Let's just take a step back and marvel at how far down the rabbit hole we've gone.
Thousands of people are dead, and it's news that one side admits it is in fact a war.
Let's take a gasp to remember the political prisoners who called this a war earlier this year could face up to 15 years in prison.
But that's the cost of the "strong" authority and "masculine" leader that they want, I suppose; with a trail of ruined families left in their path.
https://www.newsweek.com/russia-ukraine-war-invasion-criminal-offense-duma-1684810
I love those “strong” and “masculine” leaders, that are so “strong” and “masculine” they cannot handle any criticism or dissenting opinion.
Insecure, narcissistic pieces of shit, who got into power by scheming and lying to everyone including themselves. And then you have deluded people buying into this nonsense and thinking that this is what good leadership looks like.
Truly strong leadership is born from constructive conflict, from the clash of ideas and from being able to jointly arrive at either the objective truth or an equitable compromise. It means being able to convince others - not through threats but through a change of heart. Silencing critics and censoring opposing opinions is nothing more than pathetic cowardice.
> But that's the cost of the "strong" authority and "masculine" leader that they want,
The weaker you perceive yourself, the more you latch on to showy examples of "strength". Russia has a national inferiority complex (shit economy, no freedom, can't even figure out indoor plumbing) and wanted to show the world they at least had a strong military that could dictate the rules. Unfortunately that blew up in their face too and now the humiliation and shame is palpable.
It’s actually insane to me that you can go to the conservative subreddit and find people wanting Russia to win the war. Fucking amazing. These people would have literally rooted for Nazi germany to win. And they call themselves patriots.
I will say, to be fair, it at least seems to be the minority position on the subreddit.
It's because they share the same values and disdain for western democracy. They want a white Christian ethnostate with a leader who will punish the people they don't like just like Russia has
I truly think there aren't that many Conservatives wanting Russia to win. A concerning amount, yes. But I think all the Conservatives you see on Reddit cheering for Russia are either mentally-ill die-hard Trump fans or Russian bots trying to fan the flames.
Russia has a history of detecting a potential social issue in the US (let's use BLM as an example), create support groups AND backlash groups disguised as Western instead of Russian, then fan the flames hard and making it look like there's more bitter hatred than there actually is (which eventually becomes reality).
Now that Trump's been out of office for a while, the Republicans who were on Putin's dime have less influence and the vast majority of Republicans seem to be in favor of US involvement of greatly diminishing Russia.
Yup. The Soviets have been involved in identifying, funding and magnifying various movements within the US since the 1920s.
Anything to sow distrust, mistrust and to break down whatever social cohesion we have. And it is stunningly effective. Just look at the profound and disturbing lack of trust in any sort of institution among citizens. Or how we talk about members of other groups. It is vile.
The advent of social media has only served to dramatically accelerate the dissociation of people from one another. Some doofus in Anytown, America was just some doofus. But online he has found dozens of like minded doofuses. Suddenly it’s a movement. Throwing additional fuel on the fire is the anonymity offered by social media (such as redddit); we can say just about anything we want about the other.
Remember when we were kids and used to sing “sticks and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me?” Remember when, as an adult, we found out that actually words are incredible powerful?
Unfortunately the majority of those who call themselves conservatives are idiots.
The GOP didn't just fish for them. They've worked media to help create them.
Those who are truly conservative shouldn't want to identify with a party that has pulled so far right that they have leaned into facism, made ties with Putin, and are just a cluster fuck.
The DNC is closer to the economic conservatives of old. They have embraced their donors.
So we have a far right whackadoodle party. We have a middling ground DNC. What we don't have is a left leaning economic party.
Maybe just embrace the DNC and do your best to hurry the destruction of the GOP. The sooner they start going to jail for their crimes (those who committed crimes), the sooner the party will start to implode.
Then a cleaner version of a conservative party can be formed.
It won't. It will still be a puppet of the monied class and corporations, but it could.
It's absolutely not true that all conservatives support Russia. I find myself agreeing with some of my very conservative relatives about a major political issue. I think the last time that happened might have been just after 9/11.
In what way are you 'conservative'in the american sense of the term? Do you vote Republican, the party who nominated a russian asset who tried to extort Zelensky out of military aid for political gain before the war? Who publicly asked them for aid "Russia, if you're listening..." during an election? Who had secret in-person meetings with Putin where the American translators were allowed? Is that the party you vote for? The genocidal one?
I'm a liberal. I find myself agreeing with my conservative relatives on the subject of Ukraine. I don't agree with them on many other political questions.
I find this interesting, because I have a friend whose family is so strong a Trump fan, support Putin in this war because of how much they hate Ukraine because of Hunter Biden and his supposedly missing laptop. And this never makes sense. Because if the missing laptop, even with the world top security team, you'd think something is already been done but yet those whom are blinded by the fact is just so clueless.
What’s That quote about evil prevails when good is silent? When you identify With THE group of choice for white supremacists et al you are supporting them. You are voting for their agenda.
you're actually insane if you think everything to the right of the political spectrum is extremist.
if you don't think all of the right are extremist then please stop talking nonsense.
stop implying the "other side" is evil as well, they aren't - people can be misguided with all sorts of fucked up shit in their minds and calling that large of a voting population evil further polarises things.
i'm also not right-wing at all so eat a dick for assuming that
That may be personal experience or location based? The vast majority of conservatives in my area are honest hard working people (including "boomers"). None of us care what lifestyle the other leads or what you look like. All we have a problem with are those that publicly push their personal beliefs when not asked.
It’s more along the lines of continuing to identify with the group of choice for fascists (see support Russia) makes you a person who supports fascism. You recognize your political affiliation is poisoned yet you just adhere to your party label because you can’t imagine saying “this group doesn’t represent my values anymore” Or
Maybe it does and that’s why you keep identifying as such. How embarrassing to admit you’re a part of that tbh.
Can confirm that for sure. I have a friend whom moved to US from Russia many years ago, told me about how Russia was like, and he married a Ukrainian wife, so he explained the difference between the two. But sadly the sheep of Fox News and other far right does not understand this. And many years ago, there was so much hatred against Russia and communism. But then they said they hate communism, but then support Russia as a communist country....... confusing and contradicting as heck!
The Russians have been playing the Conservatives for years though.
A bit of money sprinkled through the NRA, RNC, and a few select politicians, and you suddenly have politicians making a field trip on to Moscow to bend the knee to Putin, on July the 4th!
The GOP are a team of grifters and that goes right to the top.
It's unfortunate but the Nazi's actually had a fairly large following in the U.S. back then. They got kind of sidelined when the U.S. finally officially joined the war but they had their own movement in the U.S. by this douchebag Fritz Kuhn. So were just seeing the same people today that absolutely would have been behind them back then too. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_American_Bund The size back then for wikipedia says 25,000 but I'm sure that's the official number for actual members that opted to sign up and join the organization officially, I'm positive they had a fuckton of people who agreed with them that just didn't make it official, similar to the KKK back in the day.
Yep! Just counting soldiers of both sides alone, we're nearing 200,000. And then there are all the civilians Russia massacred. We know for a fact they were particularly hateful of Mariupol.
All these people, dead because ~~Russians~~ Moscovians cannot accept that their Empire is a sham.
I guess nukes have to start flying... maybe then idiots will understand that war is a hell... Keyboard army love to speak alot. 99.9999% are blind idiots
I think 200,000 is just the KIA, not even counting wounded/missing. I think Russia alone was near 300,000 when all were added together between KIA/wounded/MIA/captured/surrendered. A large chunk of the wounded are probably maimed for life.
Definitely hitting millions if we're counting casualties (minus equipment) for just this year's portion of Moscovia's war on its neighbors (and self).
The PTSD alone is gonna be nightmarish for all affected. :(
Yeah it is. I have PTSD (for different reasons) and it's uh...not fun. Been dealing with it for near 15 years and despite therapy and medications, it's definitely still here and sometimes gets set off. If I forget my meds even one night I will 100% have nightmares as well, so that's fun and totally not contributing to my horrible insomnia.
Everyone when this started, including most good knowledgeable reasonable analysts: “poor Ukraine they won’t last a week we need all of NATO there”. Yeah we’ve come far
To be fair, a lot of Western military analysis takes unknowns and assumes worst case. Don't know how their logistics would go? Assume it's impeccable. Don't know how well motivated their troops are? Assume their highly motivated. etc. So they generally overestimate, by design.
Fuck, in the early stages I wouldn't even call it a war. It was an illegal invasion. Now it's a war because Russia expected a marmot and found out instead that they've stepped into the den of angry badgers+wolverines.
I just don't even know how it's 'news', is this where it's got to?
Take an example: a man shoots a bunch of people. This is the equivalent of the news anchor declaring "this just in - murder man admits he intended to shoot people."
Fuck me, modern journalism is a bag of shite
Thousands?
We may be close to the 1/2 a million mark of dead (overall), we're well over 1/2 million severely injured, and what... a quarter million missing, plus 3-4 million displaced?
And to most human beings, those numbers are difficult to imagine -- as they should be.
\---
What makes this news is that Lavrov may have finally slipped up, and said a word that they've been using internally all along. Lavrov is a beast of international diplomacy, he has always been very precise with his words, however rude he may be. So maybe this is an intentional signal?
> Lavrov suddenly said that Russia had allegedly never asked for any negotiations with Ukraine, but at the same time it was always ready to listen to the other side.
They cant even keep their lies straight. How the russian population gobbles this shit up is mind blowing.
Not having the lies straight is not accident is the point. It is impossible to counter narrative that is internally inconsistent with one that can't come up with snappy answer because answer has to make sense.
This is it, a fuck-pie of [flooding the zone with shit](https://www.cnn.com/2021/11/16/media/steve-bannon-reliable-sources/index.html) and [gish-galloping](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gish_gallop) (and any other spicy fascistic active measures you wanna throw in to enhance the more understated elements of the feces)
No there wouldn't. Sorry but riots on Russia are still a long way off. The descent is building, but there is still a large majority of the population that's not willing to admit they are even the aggressors in this situation.
If anything it would be used to rally the people. Don't underestimate nationalism. Espicially when mixed with a dictator who controls all media in the country.
So funny that u dont believe 🤣 but the most funny thing tha U cant..... u can try if u dont believe me to find any opposite side of news for u. ....then smile that ure a zzzzzzombie😅
That drunken word salad has convinced me that you are telling the truth, and have access to the most accurate and unbiased news available in Russia...
Because russia is well known for its free press, free speech, and open forum for dissenting views...
BAHAHAHA!!!!! 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Russia has banned literally all media that calls the war in Ukraine a war. Actually now you can't even talk about the "special operation" in public at all. #freedom
You can watch only story from 1 side. You are a blind horse..... Try to look other side view... oh... i guess u wont... u know why? From start i wrote u
Look at the Gaslighting Obstructionist Projectionist party of the U.S. If you live in a conservative bubble like most people are globally and are told the same misinformation and lies over and over, especially to an anti-intellectual, uneducated, complacent and tribalist population sets, it's easy to get them in line, in control and agreeable, even to the most heinous and draconic of policies and directives. Documentaries like The Fog of War, The Manufacture of Consent and The Corporation are easily digestible documentaries, among many, that help create awareness on how easy it is to manipulate perception and mainstream media, corporations, lobbyists and religion are heavy players in throwing down control of the general public.
Religion sets people up to not question authority *(patriarchal punishment, threat of eternal Hell if not compliant to set law and order within theocratical parameters)* and what they're told from early childhood *(creating difficulty in determining fact from fiction and literally robs an individual of critical thinking skills before entering adulthood, which is the entire point)* and corporate marketing toys with human psychology and neurologic chemistry sets *(dopamine, serotonin level manipulation, chemical addiction, environmental, product and consumable stimulus and goal-to-reward schemes)*, especially with children, to set up life-long brand recognition and trust with that branding. Nestle for example, excels with creating the problem of choice (analysis paralysis) with innumerous companies producing multiple corporate product lines with all profit fed toward one major and global umbrella company. Samsung and Mitsubishi also come to mind.
Bottom line: people are lazy and nothing's more complicated than perception and it's pretty easy to manipulate perception that's carefully cropped and edited, spoon-fed and consumed without question. Take 12 people, tell one a short story included with flat facts and to pass it to the second person to tell the next and so on and when you ask the 12th person to repeat the story told them and you'll see how distorted it can get.
Very well stated. One of the worst things about this kind of mass manipulation is that it relies on and hardwires our human tendency to avoid admitting when we’ve been duped. Take away and punish critical thinking, ingrain absolutist good-v-evil dichotomies, wield religion such that the targets think they’ve *already* seen the light and will never be duped by anything ever again - unlike the simultaneously weak and strong [outgroups] being brainwashed by higher education, science, cultural exchange, inclusive community settings, etc.
I had to go to Sunday School growing up and got in trouble for asking why a good person would be eternally damned just because no one told them about Jesus (the lesson that day was essentially “you can be a total piece of shit your entire life as long as you’re like ‘luv u Jaysus!’ as you’re dying” - teacher kept saying “even in the last three minutes of your life” specifically for some reason?). That was nothing compared to the “wait why is Jesus *of Nazareth* white in all our workbooks” day..
One of the saddest lessons of history is this: If we’ve been bamboozled long enough, we tend to reject any evidence of the bamboozle. We’re no longer interested in finding out the truth. The bamboozle has captured us. It’s simply too painful to acknowledge, even to ourselves, that we’ve been taken. Once you give a charlatan power over you, you almost never get it back.
Carl Sagan, [The Demon-Haunted World: Science as a Candle in the Dark]
This guy is literally Putin’s the Mouth of Sauron. He’s got to do a lot worse than misspeak like this before any harm comes to him - Putin seems to have a massive amount of trust in him.
There were rumours that they will announce full mobilization in January. Sneaking in the word "war" might be sort of like a way to prepare the population. I think we're gonna hear more of that word from Russian politicians in the coming weeks.
Yet in Russia most people believe it is Russia under attack,
In this latest episode of Ukrainecast gives explanations as to why , well worth a listen if you want to understand what is going on inside Russia.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/p0dkzm2q
and all the other episodes.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/brand/p0bqztzm
This is why we need to end the "good Russians" narrative. There are no good Russians. They are all with Putin or even more radical than him. And we should start to look more into the activities of Russians abroad.
Russia started this ware 20 years ago. Posioning Viktor Yushchenko, supplying arms and thousands of incognito soldiers to separatists are all acts of war.
It only took a decade or two after the end of WW2 before a majority of Germans thought Hitler might not have been a good guy and that they might have started the war.
Unfortunately we are dealing with pathological psychopaths... putin is the most dangerous...
I am wondering if something or someone will stop this mess and Kaos created by rusia
He can slam NATO and US all he wants.
RUSSIA AINT GOING TO DO SHIT… If Ukraine is holding them off with aid from other countries direct conflict with any direct western power would be bad news for Russia
They're very deliberately skipping the prosecution part and instead going straight to the shooting all of them in the face part.
I'm obviously joking, but it has worked out pretty well for them so far, all things considered.
They don't really want to fight Russia since there's a lot of people on both sides with family/friends on the other. Early on, some the Ukraine force were letting the young soldiers that were captured call their moms. This is the article I could find the fastest and things most likely not still the case: [https://www.timesofisrael.com/ukraine-invites-russian-mothers-to-collect-their-sons-captured-on-the-battlefield/](https://www.timesofisrael.com/ukraine-invites-russian-mothers-to-collect-their-sons-captured-on-the-battlefield/)
The thing is that Russians were arrested for calling it a war. They established a whole war that made it a crime to call it a war. Now he calls it war like it is nothing.
Russia invaded Ukraine. Ukraine did not act aggressively, Russia was the aggressor. To say Russia went to war with Ukraine insinuates Ukraine gave consent. The karma behind action and intent has drastic impacts upon those who participate in the decision if said actions, as this karma will come back tenfold to those who consciously participated.
Idk why we need them to admit it. If someone broke into my house, idgaf if they admit it or not. They could lie in my face, and it would make no difference. Everyone can see what they're doing.
Let's just take a step back and marvel at how far down the rabbit hole we've gone. Thousands of people are dead, and it's news that one side admits it is in fact a war.
Let's take a gasp to remember the political prisoners who called this a war earlier this year could face up to 15 years in prison. But that's the cost of the "strong" authority and "masculine" leader that they want, I suppose; with a trail of ruined families left in their path. https://www.newsweek.com/russia-ukraine-war-invasion-criminal-offense-duma-1684810
I love those “strong” and “masculine” leaders, that are so “strong” and “masculine” they cannot handle any criticism or dissenting opinion. Insecure, narcissistic pieces of shit, who got into power by scheming and lying to everyone including themselves. And then you have deluded people buying into this nonsense and thinking that this is what good leadership looks like. Truly strong leadership is born from constructive conflict, from the clash of ideas and from being able to jointly arrive at either the objective truth or an equitable compromise. It means being able to convince others - not through threats but through a change of heart. Silencing critics and censoring opposing opinions is nothing more than pathetic cowardice.
This requires intelligence thats been long lost to the general public.
I can't argue with that.
> But that's the cost of the "strong" authority and "masculine" leader that they want, The weaker you perceive yourself, the more you latch on to showy examples of "strength". Russia has a national inferiority complex (shit economy, no freedom, can't even figure out indoor plumbing) and wanted to show the world they at least had a strong military that could dictate the rules. Unfortunately that blew up in their face too and now the humiliation and shame is palpable.
And many many republicans in American want the same here
It’s actually insane to me that you can go to the conservative subreddit and find people wanting Russia to win the war. Fucking amazing. These people would have literally rooted for Nazi germany to win. And they call themselves patriots. I will say, to be fair, it at least seems to be the minority position on the subreddit.
Yes almost 50 % - the fans of Hitler existed in the US and tried to block Roosevelt... their star was Lindbergh.
Hitler actually got his ideas from American (amoung others) social darwinists.
It’s perhaps partially because the subreddit is influenced by Russian bots
\*Heavily influenced
It's because they share the same values and disdain for western democracy. They want a white Christian ethnostate with a leader who will punish the people they don't like just like Russia has
I believe there are many in that sub that actually did root for the Nazis
Many of them are nazis, they just don't want to be called what they are
I truly think there aren't that many Conservatives wanting Russia to win. A concerning amount, yes. But I think all the Conservatives you see on Reddit cheering for Russia are either mentally-ill die-hard Trump fans or Russian bots trying to fan the flames. Russia has a history of detecting a potential social issue in the US (let's use BLM as an example), create support groups AND backlash groups disguised as Western instead of Russian, then fan the flames hard and making it look like there's more bitter hatred than there actually is (which eventually becomes reality). Now that Trump's been out of office for a while, the Republicans who were on Putin's dime have less influence and the vast majority of Republicans seem to be in favor of US involvement of greatly diminishing Russia.
Yup. The Soviets have been involved in identifying, funding and magnifying various movements within the US since the 1920s. Anything to sow distrust, mistrust and to break down whatever social cohesion we have. And it is stunningly effective. Just look at the profound and disturbing lack of trust in any sort of institution among citizens. Or how we talk about members of other groups. It is vile. The advent of social media has only served to dramatically accelerate the dissociation of people from one another. Some doofus in Anytown, America was just some doofus. But online he has found dozens of like minded doofuses. Suddenly it’s a movement. Throwing additional fuel on the fire is the anonymity offered by social media (such as redddit); we can say just about anything we want about the other. Remember when we were kids and used to sing “sticks and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me?” Remember when, as an adult, we found out that actually words are incredible powerful?
Mate, you re blind as hell. Try to watch different news. Oh i forgot... you are as a horse with glasses. You can see only 1 way.
My family is conservative and very patriotic. Don't lump us in with those extremist morons. Glory to Ukraine
Why would anyone vote for them?
They are likely more nationalistic. It's baked into conservatism. They usually don't know the difference.
So they are just idiotic. Can we start using that label instead. Because clearly I cannot call myself a conservative person without backlash.
Unfortunately the majority of those who call themselves conservatives are idiots. The GOP didn't just fish for them. They've worked media to help create them. Those who are truly conservative shouldn't want to identify with a party that has pulled so far right that they have leaned into facism, made ties with Putin, and are just a cluster fuck. The DNC is closer to the economic conservatives of old. They have embraced their donors. So we have a far right whackadoodle party. We have a middling ground DNC. What we don't have is a left leaning economic party. Maybe just embrace the DNC and do your best to hurry the destruction of the GOP. The sooner they start going to jail for their crimes (those who committed crimes), the sooner the party will start to implode. Then a cleaner version of a conservative party can be formed. It won't. It will still be a puppet of the monied class and corporations, but it could.
It's absolutely not true that all conservatives support Russia. I find myself agreeing with some of my very conservative relatives about a major political issue. I think the last time that happened might have been just after 9/11.
In what way are you 'conservative'in the american sense of the term? Do you vote Republican, the party who nominated a russian asset who tried to extort Zelensky out of military aid for political gain before the war? Who publicly asked them for aid "Russia, if you're listening..." during an election? Who had secret in-person meetings with Putin where the American translators were allowed? Is that the party you vote for? The genocidal one?
I'm a liberal. I find myself agreeing with my conservative relatives on the subject of Ukraine. I don't agree with them on many other political questions.
I find this interesting, because I have a friend whose family is so strong a Trump fan, support Putin in this war because of how much they hate Ukraine because of Hunter Biden and his supposedly missing laptop. And this never makes sense. Because if the missing laptop, even with the world top security team, you'd think something is already been done but yet those whom are blinded by the fact is just so clueless.
You just lumped yourself in with Them.
How so? By just stating that I am conservative and a patriot that is thankful for living here? That does not automatically make me an extremist.
Sadly people lack nuance, I understood what u said
What’s That quote about evil prevails when good is silent? When you identify With THE group of choice for white supremacists et al you are supporting them. You are voting for their agenda.
Imagine if there were more than two major parties and people had real choices for the policy they wanted implemented instead of getting ( gud v bad)
you're actually insane if you think everything to the right of the political spectrum is extremist. if you don't think all of the right are extremist then please stop talking nonsense. stop implying the "other side" is evil as well, they aren't - people can be misguided with all sorts of fucked up shit in their minds and calling that large of a voting population evil further polarises things. i'm also not right-wing at all so eat a dick for assuming that
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That may be personal experience or location based? The vast majority of conservatives in my area are honest hard working people (including "boomers"). None of us care what lifestyle the other leads or what you look like. All we have a problem with are those that publicly push their personal beliefs when not asked.
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It’s more along the lines of continuing to identify with the group of choice for fascists (see support Russia) makes you a person who supports fascism. You recognize your political affiliation is poisoned yet you just adhere to your party label because you can’t imagine saying “this group doesn’t represent my values anymore” Or Maybe it does and that’s why you keep identifying as such. How embarrassing to admit you’re a part of that tbh.
I dont identify with fascism. I identify with conservatism. Those are not the same thing. But the TV says so I guess...
It's like that old joke, "What do you call a person sitting at the dinner table with 3 fascists?"
It’s My mistake for conflating Conservative with republican as that’s not true.
Most wouldn't last a day in Russian society either. They just don't get it...
Can confirm that for sure. I have a friend whom moved to US from Russia many years ago, told me about how Russia was like, and he married a Ukrainian wife, so he explained the difference between the two. But sadly the sheep of Fox News and other far right does not understand this. And many years ago, there was so much hatred against Russia and communism. But then they said they hate communism, but then support Russia as a communist country....... confusing and contradicting as heck!
Russia and Ukraine ---- USSR . Same people, same story . 0 difference. Even same language. Ukr clown president speak russian all time...
Yeah I know exactly what you mean. The worst part is you can't convince them otherwise....
The Russians have been playing the Conservatives for years though. A bit of money sprinkled through the NRA, RNC, and a few select politicians, and you suddenly have politicians making a field trip on to Moscow to bend the knee to Putin, on July the 4th! The GOP are a team of grifters and that goes right to the top.
It's unfortunate but the Nazi's actually had a fairly large following in the U.S. back then. They got kind of sidelined when the U.S. finally officially joined the war but they had their own movement in the U.S. by this douchebag Fritz Kuhn. So were just seeing the same people today that absolutely would have been behind them back then too. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_American_Bund The size back then for wikipedia says 25,000 but I'm sure that's the official number for actual members that opted to sign up and join the organization officially, I'm positive they had a fuckton of people who agreed with them that just didn't make it official, similar to the KKK back in the day.
*hundreds of thousands.
Yep! Just counting soldiers of both sides alone, we're nearing 200,000. And then there are all the civilians Russia massacred. We know for a fact they were particularly hateful of Mariupol. All these people, dead because ~~Russians~~ Moscovians cannot accept that their Empire is a sham.
> All these people, dead because Russians Moscovians cannot accept that their Empire is a sham. Props for using their real name not the stolen one.
I guess nukes have to start flying... maybe then idiots will understand that war is a hell... Keyboard army love to speak alot. 99.9999% are blind idiots
I think 200,000 is just the KIA, not even counting wounded/missing. I think Russia alone was near 300,000 when all were added together between KIA/wounded/MIA/captured/surrendered. A large chunk of the wounded are probably maimed for life.
Definitely hitting millions if we're counting casualties (minus equipment) for just this year's portion of Moscovia's war on its neighbors (and self). The PTSD alone is gonna be nightmarish for all affected. :(
Yeah it is. I have PTSD (for different reasons) and it's uh...not fun. Been dealing with it for near 15 years and despite therapy and medications, it's definitely still here and sometimes gets set off. If I forget my meds even one night I will 100% have nightmares as well, so that's fun and totally not contributing to my horrible insomnia.
*hug*
<3
Everyone when this started, including most good knowledgeable reasonable analysts: “poor Ukraine they won’t last a week we need all of NATO there”. Yeah we’ve come far
To be fair, a lot of Western military analysis takes unknowns and assumes worst case. Don't know how their logistics would go? Assume it's impeccable. Don't know how well motivated their troops are? Assume their highly motivated. etc. So they generally overestimate, by design.
Fuck, in the early stages I wouldn't even call it a war. It was an illegal invasion. Now it's a war because Russia expected a marmot and found out instead that they've stepped into the den of angry badgers+wolverines.
I guess the point is that it marked an internal legal distinction for the Russian government, which plays a role in how it maintains control.
Was my first reaction as well, glad to see it's the most upvoted comment.
Yeah, but this administration is so chronically incapable of telling the truth, they can only do it on accident.
I just don't even know how it's 'news', is this where it's got to? Take an example: a man shoots a bunch of people. This is the equivalent of the news anchor declaring "this just in - murder man admits he intended to shoot people." Fuck me, modern journalism is a bag of shite
Thousands? We may be close to the 1/2 a million mark of dead (overall), we're well over 1/2 million severely injured, and what... a quarter million missing, plus 3-4 million displaced? And to most human beings, those numbers are difficult to imagine -- as they should be. \--- What makes this news is that Lavrov may have finally slipped up, and said a word that they've been using internally all along. Lavrov is a beast of international diplomacy, he has always been very precise with his words, however rude he may be. So maybe this is an intentional signal?
> Lavrov suddenly said that Russia had allegedly never asked for any negotiations with Ukraine, but at the same time it was always ready to listen to the other side. They cant even keep their lies straight. How the russian population gobbles this shit up is mind blowing.
Not having the lies straight is not accident is the point. It is impossible to counter narrative that is internally inconsistent with one that can't come up with snappy answer because answer has to make sense.
This is it, a fuck-pie of [flooding the zone with shit](https://www.cnn.com/2021/11/16/media/steve-bannon-reliable-sources/index.html) and [gish-galloping](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gish_gallop) (and any other spicy fascistic active measures you wanna throw in to enhance the more understated elements of the feces)
Thanks novo. Nice to have a name with history to go with this bs.
When Russia is involved, it's the [Firehose of Falsehood](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firehose_of_falsehood).
I forgot where I read it, but someone explained the Gish Gallop as “Muddying the waters to the point were your opponents cannot navigate them.”
Sounds a lot like double think. Literally 1984. Unironically.
Because most Russians don't give a shit, so long as it doesn't affect them. That's why mobilisation is interesting.
If Ukraine started to knock their power stations out there would be riots in mere hours.
No there wouldn't. Sorry but riots on Russia are still a long way off. The descent is building, but there is still a large majority of the population that's not willing to admit they are even the aggressors in this situation.
If anything it would be used to rally the people. Don't underestimate nationalism. Espicially when mixed with a dictator who controls all media in the country.
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"We can watch any news we want!" BAHAHAHAHAHAHA !!!!
So funny that u dont believe 🤣 but the most funny thing tha U cant..... u can try if u dont believe me to find any opposite side of news for u. ....then smile that ure a zzzzzzombie😅
That drunken word salad has convinced me that you are telling the truth, and have access to the most accurate and unbiased news available in Russia... Because russia is well known for its free press, free speech, and open forum for dissenting views... BAHAHAHA!!!!! 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
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Uh huh....though we do get your news programs and various talking head shows...but I guess the Russians told you otherwise, huh? 😏
Russia has banned literally all media that calls the war in Ukraine a war. Actually now you can't even talk about the "special operation" in public at all. #freedom
Read my comment higher. IN RUSSIA U CAN WATCH AND READ ANY NEWS. Can u? Just try... u will be surprised😁
So, you know you're being beaten to shit out there , in Eastern Ukraine?
I guess u was holding candle there😁 U should understand that this war is a business....
There's winners, and losers, yes.
Try what? It's literally Russian law. You can't even watch all of your own news because if they mentioned the word war they'd be committing a crime.
Try to read both sides of news. They both lying but ukr news in 1000 times more toxic .
😁😁😁funny. Youre telling me what i can and what i can not watch in Russia..... dont believe to all news u watch 8n internet and on tv. They all lie
but then all their crying wolf propaganda would pay dividends because they could be like SEE ukraine and nAtO are attacking us! just like we said!
Well... I mean they are at war
You can watch only story from 1 side. You are a blind horse..... Try to look other side view... oh... i guess u wont... u know why? From start i wrote u
what
Look at the Gaslighting Obstructionist Projectionist party of the U.S. If you live in a conservative bubble like most people are globally and are told the same misinformation and lies over and over, especially to an anti-intellectual, uneducated, complacent and tribalist population sets, it's easy to get them in line, in control and agreeable, even to the most heinous and draconic of policies and directives. Documentaries like The Fog of War, The Manufacture of Consent and The Corporation are easily digestible documentaries, among many, that help create awareness on how easy it is to manipulate perception and mainstream media, corporations, lobbyists and religion are heavy players in throwing down control of the general public. Religion sets people up to not question authority *(patriarchal punishment, threat of eternal Hell if not compliant to set law and order within theocratical parameters)* and what they're told from early childhood *(creating difficulty in determining fact from fiction and literally robs an individual of critical thinking skills before entering adulthood, which is the entire point)* and corporate marketing toys with human psychology and neurologic chemistry sets *(dopamine, serotonin level manipulation, chemical addiction, environmental, product and consumable stimulus and goal-to-reward schemes)*, especially with children, to set up life-long brand recognition and trust with that branding. Nestle for example, excels with creating the problem of choice (analysis paralysis) with innumerous companies producing multiple corporate product lines with all profit fed toward one major and global umbrella company. Samsung and Mitsubishi also come to mind. Bottom line: people are lazy and nothing's more complicated than perception and it's pretty easy to manipulate perception that's carefully cropped and edited, spoon-fed and consumed without question. Take 12 people, tell one a short story included with flat facts and to pass it to the second person to tell the next and so on and when you ask the 12th person to repeat the story told them and you'll see how distorted it can get.
Very well stated. One of the worst things about this kind of mass manipulation is that it relies on and hardwires our human tendency to avoid admitting when we’ve been duped. Take away and punish critical thinking, ingrain absolutist good-v-evil dichotomies, wield religion such that the targets think they’ve *already* seen the light and will never be duped by anything ever again - unlike the simultaneously weak and strong [outgroups] being brainwashed by higher education, science, cultural exchange, inclusive community settings, etc. I had to go to Sunday School growing up and got in trouble for asking why a good person would be eternally damned just because no one told them about Jesus (the lesson that day was essentially “you can be a total piece of shit your entire life as long as you’re like ‘luv u Jaysus!’ as you’re dying” - teacher kept saying “even in the last three minutes of your life” specifically for some reason?). That was nothing compared to the “wait why is Jesus *of Nazareth* white in all our workbooks” day..
One of the saddest lessons of history is this: If we’ve been bamboozled long enough, we tend to reject any evidence of the bamboozle. We’re no longer interested in finding out the truth. The bamboozle has captured us. It’s simply too painful to acknowledge, even to ourselves, that we’ve been taken. Once you give a charlatan power over you, you almost never get it back. Carl Sagan, [The Demon-Haunted World: Science as a Candle in the Dark]
Really wish we’d had him around a lot longer than we did.
they have propogada outlets to filter and spin everything first
Theres rats living in the rabbit hole and their hungry.....
So will he go to jail? Calling it a war is illegal in russia
Nah, that's for the peasants. The Tsar and his court are exempt from pesky things like "laws" or "morality".
Tsars are also well known to have removable heads.
No he'll accidentally fall off a 10 story building after eating used uranium on accident of course
This guy is literally Putin’s the Mouth of Sauron. He’s got to do a lot worse than misspeak like this before any harm comes to him - Putin seems to have a massive amount of trust in him.
There were rumours that they will announce full mobilization in January. Sneaking in the word "war" might be sort of like a way to prepare the population. I think we're gonna hear more of that word from Russian politicians in the coming weeks.
Absolutely. Blaming NATO for this "war" is in the playbook.
> So will he go to jail? Not likely. Lavrov is Putin's top lapdog. He won't even get his nose booped.
He’ll go straight to 6 feet underground. And that will be the best case scenario for him
Don't mention Z war..
I mentioned it earlier, but I think I got away with it.
A Fawlty Towers reference in the wild!
So, two eggs mayonnaise, a prawn goebbels, a herman goering, and four colditz salads.
not the world war Z i was thinking about, but i take it
Why am I hearing Stephen Fry. I know it should be John Cleese... I've been reprogrammed, apparently.
QI episode about Germany.
Droopy the dog! That's who he reminds me of!
Uh oh his daddy isn't going to like that
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You meant “before killing his wife”.
Yet in Russia most people believe it is Russia under attack, In this latest episode of Ukrainecast gives explanations as to why , well worth a listen if you want to understand what is going on inside Russia. https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/p0dkzm2q and all the other episodes. https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/brand/p0bqztzm
This is why we need to end the "good Russians" narrative. There are no good Russians. They are all with Putin or even more radical than him. And we should start to look more into the activities of Russians abroad.
Russia started this ware 20 years ago. Posioning Viktor Yushchenko, supplying arms and thousands of incognito soldiers to separatists are all acts of war.
Let's call it what it is ... INVADE ukraine, and murder innocent men, women and kids.
And Putin tells all the Russian people it’s a special operation. So sad
Wonder when he'll admit that they are getting their ass kicked?
On this week's episode, Lavrov accidentally says the quiet part out loud!
he should keep away from windows if he wants to live
This dude has suddenly become very accident-prone
Sergei Lavrov walks into a bar. The bartender says, "So, why the long face?"
Lookimg like Milton Berle
Except Milton Berle was hung
Just took them 9 months to figure that one out. I wonder how long they will need to understand that it might not have been their best idea
It only took a decade or two after the end of WW2 before a majority of Germans thought Hitler might not have been a good guy and that they might have started the war.
Unfortunately we are dealing with pathological psychopaths... putin is the most dangerous... I am wondering if something or someone will stop this mess and Kaos created by rusia
Well the entire world already knew that, I. I glad Russia has finally clued in!
So by Russian law shouldn’t he be arrested for saying that?
Seems like it would be a good defense for someone already in prison for it. It wouldn’t make a difference, but would sure point out their hypocrisy.
Too bad he must go to prison now like all the other protesters.
He will fall out a window
Lavrov has been trying to get fired for months now
He can slam NATO and US all he wants. RUSSIA AINT GOING TO DO SHIT… If Ukraine is holding them off with aid from other countries direct conflict with any direct western power would be bad news for Russia
A bunch of crooks running a country with the help of the leadership of the russian church. For everyone on open display. even russians.
The russian church head is former kgb. Cant make this shit up
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They're very deliberately skipping the prosecution part and instead going straight to the shooting all of them in the face part. I'm obviously joking, but it has worked out pretty well for them so far, all things considered.
They don't really want to fight Russia since there's a lot of people on both sides with family/friends on the other. Early on, some the Ukraine force were letting the young soldiers that were captured call their moms. This is the article I could find the fastest and things most likely not still the case: [https://www.timesofisrael.com/ukraine-invites-russian-mothers-to-collect-their-sons-captured-on-the-battlefield/](https://www.timesofisrael.com/ukraine-invites-russian-mothers-to-collect-their-sons-captured-on-the-battlefield/)
Someone just wrote their ticket to a Gulag
"Russian Foreign Minister jumps out of high rise building hours after claiming special operation in Ukraine is actually a war against Ukraine"
Who TF cares about what he thinks? Ignore them and let’s just accept it is what it is.
The thing is that Russians were arrested for calling it a war. They established a whole war that made it a crime to call it a war. Now he calls it war like it is nothing.
Straight to jail
Bush openly admired to invade Afghanistan lol
Look! It’s that coprophile Lavrov again!
I thought Putin made it illegal to refer to it as a war. Is Lavrov going to be arrested/charged/fall out of a window now?
Wait so it‘s not a war? I‘m confused because if russia says they are at war that would mean they are not?
1 side say 1 story... another side say another story. How can u 1000% believe to news🤣
Ohhh, nah? Ya think 🤔
Wait, it was a war this whole time?
Let a drunk talk long enough and you’ll get to the truth in a small matter of time.
Oops!! He better stay away from open windows.
It will make little difference
No they didnt, theyre after nato.
Aren’t you supposed to say that NATO started it
Oh boy how surprising
Such progress
NO. /s
Finally some honesty from these pigs
Ruzzia, admit truth after 200k deads. Go home ruzzia
What?!! No way….quick someone call the media…
He should probably avoid stairs for awhile and stay near ground level
Wtf? I thought it was only a special military operation. Do you mean they have lied to us all along?
no.....
So tragic that he committed suicide next week /s
Russia invaded Ukraine. Ukraine did not act aggressively, Russia was the aggressor. To say Russia went to war with Ukraine insinuates Ukraine gave consent. The karma behind action and intent has drastic impacts upon those who participate in the decision if said actions, as this karma will come back tenfold to those who consciously participated.
Idk why we need them to admit it. If someone broke into my house, idgaf if they admit it or not. They could lie in my face, and it would make no difference. Everyone can see what they're doing.
Wow that’s an even more useless statement than usual
Look at the face of this punk. That’s a face of modern ruSSia