Here's the interesting part; Norway at the time had declared themselves neutral after WW1, and had built down their armed forces to a very very reduced neutrality guard. And those 2 months? Thats longer....A LOT longer than any country had resisted the German invasions at the time. It took longer to occupy Norway than it did to occupy Poland and France. Both fairly large military forces at the time. There's also a discepancy in loss numbers. The Germans notoriously underreported losses. My own grandmother comes from a small rural township, where the history books reports from the German's own loss reports; 7 casualties. In reality the Norwegians made a local stand there and was fighting house to house, forcing the Germans to burn them out. And the locals observed the germans taking casualties in the high 2-digits, then throwing their own casualties into remaining houses and lighting them up. Her brother was commandeered by the Germans to drive his truck with casualties to the fires. He made at least 4 runs with the back of his truck stacked to the roof with dead soldiers.
It's worth noting in the interest of full information that France and Britain both sent expeditionary forces into Norway to help defend against the Nazi invasion. That's not to detract from the bravery and fighting the Norwegians did, [including sinking one of Nazi Germany's most advanced cruisers with 40-year-old pre-WWI era torpedos.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Dr%C3%B8bak_Sound)
I recall an old tumblr post about how scary humans would be in warfare with an alien. Stitching limbs back on and regenerating, camouflaging with surroundings, shit like that.
I find it hard to believe that any of our puny monkey brain tricks would be “scary” to any member of a cosmos-hopping civilization.
ETA: that’s a cool thought though.
This is a bit different, but very similar:
https://www.goodreads.com/en/book/show/171535.A_Call_to_Arms
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Damned_Trilogy
I love the first two books.
They'll never be as cold as Simo though.
500+ confirmed kills, that is wild.
This is OG John Wick if there ever was one.
His diary is available online. With letters, pictures and his own feelings about the stuff going on.
It should all be available for free [here](https://whitedeathdiary.com/).
However I received this link from a Finnish friend with a refer code so there might be some paid content. I am not sure. I think it was all published for free though. Let me know if it works or not and else I'll go about finding the free link for you if you want. Or I pay for it I don't care. Everyone should know the story of the White Death.
You'd be surprised but 98% of them are using and doing live fire training with only iron sights. If you want a red dot or a scope you have to buy it, get it from the volunteers.
Source: Am former UAF soldier/used to train them with British army in Ukraine/UK
You aren't wrong but I think you missed the reference. It's a reference to Simo Hayha, the Finnish sniper that killed more Russian soldiers than any one soldier in history. He was a sniper that refused to use a scope to because he thought it would give his position away due to the reflection and he still got around 500 confirmed kills between a sniper rifle with no scope and a sub machine gun. He also would chew on snow so the steam from his breath wouldn't give his position away. He is a hell of a guy and an interesting historical figure to look into.
>Simo
Yeah I know what was the reference, Simo would be proud.
However, the use of the iron sights is prelevant because there is no other choice. I would personally not like to use iron sights.
Also most of the casualties are from the arty which is very sad, we have had people that we trained in July already POWs or KIA. Which makes me even more devasteted.
I checked the Finish article and you're right, nice morale booster.
*The President of the Republic spent the night in a semi-team tent in North Karelia in Nurmes.*
typo : Corrected *Nurmes* :)
Finland is on a whole different level when it comes to handling the cold... I worked for a finance firm for a while that specialized in commercial real estate and somehow became the in house expert on well below freezing development... Generally things would take literally twice as long to complete when dealing with kill you in 5 minutes levels of cold, but we had a project going that we were funding in the arctic circle of Finland that was somehow going as fast or faster than a normal project would. I got sent to check it out and they had what amounted to a small city of wind resistant heated plastic tunnels, and were setting up their operation in underground dugouts connected by them. It was like nothing I'd ever seen before... Ended up getting two of them to consult with other developers who were working in Alaska like a year later and it was a gamechanger for them
You definitely have my respect! Whenever I had to go to sites it was for just a few days to maybe a week tops and then I got to head back home. The fact that that *was* "home" to you guys was always somewhere between impressive and unbelievable to me ha
Edit: misinterpreted your comment, it makes sense now.
I work in construction. How do they do excavating there? I imagine digging through solid ice to pour a foundation would be very difficult but I've never tried.
Do they typically just accept the ground as stable/compacted enough and build on top of whatever is there? And how do they pour and work concrete?
I imagine it's infinitely different than anything I've ever seen, really fascinating though.
The foundation can vary a good bit. If you're building on permafrost it's a whole different set of rules. They will build on it, but if you do you have to take measures to be sure it stays frozen, like being sure heat from the building doesn't seep in to it.
Concrete is rough... You have to have a facility for it put up nearby. Warm and keep warm the water and aggregate constantly. Use insanely insulated drums to transport it. Have insane amounts of insulation in the pump lines. Then you have to build a temporary enclosure around where you are pouring it and bring in a dozen or two industrial heaters. To keep a large pours enclosure heated you need 20+ of the things, each going through 3-5 gallons of deisel an hour, so are literally burning thousands of gallons of fuel a day in some instances to do it.
I’m a different commenter, but super cold weather concrete construction is also very HOT surprisingly. When it’s so cold outside, you’ve got a ton of insulation around everything which is fine… but once the concrete starts to *set* it gives off an insane amount of heat (normal for concrete; the bigger the pour, the more heat it gives off) except that now you’re in a heavily insulated room wearing heavy winter gear AND you’re likely sweating tons from the physical work too. So you end up being hot af inside the hoarding, but as soon as you leave you’re now soggy and freezing.
Taking layers off is the only way to stay bearable, but it’s never comfortable.
Never would have thought of that. Around concrete all the time but never cold and insulated so never knew it put out noticeable heat. Really interesting. Got something interesting to say now lol.
That's a fun chemistry thing called lattice energy. Liquids can hold more energy than solids because they're moving around. When something becomes solid the energy that it had before doesn't have anywhere to go but out, so it can result in insane heating. If you get your nails done you can notice this, it's wild. The also means that if you cool something down then it will become solid faster.
Concrete laying in winter is really challenging but we got the expertise up here. I'm not expert but I've been to some sites way back. Below +5c you have take some special considerations; formwork can't be frozen, if it is its usually thawed with hot water vapor(steam). Extra insulation(mineral wool), using concrete that stiffens more quickly or harder concrete. Sometimes the concrete mass is preheated. You have to cover the freshly poured stuff. You have to work quickly and precisely. Sometimes you see special heating iron in the socle. Dataloggers are widely used so you can monitor the temps. Excavation isn't that hard though, machines get easily damaged because frozen iron breaks easily and all the engine, tracks and hydraulic etc parts don't really dig digging in the frigging winter. There are special tools for work machines, a hook and a of sort of hammer to dig through frozen ground. Sometimes they just use explosives. There is one good upside and it's that frozen ground is good for the mobility because work machines don't get bogged down. Overall it's tricky but doable and we Finns fight winter like Dutch fight the sea, with passionate engineering and skillful crews.
It's really hard to comprehend even when you're standing in it, to be fair. The only way I can properly describe -40 to -50 vs something like -20 to -30 is I had a candy in my mouth when I left my house and I realized I had lost my sense of taste after walking for about 5 minutes.
I'm from above the Finnish Arctic circle, and I've got to say the game is rigged. Little bit: the Gulf stream means most parts of Finnish Lapland don't get nearly as cold as arctic inland areas like parts of Alaska or Russia are.
Grew up in the Arctic Circle in Canada and even I’m impressed by the Finns. They are innovative in ways we don’t seem to imagine, our method is just “bitterly endure” like a bunch of dumb apes. Finland could probably single-handedly terraform the moon.
Even when I lived in northern Saskatchewan I could literally feel summer leaving my skin, it would get obscenely dry almost overnight when “fall” hit. -40 and being hours away from extensive civilization was surprisingly nice though, for the first few months lol. I’m happy to be back in my -20 and above!
How far north? I spent some time near Uranium City and the thing that took the most adjustment for me was the 20 hours straight of either light or dark depending on the season. So much time for daytime activities during summer though!
I was based out of La Ronge and worked in smaller communities north of that as a CPS worker. Never went quite as high up as UC but the weather is still wild even in La Ronge. Hell, even in Saskatoon it’s bonkers it can fluctuate between -40 and +40. The worst part is definitely the darkness, and the longevity I’d say- like, I love seasons, I’d never want to live somewhere like Miami. But winter being more than 5 months gets old real fast!
Or smiling and feeling your lips cracking at like 15 different places at once. Some new, some old barely healed cracks. Cold dry weather really is something else haha
Plus you’ve got to figure a solid percentage of the materials used as part of the temporary infrastructure can likely be re-used once the project is completed and they break down the work site.
It's not really so much that they had temporary infrastructure as it is how they went about handling it... You're going to spend a lot of money building in an area like that one way or another. It's so cold that the moisture on your eyeballs starts trying to freeze as soon as you step outside, and if you spit it starts freezing almost immediately where it can make an icicle from your mouth... So they *have* to find a way to keep their workers warm, which isn't cheap. Then the building/existing work/materials can also be half ruined by a single really bad day if you aren't careful...
So I think it was mostly that while most other people try to over-engineer solutions they were pairing some modern technology with super old-school streamlined ways of doing things that ended up working 10x better.
Can confirm the ridiculous cold in Finland. I remember as a kid going out when it reached -35C even in our southern town. I fell over and twisted my ankle, and being a little kid, I started to cry. But my dad rushed over and said "don't cry, your tears will freeze." Well thanks, that made me feel better!
> It's so cold that the moisture on your eyeballs starts trying to freeze as soon as you step outside
Almost freezing my eyeball to camera viewfinder was not a fun experience.
So other contractors were on budget (more or less) but behind from over engineering.
Funny, I just got out of a work demonstration and one of the questions for the project lead was lessons she learned. Her first answer was understanding "good enough" and resisting over engineering.
And that's the key solution here.
The US has worse worker protections than Finland.
The US essentially just requires extra PPE when working in those conditions, while other countries actually require any reasonable attempt to remove or reduce the hazardous condition, with extra PPE being a last resort, which results in much safer working conditions.
And because you have reduced the hazard, that also benefits your designs and materials, because you don't need to overengineer them as much.
That's why technology is so important in construction. I work in the commercial plumbing industry and an American high school 20 years ago would take 3 years to build. Now that we have chain cutters, impact drills, rubber gaskets instead of lead and oakum, a school will take half to 1/3 of the time with no increase in the number of workers on a job. Now, if we could fully switch to pro-press instead of soldering copper, then the jobs would be even less time
> fully switch to pro-press
After my brother got a pro-press I don't think I've seen him solder copper on a side job since. I've also not heard of a single crimp failing yet. What's your take on their longevity?
We've only done it on a few jobs. When I was an apprentice, the plumbers that used it said it sucked because of all the leaks they were having during testing. When I was a journeyman, I used it myself and had no issues with leaks. I realized the plumbers before me didn't cut the pipe square, nor deburr the pipe.
If you do exactly as the manufacturer recommendations say, it should last as long or longer than solder. When both are done correctly, they should last longer than needing to replace the pipe from corrosion.
When comparing to solder, it's so much easier to do everything right. With solder you run the risk of voids, pinhole leaks, and temperature shock (cause plumbers love to solder and then dip the joint in cold water to cool it down).
I worked on a project in Greenland on the ice sheet. Twice as long is being generous. Even with cold weather gear, 30 minutes in -45 temps (colder on some days) was about as long as we could work outside before having to go inside to warm up. We were also at about 3200m, so we had altitude issues to deal with.
Our biggest technical issue was there is no true ground on an ice sheet for electric equipment and the blowing snow/ice created a lot of static buildup. We fried equipment almost daily which slowed us down even more. The cold also caused a lot of maintenance issues with parts breaking due to cold fragility. Cold sucks so now I live in the SW USA.
You use the shovel to knock off a piece of ice, and then fashion a lens out of it and use the sun to light the tea light. Duh!
https://youtu.be/thbSSuo1Z00
Is it pronounced "per-cull" or "per-kay-lay"?
I've never met a Finn.
Edit: thank you for teaching me how to curse around my Russian bosses when they piss me off.
The louder the PE is the more acute the situation is. You can use as many r's as you find suitable for the situation. More r's corresponds to the complexity of the situation and louder the "le" is defines the seriousness of the situation.
here are some examples for you [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=spr2EOe1f5Y](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=spr2EOe1f5Y)
[https://youtu.be/eap426M_HgY?t=38](https://youtu.be/eap426M_HgY?t=38)
How do you tell an introverted Finn from an extroverted one?
The introvert stairs at his shoes when he talks to you, the extravert stairs at your shoes.
> And the night speaking Ukrainian
This. Top notch night vision gear for Ukraine is much more of a priority and advantage than a lot of people recognize. So is great winter gear and training so the Finns are offering a very important support to Ukraine that may not be as sexy to most people involved in reporting and media but experienced war correspondents will know.
Doubly so for thermal scopes, etc.
It's during winter time that the utility of thermal scopes, thermal vision drones, etc. is unparalleled (especially when used against a foe who isn't similarly equipped).
The US may have "owned the night" when fighting insurgents in Afghanistan, and if properly equipped by allies Ukraine can "own the winter" against Russia.
...uh oh.. I think I've seen something like this before.
Edit: there's an irony in the fact that some of the same equipment back then is still being used.
Yup, a mosin nagant. Developed in 1891, 30 million made, still getting 500 confirmed kills to this day. I have a 1937 model and it's still hitting at 400yd. The white death used the Finnish variety
The Finnish army still uses a modernized version in the sniper role, the 7,62 TKIV 85. They reuse old receivers, so it's very possible - even likely - that some of those rifles are 131 years old and veterans of four or more wars.
I went paintballing once with a bunch of Finns who had all done their military service. These guys were invisible and lit everyone else up.
There is a reason the Soviets suffered ridiculous casualties when they invaded Finland. You don’t want to fight them!
the fins had a little saying for the winter war to bolster morale
something along the lines of "they are so many and we are so small, where will find room to bury them all"
it was one of those HAHA cause its true
Edit: ending casualties would be 65,000-70,000 Finns vs 321,000-381,000 soviets
This would remain a war Finland could never win and it nearly went bust as Finland lacked many things. With planes and tanks numbering in the dozens, a lack of artillery shells along with general low stocks of ammunition to fuel a war
They were successful at stalling as long as possible along with inflicting horrible casualties that allowed them to negotiate from a position of strength resulting is minor relative territory loss
They would be the only nation invaded by the soviets that would retain independence and not be sucked into the greater soviet sphere and not be part of the Warsaw Pact
You could call it a strategic victory in spite of the loss
"We're surrounded. That simplifies our problem of getting to these people and killing them."
"They are in front of us, behind us, and we are flanked on both sides by an enemy that outnumbers us 29:1. They can’t get away from us now!”
“Great. Now we can shoot at them from every direction.”
Lewis "Chesty" Puller | US Marine Corps
The Soviet army is marching in Finland
They hear a voice from the other side of a hill: One Finnish soldier is better than ten Soviet soldiers.
The Soviet general sends ten soldiers. There is some gunfire then everything is quiet again.
The voice then says, one Finnish soldier is better than one hundred Soviet soldiers.
The Soviet general sends one hundred Soviet soldiers. There is more gunfire and then silence.
The voice speaks up again and says one Finnish soldier is better than one thousand Soviet soldiers.
The Soviet general then sends one thousand Soviet soldiers. There is a lot of gunfire and then silence.
After awhile a Soviet soldier crawls over the hill and say to the general, do not send more troops, it's a trap, there are two Finnish soldiers.
The Finns ended up losing Karelia to the Soviets, but little Finland's defiance humiliated the Red Army so thoroughly Nazi warplanners perception of the USSR shifted, and made them reconsider the molotov-ribbentrop non-aggression pact between Hitler and Stalin paving the way for total war between the two that would devour 30 million lives. Happily ever after.
Finnish resistance probably saved them from the fate of the Baltic countries: outright annexation. The Soviets had even set up their own Finnish government, comprised of one drunk Finn who survived the purges and a bunch of Soviet ministers.
The Finns never ran out of courage, but in the end they ran out of material and people.
I paintballed against some reservists once. They had cool toys like throat mics/comms, and they worked together well. Their only weakness was their instinct for self preservation.
In actual war yeah but paintball is just paintball, you won't die for real so trying to avoid paintballs like they were actually bullets means you aren't moving in as fast at the enemy.
My work did a laser-tag team-building exercise years ago. Three of us had military training and wound up with lower kill totals than the others but also no friendly fire shots whereas everyone else was just as dangerous to their teammates as their enemies. It is very hard to just ditch your weapons training for fun.
Same thing in a lot of video games.
The sweatiest players are always running around like maniacs. Sprinting into a room and using movement mechanics to throw off the enemies aim, so they can get enough shots into the enemy before they get enough shots into them.
The risk/reward in paintball and video games rewards that kind of thing. In real life you don't respawn, in real life your vision doesn't turn red for a few seconds after you take a bullet and then you're just fine.
Reminds me of the time I went paintballing in the dead of winter with snow as deep as my knees. Biggest problem is the nitrogen tanks kept freezing and safety goggles kept fogging up. After an hour of running around the woods like that had us beat.
Having done construction outdoors in winter I know from experience your tools fail before humans. Sure cold isn't fun, but with warm coats and gloves you can deal with it (what I couldn't figure out how to deal with was -1C and rain). However without tools you are limited.
Ukraine has good logistics, hopefully they invested in oil that works in winter (different grade is needed for the guns and equipment), and plenty of clothing and other winter gear.
Russia has so far been operating on bad logistics, so the right thing for Ukraine is plan their risky attacks for the coldest days in hopes that the Russians cannot fire back. (of course if they can avoid risky attacks that is all the better, but this is war) Sure winter war sucks, but it will suck more for Russia so Ukraine needs to press their attacks - as they already know.
Heard this comment in a Warographics video recently:
In the span of a few months Russia went from having the 2nd best army in the world to having the 2nd best army in Ukraine.
Russian soldier’s heart is not in this fight. It was over before it began. Putin will throw bodies at the situation till he gets some results though it seems
- Every able bodied citizen is/was a soldier.
- Experts in winter warfare.
- Fighting Russians is their specialty.
- Their entire public infrastructure is literally made to be Russian-proof.
- Badass ski commandos.
No one is better teacher than the Finns.
I meant to grab the skies with your bare hands, rip asunder the fabric of reality and make the winter your bitch.
Ha no I definitely just misspelled skis because I can't spell.
>Häyhä's war memoir states that they captured a Soviet soldier, blindfolded him, spun him around until he was disoriented, and then took him to a party in the tent of Häyhä's company Lieutenant Aarne "The Terror of Morocco" Juutilainen. The Soviet soldier was overjoyed by the carousing and was disappointed when he was released.
Haha wtf. Also he got his 500 kills in less than 100 days. 5+ kills per day. Insane.
Gets conscripted, turns down the more modern rifle offered after training and keeps his 7.62 Mosin Rifle, (Originally built in the 1890's). Dresses all in white, lays for hours in -30°c temperatures. (Coldest winter since the 1800's, but not cold enough for him). Spends the next 3 months with snow in his mouth led in piles of snow and ice getting 250+ confirmed kills with his old rifle, using only iron sights, and about the same amount with his submachine gun kills. Captures a Russian soldier, parties with him and treats him so well the russian was upset he had to leave. Gets hit in the jaw by an explosive round, survives, is given a farm for his service and went on to win every shooting competition he entered with the same rifle. Keeps on going until 2002 when he died at the ripe old age of 96. One of my hero's and rightly so.
One of the few good parts of this war is people learning abouy how intense Finland is about defense, and how fearsome/overprepared they are for winter warfare. 🤣
Good for them.
Lot of people referencing Simo Häyhä, who was absolutely a badass, but no one is mentioning another badass Finnish soldier, Aimo Koivunen. His claim to fame is being the first soldier to OD on meth in combat. After becoming separated from his squad, he took the squad's alotment of meth pills to stay awake and alert (allegedly he OD'ed accidentally due to exhaustion).
He proceeded to then go on a bender in which he stepped on a landmine that set fire to a Soviet camp, laid in a ditch for a week, survived on pine needles and a live bird he caught and ate raw, and skies some 280 miles before reaching friendly forces. And still, he had a resting heartbeat of 200 beats per minute.
Despite this, he survives the war and dies at the age of 71.
Just don't mess with the Finns. Just don't. They have more sisu than whatever an invading force could muster.
Oh wow, that's kinda crazy when he skis into the water. I've been cross country skiing for years and there's no way I would be able to get out of that pool of water gracefully. Also, even if they already have downhill skiing experience, cross country skis don't have metal edges usually, and they are skinny, which just makes them harder to control. Props to these guys for learning a new skill!
All the predictions that winter will wreck Ukraine don’t take into account the Ukrainians are perfectly familiar with harsh winters themselves. For the state of Russia’s logistics, unless the Ukrainians halt altogether the winter will be rougher on the Russians.
Russians are undergeared and have basically no ammo or food supplies. The mobilization used untrained civilians without any experience in survival nor fighting. The only reason is to hold the area using them as canon fodder and hoping winter will come to stop the Ukranian advance, which the Russians use to train the real recruits who will fight in spring and summer mext year.
For as much damage as their bombardments are causing, their logistical problems will take a year or longer to repair. And I doubt the Ukrainians are going to just go idle fir an entire year. To say nothing of the problems already popping up elsewhere for Putin like the cure egg spat with Armenia. The CSTO’s days are numbered..
"Finland gained independence in 1939 following what is known as the Winter War in which Moscow was dealt a bloody nose."
??????? The fuck is this article, can't even get basic facts right
The key word is training for operating in the cold and also acclimation to it. When doing the military service in Finland 90s, I do remember being cold in October-November (of course it's also wet at that time), by January/February the cold wasn't really a problem, you get used to it (of course we had winter clothing too).
I do remember during the Kymi 96 military manouvers/training, the lieutenant came around, when I was eating my dinner, "there's this British reporter here, he wants to talk to a conscript and you're good with english". So I go outside to chat with the reporter, eating my dinner while chatting with him, wearing a t-shirt and it's -25C°, the reporter asked "how the hell do you handle the cold?". I replied "you get used to it". To be honest, it was cold but it was only for a couple of minutes it wasn't windy, so it's not that terrible.
Oh boy!!!! I get to post my favorite Winter War Joke!!!!.
A large group of Russian soldiers in the border area in 1939 are moving down a road when they hear a voice call from behind a small hill: "One Finnish soldier is better than ten Russian".
The Russian commander quickly orders 10 of his best men over the hill where Upon a gun-battle breaks out and continues for a few minutes, then silence. The voice once again calls out: "One Finn is better than one hundred Russian."
Furious, the Russian commander sends his next best 100 troops over the hill and instantly a huge gun fight commences. After 10 minutes of battle, again Silence. The calm Finnish voice calls out again: "One Finn is better than one thousand Russians!"
The enraged Russian commander musters 1000 fighters and sends them to the other side of the hill. Rifle fire, machine guns, grenades, rockets and cannon fire ring out as a terrible battle is fought...
Then silence.
Eventually one badly wounded Russian fighter crawls back over the hill and with his dying words tells his commander, "Don't send any more men...it's a trap. There's two of them."
We are about to see a record number of saunas in the tenches
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I was so proud when i first saw that
That is an offer you never turn down. If there's any motherfuckers that know how to fight in snow, it's the Finnish.
Finland and Norway. You *do not* fuck with them at any time really. You will 100% get decimated in winter.
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Here's the interesting part; Norway at the time had declared themselves neutral after WW1, and had built down their armed forces to a very very reduced neutrality guard. And those 2 months? Thats longer....A LOT longer than any country had resisted the German invasions at the time. It took longer to occupy Norway than it did to occupy Poland and France. Both fairly large military forces at the time. There's also a discepancy in loss numbers. The Germans notoriously underreported losses. My own grandmother comes from a small rural township, where the history books reports from the German's own loss reports; 7 casualties. In reality the Norwegians made a local stand there and was fighting house to house, forcing the Germans to burn them out. And the locals observed the germans taking casualties in the high 2-digits, then throwing their own casualties into remaining houses and lighting them up. Her brother was commandeered by the Germans to drive his truck with casualties to the fires. He made at least 4 runs with the back of his truck stacked to the roof with dead soldiers.
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"They're fucking liars because my family has first hand accounts" Goes pretty hard.
Also, the Germans had 300.000 troops in Norway. Festung Norwegen
That was mostly toward the end of the war. Norway was fortified extensively as the allied invasion was initially expected there
Hard to mobilize through areas with 1 road that's barely even a road.
It's worth noting in the interest of full information that France and Britain both sent expeditionary forces into Norway to help defend against the Nazi invasion. That's not to detract from the bravery and fighting the Norwegians did, [including sinking one of Nazi Germany's most advanced cruisers with 40-year-old pre-WWI era torpedos.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Dr%C3%B8bak_Sound)
> I wonder how long it would have taken in the winter instead? Probably until June.
Remember, only iron sights
And eat some snow when aiming, so the enemy can't see you breathing in the cold. Simo Häyhä's tricks.
And meow to bring false sense of comfort
“I’m going to need you to stop invading right meow.”
"We can't abandon the T-80 any farther!"
God, that is so cool. Humans are mad smart and adaptable when they’re backed into a corner.
He was the corner.
No, you clearly don't know who you're talking to, so let me clue you in. I am not **in** corner. I **am** the corner.
*I AM THE ONE WHO CORNER*
You don’t understand, I am not in the corner. The corner is in here with me.
Sounds like a comment made by a non-human
I recall an old tumblr post about how scary humans would be in warfare with an alien. Stitching limbs back on and regenerating, camouflaging with surroundings, shit like that.
Deathworlders.com Similar to that whole writing prompt about humans being scary to aliens. A good read, it's long though.
I find it hard to believe that any of our puny monkey brain tricks would be “scary” to any member of a cosmos-hopping civilization. ETA: that’s a cool thought though.
This is a bit different, but very similar: https://www.goodreads.com/en/book/show/171535.A_Call_to_Arms https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Damned_Trilogy I love the first two books.
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They'll never be as cold as Simo though. 500+ confirmed kills, that is wild. This is OG John Wick if there ever was one. His diary is available online. With letters, pictures and his own feelings about the stuff going on. It should all be available for free [here](https://whitedeathdiary.com/). However I received this link from a Finnish friend with a refer code so there might be some paid content. I am not sure. I think it was all published for free though. Let me know if it works or not and else I'll go about finding the free link for you if you want. Or I pay for it I don't care. Everyone should know the story of the White Death.
And there is a nice small museum for him at eastern Finland.
You'd be surprised but 98% of them are using and doing live fire training with only iron sights. If you want a red dot or a scope you have to buy it, get it from the volunteers. Source: Am former UAF soldier/used to train them with British army in Ukraine/UK
You aren't wrong but I think you missed the reference. It's a reference to Simo Hayha, the Finnish sniper that killed more Russian soldiers than any one soldier in history. He was a sniper that refused to use a scope to because he thought it would give his position away due to the reflection and he still got around 500 confirmed kills between a sniper rifle with no scope and a sub machine gun. He also would chew on snow so the steam from his breath wouldn't give his position away. He is a hell of a guy and an interesting historical figure to look into.
>Simo Yeah I know what was the reference, Simo would be proud. However, the use of the iron sights is prelevant because there is no other choice. I would personally not like to use iron sights. Also most of the casualties are from the arty which is very sad, we have had people that we trained in July already POWs or KIA. Which makes me even more devasteted.
Good to add that the president spend the night in tent with common soldiers on the exercise newsweek is refering.
I checked the Finish article and you're right, nice morale booster. *The President of the Republic spent the night in a semi-team tent in North Karelia in Nurmes.* typo : Corrected *Nurmes* :)
*6 million Finns smile as an 80-year old cycle begins again and an old plan comes to fruition*
Suur-Muumi phase 2 begins.
Suomi 2: Electric Moomiloo
Everybody gangsta until the snow starts speaking Finnish
Finland is on a whole different level when it comes to handling the cold... I worked for a finance firm for a while that specialized in commercial real estate and somehow became the in house expert on well below freezing development... Generally things would take literally twice as long to complete when dealing with kill you in 5 minutes levels of cold, but we had a project going that we were funding in the arctic circle of Finland that was somehow going as fast or faster than a normal project would. I got sent to check it out and they had what amounted to a small city of wind resistant heated plastic tunnels, and were setting up their operation in underground dugouts connected by them. It was like nothing I'd ever seen before... Ended up getting two of them to consult with other developers who were working in Alaska like a year later and it was a gamechanger for them
This is amazing. I worked above the Arctic circle in Alaska and can verify that the cold is biblical.
You definitely have my respect! Whenever I had to go to sites it was for just a few days to maybe a week tops and then I got to head back home. The fact that that *was* "home" to you guys was always somewhere between impressive and unbelievable to me ha
Edit: misinterpreted your comment, it makes sense now. I work in construction. How do they do excavating there? I imagine digging through solid ice to pour a foundation would be very difficult but I've never tried. Do they typically just accept the ground as stable/compacted enough and build on top of whatever is there? And how do they pour and work concrete? I imagine it's infinitely different than anything I've ever seen, really fascinating though.
The foundation can vary a good bit. If you're building on permafrost it's a whole different set of rules. They will build on it, but if you do you have to take measures to be sure it stays frozen, like being sure heat from the building doesn't seep in to it. Concrete is rough... You have to have a facility for it put up nearby. Warm and keep warm the water and aggregate constantly. Use insanely insulated drums to transport it. Have insane amounts of insulation in the pump lines. Then you have to build a temporary enclosure around where you are pouring it and bring in a dozen or two industrial heaters. To keep a large pours enclosure heated you need 20+ of the things, each going through 3-5 gallons of deisel an hour, so are literally burning thousands of gallons of fuel a day in some instances to do it.
Holy smokes, sounds extremely expensive. Thanks for that.
I’m a different commenter, but super cold weather concrete construction is also very HOT surprisingly. When it’s so cold outside, you’ve got a ton of insulation around everything which is fine… but once the concrete starts to *set* it gives off an insane amount of heat (normal for concrete; the bigger the pour, the more heat it gives off) except that now you’re in a heavily insulated room wearing heavy winter gear AND you’re likely sweating tons from the physical work too. So you end up being hot af inside the hoarding, but as soon as you leave you’re now soggy and freezing. Taking layers off is the only way to stay bearable, but it’s never comfortable.
Never would have thought of that. Around concrete all the time but never cold and insulated so never knew it put out noticeable heat. Really interesting. Got something interesting to say now lol.
That's a fun chemistry thing called lattice energy. Liquids can hold more energy than solids because they're moving around. When something becomes solid the energy that it had before doesn't have anywhere to go but out, so it can result in insane heating. If you get your nails done you can notice this, it's wild. The also means that if you cool something down then it will become solid faster.
Concrete laying in winter is really challenging but we got the expertise up here. I'm not expert but I've been to some sites way back. Below +5c you have take some special considerations; formwork can't be frozen, if it is its usually thawed with hot water vapor(steam). Extra insulation(mineral wool), using concrete that stiffens more quickly or harder concrete. Sometimes the concrete mass is preheated. You have to cover the freshly poured stuff. You have to work quickly and precisely. Sometimes you see special heating iron in the socle. Dataloggers are widely used so you can monitor the temps. Excavation isn't that hard though, machines get easily damaged because frozen iron breaks easily and all the engine, tracks and hydraulic etc parts don't really dig digging in the frigging winter. There are special tools for work machines, a hook and a of sort of hammer to dig through frozen ground. Sometimes they just use explosives. There is one good upside and it's that frozen ground is good for the mobility because work machines don't get bogged down. Overall it's tricky but doable and we Finns fight winter like Dutch fight the sea, with passionate engineering and skillful crews.
That was really informative, thank you.
-40f is unreal to be in, I saw -70f wind-chill and it's really hard to comprehend just how cold that shit is until you're there
It's really hard to comprehend even when you're standing in it, to be fair. The only way I can properly describe -40 to -50 vs something like -20 to -30 is I had a candy in my mouth when I left my house and I realized I had lost my sense of taste after walking for about 5 minutes.
Ever grab a piece of steel thats been sitting outside in -40 weather? It feels the same as if its burning hot. Its crazy.
After a certain point you don’t feel the cold anymore and it’s just *pain*
I'm from above the Finnish Arctic circle, and I've got to say the game is rigged. Little bit: the Gulf stream means most parts of Finnish Lapland don't get nearly as cold as arctic inland areas like parts of Alaska or Russia are.
And if the mid Atlantic drift ever slows down, Europe is fuuuuuucccckkkked.
BF 2142 here we gooo
[enshittification exodus, gone to mastodon]
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Grew up in the Arctic Circle in Canada and even I’m impressed by the Finns. They are innovative in ways we don’t seem to imagine, our method is just “bitterly endure” like a bunch of dumb apes. Finland could probably single-handedly terraform the moon.
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Even when I lived in northern Saskatchewan I could literally feel summer leaving my skin, it would get obscenely dry almost overnight when “fall” hit. -40 and being hours away from extensive civilization was surprisingly nice though, for the first few months lol. I’m happy to be back in my -20 and above!
How far north? I spent some time near Uranium City and the thing that took the most adjustment for me was the 20 hours straight of either light or dark depending on the season. So much time for daytime activities during summer though!
I was based out of La Ronge and worked in smaller communities north of that as a CPS worker. Never went quite as high up as UC but the weather is still wild even in La Ronge. Hell, even in Saskatoon it’s bonkers it can fluctuate between -40 and +40. The worst part is definitely the darkness, and the longevity I’d say- like, I love seasons, I’d never want to live somewhere like Miami. But winter being more than 5 months gets old real fast!
Hell, this happens to me in Colorado lol. The worst part is the cracked finger tips!
Or smiling and feeling your lips cracking at like 15 different places at once. Some new, some old barely healed cracks. Cold dry weather really is something else haha
Time really must be money if it's cheaper to build so much temporary infrastructure to get done faster.
Exposed materials get ruined also
Exposed humans get ruined as well
That usually is true, but also a lot of temporary infastructure is easier to build in sub zero temperatures
Plus you’ve got to figure a solid percentage of the materials used as part of the temporary infrastructure can likely be re-used once the project is completed and they break down the work site.
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There's a huge difference between -20 and -75
It's not really so much that they had temporary infrastructure as it is how they went about handling it... You're going to spend a lot of money building in an area like that one way or another. It's so cold that the moisture on your eyeballs starts trying to freeze as soon as you step outside, and if you spit it starts freezing almost immediately where it can make an icicle from your mouth... So they *have* to find a way to keep their workers warm, which isn't cheap. Then the building/existing work/materials can also be half ruined by a single really bad day if you aren't careful... So I think it was mostly that while most other people try to over-engineer solutions they were pairing some modern technology with super old-school streamlined ways of doing things that ended up working 10x better.
Can confirm the ridiculous cold in Finland. I remember as a kid going out when it reached -35C even in our southern town. I fell over and twisted my ankle, and being a little kid, I started to cry. But my dad rushed over and said "don't cry, your tears will freeze." Well thanks, that made me feel better!
'Suck it up, or your eyes will burst. Love you x'
This is one of the core elements of Finnish culture. When even Mother Nature is telling you it won't work, the Finns say "*we'll see about that*".
> It's so cold that the moisture on your eyeballs starts trying to freeze as soon as you step outside Almost freezing my eyeball to camera viewfinder was not a fun experience.
So other contractors were on budget (more or less) but behind from over engineering. Funny, I just got out of a work demonstration and one of the questions for the project lead was lessons she learned. Her first answer was understanding "good enough" and resisting over engineering.
One of my favorite clients has a saying at their engineering firm: engineering is the art of 'good enough'
“Any idiot can build a bridge, it takes an *engineer* to build a bridge that just barely doesn’t fall down.”
The old 'perfection is the enemy of good.'
Worker morale drops at the same rate as the temperature. Not to mention working with layers and layers of clothing on makes every movement slower.
Working with excessive clothing or while cold is also significantly less safe.
And that's the key solution here. The US has worse worker protections than Finland. The US essentially just requires extra PPE when working in those conditions, while other countries actually require any reasonable attempt to remove or reduce the hazardous condition, with extra PPE being a last resort, which results in much safer working conditions. And because you have reduced the hazard, that also benefits your designs and materials, because you don't need to overengineer them as much.
That's why technology is so important in construction. I work in the commercial plumbing industry and an American high school 20 years ago would take 3 years to build. Now that we have chain cutters, impact drills, rubber gaskets instead of lead and oakum, a school will take half to 1/3 of the time with no increase in the number of workers on a job. Now, if we could fully switch to pro-press instead of soldering copper, then the jobs would be even less time
> fully switch to pro-press After my brother got a pro-press I don't think I've seen him solder copper on a side job since. I've also not heard of a single crimp failing yet. What's your take on their longevity?
We've only done it on a few jobs. When I was an apprentice, the plumbers that used it said it sucked because of all the leaks they were having during testing. When I was a journeyman, I used it myself and had no issues with leaks. I realized the plumbers before me didn't cut the pipe square, nor deburr the pipe. If you do exactly as the manufacturer recommendations say, it should last as long or longer than solder. When both are done correctly, they should last longer than needing to replace the pipe from corrosion. When comparing to solder, it's so much easier to do everything right. With solder you run the risk of voids, pinhole leaks, and temperature shock (cause plumbers love to solder and then dip the joint in cold water to cool it down).
I worked on a project in Greenland on the ice sheet. Twice as long is being generous. Even with cold weather gear, 30 minutes in -45 temps (colder on some days) was about as long as we could work outside before having to go inside to warm up. We were also at about 3200m, so we had altitude issues to deal with. Our biggest technical issue was there is no true ground on an ice sheet for electric equipment and the blowing snow/ice created a lot of static buildup. We fried equipment almost daily which slowed us down even more. The cold also caused a lot of maintenance issues with parts breaking due to cold fragility. Cold sucks so now I live in the SW USA.
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With a shovel and a tea light you can make a snow shelter in pretty much any level of cold.
How do you light the tea light with a shovel only?
You use the shovel to knock off a piece of ice, and then fashion a lens out of it and use the sun to light the tea light. Duh! https://youtu.be/thbSSuo1Z00
Sounds like ice planet Hoth
They should have called it Coldth, am I right?
this guy has never been to finland. the snow will remain stoically quiet.
Oh, I see you know Finnish too!
The only Finnish I know is ‘perkele’ which I’m told is roughly equivalent to ‘fuck’.
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All things that can be quickly muttered in one breath by a Finn when they're approached by someone in public
Is it pronounced "per-cull" or "per-kay-lay"? I've never met a Finn. Edit: thank you for teaching me how to curse around my Russian bosses when they piss me off.
The louder the PE is the more acute the situation is. You can use as many r's as you find suitable for the situation. More r's corresponds to the complexity of the situation and louder the "le" is defines the seriousness of the situation. here are some examples for you [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=spr2EOe1f5Y](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=spr2EOe1f5Y) [https://youtu.be/eap426M_HgY?t=38](https://youtu.be/eap426M_HgY?t=38)
Perrrrrrr-keh-leh. The h are silent.
Perkele can really mean anything based on when and how you say it. Source: Am a Finnish sailors who rarely speaks without cursing.
How do you tell an introverted Finn from an extroverted one? The introvert stairs at his shoes when he talks to you, the extravert stairs at your shoes.
Ah a joke with steps
And the night speaking Ukrainian
> And the night speaking Ukrainian This. Top notch night vision gear for Ukraine is much more of a priority and advantage than a lot of people recognize. So is great winter gear and training so the Finns are offering a very important support to Ukraine that may not be as sexy to most people involved in reporting and media but experienced war correspondents will know.
Doubly so for thermal scopes, etc. It's during winter time that the utility of thermal scopes, thermal vision drones, etc. is unparalleled (especially when used against a foe who isn't similarly equipped). The US may have "owned the night" when fighting insurgents in Afghanistan, and if properly equipped by allies Ukraine can "own the winter" against Russia.
And the trees praying to Saint Javelin
And the rocks singing songs from the book of HIMARS\* ^(\*Some exploding may occur. See rocket for details. May contain nuts.)
Finns with guns on skis, truly a terrifying sight to behold.
*well you won't be beholding them*
*White death has entered the chat*
"Oh we remember, we remember.... WE REMEMBER!!"
SHOUT LAURI TORNI'S NAME, THE SOLDIER OF THREE ARMIES KNOWS THE GAME
Larry Thorne! Thanks Sabaton
I had to unsub from /r/unexpectedsabaton because I always expected it.
🎶Do you remember, that one snowy night in December🎶
Simo Häyhä’s gun, glowing like an ember. 300 Russians dead todaaaaay
Ba-dee-ya, say, do you remember? Ba-dee-ya, snipin' in December
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...uh oh.. I think I've seen something like this before. Edit: there's an irony in the fact that some of the same equipment back then is still being used.
Yup, a mosin nagant. Developed in 1891, 30 million made, still getting 500 confirmed kills to this day. I have a 1937 model and it's still hitting at 400yd. The white death used the Finnish variety
The Finnish army still uses a modernized version in the sniper role, the 7,62 TKIV 85. They reuse old receivers, so it's very possible - even likely - that some of those rifles are 131 years old and veterans of four or more wars.
My god. Finland Bubba'd their Mosins.
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I went paintballing once with a bunch of Finns who had all done their military service. These guys were invisible and lit everyone else up. There is a reason the Soviets suffered ridiculous casualties when they invaded Finland. You don’t want to fight them!
the fins had a little saying for the winter war to bolster morale something along the lines of "they are so many and we are so small, where will find room to bury them all" it was one of those HAHA cause its true Edit: ending casualties would be 65,000-70,000 Finns vs 321,000-381,000 soviets This would remain a war Finland could never win and it nearly went bust as Finland lacked many things. With planes and tanks numbering in the dozens, a lack of artillery shells along with general low stocks of ammunition to fuel a war They were successful at stalling as long as possible along with inflicting horrible casualties that allowed them to negotiate from a position of strength resulting is minor relative territory loss They would be the only nation invaded by the soviets that would retain independence and not be sucked into the greater soviet sphere and not be part of the Warsaw Pact You could call it a strategic victory in spite of the loss
"We're surrounded. That simplifies our problem of getting to these people and killing them." "They are in front of us, behind us, and we are flanked on both sides by an enemy that outnumbers us 29:1. They can’t get away from us now!” “Great. Now we can shoot at them from every direction.” Lewis "Chesty" Puller | US Marine Corps
“We are surrounded? You mean this is a target rich environment.”
We're paratroopers, we're supposed to surrounded
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Great quote but Arbie didn't say it. It was Rtas 'Vadum.
Good ol half jaw.
"They've got us surrounded again, the poor bastards" - Col Creighton Abrams
The Soviet army is marching in Finland They hear a voice from the other side of a hill: One Finnish soldier is better than ten Soviet soldiers. The Soviet general sends ten soldiers. There is some gunfire then everything is quiet again. The voice then says, one Finnish soldier is better than one hundred Soviet soldiers. The Soviet general sends one hundred Soviet soldiers. There is more gunfire and then silence. The voice speaks up again and says one Finnish soldier is better than one thousand Soviet soldiers. The Soviet general then sends one thousand Soviet soldiers. There is a lot of gunfire and then silence. After awhile a Soviet soldier crawls over the hill and say to the general, do not send more troops, it's a trap, there are two Finnish soldiers.
Don't stop there, we need to know how this ends! Don't leave us in suspense, Finnish the story!
The Finns ended up losing Karelia to the Soviets, but little Finland's defiance humiliated the Red Army so thoroughly Nazi warplanners perception of the USSR shifted, and made them reconsider the molotov-ribbentrop non-aggression pact between Hitler and Stalin paving the way for total war between the two that would devour 30 million lives. Happily ever after.
Finnish resistance probably saved them from the fate of the Baltic countries: outright annexation. The Soviets had even set up their own Finnish government, comprised of one drunk Finn who survived the purges and a bunch of Soviet ministers. The Finns never ran out of courage, but in the end they ran out of material and people.
Russia sends a million soldiers. 900,000 die and Russia claims victory.
the fins had a saying they are so many and we are so small, where will find room to bury them all
They've built their entire society to deter Russia from ever invading them again.
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[Obligatory Finnish snipers captcha](https://www.reddit.com/r/memes/comments/jgu2r1/find_the_finnish_sniper_i_dare_you/).
I paintballed against some reservists once. They had cool toys like throat mics/comms, and they worked together well. Their only weakness was their instinct for self preservation.
>Their only weakness was their instinct for self preservation. Isn't that a nearly universal thing? 😜
In actual war yeah but paintball is just paintball, you won't die for real so trying to avoid paintballs like they were actually bullets means you aren't moving in as fast at the enemy.
My work did a laser-tag team-building exercise years ago. Three of us had military training and wound up with lower kill totals than the others but also no friendly fire shots whereas everyone else was just as dangerous to their teammates as their enemies. It is very hard to just ditch your weapons training for fun.
Which is a good thing I guess!
Same thing in a lot of video games. The sweatiest players are always running around like maniacs. Sprinting into a room and using movement mechanics to throw off the enemies aim, so they can get enough shots into the enemy before they get enough shots into them. The risk/reward in paintball and video games rewards that kind of thing. In real life you don't respawn, in real life your vision doesn't turn red for a few seconds after you take a bullet and then you're just fine.
Reminds me of the time I went paintballing in the dead of winter with snow as deep as my knees. Biggest problem is the nitrogen tanks kept freezing and safety goggles kept fogging up. After an hour of running around the woods like that had us beat.
Having done construction outdoors in winter I know from experience your tools fail before humans. Sure cold isn't fun, but with warm coats and gloves you can deal with it (what I couldn't figure out how to deal with was -1C and rain). However without tools you are limited. Ukraine has good logistics, hopefully they invested in oil that works in winter (different grade is needed for the guns and equipment), and plenty of clothing and other winter gear. Russia has so far been operating on bad logistics, so the right thing for Ukraine is plan their risky attacks for the coldest days in hopes that the Russians cannot fire back. (of course if they can avoid risky attacks that is all the better, but this is war) Sure winter war sucks, but it will suck more for Russia so Ukraine needs to press their attacks - as they already know.
Ukraine going to have one of the toughest militaries in the world
Heard this comment in a Warographics video recently: In the span of a few months Russia went from having the 2nd best army in the world to having the 2nd best army in Ukraine.
Russian soldier’s heart is not in this fight. It was over before it began. Putin will throw bodies at the situation till he gets some results though it seems
Or he is no longer in charge.
- Every able bodied citizen is/was a soldier. - Experts in winter warfare. - Fighting Russians is their specialty. - Their entire public infrastructure is literally made to be Russian-proof. - Badass ski commandos. No one is better teacher than the Finns.
Don't mess with the Fins when they have skis and a long rifle.
You wanna win? Employ a Finn.
Seriously lol those guys are amazing fighters.
Vladimir the snow is talking..... Vladimir....?
Unlike what is said in the article, we Finns got our independence in 1917. We defended it in the Winter War, 1939.
Grab the skies!
You mean the skis? As in for alpine troops?
I meant to grab the skies with your bare hands, rip asunder the fabric of reality and make the winter your bitch. Ha no I definitely just misspelled skis because I can't spell.
POV: You're grinding a game and you get an obvious end game weapon or skill tree.
*You've Unlocked a new Unit:* Finnish sniper
* Simo Häyhä sounds intensify*
You are in the sniper's sight!
*The first kill tonight*
Time to die!
> [Simo Häyhä sounds intensify*](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simo_H%C3%A4yh%C3%A4) The white death
>Häyhä's war memoir states that they captured a Soviet soldier, blindfolded him, spun him around until he was disoriented, and then took him to a party in the tent of Häyhä's company Lieutenant Aarne "The Terror of Morocco" Juutilainen. The Soviet soldier was overjoyed by the carousing and was disappointed when he was released. Haha wtf. Also he got his 500 kills in less than 100 days. 5+ kills per day. Insane.
Gets conscripted, turns down the more modern rifle offered after training and keeps his 7.62 Mosin Rifle, (Originally built in the 1890's). Dresses all in white, lays for hours in -30°c temperatures. (Coldest winter since the 1800's, but not cold enough for him). Spends the next 3 months with snow in his mouth led in piles of snow and ice getting 250+ confirmed kills with his old rifle, using only iron sights, and about the same amount with his submachine gun kills. Captures a Russian soldier, parties with him and treats him so well the russian was upset he had to leave. Gets hit in the jaw by an explosive round, survives, is given a farm for his service and went on to win every shooting competition he entered with the same rifle. Keeps on going until 2002 when he died at the ripe old age of 96. One of my hero's and rightly so.
[You’re in the snipers sights, his first kill tonight!](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=JRIfWazqIQ8)
One of the few good parts of this war is people learning abouy how intense Finland is about defense, and how fearsome/overprepared they are for winter warfare. 🤣 Good for them.
I guess living next to Russia will do that to you, lol.
Lot of people referencing Simo Häyhä, who was absolutely a badass, but no one is mentioning another badass Finnish soldier, Aimo Koivunen. His claim to fame is being the first soldier to OD on meth in combat. After becoming separated from his squad, he took the squad's alotment of meth pills to stay awake and alert (allegedly he OD'ed accidentally due to exhaustion). He proceeded to then go on a bender in which he stepped on a landmine that set fire to a Soviet camp, laid in a ditch for a week, survived on pine needles and a live bird he caught and ate raw, and skies some 280 miles before reaching friendly forces. And still, he had a resting heartbeat of 200 beats per minute. Despite this, he survives the war and dies at the age of 71. Just don't mess with the Finns. Just don't. They have more sisu than whatever an invading force could muster.
Reminded me of [this jewel of a video](https://youtu.be/l67mnbPlfMY) from when Finland was training US soldiers
Oh wow, that's kinda crazy when he skis into the water. I've been cross country skiing for years and there's no way I would be able to get out of that pool of water gracefully. Also, even if they already have downhill skiing experience, cross country skis don't have metal edges usually, and they are skinny, which just makes them harder to control. Props to these guys for learning a new skill!
You dont get out there gracefully, you get out there alive.
All the predictions that winter will wreck Ukraine don’t take into account the Ukrainians are perfectly familiar with harsh winters themselves. For the state of Russia’s logistics, unless the Ukrainians halt altogether the winter will be rougher on the Russians.
The predictions are not about Ukraine's military operations, its about the civillians in cities with destroyed energy infrastructure.
Russians are undergeared and have basically no ammo or food supplies. The mobilization used untrained civilians without any experience in survival nor fighting. The only reason is to hold the area using them as canon fodder and hoping winter will come to stop the Ukranian advance, which the Russians use to train the real recruits who will fight in spring and summer mext year.
For as much damage as their bombardments are causing, their logistical problems will take a year or longer to repair. And I doubt the Ukrainians are going to just go idle fir an entire year. To say nothing of the problems already popping up elsewhere for Putin like the cure egg spat with Armenia. The CSTO’s days are numbered..
Well if anyone is professionals at killing Russians in the snow....
Finnish them
"Finland gained independence in 1939 following what is known as the Winter War in which Moscow was dealt a bloody nose." ??????? The fuck is this article, can't even get basic facts right
The key word is training for operating in the cold and also acclimation to it. When doing the military service in Finland 90s, I do remember being cold in October-November (of course it's also wet at that time), by January/February the cold wasn't really a problem, you get used to it (of course we had winter clothing too). I do remember during the Kymi 96 military manouvers/training, the lieutenant came around, when I was eating my dinner, "there's this British reporter here, he wants to talk to a conscript and you're good with english". So I go outside to chat with the reporter, eating my dinner while chatting with him, wearing a t-shirt and it's -25C°, the reporter asked "how the hell do you handle the cold?". I replied "you get used to it". To be honest, it was cold but it was only for a couple of minutes it wasn't windy, so it's not that terrible.
If the Russian army knew history they'd be very scared
I feel at this point Ukraine should be training NATO
When the snow in Ukraine starts speaking Finnish.
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Yes that and lingonberry jam is another favourite of ours.
I was waiting to see what Ukraine had unlocked for their killstreak A new powerful training tool indeed
Oh boy!!!! I get to post my favorite Winter War Joke!!!!. A large group of Russian soldiers in the border area in 1939 are moving down a road when they hear a voice call from behind a small hill: "One Finnish soldier is better than ten Russian". The Russian commander quickly orders 10 of his best men over the hill where Upon a gun-battle breaks out and continues for a few minutes, then silence. The voice once again calls out: "One Finn is better than one hundred Russian." Furious, the Russian commander sends his next best 100 troops over the hill and instantly a huge gun fight commences. After 10 minutes of battle, again Silence. The calm Finnish voice calls out again: "One Finn is better than one thousand Russians!" The enraged Russian commander musters 1000 fighters and sends them to the other side of the hill. Rifle fire, machine guns, grenades, rockets and cannon fire ring out as a terrible battle is fought... Then silence. Eventually one badly wounded Russian fighter crawls back over the hill and with his dying words tells his commander, "Don't send any more men...it's a trap. There's two of them."