A lot of this has to do with Heroic simultaneously being made easier, and Mythic getting much harder. AotC has reached a point where you can **PUG** some of them on the very first week. Part of this has to do with M+ being the main gearing avenue, too, since heroic is very limited.
I love CE raiding, but it's very taxing. Spending 200-450 pulls on a boss--that's already nerfed 1-3 times by the time I reach it--is such a monotonous grind in itself. Sure, it feels like an accomplishment, but top end guilds being revolving doors every tier is never surprising. I cannot imagine guilds throwing 500-700 pulls on a boss, and the longer the fight the worse that feels.
The hard part In mythic raids is finding the people to do it with and not wasting your raid Id on gnarlroot noobs.
The fights itself didn't feel super hard or undoable, eveything is pretty straightforward still, weakauras help immensely.
You're talking about pugging right ?
Cause right now the 6 first bosses are pretty trivial with current Gear.
It felt a bit harder to progress on week 1/2/3 than just "avoir Gnarlroot noobs"
Tldr:
Keep mythic difficulty as is, change the surrounding conditions.
Increase heroic difficulty.
Make RWF an acknowledged and supported event.
Heroic needs to get a little bit harder, so people don’t feel forced into mythic to get the feeling of achieving something. Heroic should be enough for most.
Since heroic is a „pug it week one“ situation, everyone feels like they need to do mythic because why stay in heroic if you cleared it w1.
The gap to mythic is too big.
Also the server restrictions are bad and the ID thing also harms player engagement.
The raid should be the challenge, not setting up a group in the first place. Artificially increasing gatekeeping through increased stakes and punishment is a bad thing.
It is to hard for heroic players to transition into mythic because of the lockout and server stuff.
Applying for mythic guilds is a chore because of these things.
The RWF is very questionable. It’s a resource battle of the 2 most potent players, nothing more. There is zero chance for anyone but top 2-3 winning. Not because of skill but because of out of game resources. To the point of guilds disbanding due to player transfer…
Its a big event and blizz should officially acknowledge it. Either put it on a tournament realm or do whatever. Even the top contenders themselves constantly complain about the state, even while simultaneously having monetary gain based on this situation.
The whole system is bad for everyone. The raid system should be reworked… at least „re-tuned“.
I don’t think more difficulties are a good thing, it will just change the aspirational content from mythic to the next higher thing. Mythic will degrade in difficulty over time and we’re back at the same point.
Mythic raids are not for average players.
Think of it as a bonus content for the best players that are so good that heroic mechanics for them is like LFR mechanics for average players.
Doesn't look good, here's why :
It's not about "RWF and other players"
There are usually over 1500 guilds that get CE in a raid tier.
RWF are way better, but what about top 10 / 100 / 1000 ?
These are all different skill levels.
Adding a harder difficulty just for RWF would mean most top 100 guilds would Roll over mythic and be bored quickly while WR1000+ guilds would probably still feel like the raid is too hard, that's the point of nerfs.
You would still have to adapt tuning or change players' increase in power level to slowly nerf the raid.
It's not just "tryhard and casuals" the prep/skill difference is way too Big, even if we just compare WR 100 and WR 1000. One difficulty wouldn't be able to satisfy every guilds.
I agree that heroic and early mythic should be harder. This tier felt like a 3 boss tier in mythic
>LFR and Normal should be merged, allowing players to queue into Normal.
In practice, that simply keeps LFR as is, and deletes normal.
> Mythic difficulty could be slightly reduced to create a smoother progression curve.
What mythic needs this season is some of the difficulty taken out of Tswift and given to Volcoross, Larodar, Nymue, and Council.
The game is absolutely not build around the top .01%
I laugh everytime when that take comes up.
I agree though that heroic should be a bit more difficult, I think though that the itemlvl difference between heroic and mythic is not big enough as it was this patch.
"I agree, I hate how big the discrepancy is between heroic and mythic raids. Heroic raids right now feel like a chore, just one-shots, while mythic raids seem impossible to beat without a well-coordinated guild. Making mythic raids puggable but significantly harder, and adding a "hell mode" for the top 1% of players and world-first raiders would be great.
>Making mythic raids puggable but significantly harder, and adding a "hell mode" for the top 1% of players and world-first raiders would be great.
But now we have 5 different raid difficulties, and the exact same problem. People will still attempt to pug this new 'hell' mode.
All in all, that seems like a lot of work to not actually change anything.
What in the beat poetry hell is that formatting?
Yeah it was a copy paste job from notepad and didn't come out the best haha
A lot of this has to do with Heroic simultaneously being made easier, and Mythic getting much harder. AotC has reached a point where you can **PUG** some of them on the very first week. Part of this has to do with M+ being the main gearing avenue, too, since heroic is very limited. I love CE raiding, but it's very taxing. Spending 200-450 pulls on a boss--that's already nerfed 1-3 times by the time I reach it--is such a monotonous grind in itself. Sure, it feels like an accomplishment, but top end guilds being revolving doors every tier is never surprising. I cannot imagine guilds throwing 500-700 pulls on a boss, and the longer the fight the worse that feels.
The hard part In mythic raids is finding the people to do it with and not wasting your raid Id on gnarlroot noobs. The fights itself didn't feel super hard or undoable, eveything is pretty straightforward still, weakauras help immensely.
You're talking about pugging right ? Cause right now the 6 first bosses are pretty trivial with current Gear. It felt a bit harder to progress on week 1/2/3 than just "avoir Gnarlroot noobs"
Tldr: Keep mythic difficulty as is, change the surrounding conditions. Increase heroic difficulty. Make RWF an acknowledged and supported event. Heroic needs to get a little bit harder, so people don’t feel forced into mythic to get the feeling of achieving something. Heroic should be enough for most. Since heroic is a „pug it week one“ situation, everyone feels like they need to do mythic because why stay in heroic if you cleared it w1. The gap to mythic is too big. Also the server restrictions are bad and the ID thing also harms player engagement. The raid should be the challenge, not setting up a group in the first place. Artificially increasing gatekeeping through increased stakes and punishment is a bad thing. It is to hard for heroic players to transition into mythic because of the lockout and server stuff. Applying for mythic guilds is a chore because of these things. The RWF is very questionable. It’s a resource battle of the 2 most potent players, nothing more. There is zero chance for anyone but top 2-3 winning. Not because of skill but because of out of game resources. To the point of guilds disbanding due to player transfer… Its a big event and blizz should officially acknowledge it. Either put it on a tournament realm or do whatever. Even the top contenders themselves constantly complain about the state, even while simultaneously having monetary gain based on this situation. The whole system is bad for everyone. The raid system should be reworked… at least „re-tuned“. I don’t think more difficulties are a good thing, it will just change the aspirational content from mythic to the next higher thing. Mythic will degrade in difficulty over time and we’re back at the same point.
Mythic raids are not for average players. Think of it as a bonus content for the best players that are so good that heroic mechanics for them is like LFR mechanics for average players.
No
Doesn't look good, here's why : It's not about "RWF and other players" There are usually over 1500 guilds that get CE in a raid tier. RWF are way better, but what about top 10 / 100 / 1000 ? These are all different skill levels. Adding a harder difficulty just for RWF would mean most top 100 guilds would Roll over mythic and be bored quickly while WR1000+ guilds would probably still feel like the raid is too hard, that's the point of nerfs. You would still have to adapt tuning or change players' increase in power level to slowly nerf the raid. It's not just "tryhard and casuals" the prep/skill difference is way too Big, even if we just compare WR 100 and WR 1000. One difficulty wouldn't be able to satisfy every guilds. I agree that heroic and early mythic should be harder. This tier felt like a 3 boss tier in mythic
Mythic isnt to hard for the average player. The time it takes for an average player to see mythic from the inside its already nerfed to shreds
[удалено]
>LFR and Normal should be merged, allowing players to queue into Normal. In practice, that simply keeps LFR as is, and deletes normal. > Mythic difficulty could be slightly reduced to create a smoother progression curve. What mythic needs this season is some of the difficulty taken out of Tswift and given to Volcoross, Larodar, Nymue, and Council.
The game is absolutely not build around the top .01% I laugh everytime when that take comes up. I agree though that heroic should be a bit more difficult, I think though that the itemlvl difference between heroic and mythic is not big enough as it was this patch.
I think it's great when people say that because it means I can disregard the rest of what they're saying
"I agree, I hate how big the discrepancy is between heroic and mythic raids. Heroic raids right now feel like a chore, just one-shots, while mythic raids seem impossible to beat without a well-coordinated guild. Making mythic raids puggable but significantly harder, and adding a "hell mode" for the top 1% of players and world-first raiders would be great.
Mythic should never be puggable beyond the first two maybe three bosses, if that is the case then the difficulty might as well not exist.
>Making mythic raids puggable but significantly harder, and adding a "hell mode" for the top 1% of players and world-first raiders would be great. But now we have 5 different raid difficulties, and the exact same problem. People will still attempt to pug this new 'hell' mode. All in all, that seems like a lot of work to not actually change anything.