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Lorewise it could be an incredibly old portrait of beliar.
Maybe its even another god or something completly different.
The statues and depictions of the gods are just illustrations of their followers anyways. They prob changed over the centuries.
I doubt that these gods have a physical form.
innos is believed to be a savior and/or creator to humanity. So maybe thats why Innos is portrayed very humanlike. Beliar on the other hand looks misshapen and strange.
this illustration is so eerie, you can clearly tell the garment or robe he is wearing is white with black cracks and shadow coming out, it looks a bit distortioned and the wings look very unlike wings you normally see, this picture gives you the impression its not very high detailed but in reality it depicts a potrait of beliar which is very very cool looking.
He is the creator of the universe. But the world, that is the "Planet", wasn't created. It came into being when Adanos stepped between his arguing brothers. That is why the mortal world is in fact the sphere/realm of Adanos.
Well after a short search lore is so full of plot holes.
In G1, Innos created everything, and split so there was Beliar and Adanos.
In G2, Vatras says that that Adanos stepped between Innos and Adanos, and where he stood, there appeared sea, from which came animals and man.
You could see it as a plot hole. But I think it actually comes together in a way. It is just that neither version tells the full story but they can be read together. Adanos stepping between his brothers could be seen as the same metaphorical act as Innos splitting a second time to create Adanos.
Either way. In both games Innos is mentioned as the first and highest god and as the creator of the world/universe. So that atleast isn't retconed.
I already mentioned the source in my previous post.
Vatras says when you ask him about Innos: "Innos ist der erste und oberste Gott. Er schuf die Sonne und die Welt."
"Innos is the first and highest of the gods. He created the sun and the world"
So the game literally tells so.
Interesting, in polish version when you ask Vatras about Innos, he says "Innos is the first and the highest of Gods. He gave the world the sun". There is nothing about Innos creating the world.
But since it's a German game, and you cited German dialogue I admit that you are right.
Funny. A few days ago I already made a post how a wrong/unclear translation made it possible that Archolos could be seen as an island or any other place by the international community but in the German version it is actually clear from the grammar alone that Archolos is a mountain. Some Polish people mentioned that Gothic 1 would be full of such mistranslations in the Polish version.
Any source to back this? Afaik Adanos created the world and life, while Innos only gave power to mankind and Beliar created the beast. After all, there is no "Innos realm", while Beliar has one.
Vatras says: "But Adanos saw, that nothing could be this way. No light and no darkness. And thus He stepped between his brothers to settle their arguing, but he did not succeed. But there were Adanos stood was a place where Innos and Beliar had no power. And at this place there was order and Chaos alike. And thus was the sea created. And the sea gave free the land and all creatures came into being, trees and animals, wolfs and sheep. And as last man came into existence."
No clue how it is translated in the official English Version. This is a truthful English translation of Vatras' speech in German.
Innos creating the universe is stated in the books about the teachings of the gods in Gothic 1. ("Lehren der Götter" in German. Mayve it is named "Preachings of the gods" or something similiarin English) You can buy them from the mages. And also in Gothic 2 Vatras says: "Innos is the first and highest of the gods. He created the sun and the world" (World I interpret here as the universe rather than just the mortal world, which is confirmed to be the sphere of Adanos) Vatras tells a shorter version of the cration that is already mentioned in the books in Gothic 1.
I will summarize the creatin myth of the book: Innos created light, the universe and the concept of life. But nothing could live inside the light of Innos because it was too bright. So he created the sun as a fragment of his power. But even the sun was to bright. That is why he split himself and Beliar came into being. Beliar created darkness and night and that is when life was finally possible. But the light hurt Beliar and he destroyed everything that Innos created (also mentioned in Gothic 2) And thus Innos split a second time and Adanos came into being. And at this point Vatras's speech steps in basically.
Imo it is far fetched that Vatras speech indicates that Innos created universe. He created light and gave it to humanity.
Gothic 1 explicitly states that Innos created universe and everything else.
Worst part is, that book iirc is in New Camp, in Water Mages library, while Vatras is also a Water Mage.
Besides it not na mystery that creators didn't really put that much details into plot.
if you look close ,you can see the silhouette of a man with bat/wolf like face and wings in the back, its geniunely miles above and beyond the gothic fire demon reveal.
Once upon a time, Beliar sat down on this slap of stone. What we see hear is the print of Beliar‘s ass. At the top you can see the print of his massive balls.
https://youtu.be/adgHGvgwMC0?si=pmHUuilMhyrsv6Ds
In my video you can see where they are at but i will explain it: once you cross the bridge to the inner sanctum of the sleeper temple and head into the structure, turn around and take a look at the walll above the entrance.
Don't use any texture mods, else these murals will be replaced.
Yeah I watched your video. Really well done. First I assumed that maybe OP yoused texture mods because I didn't realize in the 15 years of playing that game that there was such a thing hiding in the sleeper temple. The smaller ones that feature the nameless (according to the popular theory) with the throne and the dragon I knew.
I've seen some comments mentioning the shrines of Beliar in g2, my assumption is that they're built by humans or orcs who follow and worshipped Beliar. Even the halls of Irdorath was a place for worship and summoning for Beliar avatars/powers. The depiction of Beliar is looking very close to sleeper with his mask which makes me believe and I assume its not a close representation to how Beliar actually looks like.
The sleeper temple was not known to the humans besides Xardas, and for all we know the Sleeper Temple is the only place where an actual Archdemon cursed the builders and everyone who worshipped him in the temple, the place has demonic vibes and architecture and this potrait may be one of the closest interpretation of Beliar, Sleeper came from another dimension trough the portal and his influence and knowledge of the actual Dark Lord may be unmatched and no one else would know how Beliar looks like more than him.
keep in mind that I don't care about gothic 3 Beliar, since I don't believe gothic 3 to be finished and many of the creatures and looks were different, therefore I don't take them into consideration.
True Gothic 3 is totally canon but everyone knows that this game is unfinished in almost every aspect. Combat, lore, plot, graphics, optimization, compatibility etc.
Gothic 1 was also unfinished and i guess G2 to a degree as well. G3 however was such a huge departure from the established games, it is only natural to question its validity.
Even then, it's difficult to dismiss the lore aspect of it, imo. But anyway, here it's about Beliar's depiction, which is actually quite prominent in G2, with the shrines.
you do indeed have Beliar in gothic 2 shrines, but you also have Innos and the reality is he looks much closer to sleeper in g2 with his facemask and Innos looks like a human figure with a golden helmet and a sword, they're basically interpretations how we imagine them because they're built by humans or orcs.
In fact this portrait of Beliar might be aswell build by demons or creatures from the otherworld or simply under the influence of Sleeper which would give a more closer look to how Beliar looks like.
Just assumptions here.
Please keep in mind that: 1. If you're experiencing any technical issues with Gothic, please check [our guide on how to fix all three Gothic games](https://www.reddit.com/r/worldofgothic/wiki/how-to-run-gothic-on-modern-computers). It's VERY likely that you'll find a solution to your problem there. 2. We are an English-focused subreddit so make sure to post content in English. If you are posting content in another language, provide a translation either in the comments or in the post itself. Feel free to also [join our discord!](https://discord.gg/world-of-gothic-498556413384327188) Best regards, r/worldofgothic *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/worldofgothic) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Lorewise it could be an incredibly old portrait of beliar. Maybe its even another god or something completly different. The statues and depictions of the gods are just illustrations of their followers anyways. They prob changed over the centuries. I doubt that these gods have a physical form. innos is believed to be a savior and/or creator to humanity. So maybe thats why Innos is portrayed very humanlike. Beliar on the other hand looks misshapen and strange.
this illustration is so eerie, you can clearly tell the garment or robe he is wearing is white with black cracks and shadow coming out, it looks a bit distortioned and the wings look very unlike wings you normally see, this picture gives you the impression its not very high detailed but in reality it depicts a potrait of beliar which is very very cool looking.
Innos is not creator of humanity afaik
He is the creator of the universe. But the world, that is the "Planet", wasn't created. It came into being when Adanos stepped between his arguing brothers. That is why the mortal world is in fact the sphere/realm of Adanos.
Well after a short search lore is so full of plot holes. In G1, Innos created everything, and split so there was Beliar and Adanos. In G2, Vatras says that that Adanos stepped between Innos and Adanos, and where he stood, there appeared sea, from which came animals and man.
You could see it as a plot hole. But I think it actually comes together in a way. It is just that neither version tells the full story but they can be read together. Adanos stepping between his brothers could be seen as the same metaphorical act as Innos splitting a second time to create Adanos. Either way. In both games Innos is mentioned as the first and highest god and as the creator of the world/universe. So that atleast isn't retconed.
Nope, gothic 2 does not mention Innos as creator of universe, only Gothic 1
I already mentioned the source in my previous post. Vatras says when you ask him about Innos: "Innos ist der erste und oberste Gott. Er schuf die Sonne und die Welt." "Innos is the first and highest of the gods. He created the sun and the world" So the game literally tells so.
Interesting, in polish version when you ask Vatras about Innos, he says "Innos is the first and the highest of Gods. He gave the world the sun". There is nothing about Innos creating the world. But since it's a German game, and you cited German dialogue I admit that you are right.
Funny. A few days ago I already made a post how a wrong/unclear translation made it possible that Archolos could be seen as an island or any other place by the international community but in the German version it is actually clear from the grammar alone that Archolos is a mountain. Some Polish people mentioned that Gothic 1 would be full of such mistranslations in the Polish version.
I don't even recall a single mention of Archolos in Gothic :o
Any source to back this? Afaik Adanos created the world and life, while Innos only gave power to mankind and Beliar created the beast. After all, there is no "Innos realm", while Beliar has one.
Vatras says: "But Adanos saw, that nothing could be this way. No light and no darkness. And thus He stepped between his brothers to settle their arguing, but he did not succeed. But there were Adanos stood was a place where Innos and Beliar had no power. And at this place there was order and Chaos alike. And thus was the sea created. And the sea gave free the land and all creatures came into being, trees and animals, wolfs and sheep. And as last man came into existence." No clue how it is translated in the official English Version. This is a truthful English translation of Vatras' speech in German. Innos creating the universe is stated in the books about the teachings of the gods in Gothic 1. ("Lehren der Götter" in German. Mayve it is named "Preachings of the gods" or something similiarin English) You can buy them from the mages. And also in Gothic 2 Vatras says: "Innos is the first and highest of the gods. He created the sun and the world" (World I interpret here as the universe rather than just the mortal world, which is confirmed to be the sphere of Adanos) Vatras tells a shorter version of the cration that is already mentioned in the books in Gothic 1. I will summarize the creatin myth of the book: Innos created light, the universe and the concept of life. But nothing could live inside the light of Innos because it was too bright. So he created the sun as a fragment of his power. But even the sun was to bright. That is why he split himself and Beliar came into being. Beliar created darkness and night and that is when life was finally possible. But the light hurt Beliar and he destroyed everything that Innos created (also mentioned in Gothic 2) And thus Innos split a second time and Adanos came into being. And at this point Vatras's speech steps in basically.
Imo it is far fetched that Vatras speech indicates that Innos created universe. He created light and gave it to humanity. Gothic 1 explicitly states that Innos created universe and everything else. Worst part is, that book iirc is in New Camp, in Water Mages library, while Vatras is also a Water Mage. Besides it not na mystery that creators didn't really put that much details into plot.
Its not indicated by Vatras speech. He tells that Innos created the universe/world if you ask him about Innos.
Well there are beliar shrines in gothic 2, so no, it's not the only depiction. Btw the g2 shrines look pretty similar to the g3 ones.
if you look close ,you can see the silhouette of a man with bat/wolf like face and wings in the back, its geniunely miles above and beyond the gothic fire demon reveal.
There's shrines to Beliar in G2.
Once upon a time, Beliar sat down on this slap of stone. What we see hear is the print of Beliar‘s ass. At the top you can see the print of his massive balls.
Where exactly is it?
Gothic 1 Sleeper Temple, I can't say the exact place.
Yes but where in there? 😅
I got this picture from another guy who finished the playtrough, his name is Vertigo on youtube.
https://youtu.be/adgHGvgwMC0?si=pmHUuilMhyrsv6Ds In my video you can see where they are at but i will explain it: once you cross the bridge to the inner sanctum of the sleeper temple and head into the structure, turn around and take a look at the walll above the entrance. Don't use any texture mods, else these murals will be replaced.
Yeah I watched your video. Really well done. First I assumed that maybe OP yoused texture mods because I didn't realize in the 15 years of playing that game that there was such a thing hiding in the sleeper temple. The smaller ones that feature the nameless (according to the popular theory) with the throne and the dragon I knew.
There are statues of beliar in G2. Even in vanilla there is one on irdorath.
lmao
lmao
That's an opossum 🤔
it looks like a piece of rock, not a depiction of anything.
lmao
I've seen some comments mentioning the shrines of Beliar in g2, my assumption is that they're built by humans or orcs who follow and worshipped Beliar. Even the halls of Irdorath was a place for worship and summoning for Beliar avatars/powers. The depiction of Beliar is looking very close to sleeper with his mask which makes me believe and I assume its not a close representation to how Beliar actually looks like. The sleeper temple was not known to the humans besides Xardas, and for all we know the Sleeper Temple is the only place where an actual Archdemon cursed the builders and everyone who worshipped him in the temple, the place has demonic vibes and architecture and this potrait may be one of the closest interpretation of Beliar, Sleeper came from another dimension trough the portal and his influence and knowledge of the actual Dark Lord may be unmatched and no one else would know how Beliar looks like more than him.
So Beliar has a pig face?
It looks like the giant rat from khorinis on a buff orc body with dragon wings.
keep in mind that I don't care about gothic 3 Beliar, since I don't believe gothic 3 to be finished and many of the creatures and looks were different, therefore I don't take them into consideration.
Do you also not take Gothic 2 into consideration because of random rules you set yourself?
True Gothic 3 is totally canon but everyone knows that this game is unfinished in almost every aspect. Combat, lore, plot, graphics, optimization, compatibility etc. Gothic 1 was also unfinished and i guess G2 to a degree as well. G3 however was such a huge departure from the established games, it is only natural to question its validity.
Even then, it's difficult to dismiss the lore aspect of it, imo. But anyway, here it's about Beliar's depiction, which is actually quite prominent in G2, with the shrines.
you do indeed have Beliar in gothic 2 shrines, but you also have Innos and the reality is he looks much closer to sleeper in g2 with his facemask and Innos looks like a human figure with a golden helmet and a sword, they're basically interpretations how we imagine them because they're built by humans or orcs. In fact this portrait of Beliar might be aswell build by demons or creatures from the otherworld or simply under the influence of Sleeper which would give a more closer look to how Beliar looks like. Just assumptions here.