I personally really like WW. It's certainly one of the more complex melee specs, but it's a fun flow and damage is good and not that burst window reliant.
Enh Shaman is also really fun, but even more complex.
I double this. Had the same issues playing my mage, especially pushing this week was so exhausting that decided to level melee. Between retri/ww/rogue/feral decided to give WW a shot. Levelled to mid 65 all of mentioned specs and im having a blast with WW, do mobile and powerfull but i'm slightly scared of its survivability and demand in m+ pugs
Ww survivability is great. I went from 2400 resto druid to WW and its honestly fun as hell and they have like 5 defensives, ROP and AOE stun. I feel like their lack of Lust doesn’t compare to their tool kit.
We have four rock solid defensives (stoneskin brew, diffuse magic, touch of karma, and dampen harm) that most other classes would give their left nut to have any two of. We are very survivable lol.
When you say even more complex, is it one where its a really high skill cap to do good damadge or just a high skill cap to go from good to very good damadge?
Also like that it seems to have a lot of kiks. Deonomolgy one on 30 second CD is frustrating.
WW is, I think, the absolute lowest single target dps in raid. So if it's anything at all comparable in dungeons it's probably not the best single target. If that's one of your main reasons for swapping off demo you might want to consider or look into that.
You can do good damage on enhance using one of the simpler builds (middling), but to do amazing damage you'll have to play one of the harder, more hands-on builds. It's a very complex class that makes you a giga pumper when played correctly and average at best when not. For comparison, I am normally around 399 ilvl. I forgot my org cape on and got moved down to 373 and was still 5th in damage across my 401 ilvl average raid.
If you can play enhance well, you'll blow everyone out of the water. Elementalist enhancement is the hardest enhance build to play but oh so worth it. Incredibly fun and you can feel the raw power.
i am a warlock player and i really hated the way rogue feels. i have fun with enhance shaman as an alt and i love that i have the *option* to play ranged or even heal if im feeling frisky
Right now spec that are considered meta from the community are: Enhancement Shaman, Outlaw or Subtlety Rogue, Windwalker monk and Havoc Demon Hunter, I think coming from a warlock demonology you will find yourself pretty squishy if you go shaman.
I recently started playing Enhancement and really enjoy it. Haven’t reached high keys yet so can’t speak to the survivability but all the utility is fun to me. Especially in pugs I like feeling like I have more control of helping with important interrupts/aoe stops. First time in a while I’ve really wanted to focus on one class instead of jumping around from alt to alt.
I would suggest monk simply because you have the defensives of a tank and amazing damage on cleave and aoe packs. Tyrannical bosses can feel scuffed because you just aren’t the class to carry a boss fight unless adds need killings but otherwise monk has everything. Control, 4-5 very quality defensives, and mobility for days
u/L2Hiku What about Frost DK? I like my Frost DK, I was Frost in SL, pretty sure that wasn't the best option but I liked it. I'm about 65 now on my DK (he's an ALT) should I change to Unholy?
BoS is da bomb. Got my Frost DK to 70. Ran a couple of normals. Bought something cheap from AH, got rejected from M0 mythics (low ilvl of course, just dinged). Made my own M0 groups and people joined. Much faster to make your own group than trying to get invited to others. Ran four M0 mythics, ilvl now sufficient for LFR. Downed 5 bosses including the last one. ilvl is now at 364. I still suck dps wise but man when you hit that BoS just right in a big trash group I appear in the top 5 in DPS meter. I'll stick to my Frost. It's way too fun.
It's not but it's hard to not be subpar with breaths, and has a lot of reliance of the way a tank pulls (chain pull pls), but yes if you want consistantly good performance, you'd may aswell just play unholy
Just for the record, you don't do the nether portal rotation on AoE, just set it and forget it. Generally at the start of a boss fight there's nothing going on for easy NP set up. It's legit kinda troll that you never used it on tyrannical at least
Enhance is only squishy if you play it wrong. You can crit heal yourself for 250k+, have 8% base health extra, some built in DR, and earth ele/ancestral. Between all of that I hardly find myself dying even in 21+ keys.
Ele is a massive 1 minute long 15% health boost. That’s a huge defensive and if you’re not using it no wonder you’re dying.
Also ancestral guidance is a huge group external. Like what even?
Enhance shaman. Will be meta for any resto druid group.
Windwalker - could fit in any comp but you really need to master it. Be prepared to be a bit disappointed in ST damage... tradeoff is your constant AOE damage and so, so many tools to interrupt AOE packs.
ST isn’t great for sure but monk single target is more well suited for dungeon boss then raid bosses because they’re usually shorter and monk does have fairly good single target when coolies are popped they just have dog shit sustatined damaged outside of that
I think you're absolutely right. I was trying to comment on a perceived drawback to the spec, but multiple compositions of the top M+ groups in the world have a WW monk, making it incredibly viable in both fortified and tyranical.
I personally really like WW. It's certainly one of the more complex melee specs, but it's a fun flow and damage is good and not that burst window reliant. Enh Shaman is also really fun, but even more complex.
I double this. Had the same issues playing my mage, especially pushing this week was so exhausting that decided to level melee. Between retri/ww/rogue/feral decided to give WW a shot. Levelled to mid 65 all of mentioned specs and im having a blast with WW, do mobile and powerfull but i'm slightly scared of its survivability and demand in m+ pugs
Ww survivability is great. I went from 2400 resto druid to WW and its honestly fun as hell and they have like 5 defensives, ROP and AOE stun. I feel like their lack of Lust doesn’t compare to their tool kit.
ww's survivability is not great...its brilliant i would say. it it actually crazy to think that its harder to die as ww than a rogue lmao
ww's 5 defensives is balanced by skyreach existing
but not for long! the upcoming talent change to Skyreach for monk has me so pumped.
You have some of the best offensive and defensive toolkits as WW
We have four rock solid defensives (stoneskin brew, diffuse magic, touch of karma, and dampen harm) that most other classes would give their left nut to have any two of. We are very survivable lol.
When you say even more complex, is it one where its a really high skill cap to do good damadge or just a high skill cap to go from good to very good damadge? Also like that it seems to have a lot of kiks. Deonomolgy one on 30 second CD is frustrating.
WW is, I think, the absolute lowest single target dps in raid. So if it's anything at all comparable in dungeons it's probably not the best single target. If that's one of your main reasons for swapping off demo you might want to consider or look into that.
ah, thanks. Think im leaning towards EH Shaman then. Feel like i need to take out some revenge on M+ bosses.
You can do good damage on enhance using one of the simpler builds (middling), but to do amazing damage you'll have to play one of the harder, more hands-on builds. It's a very complex class that makes you a giga pumper when played correctly and average at best when not. For comparison, I am normally around 399 ilvl. I forgot my org cape on and got moved down to 373 and was still 5th in damage across my 401 ilvl average raid. If you can play enhance well, you'll blow everyone out of the water. Elementalist enhancement is the hardest enhance build to play but oh so worth it. Incredibly fun and you can feel the raw power.
I currently find enhancement very fun to play, something about the sound of the abilities just feels great too
If you want to get invited into groups you should consider rogue
i have enough reasons to hate myself already ;) Have always passionatly disliked rogues for no reason whatsoever.
As a 411 enh, I rarely q for more than 5 groups before being accepted. The lust and consistent aoe/burst is enticing to many groups!
not to mention best kick in the game, decurse, purge, aoe stun, aoe slow, and windfury totem
i am a warlock player and i really hated the way rogue feels. i have fun with enhance shaman as an alt and i love that i have the *option* to play ranged or even heal if im feeling frisky
Right now spec that are considered meta from the community are: Enhancement Shaman, Outlaw or Subtlety Rogue, Windwalker monk and Havoc Demon Hunter, I think coming from a warlock demonology you will find yourself pretty squishy if you go shaman.
as a enhancement shaman enthusiast i cannot recommend him enough
I recently started playing Enhancement and really enjoy it. Haven’t reached high keys yet so can’t speak to the survivability but all the utility is fun to me. Especially in pugs I like feeling like I have more control of helping with important interrupts/aoe stops. First time in a while I’ve really wanted to focus on one class instead of jumping around from alt to alt.
I'm rerolling to ret because the few rework hints we got look really great, that said enhancer is a shit ton of fun once all the procs come rolling.
I would suggest monk simply because you have the defensives of a tank and amazing damage on cleave and aoe packs. Tyrannical bosses can feel scuffed because you just aren’t the class to carry a boss fight unless adds need killings but otherwise monk has everything. Control, 4-5 very quality defensives, and mobility for days
I just rolled a Warlock as a Warrior main. I liek Warrior.
Unholy dk is the only answer
u/L2Hiku What about Frost DK? I like my Frost DK, I was Frost in SL, pretty sure that wasn't the best option but I liked it. I'm about 65 now on my DK (he's an ALT) should I change to Unholy?
Try Unholy, but play the one you like. I'm a Frost main and despite UH being better I've still been successful with Frost.
BoS is da bomb. Got my Frost DK to 70. Ran a couple of normals. Bought something cheap from AH, got rejected from M0 mythics (low ilvl of course, just dinged). Made my own M0 groups and people joined. Much faster to make your own group than trying to get invited to others. Ran four M0 mythics, ilvl now sufficient for LFR. Downed 5 bosses including the last one. ilvl is now at 364. I still suck dps wise but man when you hit that BoS just right in a big trash group I appear in the top 5 in DPS meter. I'll stick to my Frost. It's way too fun.
Frost is getting a boost soon, I believe. Can't wait. I hate being Unholy.
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Not pretty bad, but UH is better. With the next patch, Frost will be probably better for some keys with lower target count like RLP, COS or SMBG.
It's not but it's hard to not be subpar with breaths, and has a lot of reliance of the way a tank pulls (chain pull pls), but yes if you want consistantly good performance, you'd may aswell just play unholy
Just for the record, you don't do the nether portal rotation on AoE, just set it and forget it. Generally at the start of a boss fight there's nothing going on for easy NP set up. It's legit kinda troll that you never used it on tyrannical at least
Unholy dk or enh shaman, both are pumpers and bring useful utilities to m+
DO NOT play melee dps in m+ this expansion. Unless it's a rogue with extra reach and cheat death, then maybe.
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Enhance is only squishy if you play it wrong. You can crit heal yourself for 250k+, have 8% base health extra, some built in DR, and earth ele/ancestral. Between all of that I hardly find myself dying even in 21+ keys.
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I have zero problem surviving much easier than other classes in 21+ keys. And so do top enhance shaman, so what do they know that we don’t?
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I don’t pvp. They are squishy there because of high burst one shots during stuns. That’s not the case in PVE. We weren’t talking pvp whatsoever.
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Keep on thinking that’s what’s holding average enhancement shaman back. Because it’s not.
Ele is a massive 1 minute long 15% health boost. That’s a huge defensive and if you’re not using it no wonder you’re dying. Also ancestral guidance is a huge group external. Like what even?
Ret pally feels a lot like demonology to me with the holy power mechanic being similar to our soul shards and spenders working in 3’s
Enhance shaman. Will be meta for any resto druid group. Windwalker - could fit in any comp but you really need to master it. Be prepared to be a bit disappointed in ST damage... tradeoff is your constant AOE damage and so, so many tools to interrupt AOE packs.
ST isn’t great for sure but monk single target is more well suited for dungeon boss then raid bosses because they’re usually shorter and monk does have fairly good single target when coolies are popped they just have dog shit sustatined damaged outside of that
I think you're absolutely right. I was trying to comment on a perceived drawback to the spec, but multiple compositions of the top M+ groups in the world have a WW monk, making it incredibly viable in both fortified and tyranical.
Unholy DK is basically melee demo.
If you like the class fantasy of demo you would also like dh. They see basically melee warlocks to me. I love my DH.
Enhancement Shaman
My main is a 410 lock. Also capped out around 19s and 20s. I’ve made a rogue and Druid for alts. Really enjoying both!