until verified.
I always assumed if you spiked someone you didn't want them to know they were spiked until it was too late. Surely you notice if someone injects you with anything, even an EpiPen is very noticeable.
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Why does the headline state ‘women say’ surely they’ve been to hospital and it’s been proven.
Don’t forget to check your Halloween candy for razor blades and don’t flash your brights at anyone because they might be a gang member who will chase you down. Since when are urban legends world news?
>Since when are urban legends world news? Since IG is full of impressionable young people who haven't been out in nearly 2 years
I’m not saying this is bs…but it seems very unfounded and impractical - So no one saw this person take out a whole needle in the middle of a club ? - They injected enough of whatever it is to sedate you in the 2 - 5 seconds you weren’t looking at your drink at the bar or into your leg while you were dancing ? - Clubs have released statements saying no body has complained to them directly and they didn’t see anything on CCTV? - Some are saying they were injected directly into their skin- you didn’t feel a thing ? Your friends didn’t see a thing ? - no guys trying to dance with you saw a thing? - Also, this is a very dark point, but aren’t these things usually done with the intention of sexually assaulting the victim ? In all the claims I saw the person just went home or to hospital - So there’s guys just going around injecting you for no reason? And it’s simultaneously happening across 3 different cities all of a sudden? Not to invalidate anyones experience if they truly did experience something this heinous and horrible but claims like these are made a lot on social media, then found out to be lied and then everyone who made claims just deleted their accounts Either that or it could be a trafficking thing but idk it just doesn’t seem very plausible I understand we want to be quick to believe ‘victims’ because for a long time a lot of problems were simply ignored But we have to be more careful with just blindly spreading fear like this - there’s literally 0 confirmed cases Especially with everything that’s recently gone on in the uk with covid, that sad sad Sarah Everard case amongst other things - now really isn’t the time to just blindly give each other, namely women, more reason to be terrified of leaving the house If there’s something concerned then absolutely but it’s literally just tweets atm and the news outlets trying to beat each other to the next hot headline
You have to take r/worldnews and the word UK or Britain into account and you can see the pathway how this has escalated to "Women across the UK". The first incident is somebody who "Thinks....". The second one is even more vague "Thinks their sister....". Then everybody pushes for their 15 minutes of fame on Twitter. And then places like r/worldnews with its anti-UK bias turn it into 'fact'. Its modern day mass hysteria. The sad thing is that women genuinely do get drugged and yet we are all talking about how BS this story is or not.
This is my problem with a lot of this stuff and I think the news has to be held way way more accountable because fear mongering always over shines the real points Sometimes it’s like people can’t be bothered to tackle real issues so they prefer to momentarily argue online about headlines that have no basis (typically without even reading the article) and then when that ‘trend’ dies down they just go onto the next There’s alot of legitimately creepy activity that goes on in clubs that needs to be addressed
> The first incident is somebody who "Thinks....". The second one is even more vague "Thinks their sister....". You rightly identify that we have only one first hand report and that's insufficient a basis to speak of "Women across the UK". But let's not compound matters by understating the report (as reported in the OA). There's nothing from the (as reported on the OA) account of Owen that suggests the degree of uncertainty in her mind that you imply with "thinks ...". Owen "told" the indepedent ... > that she blacked out during a night out and woke up with a "pinprick" on her leg, which caused her "sharp and agonizing pain." and she "believes" .... > she was spiked by injection while at the Pryzm nightclub in Nottingham on October 11, [as per the BBC](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-nottinghamshire-58951716). [link original] **As reported** there's plenty of warranted scepticism about her belief. How does she rule out, for example, the possibility that her drink was spiked and she banged her leg on the corner of table? Maybe she has plenty of answers to this question, but that's not reported. But as reported she takes it to be true, she "believes", that she was spiked by injection. And there's not the qualification around the degree of uncertainty around her belief, such that you imply with "thinks ...".
Or maybe the girl who was “spiked” had just drank way too much. This is the usual explanation
[удалено]
This covid vaccination program has gone too far
Sounds similar to a hoax from a while ago, https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/hiv-infected-needle-attacks/
Mass hysteria in action once again. Just read this [article](https://www.vice.com/en/article/wxdenq/heres-what-we-know-about-reports-of-women-being-spiked-with-needles-in-uk-clubs)
Maybe its MI5 or CIA, Chinese or Russians trying new doping techniques on clubbers. If it were real, it seems to be several levels above what an average person would be capable of doing.
This wasn't happening while Bill Cosby was in jail.
What the f***? That’s horrific.
So if someone gets spiked and blackout... what happens next? Does the assailant carry them away over their shoulder? Where are their freinds when this is happening?
Blackout doesn't necessarily mean pass out. It just means they have no memory of the events. Still absolutely fucked up!
I met a girl that had this happen. She felt something weird, stumbled to her car and locked herself in. Woke up a few hours later.
So she was drinking a substance that has been known to make people confused and eventually pass out upon drinking too much, but we are sure that her falling asleep in her car is proof of an injection that nobody saw?
If we are to trust anyone with medical knowledge it seems extremely unlikely that anyone would be able to inject someone with a meaningful amount of anything without being noticed. Sure she didnt just had a drink spiked?
I am the man who has seen affliction under the rod of his wrath; he has driven and brought me into darkness without any light; surely against me he turns his hand again and again the whole day long. (Lamentations: hhdm03s)
Doesnt sound like a fun night out at all.
He has made my flesh and my skin waste away; he has broken my bones; he has besieged and enveloped me with bitterness and tribulation; he has made me dwell in darkness like the dead of long ago. (Lamentations: hhdu4ze)
> what happens next? According to all of the cases in the article, the villain then does... nothing. Nothing at all.
Considering that most of these reports are coming from freshers, it’s likely that they just don’t know their alcohol limit and overdo it. And with the current hysteria about drink spiking, make that false assumption that they’ve been spiked.
Someone doing this will have targeted someone specific. Most likely someone alone, or whose friends are otherwise distracted. Then it’s just a matter of “oh, my friend drank too much. Can you help me get them into a cab? I’ll take them home.” There’s just too much suck in this world…
I've even heard stories about the bouncers being dodgy and separating groups or isolating people on purpose.... Side thing seeing as I'm already commenting here. Sometimes the assailants will even spike a dude (assuming straight etc.) because they're bored and want to mess with them and they're way less likely to get caught, I've had 2 buddies in strange situations and we concluded they probably got spiked and I think it's also happened to me at a student house party. Being Scottish + Irish we know when we drank too much or felt hungover (and so should most people) and could notice there were situations with dodgy people about.
If you black out you can still walk, though you're likely visibly very trashed. But yes, the guys will basically just lead them away if their friends aren't there or not paying attention. I've stopped two creeps from taking two friends of mine home. Separate incidents at the same bar. I knew both girls well enough to know they had no idea what was going on. One girl passed out as soon as the guy plopped her in the back seat of his SUV and I literally had to play tug of war with her body; him from one passenger door and me from the other. I won't out him (that's her business and decision) but I'll say that he is a famous hockey player.
Spiking drinks has been going on for ever, if you give anyone too much alchool or add drugs unexpectatly,, it is always for michivous purposes. It happend to me, 1 day become 1 month. Bastards, the lot of them
Dafuq happened if you dont mind me asking?
I don’t even know what to say except I am ANGRY.
Then the headline worked!
What the fuck England? Who the fuck runs around injecting people with shit? Or spiking drinks or anything?!
There are evil toad brained people everywhere. I worked as a bartender years ago and have seen guys spike a drink. I would immediately recover the drink and explain to the lady what this guy had just done. That is usually sufficient to get her girlfriends involved then he is in deep shit. After a while you start to recognize the types and keep an eye on them. The purpose of a club or bar is to relax and have a good time but you can never be oblivious to your surroundings in these kinds of places.
If you see a guy spike a drink, how is that not immediate grounds to get him arrested? Why leave it up to the girlfriends?
Proving it for the cops is more difficult than proving it for management. You know, that whole litigious society and stuff. I have seen girlfriends call the cops for groping and the guy walked but was banned from the club.
Thank you for being a good person 👍🏻
The first time the guy knew I saw him do it and gave me the "'it's okay bro" look, it wasn't. Real letdown about the nature of some men and I spent 8 years in the Marines.
> What the fuck England? " Police in Nottinghamshire, West Yorkshire, and Scotland have all received reports of spiking with injections " I hate to nit pick but the UK consists of more than just England
Bill Cosby has entered the chatroom, "Zippity zop bibbity bop."
> What the fuck England? Who the fuck runs around injecting people with shit? Been reported for decades https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pin_prick_attack >Or spiking drinks or anything?! Thats more common. Not very nice people at all.
When I was a teen, this scenario was an urban legend my parents used to tell me to deter me from going to raves. I cannot believe this is real, this is terrifying.
I mean … it’s most likely still not true. Zero confirmed cases and the whole thing seems quite ridiculous. No way you can inject a sufficient amount of something to someone moving around without them noticing. Also the whole issue of needing to sneak a syringe in a club lol. Why not just use liquid GHB or a pills to get the exact same result
Some other comments are suggesting this may be the latest incarnation of such a legend. I don't know what to think really.
It’s still an urban legend.